The Great Prescription Skip Debate [Chap. 3 - Analysis]

The Great Prescription Skip Debate
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Chapter 1 - Discovery:	http://pastebin.com/uxWcRhka
Chapter 2 - It Begins:	http://pastebin.com/wRsNmmhP
Chapter 3 - Analysis:	http://pastebin.com/iuStxa0J
Chapter 4 - Challenger:	http://pastebin.com/AuNF3GhC
Chapter 5 - Ideas: 	http://pastebin.com/7SaRZAvA
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[21:18] <@Cosmo> wonder if banning all post snes emulators is a bad or good idea :|
[21:19] <RME> I think it is?
[21:19] <RME> I'm not really sure
[21:19] <@jiano> dont ban outright but
[21:19] <@jiano> just dont put them with console
[21:19] <+TestRunner> is this for racing, or just WR?
[21:19] <Enterim> deprecate?
[21:19] <@Cosmo> separate
[21:19] <@Cosmo> WR tetrunner
[21:19] <@Cosmo> racing is w/e
[21:19] <+TestRunner> ok
[21:19] <Wodahs-Reklaw> I argue bad
[21:19] <@jiano> its still good to see how good the person is even if emu, just have it obvious that emu isnt considered legit
[21:19] <Enterim> that throws poodle under the bus
[21:19] <stonenot> good
[21:19] <@Cosmo> what would you do then for MST
[21:20] <@Cosmo> mark pydoyks 2:20 as "WR"? heh
[21:20] <Shredwot> SVa
[21:20] <Samura1man> Team Top Speed
[21:20] <Shredwot> SVA has a lower time
[21:20] <stonenot> Team Top Speed
[21:20] <Samura1man> sva
[21:20] <@Cosmo> oh does SVA have 2:19
[21:20] <Shredwot> Teamtopspeed
[21:20] <Shredwot> Yeah
[21:20] <@Cosmo> im not trying to shit on poodle at all in any way
[21:20] <@jiano> im tired of emu kids claiming to have wrs and shit
[21:20] <RME> I think I saw sva with 2:19 on youtube?
[21:20] <RME> I'm not sure
[21:20] <@jiano> its annoying as fuk
[21:20] <@jiano> that one dude doing sm64 single stars and getting uwrs that are impossible on console
[21:20] <Shredwot> He broke Poodles first WR with a 2:19 first to sub 2:20
[21:20] <stonenot> if they like emu so much they should just buy vc because it's the real deal of emulators
[21:20] <Wodahs-Reklaw> honestly poodles time can be topped on vc with almost equal play, I dont see how his emu advantage makes him at a clear disadvtange vs somone on vc
[21:20] <+TestRunner> personally, I'm kinda against emu
[21:21] <Exodus> im perfectly fine with emulator being not allowd for wr, i just am glad you aren;t considering banning it in races
[21:21] <Wodahs-Reklaw> other than VC having seconds lost on every reset
[21:21] <Wodahs-Reklaw> but ill take that hit because its the version I prefer
[21:21] <stonenot> i say ban emu in races
[21:21] <Shredwot> Pydowks has been on track for a 2:15 at Water temple before
[21:21] <@Cosmo> yea for races we would never ban emulator
[21:21] <@Cosmo> heh
[21:21] <qwerty1605> excape "lynch cylub"
[21:21] <Shredwot> so it's beatable by a lot
[21:21] <boris> ya i think poodle could certainly get a lower time on vc
[21:21] <qwerty1605> cylun*
[21:21] <qwerty1605> except
[21:21] <Kosmicd12> he couldnt ess on vc
[21:21] <qwerty1605> I can't type
[21:21] <%mzxrules> if you want to have emu for races and shit go for it
[21:21] <boris> he could learn
[21:21] <+Runnerguy2489> but you'd need a wii and you'd have to do illegal things with it to get jp
[21:21] <@Cosmo> i think i missed that what was ur idea
[21:21] <%mzxrules> but only official emus for wrs
[21:21] <stonenot> so more ppl see it and read it
[21:21] <+Runnerguy2489> or buy a wii from japan?
[21:22] <Shredwot> He has N64, he just needs a cap card and a tv
[21:22] <boris> you'd have to do illegal things like downloading a rom to play on emulator too
[21:22] <+Runnerguy2489> yeah boris that's my point
[21:22] <boris> ah
[21:22] <%mzxrules> otherwise I'm gonna make an emulator that's like pj64 but randomly makes you move a step farther
[21:22] <+Runnerguy2489> I mean, I don't really care or have a strong opinion on emulator
[21:22] <boris> rg is strongly opposed to vc LOL
[21:22] <Wodahs-Reklaw> im with RG
[21:22] <boris> Kappa
[21:23] <+Runnerguy2489> VC is evil for sure
[21:23] <+Runnerguy2489> Kappa
[21:23] <Wodahs-Reklaw> Oh you
[21:23] <@jiano> vc is bad but like 90% of oot players use it so
[21:23] <@Cosmo> so
[21:23] <@jiano> there u go
[21:23] <boris> i see vc as more legit than emu
[21:23] <+zodiac> as eurotrash vc is the most based thingi n my life
[21:23] <@Cosmo> lol
[21:23] <boris> even tho i think it has an advatnage over it
[21:23] <@Cosmo> yo so would you ahve
[21:23] <@Cosmo> two tables:
[21:23] <@Cosmo> Console table
[21:23] <@Cosmo> and
[21:23] <@Cosmo> Emulator table
[21:23] <@Cosmo> best console time is WR
[21:23] <+TestRunner> ehh
[21:23] <@Cosmo> regardless of version
[21:23] <@jiano> yea
[21:23] <boris> that sounds good to me i think
[21:23] <%mzxrules> best EMU time is 0:00 by me
[21:23] <+TestRunner> might be too many categories
[21:24] <boris> not perfect of course
[21:24] <@Cosmo> im envisioning this being on the same page
[21:24] <+cafde> except it's not different categories, just platforms
[21:24] <%mzxrules> just now, found a glitch where if you hold down L, your in the credits. Emu only
[21:24] <Exodus> one for emu and one for console makes perfect sense
[21:24] <+zodiac> its not like its suddenly unfair to emu or anything, console has always been wr rules ~sda life~
[21:24] <stonenot> S D A
[21:24] <Wodahs-Reklaw> if we are giong to do this table breakdown do we care between ENG vs JP?
[21:24] <@Cosmo> yea cafde
[21:24] <Wodahs-Reklaw> so we split it more
[21:24] <Warp> that would be exiting the whole idea of how the games are played
[21:24] <@Cosmo> but 1 platform is an offiical reelase
[21:24] <boris> emu has always been allowed for convenience, in our communities, i think
[21:25] <Warp> by the rule of  you can only do what the game allows you do to
[21:25] <Warp> with that example you could justify gamesharking
[21:25] <+zodiac> no you cant
[21:25] <stonenot> wtf are u talking about warp
[21:25] <+zodiac> you are a stupid person
[21:25] <@Cosmo> i promise you that at some point somebody is going to do a good OoT 100% run on japanese version
[21:25] <Warp> just now, found a glitch where if you hold down L, your in the credits. Emu only
[21:25] <@jiano> some1 is gonna beat sigs time on vc
[21:25] <boris> i hope so, cosmo
[21:25] <c0urtney19> cafde
[21:25] <@jiano> as well
[21:25] <@jiano> gg
[21:25] <Warp> im referring to that
[21:25] <boris> yeah jiano
[21:25] <Exodus> it was a joke warp...
[21:26] <+cafde> what
[21:26] <+zodiac> id be really surprised if anyone gets that good on vc
[21:26] <boris> i honestly think vc should be considered legit for sm64
[21:26] <boris> even though it'd force jp players to get us vc version
[21:26] <@jiano> same
[21:26] <boris> but esi told me their laws are stricter or something?
[21:26] <Samura1man> can't wait for sig to change to SMS
[21:26] <@Cosmo> er
[21:26] <stonenot> move to america
[21:26] <%mzxrules> vc isn't legit for sm64?
[21:26] <stonenot> problem solved
[21:26] <@Cosmo> izu and sva hacked their wiis I think
[21:26] <stonenot> AmErIcA
[21:26] <@jiano> yea
[21:26] <@Cosmo> to play US version
[21:26] <Samura1man> yes, they did
[21:26] <@jiano> dont the oot jp players use hacked wiis ?
[21:26] <stonenot> yea
[21:26] <boris> yeah they do...
[21:26] <boris> lol
[21:26] <+TestRunner> yea, i think most ppl use VC
[21:26] <RME> modding a wii is pretty trivial
[21:27] <RME> I did it to get jp VC at home
[21:27] <stonenot> modding a wii is the easiest shit ever and everyone should do it
[21:27] <+zodiac> yes
[21:27] <+zodiac> wiis should come premodded
[21:27] <@jiano> ya
[21:27] <+zodiac> its that easy
[21:27] <Wodahs-Reklaw> lol ^
[21:27] <+TestRunner> lol
[21:27] <+zodiac> save everyone a half hour of their life
[21:27] <Wodahs-Reklaw> HBC installed right out of the factory
[21:27] <boris> so i guess its just that sm64 spedran community is rooted in n64 jp version, and the majority of the community isnt gonna be willing to switch to vc or eat disadvnage
[21:27] <Samura1man> lol
[21:27] <@Cosmo> jiano is right though
[21:27] <boris> but that like
[21:27] <@Cosmo> somebody will beat sig on VC someday
[21:27] <boris> idk
[21:27] <Wodahs-Reklaw> I would say sm64 is != OoT
[21:27] <Kosmicd12> sicko switched to n64 and said everything was a lot easier
[21:28] <boris> sm64 is a game
[21:28] <boris> oot is a game
[21:28] <Samura1man> when that time will happen
[21:28] <RME> does VC SM64 have less lag?
[21:28] <RME> I haven't played sm64 in forever
[21:28] <+TestRunner> are there any significant versionn dif between n64 adn Vc or sm64?
[21:28] <Kosmicd12> a lot less
[21:28] <@Cosmo> VC saves 2-3 minutes i think
[21:28] <Samura1man> yes, it has less lag
[21:28] <@jiano> vc sm64 is about 3 minutes faster in 120 star
[21:28] <@Cosmo> on SM64 120
[21:28] <Kosmicd12> ya in 120 its 3 min
[21:28] <%mzxrules> or
[21:28] <+TestRunner> orly
[21:28] <Kosmicd12> and like 1:40 in 70 or something
[21:28] <boris> no significant v diffs other than lag and loading times i think
[21:28] <RME> wow that's pretty big
[21:28] <boris> but those are significant
[21:28] <Wodahs-Reklaw> like just out of lag its huge
[21:28] <%mzxrules> we could just have different wr categories for each version combination
[21:28] <+TestRunner> yea, i'd either disregard that or sep cat
[21:28] <%mzxrules> and let the community decide who's top dog
[21:28] <Warp> oh
[21:28] <boris> mzxrules the problem with that is that the runs arent different
[21:28] <Kosmicd12> omg guys does this mean ing still has mm wr
[21:28] <boris> so its like
[21:28] <+TestRunner> i mean SM banned ZSNES because a 30~ sec advantage
[21:28] <Wodahs-Reklaw> Id say lets worry about oot and if they want to have their own discussion the conclusions of this one will help them out on deciding what to do
[21:29] <boris> n64 and vc runs would be essentially the same run, but one would be faster because the game runs faster
[21:29] <@jiano> in the end imo if ur willing to put the hundreds of hours in to get wr u could drop 100 dollars on aconsole + game or w/e
[21:29] <@jiano> idk
[21:29] <boris> so who cares about the sloewr one
[21:29] <esi> boris VC-J is perfectly fine for zelda
[21:29] <@jiano> seems silly to just stick to emu
[21:29] <esi> not so for sm64
[21:29] <Mr_Carter> i agree with jiano
[21:29] <boris> i know vc-j is bad for sm64
[21:29] <RME> Metroid has been like, Console Only for WR as far as I can recall
[21:29] <+TestRunner> agreed jiano
[21:29] <RME> like the series
[21:29] <Mr_Carter> you have to be serious about a game to go for WR
[21:29] <stonenot> i bought my wii for $60
[21:29] <boris> im saying that vc-u should be standard casue its fastest official version
[21:29] <stonenot> pretty much any1 can pay $60 to play
[21:30] <+zodiac> yeah i really dont understand people who pour months of playtime in to games
[21:30] <+zodiac> and dont buy the console
[21:30] <stonenot> so they should do it
[21:30] <Kosmicd12> vc j is official
[21:30] <Kosmicd12> in japan
[21:30] <+zodiac> its so fucking dumb
[21:30] <Warp> i was hearing this discussion in the context of zelda, where differences werent like, 3 minutes apart
[21:30] <boris> if izu and sva can jump thru the necessary hoops to get zelda games on u version then why cant sm64 players do that
[21:30] <+zodiac> you can dedicate huge part of your life to a game and you wont even play it right
[21:30] <@jiano> i literally bought wii so i could do vc mm
[21:30] <@jiano> lol
[21:30] <@Cosmo> so
[21:30] <%mzxrules> zodiac, you sound like you play glitchless
[21:30] <stonenot> i bought my wii so i could play jp oot bc i thought my cart wasnt coming but then my jp cart came in like the next day
[21:30] <@Cosmo> are we in agreement that if somebody beats sig on VC its still WR ?
[21:31] <boris> i am, cosmo
[21:31] <@jiano> yes
[21:31] <qwerty1605> I'd say yes
[21:31] <@jiano> sig used to play vc, its his fault he switch
[21:31] <+zodiac> its prob wr but theyre still worse than sig unless they topple him by 3 mins
[21:31] <+zodiac> and everyone will know it
[21:31] <@jiano> ya
[21:31] <+TestRunner> i'd say yes if you remove version dif
[21:31] <boris> ya
[21:31] <@Cosmo> remove version dif?
[21:31] <@Cosmo> like time penalty?
[21:31] <%mzxrules> sig is a big boy now, he'll do whatever the fuck he wants
[21:31] <+TestRunner> like if VC is 2 min faster, just add 2 min to the time
[21:31] <@jiano> time penalty would never work
[21:31] <qwerty1605> time penatly is dumb
[21:31] <stonenot> that is a really bad idea
[21:31] <+TestRunner> cause that's pretty big
[21:31] <boris> i think that is too hard to make an accurate judgment on when it comes down to it
[21:31] <stonenot> because frames factor into mashing text
[21:32] <@Cosmo> yea i dont think time penalty can work
[21:32] <@Cosmo> i also disagree with converting PAL -> NTSC
[21:32] <@Cosmo> because reaction time advantage
[21:32] <@jiano> conersion should never happen
[21:32] <boris> converting pal makes pal busted
[21:32] <@jiano> yea
[21:32] <+TestRunner> no, those incomparable
[21:32] <boris> lol
[21:32] <+zodiac> pal just needs to fuck off
[21:32] <stonenot> converting should only happen in a TAS
[21:32] <+zodiac> if you play pal theres something wrong with you
[21:32] <+TestRunner> i dunno, i think VC should either not count or be a sep cat, since it's so dif
[21:32] <stonenot> where both runs have the same inputs
[21:32] <stonenot> then it would be ok
[21:32] <Enterim> PAL 60 is obv OK
[21:32] <@Cosmo> so what about snes and nes games
[21:32] <boris> this was an argument with zsr's il's
[21:32] <@Cosmo> would emu be separate table on those as well
[21:32] <boris> pal times were converted
[21:33] <boris> hm
[21:33] <+zodiac> i know lttp bans zsnes but snes9x or bsnes are legit
[21:33] <%mzxrules> no, if you play pal and don't know any better, that's ok. If you play pal deliberately you should get the fuck out now
[21:33] <boris> if it werent for alttp? i think i would just say yes
[21:33] <@jiano> no reason to separate emu for alttp
[21:33] <+TestRunner> good emus seems to good a good job
[21:33] <%mzxrules> inb4palonlyglitches
[21:33] <RME> BSNES is cycle accurate
[21:33] <@jiano> its slower than snes in fact
[21:33] <RME> or something
[21:33] <+TestRunner> just ban invalid emus
[21:33] <boris> true
[21:33] <+TestRunner> that's takes no effort to get a good emu
[21:33] <@Cosmo> bsnes + snes9x = legit? what about keyboard
[21:33] <@Cosmo> keyboard wallpumps : D
[21:34] <boris> keyboard doesnt save that much time i think
[21:34] <@jiano> keyboard wallpumps are good but thats just saving frames lol
[21:34] <boris> i think console's framerate advantage is etter
[21:34] <+TestRunner> i think snes9x 1.43+?
[21:34] <boris> *better
[21:34] <@jiano> ya boris
[21:34] <+Kryssstal> keyboard is prob like 2 seconds saved I will destroy any1 who thinks otherwise
[21:34] <@jiano> snes will still be faster
[21:34] <+Kryssstal> all you can do with keyboard is tap a little faster, saving a frame (or not even a frame sometimes)
[21:34] <@Cosmo> so basically we're saying that
[21:34] <+zodiac> if you can actually play well on keyboard you prob deserve your 2 sec advantage
[21:34] <+Kryssstal> on like the first 10 minutes of the game
[21:34] <+zodiac> that shit is impossible
[21:34] <c0urtney19> keyboard is superior to controller obviously, except mirror shield angles.
[21:34] <boris> jiano does snes9x gx have the framerate disadvantage?
[21:34] <@Cosmo> after snes, it needs to be separate tables, and WR isnt official if its on emu
[21:34] <@jiano> no idea
[21:35] <@Cosmo> before N64 WR is official on an emulator ?/
[21:35] <+TestRunner> i'd say it's ok for approved emus
[21:35] <+Kryssstal> NES emus are probably accurate enough if someone researched them
[21:35] <+zodiac> cant wait to watch poodle after emu gets shat on
[21:35] <boris> this all is just about nintendo games?
[21:35] <+zodiac> gonna be fun times
[21:35] <+TestRunner> although the games might be case by case
[21:35] <boris> how does like ps1 and 2 emulator handle
[21:35] <+Kryssstal> VC and emu for n64 is like really annoying to compare I assume
[21:36] <@Cosmo> well
[21:36] <@Cosmo> vc shits on n64 but its official
[21:36] <+Kryssstal> I can't even play a game casually on ps1 emu
[21:36] <@Cosmo> emu isnt official but it also kinda shits on n64
[21:36] <@Cosmo> lol
[21:36] <+TestRunner> and GC versions?
[21:36] <@Cosmo> gc is sort of bad
[21:36] <+zodiac> there are so many variables on emu though
[21:36] <+TestRunner> well, are there any other non-oot to be considered?
[21:36] <boris> gc oot is bad in anything that uses savewarps but it seems fine otherwise
[21:36] <+zodiac> like maybe if vc had a wall of plugins itd be lame
[21:36] <+zodiac> but you just play the game and its a real release
[21:36] <boris> gc mm has terrible lag
[21:36] <@Cosmo> it seems nobody uses dolphin for actual speedruns yet
[21:37] <@Cosmo> so post N64 its all good
[21:37] <%mzxrules> pj64 has weird time bursts occationally (get fucked pause buffering)
[21:37] <boris> so the issue is wholly n64?
[21:37] <boris> lol
[21:37] <@jiano> i think dolphin still randomly crashes and shit
[21:37] <@Cosmo> issue is mostly N64 but also NES+Snes I guess
[21:37] <%mzxrules> dolphin isn't worth it
[21:37] <+cafde> gc is fine on dolphin
[21:37] <+cafde> vc randomly crashes
[21:37] <boris> nes/snes uhhh
[21:37] <rog_> dolphin doesn't really crash often
[21:37] <boris> it seems like we can figure out which emulators are acceptable
[21:38] <rog_> except with save states, i guess
[21:38] <+zodiac> its mostly just n64 emus are really really bad
[21:38] <+zodiac> is the main issue
[21:38] <rog_> dolphin is also much faster than console
[21:38] <@jiano> yeah n64 emus are like the worst shit
[21:38] <Wodahs-Reklaw> lets just reprogram pj64, fuck it
[21:38] <@Cosmo> kryssstal can u tell me about snes9x vs console vs bsnes
[21:38] <Koobes> I can't even play half of the games I liked on n64
[21:38] <@jiano> dolphin is prob better than pj64 now
[21:38] <+Kryssstal> yea
[21:38] <rog_> pj64 source was released a while back
[21:38] <+Kryssstal> what about it specifically?
[21:38] <Koobes> Both the mystical ninja games are broken
[21:38] <boris> why are n64 emulators so bad compared to emulators of any other console?
[21:38] <%mzxrules> n64 emus are shit only because the n64 is shit that plays golden games
[21:38] <+zodiac> i dont think anyone involved in making n64 emus has ever attempted to keep it accurate
[21:38] <@Cosmo> is bsnes frame accurate for alttp
[21:39] <+Kryssstal> no it has more lag than console lol
[21:39] <@Cosmo> and i heard snes9x is a little slower than console
[21:39] <@Cosmo> oh both have more lag ?
[21:39] <%mzxrules> boris, because the n64 is a shitty console
[21:39] <Kosmicd12> plz make dk64 compatible emu
[21:39] <+zodiac> for accuracy profile on bsnes you need a monster of a pc too
[21:39] <+Kryssstal> bsnes isn't perfect emulation, probably nothing is
[21:39] <+Kryssstal> but it's close
[21:39] <Koobes> Kosmicd12 pulling a full 180
[21:39] <+zodiac> i have a pretty good comp but i still get lag on that thing
[21:39] <+TestRunner> that's interesting
[21:39] <rog_> bsnes isn't that bad to run
[21:39] <+TestRunner> well, i think it might vary from game to game
[21:39] <+Kryssstal> bsnes is faster than 9x because bsnes is 60.0988 fps (or can be)
[21:39] <qwerty1605> lol dk64 compatible emu
[21:39] <Kosmicd12> game is messed up enough w/o emu
[21:39] <@jiano> any emu thats very close should be allowed, esp if its slowe than original console
[21:39] <+Kryssstal> snes9x is 59.94 and GT is 60.0
[21:39] <qwerty1605> good fucking luck
[21:39] <@Cosmo> i wonder if emu is allowed if its slower than console but banned if its faster lol
[21:40] <+Kryssstal> that's a good way to do it
[21:40] <Kosmicd12> can you race on ique
[21:40] <qwerty1605> I agree
[21:40] <+Kryssstal> like snes9x 1.43, uosnes, zsnes, etc are faster than console probably
[21:40] <boris> basically
[21:40] <qwerty1605> if it is slower allow
[21:40] <%mzxrules> i disagree since slower could mean easier timing for more frame perfect tricks
[21:40] <+TestRunner> yea
[21:40] <boris> there should be no way that an official version of the game is fucked out of the running
[21:40] <@jiano> n64 should be d isallowed just because it cant even run all n64 games lmao
[21:40] <Kosmicd12> ^
[21:40] <@Cosmo> iQue is official
[21:40] <boris> thats the goal i guess
[21:40] <@Cosmo> is it banned for OoT
[21:40] <+Kryssstal> snes9x 1.51-1.53 will lose 10-14 secs on lttp and 30 secs on yoshi's island 100%/smrpg etc
[21:40] <boris> gfuck!!!
[21:40] <+Kryssstal> due to framerate
[21:40] <boris> fuck ique ogm
[21:41] <@jiano> i think if the whole community is down for banning a version it should be fine to do that
[21:41] <rog_> why would ique be banned
[21:41] <%mzxrules> ique is banned because da chinese are banned
[21:41] <@jiano> but vc will neve rbe banned because every1 uses it
[21:41] <Kosmicd12> Accepted versions: N64 1.0, N64 1.1, N64 1.2, GCN, VC. Banned versions: VC 1.0/1.1 (injected WAD)
[21:41] <+TestRunner> i think this is a game specific cases
[21:41] <Kosmicd12> nothing about iQue
[21:41] <@Cosmo> ok people all say ban iQue and then some random guy starts doing runs on an iQue
[21:41] <+zodiac> ique would be banned because its faster and its really really rare
[21:41] <+zodiac> is my thought
[21:41] <boris> ok
[21:41] <boris> this guy has best ique run
[21:41] <Wodahs-Reklaw> iQ is just like where is that comming from
[21:41] <boris> but... who cares
[21:41] <Kosmicd12> lets make an iQue emulator
[21:41] <boris> idk
[21:42] <%mzxrules> ok kosmic
[21:42] <Exodus> doesnt ique have a big spirit temple glitch
[21:42] <%mzxrules> let's start by figuring out how the fuck the games are encrypted
[21:42] <Kosmicd12> not in any language i know
[21:42] <lilkcough1> what's ique?
[21:42] <Abahbob> isnt the glitch if you skip the first block or something?
[21:42] <Enterim> the Chinese release
[21:42] <Enterim> came out in 2003
[21:42] <Abahbob> then the chest won't appear
[21:42] <rog_> ique games are encrypted?
[21:43] <boris> ique is a rare chinese console
[21:43] <@Cosmo> kryssstal, do you think it would be shitty if the Alttp "WR" was labeled on a console run thats slower than ur run
[21:43] <boris> that a select few n64 games were released on
[21:43] <+Kryssstal> nah
[21:43] <Enterim> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQue
[21:43] <%mzxrules> from the files that alec sent me, they looked garbled by some process
[21:43] <Enterim> rather http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQue_Player
[21:43] <boris> cosmo, i think many other people would think it was shitty
[21:43] <+Kryssstal> because imo if you're gonna use slower emu for whatever reason, the disadvantage should come with it
[21:43] <Kosmicd12> we all know she actually has it anyways
[21:43] <Enterim> with its funky stupid controller
[21:43] <+Kryssstal> that is I don't see why console wouldn't have precedence
[21:44] <+Kryssstal> and this would only be an issue on stuff like SMW any% probably?
[21:44] <+Kryssstal> if it's a stupid situation where VC is faster by some frames
[21:44] <@Cosmo> hm well
[21:44] <rog_> gonna be honest, the ique controller looks better than n64's
[21:44] <+zodiac> the ique controller looks like dreamcast controller
[21:44] <boris> idk anything about smw snes/vc/emu diffs :(
[21:44] <@Cosmo> lets say Emu and console are split, the fastest console ALTTP run is labeled as "WR", and then as Kosmicd says everybody knows you have the faster time, so people would not take the leaderboard seriously
[21:44] <+Kryssstal> WR is a pretty silly term anyway because people always throw it on their video without research
[21:44] <@Cosmo> so basically the whole thing would be kind of fucked
[21:45] <@jiano> ya WR is silly term
[21:45] <Enterim> Paper Mario runners ought to switch to iQue imo
[21:45] <+Kryssstal> I think that would very rarely be an issue @ an emu run being 'better' just because it's slower
[21:45] <+Kryssstal> bow out to the faster console run imo
[21:45] <@jiano> if some1 beat  sigs time by 1 min on vc, itd be "wr" but no1 would care about it
[21:46] <+Runnerguy2489> <@jiano> ya WR is silly term
[21:46] <+Runnerguy2489> agreed
[21:46] <+Kryssstal> yea it doesn't really count @ stuff like VC sm64
[21:46] <+Kryssstal> as far as anyone even cares
[21:46] <+Kryssstal> I dunno why oot emu became a thing since it's not like nes/snes game
[21:47] <Wodahs-Reklaw> I just think that the current leaderbord is fine, as every time subitted has emu/vc/n64/gc, eng/jp is specified
[21:47] <@Cosmo> hm so
[21:47] <Wodahs-Reklaw> Also, vc inject shouldn't matter
[21:47] <+Kryssstal> Cosmo: http://i.imgur.com/979R6.png
[21:47] <Wodahs-Reklaw> thats my only arguement here
[21:47] <+Kryssstal> pic basically says the lag emulation of console, bsnes, snes9x 1.51+, and snesgt are same thing as far as anyone would ever care
[21:47] <Kosmicd12> wow snes9x is hax
[21:48] <Wodahs-Reklaw> if you want to make it less biased then have a different format so its not fastest time toatal
[21:48] <+Kryssstal> that's 1.43 kosmic
[21:48] <+Kryssstal> really old ver
[21:48] <Wodahs-Reklaw> and have a different visual representation or something
[21:48] <+Kryssstal> idk why people on tasvideos still use 1.43 lol
[21:48] <Kosmicd12> is it even more hax now
[21:48] <+Kryssstal> just because "it's faster"
[21:48] <RME> how did they count frames on console
[21:48] <Wodahs-Reklaw> I dont know its all psycology and arguing over things that really only matter to this community
[21:48] <+Kryssstal> capture card
[21:48] <RME> ah
[21:48] <RME> yeah
[21:49] <Kosmicd12> wait is faded out good or bad lol
[21:49] <+Kryssstal> ??
[21:49] <Kosmicd12> looks lke hes entering the room
[21:49] <@maxx> hi this discussion is still going
[21:49] <@maxx> has any progress been made
[21:49] <+Kryssstal> just look at the numbers
[21:49] <+TestRunner> not really
[21:49] <+Kryssstal> 776-779 for all versions
[21:50] <+Kryssstal> i.e. console, bsnes, 9x 1.51-1.53 (same lag core), and GT have the same emulation lol
[21:50] <@jiano> maxx i think most every1 agrees console s hould be favored over emu
[21:50] <@jiano> but thats about it
[21:50] <+Kryssstal> 9x is slower than console because of framerate but this should not be an issue for the leaderboard
[21:50] <@maxx> i can agree but it's hard
[21:50] <@maxx> and could be different for n64 vs nes/snes/gb
[21:50] <@Cosmo> im not sure what to do cause like if we only label console as WR i think some ppl would stop caring about leaderboards if emu ppl have fastrer times
[21:50] <@maxx> especially handheld shit
[21:50] <@maxx> if i ever did a run of LA for ZSR boards, it would be emulated for sure
[21:51] <@maxx> how would i stream a game boy
[21:51] <+TestRunner> good point
[21:51] <RME> very carefully
[21:51] <@jiano> i think thatd be good cosmo, cus if emu ppl actually care about the gamet theyd get console
[21:51] <@jiano> like they should
[21:51] <+Kryssstal> sgb stuff maxx but then you open up a huge can of worms there hahaha
[21:51] <@maxx> yeah isn't sgb like
[21:51] <@maxx> faster clockspeed
[21:51] <+Kryssstal> yeah by a lot
[21:51] <@maxx> haha
[21:51] <boris> really
[21:51] <boris> wtf
[21:51] <+TestRunner> O.o
[21:51] <+Kryssstal> all the gb players don't run the gb correctly