[23-Feb-20 09:02 PM] levi#6206
we're moving forward with the suspect 100% right

[23-Feb-20 09:02 PM] levi#6206
we have enough votes for that?

[23-Feb-20 09:02 PM] BurntZebra#8147
how many votes are required

[23-Feb-20 09:03 PM] BurntZebra#8147
also are star/coco/fatty against qb, or are they against suspect too

[23-Feb-20 09:03 PM] levi#6206
1. The council will cycle through potential suspect nominations every two months or so. In addition, a council member may personally bring up a topic for discussion as possibly banworthy/unbanworthy at any time.
2. If at least 5/11 council members believe that the topic is banworthy/unbanworthy OR are unsure (that is, there is no supermajority disagreement with this nomination), then the topic is put through a suspect test. A thread for discussion on the topic will be set up.

[23-Feb-20 09:03 PM] levi#6206
we have like 9 outright pro-ban

[23-Feb-20 09:03 PM] levi#6206
i think

[23-Feb-20 09:03 PM] BurntZebra#8147
9?

[23-Feb-20 09:04 PM] levi#6206
me you luthier shrug doka kingler ninja tazz

[23-Feb-20 09:04 PM] levi#6206
nvm 8

[23-Feb-20 09:04 PM] levi#6206
idk what jakes thoughts are

[23-Feb-20 09:04 PM] starmaster#8286
nah im fine w/ a suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:04 PM] Luthier#1578
jake ban

[23-Feb-20 09:04 PM] BurntZebra#8147
what do we wanna do for req requirements

[23-Feb-20 09:05 PM] Ninja#8225
easier than last time

[23-Feb-20 09:06 PM] BurntZebra#8147
what were final reqs last time

[23-Feb-20 09:06 PM] BurntZebra#8147
like 82/40 games?

[23-Feb-20 09:06 PM] Serene Grace#5243
drop the reqs to 80

[23-Feb-20 09:06 PM] BurntZebra#8147
hows the ladder gxe now

[23-Feb-20 09:06 PM] Coconut#8762
I'd rather have an overpopulated suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:07 PM] Coconut#8762
and honestly I trust serene's opinion

[23-Feb-20 09:07 PM] Coconut#8762
on the ladder at this point

[23-Feb-20 09:07 PM] Coconut#8762
over just about anyone on this council

[23-Feb-20 09:07 PM] Serene Grace#5243
I am the greatest of all time

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] BurntZebra#8147
11+15+11+12+8+7+5+1= 70

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] levi#6206
i trust serene's opinion on everything

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] BurntZebra#8147
so currently 70 people on ladder have at least 80 gxe

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] Coconut#8762
I don't

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] Serene Grace#5243
name the last time ive had a wrong opinion

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] BurntZebra#8147
although looking at it now

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] Serene Grace#5243
my haters cant

[23-Feb-20 09:08 PM] BurntZebra#8147
a lot of them are lcds people

[23-Feb-20 09:09 PM] BurntZebra#8147
lcds serene    1558    89.9%

[23-Feb-20 09:09 PM] BurntZebra#8147
wtf serene

[23-Feb-20 09:09 PM] BurntZebra#8147
why do you nearly have 90 gxe

[23-Feb-20 09:09 PM] Serene Grace#5243
i was using charmander sun

[23-Feb-20 09:09 PM] BurntZebra#8147
youre an insane person

[23-Feb-20 09:09 PM] BurntZebra#8147
make that 71 accounts on ladder w/ 80 gxe or higher

[23-Feb-20 09:10 PM] BurntZebra#8147
25 of those are lcds alts

[23-Feb-20 09:10 PM] BurntZebra#8147
although i guess some of those people only laddered for suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:10 PM] BurntZebra#8147
including myself

[23-Feb-20 09:10 PM] BurntZebra#8147
i think 81 gxe sounds good

[23-Feb-20 09:10 PM] LilyAC#7887
i agree overpopulated suspect is surely better than whatever happened with the last one

[23-Feb-20 09:11 PM] BurntZebra#8147
81 seems pretty easy to get?

[23-Feb-20 09:11 PM] BurntZebra#8147
prior to the floon suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:11 PM] BurntZebra#8147
how many people had 83 gxe

[23-Feb-20 09:11 PM] BurntZebra#8147
or higher

[23-Feb-20 09:12 PM] BurntZebra#8147
actually

[23-Feb-20 09:12 PM] BurntZebra#8147
is there any danger in setting a super low gxe

[redacted]

[23-Feb-20 09:13 PM] BurntZebra#8147
do peoples opinions of pix change as you decrease skill level

[23-Feb-20 09:14 PM] hongli#4483
idk for pix but it'd be a bad look to arbitrarily change the GXE for each suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:14 PM] hongli#4483
without good reason

[23-Feb-20 09:14 PM] BurntZebra#8147
isnt it natural to change gxe for each suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:14 PM] BurntZebra#8147
well

[23-Feb-20 09:14 PM] BurntZebra#8147
more natural to increase it

[23-Feb-20 09:14 PM] BurntZebra#8147
as gxe gets more saturated

[23-Feb-20 09:14 PM] BurntZebra#8147
so i guess decreasing it is semi a bad look beyond this current suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:15 PM] hongli#4483
well the people who get high GXEs for suspect and inflate it

[23-Feb-20 09:15 PM] hongli#4483
wouldn't be using the same accounts for future suspects

[23-Feb-20 09:15 PM] hongli#4483
so is that an issue

[23-Feb-20 09:15 PM] hongli#4483
gxe saturation

[23-Feb-20 09:16 PM] BurntZebra#8147
26 out of the 71 people with above 80 gxe were suspect alts

[23-Feb-20 09:16 PM] BurntZebra#8147
which leaves 45 people who just ladder for fun and have above 80 gxe

[23-Feb-20 09:16 PM] Coconut#8762
I think 80-81

[23-Feb-20 09:16 PM] Coconut#8762
is probably a safe place to put it

[23-Feb-20 09:17 PM] BurntZebra#8147
yeah im fine with that

[23-Feb-20 09:17 PM] BurntZebra#8147
do we want to touch game count

[redacted]

[23-Feb-20 09:17 PM] levi#6206
theres a pretty good reason to lean hard toward inclusion this time i think

[23-Feb-20 09:17 PM] levi#6206
that being that we went way too hard in the other direction last time

[23-Feb-20 09:17 PM] levi#6206
it's probably a bad thing if we go that low

[23-Feb-20 09:17 PM] levi#6206
but 80 gxe should for sure be safe from that at least lmao

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] BurntZebra#8147
levi you should do a test run

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] BurntZebra#8147
and see how easy it is to get to 80 or 81 or 82

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] levi#6206
kk

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] BurntZebra#8147
or how difficult

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] levi#6206
well

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] levi#6206
it'll be easier for me

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] levi#6206
bc none of you guys will be laddering

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] BurntZebra#8147
hmm

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] levi#6206
except maybe sun king jordan, that guys everywhere

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] BurntZebra#8147
well

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] BurntZebra#8147
people laddered at like 4 am

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] BurntZebra#8147
to dodge good people

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] Coconut#8762
well how many games did it take you

[23-Feb-20 09:18 PM] Coconut#8762
last cycle?

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] levi#6206
i will ladder to do a test run

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] Coconut#8762
good to hear.

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] starmaster#8286
81 seems more than fine lmao

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] BurntZebra#8147
i think i did 34 games ish?

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] starmaster#8286
u can go 30-10 and get 81 dude

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] levi#6206
we could also just

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] levi#6206
make the range bigger maybe

[23-Feb-20 09:19 PM] BurntZebra#8147
more games=lower gxe?

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] levi#6206
like 30 with 84 down to 50 with 80 or sth

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] levi#6206
yea

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] BurntZebra#8147
50 games

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] BurntZebra#8147
lmao

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] levi#6206
😭

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] BurntZebra#8147
well

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] BurntZebra#8147
torchic suspect had a really high game count

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] BurntZebra#8147
iirc

[23-Feb-20 09:20 PM] BurntZebra#8147
wingull too probably

[23-Feb-20 09:21 PM] BurntZebra#8147
i remember getting the gxe requirement for wingull

[23-Feb-20 09:21 PM] BurntZebra#8147
but i was like 20 games away from the game requirement

[23-Feb-20 09:21 PM] starmaster#8286
we've never had more than 40

[23-Feb-20 09:21 PM] starmaster#8286
im p sure

[23-Feb-20 09:22 PM] BurntZebra#8147
GXE ≥ 81​
GXE + battle count ≥ 130​

[23-Feb-20 09:23 PM] BurntZebra#8147
torchic reqs

[23-Feb-20 09:23 PM] BurntZebra#8147
or wait

[23-Feb-20 09:23 PM] BurntZebra#8147
ok was just making sure you needed to meet both requirements

[23-Feb-20 09:23 PM] BurntZebra#8147
and not either

[23-Feb-20 09:23 PM] Coconut#8762
how many people qualified for that one?

[23-Feb-20 09:23 PM] starmaster#8286
like 30 iirc

[23-Feb-20 09:24 PM] BurntZebra#8147
44

[23-Feb-20 09:24 PM] Coconut#8762
I like that

[23-Feb-20 09:24 PM] BurntZebra#8147
84 GXE and at least 40 games played.

[23-Feb-20 09:24 PM] BurntZebra#8147
for wingull suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:24 PM] starmaster#8286
oh

[23-Feb-20 09:25 PM] starmaster#8286
damn torchic was so long ago

[23-Feb-20 09:25 PM] BurntZebra#8147
actually i guess 43

[23-Feb-20 09:25 PM] BurntZebra#8147
since quote posted to end the thread

[23-Feb-20 09:26 PM] BurntZebra#8147
30 people got wingull reqs

[23-Feb-20 09:27 PM] jake#8907
i am currently proban

[23-Feb-20 09:27 PM] BurntZebra#8147
in an ideal suspect, do you want people to hit the gxe requirement and game requirement at the same time

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] jake#8907
ideally it is close

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] jake#8907
doesnt have to be same game

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] BurntZebra#8147
like looking at the wingull suspect

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] jake#8907
but grinding for games or grinding for gxe

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] jake#8907
are both not great

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] starmaster#8286
oh it was wingull that was 30

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] starmaster#8286
oops

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] BurntZebra#8147
like 65% of people were grinding for games

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] BurntZebra#8147
to get to 40

[23-Feb-20 09:28 PM] Coconut#8762
that's bad

[23-Feb-20 09:30 PM] BurntZebra#8147
torchic had an average game count of 50

[23-Feb-20 09:31 PM] BurntZebra#8147
if you dont include council reqs

[23-Feb-20 09:31 PM] BurntZebra#8147
sken got council reqs in 14 games

[23-Feb-20 09:31 PM] BurntZebra#8147
while the normal people had to slave away for hours 😢

[23-Feb-20 09:31 PM] Coconut#8762
I miss council reqs

[23-Feb-20 09:32 PM] BurntZebra#8147
now that i can reap the benefits

[23-Feb-20 09:32 PM] BurntZebra#8147
lets bring them back

[23-Feb-20 09:32 PM] BurntZebra#8147
or is that against smogon policy

[23-Feb-20 09:32 PM] BurntZebra#8147
now

[23-Feb-20 09:32 PM] levi#6206
it is

{Reactions}
geraldo (2)

[23-Feb-20 09:32 PM] Serene Grace#5243
✊

[23-Feb-20 09:32 PM] Serene Grace#5243
power to the people

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] BurntZebra#8147
didnt they try to do council reqs where council would get a vote with lesser reqs+posting an argument on the suspect thread

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] BurntZebra#8147
like you had to prove your contribution

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] levi#6206
i think our council reqs were unfair since they just involved less games

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] Coconut#8762
we tried.

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] levi#6206
i dont*

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] levi#6206
think

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] Coconut#8762
but we never really did it

[23-Feb-20 09:33 PM] levi#6206
the difficulty was the same

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] BurntZebra#8147
idk if thats true

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] levi#6206
but it was still a bad look

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] levi#6206
im fine w having them gone

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] BurntZebra#8147
the more games you play

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] BurntZebra#8147
the more likely it is you begin to get rng'ed

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] BurntZebra#8147
or get unbelievably bad matchups

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] levi#6206
i guess we couldve balanced it by making taking advantage of council reqs require a higher gxe or sth

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] levi#6206
thats basically what we're doing here tho

[23-Feb-20 09:34 PM] levi#6206
but its free to everyone not just council

[23-Feb-20 09:35 PM] Coconut#8762
I always tried to get regular reqs

[23-Feb-20 09:35 PM] BurntZebra#8147
yeah i think 81 gxe with 40 game count

[23-Feb-20 09:35 PM] BurntZebra#8147
is good

[23-Feb-20 09:35 PM] Coconut#8762
even when we had council reqs

[23-Feb-20 09:35 PM] BurntZebra#8147
with less game count for higher gxes

[23-Feb-20 09:35 PM] BurntZebra#8147
what if we reduced the min game count to 30

[23-Feb-20 09:36 PM] levi#6206
so like

[23-Feb-20 09:36 PM] levi#6206
83 at 40 down to 81 at 40?

[23-Feb-20 09:42 PM] BurntZebra#8147
sounds good

[23-Feb-20 09:42 PM] levi#6206
what if i cant meet 81 gxe

[23-Feb-20 09:42 PM] levi#6206
can we do my other proposal instead

[23-Feb-20 09:43 PM] BurntZebra#8147
whats the other proposal

[23-Feb-20 09:43 PM] Serene Grace#5243
codenames premier league

[23-Feb-20 09:43 PM] levi#6206
like 30 with 84 down to 50 with 80 or sth

[23-Feb-20 09:49 PM] BurntZebra#8147
so 1 gxe = 5 games?

[23-Feb-20 09:49 PM] BurntZebra#8147
was that how it was for drifloon actually

[23-Feb-20 09:50 PM] hongli#4483
iirc ya

[23-Feb-20 09:52 PM] Ninja#8225
.

[23-Feb-20 09:52 PM] Ninja#8225
ok serene

[23-Feb-20 10:42 PM] Quote#9846
ok ok

[23-Feb-20 10:42 PM] Quote#9846
read over everything, so I'll provide some comments

[23-Feb-20 10:45 PM] Quote#9846
I'm personally in favour of banning veil but I'm pro-suspect, not pro-QB. I feel like there are some aspects that I could be wrong about and I'm down to take that period just to make sure. Plus while it does feel banworthy, it doesn't strike me as being on the same level as Sun. In addition, I have some other qualms about the strategy being outright busted, and I wanna see if it's possible for the meta to adapt at all to put veil in an unfortunate position. Doubtful on that but I'd still like that additional time with it around just to see what exactly it'll do.

[redacted]

[23-Feb-20 10:47 PM] Quote#9846
I'll be posting the next council minute within a couple of days. Decided to delay them because of home unexpectedly dropping and wanting to gather a bit more conversation about veil first.

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] BurntZebra#8147
when you say webs

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] BurntZebra#8147
do you mean veils

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] Quote#9846
yea

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] Quote#9846
I just woke up

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] Quote#9846
I am not in favour of banning webs

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] Quote#9846
sorry for the mixup

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] BurntZebra#8147
how about banning webs in sm lc

[23-Feb-20 10:48 PM] BurntZebra#8147
before lcpl

[23-Feb-20 10:49 PM] Quote#9846
I have mixed feelings

[23-Feb-20 10:49 PM] BurntZebra#8147
so when do we want to post the suspect for pix then

[23-Feb-20 10:49 PM] BurntZebra#8147
seems like almost everyone is on board with at least suspecting

[23-Feb-20 10:50 PM] BurntZebra#8147
not enough for a qb though

[23-Feb-20 10:51 PM] jake#8907
sorry i should correct my position too

[23-Feb-20 10:51 PM] jake#8907
i am w/ quote

[23-Feb-20 10:51 PM] jake#8907
pro suspect, not quick

[23-Feb-20 10:51 PM] Quote#9846
not used to having a TL that agrees with me

[23-Feb-20 10:51 PM] Quote#9846
weird feeling

[23-Feb-20 10:52 PM] jake#8907
💪

[23-Feb-20 11:29 PM] Quote#9846
I'm down for the suspect to start this week

[23-Feb-20 11:43 PM] Quote#9846
Oh, and as for the reqs, make them easy. Hard suspects are pointless and I don't think it's something we should go back to.

[23-Feb-20 11:43 PM] Quote#9846
idk what GXE exactly would be easy without being totally braindead

[23-Feb-20 11:43 PM] Quote#9846
probably 80 or 81

[24-Feb-20 12:09 AM] BurntZebra#8147
what was the logic for the floon suspect

[24-Feb-20 12:13 AM] Serene Grace#5243
make its as tough as possible so we have good voters :yeahok:

[24-Feb-20 12:18 AM] BurntZebra#8147
"good voters"

[24-Feb-20 12:32 AM] Quote#9846
yea that was dumb

[24-Feb-20 12:32 AM] Quote#9846
also I'd like to propose we keep suspects easy from now on, even later into the meta

[24-Feb-20 12:32 AM] Quote#9846
there's no real benefit to having a difficult suspect ladder

[24-Feb-20 12:42 AM] levi#6206
they need to be hard enough to limit it to users who both care about lc and have the capacity to make informed decisions

[24-Feb-20 12:47 AM] Quote#9846
yeah but most people don't give a shit about LC anyway

[24-Feb-20 12:47 AM] Quote#9846
doing suspects "just for fun" isn't really a thing any more

[24-Feb-20 12:48 AM] levi#6206
i dont think tc noms have slowed down all that much, have they?

[24-Feb-20 12:48 AM] levi#6206
doing suspects just for fun isnt a thing in our circle anymore because all of us have been around and already have tc

[24-Feb-20 12:51 AM] Ninja#8225
Well there’s quite a few non lcers who gave up on the last one

[24-Feb-20 12:51 AM] Ninja#8225
Bc it was too hard

[24-Feb-20 01:04 AM] levi#6206
yea

[24-Feb-20 01:04 AM] levi#6206
there needs to be a minimum bar of entry but nowhere near that high

[24-Feb-20 01:18 AM] Serene Grace#5243
80

[24-Feb-20 01:26 AM] levi#6206
30 games with 84 gxe/40 games with 82 gxe/50 games with 80 gxe

[24-Feb-20 02:47 AM] Serene Grace#5243
deal

[24-Feb-20 02:53 AM] Quote#9846
>84 gxe

[24-Feb-20 02:53 AM] Quote#9846
hell no

[24-Feb-20 03:28 AM] Serene Grace#5243
wait whats wrong with that

[24-Feb-20 03:28 AM] Serene Grace#5243
min is still 80

[24-Feb-20 08:26 AM] starmaster#8286
Yea that seems fine

[24-Feb-20 08:26 AM] starmaster#8286
U can get reqs at 35-15 lol

[24-Feb-20 08:26 AM] starmaster#8286
How much easier can it be

[24-Feb-20 10:10 AM] Quote#9846
oh

[24-Feb-20 10:10 AM] Quote#9846
We're doing the range thing again

[24-Feb-20 10:11 AM] Quote#9846
I thought levi was just trying to push 84 gxe again fsr

[redacted]

[25-Feb-20 01:36 AM] levi#6206
we are getting the suspect up right

[25-Feb-20 01:36 AM] levi#6206
like today or tmrw

[25-Feb-20 09:44 AM] Luthier#1578
For what

[25-Feb-20 09:45 AM] Quote#9846
apix

[25-Feb-20 09:45 AM] Quote#9846
I'll let @jake post the thread this time since it's his first suspect as TL 😄

[25-Feb-20 09:51 AM] jake#8907
I can put it together in abt 30 or 40 mins

[25-Feb-20 09:55 AM] Quote#9846
oh sweet

[25-Feb-20 10:04 AM] Luthier#1578
ty

[25-Feb-20 10:26 AM] brewfasa#4532
gogogogo

[25-Feb-20 10:52 AM] jake#8907
levi: 30 games with 84 gxe/40 games with 82 gxe/50 games with 80 gxe

[25-Feb-20 10:52 AM] jake#8907
this what we're going with?

[25-Feb-20 10:54 AM] starmaster#8286
I think so

[25-Feb-20 11:02 AM] jake#8907
2 weeks as well?

[25-Feb-20 11:02 AM] jake#8907
@Quote to confirm

[25-Feb-20 11:06 AM] Coconut#8762
10 days

[25-Feb-20 11:07 AM] jake#8907
end on 11:59pm on friday the 6th then

[25-Feb-20 11:07 AM] Coconut#8762
that's fine

[25-Feb-20 11:08 AM] Coconut#8762
hopefully we'll be able to vote faster than a week and a half now

[25-Feb-20 11:12 AM] jake#8907
up

[25-Feb-20 11:12 AM] jake#8907
https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/lc-suspect-behind-the-veil.3660436/

{Embed}
https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/lc-suspect-behind-the-veil.3660436/
Announcement - LC Suspect - Behind the Veil
Our next suspect will be Vulpix-Alola. Vulpix-Alola sits at a solid 17 Speed and has good neutral coverage on the whole tier between Freeze Dry and Moonblast, but the critical factor of Vulpix-Alola is its support capabilities. Vulpix-Alola has a fantastic support attack in Au...
https://www.smogon.com/forums/media/twitter.png

[25-Feb-20 11:16 AM] brewfasa#4532
goat

[25-Feb-20 11:16 AM] brewfasa#4532
joat