Muu's discussions with UM Director

Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2012 13:54:20 +0100
Subject: Re: NEO Magazine and Forum

Hi UM Director,

I'm a bit concerned that you are asking me if *** has reinstated all the
moderators.  I'm also concerned that *** has quite obviously abandoned the
NEO forum.

If you let things slip back to how they were you will be slowly strangling
the life out of your own forum and costing yourself money.  It's up to you
to keep communication with your forum staff open, not the other way around
and right now there is no direct communication from anyone at UM to the
staff on the forum.

Did *** explain to you that the way the forum has been set up requires the
forum staff (Admins) to manually check each signup and that if no-one does
that then there will be no new members?  From what I saw *** didn't bother
to process that moderation queue at all after he took over and now you are
relying on the goodwill of Manning and kuro_neko for that again.

At the moment you aren't getting any active help from anyone.  ***'s
actions and the muddled way in which he gave partial Admin rights back to
Manning and kuro_neko didn't go down well.  As things stand, If they
decided to walk off and abandon the forum out of despair for being treated
so badly you would be unlikely to find out about it until far too late.
You need to get your lines of communication open to them on the forum and
keep them open.  As has been proven over recent weeks you cannot rely on
*** for that.

Despite all that, you aren't far off unlocking all the resources that are
available to you.  We all want to help NEO be a good part of the
community.  We are just waiting on seeing the public proof of you doing the
right thing by your customers.



On Thu, Jul 26, 2012 at 9:07 PM, UM Director
<UM Director>wrote:

> Hi Muu,
>
> Been catching up on work so haven't moved this forward. Next week, I'll
> start contacting NEO advertisers about their stock.
>
> Has *** reinstated all the moderators?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 25 Jul 2012, at 01:59 PM, Muu <muupuklip> wrote:
>
> Hi UM Director,
>
> Hope you had a lovely holiday.
>
> How are things progressing?
>
> On Thu, Jun 21, 2012 at 4:50 PM, UM Director <UM Director> > wrote:
>
>> hi Muu,
>>
>> just to let you know, i'm away on holiday now for two weeks. UM Director
>>
>>
>> On 12 Jun 2012, at 17:10, Muu wrote:
>>
>> Hi UM Director,
>>
>> In the last email I mentioned that you have a specific problem with Tokyo
>> Toys.  Part of that problem is that UM and the MCM Expo have had a long
>> standing relationship with Tokyo Toys which legitimate retailers may have
>> taken to be a deliberate knowing and cosy collaboration which has favoured
>> Tokyo Toys and their open selling of counterfeit goods.  In other words,
>> they may have seen you as taking part in 'unfair competition'.  Some
>> retailers have hinted as much in posts on the NEO forum in the past.
>>
>> I mention this because the solution for UM/NEO getting the knowledge
>> about counterfeit goods lies with the legitimate retailers that are
>> genuinely serving the community.  They are the best source for information
>> about which goods are fake or unlicensed and which are legitimate.  It
>> would be a very good idea for UM to star opening dialogue with as many
>> retailers of anime/manga/'Asian culture' related goods as possible to
>> gather information about counterfeit goods and as a means of beginning to
>> build up mutually rewarding business (advertising) relationships.
>>
>> There are a couple of retailers that should be at the top of the list to
>> begin discussions about fakes and unlicensed goods:
>>
>> Tokyo15 url
>>
>> Tokyo15 have had a presence on the NEO forum in the past.  They have been
>> invaluable in bringing the problem of counterfeit goods to light.
>>
>> eyeonasia url
>>
>> You already have a relationship with Eye on Asia.  It would be a good
>> idea to make the best use of it.
>>
>> You ultimately need to get to the position where you have contact with a
>> broad range of retailers who will openly blow the whistle to you about
>> their competitors selling counterfeit goods.  That way you can weed out the
>> bad apples and save NEO from being the target of legitimate protest and
>> criticism in future.
>>
>> It would also be a good idea to open an honest and straight dialogue with
>> your customers on the NEO forum about this.  Start a thread to clear the
>> air and be sure to make it understood that you won't be trying to ban
>> anyone for telling you things you might not like to hear.  You need to
>> (re)gain trust and show that you are willing to listen and act responsibly
>> when your customers complain to you about advertising that features
>> counterfeits.  Being straight and open is the first step.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Muu
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 10, 2012 at 5:56 PM, UM Director <
>> UM Director> wrote:
>>
>>> hi Muu,
>>>
>>> did you receive my last email? would like to move forward on this. can
>>> you confirm tokyo toys is the only advertiser you'd like removed from our
>>> advertising schedule?
>>>
>>> thanks UM Director
>>>
>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>
>>> *From: *UM Director <UM Director>
>>> *Subject: **Re: NEO Magazine and Forum*
>>> *Date: *6 June 2012 12:01:03 GMT+01:00
>>> *To: *Muu <muupuklip>
>>>
>>> hi Muu,
>>>
>>> looking at our AD contracts, and how long we are signed into them. Is
>>> Tokyo Toys the only company that promotes unofficial products in NEO?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 31 May 2012, at 12:54, Muu wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi UM Director,
>>>
>>> Didn't get an email from you yesterday, and it looks like *** made a
>>> mess of things and then abandoned the NEO forum about a week ago.  Is there
>>> a problem?
>>>
>>> Muu
>>>
>>> On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 1:08 PM, UM Director <
>>> UM Director> wrote:
>>>
>>>> hi Muu,
>>>>
>>>> i'm off to mcm expo with NEO today, back sunday eve. i'm then gonna
>>>> take a couple of days off. so i'll email you on wednesday.
>>>>
>>>> UM Director
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 21 May 2012, at 16:03, Muu wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi UM Director,
>>>>
>>>> Yes, absolutely.  NEO and its online presence has always had tremendous
>>>> potential to be more or less the heart of the 'Asian culture' community in
>>>> the UK.  That's what all of us want.  We want you to be successful and be
>>>> on good terms with the community.  Whatever rough edges there may have been
>>>> up until now can be smoothed off easily enough.  Myself, Manning, and
>>>> kuro_neko have no interest in conflict, we want peace and quiet and a
>>>> strong and healthy forum.  With robust and direct channels of communication
>>>> now open to both *** and yourself there is no reason for any
>>>> 'unconventional' means of drawing your attention to any problems in future.
>>>>
>>>> Muu
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 7:49 PM, UM Director <
>>>> UM Director> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> hi Muu,
>>>>>
>>>>> imagine i've banned all advertising in NEO that contains counterfeit
>>>>> goods, and released an official press release stating our support for
>>>>> official merchandise only. Could you, *** and the mods work happily
>>>>> together to produce a happy, vibrant NEO forum? Could we work to promote
>>>>> NEO on the forum in a positive way and ensure that any future issues were
>>>>> dealt with correctly? And avoid a continuous stream of posts slating NEO
>>>>> and its staff.
>>>>>
>>>>> UM Director
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 18 May 2012, at 19:41, Muu wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Sure, that's fine.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, May 18, 2012 at 7:48 PM, UM Director <
>>>>> UM Director> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> hi Muu,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *** has asked me to ask you if it's ok for him to email you a few
>>>>>> questions. this is separate from the discussions we are having.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> UM Director
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 18 May 2012, at 17:46, UM Director wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> hi Muu,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've already started to investigate the issue of NEO accepting
>>>>>> adverts that contain counterfeit goods. i'll update you on my
>>>>>> thoughts/action when i have a clearer picture, next week.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> i'll pass the message on to ***.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> sorry for short reply, i have staff off on holiday so covering their
>>>>>> work and it's deadline day for 360 gamer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> have a good weekend. keep me updated please.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> thanks for your help.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> UM Director
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 18 May 2012, at 13:54, Muu wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have been discussing the situation with both kuro_neko and Manning,
>>>>>> and have started contacting others from the forum and wider community to
>>>>>> get their views.  The process will take some time, not least because
>>>>>> everyone communicates over multiple platforms.  But there are a few things
>>>>>> that can be said now.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Firstly, everyone needs to know where UM are going to stand on the
>>>>>> issue of counterfeit goods and taking adverts from shops that sell them.
>>>>>> If that doesn't get sorted then nothing else will matter.  Everyone I have
>>>>>> talked to so far would welcome clear and frank messages from UM, if not in
>>>>>> public then through some form of private means.  We all know that NEO needs
>>>>>> advertising revenue, and no-one expects instant marvels, but no-one will be
>>>>>> satisfied with vague comments or attempts to bury heads in the sand and
>>>>>> hope that everything will go away.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Secondly, the actions of *** ****** on the forum the last few days
>>>>>> have only really been useful in highlighting the problems that there have
>>>>>> been with (mis)communication or the lack of any communication at all.  It
>>>>>> would be helpful if he stopped posting (for now) as at least some of the
>>>>>> things he has said in his posts and PMs, along with some of the things he
>>>>>> has done around the forum in the last few days have been unhelpful to
>>>>>> everyone.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lastly, everyone involved in the discussions so far welcomes the fact
>>>>>> that you want to talk and resolve matters.  It has been taken as a positive
>>>>>> signal.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Muu
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 3:38 PM, UM Director <
>>>>>> UM Director> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> thanks Muu
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 16 May 2012, at 15:14, Muu wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Okay.  I'll talk it over with a few people from the forum and get
>>>>>>> back to you in a day or two with the results from the group discussion.
>>>>>>> May as well get it right rather than rush at it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Muu
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 2:58 PM, UM Director <
>>>>>>> UM Director> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> hi Muu,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> i'd like a happy NEO forum with happy members. We're a very small
>>>>>>>> company and ****** hasn't dedicated enough time to the forum. No fault of her
>>>>>>>> own, producing the mag takes up all of her time. i understand respect has
>>>>>>>> been lost.  i'd like to hear your suggestions so we can rectify this
>>>>>>>> situation.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> UM Director
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 16 May 2012, at 13:21, Muu wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No.  Email is fine.  Ask away.  You'll get straight answers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 12:08 PM, UM Director <
>>>>>>>> UM Director> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> hi Muu,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> would it be possible to discuss a few things over the phone. i can
>>>>>>>>> call you if you have a contact number or you can call me on ***********.
>>>>>>>>> thanks
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 9 May 2012, at 12:09, Muu wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It's about time we had a chat.  I am the man behind the Muu_Puklip
>>>>>>>>> account on your NEO Magazine forum.  I'm the one who pushed ****** ****** to
>>>>>>>>> get you to make an effort to save your own forum from being overrun with
>>>>>>>>> spam.  You may not be aware that when ********** delivered the
>>>>>>>>> vBulletin install it was in a completely unprotected state and that it was
>>>>>>>>> me who set the forum up with the anti spam measures that it has now.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You certainly don't seem to be aware that I stepped down as an
>>>>>>>>> admin (I removed the admin rights myself) on the NEO forum on the 10th
>>>>>>>>> February.  You weren't aware of it when you had the Muu_Puklip account
>>>>>>>>> banned in March and proved to everyone on the forum and elsewhere that my
>>>>>>>>> comments in the post you did not like were spot on.  You/****** then went on
>>>>>>>>> to insult Manning and kuro_neko with the offer of a free sub to the mag.
>>>>>>>>> Why do you think they have been working as admins on the NEO forum for
>>>>>>>>> nothing for the last few years?  It's not for a belated offer of a free sub
>>>>>>>>> to a mag which they no longer have any respect for.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Which brings me to the reason I am emailing you.  You have
>>>>>>>>> essentially no contact with people who can either do a lot of good or
>>>>>>>>> damage to your business.  You appear to be getting piss-poor information
>>>>>>>>> from the people you do talk to.  So I'm cutting out the middle (wo)man to
>>>>>>>>> make sure you know a few things that could end up costing you a whole lot
>>>>>>>>> of money.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> At the moment you have two big problems.  Both of which are
>>>>>>>>> probably due to you not getting good information.  Firstly, you are taking
>>>>>>>>> adverts in NEO from companies that sell counterfeit goods and at least part
>>>>>>>>> of the community already knows it.  That is damaging your reputation and
>>>>>>>>> costing you money through lost sales.  Secondly, your internet setup across
>>>>>>>>> the board is sub par and doing damage to your reputation as well as costing
>>>>>>>>> you money, and you could improve it without any cost.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Unfortunately ****** ****** is tied up with both of those in relation
>>>>>>>>> to NEO.  Your internet presence for your other mags if of course someone
>>>>>>>>> else's responsibility.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I noticed that you brought *** ****** in to poke around on the NEO
>>>>>>>>> forum again yesterday.  That is a pretty good indication that you don't
>>>>>>>>> have a grasp of some of the very simple and basic things you need to know
>>>>>>>>> about your own forum.  There's no respect for ****** amongst the people who
>>>>>>>>> matter on the NEO forum.  He damaged the code for the previous incarnation
>>>>>>>>> and was never any use in fixing things.  Frankly, he's no good.  If you
>>>>>>>>> brought him in to gather information and paid him for it, you wasted your
>>>>>>>>> money.  You can get all the information you need out of the forum for
>>>>>>>>> nothing.  If you spend a few hours reading and learning you can do
>>>>>>>>> literally everything you will ever need with your own forum and save
>>>>>>>>> yourselves from wasting cash in future too.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Are you aware that ****** has been telling people on the NEO forum
>>>>>>>>> that she/you have received assurances from Alozdi's lot that MyM is not a
>>>>>>>>> competitor for NEO?  Either ****** is the most gullible and stupid person on
>>>>>>>>> the planet or she has got so used to being dishonest that she can't
>>>>>>>>> distinguish when it's not a good idea to lie.  Everyone with a brain in
>>>>>>>>> their head knows that MyM is a direct competitor, and it doesn't do you any
>>>>>>>>> good to have someone who actually *is* representing your company
>>>>>>>>> testing the patience of the community like that.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Nor has it been helpful to you that ****** hasn't been doing
>>>>>>>>> anything worthwhile to get the message across to you that taking adverts
>>>>>>>>> which showcase counterfeit goods in NEO is doing your business harm.  I'll
>>>>>>>>> make it plain to you.  If the journalists and editor for NEO can't spot
>>>>>>>>> obviously dodgy goods and don't treat the community with any respect when
>>>>>>>>> the matter is raised then at least some people in the community will
>>>>>>>>> continue to do harm to your business by drawing attention to it until you
>>>>>>>>> catch on or go out of business.  There is no escaping that.  Turning a
>>>>>>>>> blind eye to counterfeit goods for the advertising money is not an option
>>>>>>>>> for you.  If you want to regain trust you need to turn the other way and
>>>>>>>>> start campaigning openly and properly against counterfeits.  Treat the
>>>>>>>>> community with respect and do the right thing and the community will
>>>>>>>>> respect you for it and be helpful to you.  Don't and you can expect a rough
>>>>>>>>> ride for being part of the problem.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'll be happy to share the things I know with you and help you to
>>>>>>>>> improve your internet presence at no cost if and when I see you start doing
>>>>>>>>> the right things by your customers and the wider community.  It's the NEO
>>>>>>>>> forum users, and the wider community that I am loyal to and it is their
>>>>>>>>> interests that motivate me.  Much the same is true of Manning and
>>>>>>>>> kuro_neko.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'll give you two useful pieces of information now.  First, you
>>>>>>>>> wasted your time banning the Muu_Puklip account.  If you knew how the forum
>>>>>>>>> works you would have known that it was a waste of time.  You haven't even
>>>>>>>>> cleaned up the mess you made by doing that.  It doesn't look professional
>>>>>>>>> to have your forum 'represented' by a banned account.  Unban the account
>>>>>>>>> and talk to me via that account and I will help and explain things about
>>>>>>>>> the forum to you, or at least figure out how to clear up the mess you left.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Secondly, take a very good look at your 360 Gamer forum.  One of
>>>>>>>>> your admins on there has banned more or less the whole planet to stop spam
>>>>>>>>> signups.  You won't get any spam, but you won't get any legit signups
>>>>>>>>> either.  Being greeted by a 'You have been banned' message is a sure fire
>>>>>>>>> turnoff for your customers.  It's costing you money and making you look
>>>>>>>>> incompetent.  You ought to ask why no-one who you are paying wages to has
>>>>>>>>> brought that to your attention before, yet someone like me who owes you
>>>>>>>>> nothing just has.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Have a nice day,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Muu