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  1. From: Melbourne, Australia
  2. Registered: 2011-10-20
  3. Posts: 1,066
  4. Website
  5. (Maybe this should go in "Try This"?)
  6. Hello Archers,
  7. I was thinking about software that sucks, as considered at All software sucks and Software that sucks less. I wondered whether it would be possible to measure the "suckiness" or maybe (conversely) the "Unixness" of a system. The essential idea is that if four small programs can do the same job as a single much larger program, then we should prefer the ecosystem of smaller programs, and consider this ecosystem more Unix-like.
  8. This is similar to ideas about model-selection as used in statistics, where it's preferred to use simpler models; in particular it occurred to me that an entropy-like calculation could provide a quick-and-dirty way to measure unixness. In what follows, don't expect much rigour. It's just a bit of fun, partially justified by reference to notions from information theory.
  9. Let's proceed by considering measure theoretic entropy and define X to be the concatenation of all executable files on your system. Clearly, X forms a set in which the elements are bytes defined by an address together with a value between 0x00 and 0xFF. The executable files now form a partition Q of X. Since everything is finite and discrete, Q in turn induces a sigma-algebra, so we have a measurable space.
  10. To make the measurable space into a true measure space, we need a measure. In the naive just-for-fun calculation I'm getting to, it's sufficient to assume that the best measure to use is: what proportion of X is taken up by the file f? I.e., if S(B) refers to the size S of any set of bytes B, we shall use the measure
  11. p(f) := S(f)/S(X)
  12. Now that we have a proper measure space, we can proceed directly to invoking measure theoretic entropy, mentioned earlier. In particular, we now define the unixness contributed by a file f as,
  13. H(f) := -p(f)log(p(f))
  14. where the logarithm is base 2. To calculate the unixness of multiple files, add their individual contributions.
  15. Thus, we can approximate the unixness of an entire system by running the following pair of commands:
  16. T=$(sudo find {,/usr}/{{s,}bin,lib} /usr/include /boot /etc -type f ! -empty -printf "%s\n" | awk '{t+=$1} END {print t}')
  17. sudo find {,/usr}/{{s,}bin,lib} /usr/include /boot /etc -type f ! -empty -printf "%s\n" | awk -v t=$T '{p=$1/t; h += -p*log(p)/log(2)} END {print h}'
  18. The first command calculates S(X), the size of the set of executable files X. The second command adds the unixness contributions from the individual files. The division by log 2 in the second statement is just a scale factor to change awk's natural logarithm to a binary logarithm.
  19. The sudo is required so that "find" can extract file-sizes from sensitive directories. The code will still work if you don't use sudo, you'll just get permission warnings. (These can be ignored with a "2>/dev/null".)
  20. Clearly, if the entire system is driven by a single monolithic executable, you'll get a unixness of 0.
  21. When I run the code, I get:
  22. 8.09131
  23. Last edited by /dev/zero (2012-03-05 5:16 pm)
  24. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  25. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  26. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  27. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  28. Offline
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  30. #22012-03-03 5:51 pm
  31. .:B:.
  32. Forum Fellow
  33.  
  34. Registered: 2006-11-26
  35. Posts: 5,818
  36. Email
  37. As an aside: is the sudo really necessary?
  38. Got Leenucks? :: Arch: Power in simplicity :: Get Counted! Registered Linux User #392717 :: Blog thingy
  39. Offline
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  41. #32012-03-03 5:51 pm
  42. jasonwryan
  43. Administrator
  44.  
  45. From: .nz
  46. Registered: 2009-05-09
  47. Posts: 5,966
  48. Email Website
  49. I have no idea what this means, but it sounds interesting...
  50. Arch Netbook
  51. 7.50275 10.6669
  52. Arch Desktop (with bloatware for my better half's account)
  53. 7.70631 10.7082
  54. Debian Stable Server
  55. 8.13658 10.2989
  56. eh?
  57. # edit: if these results were reversed it would make a lot more sense to me
  58. # edit2: updated with new metric
  59. Last edited by jasonwryan (2012-03-06 12:55 am)
  60. Arch + dwm   •   Mercurial repos
  61. Registered Linux User #482438
  62. Online
  63. Report Quote
  64. #42012-03-03 5:52 pm
  65. /dev/zero
  66. Member
  67.  
  68. From: Melbourne, Australia
  69. Registered: 2011-10-20
  70. Posts: 1,066
  71. Website
  72. .:B:. wrote:
  73. As an aside: is the sudo really necessary?
  74. I have a note about the sudo a bit below the commands ...
  75. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  76. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  77. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  78. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  79. Offline
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  81. #52012-03-03 5:54 pm
  82. .:B:.
  83. Forum Fellow
  84.  
  85. Registered: 2006-11-26
  86. Posts: 5,818
  87. Email
  88. Bah. And I thought I had read it twice .
  89. Got Leenucks? :: Arch: Power in simplicity :: Get Counted! Registered Linux User #392717 :: Blog thingy
  90. Offline
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  92. #62012-03-03 6:07 pm
  93. /dev/zero
  94. Member
  95.  
  96. From: Melbourne, Australia
  97. Registered: 2011-10-20
  98. Posts: 1,066
  99. Website
  100. .:B:. wrote:
  101. Bah. And I thought I had read it twice .
  102. I've split the note about sudo into a separate paragraph. This should make it easier to see.
  103. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  104. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  105. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  106. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  107. Offline
  108. Report Quote
  109. #72012-03-03 6:13 pm
  110. skunktrader
  111. Member
  112. From: Brisbane, Australia
  113. Registered: 2010-02-14
  114. Posts: 1,182
  115. 8.36644
  116. Offline
  117. Report Quote
  118. #82012-03-03 6:56 pm
  119. ambientzoo
  120. Member
  121.  
  122. From: UK
  123. Registered: 2011-08-02
  124. Posts: 58
  125. Email
  126. 7.82848
  127. Stephen
  128. Offline
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  130. #92012-03-03 7:32 pm
  131. Kaustic
  132. Member
  133. Registered: 2011-08-18
  134. Posts: 503
  135. Email
  136. -nan
  137. (Do I win anything?)
  138. NaOH
  139. Offline
  140. Report Quote
  141. #102012-03-03 7:35 pm
  142. egan
  143. Member
  144. From: Mountain View, CA
  145. Registered: 2009-08-16
  146. Posts: 264
  147. Email
  148. 7.36535
  149. GitHub
  150. Offline
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  152. #112012-03-03 8:07 pm
  153. /dev/zero
  154. Member
  155.  
  156. From: Melbourne, Australia
  157. Registered: 2011-10-20
  158. Posts: 1,066
  159. Website
  160. Kaustic wrote:
  161. -nan
  162. (Do I win anything?)
  163. lol, wtf? Maybe you have one really small file so the log went too close to zero thanks to round-off?
  164. Kaustic wins!
  165. What do you get in your "T"?
  166. Last edited by /dev/zero (2012-03-03 8:09 pm)
  167. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  168. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  169. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  170. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  171. Offline
  172. Report Quote
  173. #122012-03-03 8:12 pm
  174. KingX
  175. Member
  176.  
  177. From: Fremont, CA
  178. Registered: 2010-03-23
  179. Posts: 309
  180. 7.80924
  181. So is 10 impossible to have? And 7-8 about the ideal for a system?
  182. Offline
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  184. #132012-03-03 8:13 pm
  185. bohoomil
  186. Member
  187. Registered: 2010-09-03
  188. Posts: 1,183
  189. Email Website
  190. /dev/zero wrote:
  191. Kaustic wrote:
  192. -nan
  193. (Do I win anything?)
  194. Kaustic wins!
  195. Is obviously cheating. Must be a *BSD user...
  196. My one:
  197. 7.86591
  198. (whatever it means...).
  199. Edit: after adding $HOME/bin with circa 140 scripts:
  200. 7.91417
  201. Last edited by bohoomil (2012-03-04 9:01 am)
  202. Registered Linux User: 223384
  203. Ultimate, Infinality font config
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  206. #142012-03-03 8:24 pm
  207. hadrons123
  208. Member
  209.  
  210. From: chennai
  211. Registered: 2011-10-07
  212. Posts: 834
  213. Email
  214. 8.28108
  215. Like others I don't really have any clue what /dev/zero is saying.
  216. Last edited by hadrons123 (2012-03-03 8:25 pm)
  217. DELL E1505: C2D | 4GB | 320GBHDD | ATIX1400 | Fedora
  218. ACER 5740:INTEL DUAL CORE| 2 GB | 160GB | Archlinux, Scientific Linux
  219. Unix is user-friendly. It just isn't promiscuous about which users it's friendly with. - Steven King
  220. Offline
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  222. #152012-03-03 8:34 pm
  223. /dev/zero
  224. Member
  225.  
  226. From: Melbourne, Australia
  227. Registered: 2011-10-20
  228. Posts: 1,066
  229. Website
  230. KingX wrote:
  231. So is 10 impossible to have? And 7-8 about the ideal for a system?
  232. 10 isn't impossible to have. Depending on the total size of all executables you have installed, I don't think there's an upper bound. Eg, if all your files are the same size, then your score will go up as the logarithm of the number of executables you have installed.
  233. As for interpretation, I think it's sort of a relative thing: the point is to compare your scores to other people's scores. If most people are getting between 7.5 and 8.5, and you don't sit inside that range, then there's probably something unusual about your system. If you get a low score, that might indicate that you tend to use fewer, larger programs, that is, programs which "suck more"; and if you have a high score, that probably shows you prefer programs that "suck less" .
  234. It would be interesting to see the scores associated with various LiveCDs. Unfortunately, I can't do this myself at the second.
  235. Last edited by /dev/zero (2012-03-03 8:41 pm)
  236. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  237. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  238. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  239. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  240. Offline
  241. Report Quote
  242. #162012-03-03 9:30 pm
  243. KingX
  244. Member
  245.  
  246. From: Fremont, CA
  247. Registered: 2010-03-23
  248. Posts: 309
  249. Ah ok I thought the score was based on a scale of  1-10, 1 being extremely sucky and 10 being the least sucky.
  250. Offline
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  252. #172012-03-04 1:14 am
  253. ngoonee
  254. Forum Moderator
  255.  
  256. From: Between Thailand and Singapore
  257. Registered: 2009-03-17
  258. Posts: 6,298
  259. Email
  260. 8.33448
  261. I'm surprised, I thought my system was less UNIX-y than most (firefox, for example). Of course, I DO use awesome and mutt (but also have evolution and thunderbird installed....)
  262. Allan-Volunteer on the (topic being discussed) mailn lists. You never get the people who matters attention on the forums.
  263. jasonwryan-Installing Arch is a measure of your literacy. Maintaining Arch is a measure of your diligence. Contributing to Arch is a measure of your competence.
  264. Griemak-Bleeding edge, not bleeding flat. Edge denotes falls will occur from time to time. Bring your own parachute.
  265. Offline
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  267. #182012-03-04 1:46 am
  268. ploub
  269. Member
  270.  
  271. Registered: 2007-05-16
  272. Posts: 102
  273. Email
  274. heh.
  275. 8.48594
  276. Offline
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  278. #192012-03-04 2:05 am
  279. bernarcher
  280. Forum Moderator
  281.  
  282. From: Germany
  283. Registered: 2009-02-17
  284. Posts: 2,150
  285. Email
  286. 8.40162 here.
  287. Almost top value so far. (ploub did beat me, however.  )
  288. Also moving this thread to Try This. It does fit better there.
  289. To know or not to know ...
  290. ... the questions remain forever.
  291. Offline
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  293. #202012-03-04 2:35 am
  294. ga01f4733
  295. Member
  296.  
  297. From: bcn, Catalonia
  298. Registered: 2008-12-05
  299. Posts: 117
  300. Email
  301. 7.77387
  302. New metrics- 10.9418
  303. Last edited by ga01f4733 (2012-03-06 2:16 am)
  304. There are no foreign lands. It is the traveler only who is foreign. --R.L Stevenson
  305. Offline
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  307. #212012-03-04 2:40 am
  308. Barthalion
  309. Trusted User (TU)
  310. From: Poland, Szczecin
  311. Registered: 2010-02-26
  312. Posts: 69
  313. Email Website
  314. Desktop: 8.05751
  315. VPS:        7.5757
  316. Uff.
  317. Arch Linux - rolling release distro, where people are wanting to downgrade to a previous version
  318. Offline
  319. Report Quote
  320. #222012-03-04 2:42 am
  321. ViruSzZ
  322. Member
  323.  
  324. From: The Streets
  325. Registered: 2010-10-14
  326. Posts: 194
  327. Email Website
  328. 7.19486 on my linux-vServer based vps.
  329. Their Momma Made Em, Their Momma Gave em & now she can`t even SAVE`em | My WebLog
  330. Offline
  331. Report Quote
  332. #232012-03-04 2:48 am
  333. freek
  334. Member
  335.  
  336. From: the Netherlands
  337. Registered: 2008-07-21
  338. Posts: 33
  339. Email Website
  340. Debian testing: 7.2328
  341. there's no business like .. your own business
  342. Offline
  343. Report Quote
  344. #242012-03-04 2:49 am
  345. Gcool
  346. Member
  347.  
  348. Registered: 2011-08-16
  349. Posts: 1,345
  350. Email
  351. Workstation at work (not running Arch): 9.48663
  352. Burninate! | github
  353. Offline
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  355. #252012-03-04 2:56 am
  356. Pajaro
  357. Member
  358. Registered: 2004-04-21
  359. Posts: 854
  360. Email
  361. (8.73086) new metric -> 12.1293 ...having installed kde and xfce and lxde and openoffice and everything that i can think of. (1685 packages installed).
  362. Last edited by Pajaro (2012-03-13 10:03 am)
  363. Offline
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  365. #262012-03-04 3:21 am
  366. Bellum
  367. Member
  368. Registered: 2011-08-24
  369. Posts: 230
  370. Email
  371. 8.09135
  372. Not gonna lie, no idea what that means. Some of my stuff is small and modular (urxvt, fluxbox, vim, luakit, tmux). But some more monolithic (firerfox, thunderbird, vlc, kile, wine). Honestly even though I use fluxbox I probably have half of both KDE and Gnome installed because of dependencies.
  373. Offline
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  375. #272012-03-04 3:47 am
  376. livibetter
  377. Member
  378.  
  379. From: Taipei
  380. Registered: 2008-05-14
  381. Posts: 90
  382. Email Website
  383. I got 7.87855 on Gentoo.
  384. My math is rusty and I don't understand the theory, but I am curious about this special case (though impossible in real world): A system has n files of exactly same filesize s.
  385. If my math is still working, then
  386. S(f)=s
  387. S(X)=n*s
  388. p(f)=s/(n*s)=1/n
  389. H(f)=-1/n*log(1/n)=1/n*log(n)
  390. unixness=n*H(f)=log(n)
  391. the filesize is out of the equation in the unixness, only the number of files affect the unixness.
  392. What does that mean?
  393. Offline
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  395. #282012-03-04 4:50 am
  396. toad
  397. Member
  398.  
  399. From: if only I knew
  400. Registered: 2008-12-22
  401. Posts: 1,770
  402. Email Website
  403. 8.79174
  404. never trust a toad...
  405. ::Grateful ArchDonor::
  406. ::Grateful Wikipedia Donor::
  407. Offline
  408. Report Quote
  409. #292012-03-04 5:11 am
  410. San2ban
  411. Banned
  412. From: Bangalore, India
  413. Registered: 2010-02-09
  414. Posts: 258
  415. Email
  416. 8.09943
  417. Surprised!. I will remove some bloat and try again
  418. Satyam eva jayate
  419. Registered linux user #535257
  420. Offline
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  422. #302012-03-04 5:35 am
  423. Awebb
  424. Member
  425.  
  426. Registered: 2010-05-06
  427. Posts: 1,613
  428. Email
  429. 7.80966 (Arch desktop)
  430. 7.93163 (Arch HTPC)
  431. This numbers benefit 32bit systems (smaller binaries). Does that mean 64-bit systems suck more?
  432. EDIT: By the way... that "All software sucks" guy is a boring troll. He should redesign the site to look more like a blog, because static pages tend to be recieved as "truth and knowledge", while oppinions can be found in blogs :-D
  433. Last edited by Awebb (2012-03-04 5:37 am)
  434. Reinstalling Arch is not normal. On --force it is. --force, not even once.
  435. Offline
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  437. #312012-03-04 5:56 am
  438. hadrons123
  439. Member
  440.  
  441. From: chennai
  442. Registered: 2011-10-07
  443. Posts: 834
  444. Email
  445. Looks like guys using OS other than Arch are scoring higher.
  446. DELL E1505: C2D | 4GB | 320GBHDD | ATIX1400 | Fedora
  447. ACER 5740:INTEL DUAL CORE| 2 GB | 160GB | Archlinux, Scientific Linux
  448. Unix is user-friendly. It just isn't promiscuous about which users it's friendly with. - Steven King
  449. Offline
  450. Report Quote
  451. #322012-03-04 6:13 am
  452. Kaustic
  453. Member
  454. Registered: 2011-08-18
  455. Posts: 503
  456. Email
  457. /dev/zero wrote:
  458. What do you get in your "T"?
  459. A rather large number: 276902333
  460. Heh, I did try to add that in manually but it always produced not a number. I've tried it under Zsh and Bash in both a script and simply copy pasting into the terminal
  461. NaOH
  462. Offline
  463. Report Quote
  464. #332012-03-04 6:30 am
  465. SS4
  466. Member
  467.  
  468. From: !Rochford, Essex
  469. Registered: 2010-12-05
  470. Posts: 693
  471. 8.13925
  472. Not bad
  473. Rauchen verboten
  474. Offline
  475. Report Quote
  476. #342012-03-04 7:22 am
  477. Pajaro
  478. Member
  479. Registered: 2004-04-21
  480. Posts: 854
  481. Email
  482. San2ban wrote:
  483. 8.09943
  484. Surprised!. I will remove some bloat and try again
  485. I am overbloated and got a 8.73; try the opposite
  486. Offline
  487. Report Quote
  488. #352012-03-04 7:42 am
  489. Blµb
  490. Member
  491. Registered: 2008-02-10
  492. Posts: 174
  493. (a) 8.38748
  494. (b) 8.39183
  495. (b) Includes my ~/bin which contains a set of scripts to ease my life. And cbmc, a huge binary, actually a statistical outlier even, since it's 4.6M.
  496. How about taking a look at binaries and scripts seperately? Since scripts, for example, lack all the ELF format overhead their executing binaries have...
  497. root@blubpc ~ # cat > /tmp/filter.sh << EOF
  498. #!/bin/sh
  499. if head "\$1" | grep -q '^#!'; then
  500.   stat -c '%s' "\$1"
  501.         else
  502.           stat -c '%s' "\$1" >&2
  503.                 fi
  504.                 EOF
  505.                 root@blubpc ~ # chmod +x /tmp/filter.sh
  506.                 root@blubpc ~ # find {,/usr}/{s,}bin /lib /boot /etc /home/blub/bin -type f -executable -exec /tmp/filter.sh '{}' "%s" ';' > /tmp/filtered_scripts 2> /tmp/filtered_bins
  507.                 root@blubpc ~ # T1=$(cat /tmp/filtered_bins | awk '{t+=$1} END {print t}')
  508.                 root@blubpc ~ # T2=$(cat /tmp/filtered_scripts | awk '{t+=$1} END {print t}')
  509.                 root@blubpc ~ # echo $T1 $T2
  510.                 868139304 30871849
  511.                 root@blubpc ~ # cat /tmp/filtered_bins | awk -v t=$T1 '{p=$1/t; h += -p*log(p)/log(2)} END {print h}'
  512.                 8.25136
  513.                 root@blubpc ~ # cat /tmp/filtered_scripts | awk -v t=$T2 '{p=$1/t; h += -p*log(p)/log(2)} END {print h}'
  514.                 6.06017
  515.                 root@blubpc ~ # echo sanity check, the following should equal b=8.39183
  516.                 sanity check, the following should equal b=8.39183
  517.                 root@blubpc ~ # cat /tmp/filtered_bins /tmp/filtered_scripts | awk -v t=$[T1 + T2] '{p=$1/t; h += -p*log(p)/log(2)} END {print h}'
  518.                 8.39183
  519.                 root@blubpc ~ # cat /tmp/filtered_bins | awk -v t=$[T1 + T2] '{p=$1/t; h += -p*log(p)/log(2)} END {print h}'
  520.                 8.01669
  521.                 root@blubpc ~ # cat /tmp/filtered_scripts | awk -v t=$[T1 + T2] '{p=$1/t; h += -p*log(p)/log(2)} END {print h}'
  522.                 0.375133
  523.                 Not really what I was expecting O.o
  524.                 You know you're paranoid when you start thinking random letters while typing a password.
  525.                 A good post about vim
  526.                 Python has no multithreading.
  527.                 Offline
  528.                 Report Quote
  529.                 #362012-03-04 8:40 am
  530.                 azleifel
  531.                 Member
  532.                 From: St Evenage, UK
  533.                 Registered: 2007-10-28
  534.                 Posts: 475
  535.                 Email
  536.                 8.72211
  537.                 Offline
  538.                 Report Quote
  539.                 #372012-03-04 8:46 am
  540.                 GordonGR
  541.                 Member
  542.  
  543.                 From: Thessaloniki, Greece
  544.                 Registered: 2011-11-07
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  547.                 8.62069, and I am using KDE.
  548.                 Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU E3400 @ 2.60GHz, 1878 MB, XFCE 4.10, x86_64. AURs.
  549.                 “No one without the knowledge of geometry may enter.“ Plato.
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  552.                 #382012-03-04 9:07 am
  553.                 stressat
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  560.                 8.70095 (kde 4.8)
  561.                 http://stressat.blogspot.com/
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  564.                 #392012-03-04 9:48 am
  565.                 kinhodder
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  568.                 From: UK
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  572.                 7.99342
  573.                 Seems reasonable. I think.
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  577.                 #402012-03-04 10:07 am
  578.                 kevku
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  587.                 #412012-03-04 10:23 am
  588.                 Teho
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  598.                 #422012-03-04 10:45 am
  599.                 igndenok
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  601.                 From: Sidoarjo, Indonesia
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  606.                 ArchLinux & awesome
  607.                 Ask, and it shall be given you.
  608.                 Seek, and ye shall find.
  609.                 Knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
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  612.                 #432012-03-04 11:32 am
  613.                 jac
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  616.                 From: /home/jac
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  620.                 This is an interesting concept. Though, it appears to me that your metric is flawed. It does not measure the UNIX-ness very well at all. I mean, take a look at the formula. It only takes into account the relative size. That means that a system with 10 highly UNIX-y programs which are all the same size gets the exact same score as a system with 10 monolithic programs which are each the same size.
  621.                 With that in mind, I'm not really sure of a good way to correct it. I would think a term dependent on the absolute size only would be needed, but I haven't had time to play around with it yet. Maybe adding in something like 1/S(f) ? As long as you have no zero-byte files (which is probably the case for the person getting NaN) this should not blow up.
  622.                 I know it's all in fun and not very rigorous, but it would just be a lot cooler to me if it was tweaked to be a little better
  623.                 Last edited by jac (2012-03-04 11:35 am)
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  626.                 #442012-03-04 12:30 pm
  627.                 stlarch
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  638.                 #452012-03-04 1:10 pm
  639.                 firecat53
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  646.                 8.11125. 64-bit laptop w/ dwm (+ firefox, virtualbox, libreoffice).
  647.                 Scott
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  651.                 #462012-03-04 3:57 pm
  652.                 scjudd
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  661.                 #472012-03-04 4:34 pm
  662.                 RobbieWT
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  670.                 #482012-03-04 4:45 pm
  671.                 toad
  672.                 Member
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  674.                 From: if only I knew
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  678.                 And my desktop says 9.00682
  679.                 EDIT:
  680.                 new value 12.0578
  681.                 Last edited by toad (2012-03-10 2:09 am)
  682.                 never trust a toad...
  683.                 ::Grateful ArchDonor::
  684.                 ::Grateful Wikipedia Donor::
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  687.                 #492012-03-04 4:54 pm
  688.                 Hubi17
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  691.                 Posts: 16
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  693.                 7.99593
  694.                 using awesome wm - I guess I have some bloat
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  697.                 #502012-03-04 5:10 pm
  698.                 AaronD
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  700.                 From: Tosev 3
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  704.                 8.50055 on my Arch laptop with KDE 4.8.
  705.                 --Aaron
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  708.                 #512012-03-04 5:21 pm
  709.                 Gusar
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  714.                 Hubi17 wrote:
  715.                 7.99593
  716.                 using awesome wm - I guess I have some bloat
  717.                 Considering you get under 8, and folks with KDE get almost 9, I'd say rather than you having bloat the metric is just very, very flawed.
  718.                 I get 8.05345 on my desktop. Which is completely weird, as I could swear that when I tried on my laptop earlier in the day it was under 8. And, get this, it's the *exact* same install on both machines. Seriously. The differences are minimal, a few config files are a bit different, that's it. The packages installed are the same.
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  721.                 #522012-03-05 12:35 am
  722.                 /dev/zero
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  729.                 Gusar wrote:
  730.                 Considering you get under 8, and folks with KDE get almost 9, I'd say rather than you having bloat the metric is just very, very flawed.
  731.                 It occurs to me that since it's only counting executables, and since KDE and the like is mainly small apps built around large libraries (are they not?), this might be leading to the inaccurate results.
  732.                 When I remove the "-executable" flag, my own score suddenly leaps to "nan".
  733.                 DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  734.                 Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  735.                 Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  736.                 Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
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  739.                 #532012-03-05 12:56 am
  740.                 livibetter
  741.                 Member
  742.  
  743.                 From: Taipei
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  747.                 /dev/zero wrote:
  748.                 When I remove the "-executable" flag, my own score suddenly leaps to "nan".
  749.                 I think that is caused by files with no content, i.e. 0 bytes.
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  752.                 #542012-03-05 1:12 am
  753.                 /dev/zero
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  756.                 From: Melbourne, Australia
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  760.                 livibetter wrote:
  761.                 I think that is caused by files with no content, i.e. 0 bytes.
  762.                 Aha. Okay, when I filter out all the size zeros (grep -v "^0"), I now get 8.90591.
  763.                 DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  764.                 Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  765.                 Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  766.                 Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
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  769.                 #552012-03-05 2:34 am
  770.                 Ari'osika
  771.                 Member
  772.  
  773.                 From: Your computer, okay?
  774.                 Registered: 2010-06-22
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  777.                 8.09657
  778.                 Whatever that actually means.. haha
  779.                 If you're reading this; you're awesome.
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  782.                 #562012-03-05 12:22 pm
  783.                 Blµb
  784.                 Member
  785.                 Registered: 2008-02-10
  786.                 Posts: 174
  787.                 We do need to find a way to fix the fact that scripts are usually much smaller than binaries... Whereas scripts can also be non-unix-y
  788.                 Maybe add the size of some of the shell's segments to the script sizes?
  789.                 Last edited by Blµb (2012-03-05 12:22 pm)
  790.                 You know you're paranoid when you start thinking random letters while typing a password.
  791.                 A good post about vim
  792.                 Python has no multithreading.
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  795.                 #572012-03-05 1:01 pm
  796.                 alphaniner
  797.                 Member
  798.  
  799.                 From: Ancapistan
  800.                 Registered: 2010-07-12
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  803.                 Arch: 9.56345
  804.                 Ubuntu 10.04 Server: 11.9539
  805.                 Voting is an act of presumptive violence because each voter assumes the right to appoint a political guardian over other human beings.
  806.                 People choosing more satisfying, lower paying jobs over less satisfying, higher paying jobs costs the government millions of dollars in tax revenue each year. Close the happiness tax-loophole!
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  809.                 #582012-03-05 1:21 pm
  810.                 Hspasta
  811.                 Member
  812.                 Registered: 2011-12-23
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  815.                 I'm getting an error when I run the first command. I assume you just copy and paste right?
  816.                 T=$(sudo find {,/usr}/{s,}bin /lib /boot /etc -type f ! -empty -printf "%s\n" awk '{t+=$1} END {print t}')
  817.                 find: paths must precede expression: awk
  818.                 Usage: find [-H] [-L] [-P] [-Olevel] [-D help|tree|search|stat|rates|opt|exec] [path...] [expression]
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  821.                 #592012-03-05 1:47 pm
  822.                 /dev/zero
  823.                 Member
  824.  
  825.                 From: Melbourne, Australia
  826.                 Registered: 2011-10-20
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  828.                 Website
  829.                 Hspasta wrote:
  830.                 I'm getting an error when I run the first command. I assume you just copy and paste right?
  831.                 T=$(sudo find {,/usr}/{s,}bin /lib /boot /etc -type f ! -empty -printf "%s\n" awk '{t+=$1} END {print t}')
  832.                 find: paths must precede expression: awk
  833.                 Usage: find [-H] [-L] [-P] [-Olevel] [-D help|tree|search|stat|rates|opt|exec] [path...] [expression]
  834.                 Apologies. I edited the original post to incorporate some feedback, and removed the pipe sign. It should work now.
  835.                 DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  836.                 Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  837.                 Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  838.                 Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
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  841.                 #602012-03-05 1:54 pm
  842.                 /dev/zero
  843.                 Member
  844.  
  845.                 From: Melbourne, Australia
  846.                 Registered: 2011-10-20
  847.                 Posts: 1,066
  848.                 Website
  849.                 Blµb wrote:
  850.                 We do need to find a way to fix the fact that scripts are usually much smaller than binaries... Whereas scripts can also be non-unix-y
  851.                 Maybe add the size of some of the shell's segments to the script sizes?
  852.                 I see what you're saying; however, the commands already count your shell's binaries (/bin/bash ...), and it is good unix practice to prefer scripts to binaries; furthermore, your suggested work-around would over-complicate what's essentially just meant to be a fun heuristic.
  853.                 DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  854.                 Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  855.                 Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  856.                 Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
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  859.                 #612012-03-05 3:19 pm
  860.                 skanky
  861.                 Member
  862.  
  863.                 From: Sheffield
  864.                 Registered: 2009-10-23
  865.                 Posts: 1,146
  866.                 Email
  867.                 EDIT new version : 11.4123
  868.                 Last edited by skanky (2012-03-06 5:15 am)
  869.                 "...one cannot be angry when one looks at a penguin."  - John Ruskin
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  872.                 #622012-03-05 3:39 pm
  873.                 Zeqadious
  874.                 Member
  875.                 From: New York, USA
  876.                 Registered: 2007-10-15
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  879.                 Arch: 10.0595
  880.                 Last edited by Zeqadious (2012-03-05 3:43 pm)
  881.                 "Till shade is gone, till water is gone, into the Shadow with teeth bared, screaming defiance with the last breath, to spit in Sightblinder's eye on the Last Day"
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  884.                 #632012-03-05 3:52 pm
  885.                 Hspasta
  886.                 Member
  887.                 Registered: 2011-12-23
  888.                 Posts: 109
  889.                 Email
  890.                 Arch: 9.10433
  891.                 I wanted to get a better score so I did some package cleanup and it went up by 0.3.
  892.                 Last edited by Hspasta (2012-03-05 3:54 pm)
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  895.                 #642012-03-05 4:10 pm
  896.                 frostyfrog
  897.                 Member
  898.                 From: Utah, USA
  899.                 Registered: 2011-03-27
  900.                 Posts: 31
  901.                 Email
  902.                 Hspasta wrote:
  903.                 Arch: 9.10433
  904.                 I wanted to get a better score so I did some package cleanup and it went up by 0.3.
  905.                 Now I'm kind of afraid to do the same...
  906.                 Arch server: 9.5723
  907.                 Arch Netbook: 8.85845
  908.                 Funny, I was pretty sure my netbook had more "bloat" on it than my server...
  909.                 {arch32} {subtlewm}{Acer Aspire One AO532h}
  910.                 {arch64} {Headless Server}
  911.                 Grrr! 400 char limit
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  914.                 #652012-03-05 4:53 pm
  915.                 vwyodajl
  916.                 Member
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  918.                 Registered: 2012-01-21
  919.                 Posts: 156
  920.                 Email
  921.                 Laptop Arch 9.58941, I don't feel that bloated
  922.                 EDIT:3/6/12
  923.                 Now with recent changes made in OP
  924.                 11.2063
  925.                 Last edited by vwyodajl (2012-03-06 3:48 am)
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  928.                 #662012-03-05 5:12 pm
  929.                 /dev/zero
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  932.                 From: Melbourne, Australia
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  934.                 Posts: 1,066
  935.                 Website
  936.                 Note that this isn't really about "bloat" per se. The idea is that you will score better if, given say a 10Mb file, you can replace it with several files whose sizes add to 10Mb. Optimal unixness comes from having programs that are functionally orthogonal and which act as text filters. It's kind of independent of how large these functionally-orthogonal text filters are.
  937.                 DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  938.                 Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  939.                 Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  940.                 Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  941.                 Offline
  942.                 Report Quote
  943.                 #672012-03-05 5:38 pm
  944.                 Kaustic
  945.                 Member
  946.                 Registered: 2011-08-18
  947.                 Posts: 503
  948.                 Email
  949.                 Good news /dev/zero! Your new command worked. Here is my new score: (old score: -nan)
  950.                 11.3115
  951.                 Do I win anything... again?
  952.                 Last edited by Kaustic (2012-03-05 5:48 pm)
  953.                 NaOH
  954.                 Offline
  955.                 Report Quote
  956.                 #682012-03-05 5:43 pm
  957.                 /dev/zero
  958.                 Member
  959.  
  960.                 From: Melbourne, Australia
  961.                 Registered: 2011-10-20
  962.                 Posts: 1,066
  963.                 Website
  964.                 Kaustic wrote:
  965.                 Now, do I win anything... again?
  966.                 Close, but no cigar. With the updated command, I'm now on 11.471 .
  967.                 DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  968.                 Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  969.                 Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  970.                 Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  971.                 Offline
  972.                 Report Quote
  973.                 #692012-03-05 5:51 pm
  974.                 Kaustic
  975.                 Member
  976.                 Registered: 2011-08-18
  977.                 Posts: 503
  978.                 Email
  979.                 Balls.
  980.                 So essentially the higher the result the more, smaller, executables you have and getting lower results for having fewer, larger executables?
  981.                 Last edited by Kaustic (2012-03-05 5:52 pm)
  982.                 NaOH
  983.                 Offline
  984.                 Report Quote
  985.                 #702012-03-05 5:54 pm
  986.                 n1x4
  987.                 Member
  988.  
  989.                 From: Chernobyl
  990.                 Registered: 2012-02-17
  991.                 Posts: 141
  992.                 Email Website
  993.                 11.2407
  994.                 ||github||
  995.                 Hack-N-Slash
  996.                 Offline
  997.                 Report Quote
  998.                 #712012-03-05 5:56 pm
  999.                 /dev/zero
  1000.                 Member
  1001.  
  1002.                 From: Melbourne, Australia
  1003.                 Registered: 2011-10-20
  1004.                 Posts: 1,066
  1005.                 Website
  1006.                 Kaustic wrote:
  1007.                 Balls.
  1008.                 So essentially the higher the result the more, smaller, executables, you have and getting lower results for having fewer, larger executables?
  1009.                 Yep.
  1010.                 ... always keeping in mind that there's nothing rigorous here. You can (assuming write access) increase your score to any arbitrary value that you feel like, by running for sufficiently long:
  1011.                 while true; do echo 1 > /bin/$RANDOM; done
  1012.                 DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  1013.                 Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  1014.                 Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  1015.                 Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  1016.                 Offline
  1017.                 Report Quote
  1018.                 #722012-03-05 7:13 pm
  1019.                 hellbuster
  1020.                 Member
  1021.                 From: Chile
  1022.                 Registered: 2010-05-17
  1023.                 Posts: 14
  1024.                 Email
  1025.                 11.5583
  1026.                 Offline
  1027.                 Report Quote
  1028.                 #732012-03-05 8:50 pm
  1029.                 Bellum
  1030.                 Member
  1031.                 Registered: 2011-08-24
  1032.                 Posts: 230
  1033.                 Email
  1034.                 Hum. I don't know. I installed Scribus and Inkskape today and I've still got you beat /dev/zero.
  1035.                 Then again, I've also installed pekwm and tint2.
  1036.                 11.8462
  1037.                 Offline
  1038.                 Report Quote
  1039.                 #742012-03-05 9:43 pm
  1040.                 ANOKNUSA
  1041.                 Member
  1042.  
  1043.                 From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
  1044.                 Registered: 2010-10-21
  1045.                 Posts: 1,098
  1046.                 Email
  1047.                 /dev/zero/ wrote:
  1048.                 As for interpretation, I think it's sort of a relative thing: the point is to compare your scores to other people's scores. If most people are getting between 7.5 and 8.5, and you don't sit inside that range, then there's probably something unusual about your system. If you get a low score, that might indicate that you tend to use fewer, larger programs, that is, programs which "suck more"; and if you have a high score, that probably shows you prefer programs that "suck less"
  1049.                 Hm... 11.3251.
  1050.                 You sure about that? 'Cuz I seem to recall sucking" quite a bit more.   The only WM I've got installed right now is WMFS2; a couple weeks ago, my score would've been different.  This is interesting, albeit in a just-for-fun sort of way; I'm not sure there's much we can tell about each other's set-ups just by looking at this single number.
  1051.                 You read it--you can't UNread it!!!
  1052.                 "Oh, Skycake... Why must you be so delicious?"  --Patton Oswalt
  1053.                 Offline
  1054.                 Report Quote
  1055.                 #752012-03-05 9:52 pm
  1056.                 Gusar
  1057.                 Member
  1058.                 Registered: 2009-08-25
  1059.                 Posts: 2,473
  1060.                 Email
  1061.                 The metric has changed since that post was written. Now it seems 11 is sort of the middle point.
  1062.                 Offline
  1063.                 Report Quote
  1064.                 Pages: 1 2 NextPost reply
  1065.                 Index» Try This» Measure your system's UnixnessSubscribe to this topic
  1066.                 Quick post
  1067.                 Write your message and submit
  1068.  
  1069.                 BBCode: on [url] tag: on [img] tag: on Smilies: on
  1070.                  
  1071.                  Jump to
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  1075.  
  1076. From: Melbourne, Australia
  1077. Registered: 2011-10-20
  1078. Posts: 1,066
  1079. Website
  1080. Gusar wrote:
  1081. The metric has changed since that post was written. Now it seems 11 is sort of the middle point.
  1082. Yeah, sorry about that. The commands evolved a little bit based on the discussion.
  1083. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  1084. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  1085. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  1086. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  1087. Offline
  1088. Report Quote
  1089. #772012-03-10 12:23 am
  1090. disastrophe
  1091. Member
  1092.  
  1093. From: pdx
  1094. Registered: 2010-10-08
  1095. Posts: 90
  1096. Email
  1097. 11.5904 -- arch, xfce
  1098. "If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities." ~ Voltaire
  1099. Offline
  1100. Report Quote
  1101. #782012-03-10 1:28 am
  1102. bananas4370
  1103. Member
  1104.  
  1105. From: Warwick QLD Australia
  1106. Registered: 2011-10-25
  1107. Posts: 23
  1108. Email
  1109. I get 10.9931
  1110. Cheers
  1111. Patrick
  1112. Linux Counter: #478369
  1113. Don't fix it if it ain't broken, don't break it if you can't fix it.
  1114. Offline
  1115. Report Quote
  1116. #792012-03-10 1:52 am
  1117. SiD
  1118. Member
  1119.  
  1120. From: Germany
  1121. Registered: 2006-09-21
  1122. Posts: 729
  1123. Email
  1124. 11.3156
  1125. "To start press any key." Where's the any key? - Homer Simpson
  1126. Offline
  1127. Report Quote
  1128. #802012-03-10 3:18 am
  1129. ViruSzZ
  1130. Member
  1131.  
  1132. From: The Streets
  1133. Registered: 2010-10-14
  1134. Posts: 194
  1135. Email Website
  1136. The result of my arch+gnome3 lappy = 10.788
  1137. Their Momma Made Em, Their Momma Gave em & now she can`t even SAVE`em | My WebLog
  1138. Offline
  1139. Report Quote
  1140. #812012-03-10 6:38 pm
  1141. freek
  1142. Member
  1143.  
  1144. From: the Netherlands
  1145. Registered: 2008-07-21
  1146. Posts: 33
  1147. Email Website
  1148. OK, new metric .. Debian testing: 10.4784
  1149. there's no business like .. your own business
  1150. Offline
  1151. Report Quote
  1152. #822012-03-10 10:23 pm
  1153. iv597
  1154. Member
  1155. From: United States
  1156. Registered: 2011-09-18
  1157. Posts: 51
  1158. Email Website
  1159. My box:
  1160. 11.2489
  1161. Yeah. I kinda figured it'd be pretty high for me, I purposefully use light software.
  1162. EDIT... oh, apparently this isn't high anymore. Whatevs.
  1163. Last edited by iv597 (2012-03-10 10:24 pm)
  1164. Website (Including Blog, Code, OA Server) :: iv597 on Freenode, OFTC, Twitter, identi.ca
  1165. Offline
  1166. Report Quote
  1167. #832012-03-11 6:27 am
  1168. Ragnis
  1169. Member
  1170.  
  1171. Registered: 2012-01-29
  1172. Posts: 14
  1173. Email Website
  1174. 11.2167
  1175. Offline
  1176. Report Quote
  1177. #842012-03-11 6:39 am
  1178. portix
  1179. Member
  1180. Registered: 2009-01-13
  1181. Posts: 563
  1182. Email
  1183. desktop: 10.6551
  1184. notebook: 10.482
  1185. dwb
  1186. Offline
  1187. Report Quote
  1188. #852012-03-11 11:56 am
  1189. szorti
  1190. Member
  1191. From: Cracow, Poland
  1192. Registered: 2010-06-23
  1193. Posts: 18
  1194. Email
  1195. 11.8127 with gnome 3
  1196. Offline
  1197. Report Quote
  1198. #862012-03-12 3:59 pm
  1199. Hspasta
  1200. Member
  1201. Registered: 2011-12-23
  1202. Posts: 109
  1203. Email
  1204. Hspasta wrote:
  1205. Arch: 9.10433
  1206. I wanted to get a better score so I did some package cleanup and it went up by 0.3.
  1207. New metric: 11.5807
  1208. Offline
  1209. Report Quote
  1210. #872012-03-12 4:32 pm
  1211. debsuvra
  1212. Member
  1213. From: India
  1214. Registered: 2008-08-07
  1215. Posts: 11
  1216. Email Website
  1217. 11.1819 with GNOME 3 and Arch 64 bit. I use multiple scientific calculation software like Mathematica/MATLAB/Octave etc, coupled with standard browser, media player and usual GNOME stuffs.
  1218. Offline
  1219. Report Quote
  1220. #882012-03-12 4:59 pm
  1221. jgreen1tc
  1222. Member
  1223.  
  1224. From: St. Louis
  1225. Registered: 2011-05-15
  1226. Posts: 185
  1227. Email
  1228. 10.7441
  1229. Pretty cool. I'm not exactly sure what that means, but I like my set-up.
  1230. Offline
  1231. Report Quote
  1232. #892012-03-13 3:54 am
  1233. RaisedFist
  1234. Member
  1235.  
  1236. From: Romania
  1237. Registered: 2007-01-30
  1238. Posts: 551
  1239. Website
  1240. I'm 11.2629 unixy
  1241. last.fm
  1242. Offline
  1243. Report Quote
  1244. #902012-03-17 8:24 pm
  1245. X1650
  1246. Member
  1247.  
  1248. Registered: 2012-02-25
  1249. Posts: 1
  1250. Email
  1251. Desktop: 9.42851
  1252. Laptop: 10.2546
  1253. Interesting.
  1254. Offline
  1255. Report Quote
  1256. #912012-04-13 10:53 am
  1257. adamrehard
  1258. Member
  1259.  
  1260. From: NY, USA
  1261. Registered: 2011-11-02
  1262. Posts: 154
  1263. Email
  1264. 11.3217
  1265. So it has come to this.
  1266. http://xkcd.com/1022/
  1267. "The box said requires Vista or better, so I installed Arch"
  1268. Windows != Linux
  1269. Offline
  1270. Report Quote
  1271. #922012-04-17 1:38 pm
  1272. Sara
  1273. Member
  1274.  
  1275. From: USA
  1276. Registered: 2009-07-08
  1277. Posts: 197
  1278. Website
  1279. 11.1627, on a cli-only setup on a laptop. I really enjoyed the attempt at making this all mathematically rigorous .
  1280. Registed Linux User 483618
  1281. Offline
  1282. Report Quote
  1283. #932012-04-17 2:25 pm
  1284. nabeelimran
  1285. Member
  1286.  
  1287. From: Swat, Pakistan
  1288. Registered: 2012-02-09
  1289. Posts: 26
  1290. Email
  1291. 11.2271 !!!
  1292. Arch Linux with GNOME Fallback.
  1293. ...should I be worried or something?
  1294. Dell XPS M1710 : C2D 2.16 - 4GB - 320GB - 256MB nVidia - 17" TFT - DVD-DL-RW
  1295. Triple-Boot: Windows 7 Ultimate - Arch Linux x86_64 GNOME (MAIN) - Ubuntu 10.04.3
  1296. Offline
  1297. Report Quote
  1298. #942012-04-17 2:32 pm
  1299. /dev/zero
  1300. Member
  1301.  
  1302. From: Melbourne, Australia
  1303. Registered: 2011-10-20
  1304. Posts: 1,066
  1305. Website
  1306. Sara wrote:
  1307. 11.1627, on a cli-only setup on a laptop. I really enjoyed the attempt at making this all mathematically rigorous .
  1308. o_O Are you being sarcastic? Any real mathematician/statistician would smack me upside the head lol
  1309. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  1310. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  1311. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  1312. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  1313. Offline
  1314. Report Quote
  1315. #952012-04-17 2:44 pm
  1316. /dev/zero
  1317. Member
  1318.  
  1319. From: Melbourne, Australia
  1320. Registered: 2011-10-20
  1321. Posts: 1,066
  1322. Website
  1323. nabeelimran wrote:
  1324. 11.2271 !!!
  1325. Arch Linux with GNOME Fallback.
  1326. ...should I be worried or something?
  1327. What about? It's a reasonable number. I'm currently around 11.8924.
  1328. I saw it dip a couple of times when I installed Firefox and Uzbl; libreoffice pushed it up. This seems a little counterintuitve. I think it's because uzbl depends on libwebkit, and puts most of its little files in /usr/share (not counted by unixness), whereas libreoffice did put a lot of little files in /usr/lib (which is counted).
  1329. DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  1330. Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  1331. Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  1332. Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  1333. Offline
  1334. Report Quote
  1335. #962012-04-18 2:06 am
  1336. GERGE
  1337. Member
  1338. From: Turkey
  1339. Registered: 2008-09-29
  1340. Posts: 157
  1341. Email Website
  1342. Xfce
  1343. 10.89
  1344. Offline
  1345. Report Quote
  1346. #972012-04-18 12:50 pm
  1347. trontonic
  1348. Trusted User (TU)
  1349. Registered: 2008-07-21
  1350. Posts: 80
  1351. On my desktop computer used for testing and building all sorts of packages: 12.6766
  1352. Offline
  1353. Report Quote
  1354. #982012-04-20 2:27 pm
  1355. Sara
  1356. Member
  1357.  
  1358. From: USA
  1359. Registered: 2009-07-08
  1360. Posts: 197
  1361. Website
  1362. /dev/zero wrote:
  1363. o_O Are you being sarcastic? Any real mathematician/statistician would smack me upside the head lol
  1364. I probably would have been seriously annoyed if I had already taken measure theory, but as I've only heard of the terms, I thought it fun how you attempted to appear rigorous . So no, no sarcasm.
  1365. Registed Linux User 483618
  1366. Offline
  1367. Report Quote
  1368. #992012-04-20 3:55 pm
  1369. Terra-byte
  1370. Member
  1371. Registered: 2012-03-25
  1372. Posts: 11
  1373. Email
  1374. 11.8266
  1375. Offline
  1376. Report Quote
  1377. #1002012-04-20 7:32 pm
  1378. manzdagratiano
  1379. Member
  1380.  
  1381. From: New Jersey, USA
  1382. Registered: 2010-10-08
  1383. Posts: 131
  1384. Email
  1385. 11.659...
  1386. And I still have Gnome installed! I should mention I am compulsive about removing bloat otherwise, but nonetheless,  my score must have been helped by my massive sage install, which has many small files.
  1387. EDIT: Nope, not at all, since sage is located in $HOME, and therefore not counted by Unixness. I guess I should feel naturally Unixy.
  1388. Last edited by manzdagratiano (2012-04-21 10:25 am)
  1389. Be formless, shapeless... like water. Now you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup; you put water into a bottle it becomes the bottle; if you put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot... Now water can flow, or it can crash... Be water my friend
  1390. Offline
  1391. Report Quote
  1392. #1012012-04-20 8:07 pm
  1393. Misfit138
  1394. Misfit Emeritus
  1395.  
  1396. From: USA
  1397. Registered: 2006-11-26
  1398. Posts: 4,157
  1399. Email Website
  1400. Fedora 16 on ThinkPad T60: 12.0032
  1401. Arch on Desktop: 11.7531
  1402. In 2011, a Professor of Computer Science gave a speech on using the Linux kernel to teach his undergraduates about operating systems. Someone in the audience asked, "Why use Linux? Why not use Plan 9?" He answered, "Plan 9 looks like it was written by experts; Linux looks like something my students could aspire to write."
  1403. Offline
  1404. Report Quote
  1405. #1022012-04-21 2:31 am
  1406. onearm
  1407. Member
  1408.  
  1409. From: Anywhere but here
  1410. Registered: 2006-07-06
  1411. Posts: 354
  1412. Email
  1413. Arch (64bit): 10.116
  1414. Arch (32bit, very minimal installation): 9.14239
  1415. To get something done, a committee should consist of no more than three persons, two of them absent.
  1416. --
  1417. Twitter Github
  1418. Offline
  1419. Report Quote
  1420. #1032012-04-30 11:35 am
  1421. gruby
  1422. Member
  1423. Registered: 2012-04-30
  1424. Posts: 1
  1425. Email
  1426. hello
  1427. 12.8232  
  1428. Offline
  1429. Report Quote
  1430. #1042012-04-30 12:23 pm
  1431. kuraku
  1432. Member
  1433.  
  1434. From: planet Earth
  1435. Registered: 2012-01-03
  1436. Posts: 152
  1437. Email
  1438. 9.96677
  1439. Hmmm, seems okay for a debian sid machine with just a few programs and monsterwm.
  1440. Last edited by kuraku (2012-04-30 12:26 pm)
  1441. Offline
  1442. Report Quote
  1443. #1052012-04-30 5:02 pm
  1444. Jristz
  1445. Member
  1446.  
  1447. From: America/Santiago
  1448. Registered: 2011-06-10
  1449. Posts: 372
  1450. Email
  1451. 11.4442
  1452. xfce4 4.10 and only all that I need
  1453. Offline
  1454. Report Quote
  1455. #1062012-05-01 11:00 am
  1456. ShadowKyogre
  1457. Member
  1458.  
  1459. From: Hell! XP No... I'm not telling
  1460. Registered: 2008-12-19
  1461. Posts: 424
  1462. Website
  1463. Got this on my desktop with KDE: 12.0314
  1464. Will probably edit later to include stats for my laptop.
  1465. For every problem, there is a solution that is:
  1466. Clean
  1467. Simple and most of all...wrong!
  1468. Github page
  1469. Offline
  1470. Report Quote
  1471. #1072012-05-01 7:03 pm
  1472. mrmylanman
  1473. Member
  1474. From: Altamonte Springs, FL, USA
  1475. Registered: 2011-03-13
  1476. Posts: 175
  1477. Email
  1478. My laptop which has XFCE got 11.0648.  Kind of surprised it is as high as it is.
  1479. Arch user since 2011-03-13
  1480. Thinkpad X220 Intel Core i7-2640M CPU, 16GB DDR3-1333 RAM, 160GB Intel SATA II SSD & 60GB OCZ mSATA SSD, 12.5" IPS 1366x768 Display, 6-cell Battery
  1481. (Installation date:  2012-03-19)
  1482. Offline
  1483. Report Quote
  1484. #1082012-05-01 9:39 pm
  1485. Roken
  1486. Member
  1487.  
  1488. From: UK
  1489. Registered: 2012-01-16
  1490. Posts: 354
  1491. Email Website
  1492. I have no clue what I did - but a quick check before copy & paste suggested it wasn't going to kill my system:
  1493. 11.7211
  1494. Arch, Debian, LFS
  1495. ATI Radeon HD 6670, 2GB, AMD Phenom II X4 (965BE) @ 3.6 Ghz (Overclocked) 8GB RAM
  1496. Linux user #545703
  1497. Offline
  1498. Report Quote
  1499. #1092012-05-01 10:05 pm
  1500. Montague
  1501. Member
  1502.  
  1503. From: :age
  1504. Registered: 2010-06-24
  1505. Posts: 82
  1506. 11.7254 amazingly, I had no idea my system would be so Unix-y, I made no special efforts (have basic gnome installed but don't use it much, I also have Compiz-standalone, but I mostly log in to lxde or xfce4) so yeah a bunch of crud installed that I could clean up, and I am sure my system must "suck" in many ways, but hey, nice result nonetheless (not that this "test" means much anything at all).
  1507.  o   — ǝƃɐnƃuɐʃ ǝʌıʇɐu ʎɯ ʇou sı ɥsıʃƃuǝ
  1508.  o7o
  1509.  ///
  1510.  Offline
  1511.  Report Quote
  1512.  #1102012-05-02 11:07 pm
  1513.  zero2cx
  1514.  Member
  1515.  
  1516.  From: Minneapolis, MN
  1517.  Registered: 2012-04-29
  1518.  Posts: 16
  1519.  Email
  1520.  11.6522 The big old brick under my desk.
  1521.  Hehee, I like it. I just don't know why.
  1522.  Signature
  1523.  Offline
  1524.  Report Quote
  1525.  #1112012-05-03 4:58 am
  1526.  Gruntz
  1527.  Member
  1528.  From: Haskovo, Bulgaria
  1529.  Registered: 2007-08-31
  1530.  Posts: 250
  1531.  Email
  1532.  11.4943
  1533.  
  1534.  is higher better then lower number?
  1535.  Offline
  1536.  Report Quote
  1537.  #1122012-05-03 5:41 am
  1538.  /dev/zero
  1539.  Member
  1540.  
  1541.  From: Melbourne, Australia
  1542.  Registered: 2011-10-20
  1543.  Posts: 1,066
  1544.  Website
  1545.  Gruntz wrote:
  1546.  11.4943
  1547.  
  1548.  is higher better then lower number?
  1549.  Well, there are a few issues with making broad judgements about better or worse.
  1550.  Issue #1: there are real problems with the measure's implementation. For example, it's easy to score higher just by installing more software, whether or not you use that software. Ideally, it should only count software that you actually use. It has other problems too. Please just treat it only as a bit of fun!
  1551.  Issue #2: it's intended to be a measure of Unixness, according to traditional notions of what this means. Is being true to the Unix tradition good or bad? I personally prefer high Unixness, but I didn't write the opening post intending to make anyone feel bad.
  1552.  Issue #3: the idea of basing the measure on entropy is also possibly problematic. I seem to recall seeing precedent, in other contexts, for a measure like this, but even so, I must emphasise to only treat this in a light-hearted way.
  1553.  TLDR? Okay, higher is probably better, more or less
  1554.  DSFR: Do Some Frickin' Research
  1555.  Linux is NOT Windows | The Rootless Root
  1556.  Desktop: Phenom II X6 1090T CPU, 4Gb RAM, ArchLinux, dwm.
  1557.  Laptop: i5-2430M CPU, 4Gb RAM, BCM43227 wifi, ArchLinux, wmii.
  1558.  Offline
  1559.  Report Quote
  1560.  #1132012-05-04 12:56 am
  1561.  durian
  1562.  Member
  1563.  Registered: 2011-12-22
  1564.  Posts: 13
  1565.  Email
  1566.  Arch 64 bit, my work machine, with Openbox:
  1567.  10.2827
  1568.  -peter
  1569.  Offline
  1570.  Report Quote
  1571.  #1142012-05-06 3:23 pm
  1572.  Yurlungur
  1573.  Member
  1574.  
  1575.  From: USA
  1576.  Registered: 2012-01-05
  1577.  Posts: 115
  1578.  Email
  1579.  11.4698 on my Arch laptop with xmonad.
  1580.  My score is probably skewed because my path includes all the scripts I wrote for work.
  1581.  Actually, I was wondering about the measure... I've never seen a quotient measure before and it seemed a bit wonky. I would have thought something more reliable would be a difference measure?  Of course, if we did that, we couldn't use entropy, and the number of microstates per macrostate makes a fair amount of sense to me for unixi-ness... so there you go.
  1582.  Thanks for this fun little idea, /dev/zero.
  1583.  Last edited by Yurlungur (2012-05-06 3:25 pm)
  1584.  Lenovo Thinkpad T420; Intel sandy bridge i7 2.7GHz; integrated graphics card; 4GB RAM; wifi; Arch; Xmonad WM
  1585.  Offline
  1586.  Report Quote
  1587.  #1152012-05-06 5:49 pm
  1588.  baronmax
  1589.  Member
  1590.  From: Missouri, USA
  1591.  Registered: 2012-04-22
  1592.  Posts: 29
  1593.  Email
  1594.  11.6897 = laptop (Arch + awn/compiz and about 8 other DE/WMs)
  1595.  11.4196 = desktop 1  (Arch awn/compiz, rather slim system...or so I thought)
  1596.  11.7071 = desktop 2 (Ubuntu...soon to be Arch...bloated as all hell, as is typical with ubuntuuuuuuu)
  1597.  I guess that makes me consistent!
  1598.  I have no clue what it means, but there ya go.  
  1599.  Last edited by baronmax (2012-05-06 5:59 pm)
  1600.  Intel 980x| 6GB RAM| Arch + Openbox
  1601.  Intel 2600K| 8GB RAM| Arch + AWN/Compiz
  1602.  Intel Q740| 6GB RAM| Arch + AWN/Compiz
  1603.  AMD Phenom x6 1090T| Ubuntu/Winblowz (gaming)
  1604.  Offline
  1605.  Report Quote
  1606.  #116Today 4:58 am
  1607.  theblazehen
  1608.  Member
  1609.  Registered: 2012-12-05
  1610.  Posts: 3
  1611.  Email
  1612.  11.6684
  1613.  Offline
  1614.  Report Quote
  1615.  #117Today 5:21 am
  1616.  illusionist
  1617.  Member
  1618.  
  1619.  From: localhost
  1620.  Registered: 2012-04-03
  1621.  Posts: 317
  1622.  Email
  1623.  Arch 64 bit: 10.8442
  1624.  People are usually more convinced by reasons they discovered themselves than by those found by others. -Blaise Pascal
  1625.  @github
  1626.  Offline
  1627.  Report Quote
  1628.  #118Today 1:41 pm
  1629.  MrCode
  1630.  Member
  1631.  
  1632.  Registered: 2010-02-05
  1633.  Posts: 259
  1634.  Email
  1635.  Lappy: 11.2859
  1636.  I have yet to test my desktop, but it should be very similar, as it has most of the same software.
  1637.  Offline
  1638.  Report Quote
  1639.  #119Today 2:40 pm
  1640.  chris_l
  1641.  Member
  1642.  Registered: 2010-12-01
  1643.  Posts: 152
  1644.  Email
  1645.  11.9959.
  1646.  Reading seems it used to be about 8 the average, but now is 10 to 11 the average... means arch has now more unixness?
  1647.  My system is updated btw.
  1648.  "open source is about choice"
  1649.  No.
  1650.  Open source is about opening the source code complying with this conditions, period. The ability to choose among several packages is just a nice side effect.
  1651.  Offline
  1652.  Report Quote
  1653.  #120Today 4:31 pm
  1654.  MrCode
  1655.  Member
  1656.  
  1657.  Registered: 2010-02-05
  1658.  Posts: 259
  1659.  Email
  1660.  Reading seems it used to be about 8 the average, but now is 10 to 11 the average... means arch has now more unixness?
  1661.  The script has been changed; it now uses a different metric for measuring "Unicity".
  1662.  Offline
  1663.  Report Quote
  1664.  #121Today 5:32 pm
  1665.  czubek
  1666.  Member
  1667.  
  1668.  From: Alliance College
  1669.  Registered: 2012-03-08
  1670.  Posts: 46
  1671.  10.5072
  1672.  Arch-ck-atom 64 w/Openbox
  1673.  I was hoping for something much lower.
  1674.  Perhaps you've heard of me.
  1675.  You know all those books, "Such & Such for Idiots"
  1676.  I'm the idiot.
  1677.  Offline
  1678.  Report Quote
  1679.  #122Today 5:52 pm
  1680.  graysky
  1681.  Member
  1682.  
  1683.  From: /dev/null
  1684.  Registered: 2008-12-01
  1685.  Posts: 4,827
  1686.  Email Website
  1687.  Not sure what to make of this thread, but I'll bite:
  1688.  10.3046 on Arch Linux Dual 2012.12.01 (x86_64)
  1689.  11.0292 on my workstation
  1690.  10.8400 on my laptop
  1691.  Pre-compiled & CPU-optimized Linux-ck packages @ Repo-ck.  Enjoy!
  1692.  AUR packages  •  .zshrc and other .files on github
  1693.  Online
  1694.  Report Edit Quote
  1695.  #123Today 6:10 pm
  1696.  graysky
  1697.  Member
  1698.  
  1699.  From: /dev/null
  1700.  Registered: 2008-12-01
  1701.  Posts: 4,827
  1702.  Email Website
  1703.  Visually inspecting the responsces given in this thread, they range from 2 to 5 decimal places.  If I dump this entire thread to an html file, how can I delete everything except for numbers of these formats:
  1704.  x.xx
  1705.  x.xxx
  1706.  x.xxxx
  1707.  x.xxxxx
  1708.  xx.xx
  1709.  xx.xxx
  1710.  xx.xxxx
  1711.  xx.xxxxx
  1712.  In theory, this would allow me to extract only the results that people posted for a more indepth analysis of the responses.
  1713.  EDIT:
  1714.  The best I can come up with is not right but does filter down to just numbers:
  1715.  % sed 's/[^0-9.]*//g' unixness_thread.txt
  1716.  Last edited by graysky (Today 6:13 pm)
  1717.  Pre-compiled & CPU-optimized Linux-ck packages @ Repo-ck.  Enjoy!
  1718.  AUR packages  •  .zshrc and other .files on github
  1719.  Online
  1720.  Report Edit Quote
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