Dunk Dinkle X.49 --- Mainly, we don't control the market in P-Z. We don't have the ISK to buy the KS + other structures.

Avend Avalhar X:58 --- There was a previous discussion where test was going to provide 1- 2 KS to us to help us get started. Did something change? We can not afford to buy it all and we can not afford to lose our primary income for the alliance

Shattered Armer X:06 --- I'd rather get the ball rolling mid-week so people are prepared by Because once we kick things off, we're not going to have time to play 20 questions Perhaps I can do something Friday in EUTZ and sit around all night in comms to answer people's questions Sort of a live mil update But that's still cutting the timeline close. As far as cutting the cord goes, this is about as good as its going to get We're about 3 months too late to start seeding the idea slowly the way Test did

Algorthan Gaterau X:11 --- @shattered_armer yes.. we understand that..and I also would like to tell our membership something.. but we need to be smart about this all and realistic. @Avend I wad also curious about that.. so I messaged dran to ask him what the chances of us doing that are. Shattered all military plans for the q will fall flat on their face if we don't get a beach head set Up.

Avend Avalhar X:11 --- To be fair the idea was seeded

Shattered Armer X.11 --- And as it stands, we'll be working doubly hard on damage control once Catch actually does start eating shit

Algorthan Gaterau X:12 --- Unless we know what we are doing. The grumbling has already started

Shattered Armer X:12 --- No, most of our membership has no clue what test was talking about or telling their members Only the ones that actually pay attention

Algorthan Gaterau X:12 --- Huh? I have been getting messages all day about it Plus it was bring openly discussed in standing fleet lastnifht

Shattered Armer X:13 --- Yeah, from the annoucement that got leaked to reddit today

Algorthan Gaterau X:13 --- And then I jumped in and they started asking me when we are moving.

Shattered Armer X:13 --- I'm talking about the update they posted 3 months ago When they started mentally preparing their membership for the eventual move to Delve

Algorthan Gaterau X:13 --- Ah I see

Shattered Armer X.12 --- We havent done any prep of the sort. Aside from the military update which I'm going to publish later this week

Avend Avalhar X:13 --- A lot of our more senior members assumed a move to Q

Shattered Armer X.14 --- And its going to be a hard pill to swallow no matter what. So better to do it earlier and give our guys at least a couple of days to process things before the fireworks really start Senior members sure, but like I said, this is going to be a band aid that needs to be torn off the vast majority of our membership Especially the ones rooted so deeply in Catch

Algorthan Gaterau X:16 --- Lol na. Most of them are already under the assumption we are moving They have already pulled out of Impass And PDE is ready to go

Avend Avalhar X:17 --- With the p-Z structures... the case I would make to Dran et al is that we can not make a move and live in querious without our infrastructure and almost all of our isk is in catch infrastructure. We can not make redundancy infrastructure in querious and we can not lose our alliance income from a primary staging.

nOrman X:17 --- just pointing out, once again, that we have no money to 'get established'

nOrman X:17 --- its all going to SRP i mean, we're draining our coffers and another reminder that I'm not getting involved with new infrastructure in querious consider that my stepping out moment that I said would be happening after I was done with the cores. So we're going to need a replacement who can handle all the various holdings/posboys/srp stuff I'm doing i'll come along as a member, but I'm taking the opportunity to withdraw from a job I didn't sign up for, that I don't have time for anymore and that I'm increasingly avoiding logging in to deal with

Algorthan Gaterau X:25 --- Moon owners are starting to want to abandon ship and feel unsupported what are we allowed to tell them before Alliance Meeting

Shattered Armer X:36 --- This was where things were always going to get messy No point to be renting moons where they're not getting mined Why can't he sell them exactly? I thought Cinnabar was one of the better ores

Shattered Armer X:04 --- Siberian Squads is starting to pull the trigger on Querious How many Ihubs do we have ready to go @algorthan

Avend Avalhar X:41 --- I think he said 20. And yes there are taking ihubs right now in querious, Including the constellation we were planning to stage out of My guess this space is part of the deal with goons

Shattered Armer X:45 --- Well, there's more to it then that. But they're expecting to have weeks to run up ADMs We're going to be the pipe wrench. Russian mafia style Right in the knee caps (edited) Unrelated, can we start pulling down any unused medium Citadels? Those are probably the safer Also if we have any anchored faction forts, those need to come down as a priority With or without replacements at this stage

Algorthan Gaterau X:26 --- 15 in querious shattered

Algorthan Gaterau X.34 --- 20 TCU's I beleive

Algorthan Gaterau X:48 --- Incredible is cocked and ready to rock. -7- has their backs and I think BCrow has no choice but to go to querious

Dunk Dinkle  X:59 --- We don't control the P-Z market. We have no one to pull down structures. It's basically down to me fueling with occasion random help with nOrman stepping back.

Shattered Armer X:00 --- We will by Thursday

Dunk Dinkle X:00 --- Start dropping sov stuff now and we can run fleets to Q from either side. Get the blops folks to focus on Q. Don't make any announcements until we can do it live. Just start doing things. Call fleets as needed and take Dunk

Dinkle X:01 --- I can't wait to be out of this war and back to not dealing with so much diplo. Wait until Saturday until we say anything publically.

Shattered Armer X.02 --- No, we're announcing on Thursday

Dunk Dinkle X:02 --- Ideally we have a few wins under our belt.

Shattered Armer X:02 --- And we start killing Querious Ihubs on Friday

Dunk Dinkle X:02 --- Don't announce anything with a long text post.

Shattered Armer X:02 --- Move ops will commence Friday and into the weekend

Dunk Dinkle X:03 --- What are you talkign about? What move ops?

Shattered Armer X:03 --- Into Querious, our new deplyoment staging

Dunk Dinkle X:03 --- We have to be on the same page here.

Shattered Armer X:03 --- Did you read the mil update draft I posted?

Dunk Dinkle X:04 --- We have to manage how people are told things. I said we shoudl wait to say anything until we can have a live talk.

Algorthan Gaterau X:04 --- Dunk see message from rowa and nite. As much as I was tempted for the sake of consistency I decided to leave thst to you.

Shattered Armer X:04 --- And when will we do that? If we wait until this weekend we wont be able to do anything until next weekend. By then it will be another entire week lost

Dunk Dinkle X:05 --- Just start calling fleets? What are you intending to move?

Shattered Armer X:05 --- We step off this Friday with a full out assault on the P-Z constellation

Dunk Dinkle X:06 --- OK, we can do that. Just don't make a big announcement.

Shattered Armer X:06 --- Thursday Military Update New staging and doctrines announced. Friday, initial round of kill timers and friendly Ihub drops Orr

Dunk Dinkle X:07 --- That update is far more than a military update, it's the entire plan for the alliance.

Shattered Armer X:07 --- Move ops and ADM fleets into the weekend, and next week we start hitting their structures proper. Logistics is going to need to play catchup, we dont have any more time. We cant even wait another week. Or SBSQ will be cemented in what was supposed to be our home constellation

Dunk Dinkle X:08 --- Understood. Let me go eat lunch so I'm not hangry and get back with a plan.

Shattered Armer X:08 --- Wednesday night however We need to get the word out to our importers and builders With some degree of obscurity No specifics about where we'll be or what we'll need, but to free up their queue and be ready to start cranking out a lot of Catch/Impass staged doctrine ships somewhere that isn't Catch or Impass

Dunk Dinkle X:11 --- No one is going to move production quickly. Hauling is the only short term way.

Shattered Armer X:23 --- Production wont start for at least a week. Likely into next weekend once we've taken a second constellation or more, depending on how much resistance they put up

Algorthan Gaterau X:11 --- Mayem wants to put a Titan into build in PZMA on thrusday

Dunk Dinkle X:36 --- I'll do an impromptu alliance chat Wednesday morning (my time) for the AU & EU folks and follow up with the USTZ after work with another chat. I'll explain we have the opportunity to have more fun with people in Querious and that we are going to help with this part of the war. "kills to be had and ISK to be made". The modified spin is SibSquad giving us a new place to hunt. We are still at huge risk, especially with Goons quite unhappy with me personally, but there are no great choices at this point. I want to talk to stuffers about taking over the indy side, as I barely have time

Avend Avalhar X:02 --- Sounds like a plan. Sorry about the goons. They are desperately trying to get help since things are tipping even further into the panic realm for them. With stuffers it may take a good convincing things will be different and he can finally be able to implement some of his ideas. But having his attention to indy now would be good. We are about to see a big transition and people will need direction with indy.

nOrman X:47 --- i know catch/impass is irrelevent to our future now. But our ansiblex are getting blown up and we don't seem to care i don't care at this point but in case anyone wants to be able to move stuff out of impass/ catch, they might be interested in that

Professor Push X:58 --- Replied to a thread: just pointing out, once again, that we have n... I feel as though we are not heeding nOrman's word. This is concerning to me and even more concerning is how we keep pushing ahead. We are kinda fucking over our moon members and it's only gonna get worse if people can't get things out of Impass. Asset safety still costs isk and depending on how much is there - it can cost a LOT of isk for the line member.

nOrman X:00 --- we're way past heeding my words. Full speed ahead and I guess everything dies that's left behind vOv. I no longer care if folks heed my words, I'm working on evacing my stuff

Avend Avalhar X:10 --- I think there is a disconnect from your words and what can be done. We are alone to die in catch so we can accept that or do something about it

nOrman X.13 --- there's a disconnect now. there wasn't months ago when I said we shouldn't be going all in on querious/delve i'm not saying anything different i'm just giving up and moving out because clearly others have better ideas

Avend Avalhar X:19 --- If we didn't join test we would still be under attack and we would look like fair weather friends to our allies. Test dragged us into this war yes But all of the outcomes are the same except we are supporting our allies

Algorthan Gaterau X:20 --- This was coming from the day test announced their war.

Avend Avalhar X:21 --- We are fighting for braves future

Algorthan Gaterau X:21 --- All of our allies have been evicted. Tw gone. W4rped gone. R-R homeless

nOrman X:21 --- none of that was inevitable

Algorthan Gaterau X:21 --- None of them had any querious plans

nOrman X:21 --- those were all choices, and here we are, so I'm having to evac my stuff

Avend Avalhar X:22 --- So all these groups would have left us alone??

nOrman X.22 --- we're not even trying to fight them, like why wouldn't they take all our stuff, we're not bothering with it

Avend Avalhar X:22 --- We just defended the GE ihub

nOrman X:22 --- free kills for them. We have a POS sitting on the one midpoint we have to highsec killing every cyno that is lit and we just don't care whatever. I've seen this story several times and i've been the guy left holding the bag those times not this time i learned i'm just fed up. ignore me, it's the way of things

Avend Avalhar X:25 --- The only major screw up I saw so far is not defending the logistics route to hs

Dunk Dinkle X:34 --- You aren't going to convince nOrman, so stop trying. He was right and this war has put us in a bad place. We didn't expect things to go this way, both the war and CCP's nonsense. At this point, we don't really have any good options. Any way we choose, shit's fucked.