[21:49] Disaster Area: hey, you might as well devoice me in development. Once pokebattle's re-released I'm pretty much jumping ship to there (PS is a great sim but there's some politics mainly involving Smogon is why I'm leaving x_x)
[21:50] %Zarel: aww
[21:50] Disaster Area: don't need me to tell you it's a great sim, but the absence of competition smogon faces (and the fact that this sim won't accomodate the possibility of competition realistically growing) is why I'm gonna be jumping ship.
[21:50] %Zarel: competition realistically growing?
[21:50] %Zarel: could you clarify?
[21:50] Disaster Area: well basically
[21:51] Disaster Area: another forum I use [called pokemon perfect] is using a diff approach to tiering (but similar in some ways to smogon). I chatted with marty and he said it was gonna be basically impossible
[21:51] Disaster Area: to have even one format on the PS main server that's not a smogon or nintendo format
[21:51] %Zarel: well, that's kind of what other servers are for
[21:51] %Zarel: and also we support Other Metagames
[21:51] Disaster Area: let me clarify further why another server
[21:52] Disaster Area: wouldn't be appropriate in this case lol
[21:52] Disaster Area: I'm not trying to say 'have this format on PS main' so hear me out :)
[21:52] %Zarel: I'm listening
[21:52] Disaster Area: basically the main differences are, our 'OU' tier has much fewer initial bans (it's primals/mega mence/shadow tag/geomancy on top of the smogon oras ubers ruleset)
[21:53] Disaster Area: we use a slightly different nomenclature (1U over OU, we think it being indicative that it's the first tier is more clear)
[21:53] Disaster Area: and the way that we do our creation of lower tiers is different
[21:54] Disaster Area: basically, that is we use viability rankings. So any mon above a certain sub-rank is 1U, anything below it is 2U (potentially banned to 2P, our banlist tiers), and anything in one specific subrank
[21:54] Disaster Area: is voted upon
[21:54] Disaster Area: first let me say that
[21:54] %Zarel: sounds like that'd be better, yes
[21:54] Disaster Area: the benefits of it notably include the natural greater community involvement and
[21:54] Disaster Area: vested interests are usually pretty clear when arguing with viab ranks anyway
[21:54] Disaster Area: secondly note that if you
[21:54] Disaster Area: apply that to smogon's ou tier
[21:55] Disaster Area: it does (subjectively of course) improve it;
[21:55] Disaster Area: many BL mons that top players consider OU-worthy such as volcarona and politoed are in B+/A-
[21:55] Disaster Area: a couple of mons that are considered weak choices in OU such as sylveon would drop
[21:55] Disaster Area: mid B rank is a mishmash of OU BL and UU in the current system so naturally it's down to the council to sift through that
[21:56] Disaster Area: it gets rid of a lot of the subjectivity though which is a major plus in a non-usage-based system
[21:56] Disaster Area: obviously it's imperfect but rome wasn't built in a day
[21:56] Disaster Area: secondly, I'd make a little point about the pokemon bans (as I stated earlier) and how that impacts on your
[21:56] Disaster Area: average player who has little to no competitive experience
[21:57] Disaster Area: but with the right guidance could grow somewhat
[21:57] Disaster Area: smogon's ethos of tiering does involve as many of people's favourite pokemon not being usable, e.g. greninja
[21:57] Disaster Area: obviously I'm not questioning those bans, within the tier's context, they are wholly reasonable
[21:58] Disaster Area: (or if they're not it's not something I could judge clearly due to not being that experienced in smogon main metas)
[21:58] Disaster Area: BUT if you were to start with the highest possible diverse balanced meta (what smogon hasn't done and now finds itself too late to change even if it wanted to)
[21:58] Disaster Area: allows a lot of mons banned to ubers to find viability in these tiers, in 1U and 2U in particular
[21:58] Disaster Area: so for your totally new player the fact that
[21:59] Disaster Area: their favourite mon is much less likely to be banned
[21:59] Disaster Area: is much more likely to make them continue into higher reaches of competitive battling
[22:00] Disaster Area: of course some elite plyayers will prefer one system over the other, be it pokemon perfect's, or smogon's, but if there were the existance of at least this alternative, in the long run I hypothesise that there would be
[22:00] Disaster Area: more elite players in general which is surely all well and good
[22:00] Disaster Area: I understand that smogon's OU does more to
[22:00] Disaster Area: match the in game competitive level
[22:00] Disaster Area: there's obviously a cost-balance or whatever it's called with that; we've decided to take a different approach to smogon, and it does not invalidate smogon's approach.
[22:01] Disaster Area: anyway does that make what I'm saying clear now?
[22:01] %Zarel: I mean, yeah, but why does that require a different sim
[22:01] %Zarel: rather than just a different PS server?
[22:01] Disaster Area: because if it were on a different PS server, MUCH fewer totally new users
[22:01] Disaster Area: would come into contact with it
[22:02] Disaster Area: so I mean PS main would be ideal, but a different simulator in this instance still holds advantages over a separate PS server
[22:02] %Zarel: I can see that
[22:10] Disaster Area: I'll probably still come here a little to see a couple of friends and possibly play an RBY tour game or two if they can't/won't play on PO/pokebattle [I still prefer PO to PS for RBY but they're both just as good tbh...]
[22:10] Disaster Area: but ye anyway I think I started the convo off with
[22:11] Disaster Area: remove my voice in development
[22:11] Disaster Area: lol so unless you've decided there's a shot of oras 1u being a part of PS main then you might as well do it when you have a free moment
[22:12] %Zarel: you can stay
[22:12] %Zarel: I don't think a conflict of interest is a serious problem
[22:13] Disaster Area: woah so.. you'd consider having the metagame coded on PS main?
[22:13] Disaster Area: (if you are would it be alright to have 2U, the 'UU' tier on here once it's formed too?)
[22:15] %Zarel: no
[22:15] %Zarel: I mean, you don't have to leave PS to work on PB
[22:15] %Zarel: you can participate in both
[22:15] Disaster Area: oh x_x
[22:16] Disaster Area: fair enough then