Cross Talk Ray McGovern Interview (12/16/2016)

Supplemental document for: "Theory that Roger Stone's go-between for Wikileaks was Randy Credico", link: https://wakelet.com/wake/2d352ae9-febe-44a1-a7bb-51674a2e4bf5

Transcript excerpts from Russia Today's "Cross Talk: 'Russia Card'", broadcast date: December 16, 2016. Excerpt one goes from 8:15 to 10:50. Second excerpt runs from 20:56 to 23:22.

File link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yz_55hRvixw

Direct link to first excerpt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yz_55hRvixw#t=8m15s

Direct link to second excerpt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yz_55hRvixw#t=20m56s

First excerpt:

PETER LAVELLE
You know, Ray, weigh in on that here. Because it seems to me that first of all, the media, there was an epic fail, covering the election, the liberal media...and now we have this here, this story has consequences, no matter how it plays out here. Okay, we could see Trump having bad blood with the security forces, intelligence forces, I mean, this is such an accusation...and then, at some point, somebody's going to say, those golden words, "something must be done." And it could be very dangerous what they're thinking about, go ahead, Ray.

RAY MCGOVERN
Well, they are thinking about doing something for this egregious attempt to affect our election. The only problem I have with citing what we did in Europe and elsewhere [CIA involvement in the elections of Italy, Greece, Chile, and many others.], is that there's a false equivalency there. There's lots of evidence we did that, there's no evidence that the Russians have done this, as they were accused.

Now, you get all kinds of people, that...former Deputy Director...Michael

LAVELLE
Morell.

MCGOVERN
-he was on Charlie Rose. Yeah, Mike Morell. Right. It's Mike Morell, and he was on his grandfather Charlie Rose's program, again, for the eleventh time. And Charlie says, "What about this?" [imitates Morell] "We gotta retaliate and probably one of the best ways would be to give defensive weapons to the Ukrainians." Hello? So, let me just repeat: there's a big difference between a leak and a hack. A leak is done physically, and that's what Bradley, or Chelsea Manning did, that's what Ed Snowden did. Okay? That's a leak. Now, to hack, there's an electronic signal that is produced...the NSA, our experts say, will inevitably be able to trace to these tens of thousands of trace mechanisms through the system, trace who sent it, and who received it. So, what we've got here is the situation where the physical manifestations of this don't bear out.

Now, the other thing is this. And I don't wanna hog the time here, but...Craig Murray, former U.K. ambassador to Uzbekistan is a very good friend of mine. He is one of the awardees for the Sam Adams Integrity In Intelligence. He claims that he met the source. He claims that he talked to the source. And I can substantiate that claim.

LAVELLE
And I'm pretty sure that he's not a Russian!

Second excerpt:

LAVELLE
You know one of the interesting things, is this meme here, that Vladimir Putin, personally was involved, directed the hacking, of Hillary Clinton's mails, and John Podesta. That's the narrative here. But what's really interesting is that the people that are pushing this narrative, actually, it's like throwing fire on kerosene here, because if we have intelligence agencies that cannot keep America safe...oh my goodness, the country is so weak, so fragile, oh my goodness here...I think the intelligence community could get some backlash for that...because if you start believing this false fake news conspiracy theory, then America is very very weak, and it's very very vulnerable. And I think that's a derivative narrative that can come out over this.

MCGOVERN
Well, that may be so, Peter, but I'd just like to say, that if people were really interested in finding out whether it was a leak or a hack, and who did it, there is an ambassador in good standing, in London, whom they could call. Neither The New York Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, nobody has called ambassador Murray. I just checked with him last night. Still, no one from the United States, they write all these things, and Murray says "I met the source." And I can verify that. Because Murray was in town here, at the end of September, I'll let the FBI figure out which days, okay? But he was here- He was there to give- He was emceeing the Sam Adams Award ceremony for John Kiriakou. After it, Craig always goes out to have a drink, or some food with us; well, this time, I watched him, and he sortof silently walked backwards over a little hill, into a wooded area. And I said, "You know, that's really strange." Isn't Craig going to join us? We never saw him again. Okay?

LAVELLE
Well, he was on RT today. He was on RT today, don't worry, he's okay, go ahead. Keep going, Ray.

MCGOVERN
Well, no, when I say we never saw him again, I just mean, he didn't join us for the party. He had more important things to do...and I would have to say, the FBI or the Homeland Security folks who were supposed to follow him on that day, I was going to say, they should be fired, but they'll probably be moved up to higher positions now, because that's what malfeasance gets you [inaudible].