MURRAY: TransAlta, Murray speaking.

4 SEAN: Hey, Murray, this is Sean, Enron.

MURRAY: Hey, how you <loin'?
SEAN: Good. How you <loin'?
MURRAY: Good.
SEAN: Hey, I don't know if I talked to you - or, do you got a minute?
MURRAY: Sure.
SEAN: I don't know if I talked to you or if I - or whoever your shop I would talk to about
the I - have you guys d - ever to look at um, becoming a control area?
MURRAY: A control area?
13 SEAN: Yeah.

14 MURRAY: We'd love to be a control area.

SEAN: Why - why won't, ah - have you looked at it?
MURRAY: Ah, we are looking at it, but it seems, at least from our -what I've - I'm not the
one looking at it, but talking to the person that was, it looks like it's a long drawn-out
process.
SEAN: Who's - who's lookin' at it?
MURRAY: Ah, Claude Benoit.
SEAN: Ah, Claude Benoit OK. 'Cause what I'm wondering is, and I don't' know if you
guys would be interested in this, or if this would be something that would be, um, um, just
23 something that would good, ah, going out of the gate, would be if -'cause I think, we -we

24 have a group that sort of specializes in that -

25 MURRAY: OK.

SEAN: And ah, we've been very successful and they -in essentially a short period of time,
ah, become control area back east with just generation.
28 MURRAY: Oh, really?



SEAN: Yeah. And the problem that we have out west is we would like to have some

control area capabilities, but um, we don't, you know, we don't -we have load in California,
but effectively - and we have small generation in -in the southwest, but we don't really have
4 any generation per se up here in -in the Northwest.

MURRAY: Right.
SEAN: and so, what, you know, I was thinking the other day is, but you know, essentially if
you go to an existing utility and talk to them about some sort of um, you know, control area
type thing or you know, leasing generation and forming your own control area, or whatever,
it's y -with the, you know, existing utility mindset, um, it's you know, it's pretty much a no
go -
MURRAY: Right.
SEAN: -- from the start. So, I don't know if you guys, you know, [inaudible] if I should talk
to Claude, or maybe you just you know broach the subject with him or whatever, but it
14 would basically involve, I mean, I would say, I used to work for Portland General, so I kinda

know, you know, what control areas are about, and -
MURRAY: Yeah.
17 SEAN: -- and all that kind of stuff and it seems - and it seem like, potentially, if we could,

you know, we might want to sit down and at least talk about, um, doing something, ah,
jointly and - and you know, sort of utilizing us with respect to what, you know, our expertise
in actually getting one going and - and creating one and we, you know, we have the people
in place like at [inaudible] and [inaudible] and all that kind of stuff, ah, because it's - from an
engineering perspective it's not difficult.
MURRAY: Right.
SEAN: Um, so it's just basically a matter of [inaudible] and that sort of thing, and if with the
existing generation that you have it um, you know, at Centralia, I've, um, you know, just sort
26 of a, um, thinking about it and thinking out loud, I've thought well, you know, you could

27 easily, you know, utilize our skill at creating one and you - you - sort of your asset in order

28 to get your f - ah, foot in the door, you could basically have a joint control area, ah, it would



-it would, ah -it would be one -it would be seen by everyone - adjacent controllers as one

control area, but essentially both of us would be able to utilize different characteristics of a
control area -
4 MURRAY: Right.

SEAN: urn, in - and we could do that separately, because really the only thing you need is
one number and it's b - so you guys could be your thing separately, we wouldn't need to see
7 it. We could do our thing separately and you wouldn't need to see it, so, and 'cause really all

you need to do is -is have one aggregate control number with your adjacent control area.
MURRAY: Right.
10 SEAN: And so, if you took the sum of all your stuff, you know, what you were doin' and

added it to the sum of all of our stuff, you've got the one control - you've got the one
number -
13 MURRAY: Yeah.

14 SEAN: -- and we're not leaning on -we - since we don't have any generation -we're not

selling anything - we wouldn't be selling anything out of the control area that wouldn't be
coming into the control area, you know what I mean?
MURRAY: Yeah.
SEAN: So, it's not like we would be leaning on you guys, and you wouldn't be leaning on us
or anything, it's just basically a marriage of convenience -
MURRAY: Yup.
21 SEAN: And I think it would be - actually, I think it would be very easy to um separate our,

22 ah, transactions in such a way, like I said, we would, you know, we wouldn't need to know

23 ah - e - er -we wouldn't need to know what you guys were doing -

24 MURRAY: Right.

25 SEAN: -- sp - sp - specifically, we would just need to know a single number and again, you

26 wouldn't need to know what we were doing, except for just the one number and as long as

27 we can say, OK, this is the number, we add up the number and then we agree on a checkout

28 with the adjacent control areas, then I think we're good to go.



MURRAY: Right.

SEAN: And I really don't see, other than, you know, if your management has, you know, is
worried about what we might learn about your activities, ma - I'm certainly wouldn't, I
4 mean, knowing how it would be structured, I'm not worried that we couldn't come up with

some sort of ah - of an agreement where i -i-it would cause me any grief -
MURRAY: Right.
SEAN: -- at all, I mean, you just, like I said, you would know one number, but who cares,
you're not going to be able to tell what we were doing anyway.
MURRAY: Right. Right.
SEAN: And vice versa.
MURRAY: Right.
SEAN: Um, so I don't know if that's something that, like I said, we -we -you know, we
did a generation control, we've done it a couple of times back east and in actually in fairly
quick time.
MURRAY: Right.
SEAN: And um, so like I said, the necessary -we have the necessary people, I think, in the
right places, we have precedent, so it's like, right now, I mean, we don't, you know, do you
want to go out and buy generation just to become a control area? No we don't -
MURRAY: Right.
SEAN: -- but we would like to be able to have some of the capabilities that a, you know,
that a control area has, and I think, you know, you guys, I d - I think would definitely like to
be able to do that, and um, so I - like I said, it - you know, if it's something that, if you want
me to talk to somebody else in your shop [inaudible] if you want to broach the subject or -
24 [inaudible]

25 MURRAY: Yeah, why don't I - I - I think ah, I mean, we'd certainly be open to - to the

26 discussion part of it -

27 SEAN: Right. Right.

28 MURRAY: I mean I - we're certainly going to slam the door -



SEAN: Maybe we could [inaudible] [simultaneous]

MURRAY: Yeah.
SEAN: Yeah.
4 MURRAY: Ah, but why don't I - I pass this along to the - the people that I think would

be, ah, interested in hearing this and -
SEAN: Yeah, OK.
MURRAY: -- and give them your number, and get 'em to get in touch with you.