eUKFA Alliance Summit, 18th June '11

#eukfa.summit - 18th June 2011
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[17:08:48] McAfee01: Hello everyone, and welcome
[17:10:06] McAfee01: I would like to thank you all for attending
[17:11:04] McAfee01: The intention for this summit is to help our populace better understand matters of foreign affairs, and to indeed allow the population to make their own minds regarding alliances, nations and potential matters of interest on their own
[17:11:25] McAfee01: I would like to thank representatives of all alliances for attending
[17:12:13] McAfee01: Please read the summits agenda in the topic title for an inclination of what may be discussed, whilst also forwarding any questions you wish to ask the reps to either myself or Jamesw throughout the summit
[17:12:22] McAfee01: Now, we shall begin
[17:12:23] McAfee01: Jamesw?
[17:12:41] jamesw: ffffffff
[17:12:43] jamesw: ok
[17:13:07] jamesw: Firstly, I'd like to discuss the topic that I think most of the UK is really interested in, as it is one of the key reasons that our populace and congress disliked (and ultimately voted to leave) Terra
[17:13:14] ecksohh is now known as ecksohh|away
[17:13:14] jamesw: No surprises: that topic is ireland
[17:13:35] jamesw: Obviously, Iaswn as a member of EDEN HQ you will support them, and angeldav you will be against them as you are ONE
[17:13:40] jamesw: However, dermont|afk
[17:13:58] jamesw: As they are a relatively small nation, who can offer little damage in the face of ONE; as HQ of Terra - what are your thoughts on Ireland?
[17:14:09] jamesw: Are they worth the MPP damage that EDEN and Brazil/USA/Canada invest?
[17:15:00] dermont|afk: not in my opinion
[17:15:30] jamesw: So you'd agree with what I and a fair few others have said: its a joke that EDEN have prioritised the UK-Ireland war (and invested huge amounts of damage there) when it could have been better used in France
[17:15:42] dermont|afk: i think its on of the most annoying wars if you count cromania vs serbia&hungary
[17:15:57] dermont|afk: yup
[17:16:50] jamesw: Ok, well, lets ask EDEN directly
[17:17:21] jamesw: Iaswn - Whilst I admit it is pretty impressive for EDEN to invest this  amount of damage in RWs and MPP fights, do you not think it could have been put to much greater use elsewhere?
[17:17:33] Iaswn: Imo every member nation needs the support of the alliance
[17:17:47] Iaswn: no matter its size in terms of dmg
[17:18:13] Iaswn: ofc there are battles more important from time to time
[17:18:24] Iaswn: but this doesnt mean that we should let the others die
[17:18:36] Iaswn: because ours is bigger
[17:18:56] jamesw: well, on the subject of important battles
[17:19:23] jamesw: Wouldn't you say that protecting the USA and France is of much greater importance than Ireland?
[17:19:33] jamesw: If nothing else, it would save you a lot of damage in the long run
[17:19:45] Iaswn: I dont argue that
[17:19:53] jamesw: Now, you have RWs to fight in France (as well as Germany), whilst also trying to stop ONE in the form of Spain, Hungary, Poland
[17:20:14] Iaswn: but still this doesnt mean that I would let a country dissappear just because they have less damage to offer
[17:20:23] Iaswn: this is why they belong into our alliance
[17:20:35] Iaswn: this is why we call eden a brotherhood
[17:20:42] jamesw: ok
[17:21:02] angeldav: fine
[17:21:07] jamesw: We've seen heavy ONE fighting in the UK-Irish war as well, and obviously, so far its going well for the UK
[17:21:30] angeldav: yes, that's it
[17:21:37] jamesw: However, is this because ONE is genuinely fighting for the UK interest, or just using this as an opportunity to drain EDEN/ for propoganda purposes?
[17:22:16] angeldav: well, since Serbia had always good relations with the UK, the interest are not only to drain EDEN or making propaganda
[17:22:27] angeldav: in fact, UK hasn't been as TOP Prio in our battles
[17:22:44] angeldav: but we always cared about them with the countries whose have a MPP with them
[17:23:15] jamesw: ok, thats sort of a topic that we can touch on later
[17:23:38] jamesw: If anyone has ireland related questions -> #eukfa.talk and ping me, or /query me or McAfee01
[17:23:45] jamesw: Otherwise, we'll move on to the second topic
[17:24:11] Iaswn: may I reverse the question jamesw
[17:24:11] Iaswn: ?
[17:24:14] jamesw: sure
[17:24:38] Iaswn: Uk hasnt that dmg either
[17:24:49] jamesw: please feel free to discuss/debate others points, it will take some time for us to gather questions
[17:24:59] Iaswn: why do you belong in an alliance?
[17:25:12] ecksohh|away: you'd be suprised sometimes, i think we are stronger than a lot of nations give us credit for
[17:25:32] Iaswn: ecksohh|away I am talking in terms of the so called strong countries
[17:25:42] ecksohh|away: but yes, fair point
[17:26:08] Iaswn: what I mean here is that we all have to think of the small countries as equal members of our alliances
[17:26:42] Iaswn: and other wise only 10 countries are important in erep
[17:26:58] Iaswn: if the only thing that matters is the dmg
[17:27:32] vingaer: well we all know dmg isnt the only thing that matters :)
[17:28:08] jamesw: Just to continue this debate a bit
[17:28:35] jamesw: We have seen Germany-Poland many many times, and imo, very few times has Germany's allies been able to, or seriously tried to, withstand Poland
[17:28:48] jamesw: This is a clear case of Germany being much smaller, economically, militarily and in terms of population
[17:29:10] jamesw: So, taking this on board; is it really that different from UK-Ireland?
[17:29:26] jamesw: We may not be serbia, but in relation to Ireland, we are superior by quite some way
[17:29:59] jamesw: aeriala: as Terra SC, any thoughts?
[17:30:27] Iaswn: true story but as i said if all that matters is the size then 9 out of 10 counties in erep are powerless= useless
[17:30:29] aeriala: the problem i see with it is, that it's draining our forces of the eden/terra co-operation
[17:30:43] aeriala: i will not put terra into that war
[17:31:04] aeriala: but it still hurts us on the overall front of working together
[17:31:21] vingaer: nope, size doesn't matter imo, what matters is coordination
[17:31:28] vingaer: and will of cooperation
[17:32:17] aeriala: i know UK wants to help france
[17:32:39] aeriala: i'd like to see that but it's hard when there's an extra dmg drain going on
[17:33:09] jamesw: ok
[17:33:14] aeriala: i've been trying to work with eden to collabrate our foces on the real wars
[17:33:49] jamesw: I'm not so sure they're ready, on the evidence of today aeriala :3
[17:34:01] aeriala: you might be surprised
[17:34:12] jamesw: Anyway, i've got some citizen based questions now, and then unless there are more points either person would like to bring up, we will move on
[17:34:19] jamesw: Firstly, vingaer
[17:34:27] jamesw: How will ONE find a way to blame jamesw?
[17:34:56] vingaer: well, jamesw is an easy target to blame for a lot of things
[17:34:57] aeriala: that's a given
[17:35:28] aeriala: i stubbed my toe, blame jamesw
[17:35:50] vingaer: he even blames himself sometimes, so i am sure
[17:36:00] vingaer: it wont be hard to find some way :F
[17:37:01] McAfee01: As it seems Jamesw must dash to try and beat the sell by date of his next McDonalds meal, I shall be taking over for a lil while
[17:37:02] McAfee01: Sorry
[17:37:15] McAfee01: Next question
[17:37:46] McAfee01: This question is directed towards TERRA
[17:38:38] McAfee01: Why does your alliance deem it necessary to let Brazil/USA/Canada MPP Ireland and waste damage, if they want to focus elsewhere?
[17:39:20] McAfee01: Dermont|afk: Aeriala?
[17:39:29] aeriala: it's not deemed necessary, and those battles are never prioritized
[17:39:39] aeriala: i can't control individuals
[17:39:58] aeriala: however there has never been an order to fight there
[17:40:06] McAfee01: So you're saying Ireland is a negligible battle concern?
[17:40:24] aeriala: in the grander scheme yes, look at the world
[17:40:42] McAfee01: Okay
[17:40:57] McAfee01: Now Iaswn:
[17:41:37] McAfee01: How do you see EDEN helping Greece return to the map, in the face of the recent successes of the Macedonian military?
[17:42:28] Iaswn: you want me to express our strategy?
[17:42:44] ecksohh|away: lol, yes please
[17:42:47] ecksohh|away: :3
[17:42:50] Iaswn: sorry i wont
[17:42:53] Iaswn: :)
[17:42:58] McAfee01: He was joking Iaswn
[17:43:02] Iaswn: ofc
[17:43:19] angeldav: if strategy means CVV Code of Mastercard, then I agree... :F
[17:43:26] McAfee01: But do you see returning them as more of a short or long term goal?
[17:43:34] ecksohh|away: heh, do you think it would be more of a co-ordinated large eden thing, or just wait until you are able to get MKD when they are focused elsewhere
[17:44:02] Iaswn: I am not going to talk about strategy in here sorry
[17:44:19] McAfee01: Okay, we shall pass this
[17:44:26] Iaswn: but when the time will be right Greece will become free
[17:44:28] McAfee01: We shall have 3 more questions, then we shall move on
[17:48:27] McAfee01: Do you believe EDEN prioritises its own battles over much more important ones in Terra (for example, France, Germany)?
[17:48:27] aeriala: i don't really ask for direct support often, i ask them to co-ordinate more timing and district
[17:48:38] Iaswn: Is this a summit or a public trial cause I am losing the point here
[17:48:41] McAfee01: But do you believe that the recent French battles could have been better supported from both alliances?
[17:48:46] aeriala: it would be rude of me to ask them to stop their own fights to prioritize ours
[17:49:01] McAfee01: France is an important matter for the eUK, considering how close our two nations are
[17:49:12] McAfee01: But this is the last question, and we shall move on
[17:50:12] vingaer: may i say something reg the matter of france :>?
[17:50:22] McAfee01: Ofc vingaer
[17:50:42] vingaer: eden's agenda has always been both saving the small nations and sacrificing them for the greater cause, brotherhood spirit etc.
[17:51:04] vingaer: the current policy towards ireland is mostly unclear to us, since saving them meant sacrificing  >allied countries such as usa and france that you have mentioned
[17:51:45] vingaer: well, usa isn't technically lost yet, but all odds indicate they might face a tough war
[17:52:34] McAfee01: Do you believe EDEN + terra will be working much closer during the next few weeks than of late, in able to support each other in what can be regarded as essential battles?
[17:52:41] McAfee01: This IS the last question
[17:52:50] McAfee01: Also, Dermont:afk: O_Neill: Aeriala: angeldav: Iaswn: vingaer: Would you like a 10 minute break?
[17:53:05] aeriala: i had to push a wall
[17:53:22] vingaer: yeah it would be great
[17:53:26] angeldav: I don't mind :)
[17:53:28] aeriala: i think we are working together well
[17:53:45] aeriala: i talk to sturmann mostly since i know him best
[17:54:05] aeriala: but plans seen to come together on time
[17:54:14] McAfee01: Thank you Aeriala
[17:54:24] McAfee01: We shall recommence at :05
[17:54:41] vingaer: kk
[17:54:51] McAfee01: If you wish to discuss questions asked so far, feel free to join us in #eukfa.talk
[17:54:52] aeriala: ok
[17:54:53] McAfee01: Thank you
[18:05:14] McAfee01: And we begin
[18:05:29] McAfee01: This next segment will be focusing upon international thoughts towards the eUK
[18:05:41] McAfee01: Firstly, TERRA
[18:06:21] McAfee01: Aeriala: dermont|afk: What are your thoughts on past + present views of the country?
[18:07:23] aeriala: frankly at the moment i don't care, past present whatever, you wanna be on youtr own fine
[18:07:57] aeriala: i'm happy to ignore you for now with the present other problems
[18:08:27] McAfee01: But when the current problems resolve themselves, what will be your future inclination of the eUK?
[18:08:39] McAfee01: Will it be ignore, invade, reaffiliate with?
[18:08:47] aeriala: to continue to ignore it, why would we care
[18:09:07] dermont|afk: well from german stand its clearly we are still brothers
[18:09:22] aeriala: frankly if you wanted back onboard i'm fine with that but i can't see it as long as you are picking on ireland
[18:09:43] dermont|afk: i dont think we will agree to any action against you as long as you dont make any stupid moves against terra
[18:09:54] aeriala: as far as invading you there's no interest
[18:09:56] McAfee01: So if the eUK ceased hostilities with Ireland, you could potentially see a future between us?
[18:10:08] aeriala: it is possible
[18:10:12] dermont|afk: yeah
[18:10:25] McAfee01: Thank you
[18:10:31] McAfee01: Iaswn
[18:10:49] McAfee01: What do you feel is EDEN's past + present thoughts on the eUK?
[18:12:43] McAfee01: Iaswn? Are you here?
[18:12:50] Iaswn: Imho I feel that you havent cleared where you belong
[18:12:55] Iaswn: yup I am :)
[18:13:35] Iaswn: and I also believe that eUK is divided in 2 sides
[18:13:51] McAfee01: But from an alliance perspective, do you feel the eUK could ever respectively work alongside EDEN in future diplomacy, or do you feel relations are too strained to even consider affiliation between each other?
[18:14:26] O_Neill: so
[18:14:32] Iaswn: I believe that this can happen
[18:14:34] O_Neill: for france UK is still an ally
[18:14:54] Iaswn: but steps must be done
[18:15:08] McAfee01: Thank you Iaswn
[18:15:12] Iaswn: actually is up to you
[18:15:13] O_Neill: as long as like said dermont|afk
[18:16:02] McAfee01: O_Neill: How would you like to see the eUK in say two months between our two states?
[18:16:20] McAfee01: Could we possibly work closer military, diplomatically or economically?
[18:16:47] O_Neill: yes we can, the future will depend of the evolution of terra and eden
[18:16:57] O_Neill: is they merge
[18:17:04] O_Neill: is some new alliances arrive
[18:17:14] O_Neill: a lot of unknow things
[18:17:34] O_Neill: but with no dirrect conflict both country will stay ally like germany :)
[18:17:42] jamesw: Well, with china in the balance, things are uncertain for sure
[18:17:44] jamesw: O_Neill: dermont|afk may I ask
[18:17:46] jamesw: One of the most popular routes in the UK, at present, is for non-alignment, with strasbourg
[18:18:08] jamesw: ie, we work with whichever alliance we feel is best suited to us at the time, but always maintain strasbourg as the important part of our foreign affairs
[18:18:18] jamesw: if we have to defend against EDEN: we would have ONE
[18:18:22] jamesw: if defending against ONE, EDEN, etc
[18:19:10] O_Neill: yes but we know that non-alignement is a dangerous and non viable way
[18:19:16] O_Neill: we see it with the entente
[18:19:36] O_Neill: clearly the game only permeat a bipolar alliances
[18:20:06] jamesw: so you would say Strasbourg and ONE are mutually exclusive in the future?
[18:20:07] Iaswn: ^^ True story
[18:20:28] Iaswn: I meant what O_Neill said
[18:20:54] O_Neill: not exclusive
[18:21:01] O_Neill: we don't know how future will be
[18:21:08] O_Neill: if terra is dissolved
[18:21:27] O_Neill: i can't predict what french people will prefer beetwen eden and one
[18:21:35] jamesw: hmm, this is true
[18:21:39] jamesw: Iaswn
[18:21:47] jamesw: Would you say EDEN and strasbourg would be mutually exclusive?
[18:21:59] jamesw: For instance, if orders are to fight for say, bulgaria, who are attacking
[18:22:09] jamesw: UK would prioritise any french/german defence
[18:22:27] Iaswn: imo there is no neutrality in this game
[18:22:39] Iaswn: one way or the other you support someone
[18:22:53] Iaswn: battles are 1vs1
[18:23:11] jamesw: ok
[18:23:24] Iaswn: i think is clear that eden & terra have same enemies
[18:23:32] Iaswn: and abc and one also
[18:23:48] Iaswn: so as O_Neill said the game is bipolar
[18:24:04] jamesw: Do you think that a relationship such as UK/FR/DE, or CR/RO (and countries ignoring alliance orders in favour of their best friends) are compatible with alliances?
[18:24:14] Iaswn: nope
[18:24:22] Iaswn: they will simply dissappear soon
[18:24:26] vingaer: it is bipolar only is the majority chooses to make it bipolar :)
[18:24:38] O_Neill: it's possible jamesw
[18:24:45] O_Neill: if they are in the same side
[18:24:57] O_Neill: or in long term it's will be hard
[18:25:04] Iaswn: sorry guys I ll be back in 2 mins
[18:25:24] O_Neill: vingaer: now we are 3 polar
[18:25:31] O_Neill: terra eden one
[18:25:37] O_Neill: and one beat everyone
[18:25:54] O_Neill: so it's obvious that something not bipolar can't survive
[18:26:22] O_Neill: jamesw: we  see that with argentina
[18:26:46] Iaswn: O_Neill is still bipolar
[18:26:58] Iaswn: terra and one have same "enemies"
[18:27:04] Iaswn: terra and eden sorry
[18:27:04] vingaer: well, i would say it's 2.5-polar, if we are making strange comparisons in here
[18:27:08] vingaer: you guys are cooperating
[18:27:19] O_Neill: yes but it not all bibolar we could make 3 pole if we want
[18:27:20] vingaer: and seem to have common goals
[18:27:31] O_Neill: yes
[18:27:32] vingaer: so we can't really call it a multipolar world, can we?
[18:29:29] jamesw: tbh, in my experience at the top of Terra, the relationship of Terra-EDEN is one of mutual dependence
[18:29:38] vingaer: i'd say small, regional alliances can work in this game
[18:29:45] jamesw: Apart from the odd blip; China/Japan, UK/Ireland, etc
[18:29:50] vingaer: as long as they have their own agenda
[18:29:54] vingaer: which differs from the others
[18:30:01] vingaer: abc can serve as an example
[18:30:45] jamesw: I am not so sure what you mean vingaer
[18:30:49] jamesw: ABC are small, yes
[18:31:01] O_Neill: ABC is one extention
[18:31:08] jamesw: But as an alliance they rely on outside damage, both directly and indirectly
[18:32:01] vingaer: what i am implying jamesw
[18:32:09] vingaer: is that de/fra/uk could work as well
[18:32:18] jamesw: but it would not be independent
[18:32:18] vingaer: based on similar principles as abc
[18:32:25] jamesw: It would rely on either EDEN/ONE
[18:32:35] vingaer: well if by independence you mean superior strength.. :P
[18:32:43] jamesw: not only for direct damage, but also to distract the other "bloc" from being able to invade it
[18:32:47] O_Neill: .access add 4 sheik_tonboule
[18:32:49] O_Neill: :/
[18:32:57] jamesw: o>O O_Neill
[18:33:13] vingaer: abc uses diplomacy wisely
[18:33:30] vingaer: war isn't the only mean of achieving your goals in here ;)
[18:33:35] jamesw: hmm
[18:33:53] jamesw: Are you implying ABC could have conquered Russia/Finland/Norway without ONE not only fighting in its wars, but also, distracting the majority of Terra/EDEN elsewhere? :3
[18:34:28] sheik_tonboule: Thank you as O_Neill just say I'm a assistant of french FA, nice too meet you ;)
[18:34:35] jamesw: to me, this does not create a multi-polar dimension, it simply fragments a bi-polar dimension from ONE/EDEN into ONE/ABC to EDEN/Terra
[18:34:49] jamesw: ABC will never really align with EDEN, just as Terra will never really align with ONE
[18:34:49] vingaer: they rather wisely used the fact that one was distracting terra and eden elsewhere :)
[18:35:43] O_Neill: for me ABC is not a pole
[18:35:51] O_Neill: it's an extention
[18:36:12] O_Neill: they could not exsit without a strong alliance
[18:36:40] O_Neill: if ABC attack russia without one MPP they will not be on the map :P
[18:37:08] vingaer: here comes the diplomacy
[18:37:42] jamesw: yes, it is diplomacy vingaer
[18:37:44] jamesw: But it does not make them a third "power"
[18:37:55] O_Neill: i agree jamesw
[18:37:59] vingaer: oh, i never said that jamesw
[18:38:11] vingaer: what i mean is that there is a way other than
[18:38:23] vingaer: being a member of one of the big alliances
[18:38:26] Iaswn: guys we are circling around the same thing
[18:38:29] jamesw: well, ABC are de-facto members really :3
[18:38:31] vingaer: and still being successful :P
[18:38:32] Iaswn: call it whatever you like
[18:38:41] Iaswn: the game has to poles
[18:38:46] Iaswn: *two
[18:38:57] Iaswn: and there are some extensions
[18:39:00] Iaswn: on each pole
[18:39:23] Iaswn: poles are defined based on their enemies
[18:39:50] Iaswn: when 5 alliances 1 big and 4 small have the same enemy
[18:39:53] Iaswn: this is one pole
[18:39:57] O_Neill: i think we all agree that
[18:40:29] O_Neill: i think for some time we can stay in both pole like we do now
[18:40:40] O_Neill: because of strong friendship
[18:40:43] vingaer: yes, as long as they all wish to view it as the only way
[18:41:09] O_Neill: but we have to be in the same pole if we don't want to see the treaty destroyed
[18:41:25] O_Neill: vingaer: it's as the game round
[18:43:03] jamesw: ok, i think now is the time to move on
[18:43:25] jamesw: The next topic for discussion, is the future
[18:43:35] jamesw: vingaer?
[18:43:42] vingaer: future?
[18:43:46] jamesw: :)
[18:43:58] vingaer: you do have to be more precise jamesw
[18:44:09] O_Neill: future is unknow will terra -eden merge ? or terra desapear ? eden ?
[18:44:16] jamesw: What do you envisage the future is, for ONE?
[18:44:27] jamesw: Obviously for plans: there is the USA
[18:44:29] O_Neill: they get the world XD
[18:44:29] vingaer: uncertain and unknown
[18:44:35] jamesw: For fears: are you worried about EDEN/Terra merging?
[18:44:37] jamesw: etc :3
[18:44:47] vingaer: well, we are a superior military power atm
[18:44:57] vingaer: and fortune favours us right now
[18:45:10] vingaer: still we are aware that this state may not last forever
[18:45:37] vingaer: so yeah, while we seem to be able to do it, we would like to go for a small world tour :)
[18:46:29] vingaer: if eden and terra merged, it might create an interesting situation in the game
[18:46:48] vingaer: however i doubt they will, given the fact eden sacrificed terra members ;P
[18:48:25] jamesw: ok, Iaswn
[18:48:40] jamesw: For EDEN, is the future a merge with Terra, or do you forsee other plans?
[18:49:07] Iaswn: regarding that this is something that should not bother the public not for now at least
[18:49:26] Iaswn: this is something between the 2 of us
[18:49:39] Iaswn: for now we are 2 alliances
[18:50:00] Iaswn: we both have same enemies and if something like merging occur
[18:50:22] Iaswn: may change things or it may not
[18:50:50] Iaswn: the coordination of the nations that belong on both alliances is clear
[18:51:18] Iaswn: also the coordination of the alliances in general
[18:51:25] Iaswn: as 2 bodies
[18:51:43] jamesw: I see
[18:51:48] jamesw: Emerick, dermont|afk
[18:51:58] jamesw: Would you agree that, at least for now, Terra/EDEN are seperate alliances?
[18:52:51] Iaswn: 2 alliances with similar targets and the same enemies
[18:53:55] jamesw: e_e
[18:54:15] jamesw: hmm, ok maybe we'll skip Terra :3
[18:54:24] jamesw: O_Neill: What are your thoughts on the future of Strasbourg?
[18:54:35] sheik_tonboule: I have a question, if there are a merge of eden-terra, would uk be on the side of this new bloc ?
[18:55:00] jamesw: I think that based on the past, it is hard to see that happening
[18:55:26] jamesw: After all, EDEN/Terra supporting EDEN as seperate bodies was one of the main reasons that the UK left Terra
[18:55:44] jamesw: So for a merged EDEN/Terra to support them, changes only the fact it is one body, not two
[18:56:38] aeriala: there's still problems to be ironed out between the alliances, it's easier to just co-ordinate for now
[18:56:47] jamesw: oh aeriala sorry i forgot you were there
[18:56:52] O_Neill: XD
[18:57:03] jamesw: Could you give a Terra perspective on the possible EDEN/Terra merge?
[18:57:04] aeriala: yea i'm in 6 different places atm
[18:57:23] O_Neill: jamesw: for the future i can tell that with big problem he will continue
[18:58:01] O_Neill: with no big problem*
[18:58:04] aeriala: it's a distration right now, i'm in no rush, i'm fine that we are working together atm
[18:58:39] aeriala: at some point once some things are ironed out there'll be more time to discuss it
[18:59:07] Emerick: Sorry, I thought this was done
[18:59:10] Emerick: <jamesw> Would you agree that, at least for now, Terra/EDEN are seperate alliances?
[18:59:13] aeriala: emerick has been trying to talk to get some progress made
[18:59:18] Emerick: Yeah, it is
[18:59:23] vingaer: hello Emerick :)
[18:59:29] Emerick: sup
[18:59:45] Emerick: The US left Eden for a reason, and we don't intend to rejoin it ever again
[19:00:04] Emerick: Terra doesn't plan to merge with Eden, there are too many conflicts
[19:00:28] Emerick: We have a somewhat tense cooperation, but we work together for the sake of both parties
[19:00:44] Emerick: And when there's an issue, there are concessions on both sides
[19:00:48] Emerick: Always
[19:00:53] aeriala: otherwise we are happy with the co-ordination
[19:02:00] jamesw: You mentioned conflicts
[19:02:23] jamesw: If they are serious enough to stop the two parties merging, can the co-operation of both parties continue indefinitely?
[19:03:02] Emerick: Meaning until the game ends?
[19:03:19] Emerick: Or there's another alliance split?
[19:03:20] Iaswn: Emerick ^^ this will happen soon
[19:03:21] Iaswn: :P
[19:03:24] Emerick: Or what
[19:03:26] Emerick: ikr~
[19:03:33] jamesw: Either/or
[19:04:09] jamesw: Basically, is it possible that EDEN/Terra could be in a serious conflict one day?
[19:04:14] Emerick: We'll cooperate as long as we're both threatened by the same enemy
[19:04:38] Emerick: It's possible, but it'd need some serious reorganization of power for that to happen
[19:04:54] Emerick: Status quo, I'd say no
[19:05:24] Emerick: Given a few months or a year, I can't tell you what's going to happen
[19:05:46] Emerick: People are so bored with this game that they're doing whatever it takes to keep themselves entertained
[19:05:53] jamesw: ofc, no-one can really forsee the next huge babyboom
[19:06:06] jamesw: But essentially, you don't see any ties which make conflict on an individual or group scale, impossible?
[19:06:08] Emerick: Unless they're Poland, you're right
[19:06:43] Emerick: Nothing's impossible with the current state of the game
[19:08:37] jamesw: Ok, i've got a few citizens based questions now if thats ok
[19:08:51] Emerick: I'm ok with this.
[19:08:53] jamesw: Firstly, for you Emerick
[19:09:07] jamesw: What conflicts between EDEN/Terra are stopping any merger?
[19:10:01] Emerick: Japan/China and there's a general ill feeling towards Greece in most Terran countries
[19:10:27] Emerick: Also, if we're talking full merger, it'd be cumbersome and just awful
[19:10:32] jamesw: Ok, thank you for that
[19:10:47] jamesw: Another one for you Emerick o>O
[19:11:03] jamesw: Now that you've established you will not rejoin EDEN, and Terra cannot win anywhere, how long it is until the USA joins ONE?
[19:11:13] Emerick: If we were to go the ONE route and cut the fat, well, I don't see either of us cutting ties with our less populated friends
[19:11:25] Emerick: >Servia
[19:11:40] Emerick: >allying with the US
[19:12:08] vingaer: life may be full of surprises Emerick
[19:12:15] Emerick: It'll happen as soon as Croatia joins them
[19:13:18] Emerick: idk, I don't see that alliance happening, nor do I see future US leadership being so ruthless that they'd fight against former allies so readily
[19:13:38] Emerick: It's a game, so even if we're beaten in war, who cares?
[19:13:47] Emerick: It's not that big of a deal
[19:14:05] Emerick: We're not scared of dying on th einternet
[19:14:22] vingaer: that's a healthy approach
[19:14:26] Emerick: The game
[19:14:29] jamesw: ffffff
[19:14:49] jamesw: Finally, I think that O_Neill and dermont|afk are best suited to answer this question
[19:15:06] jamesw: How would you compare Terra/EDEN co-operation, with the co-operation of Strasbourg?
[19:16:15] O_Neill: it's hard to compare terra/eden it's a lot of coutry in different continents
[19:16:47] O_Neill: we have better co-operation because we are clother and only 3
[19:18:13] jamesw: Ok, thank you
[19:18:19] jamesw: One last question.
[19:18:30] jamesw: The guy who asked it is a bit simple, so I will leave it to anyone to answer it
[19:18:31] jamesw: the uk tries to remain neutral and we joined terra but due to various issues we had to leave.  We try to remain friendly with lots of countries but for some reason Terra and Eden countries keep trying to push us towards ONE.  Is this the intention?
[19:19:11] Emerick: How is he seeing E/T pushing the UK towards ONE?
[19:19:35] jamesw: He said something about Ireland, ignoring France/Germany, etc
[19:19:39] jamesw: but i cut that bit out!
[19:19:58] vingaer: well, we are not looking for any kind of conflict with you, and we are open to a possibility of cooperation with the uk
[19:20:05] Emerick: Ireland meaning my personal reaction to it as US president two months ago?
[19:20:09] vingaer: your choice is your business and we have no right to make it for you
[19:20:16] vingaer: all we can do is to respect it ;)
[19:20:38] jamesw: You weren't specifically mentioned
[19:21:00] jamesw: I believe he was referring to the MPPs, and the general continued massive support that EDEN and USA/Canada/Brazil offer
[19:21:21] Emerick: Well, I was referenced heavily in Woldy's address, so I assumed it had soething to do with me
[19:21:30] jamesw: We've moved on since Woldy
[19:21:34] jamesw: At least, i'd hope so ._.
[19:21:41] Emerick: I really have no idea who fights for Ireland
[19:21:50] Emerick: I've never recieved any orders to do so from my superiors
[19:21:53] Iaswn: do you believe that EDEN should leave one member nation to dissappear just because someone is asking so?
[19:21:59] Emerick: I'm sure that people do, though
[19:22:04] Emerick: I mean, we realy like Ireland
[19:22:14] aeriala: TCO in canada has strong ties to ireland and TCO is a militia, they will do what they do, we don't control them
[19:22:15] Iaswn: does this make any sense? cause it doesnt make any for me
[19:22:42] vingaer: Iaswn in eden it's called 'sacrificing a country for the greater reasons' and yes, you sometimes do it :)
[19:22:54] Emerick: The UK-Ireland war is a single event that happens to be a conflict of interest between the UK and Eden and a few Terran nations
[19:23:05] Iaswn: sometimes this may happen
[19:23:21] Emerick: I don't see how we're ignoring France and Germany, however
[19:23:22] Iaswn: but this doesnt mean that we dont care about the small countries
[19:23:46] vingaer: isn't it why sweden left?
[19:23:53] vingaer: they were ignored iirc
[19:23:54] Emerick: We've been focusing on RWs around the world since I became SG
[19:24:04] Emerick: Russia was priority because it was entirely conquered
[19:24:13] Iaswn: sweden left 4 months ago to be honest almost past my time
[19:24:20] Emerick: We've had successes p much everywhere, though
[19:24:30] Iaswn: so I am not goin to discuss what happened a year ago
[19:24:38] Emerick: >caring about Sweden
[19:24:40] vingaer: > a year ago
[19:24:44] Emerick: Is this conversation really happening
[19:25:30] Iaswn: and as emerick said both alliances support both france and germany
[19:25:34] Iaswn: and not only those
[19:25:47] vingaer: idk Iaswn over one year in eden has taught me some problems remain the same in there
[19:26:10] Iaswn: I am not here to discuss about eden
[19:26:19] Iaswn: nor the past of it
[19:26:43] vingaer: why are you here then?
[19:27:14] Iaswn: vingaer if you want a trolling war I am not going to follow
[19:27:48] Iaswn: this summit has an agenda and EDENs issues strategies and so on are not among them
[19:27:50] vingaer: if a discussion is what you call trolling :o
[19:28:21] jamesw: oh u!
[19:28:31] jamesw: I think we've pretty much covered every angle of that, so thanks for your questions.
[19:28:43] jamesw: The next agenda'd topic is priorities
[19:29:04] jamesw: As you are so active, vingaer - What would you say are the short and long term priorities within ONE?
[19:29:43] vingaer: well, the obvious priority is to try to remain a dominating power
[19:30:05] vingaer: as well as to strengthen the bonds between the member states
[19:30:30] vingaer: we have a short history together, so we have to make one every day
[19:30:54] vingaer: in order to remain happy together for a longer period of time ;)
[19:31:12] jamesw: Would you envisage ONE expanding in the future?
[19:31:42] jamesw: Or perhaps, incorporating countries such as Indonesia etc, as official members?
[19:32:18] vingaer: taking new members in isn't a bad idea and we are all looking forward to it
[19:32:39] vingaer: we don't want to do it fast and wild though
[19:33:08] vingaer: so everyone we want to take in has to be ready to join the alliance
[19:34:05] vingaer: we'd like to avoid wild expansion without thinking it through first and solving all problems BEFORE taking in new members :P
[19:34:27] jamesw: This slow approach was also shown at the inception of ONE
[19:35:04] vingaer: in reality it was a long-term process :)
[19:35:11] jamesw: Whilst it is good to be cautious, and you certainly reaped the benefits; at one point this approach lead to Serbia being reduced to only a few regions, and also saw long-term allies of both Poland/Spain, and Serbia/Hungary joining Terra.
[19:35:27] jamesw: Are you not worried that a long delay could also end badly for you, in regard to new members?
[19:36:05] vingaer: yeah, it is something which worries us, but on the other hand there are obvious disadvantages of expanding too rapidly
[19:36:30] vingaer: we want to avoid what happened with both eden and phoenix at some point of time
[19:37:15] vingaer: huge internal conflicts, hostile inside fractions etc.
[19:37:53] jamesw: I see, ok thanks for your answers :)
[19:38:19] jamesw: Iaswn - for EDEN, surely the future is a continuation of co-operation with Terra, and trying to stop the dominance of ONE. Or do you have other options available?
[19:39:18] Iaswn: 1) there are no other options
[19:39:40] Iaswn: 2) regarding the dominance you cant win if you dont lose first
[19:39:51] Iaswn: one or ex phoenix knows that better ;)
[19:40:24] Iaswn: 3) regarding Terra I am more than happy cooperating with Terra
[19:41:10] Iaswn: I suppose my answer covered the question :D
[19:42:08] jamesw: :)
[19:42:13] jamesw: Emerick, aeriala
[19:42:20] Emerick: sup
[19:42:25] jamesw: Surely you would also find it hard to see a future without EDEN co-operation?
[19:42:39] Emerick: Obviously
[19:43:08] Emerick: It's essential in order for us to survive on a suffient level
[19:43:48] jamesw: Ok, now just a quick answer if you dont mind
[19:43:51] Emerick: Some of our countries are more than happy with it, and some aren't as friendly with Eden countries, but we do what we must because we can
[19:43:54] jamesw: woops!
[19:43:55] jamesw: sorry
[19:44:21] Emerick: Sorry, I rambled
[19:44:25] Emerick: Go
[19:44:44] jamesw: ok
[19:44:53] jamesw: Now, just a quick answer from each of you please
[19:45:03] jamesw: Personally, and on behalf of your alliance, which country would you say is your biggest enemy?
[19:45:07] jamesw: Emerick - you can start
[19:45:11] Emerick: Spain
[19:45:50] jamesw: for both?
[19:45:52] Iaswn: my answer would be simple : ONE
[19:45:54] Iaswn: :)
[19:46:28] Emerick: I'd say so
[19:46:36] jamesw: ok thats fair enough
[19:46:43] Emerick: Spain is an enemy of the US, Brozil, and France
[19:46:47] Emerick: And also they are pigs
[19:46:54] jamesw: Iaswn - so thats MKD/Poland/Serbia/Hungary/Spain?
[19:47:00] jamesw: or anything more specific/genearl
[19:47:48] jamesw: general*
[19:47:59] Iaswn: my friends enemy is also my enemy
[19:48:12] Iaswn: which means that there is no discremenation on that
[19:48:46] Iaswn: any of them is an enemy
[19:48:56] Iaswn: if you mean which enemy you affraid the most
[19:49:00] Iaswn: thats another thing
[19:49:37] jamesw: Well, its more a personal thing I guess
[19:49:42] jamesw: which country would you enjoy beating the most?
[19:49:56] Iaswn: croatia :P
[19:50:05] Iaswn: ofc I am joking
[19:50:15] Iaswn: it doesnt make any difference
[19:50:23] Iaswn: we went close on deleting serbia
[19:50:29] Iaswn: something that never happened
[19:50:42] Iaswn: but at least serbia left with one region
[19:50:49] Iaswn: I call this a success
[19:51:45] angeldav: is ROFLing
[19:51:50] angeldav: sorry :)
[19:51:55] vingaer: well, we deleted various eden countries on several occasions
[19:52:04] jamesw: I was about to get to you
[19:52:14] jamesw: can't you return to the kitchen for one more minute, vingaer? ^___^
[19:52:17] vingaer: it got boring :)
[19:52:26] jamesw: Iaswn, there must be one country that you personally would like to wipe
[19:52:39] Iaswn: as a person or as SC?
[19:52:47] jamesw: as a person
[19:52:53] Iaswn: as a person that would be fyrom
[19:53:16] jamesw: and as SC?
[19:53:21] Iaswn: as a SC i consider every enemy of equal importance and I dont underestimate them
[19:53:47] jamesw: ok, i guess it is time to give the toothy vagina a go
[19:53:52] jamesw: vingaer
[19:54:12] vingaer: hell yes
[19:54:29] jamesw: Personally, and on behalf of ONE, which country would you like to wipe
[19:54:49] vingaer: the biggest challenge atm are the united states
[19:55:28] vingaer: no one has ever done it before and so on
[19:55:56] vingaer: if we manage to pop their cherry, i'll be truly proud :)
[19:56:05] jamesw: and on that disgusting note
[19:56:08] jamesw: angeldav
[19:56:17] jamesw: Any other preference, or is ONE pretty united on this?
[19:56:48] angeldav: well, we have two objectives at this moment
[19:56:52] angeldav: USA and later on, Brazil
[19:56:53] angeldav: :)
[19:57:05] vingaer: brozil*
[19:57:18] jamesw: ok
[19:57:47] jamesw: Now, i guess we have one final quick question, then I will be asking a few more citizen quesions (/query or post in #eukfa.talk)
[19:57:58] jamesw: So, Iaswn
[19:58:03] jamesw: We will talk about EDEN first
[19:58:27] jamesw: Do you think that a UK application to EDEN, could be accepted at present, or what would need to change in order for it to be accepted?
[20:00:48] jamesw: hmm, we'll come back to Iaswn
[20:00:52] jamesw: Emerick, and aeriala
[20:00:53] Iaswn: sorry
[20:00:56] Iaswn: I am back
[20:00:58] jamesw: oh, your back :)
[20:00:59] jamesw: np
[20:01:32] Iaswn: if we agree on certain things then I dont see a problem
[20:02:11] jamesw: Ok, anything in particular?
[20:02:41] Iaswn: this is something that has to be discussed with the other member nations
[20:03:03] Iaswn: as you may know all member nations of eden have to agree and vote yes
[20:03:53] jamesw: Yes, each country basically has a veto
[20:04:38] jamesw: ok then, unless there is anything more I shall move on
[20:04:50] jamesw: (if you have questions, please /query or post in #eukfa.talk!)
[20:04:55] jamesw: Ok, Emerick and aeriala
[20:05:11] Emerick: I'd say so
[20:05:16] jamesw: Should the UK eventually decide to return to Terra, what (if anything) do you think would be necessary for the application to be successful
[20:05:39] Emerick: Terra was set up so that we could handle issues, not kick people's asses for not agreeing on every issue
[20:06:17] Emerick: We, of course, strive for complete cooperation, but I believe that we're able to deal with conflicts of interest according to how they should be dealt with
[20:06:59] Emerick: We've never made a hopeful member country jump through hoops or anything
[20:07:09] jamesw: So the UK could potentially be in Terra, and continue the Irish war?
[20:07:27] Emerick: Theoretically
[20:07:44] jamesw: And realistically?
[20:07:56] Emerick: Of course it depends on a vote, you'll have to speak to each member country
[20:08:02] Emerick: We haven't discussed it this term
[20:08:26] jamesw: ok, anything further to add?
[20:08:28] Emerick: If you were to ask me to, I could hold a meeting on it
[20:08:34] Emerick: I think that covers it
[20:08:41] jamesw: ok
[20:08:45] jamesw: vingaer, and angeldav
[20:08:56] jamesw: In your opinion, what if anything, needs to be done to see a UK application to ONE be successful?
[20:09:27] vingaer: well, as i said before, for now we are open to a possibility of cooperation with you should you choose the dark side
[20:09:53] vingaer: and if it all goes well and your long-term relations with all member states are improved
[20:10:28] vingaer: your application should be successful
[20:11:00] jamesw: should, or would?
[20:11:23] jamesw: obviously you could not promise anything, but surely you have a great deal of knowledge about some of the most strained relations between ONE-UK
[20:11:27] jamesw: Most notably spain/poland
[20:12:13] vingaer: those relations certainly aren't hostile atm
[20:12:23] vingaer: so it would be a good point to start making them flourish ;)
[20:12:42] jamesw: I see
[20:12:53] jamesw: Anything further to add, before we move onto Q&A?
[20:13:04] jamesw: (/q or #eukfa.talk for the chance to ask questions!)
[20:13:25] vingaer: you kicked me from that channel :<
[20:13:30] jamesw: you aren't allowed to be there
[20:13:37] jamesw: otherwise you'd see peoples reaction :3
[20:13:58] jamesw: ok then, first question is for Terra reps :3
[20:14:15] jamesw: How would you have handled the UK/Ireland situation, if it happened now, as opposed to a few months ago?
[20:14:46] Emerick: How was it handled?
[20:14:54] Emerick: idk what you did
[20:15:01] jamesw: It wasn't my term
[20:15:07] jamesw: B)
[20:15:14] jamesw: It was the month after me
[20:15:18] Emerick: Florencia?
[20:15:24] jamesw: idek
[20:15:40] jamesw: whoever was before laxsnore-the-useless
[20:15:43] Emerick: Whatever, I'll go ahead blind
[20:15:58] Emerick: He was p bad
[20:19:08] Emerick: I would try to solve the conflict between Terra and Eden fairly to facilitate coordination between the alliances.  I would ask for consessions from each country, maybe a region swap that would actually end up benefitting them both, see how it goes.  We patched up China-Japan a few months ago, and this term I'm working on fixing it.  Similar situation, just for reference.
[20:20:19] Emerick: What is this shit
[20:20:23] jamesw:  In relation to the UK, I can tell you whenever a peace treaty was proposed, even with huge concessions, the majority of the country still favoured a complete wipe of Ireland
[20:20:48] jamesw: ie, negotiation (at least in my experience of UK/Ireland these past few months) hasn't been possible, even if it was wanted.
[20:20:52] Emerick: I'm of the opinion that the UK didn't want to be in Terra
[20:21:48] Emerick: If your country wanted to be in Terra, I think that a peaceful resolution would be considered more
[20:23:18] jamesw: go for it mr george
[20:23:19] aeriala: you around a bit emerick, i have other things tpo run?
[20:24:03] GeorgeNorfolk: Why do we have to make concessions for Ireland when it was them who were being aggressive in the first place?
[20:24:42] Emerick: You each have your own opinions, and diplomacy requires the ability to view both sides of the equation
[20:24:55] Emerick: Are you denying that the Irish didn't see BHC as a UK threat?
[20:25:32] GeorgeNorfolk: It was maddog and others basically trolling ireland for lulz, hardly a 'threat'
[20:25:53] jamesw: Luckily for us, we have maddog here tonight
[20:25:56] Emerick: They got hit p badly
[20:27:44] jamesw: Y U PRETEND MADDOG
[20:28:10] jamesw: oh god
[20:28:13] Emerick: GokuJones is here
[20:28:14] jamesw: another question for you Emerick
[20:28:29] Emerick: I also see Tomazim
[20:28:34] Emerick: ok
[20:29:02] jamesw: With 80% of the Irish population stating that they wanted NI, as well as the irish government asking for it on two seperate peace talk occasions, is it unreasonable for a country to ignore concessions, with unreasonable opponents?
[20:29:59] Emerick: NI as a part of a region swap, or were they simply making beligerant demands?
[20:30:11] jamesw: Firstly the latter, then the former
[20:30:20] jamesw: if i recall
[20:31:03] Emerick: That's unreasonable, yeah, but if they wanted to give something to get it, then it'd be something to consider a little more
[20:32:12] jamesw: ok, the rest of the other questions we've already covered
[20:32:27] jamesw: So i'd like to take this opportunity to thank everyone for coming, and of course, the representatives for spending their time answering questions
[20:32:39] jamesw: If you'd like to add a finishing statement, we can begin with Emerick
[20:37:17] vingaer: i guess he doesn't want to make a statement
[20:37:29] Emerick: Nothing is perfect, but we're always willing to take the time to examine issues and questions fairly.  We're cooperating with Eden because it's our bet bet, and because of the cooperation, we're better off than we would be without it.  But the main thing about us, Terra, is that we know that this is just an internet game.  We're not crazy nationalist shits, and I know that Obama isn't shitting his pants because internet S
[20:37:30] Emerick: pain is invading internet America.  We're all here to have an enjoyable experience, and in my experience, the wealth of countries and people I meet and fight with in Terra is more worthwhile than building a bulldozer.
[20:38:31] Emerick: The end.
[20:38:42] Emerick: Thank you for inviting me and my alliance partners
[20:38:48] jamesw: Iaswn would you like a finishing statement also?
[20:39:20] Iaswn: As I said based on the current conflict between UK na dIreland
[20:39:36] Iaswn: I would love to see u both coming into an agreement
[20:48:36] jamesw: vingaer: any closing comments? ^___^
[20:49:01] vingaer: we have cookies here on the dark side, and we wish you best on your crossroads. regardless of which direction you will take, we hope it'll be a choice which will make you satisfied. after all, it is a game and we are all here to have fun
[20:49:08] vingaer: good luck, guys, and thanks for the invitation :)
[20:49:51] vingaer: see you in mcdonalds o/
[20:53:49] jamesw: On that note, I'd like to thank you all again for coming, I guess thats pretty much it :3
[20:57:20] EnoLive: I'd of thought they'd be a lot more to contemplate but I think my own mind is now fully set