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Craig Wright Q&A on Slack

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May 4th, 2017
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  1. In which Craig S Wright answers questions on btcchat.slack.com initially through Vlad, then through his own account created at 6:43 AM in logs.
  2.  
  3. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  4.  
  5. ----- Today May 4th, 2017 -----
  6. christophbergmann [4:00 AM]
  7. Hei, @vlad2vlad are you here?
  8.  
  9. [4:01]
  10. You said CSW could answer any question I ask through your voice
  11.  
  12. vlad2vlad [4:01 AM]
  13. Ask away
  14.  
  15. christophbergmann [4:01 AM]
  16. cool ... I will ask several questions in next half hour
  17.  
  18. [4:01]
  19. First ... how did it come that you have become the voice of CSW?
  20.  
  21. vlad2vlad [4:02 AM]
  22. Destiny?
  23.  
  24. [4:02]
  25. Or you want me to ask him?
  26.  
  27. [4:04]
  28. I sent him the question. Any other ones.
  29.  
  30. christophbergmann [4:06 AM]
  31. No, yes, both ... I mean, I guess he did not just call you and said: Vlad, be my voice. Did you search him? How did you win his trust?
  32.  
  33. vlad2vlad [4:06 AM]
  34. Here's what he said: You are a little mad, as I am and I would not say you are my voice. And more than that, you never treated me like shit. You never required that I prove anything to befriend me. You are always civil.
  35.  
  36. [4:08]
  37. I was hitting him up on twitter last year and I also sent him some emails but I didn't expect anything to come of it. I tend to try and talk to all the major industry players.
  38.  
  39. christophbergmann [4:09 AM]
  40. When did you start believe that he is Satoshiß
  41.  
  42. [4:09]
  43. ?
  44.  
  45. [4:09]
  46. thank you for taking the time, btw
  47.  
  48. vlad2vlad [4:11 AM]
  49. I personally thought he was Satoshi before it was leaked, when I saw a 2 part video from like 2015 I think. That's what sold me on it. Then when he came out and all that crazy stuff happened it was confusing but I figured there had to be some logical explanation for it all so, unlike most people, I gave him the benefit of the doubt. I felt he at least deserved that. Everyone does until there's real proof. Media sound bytes are never proof for me.
  50.  
  51. christophbergmann [4:12 AM]
  52. Thanks
  53.  
  54. [4:12]
  55. What did he do 2010-2015?
  56.  
  57. vlad2vlad [4:20 AM]
  58. 2010-2011. I was in a shit place family wise>
  59.  
  60. I was in a court battle with the Tax office (I won this in 2012)
  61.  
  62. [4:23]
  63. In 2011 I started a co again. I moved assets in 2011. And I did contract code and security work. I was teaching at CSU until 2014. CSU runs the Police and military training.
  64.  
  65. [4:24]
  66. From 2010 to 2013 I worked for both gaming co.s and LE. They are both the ones who cared about risk. Not that perfect security is all, but risk.
  67.  
  68. [4:25]
  69. I had too many things answering gov questions form 2014 on
  70.  
  71. [4:26]
  72. I had a farm, a ranch really. Middle of nowhere. No people closer than 1KM. I could work with no disturbances. I sold it to fund some of the companies as well as other assets. I loved that place. My work comes first.
  73.  
  74. [4:27]
  75. Next question, @christophbergmann
  76.  
  77. christophbergmann [4:28 AM]
  78. why did he leave Bitcoin in 2010?
  79.  
  80. vlad2vlad [4:38 AM]
  81. I was in battles, one after another to keep what I was working on.
  82.  
  83. [4:39]
  84. https://www.comcourts.gov.au/file/Federal/P/SYG746/2010/actions
  85.  
  86. [4:40]
  87. I do not want to have people follow me. I want people to read and think. I want them to question and validate. Not to take my word or for that matter, anybodies. And worse, do not look at something in the past and make that the yardstick.
  88.  
  89. christophbergmann [4:41 AM]
  90. didn't know this source.
  91.  
  92. [4:42]
  93. Can you explain what happened? While you continued working on Bitcoin, your company went bankrupt?
  94.  
  95. vlad2vlad [4:48 AM]
  96. In 2003 I had a fight with a 5% shareholder. My first wife sided with him as she wanted me to be home more. I ended up in an 11 year court battle. Settled part and got the company. I ended up winning. You have the final judgements. are district court, so not on google and people only see what they can easily google.
  97.  
  98. [4:49]
  99. Here is what you can tell them all..
  100.  
  101. IF you need to do what I say as I am Satoshi and not because of the idea I am presenting, but the nature of my identity, then you are all lost!
  102.  
  103. If you cannot think for yourself, then all this was for nothing
  104.  
  105. [4:49]
  106. If you judge based on an identity alone, on a perceived authority, then you are sheeple and deserve all you get
  107.  
  108. [4:52]
  109. ----
  110.  
  111. [4:52]
  112. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10702001
  113.  
  114. list of "8 2 9 10 11", which is the list that GNUPG started generating a year (commit e50cac1d848d332c4dbf49d5f705d3cbbf074ba1) after the date on the key.
  115.  
  116. BS utter BS.
  117.  
  118. And this was written as I write, not a paid piece, but as I do and I was the author of the Authority paper.
  119.  
  120. And it was independantly validated.
  121.  
  122. It is simple and who actually checks?
  123.  
  124. Gmax says and it is law.
  125.  
  126. [4:52]
  127. Think. Learn that code is a tool and us humans can use tools, but it is not a panacea and can solve nothing on its own.
  128.  
  129. [4:57]
  130. There is no form of non-repudiation. This is stated again and again by those with a past in (applied)cryptography. Yet, it is a concept that does not exist.
  131.  
  132. We live in a world of people. Code is a tool, it is a means to ensure that we can control our destiny if we use it well, but it does not remove the need to check and will never remove the need to think.
  133.  
  134. christophbergmann [4:57 AM]
  135. Yeah, Greg seems obsessed with calling you a conman ...
  136.  
  137. vlad2vlad [4:57 AM]
  138. Non-Repudiation can never exist as we live in a world of law. Law is Law. Crypto is a tool that adds weight to evidence, but it is not law.
  139.  
  140. I can sign and then say my key was stolen. I can pass a key to another. This is a well established principle. In the courts, it is always possible to repudiate.
  141.  
  142. I learned this the hard way. In my case, I was given a contempt citation as I argued the fact that electronic evidence supported my assertions. I learnt that law is law in 2004 when I argued that evidence of source information can be used against you and can be falsified and that it is not possible to simply show a key as proof.
  143.  
  144. [4:58]
  145. ----
  146. MiniMax, err, Greg, is a douche. <------ my words. :)
  147.  
  148. [4:58]
  149. ---
  150.  
  151. [4:58]
  152. Bitcoin is code. It has all the faults that code has. It does not make the world an anarchist playground and with it we are not free. We are free when we are free. We are free only when we allow our minds to be free.
  153.  
  154. [4:59]
  155. We are in a tragic world. There are no fair solutions, the world is simply not fair and we can do no more than make it worse by interfering with markets and free choice.
  156.  
  157. [4:59]
  158. ‘a piratis et latronibus capta domimium non mutant’
  159.  
  160. Look it up. It is a concept of law.
  161.  
  162. christophbergmann [5:00 AM]
  163. Did you sleep in this time? You had a company, a family and developed Bitcoin.
  164.  
  165. vlad2vlad [5:01 AM]
  166. Theft of keys is a means to have access to keys, and what does it prove, only that you hold a key. Any transaction can be recovered. If you think this is not the case, deal with those with guns. Tax is forced, but try and avoid the force. Try legally.
  167.  
  168. [5:01]
  169. I spend millions to win a case worth 1.1 million. Pyrrhic. And what was the use. It changed nothing.
  170.  
  171. [5:02]
  172. End rant...
  173.  
  174. vlad2vlad [5:08 AM]
  175. I have a company. I have a family and I am enrolled in a Masters degree right now. When I complete this degree, I will start another PhD.
  176.  
  177. Back then, I was also going to conferences, this I can no longer do.
  178.  
  179. I am a full fee student. I do not take money for this. I pay my own way. No scholarships. My choice.
  180.  
  181. [5:08]
  182. So, why is this such an issue for so many people? I enjoy learning and knowledge.
  183.  
  184. [5:10]
  185. ---
  186.  
  187. [5:10]
  188. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10702001
  189.  
  190. The following is the sane response:
  191.  
  192. "grovulent 512 days ago [-]
  193.  
  194. As others have pointed out - it's arguable that publishing any claim about the identity of SN - puts the target in considerable, potential danger.
  195. Now I can understand that there is a public interest component in knowing SN's identity. And I'd even be willing to accept (but really only for sake of argument) that this public interest overrides SN's own right to privacy and safety.
  196. But to make these accusations when you yourself admit - as the article does - that there is a substantial degree of doubt, is to put at risk the safety and privacy of a person who doesn't deserve it in the least.
  197. This is an absolutely appalling thing to do to anyone. And it should be prima-facie obvious to you as to why.
  198. While I don't condone bullying of any sort - it really is the least of what these authors deserve. I personally don't feel Kanzure is bullying - merely pointing out how appalling this behaviour is, and this absolutely needs to be pointed out."
  199.  
  200. christophbergmann [5:11 AM]
  201. are you sad that you left Bitcoin in 2010? Was it a mistake?
  202.  
  203. vlad2vlad [5:15 AM]
  204. As for gaining... I gain nothing by proving I am Satoshi.
  205. My family gains nothing. We go into moving again.
  206.  
  207. I do not get money and I DO NOT want fame
  208.  
  209. [5:17]
  210. I did not leave Bitcoin. Gavin was left to manage the code with others. That is not leaving.
  211.  
  212. christophbergmann [5:18 AM]
  213. How would you call it then?
  214.  
  215. vlad2vlad [5:23 AM]
  216. I stopped responding to trolls. The base protocol was and is fine.
  217.  
  218. christophbergmann [5:29 AM]
  219. what is the base protocol?
  220.  
  221. vlad2vlad [5:31 AM]
  222. With the cap removed it remains ok.
  223.  
  224. christophbergmann [5:31 AM]
  225. which version?
  226.  
  227. [5:32]
  228. I'm not so interested in Blocksize things. We had this over and over, it already bored out Bitcoin
  229.  
  230. vlad2vlad [5:36 AM]
  231. This is the answer to "what is the base protocol"?
  232.  
  233. [5:36]
  234. The means to have miners controls the network through competition. The exchange of blocks, the format, the original script and protocols.
  235.  
  236. For example:
  237.  
  238. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp#L2249
  239.  
  240. See the comments that they all ignore.
  241.  
  242. Prove that is not Satoshi. I do not need to sign anything and I do not need to jump their hoops, it is the code.
  243. GitHub
  244. trottier/original-bitcoin
  245. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  246.  
  247.  
  248. christophbergmann [5:42 AM]
  249. I wondered how can I know that this is the original codebase ...
  250.  
  251. [5:42]
  252. Some other question
  253.  
  254. [5:42]
  255. Why did you not publish a signed message?
  256.  
  257. vlad2vlad [5:43 AM]
  258. Continued from last response: What we need is simple, it is competition. Not a central authority. Not a 1984 double speak committee, but open and free competition.
  259.  
  260. This means that people are allowed to build on top of the base protocol. That the miners decide (see the 08 paper). If people do not like it, they can lobby miners or better, invest in hash power.
  261.  
  262. This way, changes are made based on what the market decides. Not an authority, the market. Each tries and fails and grows based on supply to a market.
  263.  
  264. vlad2vlad [5:49 AM]
  265. Answer to your last questing about signing a message:
  266.  
  267. [5:49]
  268. URGH!
  269.  
  270. 1. Tax. I am not offering proof that is proof. If I can access or not is MY business and it stays that way.
  271.  
  272. 2. More importantly, stop looking to a bloody saviour!
  273.  
  274. Markets are the answer, free open competition. Not Satoshi on his bloody white horse. Markets!
  275.  
  276. [5:51]
  277. Layer 2 networks will require the introduction of AML and intermediary controls. These are localised networks in the form of existing intermediaries.
  278.  
  279. They can be allowed to operate with Bitcoin competitively, but not at the expense of open exchange. This being what they fear, why use L2 if you have no need?
  280.  
  281. [5:52]
  282. Those who do not think that government can set in and control this are either naive or malicious. There is no other view. This is not a false dichotomy. These are the only options.
  283.  
  284. [5:53]
  285. In all cases, L2 will require systems that can be controlled and they will require the interaction of merchants and other parties. Networks such as lightning centralise and offer control on a platter.
  286.  
  287. christophbergmann [5:53 AM]
  288. Something else ... now you are Chief Scientis at nChain, right?
  289.  
  290. vlad2vlad [6:02 AM]
  291. Yes. I will not discuss the company though.
  292.  
  293. [6:02]
  294. The others will. I say too much and get in trouble already.
  295.  
  296. [6:03]
  297. I am not a CEO for a good reason. I am good at maths and code, I can write responses that nobody reads that are cogent and sincere, but when it comes to politics and fronting things, I just dig holes for myself
  298.  
  299. christophbergmann [6:06 AM]
  300. Ok, can you say when the software will go open source?
  301.  
  302. vlad2vlad [6:24 AM]
  303. Not answering re times for Open Source. It is underway.
  304.  
  305. cryptonaut [6:34 AM]
  306. @vlad2vlad CSW won't use slack or something? Would be interesting to get him on here.
  307.  
  308. vlad2vlad [6:35 AM]
  309. I seriously doubt it but I'll ask him@
  310.  
  311. cryptonaut [6:36 AM]
  312. Here's a question. Is Scronty legit or is this story just some fan fiction? (long read, but seems to align closely with the CSW story) https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/5aflch/bitcoin_origins/
  313. reddit
  314. Bitcoin Origins • r/Bitcoin
  315. Afternoon, All. Today marks the eighth anniversary of the publication of the Bitcoin white paper. As a special tribute, I will provide you with...
  316.  
  317.  
  318. [6:38]
  319. If CSW is true and that above thread is true, Team Satoshi appears to consist of Craig, whoever that Scronty guy is, and David
  320.  
  321. vlad2vlad [6:38 AM]
  322. Dr. Wright says he'll come take a look in this channel but he's not gonna join.
  323.  
  324. [6:39]
  325. Who's got a link for this channel?
  326.  
  327. cryptonaut [6:40 AM]
  328. if you click on your name in the top left corner there should be an option to invite people by email
  329.  
  330. [6:41]
  331. tell him to make a throwaway if he wants to check it out but not join and get harrassed
  332.  
  333. csw [6:43 AM]
  334. joined #general
  335.  
  336. cryptonaut [6:43 AM]
  337. :new_moon_with_face: :rocket:
  338.  
  339. csw [6:44 AM]
  340. Scronty is a wanker
  341.  
  342. csw [6:44 AM]
  343. I am tired of people saying they worked with me. Scronty even got the number of BTC wrong.
  344.  
  345. 2 replies Last reply today at 9:18 AM View thread
  346.  
  347. vlad2vlad [6:45 AM]
  348. Welcome Dr. Wright!!!!
  349.  
  350. cryptonaut [6:45 AM]
  351. so just some fan fiction then? and yes, welcome :smile:
  352.  
  353. csw [6:46 AM]
  354. Yes, and not a fan
  355.  
  356. [6:47]
  357. "I wondered how can I know that this is the original codebase ..."
  358.  
  359. [6:47]
  360. It is not, it is close, but it is available on the satoshi Inst as well.
  361.  
  362. cryptonaut [6:47 AM]
  363. Are you able to say how many there were on the team? 3, or was there more? Not that it matters really
  364.  
  365. csw [6:47 AM]
  366. The first released code was 0.0.9
  367.  
  368. [6:47]
  369. It crashed.
  370.  
  371. onchainscaling [6:47 AM]
  372. Why was 21 million chosen? was it arbitrary number or is there a reason for that particular number?
  373.  
  374. csw [6:48 AM]
  375. The first other users are Bear and Hal
  376.  
  377. [6:48]
  378. M1
  379.  
  380. [6:48]
  381. 21 million links to global M1
  382.  
  383. christophbergmann [6:48 AM]
  384. Hallo Mr. Wright!
  385.  
  386. csw [6:49 AM]
  387. There are no decimal points, 21 million is the reference for people, the no. Satoshi (and I did not call them that) are related to M1 (edited)
  388.  
  389. cryptonaut [6:50 AM]
  390. can you expand on that?
  391.  
  392. csw [6:50 AM]
  393. http://lexicon.ft.com/Term?term=m0,-m1,-m2,-m3,-m4
  394.  
  395. [6:51]
  396. If you read the 08 paper, you will note the use of fiat as a value.
  397.  
  398. [6:51]
  399. Sect, 9. Page 5
  400.  
  401. [6:51]
  402. In the use of 21 million x 10^8 parts you have a value that maps to the cent
  403.  
  404. [6:51]
  405. That is, to global M1
  406.  
  407. vlad2vlad [6:52 AM]
  408. So bitcoin is meant to displace global fiat
  409.  
  410. [6:52]
  411. ?
  412.  
  413. csw [6:52 AM]
  414. This would be 21,000,000,000,000 USD as M1.
  415.  
  416. 21,000 trillion
  417.  
  418. [6:52]
  419. The idea is global cash.
  420.  
  421. [6:52]
  422. A single world currency
  423.  
  424. [6:53]
  425. Can I assume that you have read Hayek's work on global money?
  426.  
  427. vlad2vlad [6:53 AM]
  428. You're not gonna have many friends out there. But if you can pull it off bitcoin is gonna reach astronomical levels.
  429.  
  430. [6:53]
  431. No. But i will. :)
  432.  
  433. csw [6:53 AM]
  434. I have few friends.
  435.  
  436. cryptonaut [6:53 AM]
  437. section 9 is titled 'combining and splitting value" and does not mention a fiat value
  438.  
  439. csw [6:54 AM]
  440. I am not looking for them, I work best as I am and I find having a head in maths and code does not make one amiable to others.
  441.  
  442. [6:54]
  443. "Although it would be possible to handle coins individually, it would be unwieldy to make a
  444. separate transaction for every cent in a transfer"
  445.  
  446. [6:55]
  447. I believe that you will find that in S9.
  448.  
  449. cryptonaut [6:55 AM]
  450. right
  451.  
  452. [6:56]
  453. gotcha
  454.  
  455. csw [6:56 AM]
  456. I am sorry, I can be a little vague... If I am, ask for explanations.
  457.  
  458. [6:56]
  459. I make assumptions of knowledge
  460.  
  461. cryptonaut [6:57 AM]
  462. all good, just trying to piece together
  463.  
  464. csw [6:57 AM]
  465. It comes from too long inside universities
  466.  
  467. cryptonaut [6:57 AM]
  468. never been :wink:
  469.  
  470. csw [6:57 AM]
  471. Never been out...
  472.  
  473.  
  474. vlad2vlad [6:57 AM]
  475. Lol
  476.  
  477. csw [7:00 AM]
  478. Re: Bitcoin P2P e-cash paper 2008-11-10 14:09:26 UTC
  479.  
  480.  
  481. James A. Donald wrote:
  482. > Furthermore, it cannot be made to work, as in the
  483. > proposed system the work of tracking who owns what coins
  484. > is paid for by seigniorage, which requires inflation.
  485.  
  486. If you're having trouble with the inflation issue, it's easy to tweak it for
  487. transaction fees instead. It's as simple as this: let the output value from
  488. any transaction be 1 cent less than the input value. Either the client
  489. software automatically writes transactions for 1 cent more than the intended
  490. payment value, or it could come out of the payee's side. The incentive value
  491. when a node finds a proof-of-work for a block could be the total of the fees in
  492. the block.
  493.  
  494. Satoshi Nakamoto
  495.  
  496. cryptonaut [7:01 AM]
  497. Hah. So google tells me M1 USD supply is just under 2.1 trillion. Total # of satoshis is 2100 trillion. Close enough I say lol.
  498.  
  499. csw [7:01 AM]
  500. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/util.cpp#L210
  501. GitHub
  502. trottier/original-bitcoin
  503. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  504.  
  505.  
  506. [7:02]
  507. Have a look at the code.
  508.  
  509. [7:03]
  510. n /= CENT;
  511.  
  512. @212; 255; 261
  513. in src/util.cpp
  514.  
  515. [7:03]
  516. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.h#L17
  517. GitHub
  518. trottier/original-bitcoin
  519. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  520.  
  521.  
  522. [7:03]
  523. Main.h
  524.  
  525. [7:03]
  526. Defined against Cents
  527.  
  528. [7:04]
  529. // Value
  530. int64 nValue = (GetRand(9) + 1) * 100 * CENT;
  531. if (GetBalance() < nValue)
  532. {
  533. wxMessageBox("Out of money ");
  534. return;
  535. }
  536. nValue += (nRep % 100) * CENT;
  537.  
  538. [7:04]
  539. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/ui.cpp#L3178
  540. GitHub
  541. trottier/original-bitcoin
  542. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  543.  
  544.  
  545. [7:04]
  546. Do you require more evidence?
  547.  
  548. cryptonaut [7:08 AM]
  549. makes sense to me. Here's one for you though: what was the thinking behind adding the 1MB block limit that we are now dealing with 2.5+ years drama to solve?
  550.  
  551. csw [7:08 AM]
  552. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp
  553. GitHub
  554. trottier/original-bitcoin
  555. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  556.  
  557.  
  558. [7:09]
  559. // Transaction fee requirements, mainly only needed for flood control
  560. // Under 10K (about 80 inputs) is free for first 100 transactions
  561. // Base rate is 0.01 per KB
  562. int64 nMinFee = tx.GetMinFee(pblock->vtx.size() < 100);
  563.  
  564. [7:09]
  565. At 0.08 cents a BTC, flood control did not work.
  566.  
  567. [7:09]
  568. At more than 100USD, it does
  569.  
  570. [7:09]
  571. We are at more than 100USD a BTC right now.
  572.  
  573. [7:10]
  574. In early 2010, the number of nodes (please note, nodes are always verification agents, that is miners) was low. (edited)
  575.  
  576. cryptonaut [7:10 AM]
  577. friggin $2200 canadian on localbitcoins right now
  578.  
  579. csw [7:11 AM]
  580. It should be higher. The more people can use BitCoin natively, the more the value will increase.
  581.  
  582.  
  583. cryptonaut [7:11 AM]
  584. spelling it BitCoin is heresy you know :stuck_out_tongue:
  585.  
  586. csw [7:12 AM]
  587. This is not as has been suggested exponential, but logistic
  588.  
  589. [7:12]
  590. It was in the early code as BitCoin
  591.  
  592. cryptonaut [7:12 AM]
  593. eh, looks ugly though. But yeah, to the moon and such
  594.  
  595. csw [7:12 AM]
  596. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/readme.txt
  597. GitHub
  598. trottier/original-bitcoin
  599. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  600.  
  601.  
  602. [7:13]
  603. Line 1: BitCoin v0.1.3 ALPHA
  604.  
  605. cryptonaut [7:13 AM]
  606. Line 13: Bitcoin. Inconsistent lol
  607.  
  608. csw [7:13 AM]
  609. I have never been accused of being a designer
  610.  
  611. [7:13]
  612. I also never said I am perfect and yes, I do go back and forth.
  613.  
  614. [7:14]
  615. Lines 34 - 36:
  616.  
  617. To support the network by running a node, select:
  618.  
  619. Options->Generate Coins
  620.  
  621. cryptonaut [7:14 AM]
  622. I tend to do the same when naming things
  623.  
  624. csw [7:14 AM]
  625. Code naming conventions do not always move into the real world well.
  626.  
  627. cryptonaut [7:14 AM]
  628. true
  629.  
  630. csw [7:14 AM]
  631. Words are not variables as much as I would like to have this be so
  632.  
  633. [7:16]
  634. I thought the comments in the code were rather good, then it seems they are either ignored or they are not read.
  635.  
  636. [7:16]
  637. Either saddens me, though I cannot state which would sadden me more.
  638.  
  639. cryptonaut [7:16 AM]
  640. which points or comments do you feel are being ignored?
  641.  
  642. csw [7:17 AM]
  643. Have you read Brooks?
  644.  
  645. [7:17]
  646. Mythical Man Month, 1975, 1995 re-printed
  647.  
  648. cryptonaut [7:17 AM]
  649. I have not
  650.  
  651. csw [7:17 AM]
  652. A shame.
  653.  
  654. [7:17]
  655. Page 65 from memory of Brooks
  656.  
  657. [7:18]
  658. Triple redundancy
  659.  
  660. [7:18]
  661. //
  662. // "Never go to sea with two chronometers; take one or three."
  663. // Our three chronometers are:
  664. // - System clock
  665. // - Median of other server's clocks
  666. // - NTP servers
  667. //
  668. // note: NTP isn't implemented yet, so until then we just use the median
  669. // of other nodes clocks to correct ours.
  670. //
  671.  
  672. [7:18]
  673. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/util.cpp#L326
  674. GitHub
  675. trottier/original-bitcoin
  676. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  677.  
  678.  
  679. [7:19]
  680. I do not see why there are arguments on things link the use off NTP as a base that is averaged in the system between nodes.
  681.  
  682. [7:19]
  683. The code has a number of comments stating that this is to be done.
  684.  
  685. [7:20]
  686. // Only let other nodes change our clock so far before we
  687. // go to the NTP servers
  688. /// todo: Get time from NTP servers, then set a flag
  689. /// to make sure it doesn't get changed again
  690. }
  691.  
  692. [7:22]
  693. And it should not be monolithic...
  694.  
  695. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/net.cpp#L893
  696. GitHub
  697. trottier/original-bitcoin
  698. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  699.  
  700.  
  701. [7:22]
  702. //// todo: start one thread per processor, use getenv("NUMBER_OF_PROCESSORS")
  703.  
  704. [7:22]
  705. And the market place was never fixed.
  706. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/ui.cpp#L1619
  707. GitHub
  708. trottier/original-bitcoin
  709. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  710.  
  711.  
  712. cryptonaut [7:23 AM]
  713. I'm not too familiar with the nuances of NTP and server clocks etc, just a humble web developer. To get back to the 1MB block size thing for a second - did you anticipate the difficulty of removing or replacing the limit that we are currently experiencing?
  714.  
  715. csw [7:23 AM]
  716. There was supposed to be a means to have a merchant exchange a message with the purchaser. This would be a direct PoS system, no need for Visa etc.
  717.  
  718. [7:24]
  719. 2010
  720.  
  721. [7:24]
  722. See email
  723.  
  724. [7:24]
  725. Well before we get to where we are RIGHT NOW it is possible to preempt this and have an increase.
  726.  
  727. jp [7:25 AM]
  728. Why did you credit Adam Back hashcash when you didn't use it?
  729.  
  730. csw [7:25 AM]
  731. Adam intro'd Wei
  732.  
  733. [7:25]
  734. I do not generally talk to people I do not know. Not without an intro
  735.  
  736. jp [7:26 AM]
  737. But why credit him while you not used his? This wrong citation creates this evil blockstream
  738.  
  739. csw [7:26 AM]
  740. Adam was helpful for all that he said it would not work, but I am used to people saying my work is not worth considering.
  741.  
  742. jp [7:26 AM]
  743. Why you didn't credit triple entry accounting?
  744.  
  745. csw [7:27 AM]
  746. I am not able to see the future.
  747.  
  748. cryptonaut [7:27 AM]
  749. re: merchant exchange, decent idea but probably premature and not the best idea to put so many use cases into a single application (for example, the wallet accounts system used by Core is total garbage)
  750.  
  751. csw [7:27 AM]
  752. The list of references would be in the 100s of pages if I was to list the giants it was built to stand upon.
  753.  
  754. jp [7:28 AM]
  755. You used triple entry accounting in 2005 to inspire blockchain. But instead you credited something not actually used
  756.  
  757. csw [7:28 AM]
  758. Yes, the marketplace was far too early. And my design skills are far too poor.
  759.  
  760. [7:28]
  761. Using wxHtml was also a mistake.
  762.  
  763. jp [7:29 AM]
  764. It is why Ian grigg was heavily undervalued while core Adam back is crook
  765.  
  766. cryptonaut [7:29 AM]
  767. the idea for PoW is an iteration/evolution of hashcash so I don't think the citation is off base really
  768.  
  769. csw [7:29 AM]
  770. And triple entry accounting was something I stayed away from commenting
  771.  
  772. jp [7:29 AM]
  773. It is not too late to comment now
  774.  
  775. csw [7:29 AM]
  776. It was something I was introduced to when I was working at BDO, an accounting firm
  777.  
  778. jp [7:29 AM]
  779. Yes. Granger did
  780.  
  781. csw [7:31 AM]
  782. Again, I never foresaw the world to come as it has come. I did not see the politics. I saw state actors as more the issue than Adam B(l)ack
  783.  
  784.  
  785. jp [7:31 AM]
  786. I Think you should also correct the citation. Adam back himself was surprised when he saw he was credited
  787.  
  788. christophbergmann [7:31 AM]
  789. why was Ian Grigg heavily undervalued, @jp ?
  790.  
  791. cryptonaut [7:31 AM]
  792. what a mind trip adam must have had lol
  793.  
  794. jp [7:32 AM]
  795. He was the one kept looking for hmwjo SN was because he was surprised as his name was included in whitepaper while he knew hashcash was not used
  796.  
  797. csw [7:32 AM]
  798. It is published. Papers should not be played with
  799.  
  800. [7:32]
  801. I am not a god, I am a researcher. I code, I do maths and I am fallible. (edited)
  802.  
  803. jp [7:33 AM]
  804. It is not late to correctly credit people whose works you used.
  805.  
  806. [7:33]
  807. Adam back is not and should not be on whitepaper because of just an introduction email to Wei Dai
  808.  
  809. csw [7:34 AM]
  810. Should not. Is. These are separate concepts.
  811.  
  812. tomothy
  813. [7:34 AM]
  814. I know you touched on the 1mb cap and mining but can you comment on the idea of the UASF, (user activated soft fork) and your thought on using it to implement segwit? Also general thoughts on segwit? Thanks.
  815.  
  816. csw [7:34 AM]
  817. I do not want to be found. I did not want to be found.
  818.  
  819. cryptonaut [7:34 AM]
  820. frankly unless csw somehow 100% proves he is satoshi, any whitepaper update wouldn't be taken seriously and probably a waste of time. Plus blockstream is already a thing, too late for that
  821.  
  822.  
  823. csw [7:35 AM]
  824. UASF - Miners are nodes. Nodes are miners.
  825.  
  826. [7:35]
  827. There are NO full non-mining nodes.
  828.  
  829.  
  830. [7:35]
  831. Please read the paper.
  832.  
  833. [7:35]
  834. It is VERY VERY clear
  835.  
  836. [7:35]
  837. If you have issues, look at the code.
  838.  
  839. tomothy
  840. [7:35 AM]
  841. And then segwit generally?
  842.  
  843. csw [7:36 AM]
  844. "Nodes" that are not mining are wallets, these are fat SPV systems and sock puppets
  845.  
  846. [7:36]
  847. SegWit centralises the system
  848.  
  849. jp [7:36 AM]
  850. What is your plan to stop segwit? A hard fork coming soon?
  851.  
  852. csw [7:36 AM]
  853. It means that developers can make further changes without a consensus
  854.  
  855. bdd [7:36 AM]
  856. joined #general
  857.  
  858. csw [7:37 AM]
  859. There will not be an update. Mistakes on referencing or not
  860.  
  861. tomothy
  862. [7:37 AM]
  863. To the best of your knowledge, does segwit infringe on any patents?
  864.  
  865. csw [7:38 AM]
  866. And I will not prove. I am not here to prove. If you need to listen as you think that I am and this is the sole reason, then it is lost to you in any event.
  867.  
  868. [7:38]
  869. Tomothy.
  870.  
  871. [7:38]
  872. Yes
  873.  
  874. [7:38]
  875. I cannot expand on that here and now.
  876.  
  877. [7:39]
  878. That will be addressed soon and in the manner that is requires
  879.  
  880. tomothy
  881. [7:39 AM]
  882. And is it safe to the assume that the creators of segwit had alterior motives for creating it, introducing it, and refusing to increase 1mb limit?
  883.  
  884. [7:39]
  885. Understood. Eagerly await.
  886.  
  887. csw [7:39 AM]
  888. I cannot speak for the motivations of others I do not know intimately
  889.  
  890. jp [7:39 AM]
  891. What can we do to help?
  892.  
  893.  
  894. csw [7:40 AM]
  895. Law is Law.
  896. Cryptographic tools are tools.
  897. I know many do not see this, but when it comes to intellectual property, it is rather certain.
  898.  
  899. [7:40]
  900. To help... compete.
  901.  
  902. [7:40]
  903. Competition and markets are the source of human freedom and innovation.
  904.  
  905. [7:41]
  906. Make something.
  907.  
  908.  
  909. [7:41]
  910. Develop
  911.  
  912. jp [7:41 AM]
  913. Compete in what way? I see that the SDK is one stone two birds. Kill core and alts
  914.  
  915. csw [7:41 AM]
  916. And if you fail for the n-th time... Start and try again.
  917.  
  918. cryptonaut [7:41 AM]
  919. amen to that, @jp compete in all ways :stuck_out_tongue:
  920.  
  921. [7:41]
  922. getting super late here, I'm out guys. Cheers
  923.  
  924.  
  925. jp [7:41 AM]
  926. Will there be any smart contract applications coming?
  927.  
  928. csw [7:41 AM]
  929. I cannot discuss that./
  930.  
  931. [7:42]
  932. I also need to go.
  933. I am sorry, but I have a lot to do.
  934.  
  935.  
  936. jp [7:42 AM]
  937. Thank you.
  938.  
  939. tomothy
  940. [7:42 AM]
  941. Same, thanks for providing so many responses!
  942.  
  943. csw [7:42 AM]
  944. Please, all I ask is do not follow me, a developer or anyone based on who they are. Look anytime, everytime on the solution, the effects and the trade-off.
  945.  
  946.  
  947. bitsko [7:43 AM]
  948. thank you for your thoughts!
  949.  
  950. csw [7:43 AM]
  951. Please remember, this is a world of scarcity, there is always something that is a trade-off, a cost and we cannot just assume that a change comes without a cost.
  952.  
  953. [7:43]
  954. Fair well.
  955.  
  956.  
  957. jp [7:45 AM]
  958. And he gone.
  959.  
  960. cypherblock [7:45 AM]
  961. well that was interesting.
  962.  
  963. bitsko [7:46 AM]
  964. :awesome: :ohyeah: :awesome: :ohyeah: :success: :success: :wut: :rocket:
  965.  
  966. norway [7:47 AM]
  967. This is crazy.
  968.  
  969. tomothy
  970. [7:47 AM]
  971. Thanks for making that happen vlad
  972.  
  973. vlad2vlad [7:47 AM]
  974. BOOM!!! Told you guys Dr Wright was the real deal!!!
  975.  
  976. tomothy
  977. [7:47 AM]
  978. I still expect some God damn fireworks though. That better not be the end of it.
  979.  
  980.  
  981. vlad2vlad [7:47 AM]
  982. I do what I do. ;p
  983.  
  984. [7:48]
  985. I don't think that's the end of it. It's like core is gonna compromise.
  986.  
  987. tomothy
  988. [7:48 AM]
  989. We need that tabloid inquirer type juice too
  990.  
  991. jp [7:48 AM]
  992. I told you were a working tool. Good one.
  993.  
  994. vlad2vlad [7:48 AM]
  995. Lol.
  996.  
  997. tomothy
  998. [7:48 AM]
  999. LOL compromise LOL
  1000.  
  1001. vlad2vlad [7:48 AM]
  1002. Haha
  1003.  
  1004. norway [7:49 AM]
  1005. I like this one: "There are NO full non-mining nodes."
  1006.  
  1007.  
  1008. cypherblock [7:49 AM]
  1009. I thought his first post was interesting.
  1010.  
  1011. norway [7:50 AM]
  1012. Bitcoin mapped to current M1 makes a lot of sense.
  1013.  
  1014. vlad2vlad [7:50 AM]
  1015. Replace cash. Brilliant.
  1016.  
  1017. norway [7:51 AM]
  1018. M1 is not just physical cash. It's also spending accounts.
  1019.  
  1020. vlad2vlad [7:51 AM]
  1021. Yeah, cash equivalents
  1022.  
  1023. [7:52]
  1024. That was a solid showing
  1025.  
  1026. cypherblock [7:53 AM]
  1027. @vlad2vlad why did his first post here call out Scronty. Were you guys discussing him previously?
  1028.  
  1029. vlad2vlad [7:53 AM]
  1030. I don't think so. Not sure if someone else maybe mentioned him.
  1031.  
  1032. jp [7:54 AM]
  1033. Scronty is a wannabe wanker
  1034.  
  1035. vlad2vlad [7:54 AM]
  1036. Lol
  1037.  
  1038. jp [7:54 AM]
  1039. He even sent emails asking for 500k btc
  1040.  
  1041. norway [7:54 AM]
  1042. I made a calculation of potential bitcoin value a couple of years ago. I used M2 (Cash + spending accounts + savings accounts) as the basis. It's these pie charts: https://i.imgur.com/KA8CuED.png (231kB)
  1043.  
  1044. vlad2vlad [7:55 AM]
  1045. That guy messaged me telling me crazy stuff. Sounded desperate. Scammer type.
  1046.  
  1047. cypherblock [7:55 AM]
  1048. ah I see @cryptonaut posted question about Scronty. Scronty seems like a nice guy, either he is full of shit or he is not. Same as csw.
  1049.  
  1050. jp [7:57 AM]
  1051. Scronty sent emails demanding 500k btc
  1052.  
  1053. cypherblock [7:57 AM]
  1054. @jp please post
  1055.  
  1056. [7:58]
  1057. csw posted ~invalid~ faked, scammy satoshi signatures. (edited)
  1058.  
  1059. jp [7:58 AM]
  1060. uploaded this image: Screenshot_20170504-045821.png
  1061. Add Comment
  1062.  
  1063. vlad2vlad [7:58 AM]
  1064. Scronty told me he asked for 500k BTC. Said it was owed to him
  1065.  
  1066. jp [7:59 AM]
  1067. uploaded this image: Screenshot_20170504-045849.jpg
  1068. Add Comment
  1069.  
  1070. cypherblock [8:00 AM]
  1071. @jp didn’t look like a demand there, but that is semantics I suppose. Sounds like he was involved then? Can you confirm?
  1072.  
  1073. jp [8:00 AM]
  1074. Oh. It was a lot of rants prior that
  1075.  
  1076. [8:01]
  1077. Scronty was not involved. He is pissed off because he was not
  1078.  
  1079. [8:01]
  1080. Like you knew someone before he/she getting famous and now you jump up and down to tell people that you two were best friend forever lol
  1081.  
  1082. vlad2vlad [8:02 AM]
  1083. @jp are you Joseph?
  1084.  
  1085. cypherblock [8:02 AM]
  1086. Not involved at all? Didn’t help author the white paper or see any drafts of it prior to publication and give feedback on that?
  1087.  
  1088. jp [8:02 AM]
  1089. John Paterson
  1090.  
  1091. [8:02]
  1092. Not involved
  1093.  
  1094. [8:02]
  1095. You can write that fantasy novel too
  1096.  
  1097. [8:02]
  1098. By gathering public info and some studies
  1099.  
  1100. newliberty [8:03 AM]
  1101. joined #general
  1102.  
  1103. cypherblock [8:03 AM]
  1104. @jp who came up with using hashcash (yes I know you hate) pow? Was that csw?
  1105.  
  1106. tomothy
  1107. [8:03 AM]
  1108. NL this is slack text I wanted to send or link dunno how
  1109.  
  1110. jp [8:04 AM]
  1111. No. Hashcash was not used
  1112.  
  1113. [8:04]
  1114. It is why I raised this issue
  1115.  
  1116. cypherblock [8:04 AM]
  1117. double sha256 as pow then. who came up with that?
  1118.  
  1119. jp [8:04 AM]
  1120. Adam Back was surprised when he was credited
  1121.  
  1122. [8:05]
  1123. He kept wondering who was Satoshi because Adam back said solutions Satoshi put, wouldn't work
  1124.  
  1125. [8:05]
  1126. And here we re. Adam back tries to steal everything
  1127.  
  1128. [8:06]
  1129. Wei Dai helped
  1130.  
  1131. tomtomtom7 [8:06 AM]
  1132. joined #general
  1133.  
  1134. tomothy
  1135. [8:07 AM]
  1136. I think he might now be in http://btcchat.slack.com
  1137.  
  1138. [8:07]
  1139. If you have access
  1140.  
  1141. cypherblock [8:07 AM]
  1142. @jp but bitcoin does use double sha256 as proof of work, so there is some basis for referencing another work that also used that.
  1143.  
  1144. tomothy
  1145. [8:08 AM]
  1146. For those just joining and hoping to get some answers. Was just told he got there and is talking also
  1147.  
  1148. jp [8:08 AM]
  1149. Read Ddos resistance paper
  1150.  
  1151. tomothy
  1152. [8:08 AM]
  1153. Unless this is that slack... Lol I don't think it is though, right? To many slacks
  1154.  
  1155. cypherblock [8:08 AM]
  1156. @timothy this is btcchat yes.
  1157.  
  1158. jp [8:09 AM]
  1159. Hashcash was used for email spam
  1160.  
  1161. tomothy
  1162. [8:09 AM]
  1163. Oh. Damn, sorry NL.
  1164.  
  1165. jp [8:09 AM]
  1166. It was hashcash original purpose
  1167.  
  1168. cypherblock [8:09 AM]
  1169. @jp yes I am aware. I completely agree that bitcoin is far far different than hashcash
  1170.  
  1171. jp [8:10 AM]
  1172. Too much fantasy from email spam solution to bitcoin as Adam back claims. Totally scam
  1173.  
  1174. cypherblock [8:11 AM]
  1175. but still the concept of proof of work, of something that is easy to verify and hard to create is important. Adam came up with good solution for that and saw its use but obviously nothing like bitcoin.
  1176.  
  1177. vlad2vlad [8:11 AM]
  1178. JVP?? Man, Dr. Wright brought in the big strangers. Welcome, @newliberty
  1179.  
  1180. jp [8:11 AM]
  1181. If the whitepaper citations were done properly, actually credit properly then we wouldn't have blockstream Adam Back of today
  1182.  
  1183. [8:11]
  1184. But as Dr. Wright said, he could not see the future
  1185.  
  1186. [8:13]
  1187. Hal Finney, Dave Kleiman. Wei Dai were the team. If anyone else claimed to be a part of It and asking for money, it is scammer
  1188.  
  1189. vlad2vlad [8:15 AM]
  1190. @jp What about bear? I'm pretty sure he helped out early on
  1191.  
  1192. jp [8:16 AM]
  1193. I won't comment on that.
  1194.  
  1195. vlad2vlad [8:16 AM]
  1196. The answer is yes.
  1197.  
  1198. cypherblock [8:16 AM]
  1199. yeah who is bear? Sorry I mean I’m not familiar with that moniker, is he referenced elsewhere?
  1200.  
  1201. vlad2vlad [8:16 AM]
  1202. I actually talked to him a couple weeks ago about another project
  1203.  
  1204. [8:16]
  1205. Ray Dillinger
  1206.  
  1207. [8:17]
  1208. Maybe we can get him in here too. Bring back the whole team. Minus Hal, of course.
  1209.  
  1210. jp [8:17 AM]
  1211. Minus Dave K
  1212.  
  1213. vlad2vlad [8:17 AM]
  1214. Oops. Him too.
  1215.  
  1216. [8:18]
  1217. I've got Gavin's email. Gonna try him
  1218.  
  1219. jp [8:19 AM]
  1220. Adam Back should stop riding the bitcoin whitepaper coattail
  1221.  
  1222. vlad2vlad [8:20 AM]
  1223. I sent bear and Gavin and invite. Maybe we'll get a super dev slack going here.
  1224.  
  1225.  
  1226. awemany [8:25 AM]
  1227. joined #general
  1228.  
  1229. bitsko [8:27 AM]
  1230. Was trying to get full text with slack signup as title for a pastebin. Looks like i didnt get it all, now on cell and must work. :fearful:
  1231.  
  1232. travin [8:27 AM]
  1233. joined #general
  1234.  
  1235. cypherblock [8:29 AM]
  1236. @jp were you involved with early bitcoin? You are not jvp right? Sorry so many monikers to track.
  1237.  
  1238. jp [8:29 AM]
  1239. As Dr. Wright said, he is tired of having people saying that they worked with him.
  1240.  
  1241. tomothy
  1242. [8:29 AM]
  1243. Yeah also on mobile, Vlad maybe make a pastebin of today's excitement?
  1244. 1 reply Today at 8:31 AM View thread
  1245.  
  1246. jp [8:29 AM]
  1247. I am John Paterson
  1248.  
  1249. csw [8:30 AM]
  1250. No, I posted a link to read Satre.
  1251.  
  1252. Pinned by jp
  1253. Today at 8:32 AM Pinned by jp
  1254. [8:31]
  1255. Please read the following (translated) page for this:
  1256. http://www.nybooks.com/articles/1964/12/17/sartre-on-the-nobel-prize/
  1257. The New York Review of Books
  1258. Sartre on the Nobel Prize
  1259. Jean-Paul Sartre explained his refusal to accept the Nobel Prize for Literature in a statement made to the Swedish Press on October 22, which appeared in Le Monde in a French translation approved by Sartre. The following translation into English was made by Richard Howard. I deeply regret the fact that the incident has become … (13kB)
  1260.  
  1261. vlad2vlad [8:32 AM]
  1262. I'm also on mobile. 4 years strong
  1263.  
  1264. xhiggy [8:33 AM]
  1265. joined #general
  1266.  
  1267. vlad2vlad [8:33 AM]
  1268. Now I remember reading that
  1269.  
  1270. awemany [8:34 AM]
  1271. csw, so what I am wondering, given the general hands-off attitude you seem to possess: why do you want to get involved with Bitcoin development again through nchain? Do you distrust the market? Or do you think the market simply includes you as a market participant as well, and it therefore should reflect your actions?
  1272.  
  1273. csw [8:34 AM]
  1274. East vs West, this is a cultural comment. It does not relate to what people see, but to order and anarchy. Neither is the way. Being a Libertarian is a means to allow free trade and market solutions, but it requires institutions.
  1275.  
  1276. [8:34]
  1277. The market is all I trust!
  1278.  
  1279. [8:35]
  1280. Am I being a wet blanket here, or does anyone understand the point of the Satre rejection letter?
  1281.  
  1282. [8:36]
  1283. There exists nothing to relate a free market based global money to. It is as a consequence of never truly having been free. The "Gold standard" was in fact a Gold exchange standard and worse, it was a BiMetalist system (edited)
  1284.  
  1285. newliberty [8:38 AM]
  1286. There've been a number of different gold standards, so there's not really a standard gold standard.
  1287.  
  1288. tomothy
  1289. [8:39 AM]
  1290. The point of the letter is apt and plainly similar. Thanks for sharing.
  1291.  
  1292. csw [8:39 AM]
  1293. Everyone seeks an authority. This is what BitCoin was created to bypass. We can all trade and we can do this as the market determines. Not as a consequence of a high priesthood, but through trial and error, failure and just sheer will to try and learn and fail again.
  1294.  
  1295. [8:40]
  1296. Satoshi has to be a myth. If you make me, or anyone a 'God', an infallible authority, then what is the point?
  1297.  
  1298.  
  1299. cypherblock [8:40 AM]
  1300. did you purposely want to undermine Gavin as a way to remove his authority as well? That seems a bit, well, rough.
  1301.  
  1302. charlieshrem [8:41 AM]
  1303. joined #general
  1304.  
  1305. charlieshrem [8:42 AM]
  1306. Hey
  1307. 2 replies Last reply today at 8:42 AM View thread
  1308.  
  1309. awemany [8:42 AM]
  1310. csw: yes that authority part makes a lot of sense and also why the creator had to hide. this is why I am wondering about your personal involvement again. is nchain going to be funded by early coins?
  1311.  
  1312. csw [8:42 AM]
  1313. Core should not tell you what to do. They need to propose and allow the market to decide. Bitcoin solves the issue of sock puppets in a manner analogous to the gambler at the roulette table. This means we propose and allow it to compete and to see what we can have, not as a centralised system but through many groups.
  1314.  
  1315. newliberty [8:42 AM]
  1316. Recognizing "Satoshi" ought be more about gratitude than authority seeking. Authorities are to be questioned.
  1317.  
  1318. csw [8:42 AM]
  1319. nChain is funded, but I will not discuss that. There are people in the group who will.
  1320.  
  1321. jp [8:42 AM]
  1322. Someone pastebin this chat pls. I'm on mobile
  1323.  
  1324. csw [8:43 AM]
  1325. Authority NEEDS to be questioned.
  1326.  
  1327.  
  1328. [8:43]
  1329. I study and I write. More than that I do not ask.
  1330.  
  1331. awemany [8:43 AM]
  1332. csw: ok. Core supporters often bring forward the 'alternative implementations are menace to the network' part - what did you mean by that, in light of 'many groups' above? (edited)
  1333.  
  1334. tomothy
  1335. [8:44 AM]
  1336. Newliberty did.
  1337.  
  1338. csw [8:44 AM]
  1339. They are a menace only to those who freely decide.
  1340.  
  1341. wellspenttime [8:44 AM]
  1342. joined #general. Also, @joeldalais joined.
  1343.  
  1344. csw [8:44 AM]
  1345. If you consider the flaw in BU, it was a loss to the miner, not to the protocol
  1346.  
  1347.  
  1348. charlieshrem [8:45 AM]
  1349. BU has too many issues to safely be considered the reference client.
  1350.  
  1351. csw [8:45 AM]
  1352. That should be encouraged. No transaction was lost and the overall system did not suffer, so why is this a problem generally?
  1353.  
  1354. [8:45]
  1355. Charlie, I do agree. But the solution does not need to be so difficult
  1356.  
  1357. charlieshrem [8:45 AM]
  1358. Agreed.
  1359.  
  1360. csw [8:46 AM]
  1361. And we can scale on and off chain at the same time
  1362.  
  1363.  
  1364. charlieshrem [8:46 AM]
  1365. Agreed as well.
  1366.  
  1367. [8:46]
  1368. I feel like good solutions have come alight, but are blocked/put down based on who their authors are.
  1369.  
  1370. csw [8:46 AM]
  1371. In the 8 years, Moore's law has held and will continue.
  1372.  
  1373. [8:49]
  1374. Did any of you know that a 2nm transistor was created. This was something considered impossible. It is lower than the 7nm Quantum tunnelling effect.
  1375.  
  1376. lunar [8:49 AM]
  1377. @csw . Good afternoon. I'm just one small cog in the Bitcoin Unlimited team, but we've been trying to solve the blocksize issue for several years now. I was interested in what you thought about the emergent consensus solution? The idea BU implements, by giving miners the tools to signal between each other and come to a free market driven determination of the blocksize commodity, with an adjustable block cap. Thanks
  1378.  
  1379. csw [8:49 AM]
  1380. This occurred in 2012.
  1381.  
  1382. [8:49]
  1383. I think that miners need to decide.
  1384.  
  1385.  
  1386. joeldalais [8:50 AM]
  1387. can i ask - what is nChain bringing to the table? will it be a new client implementation? actual development (instead of this stalling we've had for years)? new teams of programmers (seems you have a very strong team)? business solutions? end user solutions? or - a mix of everything and more? or don't worry if its too early to ask (edited)
  1388.  
  1389. csw [8:51 AM]
  1390. In 2009/10, the value of Bitcoin was far too low for flood control to work based on fees without a cap.
  1391.  
  1392. tomothy
  1393. [8:51 AM]
  1394. See above, not really discussing nchain
  1395.  
  1396. joeldalais [8:51 AM]
  1397. fair enough :slightly_smiling_face:
  1398.  
  1399. Pinned by jp
  1400. Today at 8:52 AM Pinned by jp
  1401. csw [8:51 AM]
  1402. I will not discuss the business side here sorry. There is a team who do that. I focus on code and maths
  1403.  
  1404. [8:51]
  1405. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp
  1406. GitHub
  1407. trottier/original-bitcoin
  1408. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  1409.  
  1410.  
  1411. [8:51]
  1412. Please have a quick look at the 0.1.3 and earlier code
  1413.  
  1414. joeldalais [8:51 AM]
  1415. ok, then i'll be quiet and soak up what knowledge i can :slightly_smiling_face:
  1416.  
  1417. csw [8:52 AM]
  1418. Lines 2249 as comments and on:
  1419.  
  1420. // Transaction fee requirements, mainly only needed for flood control
  1421. // Under 10K (about 80 inputs) is free for first 100 transactions
  1422. // Base rate is 0.01 per KB
  1423.  
  1424. [8:53]
  1425. It is simple to create a flood based fee system
  1426.  
  1427. newliberty [8:53 AM]
  1428. For QC threats over the coming years, Shor's algo for keys and Grover's for hashing are concerns, but they will hit most every other security protocol before they are problems for Bitcoin, so should ample be time to resolve, and the failures of others to learn from. I imagine these were design considerations? Care to comment on this?
  1429.  
  1430. csw [8:53 AM]
  1431. Offer a set amount for free and then have a capped value - not a limit, let TXs pay to be in if there are too many (as decided by the market and not a committee)
  1432.  
  1433. [8:54]
  1434. QC is bunk
  1435.  
  1436. [8:54]
  1437. Grover's algo means a large QC could solve a hash in a billion years or so... classical growth will solve this faster
  1438.  
  1439. [8:55]
  1440. As for Shor's, the rate of calculation would lead to a 110 or longer solution time when a private key has been exposed.
  1441.  
  1442. [8:55]
  1443. This means that a 20 billion USD system could solve for 3 keys a year.
  1444.  
  1445. [8:56]
  1446. As a consequence, large values could be moved to multiple keys or even to multi sig systems.
  1447.  
  1448. [8:56]
  1449. I have a paper being published in this area. It took time. I needed to study some more physics first.
  1450.  
  1451. satoshi [8:57 AM]
  1452. joined #general
  1453.  
  1454. awemany [8:57 AM]
  1455. what is "110 or longer"?
  1456.  
  1457. vlad2vlad [8:57 AM]
  1458. Oh look, Satoshi is here. Lol
  1459.  
  1460.  
  1461. [8:57]
  1462. This is getting good
  1463.  
  1464. newliberty [8:58 AM]
  1465. The double hashing resolves most the preimage issues, and one-time use of coins means there is only the window of time from transmission to mining to crack, so had guessed that these were considered from the beginning.
  1466.  
  1467. csw [8:58 AM]
  1468. At a discounted rate of 1 Billion USD a key per annum, the requirement would be that a key would need to have 100 BIT stored and to have a based value of 100 million USD per BTC to make attacking Bitcoin ECDSA keys valid.
  1469.  
  1470. [8:59]
  1471. More, the double hash means that the input to the hash needs to be of a set size. The collision problem allows for scaled solutions.
  1472.  
  1473. satoshi [8:59 AM]
  1474. I am not Satoshi.
  1475.  
  1476. csw [8:59 AM]
  1477. So, if you have a set number of collisions, you find that the possibility of a valid collision diminishes
  1478.  
  1479. vlad2vlad [9:00 AM]
  1480. For crying outloud @satoshi I thought you were. Lol
  1481.  
  1482. jp [9:01 AM]
  1483. Can we focus on the technical discussion here?
  1484.  
  1485.  
  1486. satoshi [9:01 AM]
  1487. What is the most productive thing the average user can do to support on-chain scaling?
  1488.  
  1489. csw [9:01 AM]
  1490. There are an estimated infinite number of collisions for any hash, but the size is indeterminate.
  1491.  
  1492. [9:02]
  1493. Satoshi, use bitcoin and call for real solutions. This is not 2 Mb. From 09 to now, systems have increased about 100x
  1494.  
  1495.  
  1496. [9:02]
  1497. In this time, we have not moved from a cap that was set for flood control at all.
  1498.  
  1499. freetrader [9:03 AM]
  1500. joined #general
  1501.  
  1502. csw [9:03 AM]
  1503. Can I ask people to look at the code comments in the 0.1.0 to 0.1.3 release.
  1504.  
  1505. joeldalais [9:03 AM]
  1506. its where its noted as 'flood control'?
  1507.  
  1508. csw [9:03 AM]
  1509. I think that it was rather clear, but then I have a habbit of losing people
  1510.  
  1511. [9:04]
  1512. Yes.
  1513.  
  1514. [9:04]
  1515. There should always be free TXs
  1516.  
  1517.  
  1518. joeldalais [9:04 AM]
  1519. people seem to gaze over that part and ignore it :disappointed:
  1520.  
  1521. csw [9:04 AM]
  1522. Where the idea of a cap should be is a market decided limit that is not stopped, but sold at value
  1523.  
  1524. [9:04]
  1525. Nobody reads the code comments :disappointed:
  1526.  
  1527. [9:05]
  1528. There was a 100 TB drive released in the last 6 months.
  1529.  
  1530. [9:06]
  1531. This i not a standard laptop addition, but the truth is that we are in a world were exponential scaling is occuring and against that we have a logistic one.
  1532.  
  1533. awemany [9:06 AM]
  1534. csw, tbh, you lost me with the above calculations. why is it '1 billion USD a key *per annum*?". Ialso do not understand " The collision problem allows for scaled solutions.". I assume that "More, the double hash means that the input to the hash needs to be of a set size." means that the input width is fixed for the 2nd SHA256? Why is that relevant and important?
  1535.  
  1536. newliberty [9:06 AM]
  1537. Storing the full chain costs about 0.001BTC worth of drive today
  1538.  
  1539.  
  1540. csw [9:07 AM]
  1541. Can I assume that people understand the distinction between a logistic and exponential growth system?
  1542.  
  1543. ajd [9:07 AM]
  1544. csw were you on IRC while you were developing Bitcoin?
  1545.  
  1546. joeldalais [9:07 AM]
  1547. i was looking at bandwidth+drive space (costs) some while back, the growth/cost over the last 15 years. It boggles my mind why people think this growth will suddenly stop, there is certainly room now and in the future.
  1548.  
  1549. csw [9:07 AM]
  1550. Shor is not the same as linear classical systems.
  1551.  
  1552. [9:08]
  1553. If you have a 20 Billion USD system, and you can factor 3 keys a year, a basic IRR means you come to a value a little over 1 billion USD for each key.
  1554.  
  1555. [9:09]
  1556. joeldalais, the Intel roadmap is strong for the next 2 decades.
  1557.  
  1558.  
  1559. tomtomtom7 [9:09 AM]
  1560. csw: Sorry if blunt, but could you comment on why you let Gavin vouch for you without going public with proof yourself?
  1561.  
  1562. csw [9:09 AM]
  1563. http://gizmodo.com/5807151/2-nanometer-quantum-transistors-are-the-worlds-smallest
  1564. Gizmodo
  1565. 2-Nanometer Quantum Transistors Are the World's Smallest
  1566. A team of scientists at Chungbuk National University in South Korea have created a transistor that&#39;s only 2nm in size, which happens to be the smallest in the world. By comparison, the current generation of Intel processors use 32nm transistors. (35kB)
  1567.  
  1568. [9:10]
  1569. Moving goal posts.
  1570.  
  1571. [9:10]
  1572. Tomx3+7, I had never wanted what occured and I had no plans to be an authority. I will not
  1573.  
  1574. [9:11]
  1575. I will be a scammer with ideas that go to market before I become something I detest and people wanted that. They dressed me in a bloody turtle neck!
  1576.  
  1577.  
  1578. [9:12]
  1579. I have NEVER worn a frikin turtle neck in my life. Like I was bloody jobs or something.
  1580.  
  1581.  
  1582. [9:12]
  1583. I made stupid decisions and I, as all do, have regrets.
  1584.  
  1585.  
  1586. joeldalais [9:13 AM]
  1587. its not that bad decisions are done, but how we act after that matters
  1588.  
  1589. csw [9:13 AM]
  1590. I am not good with people. This is difficult for me now. Vlad and others have pushed me to be here and to be frank it scares the shit out of me
  1591.  
  1592. 1 reply Today at 9:17 AM View thread
  1593.  
  1594. tomtomtom7 [9:14 AM]
  1595. thank you csw
  1596.  
  1597. joeldalais [9:14 AM]
  1598. great respect for being here at all :slightly_smiling_face:
  1599.  
  1600.  
  1601. jp [9:14 AM]
  1602. Incompleteness.
  1603.  
  1604. travin [9:14 AM]
  1605. Thanks for that, Craig. It's well-appreciated.
  1606.  
  1607. joeldalais [9:15 AM]
  1608. and for what its worth, i think you're doing fine here
  1609.  
  1610. csw [9:15 AM]
  1611. Ta
  1612.  
  1613. jp [9:17 AM]
  1614. csw: you are better with code and math.
  1615.  
  1616. csw [9:17 AM]
  1617. LOL
  1618.  
  1619. newliberty [9:23 AM]
  1620. Maybe we work up with some worthy competition in the next 7.
  1621.  
  1622. ajd [9:26 AM]
  1623. Have you changed your opinion on multiple implementations and if so why?
  1624.  
  1625. cypherblock [9:26 AM]
  1626. @csw how long did it take the write the original bitcoin source code?
  1627.  
  1628. csw [9:27 AM]
  1629. I am not going to play Satoshi. I am not wanting to have people think I am and I am going to imagine that nobody ever doxx'd me and that I am just some overqualified academic for the moment... ok?
  1630.  
  1631. tomothy
  1632. [9:28 AM]
  1633. Oh, what's the new masters you are getting?
  1634.  
  1635. ajd [9:28 AM]
  1636. OK. I'm asking csw that question.
  1637.  
  1638. jp [9:28 AM]
  1639. Csw is just a con artist and an asshole. Move along, nothing to see.
  1640.  
  1641.  
  1642. csw [9:28 AM]
  1643. The code should compete, but what matters is that there is a reference protocol
  1644.  
  1645.  
  1646. [9:29]
  1647. I am completing a MSc right now. It is in financial econometrics
  1648.  
  1649.  
  1650. [9:29]
  1651. Uni of London
  1652.  
  1653. joeldalais [9:29 AM]
  1654. hypothetical question .. do you think it would be possible to link 2 blockchains together via a 2nd layer (that ran the same algo). A 2nd layer that basically just read and fed back data from both chains?
  1655.  
  1656. csw [9:30 AM]
  1657. I have put in a proposal into Cambridge for another PhD in Pure Mathematics this time. I hope to start that in Oct
  1658.  
  1659. libitx [9:30 AM]
  1660. joined #general
  1661.  
  1662. joeldalais [9:30 AM]
  1663. its a good uni, think one of my sisters went there
  1664.  
  1665. cypherblock [9:30 AM]
  1666. any thoughts on recent ext block proposals (or ext blocks in general with ability to move coins back and forth between main and ext)?
  1667.  
  1668. csw [9:30 AM]
  1669. I see issues, but this is not a place to discuss that.
  1670. There are too many problems with the discussion of complex issues in a few words. I have a few papers and I will be publishing again soon.
  1671.  
  1672. joeldalais [9:31 AM]
  1673. sounds good :slightly_smiling_face:
  1674.  
  1675. csw [9:31 AM]
  1676. People can read and accept or dismiss the arguments that I pose in those papers.
  1677.  
  1678. cypherblock [9:32 AM]
  1679. expected pub date? or too soon to say?
  1680.  
  1681. prometheus [9:33 AM]
  1682. joined #general
  1683.  
  1684. new messages
  1685. csw [9:33 AM]
  1686. Peer review...
  1687.  
  1688. Pinned by jp
  1689. Today at 9:34 AM Pinned by jp
  1690. [9:34]
  1691. Some have been completed... peer review is a difficult mistress. Worse than my wife :slightly_smiling_face:
  1692.  
  1693.  
  1694. newliberty [9:34 AM]
  1695. Peers can be difficult to come by
  1696.  
  1697. awemany [9:37 AM]
  1698. csw, so I am still trying to parse your above comments on using shor to crack a priv key. what I do not understand where the double hash comes in? I only see the single rpemd160 one.
  1699.  
  1700. csw [9:38 AM]
  1701. Sha256
  1702.  
  1703. tomothy
  1704. [9:38 AM]
  1705. CSW, which alt should I buy tomorrow? (don't hurt me)
  1706.  
  1707.  
  1708. csw [9:39 AM]
  1709. :stuck_out_tongue:
  1710.  
  1711.  
  1712. jp [9:39 AM]
  1713. I guess it is Diem
  1714.  
  1715. awemany [9:39 AM]
  1716. ok, sure, SHA256. but where does that come into play in cracking priv/pub pairs?
  1717.  
  1718. newliberty [9:39 AM]
  1719. Guaranteed it will hurt if you do. Rumor is we are running out of bitcoins to buy.
  1720.  
  1721. csw [9:39 AM]
  1722. 2 sec
  1723.  
  1724.  
  1725. tomothy
  1726. [9:41 AM]
  1727. On a serious note, thoughts on Monero, or ZEC, similar coins & code (confidential transactions) with regards to anonymity? Is anonymity something you see being brought to bitcoin in the near/far future? I know blockchain analytics have significantly improved and coin taint can be a concern for some. I.e., BTC tumblers essentially no longer working.
  1728.  
  1729.  
  1730. vlad2vlad [9:41 AM]
  1731. @tomothy Nuggets!! Buy NUGS if you wanna be rich.
  1732.  
  1733. 4 replies Last reply today at 9:44 AM View thread
  1734.  
  1735. awemany [9:42 AM]
  1736. @tomothy : tumblers don't work, why is that?
  1737. 4 replies Last reply today at 9:43 AM View thread
  1738.  
  1739. klee [9:42 AM]
  1740. joined #general
  1741.  
  1742. awemany [9:43 AM]
  1743. @tomothy : monero is mostly BTC in constant tumbler mode and seems to be working fine, privacy wise. so I don't see how bitcoin is fundamentally lacking. Now, sure, most people do NOT anonymize their TXN because it is a PITA with the current tools, but I see no reason how BTC is lacking there in principle
  1744.  
  1745. new messages
  1746. csw [9:43 AM]
  1747. The reality is there is nothing to fear
  1748. Most importantly, bitcoin uses a double hashing algorithm. The results of this scenario is that any unused bitcoin address will not be reversible to the public key, let alone able to be attacked through a reversal of the ECDSA key pair. Algorithm such as Grover's algorithm (Grover, 1996) are touted as being able to speed up the searching through possible collisions in the reversing of hashing algorithms including SHA-256.
  1749. This algorithm is known to be at best a solution in BPP ( ), a class of decision problem that is decidable in polynomial time with an error probability bounded by 1/3 (for all inputs). The idea is that this error rate can be minimised or made to be exponentially small in 'k" using a process of iterating the algorithm 'k' times with the most frequent value returned as the result. This process ignores the noise of the quantum computer and reports an error rate based on the ideal system alone. Bennet et al. (1997) demonstrate how an ideal quantum Turning machine cannot find a solution to an NP problem in less than time . For SHA-256, this is time and is a far more difficult problem when the true problem, the solution of a bounded size hash to a hash puzzle is introduced. His conclusion was that “Anyone afraid of quantum hash-collision algorithms already has much more to fear from non-quantum hash-collision algorithms”.
  1750. More importantly, when Bernstein (2009, ) analysed the known quantum algorithms he demonstrated conclusively that “all the quantum-collision algorithms in the literature are steps backwards from the non-quantum algorithm of (Oorschot, et al. ). In other words, any attack on the hash functions of Bitcoin would be more effective using a classical computer.
  1751. Bitcoin is thus secure against (theoretical) quantum computer attacks against a key that has not been used. Once a transaction is signed and sent to the blockchain, an attacker can extract the public key. This is not a flaw in the algorithm but a standard part of the functioning of ECC and ECDSA based systems. The question is then, what is the cost to an attacker to break the ECDSA key itself?
  1752. Grover’s algorithm could be said to reduce the bit-security of such primitives by half; one might say that a 256-bit pre-quantum primitive offers only 128-bit security in a post-quantum setting. This is far too large to be broken on any QC any time in the foreseeable future. However, Bitcoin uses the Hash of a Hash. The combination of both SHA256 bit hashes of SHA256 values and the use of a 160Bit RipeMD hash of a SHA256 value for an address makes the analysis of bitcoin addresses to uncover the private key infeasible.
  1753. Attacking ECDSA with Shor
  1754. Let us for a moment assume that a working solution to the problem of creating logical qubits on a FTQC that can maintain coherence for long time periods can be achieved. We next need to note that Shor's algorithm is not simple and a Universal QC would need specialised breaks - you cannot just solve ECC in one hit as is suggested by many pundits.
  1755. The other common fallacy and assumption is that a FTQC will just factor the private key before you can spend. It is more probable that even a 1 million logical qubit FTQC system would likely take weeks or months to break 256 bit ECDSA keys.
  1756. 9:44]
  1757. On the basis of these numbers, performing a 2048-bit number Shor factorization will take on the order of 110 days and require a system size of 2 × 109 trapped ions.
  1758. Trapping 2 × 109 ions will require 23 × 23 vacuum chambers occupying an area of ca. 103.5 × 103.5 m2.
  1759.  
  1760. Pinned by jp
  1761. [9:44]
  1762. Bitcoin Mining.
  1763. As we noted from Bernstein’s (2009) results, quantum computers are slower at solving hash collision than are algorithms for the deployment on classical systems. Hence, there is no economic benefit for a miner to use Quantum Computers for the solution of hash puzzles as they would solve fewer hashes than a miner on a more traditional ASIC. This excludes the costs of the Quantum computer as well (which is significant) and does not consider the fact that qubits are slower to process than bits (Bernstein, 2009). The result is that a miner who was to deploy a Quantum computer for the mining of Bitcoin (if one was to ever exist in the first place) would be at an economic disadvantage to a miner using more traditional ASIC based systems.
  1764. Post-quantum cryptography ( ), a purported non-partisan site for the scientific dissemination of information concerning the effects of quantum computing on cryptography that is heavily used by partisan personalities including Vitalik Buterin, (co-founder of Ethereum) starts with the doom saying prophecy:
  1765. “"Imagine that it's fifteen years from now. Somebody announces that he's built a large quantum computer. RSA is dead. DSA is dead. Elliptic curves, hyperelliptic curves, class groups, whatever, dead, dead, dead. So users are going to run around screaming and say 'Oh my God, what do we do?'”
  1766. This false prophecy is clearly misleadingly designed to read as if it was a quote from Daniel Bernstein’s ( ) analysis. The removal of the line “The New York Times runs a frontpage article reporting that all of the public-key algorithms used to protect the Internet have been broken” changes the context where the author starts by stating, “A closer look reveals, however, that there is no justification for the leap from “quantum computers destroy RSA and DSA and ECDSA” to “quantum computers destroy cryptography.””
  1767. More importantly, no consideration of the costs and time in uncovering a private key has been announced. As Bernstein (2009 ) also demonstrated, the move to alternate hashing algorithms is unwarranted due to theoretical quantum computers even were they to become a reality.
  1768.  
  1769.  
  1770. So, please never listen to the FUD. Forget ideas such as Lamport Signatures. Bitcoin is as it is for a reason and the reason that these others who worry about science fiction did not create it is the reason we need to maintain it as the protocol was created.
  1771.  
  1772. [9:44]
  1773. Sorry... parts of a paper I am writing.
  1774. awemany [9:46 AM]
  1775. ok, thanks, let me digest that
  1776.  
  1777.  
  1778. new messages
  1779. tomothy [9:50 AM]
  1780. CSW can you address thoughts regarding privacy concerns on the blockchain and comment on coins that attempt to address some of those issues? I mean, it's recognized that it's a "PUBLIC LEDGER" with "PUBLIC WALLETS" so... but still it's an interesting topic and I just wanted to see your thoughts.
  1781.  
  1782. [9:51]
  1783. Also, someone was wondering what your thoughts were about "vaults". Not sure if you've seen the article. http://hackingdistributed.com/2016/02/26/how-to-implement-secure-bitcoin-vaults/
  1784. Hacking Distributed
  1785. How to Implement Secure Bitcoin Vaults
  1786. We have come up with a simple and elegant technique for implementing hack-proof Bitcoin vaults, to deter Bitcoin thefts. (176kB)
  1787.  
  1788. csw [9:51 AM]
  1789. Threshold signatures.
  1790.  
  1791. csw [9:52 AM]
  1792. The problem with signatures is solvable using set theory. Anyone know about Cantor's use of diagonalism?
  1793. 1 reply
  1794.  
  1795. hankdasilva [9:54 AM]
  1796. joined #general
  1797.  
  1798. klee [9:54 AM]
  1799. I am the guy interested for the Vault thing
  1800.  
  1801. newliberty [9:54 AM]
  1802. Infinite sets comparisons
  1803.  
  1804. klee [9:55 AM]
  1805. and also if BitCoin blockchain was made transparent (regarding anonymity, privacy) by design
  1806.  
  1807. [9:55]
  1808. or was the best thought back in the day
  1809.  
  1810. awemany [9:56 AM]
  1811. csw, so I read the above, I see most parts of where you are coming from now and it makes sense. however, the only thing remaining is the double-hashing, which is unclear to me. what does it add in terms of security in terms of QC considerations? Grover's algo will work in sqrt(n) both for a single and a double hash and the double hashing is just a constant factor in time - no?
  1812.  
  1813. tomothy [9:56 AM]
  1814. "jp [3 minutes ago]
  1815. csw: had a conversation with Dr. Conway about Cantor
  1816.  
  1817. tomothy [2 minutes ago]
  1818. JP does that have to do with anonymity or storing of txs
  1819.  
  1820. csw [1 minute ago]
  1821. Keys. And there are ways that you can make keys more private as well... but again, too much for slack
  1822.  
  1823. tomothy
  1824. [< 1 minute ago]
  1825. Thanks, will repost into slack as threads aren't stored easy."
  1826.  
  1827. newliberty [9:57 AM]
  1828. Surreal numbers, Conway worked on something related. JP met with him a while back
  1829.  
  1830. [9:57]
  1831. Not sure how it applies though
  1832.  
  1833. new messages
  1834. iang [9:58 AM]
  1835. joined #general
  1836.  
  1837.  
  1838. jp [9:58 AM]
  1839. Welcome Ian grigg
  1840.  
  1841. newliberty [9:59 AM]
  1842. This is a rich meal of food for thought
  1843.  
  1844. csw [9:59 AM]
  1845. Hello Ian.
  1846.  
  1847. iang [9:59 AM]
  1848. good morning all
  1849.  
  1850.  
  1851. jp [10:00 AM]
  1852. Our bloody buddy is here Ian.
  1853.  
  1854. csw [10:00 AM]
  1855. In distributed thresholds you have the (n+1) vs (2n+1) issue
  1856.  
  1857. [10:00]
  1858. Sorry, there is not a lot that can be explained in this without maths.
  1859.  
  1860. newliberty [10:02 AM]
  1861. Yes, it gives diagonalism, infinite sets which are not equal
  1862.  
  1863. vlad2vlad [10:03 AM]
  1864. Man, this channel is full of world class talent.
  1865.  
  1866.  
  1867. tomothy [10:04 AM]
  1868. Do you think Grigg has been credited properly?
  1869.  
  1870. [10:04]
  1871. With regards to triple entry?
  1872.  
  1873. iang [10:05 AM]
  1874. lol. triple entry is a concept, it’s a bit difficult to just turn around and implement. A bit like smart contracts.
  1875.  
  1876. klee [10:05 AM]
  1877. https://youtu.be/4GuqlQvFYJo
  1878. YouTube Bitcoin News TV
  1879. Craig Wright Interview - Part 1 - 2014 - Satoshi?
  1880.  
  1881. csw [10:22 AM]
  1882. This way, the back office PoS can be distributed for smaller companies
  1883.  
  1884. [10:22]
  1885. Well, actually there are both an infinity of countable and uncountable infinities.
  1886.  
  1887. [10:22]
  1888. It send Cantor mad... literally
  1889.  
  1890. joeldalais [10:23 AM]
  1891. an infinite infinities :slightly_smiling_face: people used to give me weird looks when i used to say that about bitcoin
  1892.  
  1893. newliberty [10:23 AM]
  1894.  
  1895. freetrader: preimaging a hash for a collision with a dataset of unbounded size is a much easier problem than doing so with a fixed size
  1896.  
  1897.  
  1898. csw [10:23 AM]
  1899. NL... not zero, 2 as a maxima
  1900.  
  1901.  
  1902. awemany [10:23 AM]
  1903. csw, I see no aleph1 anywhere? all I see is that sha256^2 reduces from alelph0 to uint256 in the middle between the hashes?
  1904.  
  1905. freetrader [10:23 AM]
  1906. @newliberty : sure, but if anyone has proven that there are 'zero' SHA256 collisions on input size of 256 bits, I'd like to know
  1907. 3 replies Last reply today at 10:28 AM View thread
  1908.  
  1909. csw [10:23 AM]
  1910. But, the collisions are infeasible to solve
  1911.  
  1912. joeldalais [10:23 AM]
  1913. i can see a chain of businesses forming to create what you're talking about...
  1914.  
  1915. pesa [10:23 AM]
  1916. joined #general
  1917.  
  1918. csw [10:25 AM]
  1919. Awe.. the Aleph 1 comes from an unbounded set of input functions. That is not the case when a single hash is input to a hash
  1920.  
  1921. [10:26]
  1922. Freetrader. Yes, the maths to prove the reduction is proven and not just by axiomic conditions that are not completely determined.
  1923.  
  1924. newliberty [10:26 AM]
  1925. "Nearly zero" (though I think he misspelled it as neatly zero)
  1926.  
  1927. awemany [10:26 AM]
  1928. where does the unbounded set of input functions come from?
  1929. 11 replies Last reply today at 10:38 AM View thread
  1930.  
  1931. csw [10:27 AM]
  1932. In the input to a hash function, the standard calls for a stream. That stream can be of any form
  1933.  
  1934. newliberty [10:27 AM]
  1935. awemany: If there were sha256 not 2sha256
  1936.  
  1937. awemany [10:28 AM]
  1938. csw, right, but the closure of that is just aleph0?
  1939.  
  1940. csw [10:28 AM]
  1941. Yes, or lower when you bound the input
  1942.  
  1943. [10:29]
  1944. A stream is an unbounded set.
  1945.  
  1946. [10:29]
  1947. Note that this is in itself not infinite. That is finite but unbounded. Add to that infinite and the set increases again.
  1948.  
  1949. [10:30]
  1950. Joel... Yes, and in a set of companies and businesses, we create a system that can self regulate and grow.
  1951.  
  1952.  
  1953. awemany [10:31 AM]
  1954. but all the streams I actually can hash appear to be strictly enumerable? it is not like SHA256 works on *infinite* streams?
  1955.  
  1956. checksum0 [10:31 AM]
  1957. joined #general. Also, @mastodon joined.
  1958.  
  1959. csw [10:32 AM]
  1960. SHA256 works on infinite the same way any machine works on infinite... You never halt and hence it is never solved in real time. It is in the conceptual infinite
  1961.  
  1962. [10:33]
  1963. We have a distinction here between an implemented system and a mathematically possible state.
  1964.  
  1965. awemany [10:33 AM]
  1966. ok. fair enough. i can see that now. thanks!
  1967.  
  1968. joeldalais [10:33 AM]
  1969. when i thought that i couldn't have anymore 'epiphany' moments in bitcoin, another occurs :slightly_smiling_face: ty csw
  1970.  
  1971.  
  1972. csw [10:34 AM]
  1973. This is going to get me in so much trouble. I know it.
  1974.  
  1975. joeldalais [10:34 AM]
  1976. :smile:
  1977.  
  1978. [10:34]
  1979. nah, we've been lucky so far, no trolls, its been good sensible talking :slightly_smiling_face:
  1980.  
  1981. odindillinger [10:35 AM]
  1982. joined #general
  1983.  
  1984. csw [10:35 AM]
  1985. If we now start to look at network propagation models. In epidemic modelling we have giant nodes at the point of decision between competing epidemics
  1986.  
  1987.  
  1988. iang [10:35 AM]
  1989. r any changes necessary to base protocol to go to coffeechain?
  1990.  
  1991. jp [10:35 AM]
  1992. It is Hidden Markov Chain
  1993.  
  1994. csw [10:35 AM]
  1995. These are able to be made into propagation systems. Routers you may say.
  1996.  
  1997. [10:35]
  1998. Yes, the cap needs to be lifted.
  1999.  
  2000.  
  2001. iang [10:35 AM]
  2002. (I’m not familiar with the argument as to how this is done… just trying to divide and conquer…)
  2003.  
  2004. [10:36]
  2005. Ah, that’s easy.
  2006.  
  2007. csw [10:36 AM]
  2008. https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp#L2249
  2009. GitHub
  2010. trottier/original-bitcoin
  2011. original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
  2012.  
  2013.  
  2014. iang [10:36 AM]
  2015. :upside_down_face:
  2016.  
  2017. csw [10:36 AM]
  2018. The early code (commented) notes what is needed for flood control
  2019.  
  2020. awemany [10:37 AM]
  2021. csw, ok thanks you cleared this up, I think. to restate to figure out whether I got this: basically, you do the double hashing pretty much to make further analysis of the hash function - if taken as a black box - easier?
  2022.  
  2023. csw [10:38 AM]
  2024. A double hash reduces the input to a hash and makes collisions infeasible
  2025.  
  2026. [10:38]
  2027. MD5, SHA1...
  2028.  
  2029. [10:38]
  2030. All of this goes away when you have a hash of a hash
  2031.  
  2032. [10:39]
  2033. That means that when there is a flaw in the code, the hash function I should say, you end with enough time to migrate away and to another and even those who are left do not have a more than nominal chance of compromise
  2034.  
  2035. awemany [10:41 AM]
  2036. ok, thanks, I think I get the idea now. there's still nothing that proves SHA256 is surjective, however, or is there?
  2037.  
  2038. iang [10:41 AM]
  2039. In late 2000s this was a thing, post Shandong 2004.
  2040.  
  2041. chritchens [10:41 AM]
  2042. joined #general
  2043.  
  2044. csw [10:41 AM]
  2045. No, SHA256 has not been proven in all cases
  2046.  
  2047. [10:42]
  2048. So, there can be a particular SHA256 hash that maps to many 256 bit values
  2049.  
  2050. csw [10:43 AM]
  2051. uploaded this image: image.png
  2052. Add Comment
  2053.  
  2054. csw [10:43 AM]
  2055. Wow. This lets me post math images :slightly_smiling_face:
  2056.  
  2057. [10:44]
  2058. So, no, SHA 256 has not been proven surjective... That image above. There are axioms that need to be proven for this to hold
  2059.  
  2060. ajd [10:44 AM]
  2061. from wikipedia?
  2062.  
  2063. csw [10:44 AM]
  2064. Yes :slightly_smiling_face:
  2065.  
  2066. ajd [10:44 AM]
  2067. :smile:
  2068.  
  2069. csw [10:44 AM]
  2070. I could not get it to take Latex
  2071.  
  2072. csw [10:45 AM]
  2073. Can you do latex in this?
  2074. 1 reply Today at 10:45 AM View thread
  2075.  
  2076. awemany [10:45 AM]
  2077. so... that would get worse with double hashing, it potentially reduces the size of the output set. do you have any discussion on that trade-off?
  2078.  
  2079. csw [10:45 AM]
  2080. Not that I can really do justice to here
  2081.  
  2082. [10:46]
  2083. Does this thing have a whiteboard or something similar?
  2084.  
  2085. wpalczynski [10:46 AM]
  2086. joined #general
  2087.  
  2088. newliberty [10:46 AM]
  2089. No whiteboard in slack
  2090.  
  2091. csw [10:46 AM]
  2092. :disappointed:
  2093.  
  2094. newliberty [10:46 AM]
  2095. https://www.codecogs.com/latex/eqneditor.php
  2096. codecogs.com
  2097. Online LaTeX Equation Editor - create, integrate and download
  2098. HTML LaTeX equation editor that creates graphical equations (gif, png, swf, pdf, emf). Produces code for directly embedding equations into HTML websites, forums or blogs. Images may also be dragged into other applications like Word. Open source and XHTML compliant.
  2099.  
  2100. wpalczynski [10:47 AM]
  2101. hey!!
  2102.  
  2103. jp [10:47 AM]
  2104. You can livestream using 3rd app
  2105.  
  2106. klee [10:47 AM]
  2107. https://github.com/sand500/SlackLateX
  2108. GitHub
  2109. sand500/SlackLateX
  2110. SlackLateX - Bot that posts posts Latex pictures
  2111.  
  2112.  
  2113. csw [10:48 AM]
  2114. Got those, but no way to draw directly.
  2115.  
  2116. bicmac1973 [10:49 AM]
  2117. joined #general
  2118.  
  2119. klee [10:50 AM]
  2120. Just paste the captioned image (from elsewhere)
  2121.  
  2122. [10:50]
  2123. for me is the fastest way (edited)
  2124.  
  2125. csw [10:51 AM]
  2126. I will but answering on the fly is not so easy in latex :slightly_smiling_face:
  2127.  
  2128. coinspeak [10:51 AM]
  2129. joined #general
  2130.  
  2131. jp [10:51 AM]
  2132. Please consider doing some whiteboard videos in the future.
  2133.  
  2134. joeldalais [10:52 AM]
  2135. there's a paid sketch board thing for slack, but doubt this slack has it :disappointed:
  2136.  
  2137. csw [10:53 AM]
  2138. I have a big electronic whiteboard, but I do not think it has a slack plug
  2139.  
  2140.  
  2141. tomothy
  2142. [10:54 AM]
  2143. pretty sure bitsko's sleeping or at work, he mentioned it hours ago :confused:
  2144.  
  2145. jp [10:54 AM]
  2146. New slack ICO - decentralized whiteboard function included
  2147.  
  2148. tomothy
  2149. [10:54 AM]
  2150. ( I think work) (so can't add functions or change things currently)
  2151.  
  2152. satoshi [10:54 AM]
  2153. Ha!
  2154.  
  2155. joeldalais [10:54 AM]
  2156. https://sketchboard.io/pricing - for future reference (edited)
  2157.  
  2158.  
  2159. csw [10:55 AM]
  2160. Yep
  2161.  
  2162. [10:55]
  2163. Got it
  2164.  
  2165. [10:55]
  2166. I need to run in a moment.
  2167. Other questions
  2168.  
  2169. iang [10:56 AM]
  2170. Which institutions do you think should emerge?
  2171.  
  2172. [10:56]
  2173. I for one have promoted the idea of Arbitration (complicated I know) … but there are many possibilities. (edited)
  2174.  
  2175.  
  2176. csw [10:56 AM]
  2177. Many, but this is also a market function. Arbitration is a good one as it is possible to contract law.
  2178.  
  2179. wings [10:56 AM]
  2180. joined #general
  2181.  
  2182. tomothy
  2183. [10:57 AM]
  2184. When are you coming back again? :smile:
  2185.  
  2186. csw [10:57 AM]
  2187. That is, you can agree on an arbitrator and make the contract conditional on that role. This then replaces the role of the court and in Rothbardian terms allows for the democratisation of the justice system
  2188.  
  2189. satoshi [10:57 AM]
  2190. Thanks for answering questions Craig. It went surprisingly well I think. Amazing what can be accomplished in the absence of trolling.
  2191.  
  2192. jp [10:58 AM]
  2193. LukeJr missed the debate. I pinned Dr. Wright scale comments here. Expect to see Luke Jr reaponse.
  2194.  
  2195.  
  2196. iang [10:58 AM]
  2197. There’s also the possibility of moving direct voting into the system - create an ability for people holding BTC to vote on a proposal. As the proposal wins some form of majority, it leads the direction on changes.
  2198.  
  2199.  
  2200. craig_s_wright [10:58 AM]
  2201. joined #general
  2202.  
  2203.  
  2204. megalodon
  2205. [10:58 AM]
  2206. lol
  2207.  
  2208. csw [10:58 AM]
  2209. I have a doppelganger it seems :slightly_smiling_face:
  2210.  
  2211.  
  2212. satoshi [10:59 AM]
  2213. So many Craigs, so little time.
  2214.  
  2215. megalodon [10:59 AM]
  2216. will the real Craig Wright please stand up
  2217.  
  2218. craig_s_wright [10:59 AM]
  2219. Hi guys
  2220.  
  2221. new messages
  2222. checksum0 [10:59 AM]
  2223. And cue the trolls...
  2224.  
  2225. freetrader [10:59 AM]
  2226. lesson on identity
  2227.  
  2228. iang [11:00 AM]
  2229. brands are such fun… everyone should have one
  2230.  
  2231. tomothy
  2232. [11:00 AM]
  2233. But seriously, I'm sure there will be some interesting responses to a lot of your comments here today. You've provided a lot of food for thought. If I pester Vlad enough do you think you can make another appearance? :smile:
  2234.  
  2235. csw [11:00 AM]
  2236. Yes.
  2237. If we keep it civil
  2238.  
  2239. craig_s_wright [11:00 AM]
  2240. congrats on matonis
  2241.  
  2242. jp [11:00 AM]
  2243. Mod here will purge trollers and craig_s_wright
  2244.  
  2245. csw [11:01 AM]
  2246. Thanks Craig :slightly_smiling_face:
  2247.  
  2248.  
  2249. bicmac1973 [11:01 AM]
  2250. hi guys and gals, nice to be here. Let me stress that I am absolutely not craig wright!
  2251.  
  2252. jesse [11:01 AM]
  2253. joined #general
  2254.  
  2255. csw [11:01 AM]
  2256. LOL BicM...
  2257.  
  2258. craig_s_wright [11:01 AM]
  2259. I'm actually a famous craig_s_wright, and I wouldn't mind staying in this chat as craig_s_wright. nowhere do I claim to be the "real" Craig S Wright
  2260.  
  2261. csw [11:02 AM]
  2262. Well, there are a good number of Craig Wrights :slightly_smiling_face:
  2263.  
  2264. daniweav [11:02 AM]
  2265. joined #general
  2266.  
  2267. wings [11:02 AM]
  2268. be serious guys...talk on topic only plz
  2269.  
  2270. craig_s_wright [11:02 AM]
  2271. I'm going to bid 900 BTC on bitstamp right now
  2272.  
  2273. iang [11:02 AM]
  2274. ok … so here’s a rhetorical. What innovations post-2009 from the ideas / literature would have been good to put in, if only?
  2275.  
  2276. daniweav [11:02 AM]
  2277. Hello, newbie here. :baby_bottle:
  2278.  
  2279. [11:02]
  2280. Nice to meet you all. :slightly_smiling_face:
  2281.  
  2282. vlad2vlad [11:03 AM]
  2283. @bitsko time to come back!!!
  2284.  
  2285. csw [11:03 AM]
  2286. Another time Ian.
  2287.  
  2288. iang [11:03 AM]
  2289. k
  2290.  
  2291. tomothy
  2292. [11:03 AM]
  2293. Alright, well thank you for your time today CSW. I'm sure we can waste your time all day. Hope we get to do this again in a bit.
  2294.  
  2295.  
  2296. csw [11:03 AM]
  2297. I do need to go. Sorry.
  2298.  
  2299.  
  2300. joeldalais [11:03 AM]
  2301. i'm off for now, was great chatting, a lot of thanks to csw :+1: have a good one all
  2302.  
  2303. satoshi [11:03 AM]
  2304. Bye Craig. Ignore the trolls and keep working.
  2305.  
  2306. tomothy
  2307. [11:03 AM]
  2308. Thanks again for staying as long as you did. Greatly appreciated you sticking around to address all the additional comments.
  2309.  
  2310. craig_s_wright [11:03 AM]
  2311. I can take over for you @csw
  2312.  
  2313. daniweav [11:03 AM]
  2314. So many craig s wrights :dizzy_face:
  2315.  
  2316. jp [11:03 AM]
  2317. Fuck off
  2318.  
  2319. [11:04]
  2320. Where is mod?
  2321.  
  2322. daniweav [11:04 AM]
  2323. I'm very confused... Can someone help me?
  2324.  
  2325. satoshi [11:04 AM]
  2326. csw = Craig
  2327.  
  2328. tomothy
  2329. [11:04 AM]
  2330. Bitsko's at work. Please make a pastebin of texts
  2331.  
  2332. satoshi [11:04 AM]
  2333. My pastebin is updated.
  2334.  
  2335. tomothy
  2336. [11:04 AM]
  2337. If we play well and are polite maybe we get to do this again another time.
  2338.  
  2339. [11:04]
  2340. Thanks Satoshi. Can you share a link for those that just joined?
  2341.  
  2342. daniweav [11:04 AM]
  2343. Hmm... I'm going to squelch myself and observe. :thinking_face: :bow: please forgive me.
  2344.  
  2345. tomothy
  2346. [11:04 AM]
  2347. Do you have the early morning discussion as well? Or evening/afternoon depending on timezone?
  2348.  
  2349. Pinned by jp
  2350. Today at 11:05 AM Pinned by jp
  2351. satoshi [11:05 AM]
  2352. https://pastebin.com/zU6YZWXK
  2353. Pastebin
  2354. Craig Wright Q&A on Slack - Pastebin.com (19kB)
  2355.  
  2356.  
  2357. awemany [11:05 AM]
  2358. thanks!
  2359.  
  2360. satoshi [11:05 AM]
  2361. I'm going back to add discussion prior to csw joining. I have it in another notepad.
  2362.  
  2363. awemany [11:06 AM]
  2364. and make it an rbtc post. I am really wondering what nullc finds to pick apart
  2365.  
  2366. tomothy
  2367. [11:06 AM]
  2368. Alright Vlad, back to throwing mud at one another!
  2369.  
  2370. vlad2vlad [11:07 AM]
  2371. Hahaha. Awesome
  2372.  
  2373. [11:07]
  2374. All that tech talk. We can go back to talking about cats and Transylvania
  2375.  
  2376. [11:07]
  2377. The important stuff
  2378.  
  2379. tomothy
  2380. [11:07 AM]
  2381. and vampires, so many vampires
  2382.  
  2383. iang [11:08 AM]
  2384. 2nm ??? f**k
  2385.  
  2386. craig_s_wright [11:08 AM]
  2387. His stuff reads like /r/iamverysmart
  2388.  
  2389. jp [11:08 AM]
  2390. Fuck off craig_s_wright
  2391.  
  2392.  
  2393. Pinned by jp
  2394. Today at 11:08 AM Pinned by jp
  2395. travin [11:08 AM]
  2396. I have also updated my pastebin now - https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
  2397. Pastebin
  2398. Craig Wright Q&A btcchat.slack.com - Pastebin.com (19kB)
  2399.  
  2400. [11:08]
  2401. Thanks to @satoshi for doing the same. :slightly_smiling_face:
  2402.  
  2403. [11:10]
  2404. Mine is just the start at 10:00 CEST. With the first question from christopher (edited)
  2405.  
  2406. satoshi [11:12 AM]
  2407. Thanks Travin.
  2408.  
  2409.  
  2410. craig_s_wright [11:15 AM]
  2411. If I say that 1) I am not really Craig S Wright and 2) I don't believe that the real Craig S Wright is Satoshi, can I stay here? :muscle:
  2412.  
  2413. tomothy
  2414. [11:15 AM]
  2415. I think CSW or JP discussed original team members before in pastebin
  2416.  
  2417. [11:15]
  2418. early on in discussion
  2419.  
  2420. [11:16]
  2421. we've got vlad and bruce here so, :smile:
  2422.  
  2423. [11:17]
  2424. :heart:
  2425.  
  2426. checksum0 [11:17 AM]
  2427. @craig_s_wright You saw this conversation was happening by being linked to it so you damn well knew what was going on here and you still decided to sign up with that name and you expect people to not believe you are a goddamn troll?
  2428.  
  2429. craig_s_wright [11:18 AM]
  2430. It is a poorly chosen username, I admit.
  2431.  
  2432. tomothy
  2433. [11:18 AM]
  2434. whale, not troll...
  2435.  
  2436. [11:18]
  2437. another pastebin copy
  2438.  
  2439. [11:18]
  2440. https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
  2441.  
  2442. [11:19]
  2443. nm, already posted :smile:
  2444.  
  2445. bitcoindevotee [11:19 AM]
  2446. joined #general
  2447.  
  2448. prometheus [11:20 AM]
  2449. Greetings, everyone! What a wonderful chat session with CSW. Thank you for setting this up @bitsko and @vlad2vlad . I do hope CSW will return for another Q&A. I'd love to hear him answer more questions about the original code and his future vision of BTC.
  2450.  
  2451.  
  2452. vlad2vlad [11:22 AM]
  2453. We'll make it happen - it was too good to not do it again. :)
  2454.  
  2455.  
  2456. tomothy
  2457. [11:22 AM]
  2458. Quick, cat pictures or mud slinging!
  2459.  
  2460. craig_s_wright [11:22 AM]
  2461. Stop listening to Craig S Wright, he is a phony and wants your money.
  2462.  
  2463. vlad2vlad [11:23 AM]
  2464. @bitsko give me mod power. I need to smash some trolls.
  2465.  
  2466. craig_s_wright [11:23 AM]
  2467. don't be part of the problem, be part of the answer
  2468.  
  2469. daniweav [11:34 AM]
  2470. The solution* answers can be wrong. :neutral_face:
  2471.  
  2472. deadsea33 [11:47 AM]
  2473. joined #general. Also, @peggy joined, @macsga joined, @satoshi420 joined.
  2474.  
  2475. macsga [11:55 AM]
  2476. greetings
  2477.  
  2478.  
  2479. [11:57]
  2480. all the nice people here
  2481.  
  2482. alp
  2483. [12:01 PM]
  2484. how do we know this is real csw?
  2485.  
  2486. [12:01]
  2487. any verification?
  2488.  
  2489. bitsko [12:01 PM]
  2490. Nothing to see here alp
  2491.  
  2492. tomothy
  2493. [12:01 PM]
  2494. E-mail linked to his slack, text of discussion.
  2495.  
  2496. [12:02]
  2497. It can't possibly be him. He clearly was just making things up as he went along.
  2498.  
  2499. [12:02]
  2500. I paid my brother to make a fake e-mail address and spought smart sounding stuff.
  2501.  
  2502. [12:02]
  2503. ...
  2504.  
  2505. bitsko [12:02 PM]
  2506. :dove_of_peace:
  2507.  
  2508. tomothy
  2509. [12:03 PM]
  2510. But maybe it is... (Of course it is!)
  2511.  
  2512. bitsko [12:03 PM]
  2513. :ohyeah:
  2514.  
  2515. klee [12:03 PM]
  2516. :aa:
  2517.  
  2518. vlad2vlad [12:05 PM]
  2519. @alp ohhh, you missed it
  2520.  
  2521. [12:05]
  2522. Here's the pastebin for you
  2523.  
  2524. tomothy
  2525. [12:06 PM]
  2526. no pastebin...
  2527.  
  2528. [12:06]
  2529. probably because it's already been posted? can you redirect link to it or something?
  2530.  
  2531. macsga [12:06 PM]
  2532. https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
  2533.  
  2534. vlad2vlad [12:06 PM]
  2535. https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
  2536.  
  2537. tomothy
  2538. [12:07 PM]
  2539. nm :smile:
  2540.  
  2541. alp
  2542. [12:07 PM]
  2543. I saw the pastebin
  2544.  
  2545. [12:07]
  2546. havent gone through it all
  2547.  
  2548. [12:07]
  2549. but how was he verified?
  2550.  
  2551. macsga [12:07 PM]
  2552. pretty serious stuff were spoken in there, among those is that who is SN doesn't really matter
  2553.  
  2554. alp
  2555. [12:07 PM]
  2556. well csw is a fraud so of course he makes stuff up
  2557.  
  2558. macsga [12:08 PM]
  2559. that's one way to see this
  2560.  
  2561. alp
  2562. [12:08 PM]
  2563. who is jp?
  2564.  
  2565. [12:08]
  2566. jvp?
  2567.  
  2568. macsga [12:08 PM]
  2569. the other is to patiently check the text
  2570.  
  2571. [12:08]
  2572. God and Jesus Christ
  2573.  
  2574. [12:08]
  2575. (respectively)
  2576.  
  2577. norway [12:08 PM]
  2578. Homework for @alp
  2579.  
  2580. macsga [12:08 PM]
  2581. does it matter?
  2582.  
  2583. [12:08]
  2584. :slightly_smiling_face:
  2585.  
  2586. alp
  2587. [12:09 PM]
  2588. yall get bamboozled?
  2589.  
  2590. norway [12:09 PM]
  2591. Maybe
  2592.  
  2593. macsga [12:09 PM]
  2594. definitely
  2595.  
  2596. alp
  2597. [12:10 PM]
  2598. fake fake satoshi pretends to be fake satoshi lol
  2599.  
  2600. norway [12:10 PM]
  2601. Thanks for sharing, @apl
  2602.  
  2603. tomothy
  2604. [12:11 PM]
  2605. jvp is new liberty
  2606.  
  2607. [12:11]
  2608. jp john
  2609.  
  2610. [12:11]
  2611. and yeah i'd agree with macsga on characterizations
  2612.  
  2613. [12:11]
  2614. I gave him all my money and got a pin
  2615.  
  2616. [12:11]
  2617. (worth it)
  2618.  
  2619. alp
  2620. [12:11 PM]
  2621. ok wasnt sure who john is in that context (edited)
  2622.  
  2623. tomothy
  2624. [12:13 PM]
  2625. see pastebin its in there
  2626.  
  2627. [12:13]
  2628. its allllllll in there
  2629.  
  2630. [12:13]
  2631. :slightly_smiling_face:
  2632.  
  2633. macsga [12:14 PM]
  2634. yeah, nice 10m read
  2635.  
  2636. [12:15]
  2637. I'll review it once more once home
  2638.  
  2639. andrewquentson [12:33 PM]
  2640. joined #general
  2641.  
  2642. andrewquentson [12:39 PM]
  2643. "IF you need to do what I say as I am Satoshi and not because of the idea I am presenting, but the nature of my identity, then you are all lost!" why bother telling us all you're satoshi then, instead of, you know, just presenting your work @craig_s_wright @csw @vlad2vlad
  2644.  
  2645. csw [12:40 PM]
  2646. https://medium.com/@MADinMelbourne/welcome-to-the-ministry-of-truth-in-the-wiki-age-601ec28a2504
  2647. Medium
  2648. Welcome to the Ministry of Truth in the Wiki Age. – #thewildcard – Medium
  2649. “Is this really happening?” was tweeted to me yesterday as nChain announced it’s arrival into the Bitcoin scene, bringing with it the…
  2650. Reading time
  2651. ----------------
  2652. 4 min read
  2653.  
  2654. (461kB)
  2655. April 17th at 5:36 AM
  2656.  
  2657. [12:40]
  2658. Nothing of the last year was planned.
  2659.  
  2660. [12:41]
  2661. I listened to the wrong ideas and simply where we should be is ignoring and leaving the myth.
  2662.  
  2663. [12:42]
  2664. I had started to present my work. That is when the attacks started and i was not prepared for any of it.
  2665.  
  2666. [12:43]
  2667. I did not expect to have to explain the distinction between a PhD and a professional doctorate and I did not expect to have any of the other fabrications to defend.
  2668.  
  2669. [12:44]
  2670. I have learnt from this. I am saddened that people feel they need an authority and cannot learn and must come to a state where they express an attack as an opinion.
  2671.  
  2672. Yes, you can have an opinion, but this is not the same as a reasoned argument.
  2673.  
  2674. andrewquentson [12:45 PM]
  2675. Sorry, but your first act was to claim authority by claiming you are Satoshi
  2676.  
  2677. [12:45]
  2678. why?
  2679.  
  2680. csw [12:45 PM]
  2681. No, I was not the one talking in Dec 2015
  2682.  
  2683. [12:46]
  2684. Nor did I make up stories about recommended settings in encryption software
  2685.  
  2686. iang [12:46 PM]
  2687. The events of 2015 - 2016 weren’t really of Craig’s wanting. The first problem was the attacker and extortionists and various other sundy gossipers… so the writing was on the wall.
  2688.  
  2689. jp [12:46 PM]
  2690. In 2015 we were hacked and blackmailed
  2691.  
  2692. iang [12:46 PM]
  2693. The second problem was the circus team in London that went out of control.
  2694.  
  2695.  
  2696. andrewquentson [12:47 PM]
  2697. Does that include the BBC interview?
  2698.  
  2699. macsga [12:47 PM]
  2700. lol
  2701.  
  2702. csw [12:47 PM]
  2703. I was promised a simple low key interview. No TV camera
  2704.  
  2705. andrewquentson [12:47 PM]
  2706. with the BBC!
  2707.  
  2708. [12:47]
  2709. low key?
  2710.  
  2711. csw [12:47 PM]
  2712. It was not what eventuated
  2713.  
  2714. iang [12:47 PM]
  2715. yes all the events of May 2015 and the big reveal … it actually started around mid 2015.
  2716.  
  2717. betty [12:48 PM]
  2718. joined #general
  2719.  
  2720. alp
  2721. [12:48 PM]
  2722. csw can you with a key for me?
  2723.  
  2724. andrewquentson [12:48 PM]
  2725. Alright, can you tell me how it came that Gavin ended up vauching for you?
  2726.  
  2727. csw [12:48 PM]
  2728. I signed the contracts and moved to London 5 months before any of this.
  2729.  
  2730. [12:49]
  2731. A...Q... no. If Gavin does, that is his decision
  2732.  
  2733. iang [12:49 PM]
  2734. Basically it’s as said - CSW was used to add a couple of zeros to the patent portfolio. Which necessitated the ‘big reveal’ … circus. Unfortunately, CSW fails at being a pop star. Who knew…
  2735.  
  2736. alp
  2737. [12:49 PM]
  2738. when does Gavin join NChain?
  2739.  
  2740. [12:49]
  2741. How much money did Roger give to nChain?
  2742.  
  2743. csw [12:49 PM]
  2744. The worst thing I can do is play a public role.
  2745.  
  2746. [12:49]
  2747. I have given no money to Roger
  2748.  
  2749. andrewquentson [12:50 PM]
  2750. Well, how more public can you get than Gavin vauching for you
  2751.  
  2752. iang [12:50 PM]
  2753. sounds like business questions - I for one would expect the business team at nChain to deal with them.
  2754.  
  2755. csw [12:50 PM]
  2756. Gavin is semi retired and does not miss the trolling
  2757.  
  2758. andrewquentson [12:50 PM]
  2759. now, my memory might be wrong, but back then I think he publicly wrote saying you or someone related asked him to visit you
  2760.  
  2761. [12:50]
  2762. is that true?
  2763.  
  2764. csw [12:50 PM]
  2765. Related yes.
  2766.  
  2767. travin [12:50 PM]
  2768. Hey Andrew.
  2769.  
  2770. andrewquentson [12:51 PM]
  2771. so you willfully went forward with a ceremony which was meant to prove your identity, why?
  2772.  
  2773. mrhodl [12:51 PM]
  2774. joined #general
  2775.  
  2776. alp
  2777. [12:51 PM]
  2778. how much money did roger fund nChain/
  2779.  
  2780. [12:51]
  2781. not that you paid him
  2782.  
  2783. andrewquentson [12:51 PM]
  2784. identity as claimed satoshi that is
  2785.  
  2786. csw [12:51 PM]
  2787. Roger. Nothing
  2788.  
  2789. beautybubble [12:51 PM]
  2790. joined #general
  2791.  
  2792. csw [12:51 PM]
  2793. I believed promises.
  2794.  
  2795. [12:52]
  2796. I was told, one time, and then you can be left alone.
  2797.  
  2798. andrewquentson [12:52 PM]
  2799. I mean, if you want us to just judge you, rather than authority, why engage in an event which tries to claim authority by showing an alleged satoshi owned address signature?
  2800.  
  2801. csw [12:52 PM]
  2802. I agree
  2803.  
  2804. andrewquentson [12:52 PM]
  2805. you agree with what sorry?
  2806.  
  2807. klee [12:53 PM]
  2808. read the pastebin before asking questions already answered DAMNIT
  2809.  
  2810. csw [12:53 PM]
  2811. I agree that was foolish
  2812.  
  2813. beautybubble [12:53 PM]
  2814. Pleased to be here to learn some new things.
  2815.  
  2816. [12:53]
  2817. Thank you for having me.
  2818.  
  2819. andrewquentson [12:53 PM]
  2820. alright
  2821.  
  2822. travin [12:53 PM]
  2823. @andrewquentson -https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
  2824. Pastebin
  2825. Craig Wright Q&A btcchat.slack.com - Pastebin.com (19kB)
  2826.  
  2827. andrewquentson [12:53 PM]
  2828. this supercomputer @csw it doesn't exist does it?
  2829.  
  2830. csw [12:53 PM]
  2831. Actually it did
  2832.  
  2833. tomothy
  2834. [12:53 PM]
  2835. Yes, Look at yesterdays disclosure from Vlad
  2836.  
  2837. andrewquentson [12:53 PM]
  2838. did?
  2839.  
  2840. tomothy
  2841. [12:53 PM]
  2842. He provided all the information concerning the computer
  2843.  
  2844. csw [12:54 PM]
  2845. Did.
  2846.  
  2847. tomothy
  2848. [12:54 PM]
  2849. Invoices, receipts, along with significant other information
  2850.  
  2851. andrewquentson [12:54 PM]
  2852. what happened to it?
  2853.  
  2854. csw [12:54 PM]
  2855. I had dealings with people connected to Liberty Reserve and who later ran systems in Panama
  2856.  
  2857. jp [12:54 PM]
  2858. I did the security pen test on it before the public class programming on supercomputer started
  2859.  
  2860. andrewquentson [12:55 PM]
  2861. where was the supercomputer stored/held csw?
  2862.  
  2863. csw [12:55 PM]
  2864. Panama
  2865.  
  2866. iang [12:55 PM]
  2867. Moore’s Law :slightly_smiling_face: computers do get rather old…
  2868.  
  2869. macsga [12:55 PM]
  2870. like I said several times, I'd put a good use to it :slightly_smiling_face:
  2871.  
  2872.  
  2873. andrewquentson [12:55 PM]
  2874. ok
  2875.  
  2876. [12:55]
  2877. I can see your typing looks fine
  2878.  
  2879. [12:56]
  2880. your background shows, however, you often like to miss-spell words
  2881.  
  2882. [12:56]
  2883. create grammatically messy sentances
  2884.  
  2885. [12:56]
  2886. why?
  2887.  
  2888. csw [12:56 PM]
  2889. I have friends who own more computer power than I do. They simply do not use them to do scientific calculations, they run Poker rooms.
  2890.  
  2891.  
  2892. [12:56]
  2893. Would you like me to mis-type
  2894.  
  2895.  
  2896. beautybubble [12:56 PM]
  2897. Because I prefer specifics. Are you speaking of The Panamanian SERVIR center is housed in the City of Knowledge, at CATHALAC.
  2898.  
  2899. andrewquentson [12:56 PM]
  2900. my preferences are completley irrelevant
  2901.  
  2902. beautybubble [12:56 PM]
  2903. Thank you.
  2904.  
  2905. andrewquentson [12:57 PM]
  2906. the document which says you entered into a partnership with the company that provided the supercomputer parts is grammatically unsound
  2907.  
  2908. [12:57]
  2909. your public forum statements are often grammatically unsound
  2910.  
  2911. [12:57]
  2912. why?
  2913.  
  2914. csw [12:57 PM]
  2915. My academic papers are sound.
  2916.  
  2917. iang [12:57 PM]
  2918. wtf?
  2919.  
  2920. andrewquentson [12:58 PM]
  2921. is the miss-spelling intentional?
  2922.  
  2923. csw [12:58 PM]
  2924. :slightly_smiling_face:
  2925.  
  2926. [12:58]
  2927. No more.
  2928.  
  2929. alp
  2930. [12:58 PM]
  2931. you angered him andrew
  2932.  
  2933. [12:58]
  2934. the wizard of oz will close the doors on you
  2935.  
  2936. iang [12:58 PM]
  2937. @andrewquentson have you ever usd computers?
  2938.  
  2939. andrewquentson [12:58 PM]
  2940. you're completely free to not answer
  2941.  
  2942. [12:59]
  2943. but that doesn't leave many obvious conclusions
  2944.  
  2945. freetrader [12:59 PM]
  2946. ... and did you spell-check your comments above (if not, you should)
  2947.  
  2948. csw [12:59 PM]
  2949. Your assumption is that I created those documents. Even now, I like to work in my own area and remain a curmudgeon, but I am not too far from people.
  2950.  
  2951. snoop [12:59 PM]
  2952. Alp=ass
  2953.  
  2954. alp
  2955. [1:00 PM]
  2956. hi poons
  2957.  
  2958. andrewquentson [1:00 PM]
  2959. "When looking at Craig Steven Wright’s background, his seemingly inability to spell stands out immediately. As does his preference for general terms, vague language, and long windedness.
  2960.  
  2961. Wright’s now deleted Linkedin profile contains 26 A4 sized pages and terms such as “Encryption Techniology” and “continential kitchens”."
  2962.  
  2963. alp
  2964. [1:00 PM]
  2965. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6qPo1zzU7s
  2966. YouTube doc biz
  2967. in which Craig Wright says "fuck off"
  2968.  
  2969.  
  2970. andrewquentson [1:00 PM]
  2971. you didn't write your own linkedin?
  2972.  
  2973. csw [1:00 PM]
  2974. :slightly_smiling_face:
  2975.  
  2976. alp
  2977. [1:00 PM]
  2978. fuck off your mother if you want fuck off
  2979.  
  2980. csw [1:00 PM]
  2981. I did not manage much of my social media
  2982.  
  2983. beautybubble [1:01 PM]
  2984. Oh, dear.
  2985.  
  2986. kp [1:01 PM]
  2987. joined #general
  2988.  
  2989. mrhodl [1:01 PM]
  2990. @csw How long were you in a relationship with Michelle?
  2991.  
  2992. beautybubble [1:01 PM]
  2993. Once people calm down we can introduce ourselves and put on the table concerns. Right?
  2994.  
  2995. csw [1:01 PM]
  2996. Yes, I am angered by people who say that they can reverse ECC private keys (excluding brain wallets)
  2997.  
  2998. [1:01]
  2999. I have never met Seven
  3000.  
  3001. mrhodl [1:02 PM]
  3002. Alright, Who manages your social media account?
  3003.  
  3004. andrewquentson [1:02 PM]
  3005. alright, what's the probability of compromise @csw ?
  3006.  
  3007. csw [1:02 PM]
  3008. A...Q... is this me...
  3009.  
  3010. mrhodl [1:02 PM]
  3011. So you never met Seven, eh?
  3012.  
  3013. [1:02]
  3014. How did you get on that panel?
  3015.  
  3016. csw [1:02 PM]
  3017. No, I was on a panel from London
  3018.  
  3019. mrhodl [1:02 PM]
  3020. Sure, but why did she invite you? (edited)
  3021.  
  3022. alp
  3023. [1:03 PM]
  3024. csw's dick is so long it went all the way from london to the us
  3025.  
  3026.  
  3027. jp [1:03 PM]
  3028. I insisted csw not to do it
  3029.  
  3030. andrewquentson [1:03 PM]
  3031. "
  3032.  
  3033. “Where a system uses an SMS response with a separate system (such as a web page), the probability that the banking user is compromised and a fraud is committed, P(Compromise), can be calculated as: P(Compromise) = P(C.SMS) x P(C.PIN)
  3034.  
  3035. Where: P(C.SMS) is the probability of compromising the SMS function and P(C.PIN) is the compromise of the user authentication method [sic]
  3036.  
  3037. The user can be compromised by Trojan apps, poor pins that are pasted to a monitor etc.”
  3038.  
  3039. mrhodl [1:03 PM]
  3040. JP, that's not my question..
  3041.  
  3042. [1:03]
  3043. How was on on there to begin with?
  3044.  
  3045. andrewquentson [1:03 PM]
  3046. I suppose that's you, unless others write under your name in mailing lists too
  3047.  
  3048. beautybubble [1:03 PM]
  3049. I am certain once we get through some of this hostility, we can get on to the bigger, better conversation.
  3050.  
  3051. csw [1:03 PM]
  3052. That is a long story and I do not wish to discuss it. I was not (as is stated) 'fucking' her, we have never been in the same city at the same time to my knowledge
  3053.  
  3054. beautybubble [1:04 PM]
  3055. Please guys try and be civil here.
  3056.  
  3057. csw [1:04 PM]
  3058. ALP... I would like to think so... but I am not that large :wink:
  3059.  
  3060.  
  3061. mrhodl [1:04 PM]
  3062. long story ..got it
  3063.  
  3064. alp
  3065. [1:04 PM]
  3066. why should we be civil beauty?
  3067.  
  3068. csw [1:04 PM]
  3069. A...Q... That was a VERY short part of a very long equation (edited)
  3070.  
  3071. opet [1:04 PM]
  3072. joined #general
  3073.  
  3074. beautybubble [1:04 PM]
  3075. It allows for team work and conversation.
  3076.  
  3077. alp
  3078. [1:05 PM]
  3079. team work with a con artist?
  3080.  
  3081. [1:05]
  3082. who gives a fuck
  3083.  
  3084. mrhodl [1:05 PM]
  3085. @csw Does @jp have a picture of you from 2005?
  3086.  
  3087. andrewquentson [1:05 PM]
  3088. @csw what's a Merkel Tree?
  3089.  
  3090. mrhodl [1:05 PM]
  3091. I hear you met at a cypherpunk conference.. he pointed you to a tent?
  3092.  
  3093. andrewquentson [1:05 PM]
  3094. @alp and @mrhodl can you try and not shut down discussion
  3095.  
  3096. beautybubble [1:05 PM]
  3097. I came here to meet a person who I am very interested in and I hope we can work through some of the harder parts.
  3098.  
  3099. csw [1:05 PM]
  3100. MrH... I hope not. But I used to come and go from conferences
  3101.  
  3102. alp
  3103. [1:06 PM]
  3104. lol aquent whining about trolling
  3105.  
  3106. andrewquentson [1:06 PM]
  3107. questions are cool, but...
  3108.  
  3109. alp
  3110. [1:06 PM]
  3111. pot calling kettle black here
  3112.  
  3113. mrhodl [1:06 PM]
  3114. Andrew, my questions are more relevant... sorry.
  3115.  
  3116. csw [1:06 PM]
  3117. A...Q... A merkle tree... Please ask something difficult.
  3118.  
  3119. andrewquentson [1:06 PM]
  3120. yes yes just relax @alp (edited)
  3121.  
  3122.  
  3123. mrhodl [1:06 PM]
  3124. @jp Do you have that picture?
  3125.  
  3126. jp [1:06 PM]
  3127. I'm not jvp
  3128.  
  3129. mrhodl [1:06 PM]
  3130. Oh, right
  3131.  
  3132. [1:06]
  3133. So who are you?
  3134.  
  3135. jp [1:06 PM]
  3136. John
  3137.  
  3138. alp
  3139. [1:07 PM]
  3140. whats your assocation to satoshi dundee
  3141.  
  3142. jp [1:07 PM]
  3143. Fuck off bastatd
  3144.  
  3145. alp
  3146. [1:07 PM]
  3147. fluffer?
  3148.  
  3149. jp [1:07 PM]
  3150. Piece of cumbag
  3151.  
  3152. mrhodl [1:07 PM]
  3153. You told Craig not to go on that panel? Why? Who are you to Craig?
  3154.  
  3155. jp [1:07 PM]
  3156. Fluff your fucking mother if you wanna fluff
  3157.  
  3158. macsga [1:07 PM]
  3159. lol
  3160.  
  3161. satoshi [1:08 PM]
  3162. Don't engage or respond to trolling. Ping bitsko to remove.
  3163.  
  3164. macsga [1:08 PM]
  3165. dat quote
  3166.  
  3167. coinspeak
  3168. [1:08 PM]
  3169. If you have doubts that's fine but be civil. If you don't believe then just listen and see if you learn something vs dominate the conversation being a troll.
  3170.  
  3171. mrhodl [1:08 PM]
  3172. @satoshi How is this "trolling"?
  3173.  
  3174. iang [1:08 PM]
  3175. I think it is fair enough if technical and cryptographic questions are asked.
  3176.  
  3177.  
  3178. satoshi [1:08 PM]
  3179. Agreed
  3180.  
  3181. jp [1:08 PM]
  3182. And this is not a fucking interrogation
  3183.  
  3184. freetrader [1:08 PM]
  3185. I believe this slack is an exercise in free speech. We have to accept the unsavory commenters.
  3186.  
  3187. iang [1:09 PM]
  3188. Beyond that, the reality TV questions are probably better off left to some other venue. Like . reality TV.
  3189.  
  3190. klee [1:09 PM]
  3191. why should we give a flying fuk who Craig fucks?
  3192.  
  3193. mrhodl [1:09 PM]
  3194. CSW is claiming to be Satoshi, yes?
  3195.  
  3196. jp [1:09 PM]
  3197. Craig, I Think you should leave.
  3198.  
  3199.  
  3200. csw [1:09 PM]
  3201. Free speech does not incorporate any speech
  3202.  
  3203. cypherblock [1:09 PM]
  3204. csw is claiming to be csw I think.
  3205.  
  3206. mrhodl [1:09 PM]
  3207. Interesting..
  3208.  
  3209. satoshi [1:09 PM]
  3210. csw = csw
  3211.  
  3212. csw [1:09 PM]
  3213. I believe that I am CSW. I could be mistaken.
  3214.  
  3215.  
  3216. satoshi [1:09 PM]
  3217. LOL
  3218.  
  3219. klee [1:10 PM]
  3220. I am Vinny
  3221. 1 reply Today at 1:10 PM View thread
  3222.  
  3223. mrhodl [1:10 PM]
  3224. So you're not claiming to be Satoshi?
  3225.  
  3226. klee [1:10 PM]
  3227. sodl at 1250
  3228.  
  3229. [1:10]
  3230. still waiting for 800
  3231.  
  3232. iang [1:10 PM]
  3233. I’ve got that Who song in my mind… “Who are you? Who Who?” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdLIerfXuZ4
  3234. YouTube TheWhoVEVO
  3235. The Who - Who Are You?
  3236.  
  3237.  
  3238. csw [1:10 PM]
  3239. And Freetrader, no, free speech does not incorporate libel or slander.
  3240.  
  3241. alp
  3242. [1:10 PM]
  3243. satoshi: i was told by bitsko this chat room was explicitly for trolling
  3244.  
  3245. [1:10]
  3246. am i mistaken?
  3247.  
  3248. csw [1:11 PM]
  3249. I am stating that Satoshi needs to remain a myth and no more. Nobody in any position should be accounted as an authority for where they are. The ideas they express need to be weighted and viewed individually.
  3250.  
  3251. megalodon
  3252. [1:11 PM]
  3253. alp can you go back to the dragon's den and reformulate the strategy? starting to get pretty stale and repetitive by this point in time
  3254.  
  3255. freetrader [1:12 PM]
  3256. @csw : what I'm referring to is that bitsko has announced he's unlikely to remove anyone from this slack no matter what they say.
  3257. libel and slander are dealt with lawfully.
  3258. That said, it may not be wise to feed trolls more than they can handle. (edited)
  3259.  
  3260. alp
  3261. [1:12 PM]
  3262. kek
  3263.  
  3264. cypherblock [1:12 PM]
  3265. @csw do you wish to just become a “regular guy” in the community, who should be judged on his current statements, papers, etc and not on any Satoshi stuff?
  3266.  
  3267. alp
  3268. [1:12 PM]
  3269. i figure satoshi dundee's scam is pretty stale and repetitive too
  3270.  
  3271. opet [1:12 PM]
  3272. Speaking of ideas, have you released any additional details regarding nChain's intended solution for scaling?
  3273.  
  3274. mrhodl [1:12 PM]
  3275. :thinking_face:
  3276.  
  3277. prometheus [1:12 PM]
  3278. @csw Thank you for helping to bring Bitcoin to life, and thank you for taking the time to answer our questions. I enjoyed reading Andrew O'Hagan's "The Satoshi Affair" piece. In it, it mentions the name "Satoshi Nakamoto" created from combining "Satoshi" (The Pokemon character Ash in Japanese) and "Nakamoto" (Tominaga Nakamoto being the Japanese merchant philosopher). Is this the correct origin on the moniker?
  3279.  
  3280. You had incredible forethought to create a pseudonym when creating Bitcoin, and creating the "myth" that resulted. Was this influenced by your academic background in Religion and Mythology?
  3281.  
  3282. andy [1:13 PM]
  3283. joined #general
  3284.  
  3285. mrhodl [1:13 PM]
  3286. Why are you thanking him for bringing bitcoin to life? He's not Satoshi. (edited)
  3287.  
  3288. csw [1:13 PM]
  3289. CypherB... I will not be that. In my case it will be a steeper slope
  3290.  
  3291.  
  3292. andy [1:13 PM]
  3293. Well it's been a lively day already I can see.
  3294.  
  3295. klee [1:13 PM]
  3296. csw time to talk about serious stuff, like your training in Ninjutsu & Wing Chun
  3297.  
  3298. andrewquentson [1:14 PM]
  3299. @csw can you share the e-mail you sent to Adam Back?
  3300.  
  3301. csw [1:14 PM]
  3302. No, I will not release company details. There are people for that and when I talk out of turn, I cause trouble.
  3303.  
  3304.  
  3305. andrewquentson [1:14 PM]
  3306. not sure if that's been made public?
  3307.  
  3308. andy [1:14 PM]
  3309. Thanks for answering questions csw.
  3310.  
  3311.  
  3312. csw [1:14 PM]
  3313. A..Q.. That would not be good iff I was to remain not in a role... That email may come out in time.
  3314.  
  3315. andrewquentson [1:15 PM]
  3316. ok
  3317.  
  3318. csw [1:15 PM]
  3319. It would "not" come from me.
  3320.  
  3321. andrewquentson [1:15 PM]
  3322. what happened after you emailed Adam back in... whenever it was?
  3323.  
  3324. andy [1:15 PM]
  3325. If bitcoin suddenly ended tomorrow, would you support the creation of a new coin or support an existing one?
  3326.  
  3327.  
  3328. csw [1:15 PM]
  3329. If Bitcoin ends, then I am broke :slightly_smiling_face:
  3330.  
  3331.  
  3332. macsga [1:15 PM]
  3333. ME TOO
  3334.  
  3335.  
  3336. [1:15]
  3337. :stuck_out_tongue:
  3338.  
  3339. jp [1:15 PM]
  3340. Me too
  3341.  
  3342. macsga [1:16 PM]
  3343. lol
  3344.  
  3345. klee [1:16 PM]
  3346. no suga mamma?
  3347.  
  3348. megalodon
  3349. [1:16 PM]
  3350. lol looks like we all really are satoshi then
  3351.  
  3352.  
  3353. jp [1:16 PM]
  3354. No Vegas
  3355.  
  3356. macsga [1:16 PM]
  3357. sugga momma will divorce me
  3358.  
  3359. klee [1:16 PM]
  3360. rekt
  3361.  
  3362. macsga [1:16 PM]
  3363. unless provide sex
  3364.  
  3365. csw [1:16 PM]
  3366. A....Q... Adam (from my understanding) pointed a certain person to Wei. :slightly_smiling_face:
  3367.  
  3368. jp [1:16 PM]
  3369. Vinny rich
  3370.  
  3371. klee [1:16 PM]
  3372. Where's Vinny?
  3373.  
  3374. mrhodl [1:16 PM]
  3375. https://btcchat.slack.com/archives/C555C1FME/p1493918140758518 Why do you say that?
  3376. csw
  3377. If Bitcoin ends, then I am broke :slightly_smiling_face:
  3378. Posted in #generalToday at 1:15 PM
  3379.  
  3380. macsga [1:17 PM]
  3381. Vinny is alp
  3382.  
  3383. andrewquentson [1:17 PM]
  3384. did you speak to wei @csw ?
  3385.  
  3386. klee [1:17 PM]
  3387. We are all Vinny
  3388.  
  3389. jp [1:17 PM]
  3390. Vinnayaan kleecumming
  3391.  
  3392.  
  3393. andrewquentson [1:17 PM]
  3394. speak obvs includes email etc
  3395.  
  3396. rajsallin [1:17 PM]
  3397. joined #general
  3398.  
  3399. macsga [1:17 PM]
  3400. he sodl early and now butthurt
  3401.  
  3402. csw [1:17 PM]
  3403. 99% of my wealth is in Bitcoin in one way or another. I own no Alts and I have sold most of the property I owned
  3404.  
  3405. mrhodl [1:17 PM]
  3406. @csw Prove it.
  3407.  
  3408. csw [1:17 PM]
  3409. I have talked to Wei in the past, yes.
  3410.  
  3411. andrewquentson [1:17 PM]
  3412. did you speak to wei after speaking to adam @csw ?
  3413.  
  3414. csw [1:17 PM]
  3415. MrH... Prove what?
  3416.  
  3417. [1:18]
  3418. A...Q... No comment
  3419.  
  3420. jp [1:18 PM]
  3421. Keep up with the kardashian is happening, featuring Craig Wright and dragon den ... Ding ding ding.
  3422.  
  3423. Round 1
  3424.  
  3425. mrhodl [1:18 PM]
  3426. That you are the type of holder you say you are.
  3427.  
  3428. andy [1:18 PM]
  3429. That you'll be broke. Ignore it. It's not an assertion that requires proving imo.
  3430.  
  3431. mrhodl [1:18 PM]
  3432. At least sign block 9?
  3433.  
  3434. klee [1:18 PM]
  3435. Plan 9 from Outer Space
  3436.  
  3437. andrewquentson [1:18 PM]
  3438. @csw can you describe what b-money is and how it's similiar or different from bitcoin?
  3439.  
  3440. [1:18]
  3441. this one is a genuine question
  3442.  
  3443.  
  3444. csw [1:18 PM]
  3445. Yes, I can explain b-money
  3446.  
  3447. alp
  3448. [1:19 PM]
  3449. uploaded this image: image.png
  3450. Add Comment
  3451.  
  3452. andy [1:19 PM]
  3453. I'm pretty sure csw has at least a couple of bits if he's CEO of a $300m enterprise looking to dethrone BS.
  3454.  
  3455.  
  3456. iang [1:19 PM]
  3457. Signing things with early keys is not particularly helpful - the keys were moved around several times, and no ‘proof’ is therefore proof.
  3458.  
  3459.  
  3460. csw [1:19 PM]
  3461. Have you read b-money, the concept is sound, but it was not developed
  3462.  
  3463. mrhodl [1:19 PM]
  3464. @csw Will you ever sign any of the early blocks?
  3465.  
  3466. alp
  3467. [1:19 PM]
  3468. andy: how is bs ona throne
  3469.  
  3470. andrewquentson [1:19 PM]
  3471. I'm actually very curious to know how b-money is similiar and different from bitcoin @csw in a sort of high level conceptual manner
  3472.  
  3473. andy [1:19 PM]
  3474. I bet nChain has more BTC holdings that BS does, as they keep their funds in fiat.
  3475.  
  3476.  
  3477. macsga [1:19 PM]
  3478. @alp VINNY!
  3479.  
  3480. alp
  3481. [1:19 PM]
  3482. kek
  3483.  
  3484. iang [1:19 PM]
  3485. I outlined this on Crypto list a year back: http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2016-May/029323.html Basically, signing won’t give you the proof-boost you want.
  3486.  
  3487. alp
  3488. [1:19 PM]
  3489. you think nchain has any holdings?
  3490.  
  3491. andy [1:20 PM]
  3492. If tons of people have access to early keys then the coins associated would have moved by now, no?
  3493.  
  3494. csw [1:20 PM]
  3495. Part 1 - the paper to discuss.
  3496.  
  3497. mrhodl [1:20 PM]
  3498. @csw Will you ever sign any of the early blocks or are you going to continue bullshitting us?
  3499.  
  3500. csw [1:20 PM]
  3501. I am fascinated by Tim May's crypto-anarchy. Unlike the communities
  3502. traditionally associated with the word "anarchy", in a crypto-anarchy the
  3503. government is not temporarily destroyed but permanently forbidden and
  3504. permanently unnecessary. It's a community where the threat of violence is
  3505. impotent because violence is impossible, and violence is impossible
  3506. because its participants cannot be linked to their true names or physical
  3507. locations.
  3508.  
  3509. Until now it's not clear, even theoretically, how such a community could
  3510. operate. A community is defined by the cooperation of its participants,
  3511. and efficient cooperation requires a medium of exchange (money) and a way
  3512. to enforce contracts. Traditionally these services have been provided by
  3513. the government or government sponsored institutions and only to legal
  3514. entities. In this article I describe a protocol by which these services
  3515. can be provided to and by untraceable entities.
  3516.  
  3517. I will actually describe two protocols. The first one is impractical,
  3518. because it makes heavy use of a synchronous and unjammable anonymous
  3519. broadcast channel. However it will motivate the second, more practical
  3520. protocol. In both cases I will assume the existence of an untraceable
  3521. network, where senders and receivers are identified only by digital
  3522. pseudonyms (i.e. public keys) and every messages is signed by its sender
  3523. and encrypted to its receiver.
  3524.  
  3525. [1:20]
  3526. http://www.weidai.com/bmoney.txt
  3527.  
  3528. andy [1:21 PM]
  3529. I don't think he has to prove anything with regard to SN if he doesn't seek to convince anyone that he's SN.
  3530.  
  3531. andrewquentson [1:21 PM]
  3532. I've read that
  3533.  
  3534. [1:21]
  3535. the question was
  3536.  
  3537. [1:21]
  3538. how is b-money similiar and different from bitcoin?
  3539.  
  3540. mrhodl [1:21 PM]
  3541. But he did claim to be Satoshi?
  3542.  
  3543. [1:21]
  3544. on more than one occasion.
  3545.  
  3546. csw [1:21 PM]
  3547. I know and this is a forum that takes time to answer in
  3548.  
  3549.  
  3550. jp [1:22 PM]
  3551. Hold my beer
  3552.  
  3553. andy [1:22 PM]
  3554. He was at one time forced into a position by former staff. He initiated but then digressed from the assertion you're trying to get him to reassert.
  3555.  
  3556. csw [1:22 PM]
  3557. Shall I start on the first or the second protocols A...Q...?
  3558.  
  3559. andrewquentson [1:22 PM]
  3560. you can start on the high level differences
  3561.  
  3562. [1:22]
  3563. presumably you can abstract stuff in thought?
  3564.  
  3565. [1:23]
  3566. and distill it
  3567.  
  3568. csw [1:23 PM]
  3569. In b-money, each party has a database, but, unlike in Bitcoin this is not syncronised.
  3570.  
  3571. andrewquentson [1:23 PM]
  3572. then succinctly communicate it
  3573.  
  3574. csw [1:23 PM]
  3575. The issue was the Byzantine Generals problem.
  3576.  
  3577. [1:24]
  3578. Where this was solved is through the use of the gamblers fallacy. In this, we have the attacker under 51% (not 50) playing a game of roulette in effect.
  3579.  
  3580. [1:24]
  3581. As each roll is under the required return, they never expect to win in the long run.
  3582.  
  3583. andrewquentson [1:25 PM]
  3584. yes we know what the general's problem is
  3585.  
  3586. csw [1:25 PM]
  3587. B-money was similar to Adam's hashcash in use
  3588.  
  3589. [1:26]
  3590. It was not in effect capped. The solution was based on a known PoW that set the economic value to be the cost of "mining" the demonstrated calculation.
  3591.  
  3592. alp
  3593. [1:26 PM]
  3594. :crocodile:
  3595.  
  3596. [1:26]
  3597. :knife: that's not a knife
  3598.  
  3599. csw [1:26 PM]
  3600. Basically, each entity seeks to mint coins
  3601.  
  3602. beautybubble [1:26 PM]
  3603. Was not that issue covered in a Ripple forum some years ago OR does it remain relevant? Thank you.
  3604.  
  3605. csw [1:27 PM]
  3606. b-money and the broadcast system was an account based system
  3607.  
  3608. alp
  3609. [1:27 PM]
  3610. csw: is mike hearn going to join you?
  3611.  
  3612. csw [1:27 PM]
  3613. I have not been up with Ripple of late sorry.
  3614.  
  3615. [1:28]
  3616. In b-Money (bm from now) the user agrees to send a transaction and complete the work before a time.
  3617.  
  3618. [1:28]
  3619. In this manner, bm is in effect a system that is online and requires the broadcast to be created in a set time window,
  3620.  
  3621. andy [1:28 PM]
  3622. @alp I don't imagine Hearn will return. The community isn't going to suddenly become nontoxic, even if on-chain scaling happens.
  3623.  
  3624. beautybubble [1:28 PM]
  3625. Thank you for your answer. Appreciate it.
  3626.  
  3627. csw [1:29 PM]
  3628. The options do allow for a payment in default against an account, but there is little in the form or nature of scripting nor of what could be a smart contract.
  3629.  
  3630. andrewquentson [1:30 PM]
  3631. alright let me narrow down
  3632.  
  3633. alp
  3634. [1:30 PM]
  3635. i mean return to nchain not bitcoin
  3636.  
  3637. andrewquentson [1:30 PM]
  3638. wei says b-money has two layers
  3639.  
  3640. csw [1:30 PM]
  3641. SHA1 was proposed in bm. At the time this was still used widely, but faults had developed by 2007
  3642.  
  3643. andrewquentson [1:30 PM]
  3644. lets focus on the base layer
  3645.  
  3646. [1:30]
  3647. he says it's inefficient
  3648.  
  3649. [1:30]
  3650. that's why it needs a second layer
  3651.  
  3652. danielnyairo [1:30 PM]
  3653. joined #general
  3654.  
  3655. andrewquentson [1:30 PM]
  3656. what makes b-money inefficient but bitcoin efficient and therefore not needing a second layer?
  3657.  
  3658. new messages
  3659. csw [1:31 PM]
  3660. For a start, there are issues with the need for a secure network. Tor even was not really of sufficient quality (edited)
  3661.  
  3662. ajd [1:31 PM]
  3663. I want to know why 50.9% isn't enough.
  3664.  
  3665. csw [1:32 PM]
  3666. Bitcoin allows for offline signing. It also has a separation of the validation function
  3667.  
  3668. [1:32]
  3669. The use of UTXO to mint coin at each transaction(these being in effect destroyed and created a new) allows for the use as cash and not an account
  3670.  
  3671. 1:33]
  3672. Bitcoin is not and does not require the transaction to be encrypted.
  3673.  
  3674. andrewquentson [1:33 PM]
  3675. what do you mean?
  3676.  
  3677. [1:33]
  3678. encrypted how?
  3679.  
  3680. csw [1:34 PM]
  3681. BTC uses a hashing algorithm and DSS. It is not encrypted.
  3682.  
  3683. beautybubble [1:35 PM]
  3684. May I quote you on that?
  3685.  
  3686. csw [1:35 PM]
  3687. Bm requires that the channel is encrypted. Basically, more than a VPN as the need for an untraceable connection means that attacks can be formed by link analysis
  3688.  
  3689. [1:35]
  3690. BB?
  3691.  
  3692. beautybubble [1:35 PM]
  3693. Yes, on the "BTC uses a hashing algorithm and DSS. It is not encrypted."
  3694.  
  3695. csw [1:35 PM]
  3696. BTC uses a hashing algorithm and DSS. It is not encrypted.?
  3697.  
  3698. [1:35]
  3699. Yes, ECC is not used. EcDSA is.
  3700.  
  3701. beautybubble [1:36 PM]
  3702. Thank you. Heading to twitter.
  3703.  
  3704. csw [1:37 PM]
  3705. Messages in Bitcoin are singed, but they are also open and can be analysed
  3706.  
  3707. andrewquentson [1:37 PM]
  3708. @csw I'm not sure what you might have discussed with wei, I'm going by the 4-5 para he wrote
  3709.  
  3710. [1:38]
  3711. he seems to be describing bitcoin in great parts, but he says the base layer is inefficient, why isn't bitcoin's? (edited)
  3712.  
  3713. andy [1:38 PM]
  3714. The plural of bitcoin is bitcoin.
  3715.  
  3716.  
  3717. klee [1:39 PM]
  3718. bitscoin?
  3719.  
  3720.  
  3721. jp [1:40 PM]
  3722. Bitcorns
  3723.  
  3724. csw [1:40 PM]
  3725. Bitcoin uses what is in effect a SEIR-c epidemic model. The messages are sent unencrypted but signed and the propagation (should) requires verification prior to forwarding
  3726.  
  3727. andrewquentson [1:41 PM]
  3728. but every node needs to store it
  3729.  
  3730. [1:41]
  3731. and they keep sending each other data, many of it useless, research has found for 8k real blocks some 200k are sent
  3732.  
  3733. csw [1:41 PM]
  3734. Yes. Each node. That can also be a risk decision
  3735.  
  3736. megalodon
  3737. [1:41 PM]
  3738. @csw What's a Bitcoin? :innocent:
  3739.  
  3740. csw [1:41 PM]
  3741. And a point in time can mean that the verification for some nodes in limited.
  3742.  
  3743. andy [1:42 PM]
  3744. Do you currently mine csw?
  3745.  
  3746. andrewquentson [1:42 PM]
  3747. yes, alright
  3748.  
  3749. xhiggy [1:42 PM]
  3750. Can you explain how bitcoin maps to a SEIR-C epidemic model, and why not an SIR model?
  3751.  
  3752. andrewquentson [1:42 PM]
  3753. how did Adam Back come to your attention before you contacted him @csw?
  3754.  
  3755. csw [1:42 PM]
  3756. And there are methods that can make SEIR network graphs more efficent
  3757.  
  3758. andrewquentson [1:43 PM]
  3759. I don't think google can help you and of course the time it takes to answer is a factor @csw
  3760.  
  3761. [1:44]
  3762. its a very easy question
  3763.  
  3764. [1:44]
  3765. for satoshi
  3766.  
  3767. [1:44]
  3768. or adam back
  3769.  
  3770. csw [1:44 PM]
  3771. LOL
  3772.  
  3773. [1:45]
  3774. And as I said, I am not going to answer Satoshi questions.
  3775.  
  3776. [1:45]
  3777. But a good try.
  3778.  
  3779. andrewquentson [1:45 PM]
  3780. you should answer this one
  3781.  
  3782. jp [1:45 PM]
  3783. Csw is a con artist, move along.
  3784.  
  3785. andrewquentson [1:45 PM]
  3786. its public knoweldge
  3787.  
  3788. [1:45]
  3789. go on
  3790.  
  3791. csw [1:45 PM]
  3792. No, it is what Adam stated and what a few sites such as Gwern's state.
  3793.  
  3794. jp [1:46 PM]
  3795. Cright wraig is not Satoshi, con artist and asshole. Move long guys.
  3796.  
  3797. andrewquentson [1:46 PM]
  3798. stated what?
  3799.  
  3800. csw [1:46 PM]
  3801. Read Gwern's over long post and a few other blogs.
  3802.  
  3803. [1:46]
  3804. And it is not the real answer, but more I will not comment.
  3805.  
  3806. andrewquentson [1:46 PM]
  3807. what does gwern's blog say
  3808.  
  3809. andy [1:47 PM]
  3810. andrewquentson You're still seeking for him to prove something he's acknowledged he isn't seeking to prove.
  3811.  
  3812. csw [1:47 PM]
  3813. That is not too difficult to google AQ
  3814.  
  3815. ajd [1:47 PM]
  3816. Why is 51% the threshold and not 50%?
  3817.  
  3818.  
  3819. megalodon
  3820. [1:48 PM]
  3821. any estimate on when more details for the SDK nChain is working on will be available?
  3822.  
  3823. andy [1:48 PM]
  3824. 51% loses over a long enough time.
  3825.  
  3826. [1:48]
  3827. or wins rather
  3828.  
  3829. [1:48]
  3830. derp
  3831.  
  3832. andrewquentson [1:48 PM]
  3833. do you mean this @csw ? https://www.gwern.net/docs/2008-nakamoto
  3834. gwern.net
  3835. Dai/Nakamoto emails - Gwern.net
  3836. Emails between Wei Dai and Satoshi Nakamoto discussing Bitcoin
  3837.  
  3838. ajd [1:48 PM]
  3839. What about 50.9%?
  3840.  
  3841. andrewquentson [1:48 PM]
  3842. so you were googling then!
  3843.  
  3844. [1:49]
  3845. but that doesn't say how adam back came to your attention does it?
  3846.  
  3847. klee [1:49 PM]
  3848. I like Adam's hair
  3849.  
  3850.  
  3851. csw [1:49 PM]
  3852. No A.Q. I was on a private chat with MrHodl
  3853.  
  3854. klee [1:49 PM]
  3855. much beauty
  3856.  
  3857. csw [1:49 PM]
  3858. 50.00000000001% even
  3859.  
  3860. andrewquentson [1:50 PM]
  3861. can you say how adam back came to your attention @csw?
  3862.  
  3863. klee [1:50 PM]
  3864. such brains
  3865.  
  3866. beautybubble [1:50 PM]
  3867. May I ask... the hostility in this channel is coming from a belief that the SLACK member csw is not Craig Steven Wright, Australian computer scientist and businessman? So with a very simple question to the member, @csw Are you indeed the person named and described here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Steven_Wright -- Thank you for your kind answer. ~Beauty
  3868. Wikipedia
  3869. Craig Steven Wright
  3870. Craig Steven Wright (born October 1970) is an Australian computer scientist and businessman. He claims to be the real person behind the pseudonym Satoshi Nakamoto—the creator of bitcoin—a claim that is disputed within the bitcoin community.
  3871.  
  3872. iang [1:50 PM]
  3873. 51% is just a convenient way of saying a slight majority. Like 50% plus a little bit.
  3874.  
  3875. ajd [1:51 PM]
  3876. Okay I thought maybe there was something more to https://btcchat.slack.com/archives/C555C1FME/p1493918661942624
  3877. csw
  3878. Where this was solved is through the use of the gamblers fallacy. In this, we have the attacker under 51% (not 50) playing a game of roulette in effect.
  3879. Posted in #generalToday at 1:24 PM
  3880.  
  3881. iang [1:51 PM]
  3882. The point isn’t so much xx%% but that the algorithm eventually decides one way or the other.
  3883.  
  3884. alp
  3885. [1:51 PM]
  3886. @beautybubble : its that csw is a con artist
  3887.  
  3888. beautybubble [1:51 PM]
  3889. I am being patient with the answer.
  3890.  
  3891. xhiggy [1:51 PM]
  3892. Who is he conning?
  3893.  
  3894. andrewquentson [1:51 PM]
  3895. @csw can you say how adam back came to your attention?
  3896.  
  3897. macsga [1:51 PM]
  3898. @alp VINNY, BUY TEH DIPS
  3899.  
  3900. csw [1:52 PM]
  3901. I am the person named here: https://medium.com/@MADinMelbourne/welcome-to-the-ministry-of-truth-in-the-wiki-age-601ec28a2504
  3902. Medium
  3903. Welcome to the Ministry of Truth in the Wiki Age. – #thewildcard – Medium
  3904. “Is this really happening?” was tweeted to me yesterday as nChain announced it’s arrival into the Bitcoin scene, bringing with it the…
  3905. Reading time
  3906. ----------------
  3907. 4 min read
  3908.  
  3909. (461kB)
  3910. April 17th at 5:36 AM
  3911.  
  3912. iang [1:52 PM]
  3913. Unfortunately, sadly, people are obsessed with numbers. Numbers make something seem real. So we have to put some numbers on the explanation … to make people believe. See, I used numbers 3 times there, so I’m right.
  3914.  
  3915. beautybubble [1:52 PM]
  3916. Can you be so kind to answer my question too? Thank you.
  3917.  
  3918. andy [1:52 PM]
  3919. 3 is a number too. I believe you now.
  3920.  
  3921. klee [1:52 PM]
  3922. https://twitter.com/VinnyLingham/status/860184952003940352
  3923. Vinny Lingham @VinnyLingham
  3924. 1/ The current price momentum and new highs for Bitcoin has effectively neutered any chance of Segwit being activated on Bitcoin, IMHO.
  3925. TwitterToday at 1:30 PM
  3926.  
  3927.  
  3928. [1:52]
  3929. HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA
  3930.  
  3931. [1:52]
  3932. I FART FROM LAUGHING
  3933.  
  3934. [1:52]
  3935. POOR MFer!!
  3936. !!!
  3937.  
  3938. csw [1:52 PM]
  3939. BB. The one on who?
  3940.  
  3941. beautybubble [1:52 PM]
  3942. The wiki page.
  3943.  
  3944. macsga [1:52 PM]
  3945. lol
  3946.  
  3947. andy [1:53 PM]
  3948. Segwit is DOA. Would you agree csw?
  3949.  
  3950. csw [1:53 PM]
  3951. And I did answer.
  3952.  
  3953. beautybubble [1:53 PM]
  3954. Thank you.
  3955.  
  3956. csw [1:53 PM]
  3957. SegWit is a removal of many of the fundimental aspects of Bitcoin
  3958.  
  3959. klee [1:54 PM]
  3960. VinnyCoin
  3961.  
  3962.  
  3963. jp [1:54 PM]
  3964. Corn will crash to 400.
  3965.  
  3966. csw [1:54 PM]
  3967. This simplistic idea that Transaction = H(TX) is a solution is a demonstration that only settlement matters to some.
  3968.  
  3969. prometheus [1:54 PM]
  3970. @csw are you concerned about any other alt-coins usurping BTC's position? The closest one I can currently see getting close is Ethereum (ETH), but I personally view it as being fundamentally flawed in that the chain is storing and processing all smart contract transactions (bad for storage and scaling) and there's a never ending inflation of the asset (bad for use as a hard currency).
  3971.  
  3972. Litecoin (LTC) is similar to BTC, in that it's capped, and plans to implement SegWit soon. There's a lot of hype around LTC right now, but I'm unconvinced it's sustainable, unless businesses actually start utilizing SegWit and implementing Lightning (which centralizes the network, in my opinion).
  3973.  
  3974. Your thoughts?
  3975.  
  3976. csw [1:54 PM]
  3977. I do not follow Alts.
  3978.  
  3979.  
  3980. andrewquentson [1:55 PM]
  3981. @csw I won't ask again. Can you say how Adam Back came to your attention?
  3982.  
  3983. andy [1:55 PM]
  3984. I think people are going to persist in trying to disprove you're Satoshi, regardless of how clearly you state that you do not seek to prove this.
  3985.  
  3986. csw [1:56 PM]
  3987. A...Q... Then stop asking.
  3988.  
  3989.  
  3990. cypherblock [1:56 PM]
  3991. can you say some more about how segwit removes some fundamental aspects?
  3992.  
  3993. csw [1:56 PM]
  3994. Segwit changes the validation layer
  3995.  
  3996. andrewquentson [1:57 PM]
  3997. Well, I did say it was the last time I'd ask, but why won't you say?
  3998.  
  3999. ajd [1:57 PM]
  4000. What do you think about P2SH, then?
  4001.  
  4002. csw [1:57 PM]
  4003. It changes the control from those who mine to a number of "soft" change options.
  4004.  
  4005. andrewquentson [1:57 PM]
  4006. It's public knowledge, although you clearly don't appear aware of it
  4007.  
  4008. beautybubble [1:57 PM]
  4009. May I post an invitation to this SLACK? Having a chance to ask you serious questions and then learn about your newer ventures I believe would help everyone. Thank you.
  4010.  
  4011. alp
  4012. [1:57 PM]
  4013. andy: csw does quite a fine job disproving it every word he speaks.
  4014.  
  4015. andrewquentson [1:57 PM]
  4016. Satoshi, however, would certainly know
  4017.  
  4018. csw [1:57 PM]
  4019. P2SH was a basket case, but we have it now
  4020.  
  4021. iang [1:57 PM]
  4022. The Transaction = H(TX) thing was something I found pretty critical in my work, and would naturally follow it. But bitcoin’s UTXO layout is completely different, and it’s non-obvious. Also the entire published ledger takes away the need to have a hash proof of existence. Still, it complicates things having multiple valid transactions.
  4023.  
  4024. alp
  4025. [1:57 PM]
  4026. he clearly doesnt know the code.
  4027.  
  4028. andrewquentson [1:57 PM]
  4029. as does Adam Back of course
  4030.  
  4031. iang [1:57 PM]
  4032. But I’m guessing this is a whiteboard discussion :disappointed:
  4033.  
  4034. cypherblock [1:58 PM]
  4035. @andrewquentson why are you asking about adam ? He is not trying to prove he is Satoshi right now.
  4036.  
  4037. ajd [1:58 PM]
  4038. Okay you gave the right answer to that one. :slightly_smiling_face:
  4039.  
  4040. mrhodl [1:58 PM]
  4041. @cypherblock *right now* is keyword. He did in the past.
  4042.  
  4043. andy [1:58 PM]
  4044. alp seems to be an expert on who satoshi is based on their statements of the tech. perhaps csw or someone else could ask alp a question to demonstrate his prowess with knowledge of the protocol?
  4045.  
  4046. iang [1:58 PM]
  4047. Everyone knows Adam Back. I’ve known him for over 20 years.
  4048.  
  4049. alp
  4050. [1:58 PM]
  4051. i do not claim to be satoshi andy
  4052.  
  4053. [1:59]
  4054. I didnt write the code.
  4055.  
  4056. csw [1:59 PM]
  4057. Who wrote the book referenced in the code on triple redundancy?
  4058.  
  4059. cypherblock [1:59 PM]
  4060. @mrhodl maybe maybe not.
  4061.  
  4062. mrhodl [1:59 PM]
  4063. what?
  4064.  
  4065. [1:59]
  4066. What do you mean maybe maybe not?
  4067.  
  4068. iang [1:59 PM]
  4069. Him I don’t know. But my ex-SO does. Goes to uni where he was.
  4070.  
  4071. mrhodl [2:00 PM]
  4072. Are you saying he never said he was the creator of bitcoin? @cypherblock
  4073.  
  4074. iang [2:00 PM]
  4075. He’s very old :slightly_smiling_face:
  4076.  
  4077. klee [2:00 PM]
  4078. Atherosclerosis
  4079.  
  4080. klee [2:00 PM]
  4081. uploaded this image: image.png
  4082. Add Comment
  4083.  
  4084.  
  4085. andrewquentson [2:02 PM]
  4086. You guys here
  4087.  
  4088. macsga [2:02 PM]
  4089. uploaded this image: hear hear
  4090. Add Comment
  4091.  
  4092. andrewquentson [2:02 PM]
  4093. @cypherblock
  4094.  
  4095. [2:02]
  4096. @iang
  4097.  
  4098. [2:02]
  4099. @jp
  4100.  
  4101. cypherblock [2:02 PM]
  4102. @mrhodl I’m saying he may either have never wanted to prove he was satoshi or maybe changed his mind.
  4103.  
  4104. andrewquentson [2:02 PM]
  4105. @bitsko
  4106.  
  4107. [2:02]
  4108. and the rest
  4109.  
  4110. [2:02]
  4111. you know this guy
  4112.  
  4113. [2:02]
  4114. fucking discraced Gavin?
  4115.  
  4116. cypherblock [2:02 PM]
  4117. yes I know
  4118.  
  4119. andrewquentson [2:02 PM]
  4120. you know he overshadowed the May blockchain coference
  4121.  
  4122. jp [2:02 PM]
  4123. Vegas modafackor, M O O N F I L T H Y
  4124.  
  4125. iang [2:03 PM]
  4126. @andrewquentson can you please stop spamming the channel - you’re not making yourself welcome.
  4127.  
  4128. andrewquentson [2:03 PM]
  4129. when we were to talk about all srots of nice thing
  4130.  
  4131. [2:03]
  4132. It was to be the comming out party
  4133.  
  4134. [2:03]
  4135. you know he is the cause of the commit removal?
  4136.  
  4137. cypherblock [2:03 PM]
  4138. yes I know
  4139.  
  4140. andrewquentson [2:03 PM]
  4141. and now he blabs here
  4142.  
  4143. jp [2:03 PM]
  4144. uploaded this image: e7bb793450426bdf1cb4e79397aea11dea281c31505206ca1bd95fcd3a0404a7.jpg
  4145. Add Comment
  4146.  
  4147. jp [2:03 PM]
  4148. 1600 kleenay vincumming
  4149.  
  4150. macsga [2:03 PM]
  4151. @andrewquentson what's your problem exactly?
  4152.  
  4153. andrewquentson [2:03 PM]
  4154. and some big blockers are all yeh maybe
  4155.  
  4156. [2:03]
  4157. sure
  4158.  
  4159. macsga [2:03 PM]
  4160. are you him?
  4161.  
  4162. andrewquentson [2:03 PM]
  4163. maybe the sun falls
  4164.  
  4165. macsga [2:04 PM]
  4166. I don't see Gavin here
  4167.  
  4168. cypherblock [2:04 PM]
  4169. The gavin thing was unfortunate. @csw did you see that as necessary to disrupt authority myths?
  4170.  
  4171. andrewquentson [2:04 PM]
  4172. what authority myths
  4173.  
  4174. mrhodl [2:04 PM]
  4175. lol
  4176.  
  4177. jp [2:04 PM]
  4178. As I said. This slack should be private instead of inviting those like alp and andrew
  4179.  
  4180. andrewquentson [2:04 PM]
  4181. he is claiming the HIGHEST authority
  4182.  
  4183. macsga [2:04 PM]
  4184. alp is Vinny
  4185.  
  4186. iang [2:04 PM]
  4187. Gavin was just caught up in the entire circus. He wasn’t “intended” he was just roadkill as the community responded.
  4188.  
  4189. macsga [2:04 PM]
  4190. let him here I like him
  4191.  
  4192. [2:04]
  4193. :stuck_out_tongue:
  4194.  
  4195. jp [2:04 PM]
  4196. Find the fucking sentence he said he wanted to be the highest
  4197.  
  4198. cypherblock [2:04 PM]
  4199. satoshi is authority myth.
  4200.  
  4201. mrhodl [2:05 PM]
  4202. I can't believe this but i'm with Andrew Quentson on this
  4203.  
  4204. andrewquentson [2:05 PM]
  4205. there is no myth @cypherblock
  4206.  
  4207. mrhodl [2:05 PM]
  4208. @andrewquentson Wanna try and be friends?
  4209.  
  4210. jp [2:05 PM]
  4211. Go back to your dragon den
  4212.  
  4213.  
  4214. andrewquentson [2:05 PM]
  4215. satoshi is presumed to have brains
  4216.  
  4217. [2:05]
  4218. because of what he achieved
  4219.  
  4220. mrhodl [2:05 PM]
  4221. hahahah
  4222.  
  4223. andrewquentson [2:05 PM]
  4224. smarts
  4225.  
  4226. alp
  4227. [2:05 PM]
  4228. lol jp
  4229.  
  4230. andrewquentson [2:05 PM]
  4231. you know
  4232.  
  4233. alp
  4234. [2:05 PM]
  4235. jp who the fuck are you anyway
  4236.  
  4237. andrewquentson [2:05 PM]
  4238. intellect
  4239.  
  4240. iang [2:05 PM]
  4241. We understand that you’re trying to create some great copy - but the myth is dead. SN is no more. It’s over.
  4242.  
  4243.  
  4244. andrewquentson [2:05 PM]
  4245. thats a useful thing
  4246.  
  4247. awemany [2:05 PM]
  4248. @newliberty , @csw: after some fresh air, i think the "aleph1" argument from above has a gaping hole: there needs to be a clear definition of what SHA256 (or any other hash function) *is* then
  4249.  
  4250. jp [2:05 PM]
  4251. I'm the one fuck your modafacker
  4252.  
  4253. alp
  4254. [2:05 PM]
  4255. lol
  4256.  
  4257. awemany [2:05 PM]
  4258. It sounds cool, but I think it does not make sense
  4259.  
  4260. cryptonaut [2:05 PM]
  4261. @andrewquentson it's actually people like you that try to claim Satoshi is "the highest authority". Literally everything csw has said so far has been the opposite
  4262.  
  4263. alp
  4264. [2:06 PM]
  4265. so whats the plan after no one buys this?
  4266.  
  4267. jp [2:06 PM]
  4268. I fucking fun in dat hole to create you piece of shit
  4269.  
  4270. csw [2:06 PM]
  4271. I am not claiming authority at all
  4272.  
  4273. andrewquentson [2:06 PM]
  4274. Satoshi is not an "authority"
  4275.  
  4276. cryptonaut [2:06 PM]
  4277. you are claiming he is
  4278.  
  4279. macsga [2:06 PM]
  4280. @alp boobs and BJ buddy
  4281.  
  4282. andrewquentson [2:06 PM]
  4283. thats like calling einstein an "authority"
  4284.  
  4285. andy [2:06 PM]
  4286. agreed
  4287.  
  4288. mrhodl [2:06 PM]
  4289. Yet, you want us to follow your lead? @csw
  4290.  
  4291. csw [2:06 PM]
  4292. No, I want people to think
  4293.  
  4294. fatman3001 [2:06 PM]
  4295. joined #general
  4296.  
  4297. klee [2:06 PM]
  4298. SHORT LTSHIT MFERS
  4299.  
  4300. mrhodl [2:06 PM]
  4301. I'm think you're full of shit.
  4302.  
  4303. andy [2:06 PM]
  4304. good luck with that one csw
  4305.  
  4306. awemany [2:07 PM]
  4307. csw, I see you are here again. Can you explain how you extend SHA256 to infinite data streams for your aleph1 argument?
  4308.  
  4309. jp [2:07 PM]
  4310. @mrhodl fuck you modafackers. Get the fuck out of here
  4311.  
  4312. mrhodl [2:07 PM]
  4313. jp, eat a dick.. thank you.
  4314.  
  4315. csw [2:07 PM]
  4316. It saddens me, but you may be right Andy
  4317.  
  4318. beautybubble [2:07 PM]
  4319. I see that @charlieshrem is in the channel. Maybe if he came forward in the conversation we can settle things once and for all.
  4320.  
  4321. fatman3001 [2:07 PM]
  4322. Hi all
  4323.  
  4324. mrhodl [2:07 PM]
  4325. English please
  4326.  
  4327. charlieshrem [2:08 PM]
  4328. Hmm?
  4329.  
  4330. fatman3001 [2:08 PM]
  4331. Hi csw
  4332.  
  4333. mrhodl [2:08 PM]
  4334. Hi Charlie
  4335.  
  4336. beautybubble [2:08 PM]
  4337. Oh, there you are!
  4338.  
  4339. andy [2:08 PM]
  4340. some us think. the thoughtful ones are the silent types though.
  4341.  
  4342. charlieshrem [2:08 PM]
  4343. HI
  4344.  
  4345. andy [2:08 PM]
  4346. heya charlie
  4347.  
  4348. beautybubble [2:08 PM]
  4349. I think we need your sensible self injected here Charlie.
  4350.  
  4351. charlieshrem [2:08 PM]
  4352. Regarding?
  4353.  
  4354. beautybubble [2:09 PM]
  4355. I guess people are having an issue believing the @csw is indeed himself.
  4356.  
  4357. jp [2:09 PM]
  4358. Why would we need this guy? Core shiller
  4359.  
  4360. charlieshrem [2:09 PM]
  4361. OK
  4362.  
  4363. [2:09]
  4364. I asked him the same question
  4365.  
  4366. alp
  4367. [2:09 PM]
  4368. jp seems to be on some kind of drugs
  4369.  
  4370. [2:09]
  4371. its funny when aquent is the voice of reason in a room
  4372.  
  4373.  
  4374. iang [2:09 PM]
  4375. icecream :disappointed:
  4376.  
  4377. andrewquentson [2:10 PM]
  4378. always voice of reason
  4379.  
  4380. beautybubble [2:10 PM]
  4381. And are you satisfied that it is indeed Craig?
  4382.  
  4383. charlieshrem [2:10 PM]
  4384. I can confirm @csw emailed me to verify from 2 emails, @ncrypt.com and @rcjbr.org
  4385.  
  4386. jp [2:10 PM]
  4387. First of all, this is not an investigation nor an interrogation.
  4388.  
  4389. beautybubble [2:10 PM]
  4390. Thank you so much.
  4391.  
  4392. alp
  4393. [2:10 PM]
  4394. its whatever we want it to be jp
  4395.  
  4396. cypherblock [2:11 PM]
  4397. @csw that medium post you linked to before doesn’t have any papers you wrote linked. Do you have some papers you’ve written as csw that you could post links to?
  4398.  
  4399. awemany [2:11 PM]
  4400. lets get to some issues: how does the aleph1 SHA256 work? I really like to have input on that, because although it sounds all nice, this one actually is a gaping hole in the above arguments, as far as I can see.
  4401.  
  4402. csw [2:11 PM]
  4403. Not at hand.
  4404.  
  4405. beautybubble [2:11 PM]
  4406. And it is good to have you around. My prayers for your safe return back home were heard.
  4407.  
  4408. andy [2:12 PM]
  4409. Wow. B is going parabolic isn't it?
  4410.  
  4411. jp [2:12 PM]
  4412. 1625
  4413.  
  4414. cypherblock [2:13 PM]
  4415. are there any papers of yours online at all? I really haven’t seen anything academic written by you. Maybe someone else here has links?
  4416.  
  4417. iang [2:13 PM]
  4418. I actually don’t follow that either. Although SHA256 has infinite input, it is only used with a fixed length. So in effect we have SHA256bis which has a finite input. But I’m not a real cryptographer, I just play one on slack.
  4419.  
  4420. csw [2:13 PM]
  4421. AweM... As there is not a means to have a infinite input stream into SHA 256, it remains a discussion that is academic and not one that lends itself to slack
  4422.  
  4423. awemany [2:14 PM]
  4424. we've been discussing that in terms of collisions, and after rethinking it, it doesn't appear to make sense. so I am really curious if you could provide a solid argument on this (edited)
  4425.  
  4426. iang [2:14 PM]
  4427. I miss whiteboards :disappointed:
  4428.  
  4429. macsga [2:18 PM]
  4430. I don't :slightly_smiling_face:
  4431.  
  4432. fatman3001 [2:19 PM]
  4433. apologies to @csw , but I do think it's significant that SN is back (among the living? I assumed he was dead). If I've understood you're trying to create an entity or venue to compete with the ideas promoted by core. BU is such a thing, but a new branch with some well known names and gravitas is significant.
  4434.  
  4435. macsga [2:19 PM]
  4436. Yes, projected value is 11500 USD
  4437. andy
  4438. Wow. B is going parabolic isn't it?
  4439. Posted in #generalToday at 2:12 PM
  4440.  
  4441. fatman3001 [2:19 PM]
  4442. can someone point me to the short and dirty of what the gameplan is?
  4443.  
  4444. csw [2:20 PM]
  4445. Open competition
  4446.  
  4447.  
  4448. agreenberg [2:20 PM]
  4449. joined #general. Also, @david joined.
  4450.  
  4451. andrewquentson [2:20 PM]
  4452. right
  4453.  
  4454. csw [2:20 PM]
  4455. Capitalism in its purest form and in true libertarian format
  4456.  
  4457. andrewquentson [2:20 PM]
  4458. I guess you're sort of not asking for attention now either.....
  4459.  
  4460. tomothy
  4461. [2:20 PM]
  4462. And would segwit impact open competition?
  4463.  
  4464. andrewquentson [2:20 PM]
  4465. welcome @agreenberg
  4466.  
  4467. wings [2:21 PM]
  4468. @csw but there will be hardfork with Core-btc or not ? (edited)
  4469.  
  4470. alp
  4471. [2:21 PM]
  4472. patents and closed source -> open competition lulz
  4473. 2 replies Last reply today at 2:26 PM View thread
  4474.  
  4475. andrewquentson [2:21 PM]
  4476. I was putting @csw through a test @agreenberg
  4477.  
  4478. [2:21]
  4479. I asked him something which is public knowledge
  4480.  
  4481. [2:21]
  4482. but assumed he wouldn't know
  4483.  
  4484. [2:21]
  4485. the question is simple
  4486.  
  4487. csw [2:21 PM]
  4488. SegWit adds incentives for off chain systems at the expense of the main system.,
  4489.  
  4490. andrewquentson [2:21 PM]
  4491. How did Adam Back come to his attention, and by his I mean Satoshi's of course
  4492.  
  4493. [2:22]
  4494. he hasn't replied
  4495.  
  4496. [2:22]
  4497. with an answer
  4498.  
  4499. csw [2:22 PM]
  4500. And A...Q... desires that I answer things in a manner I do not wish to.
  4501.  
  4502. andrewquentson [2:22 PM]
  4503. no no
  4504.  
  4505. [2:22]
  4506. its public knowledge
  4507.  
  4508. iang [2:22 PM]
  4509. @fatman3001 SN isn’t back. SN is dead. What’s happening is that some of the old team are now doing something … more in the public eye. And no longer caring.
  4510.  
  4511.  
  4512. andrewquentson [2:22 PM]
  4513. you dont know the answer
  4514.  
  4515. [2:22]
  4516. if you do state it
  4517.  
  4518. [2:22]
  4519. well
  4520.  
  4521. [2:22]
  4522. if you were satoshi
  4523.  
  4524. tomothy
  4525. [2:22 PM]
  4526. I think that was covered this morning. Did you read the paste bin?
  4527.  
  4528. travin [2:22 PM]
  4529. Andrew can't read.
  4530.  
  4531. checksum0 [2:22 PM]
  4532. I guess not, reading is hard
  4533.  
  4534. tomothy
  4535. [2:22 PM]
  4536. Oh.
  4537.  
  4538. [2:23]
  4539. Talk about a rock and a hard spot then.
  4540.  
  4541. macsga [2:23 PM]
  4542. @andrewquentson he did gave an answer
  4543.  
  4544. tomothy
  4545. [2:23 PM]
  4546. You might not like it.
  4547.  
  4548. fatman3001 [2:23 PM]
  4549. _csw [8:20 PM]
  4550. Open competition_
  4551.  
  4552. F*cking brilliant
  4553. pardon my french
  4554.  
  4555. snoop [2:23 PM]
  4556. Andrew Q does not read
  4557.  
  4558. andrewquentson [2:23 PM]
  4559. he hasn't given the answer
  4560.  
  4561. [2:23]
  4562. if he did, what is it?
  4563.  
  4564. csw [2:23 PM]
  4565. Yes, there seems to be this idea that we can force others to our will in here.
  4566.  
  4567. macsga [2:23 PM]
  4568. @fatman3001 :heart:
  4569.  
  4570. tomothy
  4571. [2:23 PM]
  4572. Hasn't given you the answer you want. Awwwwwwww
  4573.  
  4574.  
  4575. csw [2:24 PM]
  4576. That you have a right to an answer of a question that yu decide you want to ask
  4577.  
  4578. andrewquentson [2:24 PM]
  4579. no, he hasn't give the answer
  4580.  
  4581. [2:24]
  4582. the question has one answer
  4583.  
  4584. tomothy
  4585. [2:24 PM]
  4586. Well, that's an answer in and of itself.
  4587.  
  4588. macsga [2:24 PM]
  4589. @andrewquentson yes, the one YOU want
  4590.  
  4591. [2:24]
  4592. google it man
  4593.  
  4594. [2:24]
  4595. paste it here
  4596.  
  4597. jp [2:24 PM]
  4598. He is just a retard one.
  4599.  
  4600. csw [2:24 PM]
  4601. Is that it A...Q...? Do you think that you decide who and how ?
  4602. That you get to force a response?
  4603.  
  4604. andrewquentson [2:24 PM]
  4605. pardon?
  4606.  
  4607. snoop [2:25 PM]
  4608. AQ is an "Authority"
  4609.  
  4610.  
  4611. tomothy
  4612. [2:25 PM]
  4613. Do you not read English?
  4614.  
  4615. klee [2:25 PM]
  4616. Andrew try picking up a girl in a bar
  4617.  
  4618. [2:25]
  4619. and leave us alone
  4620.  
  4621.  
  4622. jp [2:25 PM]
  4623. Retard can't read
  4624.  
  4625. andrewquentson [2:25 PM]
  4626. I simply asked a question
  4627.  
  4628. [2:25]
  4629. you chose to not answer it
  4630.  
  4631. snoop [2:25 PM]
  4632. AQ has hurt feelings.
  4633.  
  4634. macsga [2:25 PM]
  4635. Ok, on with the tech questions; some pretty significant stuff has been said in here today
  4636.  
  4637. csw [2:25 PM]
  4638. In the last year, I have learnt to deal with media better A...Q...
  4639.  
  4640. You asked, but you offer nothing of value
  4641.  
  4642.  
  4643. andrewquentson [2:26 PM]
  4644. thats like asking a 5 year old whats 1+1
  4645.  
  4646. alp
  4647. [2:26 PM]
  4648. they are ganging up on you aquent, seems like you are on the right track.
  4649.  
  4650. jp [2:26 PM]
  4651. Mommy he doesn't answer me. Mommy!!!
  4652.  
  4653. andrewquentson [2:26 PM]
  4654. and they dont provide an answer
  4655.  
  4656. csw [2:26 PM]
  4657. Do you understand value AQ
  4658.  
  4659. checksum0 [2:26 PM]
  4660. OH snap
  4661.  
  4662. beautybubble [2:26 PM]
  4663. I do believe if we all knew a little bit about intention on social networks we would see that @csw is coming to this SLACK with good intention and has a purpose.
  4664.  
  4665. andrewquentson [2:26 PM]
  4666. can I assume they don't know it?
  4667.  
  4668. [2:26]
  4669. maybeeeeeeeeeee you do
  4670.  
  4671. alp
  4672. [2:26 PM]
  4673. lol
  4674.  
  4675. csw [2:26 PM]
  4676. Free exchange?
  4677.  
  4678. snoop [2:26 PM]
  4679. Alp = ass
  4680.  
  4681. andrewquentson [2:26 PM]
  4682. but what is my little brain to rationally conclude
  4683.  
  4684. alp
  4685. [2:26 PM]
  4686. scammer coming with good purpsose and intent? lol
  4687.  
  4688. tomothy
  4689. [2:26 PM]
  4690. Alp just feels left out
  4691.  
  4692. alp
  4693. [2:26 PM]
  4694. lol
  4695.  
  4696. macsga [2:26 PM]
  4697. VINNY!
  4698.  
  4699. klee [2:26 PM]
  4700. alp-aca
  4701.  
  4702. cobra-bitcoin [2:26 PM]
  4703. joined #general
  4704.  
  4705. macsga [2:26 PM]
  4706. did you buy the dips in XRP?
  4707.  
  4708. tomothy
  4709. [2:26 PM]
  4710. We can throw the ball back and forth. I'll be your daddy, we can play catch.
  4711.  
  4712. checksum0 [2:26 PM]
  4713. Oh my god...
  4714.  
  4715. snoop [2:27 PM]
  4716. Alp=AQ ?
  4717.  
  4718. checksum0 [2:27 PM]
  4719. The trolls are pouring in
  4720.  
  4721. andrewquentson [2:27 PM]
  4722. cute, hi @cobra-bitcoin
  4723.  
  4724. mrhodl [2:27 PM]
  4725. lol
  4726.  
  4727. tomothy
  4728. [2:27 PM]
  4729. No, alp = alfonse.
  4730.  
  4731. andrewquentson [2:27 PM]
  4732. how did you become maintainer of bitcoin.org?
  4733.  
  4734. snoop [2:27 PM]
  4735. Null=Alp=AQ
  4736.  
  4737. cypherblock [2:27 PM]
  4738. can someone just post the answer to @andrewquentson question here so we can move on. Not you csw, I mean someone else. (edited)
  4739.  
  4740. alp
  4741. [2:27 PM]
  4742. left out of what, an orgy with michele seven?
  4743.  
  4744. macsga [2:27 PM]
  4745. in reality he's NotLambChop
  4746.  
  4747. csw [2:27 PM]
  4748. A...Q.. == Andrew Quentson
  4749.  
  4750. cobra-bitcoin [2:27 PM]
  4751. Hey, more active than I expected in here
  4752.  
  4753. alp
  4754. [2:27 PM]
  4755. @cobra-bitcoin welcome its a good time
  4756.  
  4757. mrhodl [2:27 PM]
  4758. Craig in the house.
  4759.  
  4760. tomothy
  4761. [2:27 PM]
  4762. Omg is he nlc?
  4763.  
  4764. alp
  4765. [2:27 PM]
  4766. craigs groupies are here white knighting and aquent is ripping him a new one
  4767.  
  4768. checksum0 [2:28 PM]
  4769. All we are missing is Greg now I guess...
  4770.  
  4771. freetrader [2:28 PM]
  4772. >A...Q.. == Andrew Quentson
  4773. fark me, I though it stood for "Answer ... Question"
  4774.  
  4775. jp [2:28 PM]
  4776. Racist ... I'm a black knight lol
  4777.  
  4778. macsga [2:28 PM]
  4779. @alp ma man where have you been all this time
  4780.  
  4781. csw [2:28 PM]
  4782. And now A...Q... wants answers about a site run in 2008 from a VPN line to a Malaysian system owned and operated bu the same people who run Vistomail.
  4783.  
  4784. travin [2:28 PM]
  4785. Call him Aquent
  4786.  
  4787. andrewquentson [2:28 PM]
  4788. THE ANSWER IS KNOWN
  4789.  
  4790. beautybubble [2:28 PM]
  4791. Well, let's deal with it now.
  4792.  
  4793. mrhodl [2:28 PM]
  4794. lol
  4795.  
  4796. andrewquentson [2:28 PM]
  4797. satoshi would defo know it
  4798.  
  4799. [2:28]
  4800. adam back knows it
  4801.  
  4802. tomothy
  4803. [2:29 PM]
  4804. Don't answer! Lol!
  4805.  
  4806. andrewquentson [2:29 PM]
  4807. its not even fully private
  4808.  
  4809. fatman3001 [2:29 PM]
  4810. _csw [8:21 PM]
  4811. SegWit adds incentives for off chain systems at the expense of the main system.,_
  4812.  
  4813. This one has been bugging me. I've tried to prod core guys about whether they've looked at the consequences of this and thus far I haven't gotten a good reply. I understand they can code and all, but incentive structures need to be researched by people with an insight into systems and economics. The closest I got to an answer was : "Yes, the incentive structure will change."
  4814.  
  4815. Other than that I'm sure Segwit is a marble of engineering.
  4816.  
  4817. andrewquentson [2:29 PM]
  4818. its public
  4819.  
  4820. klee [2:29 PM]
  4821. let us all post random shit, it will be more readable
  4822.  
  4823. mrhodl [2:29 PM]
  4824. This is what you're going with Craig?
  4825.  
  4826. macsga [2:29 PM]
  4827. Adam Back is SN
  4828.  
  4829. [2:29]
  4830. invite him here
  4831.  
  4832. beautybubble [2:29 PM]
  4833. You can use search in SLACK and just see one poster.
  4834.  
  4835. andy [2:29 PM]
  4836. AQ he's not seeking to prove he's SN. How many times does that need stated to you?
  4837.  
  4838. andrewquentson [2:29 PM]
  4839. course he seeking to prove he satoshi
  4840.  
  4841. [2:29]
  4842. he felew gavin there
  4843.  
  4844. [2:29]
  4845. gave him some...
  4846.  
  4847. csw [2:29 PM]
  4848. Fatman3001
  4849.  
  4850. tomothy
  4851. [2:29 PM]
  4852. No, read the sarte article
  4853.  
  4854. andrewquentson [2:29 PM]
  4855. and now...
  4856.  
  4857. macsga [2:29 PM]
  4858. @andrewquentson because your word counts ?
  4859.  
  4860. tomothy
  4861. [2:29 PM]
  4862. Read his prior responses
  4863.  
  4864. csw [2:30 PM]
  4865. The incentives move from mining to "softer" options allowing for easier chages
  4866.  
  4867. andrewquentson [2:30 PM]
  4868. anyway @agreenberg just thought to let you know, tred as you please
  4869.  
  4870. cryptonaut [2:30 PM]
  4871. @andrewquentson if it's publicly known then how would him repeating it prove anything?
  4872.  
  4873. [2:30]
  4874. seems silly
  4875.  
  4876. cobra-bitcoin [2:30 PM]
  4877. Is this actually Craig lmao?
  4878.  
  4879. andrewquentson [2:30 PM]
  4880. because he cant
  4881.  
  4882. macsga [2:30 PM]
  4883. no, it's not! It's what @andrewquentson wants
  4884.  
  4885. csw [2:30 PM]
  4886. As the answer is not the public one.
  4887.  
  4888. andrewquentson [2:30 PM]
  4889. I mean he has had hours of googling opportunity
  4890.  
  4891. [2:30]
  4892. and still cant......
  4893.  
  4894. jp [2:30 PM]
  4895. Yea. Adam back is SN. Craig is con man. Leave him alone
  4896.  
  4897. andrewquentson [2:30 PM]
  4898. if he could he would have jumped
  4899.  
  4900. csw [2:30 PM]
  4901. Segwit also makes the introduction of protocol change far easier than it should be. This is not simple a slippery slope argument, it means that developers and others who are not invested in the system (and I mean economically invested) can make changes that impact the wider system.
  4902.  
  4903. andrewquentson [2:30 PM]
  4904. like he did saying gewrn's blog is wrong
  4905.  
  4906. csw [2:31 PM]
  4907. Moving TxID = H(Tx, Sig) into TxID = H(Tx) plus Sig makes block validation less likely and extends verification
  4908.  
  4909. andrewquentson [2:31 PM]
  4910. the blog does not even mention it!
  4911.  
  4912. [2:31]
  4913. it says how wei came to satoshis attention
  4914.  
  4915. [2:31]
  4916. but not how adam back.............
  4917.  
  4918. [2:31]
  4919. tsssssssssssssss
  4920.  
  4921. [2:31]
  4922. FAIL
  4923.  
  4924. iang [2:31 PM]
  4925. yeah I get it. It’s a worry - the Bitcoin governance layer isn’t really set up. But what would I know.
  4926.  
  4927. csw [2:31 PM]
  4928. LOL A...Q...
  4929.  
  4930. tomothy
  4931. [2:31 PM]
  4932. Oh, thoughts on parallel validation?
  4933.  
  4934. andrewquentson [2:31 PM]
  4935. its not a laughing matter sir
  4936.  
  4937. [2:31]
  4938. its a very serious matter
  4939.  
  4940. tomothy
  4941. [2:32 PM]
  4942. No. No it isn't
  4943.  
  4944. travin [2:32 PM]
  4945. No, Aquent, can't be serious.
  4946.  
  4947. macsga [2:32 PM]
  4948. @andrewquentson WTaF? stop it man
  4949.  
  4950. andrewquentson [2:32 PM]
  4951. it so is he fucking ruined Gavin and the big blocker movement in 2016
  4952.  
  4953. csw [2:32 PM]
  4954. The code notes (at least in the early days it did) the need to change the threading and have parallelism...
  4955.  
  4956. andrewquentson [2:32 PM]
  4957. with his stunt
  4958.  
  4959. andy [2:32 PM]
  4960. Just say you're not Satoshi so they can stop blowing that trumpet.
  4961.  
  4962. klee [2:32 PM]
  4963. andrew has some anal itching it seems
  4964.  
  4965. tomothy
  4966. [2:32 PM]
  4967. Sounds like you feel hurt?
  4968.  
  4969. [2:33]
  4970. Betrayed?
  4971.  
  4972. jp [2:33 PM]
  4973. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  4974.  
  4975. prometheus [2:33 PM]
  4976. fascinating to hear that the BTC model follows an epidemic model, like a "virus". I love how much of BTC mimics biology. I definitely noticed the fractal patterns in the BTC price. :slightly_smiling_face:
  4977.  
  4978. macsga [2:33 PM]
  4979. Ch00 Ch00
  4980.  
  4981. mrhodl [2:33 PM]
  4982. If he's not claiming to be satoshi why do we care about anything he says?
  4983.  
  4984. jp [2:33 PM]
  4985. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  4986.  
  4987. [2:33]
  4988. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  4989.  
  4990. macsga [2:33 PM]
  4991. Who are you again? :stuck_out_tongue:
  4992. prometheus
  4993. fascinating to hear that the BTC model follows an epidemic model, like a "virus". I love how much of BTC mimics biology. I definitely noticed the fractal patterns in the BTC price. :slightly_smiling_face:
  4994. Posted in #generalToday at 2:33 PM
  4995. 3 replies Last reply today at 2:37 PM View thread
  4996.  
  4997. jp [2:33 PM]
  4998. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  4999.  
  5000. [2:33]
  5001. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5002.  
  5003. cryptonaut [2:33 PM]
  5004. lol the craig thing last year was just a footnote in the block size debate, I seriously doubt it changed anything besides entrenching beliefs.
  5005.  
  5006. jp [2:33 PM]
  5007. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5008.  
  5009. [2:34]
  5010. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5011.  
  5012. mrhodl [2:34 PM]
  5013. If he's not claiming to be satoshi why do we care about anything he says?
  5014.  
  5015. cobra-bitcoin [2:34 PM]
  5016. Satoshi is here guys, have some respect lol
  5017.  
  5018.  
  5019. cryptonaut [2:34 PM]
  5020. @mrhodl ask yourself that
  5021.  
  5022. awemany [2:34 PM]
  5023. csw: "The code notes (at least in the early days it did) the need to change the threading and have parallelism..." <- for further understanding, can you point out, where?
  5024.  
  5025. jp [2:34 PM]
  5026. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5027.  
  5028. Pinned by jp
  5029. Today at 2:36 PM Pinned by jp
  5030. csw [2:34 PM]
  5031. Oh, Adam wrote hashcash and it is not used in Bitcoin. Sorry to say that and burst your bubble.
  5032.  
  5033.  
  5034. tomothy
  5035. [2:34 PM]
  5036. LOLLLLL
  5037.  
  5038. jp [2:34 PM]
  5039. Die shitcoin die
  5040.  
  5041. macsga [2:34 PM]
  5042. DIEh
  5043.  
  5044. jp [2:35 PM]
  5045. Vinaayyahhha leecuminggg 800 corn
  5046.  
  5047. macsga [2:35 PM]
  5048. where's Vinny
  5049.  
  5050. andrewquentson [2:35 PM]
  5051. what bubble
  5052.  
  5053. klee [2:35 PM]
  5054. I am here
  5055.  
  5056. alp
  5057. [2:35 PM]
  5058. but bitcoin is hashcash with inflation control
  5059.  
  5060. [2:35]
  5061. he was cited by satoshi
  5062.  
  5063. macsga [2:35 PM]
  5064. but but NewLambChop
  5065.  
  5066. jp [2:35 PM]
  5067. I want 800. Where is kleecummingvinanrry?
  5068.  
  5069. klee [2:35 PM]
  5070. shroomskit
  5071.  
  5072. megalodon
  5073. [2:35 PM]
  5074. Vinny promised 850 and traded alts while I waited in fiat for his prediction to come true
  5075. 1 reply Today at 2:37 PM View thread
  5076.  
  5077. csw [2:35 PM]
  5078. Cited. Adam was mentioned as Adam pointed out who to contact Wei
  5079.  
  5080.  
  5081. jp [2:35 PM]
  5082. Lambo choo choo
  5083.  
  5084. macsga [2:35 PM]
  5085. hahahaha
  5086.  
  5087. andrewquentson [2:36 PM]
  5088. yes csw that's what gwern's blog says
  5089.  
  5090. jp [2:36 PM]
  5091. Short btc now 1600, close at 800. 100x. 20000% profit guysss
  5092.  
  5093. andrewquentson [2:36 PM]
  5094. but how did nakamoto get to contact adam back?
  5095.  
  5096. csw [2:36 PM]
  5097. You do understand that a reference is not a pointer to stat that one is an authority?
  5098.  
  5099.  
  5100. klee [2:36 PM]
  5101. STOP IT!
  5102. I WANNA SHORT LTC
  5103.  
  5104. [2:36]
  5105. thx
  5106.  
  5107. andrewquentson [2:36 PM]
  5108. should I tell him guys?
  5109.  
  5110. [2:36]
  5111. I'm just worried he'll use it next time
  5112.  
  5113. csw [2:37 PM]
  5114. LOL
  5115.  
  5116. andrewquentson [2:37 PM]
  5117. ITS NOT FUNNY
  5118.  
  5119. megalodon
  5120. [2:37 PM]
  5121. we're all dying to know...
  5122.  
  5123. andy [2:37 PM]
  5124. LOL
  5125.  
  5126. jp [2:37 PM]
  5127. R3kt
  5128.  
  5129. megalodon
  5130. [2:37 PM]
  5131. :face_with_rolling_eyes:
  5132.  
  5133. andrewquentson [2:37 PM]
  5134. I mean it might be funny for us, others
  5135.  
  5136. tomothy
  5137. [2:37 PM]
  5138. LMFAO@
  5139.  
  5140. checksum0 [2:37 PM]
  5141. IT IS FUNNY AS HELL
  5142.  
  5143. andrewquentson [2:37 PM]
  5144. but
  5145.  
  5146. jp [2:37 PM]
  5147. Short btc now and close at 400.
  5148.  
  5149. [2:37]
  5150. Triple vinanny
  5151.  
  5152. tomothy
  5153. [2:37 PM]
  5154. LOLLLLL
  5155.  
  5156. andrewquentson [2:37 PM]
  5157. ITS NOT FUNNY
  5158.  
  5159. andy [2:37 PM]
  5160. HAHA
  5161.  
  5162. checksum0 [2:37 PM]
  5163. IT IS
  5164.  
  5165. jp [2:37 PM]
  5166. 100x guys
  5167.  
  5168. [2:37]
  5169. Or 500x Yolo
  5170.  
  5171. csw [2:37 PM]
  5172. NO A...Q.. you are in fact a little funny.
  5173.  
  5174. tomothy
  5175. [2:37 PM]
  5176. Please, say it a few more times
  5177.  
  5178. macsga [2:37 PM]
  5179. SHOTR TEH COIZN
  5180.  
  5181. csw [2:38 PM]
  5182. I have not engaged in this before, and I see why so little work is done. (edited)
  5183.  
  5184. klee [2:38 PM]
  5185. SHOTR ALL THE COINZ
  5186.  
  5187. iang [2:38 PM]
  5188. I think it’s a little sad… seeing so much opportunity go to such a waste.
  5189.  
  5190.  
  5191. andrewquentson [2:38 PM]
  5192. really
  5193.  
  5194. mrhodl [2:38 PM]
  5195. Wait, who here believes CSW is Satoshi, raise your :raised_hands:
  5196.  
  5197. 2 replies Last reply today at 2:39 PM View thread
  5198.  
  5199. jp [2:38 PM]
  5200. SHOTR Satoshi loll at csw price, close at Adam back profit
  5201.  
  5202. klee [2:38 PM]
  5203. me
  5204.  
  5205. macsga [2:38 PM]
  5206. :raised_hands:
  5207.  
  5208. megalodon
  5209. [2:38 PM]
  5210. :raised_hand:
  5211.  
  5212. iang [2:38 PM]
  5213. What is belief?
  5214.  
  5215. cypherblock [2:38 PM]
  5216. @andrewquentson doesn’t scronty claim to have brought hashcash into the equation so to speak
  5217.  
  5218. csw [2:38 PM]
  5219. Please don't
  5220.  
  5221. tomothy
  5222. [2:39 PM]
  5223. Part of a team of four, yes.
  5224.  
  5225. nitram [2:39 PM]
  5226. joined #general
  5227.  
  5228. jp [2:39 PM]
  5229. Die shitcoin die
  5230.  
  5231. andrewquentson [2:39 PM]
  5232. don't matter @cypherblock
  5233.  
  5234. klee [2:39 PM]
  5235. Make a future contract at BMEX: Is CSW Satoshi?
  5236.  
  5237. pesa [2:39 PM]
  5238. :raised_hands:
  5239.  
  5240.  
  5241. andrewquentson [2:39 PM]
  5242. this guy was given a social test
  5243.  
  5244. macsga [2:39 PM]
  5245. 1700 in finex
  5246.  
  5247. csw [2:39 PM]
  5248. No, scronty and I did not work together.
  5249.  
  5250. andrewquentson [2:39 PM]
  5251. from public knowledge
  5252.  
  5253. [2:39]
  5254. its an F
  5255.  
  5256. tomothy
  5257. [2:39 PM]
  5258. Totally an f
  5259.  
  5260. jp [2:39 PM]
  5261. Tomorrow: hashcash ICO raise 30M USD issued token on ethtard
  5262.  
  5263. fatman3001 [2:39 PM]
  5264. @csw ok, so the integrity of the network is attacked both by steering incentives off course and by softening the ultimate safeguards of the network. I thought this was accounted for somehow. Ugh...
  5265.  
  5266. andrewquentson [2:39 PM]
  5267. the answer doesnt have anything else but x
  5268.  
  5269. mrhodl [2:39 PM]
  5270. :joy::joy:
  5271.  
  5272. klee [2:40 PM]
  5273. POLO REKT
  5274.  
  5275. andrewquentson [2:40 PM]
  5276. I mean I can reveal it but I think he'd prob just use it next time
  5277.  
  5278. klee [2:40 PM]
  5279. IT IS HAPPENING
  5280.  
  5281. macsga [2:40 PM]
  5282. invite Scronty here
  5283.  
  5284. tomothy
  5285. [2:40 PM]
  5286. Fatman, it is, that's why it wasn't adopted
  5287.  
  5288. snoop [2:40 PM]
  5289. "STOP LAUGHING AT ME!!!!" - AQ
  5290.  
  5291. macsga [2:40 PM]
  5292. I like his l33t haxx0r site
  5293.  
  5294. [2:40]
  5295. AQ is Scronty?
  5296.  
  5297. [2:40]
  5298. :smile:
  5299.  
  5300. csw [2:40 PM]
  5301. Fatman3001, the weight is set centrally in effect, this removal of market based controls means that a central authority gets to control the payments.
  5302.  
  5303.  
  5304. cryptonaut [2:40 PM]
  5305. @andrewquentson just spit it out already
  5306.  
  5307. andrewquentson [2:40 PM]
  5308. it takes balls tho csw
  5309.  
  5310. [2:40]
  5311. big ones
  5312.  
  5313. [2:41]
  5314. to come in here, with your background
  5315.  
  5316. csw [2:41 PM]
  5317. If you think this through, and note that payment is attributed by a central body, can I ask you to follow the money?
  5318.  
  5319.  
  5320. andrewquentson [2:41 PM]
  5321. and claim you are satoshi nakamoto
  5322.  
  5323.  
  5324. jp [2:41 PM]
  5325. Kleecumming vinaaaayyy longcorn at 850
  5326.  
  5327. cobra-bitcoin [2:41 PM]
  5328. No doubt he has balls that's for sure
  5329.  
  5330. andrewquentson [2:41 PM]
  5331. how did you decide to do just that?
  5332.  
  5333. csw [2:41 PM]
  5334. And what background is that A...Q..
  5335.  
  5336. beautybubble [2:41 PM]
  5337. Well I am ready to read any collaterals on the project. If you wanted to post them @csw - Thank you.
  5338.  
  5339. mrhodl [2:41 PM]
  5340. Easy to have balls when you have the State backing you up
  5341.  
  5342. andrewquentson [2:41 PM]
  5343. well
  5344.  
  5345. nitram [2:41 PM]
  5346. let's solve this once and for all...
  5347.  
  5348. jp [2:41 PM]
  5349. @cobra-bitcoin which alts to buy tmrw?
  5350.  
  5351. andrewquentson [2:41 PM]
  5352. there is no evidence of a supercomputer
  5353.  
  5354.  
  5355. klee [2:41 PM]
  5356. @beautybubble your twitter id?
  5357.  
  5358. cobra-bitcoin [2:41 PM]
  5359. Satoshi is it OK if the white paper gets updated?
  5360.  
  5361.  
  5362. andrewquentson [2:41 PM]
  5363. the ATA sort of wants to talk to you
  5364.  
  5365. beautybubble [2:41 PM]
  5366. Same as this handle.
  5367.  
  5368. awemany [2:41 PM]
  5369. lol
  5370.  
  5371. andrewquentson [2:42 PM]
  5372. you mispell in public forums
  5373.  
  5374.  
  5375. csw [2:42 PM]
  5376. White papers are not updated.
  5377.  
  5378.  
  5379. nitram [2:42 PM]
  5380. @csw do you like rick and morty? that will reveal your true character
  5381.  
  5382. andrewquentson [2:42 PM]
  5383. you have a linked in that lists many degrees which dont exist
  5384.  
  5385. beautybubble [2:42 PM]
  5386. https://twitter.com/BeautyBubble
  5387. twitter.com
  5388. Just Find Me...Okay (@BeautyBubble) | Twitter
  5389. The latest Tweets from Just Find Me...Okay (@BeautyBubble). Donations | Tips | Thank Me w. BTC 1N4XyVTpR84neGC9RmQzjz1fn3mmZSwYcZ. Private
  5390.  
  5391.  
  5392. csw [2:42 PM]
  5393. Not in the form it is.
  5394.  
  5395. mrhodl [2:42 PM]
  5396. @cobra-bitcoin Yes, it's def time.
  5397.  
  5398. andrewquentson [2:42 PM]
  5399. you dont know how you became aware of Adam back
  5400.  
  5401. mrhodl [2:42 PM]
  5402. What are you waiting for
  5403.  
  5404. andrewquentson [2:42 PM]
  5405. you gave us all a fake signature
  5406.  
  5407. beautybubble [2:42 PM]
  5408. Okay.
  5409.  
  5410. jp [2:42 PM]
  5411. Corn at 850
  5412.  
  5413. andrewquentson [2:42 PM]
  5414. and dunno
  5415.  
  5416. cobra-bitcoin [2:43 PM]
  5417. But it's your paper, it's OK with you if the incorrect stuff gets changed?
  5418.  
  5419. iang [2:43 PM]
  5420. I don’t think of it is a whitepaper, it’s a paper to me.
  5421.  
  5422. beautybubble [2:43 PM]
  5423. FYI. Twitter always includes your latest pinned tweet to your handle URL.
  5424.  
  5425. [2:43]
  5426. No solicitation meant whatsoever in me posting my handle.
  5427.  
  5428. klee [2:43 PM]
  5429. blackpaper
  5430.  
  5431. csw [2:43 PM]
  5432. I asked you to read a letter from Satre. I see that was more than one could expect
  5433.  
  5434. klee [2:43 PM]
  5435. black pepper
  5436.  
  5437. [2:43]
  5438. PEPPER YOUR ANGUS
  5439.  
  5440. jp [2:43 PM]
  5441. Short the fuck out of polo lolll
  5442.  
  5443. [2:43]
  5444. 1702
  5445.  
  5446. tomothy
  5447. [2:43 PM]
  5448. Aquent see the documents Vlad posted the other day
  5449.  
  5450. iang [2:44 PM]
  5451. see - I told you you needed 2 phones
  5452.  
  5453.  
  5454. csw [2:44 PM]
  5455. And what incorrect stuff?
  5456.  
  5457. cypherblock [2:44 PM]
  5458. @csw I remember you talking a while back about releasing some write up on bitcoin simulations you were running. Did you ever do that?
  5459.  
  5460. klee [2:44 PM]
  5461. signal to noise ratio = ???
  5462.  
  5463. csw [2:45 PM]
  5464. CobraBTC... What is incorrect in the paper?
  5465.  
  5466. jp [2:45 PM]
  5467. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5468.  
  5469.  
  5470. csw [2:45 PM]
  5471. Cypher Block
  5472.  
  5473. cobra-bitcoin [2:45 PM]
  5474. Confirmed definitely not Satoshi, Satoshi never called me "CobraBTC", ew
  5475.  
  5476. csw [2:45 PM]
  5477. These were delayed. Moving to the UK and children...
  5478.  
  5479. [2:45]
  5480. LOL
  5481.  
  5482. jp [2:45 PM]
  5483. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5484.  
  5485. macsga [2:46 PM]
  5486. this troll house is worse than @klee 's
  5487.  
  5488. jp [2:46 PM]
  5489. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5490.  
  5491. tomothy
  5492. [2:46 PM]
  5493. Cypherblock can you link text?
  5494.  
  5495. jp [2:46 PM]
  5496. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5497.  
  5498. fatman3001 [2:46 PM]
  5499. @csw @andrewquentson one day we can arrange to have Craig on an episode of "Who do you think you are?" and all this can be settled.
  5500.  
  5501. klee [2:46 PM]
  5502. ltc on gox
  5503.  
  5504. awemany [2:46 PM]
  5505. jp, what's the reason to spam this?
  5506.  
  5507. cypherblock [2:46 PM]
  5508. no, just remember.
  5509.  
  5510. iang [2:46 PM]
  5511. @newliberty can you kick @jp’s phone, it’s broken
  5512.  
  5513. macsga [2:46 PM]
  5514. @tomothy what is text
  5515.  
  5516. jp [2:46 PM]
  5517. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5518.  
  5519. alp
  5520. [2:46 PM]
  5521. lol
  5522.  
  5523. [2:46]
  5524. Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
  5525.  
  5526. tomothy
  5527. [2:46 PM]
  5528. Whatever he's asked csw and csw has responded to, answer but no ?
  5529.  
  5530. awemany [2:46 PM]
  5531. @bitsko , please kck jp, there seems to be a problem indeed
  5532.  
  5533. mrhodl [2:47 PM]
  5534. Wait, @csw you have spoken to @cobra-bitcoin , right?
  5535.  
  5536. alp
  5537. [2:47 PM]
  5538. you cant kick from the main channel
  5539.  
  5540. macsga [2:47 PM]
  5541. :boot:
  5542.  
  5543. tomothy
  5544. [2:47 PM]
  5545. Anti kick slack. Accept the suffering. Like finding Nirvana.
  5546.  
  5547. jp [2:47 PM]
  5548. Lol. Match troll level
  5549.  
  5550. csw [2:47 PM]
  5551. No, I am not confirming certain things. Not in any public manner.
  5552.  
  5553. [2:47]
  5554. :slightly_smiling_face:
  5555.  
  5556. klee [2:47 PM]
  5557. :awesome:
  5558.  
  5559. freetrader [2:47 PM]
  5560. https://bitco.in/forum/threads/general-bitcoin-slack-unaffiliated-unmoderated.2073/
  5561. says "unmoderated" right there, bitsko just staying true to his word (edited)
  5562.  
  5563. bitsko [2:47 PM]
  5564. Im not kicking anyone guys. I dislike it philosophically. This is we we cant have nice things like scaling.
  5565.  
  5566.  
  5567. awemany [2:48 PM]
  5568. i was assuming this was a client malfunction
  5569.  
  5570. alp
  5571. [2:48 PM]
  5572. will you kick me ifi post horse pr0n?
  5573.  
  5574. xhiggy [2:48 PM]
  5575. Yes
  5576.  
  5577. beautybubble [2:48 PM]
  5578. And un-moderated conversational social network is the ideal!
  5579.  
  5580. tomothy
  5581. [2:48 PM]
  5582. Oh. Um.
  5583.  
  5584. xhiggy [2:48 PM]
  5585. I mean, please do
  5586.  
  5587. jp [2:48 PM]
  5588. Now I like you alp
  5589.  
  5590. mrhodl [2:48 PM]
  5591. @csw You're not confirming that you've spoken to @cobra-bitcoin in the past?
  5592.  
  5593. bitsko [2:48 PM]
  5594. You make me sad alp
  5595.  
  5596. tomothy
  5597. [2:48 PM]
  5598. Lol
  5599.  
  5600. luke-jr [2:48 PM]
  5601. @mrhodl that could be falsified, so ofc he won't
  5602.  
  5603. beautybubble [2:48 PM]
  5604. Thank you @bitsko for doing your best to keep it that way.
  5605.  
  5606. mrhodl [2:48 PM]
  5607. @csw You're digging yourself a hole here.
  5608.  
  5609. luke-jr [2:49 PM]
  5610. @mrhodl he's already buried
  5611.  
  5612. mrhodl [2:49 PM]
  5613. We have multiple people in this channel that spoken to Satoshi. You can put all of this to rest right now @csw (edited)
  5614.  
  5615. macsga [2:49 PM]
  5616. @luke-jr fork this mofo
  5617.  
  5618. ajd [2:49 PM]
  5619. Happy belated parity day luke-jr
  5620.  
  5621. macsga [2:49 PM]
  5622. die shitcoin - we all jump into SEXWITH
  5623.  
  5624. cypherblock [2:49 PM]
  5625. @mrhodl except he doesn’t want to prove he is satoshi
  5626.  
  5627. [2:49]
  5628. or he can’t
  5629.  
  5630. klee [2:49 PM]
  5631. @luke-jr how is segwit going? hahahhahaha
  5632.  
  5633.  
  5634. cypherblock [2:50 PM]
  5635. but we cant tell difference
  5636.  
  5637. cobra-bitcoin [2:50 PM]
  5638. Let's just ignore Craig, he's not interesting anymore :disappointed:
  5639.  
  5640. mrhodl [2:50 PM]
  5641. Yeah
  5642.  
  5643. klee [2:50 PM]
  5644. @luke-jr no worries bro, you can still r&d in LTShit!!!
  5645.  
  5646. macsga [2:50 PM]
  5647. KLEE IS HERE
  5648.  
  5649. ajd [2:50 PM]
  5650. Why does it matter if he's Satoshi?
  5651.  
  5652. tomothy
  5653. [2:50 PM]
  5654. That's silly. If sn was part of a team of 4 doesn't matter
  5655.  
  5656. luke-jr [2:50 PM]
  5657. @mrhodl already, nobody with a clue takes @csw seriously; his best hope of getting involved is to pretend the whole pretend-Satoshi thing never happened and start contributing for real
  5658.  
  5659.  
  5660. checksum0 [2:50 PM]
  5661. So I guess you can leave then if you don't find the reason you are here interesting anymore...
  5662.  
  5663. macsga [2:50 PM]
  5664. I'm Satoshi bitches deal with it
  5665.  
  5666. [2:50]
  5667. let me forkr it
  5668.  
  5669. cypherblock [2:50 PM]
  5670. well you guys came here to see csw. why come here just to pester him. See what he has to say. it either makes sense or does not.
  5671.  
  5672. cobra-bitcoin [2:51 PM]
  5673. Didn't come here for Craig, wanted to see how active it was in here in general
  5674.  
  5675. csw [2:51 PM]
  5676. Well, I will leave you all. Have fun - I am off to have a t-bone :slightly_smiling_face:
  5677.  
  5678.  
  5679. luke-jr [2:51 PM]
  5680. @cypherblock I came here cuz I was invited.
  5681.  
  5682. mrhodl [2:51 PM]
  5683. HAhahahahahahahahahahahha
  5684.  
  5685. tomothy
  5686. [2:51 PM]
  5687. Do you know of any patents that cover segwit? Can you discuss?
  5688.  
  5689. fatman3001 [2:51 PM]
  5690. bye csw
  5691.  
  5692. jp [2:51 PM]
  5693. Muahahha. Super rare bloody t bone
  5694.  
  5695. tomothy
  5696. [2:51 PM]
  5697. Enjoy lunch!
  5698.  
  5699. cypherblock [2:51 PM]
  5700. @cobra-bitcoin @luke-jr your lucky day then :slightly_smiling_face:
  5701.  
  5702. cobra-bitcoin [2:51 PM]
  5703. Bye Craig
  5704.  
  5705. macsga [2:51 PM]
  5706. there he left us all alone with @luke-jr
  5707.  
  5708. luke-jr [2:51 PM]
  5709. @cobra-bitcoin what criteria do you want to see before UASF is allowed on bitcoin.org ?
  5710.  
  5711. megalodon
  5712. [2:51 PM]
  5713. toodles
  5714.  
  5715. beautybubble [2:51 PM]
  5716. Thank you for time and honesty.
  5717.  
  5718. klee [2:51 PM]
  5719. rip the t-bone
  5720.  
  5721. cobra-bitcoin [2:52 PM]
  5722. UASF will never be allowed on bitcoin.org, bitcoin.org is for bitcoin, not altcoins
  5723.  
  5724.  
  5725. macsga [2:52 PM]
  5726. and WHERE'S VINNY?
  5727.  
  5728. [2:52]
  5729. did he buy teh dip?
  5730.  
  5731. klee [2:52 PM]
  5732. buying shitcoins
  5733.  
  5734. luke-jr [2:52 PM]
  5735. guess I should be asking that on the uasf channel
  5736.  
  5737. mrhodl [2:52 PM]
  5738. Cobra...not *yet* :wink:
  5739.  
  5740. jp [2:52 PM]
  5741. He is sending more coins to his underwater position
  5742.  
  5743. luke-jr [2:52 PM]
  5744. @cobra-bitcoin bitcoin.org is anti-softfork now?
  5745.  
  5746. freetrader [2:52 PM]
  5747. Where can i buy BTU-AsF
  5748.  
  5749. megalodon
  5750. [2:52 PM]
  5751. so can we all agree that segwit diehards can focus on LTShit and leave bitcoin to the big boys? :sunglasses:
  5752.  
  5753. klee [2:52 PM]
  5754. AMEN
  5755.  
  5756. macsga [2:53 PM]
  5757. yeah
  5758.  
  5759. luke-jr [2:53 PM]
  5760. @megalodon I'd sooner make a new altcoin
  5761.  
  5762. macsga [2:53 PM]
  5763. LTC IZ DA FUTURZ
  5764.  
  5765. beautybubble [2:53 PM]
  5766. I will be on the #random channel.
  5767.  
  5768. megalodon
  5769. [2:53 PM]
  5770. oh you mean UASF ?
  5771.  
  5772. mrhodl [2:53 PM]
  5773. @luke-jr @cobra-bitcoin Not here.
  5774.  
  5775. cobra-bitcoin [2:53 PM]
  5776. @luke-jr bitcoin.org is against hostile takeover of the network unless it has overwhelmbing consensus
  5777.  
  5778. klee [2:53 PM]
  5779. LTC-jr?
  5780.  
  5781.  
  5782. jp [2:53 PM]
  5783. Corn just crash to 400 and quickly crashing more.
  5784.  
  5785. megalodon
  5786. [2:53 PM]
  5787. because tahts what that would be, an alt coin
  5788.  
  5789. macsga [2:54 PM]
  5790. DIE SHITCOIN
  5791.  
  5792. [2:54]
  5793. buy all alts dips boys
  5794.  
  5795. luke-jr [2:54 PM]
  5796. @cobra-bitcoin so the question is, what criteria do you use to determine overwhelming consensus?
  5797.  
  5798. macsga [2:54 PM]
  5799. sorry, wrong window, I thought I was typing that in FONTASS slack
  5800.  
  5801. cobra-bitcoin [2:55 PM]
  5802. @luke-jr All the stakeholders agree, so almost all the miners, users, developers, overall economy, etc
  5803.  
  5804. jp [2:55 PM]
  5805. You have been fontasssed
  5806.  
  5807. klee [2:55 PM]
  5808. Vinnied
  5809.  
  5810. luke-jr [2:55 PM]
  5811. @cobra-bitcoin and segwit doesn't have that?
  5812.  
  5813.  
  5814. jp [2:55 PM]
  5815. Yayayyayanayyvinnay
  5816.  
  5817. bitsko [2:55 PM]
  5818. Now i worry we will run out of free 10000 before i get home lol thanks trolls
  5819.  
  5820. andy [2:55 PM]
  5821. This is the weirdest day ever.
  5822.  
  5823.  
  5824. checksum0 [2:56 PM]
  5825. I guess this slack became bitcoin.org slack using the free 10000
  5826.  
  5827. cobra-bitcoin [2:56 PM]
  5828. @luke-jr Nope, a lot of miners are against segwit, and lots of users too unless it comes with a block size increase, so it should never be pushed through as a UASF
  5829.  
  5830.  
  5831. macsga [2:56 PM]
  5832. @bitsko we know this, managed to troll everyone in klee's slack within 2days
  5833.  
  5834. luke-jr [2:56 PM]
  5835. @cobra-bitcoin it does come with a block size increase..
  5836.  
  5837. wings [2:57 PM]
  5838. @klee how is XOF doing ? :stuck_out_tongue:
  5839.  
  5840.  
  5841. cypherblock [2:57 PM]
  5842. @cobra-bitcoin “all the stakeholders” all is a pretty strong criteria.
  5843.  
  5844. luke-jr [2:57 PM]
  5845. @cobra-bitcoin there's only like 2 miners opposed, and pretty few users
  5846.  
  5847. fatman3001 [2:57 PM]
  5848. @andy _"This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call the Twilight Zone."_
  5849.  
  5850. mrhodl [2:57 PM]
  5851. Miners? Here i thought it was just asic manufacturer.
  5852.  
  5853. cobra-bitcoin [2:57 PM]
  5854. @luke-jr People don't feel that it does enough
  5855.  
  5856. megalodon
  5857. [2:57 PM]
  5858. ay fatman come back to klee's slack :stuck_out_tongue:
  5859.  
  5860. new messages
  5861. macsga [2:57 PM]
  5862. yeah we missed you black cat
  5863.  
  5864. luke-jr [2:57 PM]
  5865. @cobra-bitcoin I don't get that impression at all. Everyone seems to want it except trolls.
  5866.  
  5867.  
  5868. fatman3001 [2:57 PM]
  5869. @megalodon I never left
  5870.  
  5871. mrhodl [2:57 PM]
  5872. What does "feelings" have anything to do with it?
  5873.  
  5874. macsga [2:58 PM]
  5875. we have none to troll and we troll each other
  5876.  
  5877. mrhodl [2:58 PM]
  5878. It's either a blocksize increase or it's not.
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