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Mar 10 20:56:16 <Hobz>	Buckley, A friend of mine I knew growing up moved from Canada to the US and has been an MP for almost ten years now.  If he was racist before I didn't pick up on it.
Mar 10 20:56:32 <Hobz>	It's seriously weirding me out
Mar 10 20:56:33 <Buckley>	the group of friends i've been hanging out with since joining the military is super diverse and as a result we as a goof get over politically correct
Mar 10 20:57:02 <loudaslife>	shambrarian: This is fantastic
Mar 10 20:57:10 <Stereo>	it's just socialization, if you think something's normal yuo eventually start doing it
Mar 10 20:57:25 <Buckley>	it's a bit of an inside joke to tell other people what they're saying is racist if it's anywhere even close to being racist
Mar 10 20:57:27 <Hobz>	Buckley, He seems to be using it in more of a Chris Rock "Black People vs. N-words" kind of way
Mar 10 20:57:34 <Buckley>	and sometimes when it's no where close
Mar 10 20:57:51 <Buckley>	Hobz, ugh, Chris Rock has even said he regrets ever doing that bit
Mar 10 20:58:03 <Hobz>	No doubt
Mar 10 20:58:04 <Bucket>	"No Doubt" would make a good band name
Mar 10 20:58:13 <Buckley>	hahah
Mar 10 20:58:28 <Hobz>	Nailed it!
Mar 10 20:58:29 <Bucket>	ALL NIGHT LONG BABY
Mar 10 20:58:40 <shambrarian>	Bucket, the 90s
Mar 10 20:58:41 <Bucket>	90s is 20 years ago
Mar 10 20:58:51 <shambrarian>	D;
Mar 10 20:58:53 <Hobz>	was, it was 20 years ago
Mar 10 20:59:23 <Buckley>	Hobz, sometimes what can happen is even if someone isn't racist if they haven't been exposed to other races or types of people when they finally are they don't know how to handle themselves and will just be racist
Mar 10 20:59:42 <Buckley>	were, the 90s are plural
Mar 10 20:59:43 <shambrarian>	even though pyphor is a 6-string party pooper: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0u0rv914Qio
Mar 10 20:59:47 <shambrarian>	fascinating
Mar 10 20:59:47 <Bucket>	http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxk2h84cLk1qcq2h3.jpg
Mar 10 21:00:25 <Hobz>	Buckley, I dunno, I suspect he's had some very stereotypical negative experiences with black people
Mar 10 21:00:26 <Buckley>	that can happen a lot to the east asians with black people
Mar 10 21:00:49 <Hobz>	He's part Mohawk
Mar 10 21:00:53 <Buckley>	Hobz, stereotypes seem to have some root in reality
Mar 10 21:00:58 <shambrarian>	I remember vividly trying to play along with van halen as a bored teenager, and coming away with the idea "I'll never be this good, so why bother?". and it was the beginning of the end of any serious study.
Mar 10 21:01:05 <Buckley>	im from boston
Mar 10 21:01:08 <Buckley>	im an asshole
Mar 10 21:01:09 <Hobz>	Buckley, They do come from somewhere, if only perception
Mar 10 21:01:12 <Buckley>	coincidence?
Mar 10 21:01:13 <Bucket>	Buckley: I would say yes
Mar 10 21:01:33 <Hobz>	Asshole or just lacking in tact?
Mar 10 21:01:35 <sean>	Bucket: define "be racist"
Mar 10 21:01:36 <Bucket>	I'm sorry, there's currently nothing associated with that keyphrase.
Mar 10 21:01:38 <shambrarian>	nik west is 100% the opposite. I want to go home and beat the shit out of my bass for the next 3 days straight.
Mar 10 21:01:39 <sean>	Bucket: i mean
Mar 10 21:01:40 <Bucket>	You mean. I kind.
Mar 10 21:01:45 <sean>	BUCKLEY DAMMIT
Mar 10 21:02:12 <Hobz>	Can't you change your name to 8uckley?
Mar 10 21:02:27 <Buckley>	sean, they end up treating people differently than they normally do
Mar 10 21:02:36 <Hobz>	It'd be more 1337
Mar 10 21:02:38 <Buckley>	whether it's consiously or subconsciously
Mar 10 21:02:46 <Froward>	Ever1 is racis...
Mar 10 21:02:59 <shambrarian>	implicit association: it's a thing
Mar 10 21:03:06 <sean>	Buckley: well that isnt necessarily bad
Mar 10 21:03:26 <sean>	i treat women differently than i treat men, but that doesnt mean im sexist, or condescending, or anything really
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Mar 10 21:03:27 <Buckley>	it can go either way
Mar 10 21:03:28 <Hobz>	Trump seems to finally be making the right moves regarding his business practices vs. policy objectives
Mar 10 21:03:45 <Buckley>	i was about to say that was something i did with women too
Mar 10 21:04:02 <Buckley>	but it was because i hadn't figured out how im supposed to treat them
Mar 10 21:04:03 <sean>	I'm not sure if acting differently towards different people's is racist, or even negative
Mar 10 21:04:11 <Hobz>	I respect and embrace the differences while trying not to let it influence my decision making process
Mar 10 21:04:40 <Buckley>	it's really just you need to know little differences
Mar 10 21:04:49 <sean>	Buckley: well, i dunno, I may use different language with women
Mar 10 21:05:08 <shambrarian>	I was very relieved to learn about the research about implicit association - it gave me hope that I can change my unfavorable habits, and also a little bit of an out to not condemn myself for them
Mar 10 21:05:12 <sean>	I can't really think of a specific example
Mar 10 21:05:14 <Buckley>	sean, i lower my voice an octave and stare off into the distance
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Mar 10 21:05:25 <Buckley>	I count to twelve in my head before i respond to girls
Mar 10 21:05:31 <shambrarian>	Buckley: so you're deadpool?
Mar 10 21:05:44 <sean>	lul maybe that's a bit extreme
Mar 10 21:05:44 <Buckley>	yeah, deadpool in that one movie
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Mar 10 21:05:52 <Buckley>	defintely. maybe
Mar 10 21:05:57 <sean>	i just act like a complete dork.  honestl,y im more myself with women than with guys.  I'm awkward talking to guys.
Mar 10 21:06:00 <Froward>	uh wow do you get bad gas when u talk to girls
Mar 10 21:06:04 <sean>	(I'm straight)
Mar 10 21:06:17 <shambrarian>	sean: I've always been the same way
Mar 10 21:06:33 <shambrarian>	I credit two sisters and a spitfire mom for that too
Mar 10 21:06:35 <Buckley>	i am most comfortable talking to girls who are in a relationship
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Mar 10 21:06:47 <shambrarian>	guys are morons
Mar 10 21:06:57 <shambrarian>	statistically
Mar 10 21:06:58 <Bucket>	Unsupported assertions are statistically more likely to be believed without citation if one adds the word "statistically".
Mar 10 21:07:09 <Buckley>	they aren't interested in a romantic relationship with me because of that so there's no barrier
Mar 10 21:07:10 <sean>	male friendship is strange for me and i struggle with it
Mar 10 21:07:16 <shambrarian>	Bucket, on fire again
Mar 10 21:07:17 <Bucket>	Error 402: Drunk.
Mar 10 21:07:24 <Buckley>	i can actually be friends with a girl in a relationship
Mar 10 21:07:54 <Buckley>	and i'm not an idiot about it, i ask if i can meet the bf/husband/whatever and befriend him
Mar 10 21:08:02 <Buckley>	then i get two friends for the price of one
Mar 10 21:08:18 <shambrarian>	the "bro" thing is coming back around with the students here. I want to punch them all out when they come to the desk.
Mar 10 21:08:24 <Froward>	that's how u land the cool 3way ;)
Mar 10 21:08:38 <IceKarma>	shambrarian, 'bro' thing?
Mar 10 21:08:44 <shambrarian>	I never thought I would miss the rich preppy assholes
Mar 10 21:09:00 <Froward>	call everyone bro
Mar 10 21:09:13 <shambrarian>	IceKarma: "uuuhhhh, yeah, 'cause I'm too cool to talk more than 5 wpm, bro"
Mar 10 21:09:25 <Froward>	shambrarian: bro what gives
Mar 10 21:09:40 <sean>	Bro is an awesome word
Mar 10 21:09:49 <sean>	I call everyone bro, bro.
Mar 10 21:09:56 <Froward>	yah bro
Mar 10 21:09:56 <sean>	Also, dude.  Dude is cooler.
Mar 10 21:09:56 <IceKarma>	shambrarian, will admit there are a few of those types I'd like to screw, but nothing more ;3
Mar 10 21:09:56 <Buckley>	my friends and i take bro to a new level
Mar 10 21:09:56 <shambrarian>	with eye squint, awful trucker hat and a 10 word vocabulary
Mar 10 21:10:02 <qkombur>	i call everyone man.
Mar 10 21:10:13 <Buckley>	it's more like "bruh" or "breh" or just "br-"
Mar 10 21:10:15 <sean>	Man is nice.  Fam is fun.
Mar 10 21:10:18 <Froward>	that's species, qkombur
Mar 10 21:10:19 <Lhyzz>	I feel more comfortable with male friends. You can tease them more, generally, without hurting feelings.
Mar 10 21:10:24 <shambrarian>	it's the fact that it seems like a shitty act than a personality
Mar 10 21:10:28 <Froward>	*speciest
Mar 10 21:10:36 <Lhyzz>	Mostly I prefer cats, though.
Mar 10 21:10:37 <sean>	Lhyzz: yeah, tht, maybe.  I dunno.  But backwards.
Mar 10 21:10:39 <IceKarma>	Froward, surely you've noticed I'm speciesist
Mar 10 21:10:40 <qkombur>	Froward, My dog's still wag their tail.
Mar 10 21:10:43 <Buckley>	when i was in charge of people "big guy" was my go to
Mar 10 21:10:44 <shambrarian>	I don't like it when people play dumb to be accepted
Mar 10 21:10:45 <IceKarma>	Froward, cats rule, dogs drool
Mar 10 21:10:48 <phyphor>	bros before hoes, because a relatively obscure British boy band from the 80s appears earlier in the dictionary than the gardening implement
Mar 10 21:10:53 <Buckley>	"you need osmething big guy?"
Mar 10 21:10:55 <snark>	you can tease cats a lot without hurting their feelings too
Mar 10 21:11:13 <qkombur>	only cats can hurt a cats feeling.
Mar 10 21:11:22 <phyphor>	only gingers can call another ginger ginger
Mar 10 21:11:23 <IceKarma>	qkombur, see, I've always understood that a dog's tail wagging = anxiety, not happiness
Mar 10 21:11:26 <qkombur>	Ever see one fuck up a jump? they just stand there all dejected.
Mar 10 21:11:27 <sean>	when my cat is in attack-but-relaxing mode i try touching all four of her feet without her biting me
Mar 10 21:11:31 <Stereo>	dog drool has healing powers though, cat drool just gets stuck under the carpet
Mar 10 21:11:38 <Froward>	Buckley: "dickhaver" and "dicktoucher" also good casual titles
Mar 10 21:11:39 <shambrarian>	I don't particularly like dumb people either, but at least they may have a good reason for being that way
Mar 10 21:11:48 <snark>	that's because cats don't actually drool, they rule
Mar 10 21:11:51 <qkombur>	IceKarma, That sounds wrong.
Mar 10 21:11:59 <Buckley>	champ is good to
Mar 10 21:12:00 <sean>	this cat drools im sure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHYhzg8QWbI
Mar 10 21:12:11 <IceKarma>	qkombur, yeah, most dog owners disagree with me
Mar 10 21:12:15 <IceKarma>	qkombur, most dog owners have no clue, though
Mar 10 21:12:30 <Buckley>	we can't use chief because it's A) a rank in the military and B) racist (we have two native americans in our friend group)
Mar 10 21:12:32 <qkombur>	IceKarma: I mean it's not universally for happiness.
Mar 10 21:12:52 <Stereo>	i mostly think of dog anxiety as being yawning
Mar 10 21:12:55 <IceKarma>	qkombur, they're anxious to make their pack leader -- you -- happy
Mar 10 21:12:57 <phyphor>	bah, now I'm remnded of a less than awesome thing from earlier - in the pub someone was saying that they'll be "extra manly on November 19th" and was trying to work out what that might mean
Mar 10 21:13:00 <shambrarian>	IceKarma: that's what I always have to keep in mind during the warm seasons here "pretend you're like a dog chasing a car. what the hell would I do if I actuallly caught one?"
Mar 10 21:13:00 <sean>	Buckley: uh what
Mar 10 21:13:01 <Bucket>	Well, sean, how I see it is that you keep trying to make sense of things. Just stop doing that, and everything in life will be better.
Mar 10 21:13:09 <sean>	is chief an amerindian word now
Mar 10 21:13:16 <Buckley>	indian chiefs
Mar 10 21:13:17 <IceKarma>	sean, ...
Mar 10 21:13:20 <qkombur>	shambrarian, bite the shit out of it.
Mar 10 21:13:22 <Buckley>	really
Mar 10 21:13:23 <Bucket>	RLY!
Mar 10 21:13:26 <phyphor>	they said "eating steak and scratching my balls" - I pointed out I know women who do that thign "you know women who scratch their own balls?" ... well, yeah
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Mar 10 21:13:28 <Buckley>	like all the feathers
Mar 10 21:13:36 <shambrarian>	I never thought I would want to yell at young people to put some damned clothes on
Mar 10 21:13:39 <snark>	if chief is racist, is the rank of masterchief basically one of those 4chan portmantslurs
Mar 10 21:13:54 <shambrarian>	qkombur: acceptable answer!
Mar 10 21:13:55 <snark>	I dunno, I guess master->slave->racist may be too much of a stretch
Mar 10 21:14:01 <IceKarma>	snark, nah, that's the 'rank' usage
Mar 10 21:14:13 <phyphor>	"chief" isn't racist in and of itself, it has racist connotations because of poor nomenclature in the US
Mar 10 21:14:16 <Buckley>	here's a funny:
Mar 10 21:14:23 <Froward>	fart
Mar 10 21:14:32 <IceKarma>	phyphor, that's an *awfully* fine line =3
Mar 10 21:14:39 <phyphor>	snark: there has been some debate whether hard drives should have different terminology for where they appear on IDE cables
Mar 10 21:14:47 <Buckley>	the navy has a master chief petty officer and the air force has a chief master sergeant (these two are equivalent ranks)
Mar 10 21:14:56 <IceKarma>	phyphor, I believe it was California that outlawed 'master'/'slave' in IT contexts
Mar 10 21:14:56 <phyphor>	because "master" and "slave" has connotations
Mar 10 21:14:58 <Buckley>	master chief and chief master
Mar 10 21:15:04 <sean>	I suspect that the slangy usage of chief is not in reference to native american culture, but who knows, i could be wrong
Mar 10 21:15:19 <sean>	i mean, i COULD see it being the case.
Mar 10 21:15:21 <IceKarma>	sean, doesn't mean that Native Americans won't necessarily take offense
Mar 10 21:15:30 <phyphor>	sean: I think it came about because it was popluarised through US media of cowboys and native american western shows
Mar 10 21:15:39 <sean>	well, as the xkcd forums taught me, offense doesnt matter a damn
Mar 10 21:15:43 <IceKarma>	sean, hell, "black" and "African American" are both loaded terms
Mar 10 21:15:43 <sean>	it's real world harm
Mar 10 21:15:49 <phyphor>	But in the UK I'd use chief without meaning anything else, but, also, intent isn't magic
Mar 10 21:15:56 <Buckley>	sean, it's again something we call racist among my friends because it is almost kinda close to being racist
Mar 10 21:16:01 <sean>	it's like "lame"
Mar 10 21:16:13 <sean>	Maybe it used to harm people, but I doubt it does anymore
Mar 10 21:16:14 <phyphor>	IceKarma: It's why Benedict Cumberbatch was unfairly hauled over the coals when he tried to do the right thing
Mar 10 21:16:22 <IceKarma>	Buckley, better to err on the side of caution >.>
Mar 10 21:16:24 <IceKarma>	phyphor, hm?
Mar 10 21:16:39 <phyphor>	sean: "lame" being offensive? that's dumb! that's reta... oh, no, that one still is hurtful
Mar 10 21:16:40 <Buckley>	IceKarma, most of the things we call racist really aren't
Mar 10 21:16:49 <sean>	phyphor: haha
Mar 10 21:16:56 <phyphor>	IceKarma: some months ago he was asked about roles for certain actors
Mar 10 21:17:05 <IceKarma>	phyphor, welcome to the eu/dysphemism treadmill ;3
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Mar 10 21:17:12 <phyphor>	IceKarma: in the UK we can say "black" and it not be offensive, but it has connotations in the US
Mar 10 21:17:23 <sean>	black is not offensive in the US
Mar 10 21:17:23 <sean>	full stop
Mar 10 21:17:28 <sean>	that's a myth only white people believe
Mar 10 21:17:31 <phyphor>	so he started saying black actors, realised he was making a mistake and said "coloured actors"
Mar 10 21:17:38 <Buckley>	like uh, "what color is leah's new car?" "silver" "oh, she wouldn't get a black car huh?"
Mar 10 21:17:39 <phyphor>	when he should have said "actors of colour"
Mar 10 21:17:54 <IceKarma>	sean, I've run into problem sbefore with both "African American" and "black"
Mar 10 21:18:03 <phyphor>	because "coloured $foo" also has connotations
Mar 10 21:18:07 <Buckley>	african american is usually wrong
Mar 10 21:18:13 <sean>	it's only potentially offensive if people use it in a situation where race isn't relevant, or if it's an official context (african american is more prefered there)
Mar 10 21:18:20 <phyphor>	because of the euphemism treadmill running in reverse
Mar 10 21:18:28 <sean>	IceKarma: how, with black?
Mar 10 21:18:28 <Buckley>	it's most correct when someone moves ot america from africa and becomes an american
Mar 10 21:18:30 <IceKarma>	phyphor, that's the "dysphemism treadmill"
Mar 10 21:18:36 <--	templarii has quit (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
Mar 10 21:18:38 <phyphor>	Is it, though?
Mar 10 21:18:41 <sean>	Buckley: I strongly disagree.
Mar 10 21:18:52 <qkombur>	i mean if the words themselves aren't hurtful then surely it doesn't matter.
Mar 10 21:19:04 <IceKarma>	sean, how the hell should I know, I've offended people both ways
Mar 10 21:19:07 <Buckley>	sean, as a black man i strongly disagree with you
Mar 10 21:19:16 <phyphor>	Buckley: except that if a white African migrates to the US they are being deliberately obtuse claiming tey are "African American"
Mar 10 21:19:38 <Buckley>	phyphor, that's funny shit to me
Mar 10 21:19:40 <IceKarma>	phyphor, didn't someone use that to claim a scholarship at a black university >.>
Mar 10 21:19:40 <Cthuloops>	I've developed a cough
Mar 10 21:19:42 <Cthuloops>	the end is nigh
Mar 10 21:19:43 <Bucket>	The end is neigh
Mar 10 21:19:49 <phyphor>	also, "as a black man" is not good evidence
Mar 10 21:19:50 <sean>	Buckley: being black doesnt make you right.  A boer-descended whtie person who moves to the US is not african american
Mar 10 21:19:54 <IceKarma>	phyphor, when they were white >.>
Mar 10 21:19:55 <qkombur>	buckley: as a white man i'd feel weird of you called me caucasian american.
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Mar 10 21:20:00 <Froward>	racism never stops fucking the language
Mar 10 21:20:00 <sean>	african american is analogous with "european american".  it's a cultural term
Mar 10 21:20:17 <phyphor>	I mean, sure, you have a right to your opinion, and it's possibly of more relevance than others, but it's still merely opinion at this stage
Mar 10 21:20:18 <IceKarma>	qkombur, and so you should, Caucasians technically aren't white =P
Mar 10 21:20:20 <Buckley>	qkombur, are you from the caucasus region?
Mar 10 21:20:21 <sean>	or chinese american, italian american, korean american, etc
Mar 10 21:20:55 <qkombur>	depends on how far back you wanna go
Mar 10 21:20:56 <IceKarma>	qkombur, and no, I refuse to touch that minefield
Mar 10 21:20:56 <Buckley>	sean, the appropriate term is "american of XXX heritage"
Mar 10 21:21:08 <Froward>	phyphor: actually,
Mar 10 21:21:09 *	Bucket spins around and waits expectantly.
Mar 10 21:21:09 <sean>	Buckley: term for what
Mar 10 21:21:24 <Buckley>	we're just americans, why do only blacks have to be qualified?
Mar 10 21:21:32 <sean>	Buckley: when it's relevant
Mar 10 21:21:36 <phyphor>	Buckley: Irish Americans?
Mar 10 21:21:37 <sean>	in sociology papers and such
Mar 10 21:21:38 <qkombur>	Buckley, "Fuck it"
Mar 10 21:21:51 <phyphor>	Buckley: Pennsylvania Dutch?
Mar 10 21:22:01 ---	ChanServ gives channel operator status to Froward
Mar 10 21:22:04 <Buckley>	phyphor, in a police line up those people are white
Mar 10 21:22:11 <sean>	Buckley: there are even childrearing differences and such, that only make sense if you have the concept of subcultures within the main american culture
Mar 10 21:22:15 <qkombur>	I really do like ancestor history though
Mar 10 21:22:18 <phyphor>	Buckley: Asian Americans?
Mar 10 21:22:18 <Buckley>	yet a black man is african american
Mar 10 21:22:23 <qkombur>	like apparently i'm from england.
Mar 10 21:22:27 <Froward>	kids let's be fucking tasteful
Mar 10 21:22:30 <qkombur>	and france.
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Mar 10 21:22:40 <qkombur>	and germany, and the netherlands/
Mar 10 21:22:46 <sean>	Buckley: not all of them.  Now of course who the fuck am i to make this judgement, but im not sure id call an immigrant from nigeria to the US an african american
Mar 10 21:22:51 <phyphor>	Buckley: you made an assertion that's provably untrue
Mar 10 21:22:55 <qkombur>	add a pinch of native american and you got me.
Mar 10 21:23:00 <Murrlin>	a loo bloo
Mar 10 21:23:03 <Buckley>	phyphor, im not asian, i can't ccomment on that
Mar 10 21:23:08 <sean>	they do not 1. have american slave ancestry and 2. where not raised in the culture of those who descended from american slaves
Mar 10 21:23:23 <sean>	I believe earl sweatshirt is african american, but not his father, the great poet whatshisname
Mar 10 21:23:35 <Buckley>	so obama
Mar 10 21:23:35 <phyphor>	"why do only blacks have to be qualified" - thye don't "have" to be, they have been cast as the "other" and have accrued slurs from those times so we now try ot use terms that are descriptive without causing offence
Mar 10 21:23:47 <Buckley>	first black president or 44th white president?
Mar 10 21:23:50 <sean>	obama is african american
Mar 10 21:23:55 <sean>	first black president
Mar 10 21:24:02 <IceKarma>	Buckley, how about "44th president" =(
Mar 10 21:24:09 <phyphor>	And, right now, "person of colour" seems to be the preferred term of least offence
Mar 10 21:24:10 <IceKarma>	or whichever number
Mar 10 21:24:10 <sean>	he's not white.  Don't forget that race is a social construct.
Mar 10 21:24:12 <Buckley>	IceKarma, ding ding ding
Mar 10 21:24:24 <sean>	phyphor: I disagree with that.
Mar 10 21:24:25 <phyphor>	sean: race is one thing, skin colour another
Mar 10 21:24:30 <Buckley>	phyphor, "black"
Mar 10 21:24:33 <phyphor>	sean: good for you
Mar 10 21:24:34 <Bucket>	I know!
Mar 10 21:24:40 <sean>	phyphor: "black" isnt a skin color
Mar 10 21:24:43 <Buckley>	person of color is there with "colored"
Mar 10 21:24:45 <sean>	it is a race.
Mar 10 21:25:03 *	IceKarma sighs a bit at this conversation
Mar 10 21:25:03 <phyphor>	sean: you can disagree about lots of thigns, but, and this is why I laugh at you, I said "seems", implying in my opinion
Mar 10 21:25:03 <Buckley>	and that's as racist as it gets without saying nigger
Mar 10 21:25:11 <phyphor>	and you can have your own opinion, that's damned cool
Mar 10 21:25:16 <IceKarma>	you know, if someone wants you to not call them XYZ, how about not calling them XYZ
Mar 10 21:25:29 <sean>	what IceKarma said really
Mar 10 21:25:34 <IceKarma>	regardless of your opinion of the justification for or against any given label
Mar 10 21:25:40 <phyphor>	IceKarma: good call
Mar 10 21:25:41 <Bucket>	Thank you for calling Bucket Support!
Mar 10 21:25:52 <Buckley>	we were supposed to be learning some REDACTED shit one day in class and we spent a couple hours debating this
Mar 10 21:25:58 <sean>	in my experience, "black" is totally acceptable by every black person ive seen, in person, on tv, anywhere
Mar 10 21:26:02 <sean>	it's how they self-identify
Mar 10 21:26:03 <IceKarma>	phyphor, and the funny thing is, my opinion has nothing to do with race
Mar 10 21:26:11 <Buckley>	it was a super diverse class among the 9 students and two instructors
Mar 10 21:26:13 <sean>	more rarely, african american
Mar 10 21:26:17 <sean>	so i go with "black" by default
Mar 10 21:26:18 <Buckley>	whites were the minority iirc
Mar 10 21:26:34 <Buckley>	two black people, three asians, two native americans, two hispanics
Mar 10 21:26:37 <IceKarma>	phyphor, after so many years in the furry fandom dealing with people who identify as all kinds of mind-bending shit, it seems too much hassle to deny people their self identifications
Mar 10 21:26:37 <phyphor>	sean: also note that PoC is more inclusive than just "black", in that other minority groups are also included
Mar 10 21:26:45 <Hobz>	I stepped out for a few minutes, were we at?
Mar 10 21:26:57 <phyphor>	IceKarma: people are fucking crazy, but what's new?
Mar 10 21:26:58 <Lhyzz>	I believe "person of color" is an all-encompasing term for anyone who is not white.
Mar 10 21:26:59 <sean>	phyphor: well, I don't use person of color because it's bullshit sjw language, and id rather not encourage them
Mar 10 21:27:00 <IceKarma>	if someone says 'please call me X'/'please don't call me Y', well
Mar 10 21:27:08 <sean>	to be frank about it :>
Mar 10 21:27:19 <phyphor>	sean: oh, so you're a status quo warriar?
Mar 10 21:27:29 <IceKarma>	oh boy
Mar 10 21:27:29 <sean>	No, I'm a progressive
Mar 10 21:27:29 <Bucket>	Your brain has been swiss-cheesed!
Mar 10 21:27:33 <phyphor>	yeah, down with actually wanting "justice"!
Mar 10 21:27:38 <sean>	im not a fan of like...making up new terms
Mar 10 21:27:47 <Buckley>	that's it
Mar 10 21:27:48 <Bucket>	You're damn right it is!
Mar 10 21:27:53 <IceKarma>	phyphor, ... eh, you can be a fan of justice while disapproving of how SJWs go about seeking same
Mar 10 21:27:54 <sean>	it seems too forced sometimes.  has to come more naturally.
Mar 10 21:27:55 <Buckley>	let's end this discussion
Mar 10 21:27:55 <Buckley>	new one
Mar 10 21:27:55 <phyphor>	I mean, how dare those people fighting for an improvement in the world dare to .. fight for improvement
Mar 10 21:28:06 <mewyn>	Er, sometimes you need a new term to describe something you don't have a word for.
Mar 10 21:28:10 <sean>	what IceKarma said, actually, sums it very well
Mar 10 21:28:25 <Buckley>	who would win in a fight: a grilled cheese sandwich or a taco?
Mar 10 21:28:27 <IceKarma>	phyphor, given the tendency to restrict that usage to people who often seem batshit-crazy
Mar 10 21:28:31 <phyphor>	IceKarma: SJW *used* to be a term used within the progresive movement to mock a certain subset, since then it has been co-opted by those outside to attack those who dare to challenge assumptions
Mar 10 21:28:38 <Lhyzz>	Buckley: soft or hard taco?
Mar 10 21:28:39 <mewyn>	Please tell me way to refer to people who are not white without comparing them to white people
Mar 10 21:28:43 <sean>	Buckley: grilled cheese.  the taco's innards would all fall out
Mar 10 21:28:44 <Buckley>	lard shell
Mar 10 21:28:50 <Buckley>	hard shell*
Mar 10 21:29:11 <Hobz>	Maybe we shouldn't call white people white
Mar 10 21:29:18 <Lhyzz>	I think the taco wins - if the shell is cracked (injury, not KO) it can be used as a weapon
Mar 10 21:29:20 <Hobz>	Maybe this whole premise is flawed
Mar 10 21:29:24 <Buckley>	mewyn, does just calling them people count as cheating?
Mar 10 21:29:27 <phyphor>	IceKarma: SJW is now undergoing a re-adoption as a badge of honour by some progressives
Mar 10 21:29:36 <phyphor>	it's all just bullshit and divisionary
Mar 10 21:29:37 <Buckley>	Lhyzz, prison rules
Mar 10 21:29:59 <sean>	phyphor: what does that mean?
Mar 10 21:29:59 <Bucket>	It means you shall not pass.
Mar 10 21:30:14 <Hobz>	true dat...
Mar 10 21:30:15 <Bucket>	True, stat!
Mar 10 21:30:15 <sean>	phyphor: serious question, i cant parse that sentence right
Mar 10 21:30:15 <mewyn>	Buckley: That doesn't describe people of color as a group; you're including the white majority there, and sometimes you need to refer to a group with out white people.
Mar 10 21:30:49 <sean>	mewyn: how do you refer to everyone who isnt asian without referring to asians?
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Mar 10 21:31:16 <sean>	how do you refer to every animal that isnt an elephant without referrign to elephants?
Mar 10 21:31:27 <sean>	i dont see why it's necessary to hae this conversation
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Mar 10 21:31:47 <qkombur>	Elephantidae
Mar 10 21:31:48 <sean>	(sorry if that sounded rude)
Mar 10 21:31:58 <phyphor>	sean: in the wibbly-wobbly time of old certain people pushing for progressive change in culture and society labelled some people on the left who used aggressive techniques as SJWs
Mar 10 21:32:22 <phyphor>	as a follow-on, probably, from keyboard warrior
Mar 10 21:32:33 <phyphor>	it used to be a perjorative term used within the left
Mar 10 21:32:44 <sean>	phyphor: I can see your concern, and I sorta hate myself sometimes for picking on them, and for using that term even
Mar 10 21:32:49 <sean>	which is a bit of a TTC in some instances
Mar 10 21:33:03 <phyphor>	since then people who are opposed to any form of social progressivism apply the term "sjw" to all those who dare to rock any boat at all
Mar 10 21:33:36 <phyphor>	which is why, for example, 4chans /b/ and /pol, and 8chan and gamergate etc. label all their opponents as SJWs
Mar 10 21:33:53 <sean>	phyphor: but at the same time, an argument can be made that their tone and methods could be harming adoption of progressive viewpoints
Mar 10 21:34:04 <phyphor>	(it's an unfortuante coincidence that some have used to further attack, that SJW and Jew have some letters in common)
Mar 10 21:34:13 <sean>	phyphor: see: the atheist community.  /r/atheism is so bad, people distance themselves from atheist activism
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Mar 10 21:34:32 <IronAngel>	ew, /r/atheism
Mar 10 21:34:35 <IceKarma>	sean, Christians react so badly it's not worth it =P
Mar 10 21:34:40 <IronAngel>	that is not a happy place
Mar 10 21:34:51 *	IceKarma anti-religion anti-Christian strong-form atheist... doesn't push it at all =P
Mar 10 21:34:52 <phyphor>	In retalliation for the co-opting of the term as a general slur for all progressives some progressives have taken up the SJW as a badge of honour/mantle
Mar 10 21:35:01 <sean>	IronAngel: and it makes me look like an asshole for being an antitheist, which is why i hate /r/atheism
Mar 10 21:35:08 <phyphor>	and have gone on to suggest other D&D style classes they can be - SJBards, SJClerics, etc.
Mar 10 21:35:09 <IceKarma>	as long as /you/ don't push your religion on /me/, then we're fine
Mar 10 21:35:11 <IronAngel>	sean, agreed
Mar 10 21:35:32 <puddle>	http://i.imgur.com/n667JSA.jpg  http://i.imgur.com/Zm6NXuW.jpg
Mar 10 21:35:42 <sean>	so, i have a similar viewpoint towards so-called social justice warriors
Mar 10 21:35:44 <IronAngel>	phyphor Ive seen that... Im reminded of clerks 2 and the whole bit about taking it back
Mar 10 21:35:45 <IceKarma>	it really doesn't help I have irreconcilable differences with most forms of Christianity
Mar 10 21:35:52 <Hobz>	Oh my, kitty cats!
Mar 10 21:36:03 <phyphor>	as we're now this far down the timeline I accept that *now* the use of SJW as a snarl/slur is indiciative that the speaker is usually on the right
Mar 10 21:36:18 <IceKarma>	phyphor, I find that a bit offensive =P
Mar 10 21:36:27 <IceKarma>	phyphor, I'm pretty far to the left, yet there are still people I label 'SJWs'
Mar 10 21:36:33 <phyphor>	whilst it's true some people on the left still use SJW in the "original" sense
Mar 10 21:36:34 <sean>	it's their focus on language from well-intended people, minor things like dumb jokes in movies, or games, insistence in being in your face, and developing their own jargon, that makes feminism look really bad
Mar 10 21:36:43 <phyphor>	it's sort of becoming less common
Mar 10 21:36:44 <sean>	because of SJW, the very valid oncept of privilege is now MOCKED.
Mar 10 21:36:46 <sean>	that is NOT progress
Mar 10 21:36:50 <Buckley>	so this is gonna be a weird question
Mar 10 21:37:00 <phyphor>	sean: yeah, no
Mar 10 21:37:06 <Buckley>	does anyone have any good chiropractic videos?
Mar 10 21:37:09 <IceKarma>	phyphor, that said I'm probably among the people continuing to use it in its 'original' sense
Mar 10 21:37:11 <sean>	yeah but no yeah
Mar 10 21:37:13 <Buckley>	i find them really settling
Mar 10 21:37:13 <IceKarma>	Buckley, chiropraxis is a sham
Mar 10 21:37:17 <Lhyzz>	It is the same error to be anti-someone-else's-religion as it is to be anti-someone-else's-atheism.
Mar 10 21:37:23 <phyphor>	4chan have done some impressive, but awful, things in the ways of setting up straw-feminists and the like
Mar 10 21:37:27 <Buckley>	IceKarma, yeah, but i like hearing the cracks
Mar 10 21:37:35 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I am anti-religion in general
Mar 10 21:37:53 <phyphor>	IceKarma: I know some people who use "gay" to mean happy
Mar 10 21:38:02 <sean>	phyphor: i actually agree with that
Mar 10 21:38:05 <phyphor>	it's obscure and archaic, but, sure
Mar 10 21:38:14 <sean>	phyphor: i doubt that's sincere though
Mar 10 21:38:18 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, mostly because so many religions involve "don't think, just God"
Mar 10 21:38:26 <sean>	its like how no one would ACTUALLY use the word niggardly anymore if it didnt sound like nigger.
Mar 10 21:38:40 <sean>	(not that "gay" is a slur, of course)
Mar 10 21:38:49 <phyphor>	sean: it genuinely is
Mar 10 21:38:54 <phyphor>	also, I've used niggardly before
Mar 10 21:38:58 <phyphor>	and genuinely
Mar 10 21:38:58 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: as you do not have a religion, that is in the same category. Religion isn't right for you, that's cool with me. Expecting others to behave in accordance with your beliefs or risk your condemnation (or something akin to that), isn't.
Mar 10 21:39:09 <sean>	phyphor: would you have, if it didnt become infamous for sounding like nigger?  Honest question.
Mar 10 21:39:12 <IceKarma>	phyphor, it can be. it's also the first word I would go for to describe myself, ignoring the whole gender-queer thing
Mar 10 21:39:17 <sean>	I pesonally highly doubt you would have.
Mar 10 21:39:20 <phyphor>	I've also used "retarded" in the sense of "reducing speed"
Mar 10 21:39:21 <Lhyzz>	And I don't consider myself religious.
Mar 10 21:39:26 <sean>	it's a "wink wink look how edgy I'm being" thing.
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Mar 10 21:39:36 <phyphor>	sean: I did before it (re-)grew that infamy
Mar 10 21:39:47 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I expect people to make use of the capacity for critical thinking that is their birthright, instead of learning to suppress it because their religion discourages questions
Mar 10 21:39:49 <sean>	okay, why did you use it, then?
Mar 10 21:40:02 <phyphor>	sean: I'm a Brit, living in the UK, we don't really have the cultural connotations you do
Mar 10 21:40:14 <sean>	perhaps
Mar 10 21:40:15 <Bucket>	Perhaps you're porkpies.
Mar 10 21:40:21 <sean>	but is niggardly used commonly in speech, even in the UK?
Mar 10 21:40:35 <sean>	i never see it in print
Mar 10 21:40:40 <phyphor>	sean: because it was another epithet after, miserly and stingy
Mar 10 21:40:45 <phyphor>	it's not that common, no
Mar 10 21:40:54 <phyphor>	but it wasn't used "because it sounds like another word"
Mar 10 21:40:55 <sean>	so why did you use it?
Mar 10 21:41:00 <phyphor>	it was used because it was appropriate
Mar 10 21:41:02 <IceKarma>	but it's not like the US, where people lose their shit over it because it sounds like 'nigger'
Mar 10 21:41:09 <phyphor>	it simply doens't have the ede-lord connotations
Mar 10 21:41:14 <sean>	IceKarma: no, they don't.
Mar 10 21:41:22 <IceKarma>	sean, enough do
Mar 10 21:41:22 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: not all religions discourage questions. And I hope everyone can do the same. But making intelligent decisions based on critical thinking is not mutually exclusive with religion.
Mar 10 21:41:32 <sean>	in the US we roll our eyes because, look, another smarmy fucker is trying to fool people into thinking he said something racist
Mar 10 21:41:36 <phyphor>	sean: I've also seen a video where someone lost their shit because someone referred to a finanacial black hole
Mar 10 21:41:47 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I can respect that that's your opinion, while simultaneously recognizing its rarity
Mar 10 21:41:59 <sean>	phyphor: why
Mar 10 21:42:08 <puddle>	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Moore probably is responsible for the use of "politically correct" in the most bigoted context by the most well-known person. I've seen appropriate uses of "politically correct" where I get what they're saying but it's some Rush Limbaugh-type uses poison the well and make me suspicious until they give contradictory
Mar 10 21:42:08 <puddle>	information
Mar 10 21:42:09 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: I think your experience with religion is far different from mine, then.
Mar 10 21:42:19 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, yup! being a gay man will do that for you =3
Mar 10 21:42:21 <phyphor>	sean: because it was a discussion about money in IIRC a university and some discrepencies about funds
Mar 10 21:42:34 <phyphor>	and one of the people involved believed the term was used with racist intent
Mar 10 21:42:37 <sean>	phyphor: okay, but why was it deemed offensive though?
Mar 10 21:42:43 <sean>	reference to a vagina?
Mar 10 21:42:44 <sean>	or racial?
Mar 10 21:42:57 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, there only being an endless list of religions that will condemn you to the local analog of Hell for such things
Mar 10 21:43:05 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: The religion I grew up in did not include homophobia.
Mar 10 21:43:05 <Oracle989>	Grrr
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Mar 10 21:43:19 <Oracle989>	The gremlin in my kayak has vanished unexpectedly
Mar 10 21:43:22 <kitten>	stephen fry sums up my feelings on religion far better than i ever could; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-suvkwNYSQo
Mar 10 21:43:22 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, but, yeah, funny that I'm anti-Christian, given how they talk so much about "love the sinner, hate the sin", but practice so much "hate the sinner and the sin"
Mar 10 21:43:24 <phyphor>	sean: "racist intent" ... so ... racial
Mar 10 21:43:50 <chaos95>	phyphor: did you set that person straight?
Mar 10 21:43:51 <sean>	phyphor: okay, so the person who got upset...are they a dick for getting upset?
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Mar 10 21:44:12 <sean>	was it fake offense?
Mar 10 21:44:13 <Froward>	Christianity would be p great if its practitioners actually followed the writ
Mar 10 21:44:14 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, Judaism doesn't really get a pass for that, they're just a lot less in my face about it
Mar 10 21:44:24 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: I can imagine why you would feel that way. I'm not Christian. And while they are relatively few, there are Christian churches that are inclusive and supportive of LGBT people.
Mar 10 21:44:30 <phyphor>	sean: it's ... complicated
Mar 10 21:44:33 <kitten>	Froward: Christianity would be impossible if they followed it
Mar 10 21:44:37 <phyphor>	Commissioner John Wiley Price
Mar 10 21:44:38 <kitten>	its entirely contradictions
Mar 10 21:44:39 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I'm well aware.
Mar 10 21:44:40 <Hobz>	Is Buddhism considered an atheistic religion?
Mar 10 21:44:44 <phyphor>	that's the video reference I BELIEVE
Mar 10 21:44:45 <IceKarma>	Hobz, mostly.
Mar 10 21:44:58 <sean>	phyphor: because it's possible that that person is either very unintelligent, or just very ignorant and got confused
Mar 10 21:45:00 <IceKarma>	Hobz, it's specifically the intersection of "theistic" and "organized" I usually have problems with
Mar 10 21:45:11 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: First off, Judaism comes in different sects, just like Christianity does. I'm Reform. Second, even the most observant Jews don't tend to care much about the conduct of non-Jews.
Mar 10 21:45:14 <IceKarma>	Hobz, e.g. paganism is "theistic, unorganized"
Mar 10 21:45:15 <phyphor>	sean: the suggestion is that the term "black hole" was used specifically because it had connotations
Mar 10 21:45:15 <sean>	phyphor: if either are the case, they shouldnt be mocked or made fun of
Mar 10 21:45:18 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I'm aware
Mar 10 21:45:21 <Froward>	Ah, religious apologism.. what fun!
Mar 10 21:45:25 <sean>	phyphor: right, i got that.
Mar 10 21:45:29 <phyphor>	sean: the video's on YouTube
Mar 10 21:45:40 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, glad that you're Reform, rather than any of the more toxic, conservative strains
Mar 10 21:45:43 <phyphor>	sean: it is true that the term "black hole" is scientific
Mar 10 21:45:55 <IceKarma>	Hobz, Buddhism is "athetistic, organized"
Mar 10 21:45:58 <sean>	agree or disagree: religion is as bullshit as the taboo against nudity
Mar 10 21:45:59 <Hobz>	IceKarma, I had a bit of a chat with a buddhist friend of the family he wound up walking away a little insulted.  I don't mind, he's a bit of an ass, just as long as I was right
Mar 10 21:46:03 <phyphor>	sean: but "niggardly" is also an old English word
Mar 10 21:46:10 <Hobz>	IceKarma, He kept confusing atheism with nihilism
Mar 10 21:46:17 <phyphor>	sean: I would avoid use of the word int he US because I don't want to antagonise
Mar 10 21:46:20 ---	ChanServ removes channel operator status from Froward
Mar 10 21:46:23 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: I'm sorry you've had a hard time, but that doesn't give you license to be condescending and insulting towards entire religions.
Mar 10 21:46:35 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, hahahaha. sure it does.
Mar 10 21:46:40 <sean>	phyphor: well on reddit youll get 500 upvotes for being so brave for using that word
Mar 10 21:46:42 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, ever heard of the Golden Rule?
Mar 10 21:46:42 ---	THIS-NICK-SUCKS is now known as Donald-Trump
Mar 10 21:46:45 <Hobz>	Everybody get's an opinion
Mar 10 21:46:47 <Froward>	Wait we have to license out judgement???
Mar 10 21:46:50 <IceKarma>	"treat others as you wish yourself to be treated"?
Mar 10 21:46:52 <phyphor>	but it is a little frustrating that the US cultural hegemony dictates that an English person speaking English can't say certain words
Mar 10 21:46:53 <kitten>	IceKarma: it ain't gay if its in a three way?
Mar 10 21:46:54 <kitten>	oh
Mar 10 21:46:56 <IceKarma>	so many religions fail that
Mar 10 21:47:02 <Donald-Trump>	IceKarma: I like gold
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Mar 10 21:47:08 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: Ok, so let's say I was bullied by gay kids in high school. I have a license to say shitty things about all gay people?
Mar 10 21:47:12 <IceKarma>	if you're the wrong religion or something the religion doesn't like like homosexuality, well, you're fucked
Mar 10 21:47:13 <Lhyzz>	Because I had a hard time?
Mar 10 21:47:14 <phyphor>	IceKarma: 1.618?
Mar 10 21:47:19 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, hahahahahahahahaha
Mar 10 21:47:23 <sean>	phyphor: no, they can.  And if i see the word niggardly in an old book, i wouldnt think twice.  But some words DO become archaic
Mar 10 21:47:27 <chaos95>	iceaWhoever has the gold makes the rules
Mar 10 21:47:28 <phyphor>	Bucket: the golden rule <reply> about 1.618
Mar 10 21:47:28 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: hhahahahahahqhahahahabhawelkhqfseijfweijpwegijpwegwet
Mar 10 21:47:29 <Bucket>	Okay, phyphor.
Mar 10 21:47:31 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I'm sorry, but this conversation's over
Mar 10 21:47:32 <Hobz>	Lhyzz, I sense that you're not going to win this one
Mar 10 21:47:33 <chaos95>	wow tab fail
Mar 10 21:47:37 <Froward>	Lhyzz: your argument boils down to "but I'm one of the cool Jews!" ?
Mar 10 21:47:38 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: my thoughts exactly
Mar 10 21:47:38 <Donald-Trump>	Lhyzz: yes
Mar 10 21:47:42 <chaos95>	IceKarma: Whoever has the gold makes the rules
Mar 10 21:47:43 <phyphor>	Bucket: the golden rule <reply> Whoever has the gold makes the rules!
Mar 10 21:47:44 <IceKarma>	Hobz, I'm not even bothering
Mar 10 21:47:44 <Bucket>	Okay, phyphor.
Mar 10 21:47:49 <sean>	and when one of those archaic words happens to resemble a very offensive word, and all of the sudden people start "naturally" saying that word again, and innocently claim that its natural
Mar 10 21:47:53 <sean>	I question their motives
Mar 10 21:47:54 <IceKarma>	Hobz, if Lhyzz can't see the incredible difference between the two, well
Mar 10 21:47:56 <Donald-Trump>	first amendment
Mar 10 21:47:59 <phyphor>	sean: and you're right to do so
Mar 10 21:48:02 <Lhyzz>	Froward: you're skating on incredibly thin, anti-Semitic ice
Mar 10 21:48:08 <sean>	Usually it's not racism, it's just them being "edgy", because being "edgy" is the most important thing to some people
Mar 10 21:48:14 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I think he has a great point
Mar 10 21:48:15 <BytesAndCoffee>	my mom found out about Wish
Mar 10 21:48:20 <Lhyzz>	I don't appreciate anyone painting any group with a broad brush.
Mar 10 21:48:24 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, and if you try to categorize me as anti-Semitic I'll fly to NYC and fucking punch you out
Mar 10 21:48:25 <BytesAndCoffee>	that cheap Amazon-ish online store
Mar 10 21:48:36 <Lhyzz>	I don't like seeing people blaming whole groups of people for the actions of individuals within that community.
Mar 10 21:48:37 <sean>	phyphor: in fact there are some words that ARENT archaic that resemble dirty or ofensive words today, and no one gives them a second thought
Mar 10 21:48:41 <phyphor>	arguably, though, SJW is becoming an offensive word, snarled with similar venom and often slurred with Jew
Mar 10 21:48:49 <Hobz>	Maybe lets everybody just take a breath...
Mar 10 21:48:57 <BytesAndCoffee>	and she's probably bought a few hundred dollars of crap in the last few days
Mar 10 21:49:00 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, when that's the fucking *default stance* of many religious communities, maybe you can see my anger
Mar 10 21:49:07 *	sean takes a deep breath, chokes on air
Mar 10 21:49:07 <phyphor>	hence, for example, the anti-semitic caricatures of Anita Sarkeesian who *isn't a Jew*
Mar 10 21:49:22 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, but while you're a Jew, and thus the target of various attacks, I'm gay, and thus the target of different attacks
Mar 10 21:49:34 <puddle>	IceKarma: if you use "Judeo-Christian values" you should be good
Mar 10 21:49:36 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, we can continue this not-seeing-eye-to-eye bullshit
Mar 10 21:49:43 <phyphor>	sean: they say the English language is based on penis glorification - that's a phallussy
Mar 10 21:49:45 <Froward>	Yah there are some good homophobes its unfair to paint them all with the same brush
Mar 10 21:50:06 <puddle>	since it's what fundies use to dog-whistle when they require religion in schools they'll only cut out the Muslims
Mar 10 21:50:14 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, and you know, this smells suspiciously like you can dish it, but can't take it
Mar 10 21:50:26 <Froward>	^
Mar 10 21:50:32 <sean>	I persoanlly think homophobia is a bullshit word, because hatred of gay people *probably* isn't actually based off fear of being gay.
Mar 10 21:50:36 <Lhyzz>	What in the hell did I dish?
Mar 10 21:50:37 <phyphor>	sean: I'm reminded of the Australian who, in Parliament, said "I'm a country member" and a member of their opposition said "I remember"
Mar 10 21:50:53 <phyphor>	sean: $foophobia no longer means "fear"
Mar 10 21:50:53 <Lhyzz>	Froward, do you still have ops?
Mar 10 21:50:55 <sean>	Yeah, I actually had country/cunt in mind when i wrote that :D
Mar 10 21:50:56 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, you're quick to shit on others, but as soon as someone insinuates that maybe some group you're incidentally connected with is bad, ho boy, watch the defending
Mar 10 21:51:00 <Lhyzz>	Because I would be AMAZED if you did
Mar 10 21:51:05 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, yes, he's just deopped this instant
Mar 10 21:51:07 <phyphor>	English -phobia is slightly divorced from the original Greek
Mar 10 21:51:08 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, he deopped a few minutes ago
Mar 10 21:51:24 <Lhyzz>	IceKarma: When did I shit on anyone?
Mar 10 21:51:34 <sean>	phyphor: it's one of the few greek suffixes that most english speakers agree on, so the connotation of phobos equally fear is VERY strong
Mar 10 21:51:36 <Hobz>	I'm going to watch suits for a bit
Mar 10 21:51:40 <--	Hobz (~Hobz@hide-208BBE8.ipv6.telus.net) has left #xkcd (Leaving)
Mar 10 21:51:45 <Lhyzz>	I think you need to take a giant step back and think about what you say.
Mar 10 21:51:46 <sean>	you can make up a word--catophobia--and people will isntantly parse it as "fear of cats"
Mar 10 21:51:55 <Lhyzz>	You started up about religions, and I am not religious.
Mar 10 21:52:00 <sean>	never "hatred or discrimination against cats"
Mar 10 21:52:04 <phyphor>	sean: yeah, but homophobia doesn't mean fear-of-the-same
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Mar 10 21:52:16 <Lhyzz>	I saw a problem with the way you are hating on basically everyone in the fucking world because you have a (rightful) chip on your shoulder.
Mar 10 21:52:20 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, yeah, I'm already deeper into this than I wanted to get, but you have this bad habit of being dismissive until someone starts poking at *you*, at which point you get horribly defensive
Mar 10 21:52:22 <phyphor>	see, also, transphobia
Mar 10 21:52:22 <sean>	right, it means hatred, and thus is a bullshit word.
Mar 10 21:52:27 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, much like how you trotted the bit about being a Reform Jew
Mar 10 21:52:52 <sean>	phyphor: same with transphobia
Mar 10 21:52:57 <phyphor>	sean: it means *hatred* of somethign that the bit before the -phobia doesn't quite encompass
Mar 10 21:53:00 <chaos95>	sean: Here in Melbourne we have a very popular (until google maps, at least) serious of yearly-published street directories, called 'Melway'. I have frequently heard complaints that the coverage of these directories in rural areas is insufficient, and they should have an equivalent for the country areas, called 'Countways'
Mar 10 21:53:02 <Lhyzz>	What the hell does that even mean? We were discussing religion, I was giving the context of my experience.
Mar 10 21:53:12 <sean>	phyphor: why not transogyny?
Mar 10 21:53:12 <phyphor>	it's not fear of the same, it's hatred of homosexuals
Mar 10 21:53:14 <Lhyzz>	If you feel like that's "defensive" then you are projecting an awful lot.
Mar 10 21:53:27 <phyphor>	because the English language shifts
Mar 10 21:53:38 <sean>	oh, fuck
Mar 10 21:53:39 <Bucket>	Son of a hell!
Mar 10 21:53:43 <sean>	misotrany then
Mar 10 21:53:43 <Lhyzz>	You think your experience applies to the entire world, and it doesn't.
Mar 10 21:53:51 <phyphor>	Lhyzz & IceKarma : with respect, you are both ops and this should either be taken to PM or be dropped
Mar 10 21:53:51 <sean>	gyny means woman, miso means hate
Mar 10 21:54:04 <Lhyzz>	And you can't simply say "I'm against other people believing in a thing"
Mar 10 21:54:14 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, not what I said
Mar 10 21:54:17 <Buckley>	should i get 8 or 16gb of ram for my build
Mar 10 21:54:19 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, also, I'm stopping engaging with you now
Mar 10 21:54:20 <Lhyzz>	You can say "I am against people treating others a certain way because of their beliefs" -- and that is 100% valid
Mar 10 21:54:26 <IceKarma>	Lhyzz, I'd put you on /ignore, if I felt that was an option
Mar 10 21:54:37 <chaos95>	sean: Buckley what are you building?
Mar 10 21:54:39 <phyphor>	Lhyzz & IceKarma : with less, but still some, respect, you are both ops and this should either be taken to PM or be dropped
Mar 10 21:54:45 <Lhyzz>	Yeah because you can't back up your bigotry-against-bigotry position.
Mar 10 21:54:48 <sean>	chaos95: building?
Mar 10 21:54:48 <chaos95>	wtf is up with my tab completion today
Mar 10 21:54:49 <Bucket>	building is always completely free
Mar 10 21:54:57 <chaos95>	sean: sorry, I mean to ping Buckley, not you
Mar 10 21:55:07 <Buckley>	chaos95, gaming rig
Mar 10 21:55:13 <chaos95>	Buckley: 16
Mar 10 21:55:13 <Buckley>	want to do 4k gaming
Mar 10 21:55:36 <kitten>	you know its incredibly awkward when someone tries to end a difficult conversation before things get nasty and the other people has to get a last slap in instead of mutually being the bigger person
Mar 10 21:55:37 <phyphor>	Buckley: more RAM is pretty much always better
Mar 10 21:55:47 <sean>	phyphor: one of my biggest things is changing language for political purposes, which is not the same as politically ocrrect speech, which im fine with (in concept)
Mar 10 21:55:47 <Oracle989>	Wait, wait, wait
Mar 10 21:55:48 <Bucket>	<Oracle989> the sky's all bright blue and there's this giant fireball! it's the end of the world!
Mar 10 21:56:05 <phyphor>	kitten: you know what else is awkward? when it has been dropped and someone else gets in another attack from the sidelines, trying to kick it off again.
Mar 10 21:56:05 <Oracle989>	Rose Art and Mega Bloks are made by the same company
Mar 10 21:56:09 <Oracle989>	What an evil, evil company@
Mar 10 21:56:10 <Oracle989>	!*
Mar 10 21:56:21 <chaos95>	Oracle989: also playmobil if i'm not mistaken
Mar 10 21:56:31 <Kizul>	...I like all three of those.
Mar 10 21:56:37 *	kitten wiggles eyebrows
Mar 10 21:56:42 <sean>	kizul is an 8 year old
Mar 10 21:56:42 <phyphor>	sean: English is a bastard of a language
Mar 10 21:56:50 <Kizul>	Roseart colored pencils have the most FANTASTIC Oreo cookie brown, yo.
Mar 10 21:56:52 <sean>	phyphor: it isnt, though
Mar 10 21:56:55 <chaos95>	wait, I am mistaken
Mar 10 21:56:59 <chaos95>	heh
Mar 10 21:57:00 <Kizul>	You can't get them from Crayolas!
Mar 10 21:57:15 <phyphor>	sean: then explain how both "cactus" and "octopus" have *3* valid plural forms
Mar 10 21:57:29 <phyphor>	explain why both "flammable" and "inflammable" mean the same thing
Mar 10 21:57:34 <sean>	phyphor: they do in other languages too, you know
Mar 10 21:57:40 <phyphor>	expalin why "peating" isn't just saying something once
Mar 10 21:57:47 <sean>	phyphor: because flammable and inflammable meant the same thing in latin too
Mar 10 21:57:47 <chaos95>	octopodes
Mar 10 21:57:48 <Bucket>	The correct plural is octopuses
Mar 10 21:57:53 <phyphor>	the language is terrible
Mar 10 21:58:06 <sean>	phyphor: "peating" would have nothing to do with english being a "bastard"
Mar 10 21:58:16 <phyphor>	it's because enflame -> inflammable -> peoplemight get this wrong
Mar 10 21:58:28 <sean>	phyphor: no it isnt
Mar 10 21:58:40 <sean>	hold on
Mar 10 21:58:41 <Bucket>	but I don't have hands! :(
Mar 10 21:58:45 <Kizul>	UNflammable. \o/
Mar 10 21:58:46 <chaos95>	'tis but a scratch
Mar 10 21:59:13 <sean>	inflammable comes from latin in (on) + flammare (to set on fire)
Mar 10 21:59:22 <sean>	and, well, abilis, which is "able to"
Mar 10 21:59:23 <phyphor>	yeah
Mar 10 21:59:36 <sean>	nothing to do with disparate languages combining
Mar 10 22:00:04 <phyphor>	no, but the fact that "in-" is understood to be the negation *is* to do with disparate languages
Mar 10 22:00:16 <sean>	no, because in meaning not comes from latin too
Mar 10 22:00:18 <sean>	see: insanus
Mar 10 22:01:44 <sean>	English isn't really that unique a language.  interesting in a few ways, but not really a particularly illogical language
Mar 10 22:01:55 <sean>	its got its things.
Mar 10 22:03:50 <sean>	the repeat thing...re means "again" and "peto" means attack.  A non-re version of repeat is "petition"
Mar 10 22:04:04 <sean>	languages change over time...all languages, not just english, and forms and whole words are lost
Mar 10 22:04:14 <sean>	petition sorta lost it's "attacking" character
Mar 10 22:04:46 <sean>	became more of a beseeching
Mar 10 22:05:06 <sean>	these things happen in all languages
Mar 10 22:05:16 <phyphor>	right
Mar 10 22:05:24 <phyphor>	and that's what's happnign with -phobia
Mar 10 22:05:40 <sean>	well, homophobia was coined
Mar 10 22:05:40 <phyphor>	it's losing it's "fear" character and become more of a "hated" thing
Mar 10 22:05:44 <phyphor>	yes
Mar 10 22:05:51 <sean>	and a specific person coined it, knowing it wasnt the best coining
Mar 10 22:06:25 <IceKarma>	you know what, the "original" meaning of words is irrelevant
Mar 10 22:06:30 <phyphor>	"good enough"
Mar 10 22:06:31 <IceKarma>	what matters is how they're interpreted now
Mar 10 22:06:36 <phyphor>	all words were neologisms at once point
Mar 10 22:06:52 <sean>	IceKarma: well, original is irrelevant, sure.  im fine with words changing
Mar 10 22:06:55 <IceKarma>	phyphor, as a linguist? *wacky* ones, at that
Mar 10 22:07:01 <sean>	i think they should change naturally and without political motivation
Mar 10 22:07:11 <IceKarma>	phyphor, "nest" comes from "where the bird sits"
Mar 10 22:07:22 <IceKarma>	phyphor, and that's fairly straightfowrard
Mar 10 22:07:26 <sean>	i think homophobia perpetrates the myth that people hate gays because they're afraid of being gay.
Mar 10 22:07:36 <sean>	which is a distressingly commonmyth amongst liberals
Mar 10 22:07:59 <phyphor>	I thought it was that they were afraid of being discovered that they're gay
Mar 10 22:08:03 <IceKarma>	sean, if I had a nickel for every time someone rampantly homophobic subsequently came out...
Mar 10 22:08:10 <sean>	phyphor: well, similar
Mar 10 22:08:21 <sean>	IceKarma: well, it happens, sure
Mar 10 22:08:24 <sean>	reaction formation and all that
Mar 10 22:08:29 <Oracle989>	IceKarma: You'd have at least a few bucks!
Mar 10 22:08:41 <sean>	IceKarma: but most homophobes hate gays because it's what their church says to do
Mar 10 22:09:02 <sean>	or other social/cultural reasons
Mar 10 22:09:22 <sean>	The vast majority of people are not gay
Mar 10 22:09:35 <Buckley>	can anyone say why one of these is five dollars more than the other http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148561 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148626
Mar 10 22:09:55 <Buckley>	they have the same timing, voltage, and speed
Mar 10 22:10:00 <Buckley>	one is black
Mar 10 22:10:15 <chaos95>	IceKarma: have you read Anathem?
Mar 10 22:10:22 <phyphor>	sean: IIRC there is some evidence (weasel words, I know) that suggest that the rampant homophobia and the intrinsic belief that baing gay "is a choice" is because many of them *are gay* (or bisexual) and have to repress it
Mar 10 22:10:52 <phyphor>	and they believe that because they repress it, everyone feels that way, and it's only those who choose not to repress it are "choosing to be gay"
Mar 10 22:11:01 <sean>	phyphor: sure, perhaps with some of them
Mar 10 22:11:36 <sean>	but say half of the US is uncomfortable with gay people (maybe a few years ago).  Would you say half the US population is repressing being gay?
Mar 10 22:11:39 <phyphor>	also, I'm not sure that the majority of people are exactly, purely, 100% definitely straight
Mar 10 22:11:53 <sean>	I'm pretty sure they are.
Mar 10 22:12:00 <sean>	I dont take the kinsey scale seriously
Mar 10 22:12:07 <phyphor>	I'd argue that it's more likelyt hat we're closer to 100% being not entirely straight
Mar 10 22:12:38 <Froward>	u don't believe in the Kinsey scale.  But it believes in you!!!
Mar 10 22:12:44 <phyphor>	also, gender is bullshit, and sexuality is therefore complicated and shouldn't be extrapolated past "do you find any particualr person attractive"
Mar 10 22:13:14 <sean>	its pretty useful to know if someone likes dudes or chicks
Mar 10 22:13:25 <sean>	if youre trying to set them up or something
Mar 10 22:13:28 <phyphor>	only if you think "dudes and chicks" is an important distinction
Mar 10 22:13:43 <sean>	itd be silly to say "do you like them?" "no, i like the ones iwth boobs" "GASP that's SEXIST!"
Mar 10 22:14:06 <phyphor>	sean: even if you like women it's facile to assume you like all women and no men
Mar 10 22:14:17 <phyphor>	it's not sexist, that's a bullshit strawman argument
Mar 10 22:14:25 <phyphor>	nobody's claiming it's sexist
Mar 10 22:14:28 <sean>	no, but i like all attractive women
Mar 10 22:14:37 <phyphor>	when it's rainign it's raining
Mar 10 22:14:51 <phyphor>	by definition if you find them attractive then they're attractive to you
Mar 10 22:14:52 <sean>	within a certain range and with a god personality, and without any damning flaws about them
Mar 10 22:14:59 <sean>	with those caveats, i like all women
Mar 10 22:15:01 <phyphor>	that's hardly anything informative
Mar 10 22:15:15 <phyphor>	deine "good personaliity"
Mar 10 22:15:21 <phyphor>	define "range of attractiveness"
Mar 10 22:15:25 <phyphor>	define "flaws"
Mar 10 22:15:28 <sean>	age range
Mar 10 22:15:31 <sean>	is what i meant to say
Mar 10 22:15:35 <Froward>	Use absolute and objective terms
Mar 10 22:15:41 <Froward>	No fudging now
Mar 10 22:15:42 <Bucket>	"No Fudging Now" would make a good name for a band.
Mar 10 22:15:50 <Froward>	Only raw stats
Mar 10 22:16:02 <sean>	phyphor: regardless, every person i find sexually attractive has XY chromosomes
Mar 10 22:16:05 <phyphor>	Froward: it's not quite like that
Mar 10 22:16:10 <Froward>	Otherwise Kinsey was right and almost everyone is a lil gay
Mar 10 22:16:10 <phyphor>	sean: bullshit
Mar 10 22:16:11 <Bucket>	***INTERNET BULLSHIT DETECTED***
Mar 10 22:16:16 <Froward>	These are the steaks
Mar 10 22:16:19 <sean>	and if they don't--don't know if this has happened--then they look VERY strongly like they would
Mar 10 22:16:26 <sean>	shit, XX
Mar 10 22:16:26 <phyphor>	sean: you do *not* carry a DNA testing kit around with you
Mar 10 22:16:27 <sean>	whatever
Mar 10 22:16:28 <Bucket>	Let's go ride bikes!
Mar 10 22:16:33 <sean>	haha did i decloset myself?
Mar 10 22:16:59 <Froward>	Yup welcome to the clan
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Mar 10 22:17:04 <phyphor>	sean: no, you've just shown that, like most people trying to use sex chromosoeoms to make a point, that you don't know shit about the subject
Mar 10 22:17:07 <phyphor>	sex is not a binary
Mar 10 22:17:10 <phyphor>	gender is not a binary
Mar 10 22:17:18 <sean>	Hmm.
Mar 10 22:17:31 <phyphor>	sex chromosomes isn't a perfect match for sex phenotype isn't a perfect match for gender
Mar 10 22:17:34 <Stereo>	given those, why should attraction be?
Mar 10 22:17:43 <phyphor>	Stereo: exactly
Mar 10 22:17:44 *	Bucket takes notes.
Mar 10 22:17:46 <Buckley>	is it better to get one big hdd or multiple smaller ones?
Mar 10 22:17:55 <phyphor>	sean: there are, what, 7 billion people on the planet?
Mar 10 22:18:01 <sean>	yeah
Mar 10 22:18:07 <Froward>	Stereo: I'm attracted to you on prime number dates
Mar 10 22:18:20 <phyphor>	are you saying that of the about 3.5 billion dudes there's not one that you've thought "huh, that's attractive" about?
Mar 10 22:18:20 <Stereo>	frowardd: like 3/11?
Mar 10 22:18:21 <Buckley>	and by smaller i mean multiple 1tb drives
Mar 10 22:18:25 <sean>	Froward: which calendar though
Mar 10 22:18:51 <phyphor>	and of the 3.5 billion "chicks", cut out those of the wrong age, that's still, what over 1 billion women and you'd find them all attractive?
Mar 10 22:18:56 <sean>	phyphor: intellectually knowing they follow the criteria to be attractive in my culture, yes
Mar 10 22:19:00 <sean>	brad pitt is handsome
Mar 10 22:19:04 <sean>	personal attraction, no
Mar 10 22:19:10 <Froward>	Stereo: another 40 minutes and I'm gonna have some feelings to confess
Mar 10 22:19:34 <sean>	furtively looking at them across the room becuase they're just so cute, no.  Wanting to fuck them, no.
Mar 10 22:19:45 <Stereo>	froward: unfortunately I'm only attracted to you on composite dates.  it's one of those star crossed problems
Mar 10 22:19:49 <sean>	assumign these 3.5 billion people are indisputably male in all measures
Mar 10 22:20:10 <phyphor>	"all measures"?
Mar 10 22:20:21 <phyphor>	the only measure that counts - they consider themselves male
Mar 10 22:20:38 <sean>	well, that only measure is just one
Mar 10 22:20:44 <sean>	im assuming the other ones
Mar 10 22:20:53 <sean>	sexually male
Mar 10 22:21:10 <sean>	cis, penis, no vagina, no transitioned, XY
Mar 10 22:21:14 <Froward>	Ah the Dingus test. How much Dingus makes a man
Mar 10 22:21:31 <sean>	I ain't arguing that transmen arent men
Mar 10 22:21:33 <Froward>	What if they fail any of those tests
Mar 10 22:21:40 <phyphor>	interestingly there's a dude on reddit who posted that they found out they're XX
Mar 10 22:21:40 <Froward>	What are those people then?
Mar 10 22:21:43 <chaos95>	THEN THEY ARE WOMEN
Mar 10 22:21:47 <sean>	im just assuming fo rthis hypothetically, we're not cnsidering them
Mar 10 22:21:55 <Froward>	I'm not
Mar 10 22:21:56 <Bucket>	I'm not one to inject logic into a situation, i don't even know what a situation is
Mar 10 22:21:59 <sean>	if we consider them, its possible i could be attracted to them, who knows
Mar 10 22:22:01 <phyphor>	born with a penis, assigend male at birth, has relations with women, has a beard, but is XX
Mar 10 22:22:02 <Froward>	These people exist
Mar 10 22:22:09 <chaos95>	pronouns: Xe/Xis
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Mar 10 22:22:30 <phyphor>	They only found they were XX bvecause they went in for an unrelated DNA test for something else
Mar 10 22:23:12 <chaos95>	the aspects of gender that manifest physiologically are only relevant when it comes to reproduction
Mar 10 22:23:19 <phyphor>	If it's all about the genitalia what about, say, Buck Angel?
Mar 10 22:23:32 <sean>	everyone who is penis-no-vagina-cis-masculine...ive never been attracted to any of them
Mar 10 22:23:58 <sean>	as far as i know, everyone i have been attracted to is vagina-no-penis-cis-feminine-xx
Mar 10 22:24:00 <Stereo>	anyway, if you draw the spectrum of gender presentation, doesn't being attracted to more than 1 person imply that you're not straight
Mar 10 22:24:10 <phyphor>	you can't know about chromosomes
Mar 10 22:24:26 <sean>	phyphor: "as far as i know"
Mar 10 22:24:39 <Stereo>	only the 2 people at the ends can be straight, and only if they're only attracted to each other
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Mar 10 22:25:02 <sean>	gender presentation?  I dont count that
Mar 10 22:25:05 <chaos95>	I am a middle class, 18-39, caucasian heterosexual cis male. I really can't complain. Time for another latte.
Mar 10 22:25:17 <sean>	I could date a "tomboy".  they can be cute.  why not?
Mar 10 22:25:27 <sean>	i do like the classic girl look though
Mar 10 22:25:54 <sean>	you know, the classic one.  no, the other classic one.  no, too classic.  yeah, that's the one. mid sixties classic.
Mar 10 22:26:35 <sean>	chaos95: its amazing that you can span 2 decades like that
Mar 10 22:26:37 <Froward>	*sets up slide projector and felt board* I hope everyone's ready for my *inflates giant penis decoration * GENDER PRESENTATION
Mar 10 22:26:51 <chaos95>	sean: like Patti Boyd?
Mar 10 22:27:06 <sean>	hehe
Mar 10 22:27:07 <sean>	In 2012 the Associated Press Style Book was revised to advise against using non-clinical words with the suffix -phobia, including homophobia, in "political and social contexts." AP Deputy Standards Editor Dave Minthorn said the word homophobia suggests a severe mental disorder, and that it could be substituted with "anti-gay" or similar phrasing.[110][111] The AP's decision was criticized in some media outlets,
Mar 10 22:27:07 <sean>	 especially those in the LGBT ...
Mar 10 22:27:07 <sean>	... area,[112] who argued that homophobia did not necessarily have to be interpreted in a strict clinical sense.
Mar 10 22:27:39 <sean>	patti boyd, yes.  perfect mid 60s girl
Mar 10 22:27:57 <Froward>	I'm heterophobic. They just roll right off my skin.
Mar 10 22:28:02 <sean>	did you see the beatles movie she was in?  john was singing to her.  with that little cute tie.  ties on girls is very attractive
Mar 10 22:28:25 <Froward>	what about short hair
Mar 10 22:28:40 <phyphor>	sean: so you find some tomboys attractive, and people who wear ties
Mar 10 22:28:43 <phyphor>	...
Mar 10 22:28:44 <Bucket>	[The bottom drops out.]
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Mar 10 22:29:00 <phyphor>	buit you're *definitely* *100%* *no-questions* straight
Mar 10 22:29:04 <sean>	phyphor: girls who wear ties.  increases their femininity
Mar 10 22:29:14 <sean>	phyphor: yes?
Mar 10 22:29:22 *	Cthuloops gives bucket a cough drop
Mar 10 22:29:23 *	Bucket is now carrying a cough drop, but dropped Cthuloops.
Mar 10 22:29:25 <Froward>	Man you've got a whole lil fortress built up
Mar 10 22:29:29 <sean>	You have strange standards.
Mar 10 22:29:39 <phyphor>	apparently
Mar 10 22:29:40 <Bucket>	Indubitably!
Mar 10 22:29:45 <sean>	and i said i dont usually find tomboys attractive, but i could
Mar 10 22:30:12 <phyphor>	how dpo you know what parts they're packing until you're in a situation when you're about to get intimate?
Mar 10 22:30:17 <phyphor>	it's just ...
Mar 10 22:30:28 <phyphor>	this is one of those subjects I find absolutely counfounding
Mar 10 22:30:34 <sean>	phyphor: http://www.themortonreport.com/uploads/pics/Harrison_and_Pattie_Boyd_from_A_Hard_Day's_Night.png
Mar 10 22:30:45 <phyphor>	and I'm not picking on you sean, I've had similar subjects with someone who was *adamant* they were 100% pure lesbian
Mar 10 22:30:50 <sean>	you dont think the girl on the right is so much cuter with that tie?  what about her is masculine?
Mar 10 22:31:09 <sean>	you make it sound like a tie is a beard
Mar 10 22:31:12 <sean>	or a tie is a penis
Mar 10 22:31:27 <sean>	if i like a girl's pair of pans, does that make me not entirely 100% straight?
Mar 10 22:31:31 <sean>	pants*
Mar 10 22:31:41 <sean>	but it isnt the 1800s anymore.  girls do wear pants.
Mar 10 22:31:46 <Aaeriele>	this is a very odd conversation
Mar 10 22:31:53 <phyphor>	I'm just saying that you appear to already accept that gender trappings aren't all that
Mar 10 22:32:05 <sean>	i saw it once!  just today!  A girl, out in broad daylight, wearing pants.
Mar 10 22:32:09 <sean>	Naturally I threw rocks at her.
Mar 10 22:32:24 <chaos95>	I like a nice pair of pans
Mar 10 22:32:30 <sean>	phyphor: apparently you think gender is based entirely off representation.  im no lumberjack myself.
Mar 10 22:32:42 <phyphor>	no, I thnk gender is bullshit
Mar 10 22:32:53 <phyphor>	like I've said pretty much consistenly
Mar 10 22:33:22 <sean>	phyphor: well you think its a social constuct, no?
Mar 10 22:33:35 <phyphor>	I think it's bullshit
Mar 10 22:33:36 <sean>	Aaeriele: do you disagree with ties being penises?
Mar 10 22:34:12 <Cthuloops>	I need cough syrup but I'm too sick to drive
Mar 10 22:34:15 <permagreen>	Most ties don't fit too well in vaginas
Mar 10 22:34:17 <Cthuloops>	this is unaccceptable.
Mar 10 22:34:21 <Cthuloops>	I'm a lumberjack
Mar 10 22:34:23 <Cthuloops>	what's going on here
Mar 10 22:34:24 <Bucket>	YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH
Mar 10 22:34:27 <chaos95>	permagreen: have you ever tried?
Mar 10 22:34:32 <Cthuloops>	I fried eggs in bacon grease earlier
Mar 10 22:34:32 <impracticaldesign>	What? I was under the impression that ties were, in fact, penises. Fuck. This explains so much.
Mar 10 22:34:36 <Cthuloops>	I'll fight you
Mar 10 22:34:45 <Lhyzz>	sean: I got a surprise for you: some women have beards!
Mar 10 22:34:46 <permagreen>	chaos95, you haven't?
Mar 10 22:34:55 <chaos95>	permagreen: I am texting my wife as we speak
Mar 10 22:35:07 <permagreen>	Science thanks you
Mar 10 22:35:15 <Lhyzz>	Cthuloops: that's okay
Mar 10 22:35:20 <sean>	Lhyzz: I got a surprise for you: I've never indicated once that I believed otherwise, and in fact have been talking constantly about how transwomen are women (as an example)
Mar 10 22:35:31 <sean>	also, damn, what's that religion?
Mar 10 22:35:32 <Lhyzz>	Cthuloops: can you tell me about your sleep schedule?
Mar 10 22:35:38 <sean>	that forbids you from shaving.  crap
Mar 10 22:35:38 <Cthuloops>	I'm delirious with the fevering
Mar 10 22:35:43 <phyphor>	trans women are women, but not the subsetof women that sean knowingly fancies
Mar 10 22:35:44 <sean>	it's in india
Mar 10 22:35:47 <Cthuloops>	I slept 16 hours yesterday/this morning
Mar 10 22:36:17 <Cthuloops>	I napped for an hour around 4pm
Mar 10 22:36:28 <phyphor>	sean: the one where that cis woman was photoes and put on reddit and started off with mockery before being shut down by "SJWs"?
Mar 10 22:36:33 <Lhyzz>	sean: I'm sorry, I must have misinterpreted you. You were saying something about ties, and penises?
Mar 10 22:36:37 <Lhyzz>	I'll listen quietly.
Mar 10 22:36:38 <Bucket>	http://illlistenquietly.tumblr.com/
Mar 10 22:36:38 <chaos95>	"Hi darling, the internet wants you to stick a necktie up your nethers. Please send photos. Thx ♡"
Mar 10 22:36:40 <Aaeriele>	You're probably thinking of Sikhism.
Mar 10 22:36:45 <sean>	Sikh women often have beards!
Mar 10 22:36:59 <sean>	it's not even a gender thing, it's just their religion forbids shaving
Mar 10 22:37:08 <sean>	thanks Aaeriele
Mar 10 22:37:28 <Lhyzz>	sean: Are ties penises?
Mar 10 22:37:35 <sean>	Lhyzz: Yes, dammit.
Mar 10 22:37:37 <phyphor>	but not cutting nails, which I was curious about
Mar 10 22:37:39 <Cthuloops>	Mp
Mar 10 22:37:42 <sean>	That's what phyphor said.
Mar 10 22:37:43 <Lhyzz>	sean: ah, okay. Got it.
Mar 10 22:37:48 <phyphor>	I did?
Mar 10 22:37:48 <Lhyzz>	sean: what religion are you?
Mar 10 22:37:48 <Bucket>	I'm a casually devout christian muslim sikh hindu shinto buddhist confucist fundamentalist.
Mar 10 22:37:54 <impracticaldesign>	Darn. I expected http://illlistenquietly.tumblr.com/ to be a real thing lol
Mar 10 22:37:57 <sean>	Lhyzz: Freudist.
Mar 10 22:38:00 <Cthuloops>	Arm bars, on the other hand
Mar 10 22:38:02 <Cthuloops>	Dicks
Mar 10 22:38:02 <phyphor>	sean: in what crazy universe are you broadcasting from?
Mar 10 22:38:04 <Lhyzz>	sean: cool, cool.
Mar 10 22:38:27 <sean>	illli combination sucks.
Mar 10 22:38:36 <Lhyzz>	sean: He was a Jew, you know. I'll just be back here. Quietly.
Mar 10 22:38:43 <sean>	Lhyzz: okay?
Mar 10 22:38:50 <chaos95>	Lhyzz: wat
Mar 10 22:38:51 <Lhyzz>	sean: Just offering nuggests of information.
Mar 10 22:38:54 <permagreen>	Bucket, remember chaos95 darling
Mar 10 22:38:55 <Bucket>	Okay, permagreen, remembering ""Hi darling, the internet wants you to stick a necktie up your nethers. Please send photos. Thx ♡"".
Mar 10 22:38:58 <Lhyzz>	chaos95: It's a long story.
Mar 10 22:39:05 <sean>	nuggets of information everyone knows?
Mar 10 22:39:07 <Cthuloops>	There are too many things going on and it's making me want to die
Mar 10 22:39:13 <Lhyzz>	oh sorry, I'll try to think of some better trivia
Mar 10 22:39:20 <impracticaldesign>	What the heck is a freudist? Lol
Mar 10 22:39:31 <sean>	impracticaldesign: it's when you beleive everything is a penis
Mar 10 22:39:34 <Lhyzz>	sean: Did you know spider's blood is clear?
Mar 10 22:39:38 <sean>	that cigar?  totally a penis.
Mar 10 22:39:53 <impracticaldesign>	"All hail my mother's genitalia, from which all my problems subconsciously stem."
Mar 10 22:40:04 <sean>	if youre sexually attracted to a woman wearing a tie, you're really gay, because that tie is a penis.
Mar 10 22:40:10 <Lhyzz>	I'm just trying to gauge how obscure my nuggets need to be.
Mar 10 22:40:19 <impracticaldesign>	Bucket, remember sean tie
Mar 10 22:40:20 <Bucket>	Okay, impracticaldesign, remembering "if youre sexually attracted to a woman wearing a tie, you're really gay, because that tie is a penis.".
Mar 10 22:40:21 <Lhyzz>	sean: is this what you've been alluding to all night?
Mar 10 22:40:27 <Aaeriele>	billygoat: stopword penis
Mar 10 22:40:28 <billygoat>	Okay, next person to say 'penis' gets kickbanned.
Mar 10 22:40:35 <chaos95>	Bucket, remember impracticaldesign stem
Mar 10 22:40:36 <Bucket>	Okay, chaos95, remembering ""All hail my mother's genitalia, from which all my problems subconsciously stem."".
Mar 10 22:40:42 <Lhyzz>	So, wait, if a woman wears a pen15, that makes her a man?
Mar 10 22:40:59 <chaos95>	pen15? what is this, grade 5?
Mar 10 22:41:01 <phyphor>	wow
Mar 10 22:41:09 <Cthuloops>	You're confusing gender and sex. you're fired
Mar 10 22:41:10 <Lhyzz>	Aaeriele set a stopword.
Mar 10 22:41:10 <dngor>	There are at least two schools of philosophy: Yes, and no.
Mar 10 22:41:11 <arble>	chaos95: try it and see
Mar 10 22:41:12 <phyphor>	Lhyzz: that's ...
Mar 10 22:41:12 <sean>	chaos95: what do you think she--no, no, that's goading you.
Mar 10 22:41:18 <chaos95>	Lhyzz: I know :P
Mar 10 22:41:26 <Lhyzz>	I'm just trying to figure out what you guys are saying.
Mar 10 22:41:31 <phyphor>	Lhyzz: yeah, and so evading tat stop-word is bad behaviour
Mar 10 22:41:35 <chaos95>	Lhyzz: I was trying to provoke someone else into saying it instead
Mar 10 22:41:41 <Lhyzz>	phyphor: I'll kick myself
Mar 10 22:41:44 <--	Lhyzz has kicked Lhyzz from #xkcd (Lhyzz)
Mar 10 22:41:44 <sean>	Lhyzz: that whole tie thing is me makign fun o phyphor you know.
Mar 10 22:41:45 <Bucket>	S.W.A.L.K
Mar 10 22:41:48 <phyphor>	chaos95: that's also bad behaviour
Mar 10 22:41:49 -->	Lhyzz (lhyzz@hide-6A828967.peeron.com) has joined #xkcd
Mar 10 22:41:49 ---	ChanServ gives channel operator status to Lhyzz
Mar 10 22:41:59 <Lhyzz>	Thank you, Lhyzz. You have shown me the way.
Mar 10 22:42:08 <phyphor>	sean: that whole tie thing is you setting up a strawman attack, and then attacking it
Mar 10 22:42:11 <phyphor>	it's not you making fun of me
Mar 10 22:42:16 <arble>	Thanks, Lhyzz. Thyzz.
Mar 10 22:42:19 <arble>	write that down
Mar 10 22:42:20 *	Bucket accidentally burns the paper.
Mar 10 22:42:39 <phyphor>	arble: do you want to thank ants? Because that's how you thank ants!
Mar 10 22:42:48 <phyphor>	arble: what is that? a thank you for ants?
Mar 10 22:42:53 <impracticaldesign>	Why not just use other words? Dick, donger, dong, and squirting snake are all still up for grabs.
Mar 10 22:42:56 <Lhyzz>	Hmm, nothing in the rules about stopwords :/
Mar 10 22:43:00 <Lhyzz>	Guess I kicked myself for nothing.
Mar 10 22:43:01 <sean>	phyphor: well, no, it's gentle fun.  I do thin that you're a bit extreminist about the kinsey scale, and with gender and sex both not existing
Mar 10 22:43:03 <Lhyzz>	I'm such a fascist.
Mar 10 22:43:07 <Cthuloops>	I'm still conufsed as to why Lhyzz wanted to know about my sleeping habits
Mar 10 22:43:12 <Cthuloops>	because lumberjack?
Mar 10 22:43:21 <sean>	phyphor: that's not really soething I can argue about directly though
Mar 10 22:43:23 <Lhyzz>	phyphor: I thought he was having a Socratic debate with himself
Mar 10 22:43:24 <Cthuloops>	as a lumberjack you actually get up before the sun so
Mar 10 22:43:30 <impracticaldesign>	Penis
Mar 10 22:43:31 ---	billygoat sets ban on *!uid151113@*.tooting.irccloud.com
Mar 10 22:43:31 <--	billygoat has kicked impracticaldesign from #xkcd (Jackpot!!!)
Mar 10 22:43:32 <Bucket>	GOOOOOAAAAT!
Mar 10 22:43:34 <dngor>	Don Quixoady
Mar 10 22:43:34 <phyphor>	gender doesn't exist, sex sort of exists but isn't a binary. and sexuality is complicated and putting people in boxes doesn't often help
Mar 10 22:43:37 <Lhyzz>	Cthuloops: Yeah. Monty Python reference.
Mar 10 22:43:53 *	Cthuloops one thumb up
Mar 10 22:44:36 <phyphor>	poor impracticaldesign :(
Mar 10 22:44:37 <Lhyzz>	phyphor: I used to think gender didn't exist, but it seems like maybe it does? Gender roles are a social construct, but gender identity seems to be a thing.
Mar 10 22:44:39 <sean>	phyphor: I guess my argument is that you're really putting everyone into many more, smaller boxes
Mar 10 22:44:48 <phyphor>	Lhyzz: unicorns are a thing
Mar 10 22:44:49 *	Cthuloops falls down
Mar 10 22:44:53 <sean>	gender identity is a real thing.
Mar 10 22:44:55 <arble>	like those monks in H2G2 with the astounding mental powers
Mar 10 22:44:58 <phyphor>	Lhyzz: doesn't make them "real"
Mar 10 22:45:03 <chaos95>	I used to think gender didn't exist, but then I took an arrow to the knee
Mar 10 22:45:10 <phyphor>	and unicorns can even be properly described
Mar 10 22:45:13 <chaos95>	phyphor: what is real?
Mar 10 22:45:19 <phyphor>	without getting tautological or self-referential
Mar 10 22:45:21 <Lhyzz>	chaos95: is that where you were keeping your gender at the time?
Mar 10 22:45:23 <chaos95>	phyphor: how do we define real?
Mar 10 22:45:31 <dngor>	Even if gender exists, it has no useful interface for social protocols.
Mar 10 22:45:33 <chaos95>	Lhyzz: yeah like that alien in rura penthe
Mar 10 22:45:39 <arble>	numbers with no imaginary component
Mar 10 22:46:15 <sean>	At first I thoguht H2G2 was Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Mar 10 22:46:18 <sean>	but it is not.
Mar 10 22:46:25 <Cthuloops>	Do you ever think about how fucked up the vietnam war was
Mar 10 22:46:32 <arble>	it is
Mar 10 22:46:36 <dngor>	Gender as people of gender wish it to be is totally decoupled from presentation, so there's no way to behave politely in its regard until something announces it.  Like, we all wear HI, MY GENDER IS... tags, or something.
Mar 10 22:46:54 <Lhyzz>	well I guess nothing is real, since this is all a computer simulation
Mar 10 22:47:02 <phyphor>	dngor: quite
Mar 10 22:47:12 <Lhyzz>	i mean, like, we're all just little beeps and boops in the big cosmic circuit board
Mar 10 22:47:18 <sean>	I'm skeptical about "third gender" "fluid gender" etc stuff because science doesnt seem to support it
Mar 10 22:47:20 <Lhyzz>	sorry, I'm just CLUELESS about computers
Mar 10 22:47:28 <dymaxion>	we are all Bucket
Mar 10 22:47:28 <phyphor>	sean: I ... what?
Mar 10 22:47:34 <chaos95>	Lhyzz: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yB5G0QwRhWg
Mar 10 22:47:40 <sean>	phyphor: hi
Mar 10 22:47:40 <phyphor>	sean: science says very little about gender
Mar 10 22:47:46 <Cthuloops>	bucket: inventory
Mar 10 22:47:47 <Bucket>	
ACTION contains a colour out of space, Cthuloops's secrets, 8 fifty-pound bags of salt, a sense of well-being, cocoa puffs, the gay agenda, The Rise and Fall of the Roman Vampire, a horny porny vampire, a breakfast burrito, inflection, infection, swine flu, a golden shower, gender fluid, chirping background crickets, greg, a naked singularity wearing a bathrobe, time dilation, enough alcohol to kill a donkey, and a cough d
Mar 10 22:47:50 <sean>	phyphor: well, yeah, so no evidence for it yet.
Mar 10 22:47:58 <phyphor>	certainly it''s scientific truth that sex isn't binary
Mar 10 22:48:00 <sean>	I dont trust self-reporting
Mar 10 22:48:08 <sean>	phyphor: erm.
Mar 10 22:48:13 <Science>	sean, as far as I'm aware this is not an area of particularly intense study. It seems absurd to me that your immediate response to someone asking you to respect their identity would be "I don't believe in you"
Mar 10 22:48:18 <sean>	I think gender and sex both revolve around a central binary.
Mar 10 22:48:23 <chaos95>	if real is simply what you can smell or taste or touch, then both ties and penises are real
Mar 10 22:48:26 <phyphor>	certainly it's scientific truth that sexual genotype and phenotype don't match
Mar 10 22:48:30 ---	billygoat removes ban on *!uid151113@*.tooting.irccloud.com
Mar 10 22:48:39 <Science>	sean, you are definitely wrong about that. The science does not support a dichotomy like you present.
Mar 10 22:48:50 <Science>	You can recognize general trends and try to establish a baseline of normal
Mar 10 22:48:52 <Science>	But that's all
Mar 10 22:48:53 -->	impracticaldesign (uid151113@hide-3EC701ED.tooting.irccloud.com) has joined #xkcd
Mar 10 22:49:00 <impracticaldesign>	Aha!
Mar 10 22:49:03 <phyphor>	Science!
Mar 10 22:49:04 <Bucket>	Science is http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3868/shoot_to_thrill_biosensory_.php
Mar 10 22:49:07 <sean>	Science: well i wont say you're wrong, or even that it doesnt exist, really, just...i feel like it's probably all likely manifestations of a similar thing?
Mar 10 22:49:13 <phyphor>	impracticaldesign: try not to do that again :)
Mar 10 22:49:34 <impracticaldesign>	Alright lol. Apparently Billygoat is much more serious than I thought.
Mar 10 22:49:37 <phyphor>	sean: so, you're feelings are more important than science
Mar 10 22:49:37 <Science>	sean, so your response is to tell a person who is struggling with their identity that they are wrong because there isn't any evidence for or against?
Mar 10 22:49:42 <sean>	maybe self-rationalied with different explanations according to who you are and your experiences
Mar 10 22:49:44 <Science>	That's both rude and bad science.
Mar 10 22:49:45 <Lhyzz>	sean: not understanding it doesn't mean it's fair to be skeptical about someone else's self-professed identity.
Mar 10 22:49:51 <phyphor>	but when a person says they feel that their body is wrong that's not enough?
Mar 10 22:50:07 <Lhyzz>	sean: I don't understand it, but I feel like we just have to take people at their word about their own selves.
Mar 10 22:50:09 <sean>	phyphor: eh?  I definitely didnt say that.
Mar 10 22:50:11 <Science>	phyphor, I would argue that no, it is not enough. But it is certainly enough that we ought to be more respectful of the topic.
Mar 10 22:50:14 <Lhyzz>	anything else would be unfair.
Mar 10 22:50:22 <phyphor>	Science: good call
Mar 10 22:50:23 <Bucket>	Thank you for calling Bucket Support!
Mar 10 22:50:50 <Science>	phyphor, and also it's an interesting thing that we should look into more.
Mar 10 22:50:52 <dngor>	Gender works in virtual space so it might be a transhuman construct.  Your presentation is decoupled from the sex of the brain floating in your vat.  We just need to agree on a mapping between whatever the hell that is, and what to agree on calling it.
Mar 10 22:51:09 *	chaos95 gives bucket Captain Kirk's fur coat
Mar 10 22:51:10 *	Bucket is now carrying Captain Kirk's fur coat, but dropped a colour out of space.
Mar 10 22:51:20 <phyphor>	"Gender works in virtual space" - it does?
Mar 10 22:51:20 <sean>	I think I'm saying that these are identities and are very hard to study, and are prone to biases in yoru brain, so maybe how one person feels is the same as another person feels, but they may, for whatever circumstantial reason, identify as different ways
Mar 10 22:51:24 <Science>	dngor, you're first assuming the concept of a "sex of the brain" which is distinct and even harder to define than the already hard to define physical sex
Mar 10 22:51:26 <sean>	of course they still have that same identity
Mar 10 22:51:29 <sean>	just different labels
Mar 10 22:51:37 <impracticaldesign>	Did anybody else completely not understand dngor's message
Mar 10 22:51:41 <sean>	itd be interesting to see what psychology/neurology says
Mar 10 22:51:42 <dngor>	Science: When in doubt, sequence DNA.
Mar 10 22:51:58 <Science>	dngor, yeah sure. Do it and get back to me.
Mar 10 22:52:14 <Aaeriele>	Sorry, I'm trying really hard not to laugh here and mostly failing
Mar 10 22:52:21 <sean>	that is not the same as saying they dont exist
Mar 10 22:52:22 <chaos95>	phyphor: sure it does
Mar 10 22:52:22 <Bucket>	You Betcha.
Mar 10 22:52:29 <phyphor>	out of curiosity who here, other than me, actually knows their genotype?
Mar 10 22:52:32 <chaos95>	phyphor: just look how many penises are floating around in Second Life right now
Mar 10 22:52:37 <sean>	but i still hold a scientific sort of skepticism in general about identity stuff
Mar 10 22:52:44 <phyphor>	chaos95: penes have nothing to do with gender
Mar 10 22:52:52 <phyphor>	floating or otherwise
Mar 10 22:52:53 <chaos95>	phyphor: thatsthejoke.jpg
Mar 10 22:52:53 <Science>	You're still just being rude and unscientific
Mar 10 22:53:04 <tomatosalad>	Fack. http://www.chron.com/news/medical/article/California-lawmakers-near-vote-on-raising-smoking-6881262.php#photo-9582777
Mar 10 22:53:05 <sean>	apologies for being rude, Science
Mar 10 22:53:07 <phyphor>	and if anyone would know ...
Mar 10 22:53:09 <Froward>	I'm trans human as fuck
Mar 10 22:53:20 <sean>	rule one or taling to me: I don't know bullshit, and I speak out of turn
Mar 10 22:53:34 <rcombs>	so usually I see the kansai dialect of japanese translated into the american southern dialect of english
Mar 10 22:53:34 <Science>	Rule one of any community: Fuck that bullshit
Mar 10 22:53:38 <rcombs>	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CdKkc9xW8AEGd_p.jpg:large this is a new one
Mar 10 22:53:50 <Science>	You cannot excuse yourself from social mores.
Mar 10 22:53:54 <Science>	That's not how it works.
Mar 10 22:54:00 <sean>	hmm
Mar 10 22:54:15 <Buckley>	who makes the most reliable power supplies?
Mar 10 22:54:21 <dngor>	Meh.  I'm fine with not making sense.
Mar 10 22:54:31 <sean>	Science: well, just curious, how do you feel about self-diagnosis of psychological diseases?
Mar 10 22:54:33 <arble>	Buckley: PC?
Mar 10 22:54:37 <Buckley>	i grew up knowing pc pwer and cooling to be the standard but they're gone
Mar 10 22:54:38 <Buckley>	yeah
Mar 10 22:54:42 <Buckley>	desktop pc
Mar 10 22:54:46 <chaos95>	I am a sœcular transhumanist
Mar 10 22:54:49 <arble>	I've had no problems at all with this EVGA Supernova G2
Mar 10 22:54:59 <arble>	I press the button and the PC powers on
Mar 10 22:55:02 <arble>	10/10
Mar 10 22:55:11 <impracticaldesign>	chaos95: ooh, two letters really close together. Edgy.
Mar 10 22:55:13 <chaos95>	Buckley: thermaltake
Mar 10 22:55:27 <arble>	my cooler on the CPU is Noctua
Mar 10 22:55:27 <chaos95>	impracticaldesign: alt+q
Mar 10 22:55:44 -->	abzde (~abzde@hide-B262B2FF.subluminal.net) has joined #xkcd
Mar 10 22:55:50 <sean>	I bet chaos95 is so fancy he doesnt even form ellipses with three characters like a real red-blooded american.
Mar 10 22:55:56 <impracticaldesign>	I'm on a phone so I'm sad now because I don't get to be edgy ;_;
Mar 10 22:56:10 <sean>	he's probably one of those weird green-blooded ones.
Mar 10 22:56:13 <Science>	Aaeriele, you're taking the only rational route I think
Mar 10 22:56:35 <impracticaldesign>	Who decided that a single "ellipsis" character was necessary?
Mar 10 22:56:35 <--	loudaslife has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
Mar 10 22:56:44 <Froward>	Wē häve suçh thîngs tø shœw yoū
Mar 10 22:56:50 <sean>	impracticaldesign: the powers that be.  Who are presumably mormons.
Mar 10 22:57:01 <sean>	Thought it was the jews that control the world?  Wrong.  Totally mormons.
Mar 10 22:57:07 <chaos95>	…
Mar 10 22:57:08 <Bucket>	[You hear a sound reminiscent of an elephant stepping on a peanut.]
Mar 10 22:57:14 <Buckley>	corsair was good back in the day
Mar 10 22:57:19 <chaos95>	impracticaldesign: alt+;
Mar 10 22:57:31 <impracticaldesign>	Bucket: how am I supposed to know what that sounds like?
Mar 10 22:57:32 <Bucket>	I do not know.
Mar 10 22:57:32 <chaos95>	Buckley: corsair make keyboards now
Mar 10 22:57:44 <Buckley>	they make everything
Mar 10 22:57:48 <sean>	impracticaldesign: rent an elephant, buy a peanut
Mar 10 22:57:57 <chaos95>	sean: nah man, vice versa
Mar 10 22:58:04 <sean>	the easiest part of this is renting the elephant, because it's impossible to buy a single peanut.
Mar 10 22:58:31 <chaos95>	sean: bollocks, my supermarket has self-serve nuts
Mar 10 22:58:33 <Buckley>	oh holy crap
Mar 10 22:58:44 <Buckley>	build came out to just over $2k
Mar 10 22:58:47 -->	Hobz (~Hobz@hide-208BBE8.ipv6.telus.net) has joined #xkcd
Mar 10 22:58:49 <chaos95>	interestingly (and perhaps freudianly) I almost typed 'self-sever nuts'
Mar 10 22:58:53 <Cthuloops>	"Anti-vaxx mom abandons movement - after all seven of her kids get whooping cough"
Mar 10 22:58:57 <Cthuloops>	wonderful headline
Mar 10 22:59:07 <rcombs>	~what a surprise~
Mar 10 22:59:07 <Hobz>	Oh sweet poetic justice
Mar 10 22:59:15 <chaos95>	those poor kids :(
Mar 10 22:59:17 <sean>	Wasn't there an aids-denialist who died...from AIDS?
Mar 10 22:59:22 <sean>	She had a whole magazine about it too
Mar 10 22:59:28 <chaos95>	sean: paula deen?
Mar 10 22:59:28 <Cthuloops>	probably
Mar 10 22:59:29 <Bucket>	butter
Mar 10 22:59:29 <Bucket>	The potential error is minimal.
Mar 10 22:59:39 <Cthuloops>	Hey, Super Mar 10 is almost over
Mar 10 22:59:40 <rcombs>	meanwhile the FBI has lost the support of senator Lindsey Graham after someone actually explained the situation to him
Mar 10 22:59:43 <Aaeriele>	I just feel sorry for the mom and her kids.
Mar 10 22:59:43 <Cthuloops>	hope it was... super
Mar 10 23:00:03 <impracticaldesign>	p<.05! Only a 5% chance of coincidence!
Mar 10 23:00:12 -->	famine_ (~Faminepul@hide-F5DFD892.tampfl.fios.verizon.net) has joined #xkcd
Mar 10 23:00:36 <sean>	(The AIDS denialism was that HIV causes AIDS, btw)
Mar 10 23:01:14 <impracticaldesign>	I don't think anybody claims that autoimmune deficiency doesn't exist haha
Mar 10 23:01:38 <rcombs>	I wouldn't be surprised if _someone_ was claiming it's a government conspiracy
Mar 10 23:01:43 <sean>	I've heard it said that the drugs that they give HIV patients causes AIDS
Mar 10 23:01:49 <sean>	and they give those drugs in order to kill gay people
Mar 10 23:01:56 <rcombs>	and they all really have—yeah, something like that
Mar 10 23:02:07 <rcombs>	or it's really lupus
Mar 10 23:02:15 <sean>	It's never lupus.
Mar 10 23:02:16 <Bucket>	... except when it is.
Mar 10 23:02:18 <rcombs>	(obviously not the case; it's never lupus)
Mar 10 23:02:22 <sean>	Selena Gomez has lupus.
Mar 10 23:02:25 <Buckley>	i7 4GHz w/ cooler master heatsink, 980 Ti classified (evga), 16GB DDR3 1600 (crucial ballistix), Z97 MSI mb, 512GB M.2 SSD (samsung), 2TB HDD (WD red), 850W PSU (thermaltake), antec p100 w/ three extra 140mm fans
Mar 10 23:02:31 <Buckley>	holy macaroni
Mar 10 23:02:50 <chaos95>	Buckley: yeah that sounds liek about 2k worth
Mar 10 23:02:57 <Buckley>	think that can handle 4k
Mar 10 23:03:02 <impracticaldesign>	It's never Lupus, except: 1) when it is, 2) House, m.d.
Mar 10 23:03:58 <chaos95>	Buckley: yeah
Mar 10 23:04:16 <Buckley>	a noticeable chunk of that is the ssd
Mar 10 23:04:34 <Buckley>	it's the same cost as the cpu
Mar 10 23:04:36 <chaos95>	Buckley: can you get 2x256 instead? :D
Mar 10 23:04:45 <Buckley>	that would be more
Mar 10 23:04:48 <Buckley>	well
Mar 10 23:04:51 <arble>	that's closeish to my PC
Mar 10 23:05:03 <chaos95>	ah ok. There's been points in the past where that kind of combo was cheaper in SSD-land
Mar 10 23:05:23 <chaos95>	and RAID made up for the difference in volume size
Mar 10 23:05:32 <arble>	i5 6600K, MSI 980 Ti, 850W EVGA PSU and the 256GB M.2 from Samsung
Mar 10 23:05:50 <Buckley>	i got this ssd http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA12K3U60461
Mar 10 23:05:53 <arble>	it hasn't given even slight signs of struggling with anything
Mar 10 23:06:44 <Buckley>	they also have like this one http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147399
Mar 10 23:08:17 <sean>	sorry i annoyed the everliving crap out of you people, have a good night <#
Mar 10 23:08:40 <Cthuloops>	wat
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Mar 10 23:08:54 <impracticaldesign>	It's okay! Annoyingness is fine, if it creates a constructive discussion.
Mar 10 23:10:08 <Buckley>	so i could save some money i guess
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Mar 10 23:13:23 <Bucket>	environment variables is http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd560744(WS.10).aspx
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Mar 10 23:21:44 <impracticaldesign>	Bucket, are you okay?
Mar 10 23:21:45 <Bucket>	I'm five by five.
Mar 10 23:22:04 <sammi>	hey i know what that means
Mar 10 23:22:07 <sammi>	4 by 20
Mar 10 23:22:08 <sammi>	<.<
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Mar 10 23:25:23 <Bucket>	a vegetarian is someone who eats Vegeta
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Mar 10 23:26:09 <rcombs>	Buckley: what CPU?
Mar 10 23:27:56 <Aaeriele>	Bucket: forgot how to cat is https://imgur.com/ffgQleM
Mar 10 23:27:57 <Bucket>	Okay, Aaeriele.
Mar 10 23:28:40 <Buckley>	rcombs, 4790K
Mar 10 23:32:23 <Bucket>	roses are dolphins
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Mar 10 23:33:57 <permagreen>	Indeed, my city is known for its dolphin gardens
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Mar 10 23:37:23 <Bucket>	jesus christ is fuckin' metal
Mar 10 23:40:35 -->	Arnelon (Arnelon@hide-C0ABC251.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) has joined #xkcd
Mar 10 23:46:42 <Froward>	http://56.media.tumblr.com/3d73ecc56a5774583382978a6179adf5/tumblr_nzg9s33cWv1tfoucpo1_1280.jpg
Mar 10 23:50:24 <Bucket>	samba is awesome when you have good literature
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Mar 11 00:19:23 *	impracticaldesign calls out into the void of IRC*
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Mar 11 00:22:24 <Bucket>	Mondays are i.imgur.com/DQwdzae.gif
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Mar 11 00:38:39 <ephone>	The fuck is there to do when the power goes out
Mar 11 00:41:49 <snark>	sleep
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Mar 11 00:45:26 <Bucket>	tmm is a pervy creeper
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Mar 11 00:58:10 <bassgoon>	winning a board game isn't fun if you actually strain a friendship...
Mar 11 00:59:05 *	Servicing ident request from 193.163.220.3 as bassgoon
Mar 11 01:00:32 <wao>	is the 'game'
Mar 11 01:00:35 <wao>	game?
Mar 11 01:00:47 <bassgoon>	it's called the resistance
Mar 11 01:00:50 <wao>	impracticaldesign: hello, here is void echo, how I can void to you?
Mar 11 01:01:04 <bassgoon>	I basically started being super immature and obnoxious
Mar 11 01:01:09 <bassgoon>	but it won me the game
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Mar 11 01:01:34 <wao>	btw, what xkcd thinks about http://hackerdome.xyz ?
Mar 11 01:01:47 <wao>	I plan to do hackbase (hacker residency here in Central Europe)
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Mar 11 01:04:44 <Oracle989>	What base are roman numerals?
Mar 11 01:04:45 <mobilelmc>	Hello?
Mar 11 01:05:15 <Hobz>	I think we covered this a while back
Mar 11 01:05:35 <Kliment>	Oracle989: Military base
Mar 11 01:05:54 <Oracle989>	Hobz: Was the answer "It doesn't have one"?
Mar 11 01:06:09 <Hobz>	Oracle989, Hang on, notepad is parsing my #xkcd logfile
Mar 11 01:07:02 <Hobz>	Stiiiill parsing
Mar 11 01:07:43 <Hobz>	The parsing continues...
Mar 11 01:07:43 <Kliment>	Y U no use something other than notepad? notepad++ for example?
Mar 11 01:07:56 <Hobz>	Shhh!  Parsing!
Mar 11 01:09:41 <Hobz>	Yes, you asked the same question on December 23, 2015
Mar 11 01:10:04 <Oracle989>	Aha
Mar 11 01:10:06 <Hobz>	And the answer was that it doesn't really have a base
Mar 11 01:10:15 <Oracle989>	I thought I remembered discussing that at some point
Mar 11 01:10:28 <Oracle989>	But "it has no base" isn't an interesting answer so I figured I'd rehash it
Mar 11 01:10:30 <bhuddah>	good morning.
Mar 11 01:10:31 <Bucket>	I love the smell of #xkcd in the morning
Mar 11 01:10:34 <Hobz>	And then you changed your username to OracleIXXIIIIX
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Mar 11 01:12:41 <bhuddah>	OracleCMLXXXIX
Mar 11 01:13:16 <Oracle989>	bhuddah: No, it's not 989, it's 9 8 9
Mar 11 01:13:28 <Oracle989>	IXVIIIIX
Mar 11 01:13:42 <barometz>	at least put some goddamn dashes in there
Mar 11 01:13:47 <Oracle989>	No
Mar 11 01:13:54 <barometz>	I do not need to wake up to malformed roman numerals
Mar 11 01:13:57 <barometz>	don't make me
Mar 11 01:13:57 <Bucket>	But then how should I compile you?
Mar 11 01:14:13 <barometz>	just add linker
Mar 11 01:14:29 -->	DaMullet_ (DaMullet@hide-91575CC7.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net) has joined #xkcd
Mar 11 01:14:32 <Kliment>	wao: Where are you based?
Mar 11 01:15:15 <Hobz>	Bucket, remember barometz malformed
Mar 11 01:15:16 <Bucket>	Okay, Hobz, remembering "I do not need to wake up to malformed roman numerals".
Mar 11 01:15:36 <--	DaMullet has quit (Ping timeout: 181 seconds)
Mar 11 01:16:36 <impracticaldesign>	Roman numerals are base x, where x = "unpredictable intervals, arithmetic can go fuck itself"
Mar 11 01:16:36 <bhuddah>	Oracle989: the romans don't have the concept of digits other than fingers.
Mar 11 01:16:48 -->	gibigiana (gibigiana@B02433EC.C3CC002F.7BA810B6.IP) has joined #xkcd
Mar 11 01:17:04 <bhuddah>	roman numerals work as good as the imperial system. i wonder why the US doesn't use them.
Mar 11 01:17:45 <Kliment>	wao: Oh, it's your page
Mar 11 01:18:04 <wao>	Kliment: oh, is it, central europe, slovakia, bratislava :)
Mar 11 01:18:07 <impracticaldesign>	Don't bring up the Imperial system. *flashbacks to middle school woodshop*
Mar 11 01:18:31 <Oracle989>	bhuddah: So...they're perfectly adequate for the overwhelming majority of uses, better for a few, and there's no compelling reason to change if you use them?
Mar 11 01:18:50 <barometz>	I would.. disagree with that one
Mar 11 01:18:53 <bhuddah>	Oracle989: i want you to believe that. yes.
Mar 11 01:19:07 <bhuddah>	maybe we can make them wear banners too
Mar 11 01:19:11 <barometz>	roman numerals are a pain in the butt
Mar 11 01:19:44 <Kliment>	wao: You might want to mention that none of this is built yet, and have some timetable for all the planned stuff
Mar 11 01:20:07 <Kliment>	wao: Were you the one with the big dome at Camp last year?
Mar 11 01:20:09 <wao>	Kliment: none of what? hackerdome?
Mar 11 01:20:32 <impracticaldesign>	In my opinion, any system of anything which is less than intuitive needs a good reason, and the Imperial system's reason is "fuck you that's why"
Mar 11 01:20:38 <wao>	Kliment: cccamp2015? no, not me, but I've been in that bigger one :)
Mar 11 01:20:57 <Hobz>	impracticaldesign, Divides into fractions easier
Mar 11 01:21:19 <Kliment>	wao: All the (WIP), (planned) etc shit
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Mar 11 01:22:02 <wao>	Kliment: oh, is it there, on 4th line, I should place it bigger
Mar 11 01:22:06 <Kliment>	wao: My primary concern would be lack of privacy and facilities
Mar 11 01:22:12 <impracticaldesign>	Hobz: not really? If you really, really want to, you can just say 1/12 of a meter? Not that you'd ever have a reason.
Mar 11 01:22:20 <Hobz>	There's a reason I divide my teams into groups of 12, I can get: 1 group of 12, 2 groups of 6, 3 groups of 4, 4 groups of 3, 6 groups of 2, and 12 groups of 1
Mar 11 01:22:25 <wao>	Kliment: what kind of facilities?
Mar 11 01:22:44 <Hobz>	impracticaldesign, You'd have to get into decimals for a standard unit, though
Mar 11 01:22:52 <Kliment>	wao: Toilets, showers, etc
Mar 11 01:23:11 <wao>	Kliment: oh, in the end, it will be house with dome over it :)
Mar 11 01:23:30 <Hobz>	I mean, yes, technically there are decimal feet
Mar 11 01:23:31 <Kliment>	wao: I assume they are shared, if they exist at all, and I assume that with a lot of people coming over and paying essentially nothing there won't be staff to clean them and the people staying for just one day won't give a shit
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Mar 11 01:24:10 <Oracle989>	Hobz: Just have groups of 10, and you can have 1 group of 10, 2 groups of 5, 3 groups of 3.33, 4 groups of 2.5...
Mar 11 01:24:16 <impracticaldesign>	Hobz: even better, you can divide 1 as many ways as you want!
Mar 11 01:24:50 <Kliment>	wao: Also, you REALLY need to a) add more pictures of your thing and b) make it ABSOLUTELY FUCKING CLEAR that the pictures of domes below are not of your thing
Mar 11 01:25:18 <--	mobilelmc has quit (Connection reset by peer)
Mar 11 01:27:29 <Hobz>	impracticaldesign, Oracle989, Integer math, people!
Mar 11 01:27:55 <wao>	Kliment: oh, that's why is it under concepts, but yeah, making it clear would be better
Mar 11 01:27:57 <Hobz>	I can't get 3.33 persons without violating any number of local and federal laws, not to mention the Geneva convention
Mar 11 01:28:14 <wao>	Kliment: well, literaly there will be some facilities, also trying to keep clean stuff, it's all about co-living stuff
Mar 11 01:28:15 <barometz>	Hobz: what SI unit counts people? :P
Mar 11 01:29:12 <Hobz>	If I was in the US in the early 19th century I could wrangle up an appropriate number of negros and maybe, MAYBE, make it work under the 3/5ths rule
Mar 11 01:29:40 <Hobz>	But by any modern standard it's just wong
Mar 11 01:29:43 <Hobz>	wrong*
Mar 11 01:29:43 <relsqui>	Hobz: y'know, even when you're talking *about* the 19th century that's an inappropriate way to refer to people
Mar 11 01:29:44 <Hobz>	shit
Mar 11 01:30:18 <--	alsoFerris has quit (Quit: )
Mar 11 01:30:23 <Hobz>	I...am not entirely sure how to respond to that
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Mar 11 01:31:19 <bhuddah>	*sigh*
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Mar 11 01:32:02 <Oracle989>	relsqui: Yeah, that's implying slaves are people!
Mar 11 01:32:23 <barometz>	what
Mar 11 01:32:24 <ephone>	Well the power came back long enough for me to finish installing windows updates and open a few browser tabs
Mar 11 01:32:40 <relsqui>	...
Mar 11 01:32:41 <Bucket>	[You hear the chime of a cash register.]
Mar 11 01:33:23 <barometz>	ephone: agh, did the power drop in the middle of updates?
Mar 11 01:33:37 <Oracle989>	Moving on to other news, does anyone have a code for Windows 8, Windows 10, or ICBM launch that they could spare?
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Mar 11 01:34:18 <Walther>	Oracle989: wasn't it just a bunch of zeroes for the last one
Mar 11 01:34:36 <Oracle989>	Walther: For a while, yes
Mar 11 01:34:55 <Kliment>	Bucket: remember Hobz Geneva
Mar 11 01:34:55 <Oracle989>	But that's not as funny/scary as you'd think because the launch "code" isn't that important in the process really
Mar 11 01:34:55 <Bucket>	Okay, Kliment, remembering "I can't get 3.33 persons without violating any number of local and federal laws, not to mention the Geneva convention".
Mar 11 01:35:23 <Kliment>	Oracle989: NOt nearly as bad as the bike lock on the UK ones
Mar 11 01:35:38 <ephphatha>	barometz: thankfully no, it seemed to complete that fine
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Mar 11 01:35:56 <ephphatha>	lets see how long it stays up this time
Mar 11 01:36:43 <wao>	Kliment: well, changed, I'll push changes to web, thanks for input! :)
Mar 11 01:36:48 <Kliment>	wao: co-living doesn't work when the vast majority of your visitors are two day tourists who have discovered it's a great free place to stay
Mar 11 01:36:58 <Kliment>	wao: And your structure encourages exactly that
Mar 11 01:37:09 <--	JBlitzen has quit (Connection reset by peer)
Mar 11 01:37:11 <Kliment>	wao: Make stays one week minimum
Mar 11 01:37:21 <wao>	well, one-night crash is acceptable if people pay with work (cleaning for example)
Mar 11 01:37:26 <wao>	hmm
Mar 11 01:37:30 -->	Katrie (Katrie@hide-BB1AA57.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #xkcd
Mar 11 01:37:47 <Kliment>	wao: And yes, pay with work might work, but then you need someone to babysit them
Mar 11 01:37:53 ---	Katrie is now known as grrtrude
Mar 11 01:38:15 <Hobz>	Kliment, what you're describing is the majority of European hostels in the 70's
Mar 11 01:38:15 <wao>	I think it will take time to balance and glue people for long-terms
Mar 11 01:38:18 <Oracle989>	The Bomb is actually armed by inserting a bicycle lock key into the arming switch and turning it through 90 degrees. There is no code which needs to be entered or dual key system to prevent a rogue individual from arming the Bomb.  Nice work, Brits
Mar 11 01:38:30 <Hobz>	Kliment, Sorry, meant wao
Mar 11 01:38:39 <Hobz>	Oh hell, both of you, really
Mar 11 01:38:46 <Oracle989>	Kliment: I'm thinking of building a spin coater.  What should I spin coat with it?
Mar 11 01:39:00 <wao>	Hobz: and it was bad?
Mar 11 01:39:00 <Hobz>	candy!
Mar 11 01:39:21 <Kliment>	Oracle989: I'm thinking you should answer that question before building it
Mar 11 01:39:43 <Hobz>	wao, I have no idea, I wasn't born then, but from my parents stories if there's a high enough turnover rate then there'll be enough new people to work for a couple of days before they figure out that nobody's checking up on them and start slacking off
Mar 11 01:40:08 <Hobz>	And then more new people
Mar 11 01:40:13 <wao>	I dont plan slay people, it about making place sustainable
Mar 11 01:40:22 <Hobz>	I hope you don't
Mar 11 01:40:23 <wao>	(hygienic at least)
Mar 11 01:40:42 <Hobz>	I think Tarantino made a movie about that
Mar 11 01:40:47 <wao>	which one?
Mar 11 01:40:48 <Bucket>	I like the one with the Hello Kitty decal [^.^]
Mar 11 01:40:53 <Oracle989>	Kliment: Nah
Mar 11 01:41:04 <wao>	also, I listed there utopians concept, hackerdome is just small step what I plan next
Mar 11 01:41:06 <Hobz>	wao, Hostel
Mar 11 01:41:09 <wao>	oh
Mar 11 01:41:13 <Oracle989>	It's one of those tools that makes its own uses, I think
Mar 11 01:41:24 <Kliment>	Also yay, it's my birthday
Mar 11 01:41:45 <Oracle989>	Workshop essentials: socket wrench, screwdriver set, hammer, mallet, Dremel, clamps, spin coater
Mar 11 01:41:53 <bhuddah>	happy birthday, Kliment
Mar 11 01:42:11 <Kliment>	Oracle989: Build a paintbox instead
Mar 11 01:42:14 ---	Hobz has changed the topic to: A very Bavarian Birthday to Kliment! | Not to be confused with George RR Martin | RIP Sir George Martin http://goo.gl/PcnJLe | Microsoft SQL Server on linux http://goo.gl/vjnJbJ | What did one snowman say to the other? PM Ahrotahntee | Fable Legends cancelled http://goo.gl/sWZZSQ | RIP Liquorice | Nancy Re
Mar 11 01:42:19 <wao>	Hobz: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0450278/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1 ?
Mar 11 01:42:22 <Kliment>	Why Bavarian?
Mar 11 01:42:30 <wao>	Kliment: happy bday!:)
Mar 11 01:42:31 <Hobz>	Oh christ, did I miss?
Mar 11 01:42:38 <Kliment>	Badly
Mar 11 01:42:39 <Walther>	Kliment: happy birthday <3
Mar 11 01:42:41 <Hobz>	Dammit
Mar 11 01:42:41 *	Bucket takes a quarter from Hobz and places it in the swear jar.
Mar 11 01:42:50 <Hobz>	Take it all, Bucket, take it all
Mar 11 01:42:56 <Oracle989>	Kliment_age++;
Mar 11 01:43:00 <Kliment>	I'm like all the way across from Bavaria, closer to Belgium than Austria
Mar 11 01:43:06 <bhuddah>	Kliment: at least they have good beer.
Mar 11 01:43:17 <Hobz>	wao, Yes.  There was much slaying in that one.
Mar 11 01:43:19 <Kliment>	bhuddah: I don't drink beer while in Germany
Mar 11 01:43:24 <Hobz>	Kliment, well, not THAT badly
Mar 11 01:43:30 <bhuddah>	Kliment: the belgians too.
Mar 11 01:43:45 <Oracle989>	I'm not a fan of Belgian beers
Mar 11 01:43:47 <wao>	Hobz: plotline, slovakia hostel, well, hope, just coincidence
Mar 11 01:43:49 <Kliment>	Hobz: I do want that out of the topic though
Mar 11 01:43:53 <Oracle989>	Or German, for that matter, now that I think about it
Mar 11 01:44:08 <Jax184>	I need a bogel for the glotch!
Mar 11 01:44:08 ---	Hobz has changed the topic to: A very happy Birthday to Kliment! | Not to be confused with George RR Martin | RIP Sir George Martin http://goo.gl/PcnJLe | Microsoft SQL Server on linux http://goo.gl/vjnJbJ | What did one snowman say to the other? PM Ahrotahntee | Fable Legends cancelled http://goo.gl/sWZZSQ | RIP Liquorice | Nancy Re
Mar 11 01:44:22 <Kliment>	Oracle989: If you're a fan of any beer, there are probably some decent ones of a kind you like in Belgium
Mar 11 01:44:28 <--	dymaxion has quit (Ping timeout: 185 seconds)
Mar 11 01:44:28 <Kliment>	Oracle989: The variety is tremendous
Mar 11 01:44:37 <IronAngel>	oh hey, congrats kliment