[QUOTE="Birkal, post: 8094135, member: 66676"]

I am only able to post via phone, but I find the lack of discussion for Regenerator extremely worrisome. We could talk shop about how the TLT banned it from conversation initially and whether or not it ultimately facilitated the discussion, but that’s in the past. What’s NOT in the past is our primary ability, and in this situation, I feel that Regenerator is the most simplistic AND best fit for CAP26 as a pivot.



CAP has a tendency to way overthink parts of its designs. That’s good for conversation — you can see a lot of discussion went into some abilities that I honestly hadn’t considered for CAP26. But I think I can illustrate to you an example of a recent CAP in which we overthought our abilities: Jumbao.



When we made CAP24, we set out to make a mon that utilized two weathers. What’s the best way to utilize one? To set it up: Jumbao snagged Drought as its primary ability and has greatly bolstered Sun as a concept within the meta, from making Volk’s damage output even more insane to providing more diverse teambuilds than just Mega Charizard Y. It was a simple choice to make, but one that stood by our concept strongly.



The same cannot be said for Trace as its secondary ability. Sure, it can be put on sand teams, but Trace Jumbao has found itself a new role as a Wishpasser and defensive pivot thanks to some key matchups that the ability provides, most notably all Heatran sets without Z-Flash Cannon. This isn’t inherently a bad thing, but it doesn’t strike me as particularly pro-concept, because I don’t feel drawn to include Jumbao on a sand team anymore than I would any core I’m trying to make, offensively or defensively. Trace Jumbao pairs with a ton of stuff, which increases its viability in a way it probably didn’t need in the first place, while also not supporting the concept in a significant way.



I hope this illustration demonstrates why Regenerator is our best option. [USER=395754]Jordy[/USER] aptly pointed out in his first post that Regenerator is the most simple option to choose for a pivot. He is absolutely right, and in this case, the most simple option is the best option. It provides a way to passively heal without clicking a move, and I can’t think of a mechanic more suited for a pivot trying to come into a match multiple times to throw out Doom Desire. Spending an additional turn to recover eats up too much time, and will ultimately lead CAP26 to pursue other options in terms of its most effective sets in the metagame. With Regenerator, CAP26 can guarantee that its own longevity in a match as a pivot with a fantastic defensive typing. I can appreciate how Jordy steered the discussion away from Regenerator in order to stimulate a more bombastic and thought-provoking series of posts. But now that Regenerator is open for consideration, I think we need to seriously sit down and parse out if any ability comes close to providing CAP26 with the tools to succeed conceptually. And in my opinion, I’m not convinced that any of these other abilities come close to providing the utility and flexibility that Regenerator does for our CAP.

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I think this discredits a lot of the discussion we've had. I agree, Regenerator is one of the top choices for CAP26. Clicking Doom Desire instead of Recover is definitely a positive to Regenerator. However, Steel / Ground is actually one of the few typings that could have been picked where I think Regenerator isn't far and away the best choice. For Steel / Ghost and Steel / Flying, moreso. But for Steel / Ground? Look at our switch-in list from SHSP's final post of the threats discussion:



[QUOTE="SHSP, post: 8087412, member: 249085"]



Switch Ins: Mega Crucibelle, Clefable, Tapu Koko, Most Tornadus-T, Magearna lacking Focus Blast



[/QUOTE]

Frankly, we don't have many great switch-in opportunities as of right now because we lack relevant resistances. While we switch into Mega Crucibelle, Tapu Koko, and "most Tornadus-T," those run U-turn a good bit of the time (Tapu Koko has opted for Volt Switch lately, admittedly). Clefable is also trending downward. My point is, having 5 switch-ins by typing, 2 of which are shaky, 1 of which is not very relevant, means we're going to suffer switching in. This is why immunity abilities have been rather popular in the thread, and why the discussion before Jordy opened Regenerator has been extremely important.



I'm not saying that Regenerator is a bad option. Regenerator + Assault Vest is an option we can use to shore up our bulk, or we can just have really great natural bulk to allow us to switch into the metagame. However, I think that, with our typing, we can't discount the benefits of some of the good immunity abilities discussed, namely Levitate, Bulletproof, and Water Absorb. Specifically, Levitate is the ability that can contend with Regenerator's effectiveness the best.



To reiterate, Levitate provides a fantastic immunity to Ground-type attacks, meaning Garchomp, Jumbao, and Mega Tyranitar are forced to run Fire-type attacks to damage CAP26, Pain Split + Calm Mind Magearna and Mega Diancie are helpless against CAP26 unless they run suboptimal coverage (i.e. they go out of their way to beat CAP26, specifically), Landorus-T will have to resort to Superpower to reliably damage CAP26 (which is likely not going to happen, it'll just rely on U-turn), Tangrowth will have to rely on its less effective Grass-type STAB to wear down CAP26, and Excadrill, which has seen an upward trend with the more reliable sand teams, cannot reliably damage CAP26. That's a lot more switch-in opportunities that CAP26 can utilize, and these are relevant Pokemon in the metagame.



Moreover, Levitate has an extremely useful benefit of ignoring Spikes damage. I cannot stress enough how important this is. Spikes are prominent in the current metagame with great setters like Greninja, Ferrothorn, Arghonaut, and Ash Greninja (Syclant isn't terrible but hasn't run Spikes as much lately, in favor of Choice Band). What's indicative of Spikes' dominance is that the two best reliable Defoggers in the metagame are Tornadus-T and Rotom-W, which are immune to Spikes. Another upwards-trending Defogger is Tapu Fini, which can counteract the influx of Choice Scarf Volkraken while providing Defog support, and shut down Ash Greninja and Arghonaut, two of the aforementioned Spike setters. Bottom-line, if CAP26's only hazard chip damage is the 3% chip damage from Stealth Rock, CAP26 gains a lot of survivability, on top of the added immunity to the aforementioned Ground-type attacks.



Furthermore, there are other ways for CAP26 to heal besides using a recovery move. A prominent strategy among Pokemon without reliable recovery has been to run a 50% pinch berry like Iapapa Berry. For Pokemon like Rotom-W, non-Z Garchomp, and some Heatran variants, this is a valuable and viable strategy that CAP26 can use as an alternative to Recover. This is not to say that a Levitate CAP26 should have to run Iapapa Berry, but it certainly is an option.



As for Bulletproof and Water Absorb, these abilities are a lot more focused in what they do, but Bulletproof ensures CAP26 can wall prominent threats that it would wall aside from Focus Blast like Magearna, Mega Alakazam, Tapu Lele, Tornadus-T, and Aurumoth(see my last post on this). Water Absorb, while I find to be the least effective of these four, solidifies the Toxapex matchup, which can appreciably annoy CAP26's teammates trying to achieve a Doom Desire lock. Aside from that, it allows CAP26 to place pressure on Ash-Greninja (which always runs Choice Specs) and Volkraken (which always runs a choice item, mostly Choice Scarf now). Both of these abilities' attributes are valuable, even if niche.



So basically, I don't think we need to say "well Regenerator is the simplest, obviously best option, so let's go with that." We actually did have a productive discussion on immunity abilities that improve CAP26's ability to switch-in. Thus, I think we should consider Regenerator with as much scrutiny as the other abilites. I like how quziel puts it here:



169599



Both of these options are equally viable. We get more switch-in opportunities with an immunity ability, as I have outined more specifically above. On the other hand, we can give CAP26 a lot of natural bulk to compensate for its lack of relevant resistances and allow it to use Regenerator successfully.



As of now, I think I'm leaning Levitate > Regenerator >> Bulletproof > Water Absorb > others. Any one of these abilities will improve CAP26's ability to pivot, which will give it opportunities to switch in, use Doom Desire effectively, and switch out. Regardless, the mindset that "Regenerator is obviously the shoe-in" died when we got Steel / Ground as our typing, rather than something that Steel / Ghost or Steel / Flying, which has an actual resist palate. Let's not confound the issue here.