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enk + DoW convo

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Dec 5th, 2016
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  1. [3:16 PM] enkelin: so you really think escalating this is a good idea for RE, huh
  2. [3:16 PM] enkelin: you know you guys drastically overstepped your bounds this uni
  3. [3:16 PM] enkelin: with the tithe, taking gals from Traders, SRX, SaP
  4. [3:17 PM] DoW: Hola
  5. [3:17 PM] enkelin: hola to you
  6. [3:17 PM] DoW: I don't disagree with you
  7. [3:17 PM] DoW: I said this myself, hopefully to DS as well as the rest of the leadership
  8. [3:18 PM] enkelin: what statement are you referring to
  9. [3:18 PM] DoW: overstepping bounds
  10. [3:19 PM] DoW: Pissed off way too many teams all in one uni
  11. [3:19 PM] enkelin: so what's all this about RE planning to retaliate
  12. [3:19 PM] DoW: ?
  13. [3:19 PM] DoW: where?
  14. [3:19 PM] enkelin: I honestly expected smarter from you guys, compared to thrm
  15. [3:19 PM] enkelin: please, you really think my teammates don't tell me when you make threats like that
  16. [3:20 PM] DoW: me?
  17. [3:20 PM] enkelin: "SaP space will die. RF space will die. SRX space will die."
  18. [3:20 PM] enkelin: your words, not mine
  19. [3:21 PM] DoW: "RE Space can die"
  20. [3:21 PM] DoW: lol
  21. [3:21 PM] DoW: maybe I should have used the word would
  22. [3:22 PM] DoW: if Alan wants to quote the rest verbatim that would have been more useful for context
  23. [3:22 PM] enkelin: oh I'm seeing the whole thing, trust me
  24. [3:22 PM] enkelin: but if you want to walk some of it back, that's fine with me
  25. [3:23 PM] DoW: So I'm sure you saw before that I put 'IF this goes the way it COULD'
  26. [3:23 PM] enkelin: indeed
  27. [3:23 PM] DoW: So there's nothing there promising a retaliation to anything
  28. [3:23 PM] enkelin: I don't see how it could go that way unless RE are total maniacs
  29. [3:24 PM] DoW: Well I wasn't even online at that point
  30. [3:26 PM] enkelin: just FYI, the entire operation was conceived as a slap on the wrist
  31. [3:26 PM] DoW: so where do we proceed from here
  32. [3:26 PM] enkelin: we made sure not to hit any RE core gals, and in fact we were prepared to use diplomacy midway if it had been offered
  33. [3:26 PM] enkelin: our objectives were to remove RE from SaP and SRX claims, and from anatolia
  34. [3:26 PM] DoW: well played
  35. [3:26 PM] DoW: SaP and SRX Claims?
  36. [3:26 PM] enkelin: we took your HQ in order to have a bargaining position of cutting your ownership abilities
  37. [3:26 PM] DoW: oh nvm
  38. [3:27 PM] enkelin: so from the very first, it was always a targeted strike with no commitment to escalation unless required by RE response
  39. [3:27 PM] DoW: good to know
  40. [3:27 PM] DoW: so what of Sondadarla and Hipparcos or whatever now
  41. [3:28 PM] enkelin: our terms are pretty simple
  42. [3:29 PM] enkelin: 1) no aggressive action against SRX, RF, SaP, Traders this or next uni.
  43. 2) no contesting Traders emp claim for the remainder of the uni
  44.  
  45. We will hold Sondadarla and Hipparcos as collateral for the agreement, in order to have staging areas in the event of a breach.
  46. [3:30 PM] enkelin: As you can see, the primary purpose of our terms is in line with our stated objective of correcting what we deemed was too aggressive play on RE's part
  47. [3:30 PM] DoW: Collateral?
  48. [3:30 PM] DoW: It cuts our teamspace in two
  49. [3:30 PM] enkelin: that is correct
  50. [3:30 PM] enkelin: if you breach our terms, it will be with possibly severe consequences to us or our allies
  51. [3:30 PM] enkelin: sneak attacks are powerful things you know
  52. [3:31 PM] enkelin: in that eventuality, we insist on having the ability to strike with much greater force, as afforded by lack of owned galaxies
  53. [3:31 PM] DoW: Sneak attacks are especially powerful after a mid uni major base rehaul resulting in severe problems with bases
  54. [3:31 PM] enkelin: Danger has gone over all of the claims about broken bases today
  55. [3:31 PM] enkelin: he has found nothing of particular note, after a pretty exhaustive analysis
  56. [3:32 PM] enkelin: you can talk to him directly if you want to know the specifics
  57. [3:32 PM] enkelin: and as always, a breach of the peace would result in uni+1 consequences
  58. [3:33 PM] DoW: Fruits is willing to refund kits for Hipparcos
  59. [3:33 PM] enkelin: Traders has no great fondness for being the uni police. We wouldn't have taken on this role if it had not been for the quorum of other teams who saw things the same way
  60. [3:33 PM] DoW: Well that's precisely what's happening
  61. [3:33 PM] enkelin: Yes, because of extenuating circumstances
  62. [3:33 PM] DoW: SaP can have Foxtrot and Fitnushel
  63. [3:34 PM] enkelin: As I said at the beginning of this conversation, RE have grossly overstepped their bounds and it was determined by these four teams that that should be corrected, even at cost to ourselves
  64. [3:34 PM] DoW: extenuating? Other than Roonan which was the action of 1 player we've done shit all to traders
  65. [3:34 PM] enkelin: not just to us
  66. [3:34 PM] enkelin: If you hadn't busted up SRX and SaP for that bogus reason, we probably would have let Roonan slide
  67. [3:34 PM] enkelin: But DS has already raked you over the coals for that
  68. [3:34 PM] DoW: If anything I think we've worked perfectly amimcably to maintain good relations with Traders, particularly between DS and myself
  69. [3:34 PM] DoW: SRX lost 1 gal for shit KMW ruins
  70. [3:35 PM] DoW: KM*
  71. [3:35 PM] enkelin: You know full well that RE have been complete dicks to the player base this uni, and we and the rest of our group have had enough
  72. [3:35 PM] DoW: SaP BVB'd us at uniset
  73. [3:35 PM] DoW: exactly what happend in roonan
  74. [3:35 PM] enkelin: I'm not interested in discussing your opinion on whether RE is or is not overstepping their bounds this uni
  75. [3:35 PM] DoW: Again I don't disagree with you
  76. [3:35 PM] enkelin: It was the determination of our alliance that this was the case, and we acted accordingly
  77. [3:35 PM] DoW: but I don't particularly agree with Traders getting involved, I was quite happy with Traders - RE relations as they stood
  78. [3:35 PM] enkelin: Sometimes actions can have global consequences
  79. [3:36 PM] DoW: well you've brought it up twice now and I've agreed with you both times..
  80. [3:36 PM] enkelin: We have friends on other teams, and we stick up for those friends
  81. [3:36 PM] enkelin: Even in this case at the possible cost of RE-Traders relations
  82. [3:36 PM] DoW: so do we, SRX lost 1 gal
  83. SaP lost a load of shit galaxies
  84. RF have lost nothing
  85. [3:36 PM] DoW: Traders lost nothing
  86. [3:36 PM] enkelin: Getting back to your offers
  87. [3:36 PM] enkelin: SaP already have Foxtrot and Fintushel if they want them
  88. [3:36 PM] enkelin: You are not offering us anything we don't already have
  89. [3:37 PM] DoW: Fintushel has shit all in terms of defences
  90. [3:37 PM] DoW: I said keep
  91. [3:37 PM] enkelin: If you really want us to pull out of Hipparcos, it will be costly to you
  92. [3:37 PM] DoW: Or rather, I intended to
  93. [3:37 PM] enkelin: I am not super interested in extracting a surrender cost this time, unlike in previous Traders conflicts
  94. [3:37 PM] DoW: So, fruts offer of refunds for Hipparcos kits, no retalliation against any team
  95. [3:37 PM] enkelin: that's not sufficient, sorry
  96. [3:38 PM] enkelin: if you really want team ownership, the cost will be steep because it's not really in the interest of the alliance
  97. [3:38 PM] enkelin: the interests of the alliance are much more aligned with keeping RE in a knackered state this uni, to make doubly sure that no retaliation will take place
  98. [3:38 PM] DoW: afk being a taxi
  99. [3:39 PM] enkelin: lol
  100. [3:39 PM] enkelin: Furthermore, the main reason you would insist on regaining ownership is if you actually planned to go on the offensive
  101. [3:39 PM] enkelin: You have my word that there will be no alliance-sanctioned action against RE unowned gals if your part of the terms are satisfied
  102. [3:39 PM] DoW: like that would stop retalliation from any of the teams
  103. [3:40 PM] enkelin: And my word is backed up by the spotless way in which this 4-team operation was conducted
  104. [3:40 PM] enkelin: Not to mention the fact that such action would be totally pointless and most likely just put us into a conflict with a desperate team
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