this is ryToday at 1:11 AM
But, well, many of them
Man I wish cave still made games
;_;

sp0thssToday at 1:15 AM
;__;
we just have to admit that public interest in stg is too low ;__;

this is ryToday at 1:52 AM
Hmm, I think STG might have a resurgence at some point
Its hard to say

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 1:54 AM
It wont
There’s no way a genre like stg could ever have a resurgence in the utterly sterilised modern day where if a thing takes more than 2 attempts 99.9% of people will drop it

sp0thssToday at 1:56 AM
sad but probably true

栄光の余映Today at 2:00 AM
maybe if Toby Fox suddenly shilled touhou for a whole year or smt then we'd get more 2hu peeps who might then play stgs proper
but it's likelier that that wouldnt create more stg players; it'd just create more secondaries
:niwatari_chicken:

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:01 AM
Yes

GhostToday at 2:22 AM
I mean eventually everything will circle back around
And people will get bored of instant gratification

this is ryToday at 2:27 AM
That's what I think ghost
I mean, just look at the WoW classic phenomenon - it's basically a massive middle finger by gamers to modern mmo design
I think we are gonna see a shift at some point
Plus, I don't think STG as a community is dying, I think it's pretty much in a plateau atm
And usually that's a good sign that the community is stable i.e. there isn't gonna be a drop off

sp0thssToday at 2:30 AM
modern mmo is definitely inferior
p2w bad

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:30 AM
Wow classic will probably die down within a few months

this is ryToday at 2:30 AM
It wont
There's no evidence to suggest that

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:31 AM
Theres only so much you can do in an updateless mmo before theres nothing left

this is ryToday at 2:31 AM
All the content isn't going to be available for a while
They're staggering the release
I imagine over a 2 year period

sp0thssToday at 2:32 AM
I mean, its an inherent problem of mmo games

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:32 AM
Wait so its not full vanilla wow?

this is ryToday at 2:33 AM
Only MC and Onyxia is available at launch
PvP isn't in Launch, Dire Maul isn't in Launch
As in, PvP system
PvP is ofc in there
Battlegrounds only get released months after the pvp system gets released too
Classic WoW wont last forever sure, but I think it's really important
I think it's gonna give big triple A companies a kick up the ass

GhostToday at 2:35 AM
I mean just in general you can tell people are getting tired of modern microtransaction filled AAA stuff

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:35 AM
Gaming reddit says that sure but they still swallow it anyway

this is ryToday at 2:35 AM
Though, as yahtzee from zero punctuation put it, we're on a verge of a videogame revolution

GhostToday at 2:35 AM
And there will probably be more laws coming down on lootboxes as time goes on

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:35 AM
Unless people actually boycott it then nothings going to change

this is ryToday at 2:36 AM
Things are changing, they just take time. it's not an overnight thing or anything.

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:36 AM
All i’ve seen is meaningless platitudes and shit like the latest asscreed or battlefront 2 making just as much money as they always do

this is ryToday at 2:36 AM
Big companies are losing a lot of their investors

GhostToday at 2:36 AM
I mean overwatch is dying right
Thats something

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:37 AM
Thats hardly because of the lootboxes

GhostToday at 2:37 AM
I mean its part of it

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:37 AM
Its because blizard is a shit company and puts out 1 update every trillion years
They’ve only added a handful of chars and maps since launch

sp0thssToday at 2:37 AM
:hahaa:

GhostToday at 2:37 AM
Constant updates are part of the problem

sp0thssToday at 2:37 AM
^

GhostToday at 2:37 AM
How do you fund constant development
Without microtransactions
This meme of like

this is ryToday at 2:38 AM
Subscription model was unironically good
Imo

GhostToday at 2:38 AM
Omg i paid full price for my game why should i pay more

sp0thssToday at 2:38 AM
I think esport-type games should have more stable versions
rather than constant updates

GhostToday at 2:38 AM
Then also complaining about not getting constant updates to your game youre not putting more money into
Subscription models are top tier

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:39 AM
Next gen graphics were a mistake

this is ryToday at 2:39 AM
Especially because subscription models are very pro consumer. Even in retail wow, when people don't like the game they unsub quite fast and the wow team fucking panics and makes sure to fix whatever has pissed off the playerbase
Graphics are annoying tbh

GhostToday at 2:40 AM
Overpriced dlc was just the precursor to microtransactions
Which is the best way to milk consumers

this is ryToday at 2:40 AM
I want the days of expansion sets again

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:40 AM
Next gen graphics are legit probably one of the worst things to happen to vidya next to micro transactions

GhostToday at 2:40 AM
Subscription models are way more fair and can also sustain constant development but like
Theyre less profitable than the lootbox meme
So

sp0thssToday at 2:40 AM
subscription model is the best

GhostToday at 2:41 AM
Gotta either wait for law to change
Or consumers to wise up
But you only need a minority to whale

this is ryToday at 2:41 AM
^

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:41 AM
It’ll have to be the former

this is ryToday at 2:41 AM
Whales are a fucking cancer
Can we just bitcoin fund the assassination of whales
I think we need a new totalbiscuit, despite what some people think of him he did a lot to educate consumers

GhostToday at 2:42 AM
I mean whales arent the problem its the devs deliberately profiting off them thats the problem

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:42 AM
Its both

GhostToday at 2:42 AM
Without whales the games wouldnt exist
In their current formats
Cos thats how theyre monetized
Hearthstone would die
It should die
But still

sp0thssToday at 2:43 AM
p2w system is the biggest mistake in gaming history

GhostToday at 2:43 AM
For profit gaming is the issue
like
Profit motive just leads to exploiting consumers being the #1 goal
Rather than consumer fun

sp0thssToday at 2:44 AM
;__;
no fun allowed

GhostToday at 2:44 AM
Nobody likes microtransactions but theyre the most profitable way to monetise your consumers

this is ryToday at 2:44 AM
Hmm, I think profit gaming isn't the issue, I think it's a few particular individuals not understanding how you want to monetise shit.
For example

GhostToday at 2:45 AM
What do you mean
They understand perfectly
lol

CrestedToday at 2:45 AM
it makes money

GhostToday at 2:45 AM
Maximising shareholder value bby

CrestedToday at 2:45 AM
so they so it
lmao

this is ryToday at 2:45 AM
Well they're going to get a backlash
It's a short term strategy
Maybe medium term

CrestedToday at 2:45 AM
who cares about backlash if you keep the dough rolling

this is ryToday at 2:45 AM
But it's certainly not a long term strategy

GhostToday at 2:45 AM
Yea thats how all companies work

sp0thssToday at 2:45 AM
again, sad but true

this is ryToday at 2:45 AM
The backlash is noticeable economically

GhostToday at 2:46 AM
Maximising short term value for shareholders to gain a greater leverage over the market you can exploit for more profit
lol
See epic

CrestedToday at 2:46 AM
public opinion be damned, those kids and tired moms won't know or care about how many microtransactions we put into football game

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:46 AM
I dont think gaming can ever go back to how it used to be, not since it got popular among a more mainstream crowd

GhostToday at 2:46 AM
Putting everything on their store

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:46 AM
Gamers rise up

CrestedToday at 2:46 AM
and the whales just keep giving us money

this is ryToday at 2:47 AM
It's not profitable in the long term though because it makes you an unstable investment.

GhostToday at 2:47 AM
Idk
Whats long term here

CrestedToday at 2:47 AM
no company cares about long term in current day

this is ryToday at 2:47 AM
Decades

GhostToday at 2:47 AM
Microtransactions only been increasing in usage since the farmville days
lol

CrestedToday at 2:48 AM
we can only hope that some companies and some games remain free from that shit from the community's voices and publishers' conscience
it's sad but it's become common for the initial reaction to any game reveal to be

GhostToday at 2:49 AM
Just look to indie shit
For actually fun games

CrestedToday at 2:49 AM
"don't add microtransactions"
"don't be Epic exclusive"

GhostToday at 2:50 AM
Epic exclusivity is so overblown

CrestedToday at 2:50 AM
literally the KSP2 reveal had such reactions

GhostToday at 2:50 AM
tbh
I dont use

CrestedToday at 2:50 AM
and thankfully the publishers seem to listen to the community here

GhostToday at 2:50 AM
99% of steam features

this is ryToday at 2:50 AM
There is a lot of power in having goodwill with your consumers. Banks do this a lot because they know they are better taking a loss in the short term to make money in the long term as if they don't treat you like shit they have you for life, cus it's really easy to switch banks. I think game developers really need to start doing this sort of thing again - fostering loyalty is profitable and you can only gain solid loyalty by good business practices.

GhostToday at 2:50 AM
People complain epic doesnt have
lol

CrestedToday at 2:51 AM
the thing about ksp community is that the steam workshop is very powerful there

GhostToday at 2:51 AM
@this is ry the mistake here is youre treating companies like people
Theres no bond
Between you and a company
There never has been

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:51 AM
Companies are the enemies of humanity

GhostToday at 2:51 AM
Idgaf about nintendo even if i play smash a lot
Omg communist @Toksyczny Kochanek

this is ryToday at 2:51 AM
Yes, but the majority of consumers don't realise that.

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:52 AM
Damn ghost you’re right

CrestedToday at 2:52 AM
and they profit off that obliviousness

this is ryToday at 2:52 AM
I mean, people used to have a bond between themselves and bethesda and blizzard

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:52 AM
Also i fucking hate how nintendrones act like nintendo is thier best friend

this is ryToday at 2:52 AM
But, well, I never hear that nearly as much these days

GhostToday at 2:52 AM
Well
They were mistaken
Companies care about consumers to the extent they maximise shareholder value

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:53 AM
While nintendo sends out cand’s to literally every fan project and rom site

GhostToday at 2:53 AM
Yea legit
Fuck
Nintendo

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:53 AM
And does shitty practices on the regular

GhostToday at 2:53 AM
For all that shit

this is ryToday at 2:53 AM
Well nintendo are protected by Japan's government

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:53 AM
Haha funni regi funny miyamoto

this is ryToday at 2:53 AM
And Japan's culture

CrestedToday at 2:53 AM
at this point the mario fangame community knows that their games will be short-lived

this is ryToday at 2:53 AM
'the company can't do no wrong' kinda mentality
Tbh whoever said that copyright laws protected artists can go suck my dick

CrestedToday at 2:54 AM
i'm betatesting Super Mario Flashback and they've been incredibly careful to not trip any lines, but if they end up getting the ol CnD it's just too bad

this is ryToday at 2:54 AM
All they do is support giant corporations

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 2:54 AM
Disney said that
Xd
Fuck disney especially, it along with big tech and big pharma need to get broken up as soon as possible but i doubt that will ever happen
Talk about living in a society

this is ryToday at 2:55 AM
I think it's gonna be interesting to see which game companies survive when the recession hits
I'm looking forward to it
(anyone with any sense should put their capital into something that isn't gonna lose it's value when that hits in the coming years cos, oh boy)
Wasn't the 2008 recession also the time when the last revolution happened in the gaming industry
I can't recall

CrestedToday at 3:01 AM
i don't know how much longer sc2 esports will survive

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:02 AM
Shorter than hearthstone esports
Xd

CrestedToday at 3:02 AM
feelsbadman
sc2 is getting more and more popular but activision's no longer interested in the franchaise
its death is inevitable

GhostToday at 3:02 AM
FGC esports is in a bubble right now

this is ryToday at 3:03 AM
It'll die with wc3 reforged

GhostToday at 3:03 AM
The consumers simply arent profitable the same way league viewers are
Yet these orgs keep pumping money in
Trying to claim real estate in the hopes it will become profitable later

CrestedToday at 3:04 AM
i think sc2 is sufficiently differentiated from wc3 reforged that the games will have different scenes but blizzard may switch funding

this is ryToday at 3:04 AM
There's gonna be a massive push for wc3 esports meaning any rts player who is good enough to make money is gonna go there

CrestedToday at 3:04 AM
wc3 is very different in gameplay though

this is ryToday at 3:05 AM
Yes, but the skillset required is transferable enough that anyone can make money off of it will go there

CrestedToday at 3:05 AM
i know full well that that scene will explode at first, but it's going to be like when BW remastered came out

this is ryToday at 3:05 AM
Nah it's different

CrestedToday at 3:05 AM
people try it out then go back when it doesn't work out

this is ryToday at 3:05 AM
WC3 reforged is very different from BW remastered

CrestedToday at 3:06 AM
...oh yeah i forgot they are improving gameplay mechanics for wc3

this is ryToday at 3:06 AM
Blizzard is already fucking with the wc3 meta in prep for it
(oh yeah they're adding hero skins too Xddddddd)

CrestedToday at 3:06 AM
i just hope that sc2 sustains enough interest to keep going, tbh

this is ryToday at 3:07 AM
It seems like wc3 reforged is gonna be the highlight of blizzcon for the warcraft franchise tbh

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:07 AM
Will blizzard have shills in the audience asking questions again this year

CrestedToday at 3:07 AM
they're releasing these war chests with unit skins and the money from them goes to sponsor blizzcon prize pool

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:07 AM
That was hillarious

this is ryToday at 3:08 AM
Lmao, probably
But there'll also be people like
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73yT9UXJLT0
YouTube
Catheriiine
Diablo Immortal Devs get BOO'ED at Q&A & "Is this an out of season...


Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:09 AM
https://youtu.be/hN3NX8xRpzQ
Fat guy at 52 seconds
YouTube
Lil Forte Rush
Diablo Immortals Q&A Day 2 lul ex. microtransaction and etc

What a fucking lol

this is ryToday at 3:10 AM
Stereotypical brainlet shill
I don't think he's a plant
Just a shill

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:11 AM
The same person ended up getting to ask a question on another day tho

this is ryToday at 3:12 AM
I did feel bad for the diablo guys on that stage since they apparently were supposed to announce diablo 4 and then it got postponed or some shit so they just had the phone stuff to present

CrestedToday at 3:12 AM
is there even a d4 announced yet

this is ryToday at 3:12 AM
Lol no

CrestedToday at 3:12 AM
then it got canned
yikes

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:12 AM
Good
Diablo is a shit franchise

this is ryToday at 3:13 AM
Tbh it's not impossible he got to ask another question
The lines for questions are first come first serve
If you want to ask a question, you have to really want to ask a question
An example is the original red shit guy
For wow
Asked a question in many blizcons
But apparently he had to optimize getting in the line each time
So despite him being a 'fan favourite' he didn't actually get preferential treatment despite what the casual observer thought
So this shill is probably just a super dedicated diablo fan who really wanted to ask questions
Tbh we need more game companies like from soft
But lmao

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:17 AM
Yea

this is ryToday at 3:17 AM
I go on fromsoft's wikipedia page

They really are fucking everywhere

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:18 AM
The disney of japan

this is ryToday at 3:20 AM
I do have optimism for the industry
Despite big devs being generally shitters, indies are putting out good work as always

Mokou Sheep 🐑Today at 3:20 AM
Crazy how the big devs are the bad ones

this is ryToday at 3:20 AM
People are more receptive to more arthousey games for example

GhostToday at 3:20 AM
Yea i think more people will look to indies
Over time
Which also means more touhou gamers maybe
Ahaha

Mokou Sheep 🐑Today at 3:20 AM
Indies will take over the game industry kappa

this is ryToday at 3:21 AM
You say that
But I don't think it's too far from the truth
In the long term

GhostToday at 3:21 AM
Idk why i play smash when like
I could be playing some indie fighter
Like brawhalla
With larger prize pools

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:22 AM
Like rivals of aether d:^)

GhostToday at 3:22 AM
And less players
No joke

this is ryToday at 3:22 AM
And it's probably better designed Xd

Mokou Sheep 🐑Today at 3:22 AM
Larger prize pools? You'd think it'd be less

GhostToday at 3:22 AM
Even indie devs pump more money into comp scene than nintendo
Fuck off nintendo

this is ryToday at 3:22 AM
No idea about either game :^)

Toksyczny KochanekToday at 3:23 AM
Nintendo cares deeply
They pumped hero into it after all d:^)