sol v slag fury

[8:14 PM] Kiri: y'know, I just had a really silly idea for a very lategame fight
[8:14 PM] Kiri: I had the idea in my head of canonizing the fact that I made that time gate spell as like
[8:14 PM] Kiri: Solacia knows how to drastically slow the flow of time, but she's never been strong enough to actually be able to act during it
[8:15 PM] Kiri: it's basically exclusively an out for 'I need a moment to think' in the middle of a super rough battle
[8:15 PM] Leafia_Barrett: act as in "independent of the timeslow" or just "act in any capacity"?
[8:16 PM] Kiri: Like, she can't slow time and then also capitalize by killing whoever instantly
[8:16 PM] Kiri: she can hardly move if at all
[8:16 PM] Kiri: while the spell is active
[8:16 PM] Leafia_Barrett: so she can't, like
[8:16 PM] Leafia_Barrett: TAS real life
[8:16 PM] Kiri: yeah
[8:16 PM] Kiri: ... The problem being, like
[8:16 PM] Kiri: one of the forms of The Ragnarok totally can.
[8:17 PM] Leafia_Barrett: .
[8:17 PM] Kiri: like, Slag Fury probably considering he goes into the Mage gear.
[8:17 PM] Kiri: so she activates that
[8:17 PM] Kiri: and then suddenly he keeps moving
[8:17 PM] Kiri: punches her clean the fuck out like 'Heh, never knew I could pull this off, thanks girlie'
[8:18 PM] Kiri: which basically forces Sol to like, crank the overloader up higher than she's ever had to before, like we're talking upwards of 800, 900%
[8:18 PM] Kiri: and then do an entire battle with this guy in stopped time
[8:18 PM] Kiri: while he's constantly being like 'I just fired that shot at your friend, if I hit you too hard they're gonna get crushed by all of that at once' so she has to like, find time to bump Lilac out of the way
[8:19 PM] Brendan Farenite: Jotaro vs Dio, TL style
[8:20 PM] Kiri: I honestly forget how the entirety of Gaia as Ragnarok goes in-story beyond Gaia is 'in there somewhere' but like
[8:22 PM] Kiri: I really like the idea that in the middle of a much greater fight, this entire thing happens and Slag Fury gets to go all 'You know, I've been looking for an excuse to turn heel on both of these chucklefucks, thanks for giving me the opportunity. I'll tell you what; I'll be real nice and let your friends die first, so they don't have to drown in primordial fire like everyone else.'
[8:22 PM] Kiri: like each individual aspect of The Ragnarok is itself a final boss
[8:22 PM] Leafia_Barrett: Omnicide is the one who killed Green and Celeste
[8:22 PM] Kiri: (again, this is me throwing random shit at the wall and seeing what sticks while listening to music that's making me far more hype than I should be, so shut me up if it doesn't work :p)
[8:23 PM] Leafia_Barrett: which I had a thought for why suddenly they went from "god this guy hits hard, I don't know how much of this the shield can take" to "a single laser just punched a hole clean through both of us"
[8:23 PM] Leafia_Barrett: okay so
[8:24 PM] Leafia_Barrett: Omnicide's gimmick is
[8:24 PM] Leafia_Barrett: you're on a time limit
[8:24 PM] Leafia_Barrett: if you don't kill him before the debuff he inflicts on spawn runs out, you die
[8:24 PM] Leafia_Barrett: instantly
[8:24 PM] Leafia_Barrett: no saving roll
[8:24 PM] NaClverist: Yep.
[8:24 PM] Leafia_Barrett: and there's your explanation
[8:24 PM] NaClverist: He also has a bucketload of health.
[8:25 PM] Leafia_Barrett: Celeste and Green ran out of time.
[8:25 PM] Kiri: yeah
[8:25 PM] Brendan Farenite: Works
[8:26 PM] Brendan Farenite: At the time they couldn't know
[8:26 PM] Leafia_Barrett: at the time the thing seemed impervious to damage
[8:26 PM] Leafia_Barrett: Celeste specifically comments on that during the epilogue
[8:26 PM] Leafia_Barrett: "I can't even scratch this guy"
[8:27 PM] Leafia_Barrett: paraphrased
[...]
[8:34 PM] Kiri: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOlHuDVz1Ys sorry I'm still imagining Sol and this godlike burning colossus fighting to this track in and out of frozen time and it's kind of incredible in my head
[8:35 PM] Brendan Farenite: Tfw I can't listen to it because my gf is sleeping besides me, I'm not waking her up
[8:36 PM] Kiri: yeah that's fair the track is kinda loud ^^;
[8:39 PM] Kiri: If it weren't tonally inappropriate for the character with the least meaning to do it, I'd almost like for it to be Omnicide if not Slag Fury
[8:39 PM] Kiri: just because I love the idea that the time stop thing was, like, Sol's desperation move against the instant death timer
[8:40 PM] Kiri: and that's why she literally can't afford to unfreeze time, because if she does, everyone dies anyways
[8:40 PM] Brendan Farenite: She had to get inventive and outsmart her opponent then
[8:41 PM] NaClverist: tbf, given Amande saw their deaths, he'd pretty much figure out very fast that the green one is the biggest danger.
[8:42 PM] Leafia_Barrett: yes, but you said it yourself, dude's a goddamn meatwall
[8:42 PM] NaClverist: Resilient and respectably strong, until that single moment where it struck them fatally.
[8:42 PM] Kiri: Maybe the in-story countdown is something they all plan to do together, some big team attack, and the fact that Sol takes out Slag Fury is enough to keep that from happening, even if Omnicide is still the biggest threat
[8:42 PM] Kiri: idk, just thinking out loud
[8:43 PM] Leafia_Barrett: wouldn't work, assuming the reason Celeste and Green died is because the clock hit 0
[8:43 PM] NaClverist: The moment he sees and recognises Omnicide, with Zl'ana's memory letting him know what it did and who Red and Li are, he'd call to them both and swiftly tell them to focus on it.
[8:44 PM] Aszarun: Again, this is a situation that Celia would step in. Gaia is pretty much showing her hand, and as mediator between the gods, she has to be there.
[8:44 PM] NaClverist: "The green one be the big deal, you two. I saw it end ye both."
[8:45 PM] Leafia_Barrett: oh trust me, they would remember it



[9:21 PM] Kiri: So like, do you like the idea I had re: 'Sol battling a third of Ragnarok in the frozen time'
[9:26 PM] Leafia_Barrett: my main question is "what kind of effects will that have on Sol, pushing her Overloader that far"
[9:26 PM] Leafia_Barrett: short or long term
[9:26 PM] Kiri: It... probably puts her out for the rest of the Ragnarok fight, easily
[9:26 PM] Kiri: and she'd only wake up right around when the Devourer shows up
[9:29 PM] Kiri: Like just to move in the frozen time would require like, 700%
[9:29 PM] Kiri: so imagine an Alucard-ass distortion effect around her by then
[9:29 PM] Kiri: and by the end she needs to have it at like 900% considering she's competing with all the anger of the Ragnarok
[9:30 PM] Kiri: so at that point her body is dissolving to blue and violet fire
[9:33 PM] Kiri: meanwhile from everyone else's perspective, Lilac just got shoulder-checked by nothing a good dozen feet out of the way of a flaming laser that wasn't there a frame ago, Amande is suddenly in a crouch position he doesn't remember taking as a pyroclastic blast flies over his head, Sol and Slag Fury are halfway across the battlefield from where they had been last anyone remembered, the latter suddenly already taking every spell Sol knows colliding on top of him all at once
[9:37 PM] Kiri: like it's literally instantaneous and nobody knows what happened other than 'well I guess there's only two now'
[...]
[5:12 AM] Kiri: oh god, I just thought of a really good fuckin' thing for the fight with the Rusted Company we have in the dungeon
[5:13 AM] Kiri: Sol's the one on crowd control and she trusts Lilac to 'get their cover fire'
[5:13 AM] Kiri: because they seem to be getting shot at from every angle
[5:13 AM] Kiri: ... it turns out they only have one gunner.
[5:13 AM] Kiri: who is just extraordinary at calculating bank shots
[5:13 AM] Kiri: to a point where he is literally capable of using that to make the both of us think that they have an entire militia firing at us
[5:14 AM] Kiri: and we can't tell because it's fucking imperceptibly dark in the dungeon's deepest reaches
[5:17 AM] Kiri: Lilac spends most of the fight shooting at walls and getting increasingly confused and frustrated
[5:17 AM] Kiri: before she takes one to her left shin, or something
[5:17 AM] Kiri: and without looking realizes that's a dart and not a bullet
[5:17 AM] Kiri: and she looks down and realizes
[5:17 AM] Kiri: that's a dart capable of ricocheting
[5:20 AM] Kiri: She'd probably recognize this and then actually slow down
[5:21 AM] Kiri: intentionally take a few blows, just to internalize the point of entry into her body (probably blocking them with one of her strong-ass arms)
[5:21 AM] Kiri: count the number of ricochets
[5:21 AM] Kiri: then by the fourth shot, she straight up catches one dart between two fingers like 'Gotcha.'
[5:21 AM] Kiri: and fires literally one shot
[5:22 AM] Kiri: and nails the fucker right between his eye-sockets
[5:22 AM] Kiri: (If Sol gets to be that kind of cool, everyone else deserves it too :p)
[...]
[4:33 PM] Kiri: so am I selfish for wanting to hear opinions on that stuff I dropped on you a couple hours ago
[4:34 PM] Kiri: Solacia versus Slag Fury's The World, Lilac versus what remains of one of the best snipers who ever lived
[4:50 PM] Leafia_Barrett: for the first one, a thought
[4:50 PM] Leafia_Barrett: you've seen raocow as much as I have if not more
[4:50 PM] Leafia_Barrett: I forget where it was, I think in ASMBXT
[4:50 PM] Leafia_Barrett: a blue boot section with a timestop involved
[4:51 PM] Leafia_Barrett: remember how that just left a trail of sparkles that all happened at once when the timestop wore off?
[4:51 PM] Leafia_Barrett: I think mentioning a trail of whatever ethereal fire is coming off of Sol during that part might be neat
[4:59 PM] Kiri: ah yeah
[4:59 PM] Kiri: so like, the only real hints of what Sol was doing are just this trail of blue embers
[4:59 PM] Kiri: that just sorta zips around all over the place
[5:02 PM] Kiri: so like, I have your approval for them both?
[5:04 PM] Leafia_Barrett: for the ricocheting dart idea, that would have to be a variant of crystal darts, crystal darts were the only bouncing dart type in existence back during WJ
[5:04 PM] Leafia_Barrett: that works well for the scene because crystal darts go obscenely fast as well
[5:05 PM] Kiri: yeah
[5:05 PM] Leafia_Barrett: and on top of that, Lilac would recognize them in an instant as soon as she could actually see it
[5:05 PM] Kiri: so yeah, like, she gets stuck with one and it tags her right in the leg
[5:05 PM] Kiri: and it's like 'hold up'
[5:06 PM] Kiri: I went over this in the group chat, but like... I've learned to really enjoy fight scenes where the fight itself isn't what you're here for
[5:06 PM] Kiri: because at this point, no yeah Lilac would win a sniper duel, so clearly they'd have to be trying some shit.
[5:06 PM] Leafia_Barrett: not a straight brawl, but a puzzle
[5:07 PM] Leafia_Barrett: and I agree
[5:07 PM] Kiri: (you should really watch Jojo so you can learn what I mean, it's unironically some next level bullshit with this concept)
[5:10 PM] Leafia_Barrett: I get the concept, at least
[5:10 PM] Leafia_Barrett: it's kinda what I was thinking with the Leviathan suggestion
[5:13 PM] Kiri: yeah
[5:15 PM] Leafia_Barrett: less like a street brawl, more like the world's most violent game of chess
[5:16 PM] Kiri: god I'm just trying to think of what the best example of this is in Jojo that involves the least spoilers(edited)
[5:17 PM] Kiri: J. Guile and the Hanged Man is one of my favorite fights in the series out of what I've seen so far
[5:18 PM] Kiri: where basically one of the main characters, Polnareff, is under attack by this strange stand who he can only seem to see in mirrors
[5:18 PM] Kiri: what happens to him in the reflection happens simultaneously to his actual body, so if this stand, Hanged Man, stabs him in the neck, he gets an identical wound
[5:18 PM] Kiri: However, when he goes to smash the mirror, nothing happens.
[5:19 PM] Kiri: The entire episode revolves around how, as far as Polnareff can tell, this stand is invincible.
[5:19 PM] Kiri: It seems to only exist in a mirror world that he cannot enter and thus he cannot fight it
[5:20 PM] Kiri: and the user, J. Guile, is very adamant about reinforcing his fears, stating repeatedly that his is one of the strongest stands
[5:20 PM] Kiri: and it takes until Kakyoin, another main character, talks to him rationally as they flee the scene for Polnareff to realize
[5:21 PM] Kiri: that stands are crazy, but ultimately at the end of the day, they can only get so crazy. They need to have a basis in reality.
[5:21 PM] Kiri: The 'mirror world' doesn't exist because a mirror is just something that reflects light. It's an object with a pretty surface.
[5:22 PM] Leafia_Barrett: so it's "reflecting" light that's bounced off of an invisible object, basically
[5:22 PM] Kiri: A handful of tense scenes later and Polnareff realizes how Hanged Man works:
[5:23 PM] Kiri: It can turn itself into light and thus become its own reflection
[5:23 PM] Leafia_Barrett: oh
[5:23 PM] Kiri: and bounce nearly instantly between any two reflective surfaces
[5:23 PM] Kiri: It turns out he's just a really good actor, when it came to parts like 'watch as I cut your throat from the mirror', because he was just instantly bouncing between the mirror and a window, slitting his throat on the way
[5:24 PM] Kiri: again, moving at the literal speed of light
[5:24 PM] Kiri: Because it needs a reflective surface to stay untouchable, however
[5:24 PM] Kiri: should it vanish for any reason, he needs to jump to another
[5:25 PM] Kiri: So you just get this super fucking creative scene that could only happen with this setup
[5:25 PM] Kiri: where basically Polnareff needs to figure out a way to give Hanged Man only a single point to flee to
[5:25 PM] Kiri: while at the same time, J. Guile is being the most diabolically devious motherfucker about it and doing everything he can to play dirty
[5:26 PM] Kiri: because Polnareff and his stand, Silver Chariot, totally could cut Hanged Man even moving at the speed of light, because speed is what Silver Chariot is high god king of
[5:26 PM] Kiri: he just needs to make sure he moves in a way that he can actually hit him.
[5:27 PM] Kiri: I don't want to say too much about the fight just because actually watching it is so fucking engaging
[5:27 PM] Kiri: but you see why I love this fight so much right
[...]
[5:37 PM] Kiri: just... yeah, the moral of the story is that like
[5:37 PM] Kiri: Jojo made me realize that like... a fight isn't engaging just because 'oh man, violence'.
[5:37 PM] Kiri: you get an actual hook when there's something that changes the dynamic of the fight, or sets the stakes