kek

<DarnellJermaine> it just feels as the system is now, a lot of people that are use to it make really gaming and complicated annoying powers with lots of numbers and math
<BobaFettuccine> Nah, Abby this discussion happens pretty often.
<Abby`> I'm all about the numbers. I may have a thing for them. I don't know; I just like seeing numbers in character sheets.
<DarnellJermaine> really? It's the first time I've brought it up, anyways
<BobaFettuccine> Well, discussions about how this system isn't great happen fairly regularly.
<EndPhone> well, true, some of my powers are ma monsters
<EndPhone> but to compare strength, you need a lot of measures anyways
<DarnellJermaine> so you get all these complex super powers with lots of math and crazy shit
<DarnellJermaine> and calculations and stuff that's hard for people to comprehend OOC
<Kioku> There... aren't very many complex math-filled powers...
<DarnellJermaine> but you can't use the basics like super strength or speed
<Kioku> Actually, I can't think of a single one with overly difficult calculations.
<DarnellJermaine> but then you have Violet powers
<EndPhone> Well, some of mine have terribly strong math
<Kioku> And DJ, I'll point out that things like super strength or speed were /outright banned/ under SGF.
<EndPhone> but that never makes it to rolls
<DarnellJermaine> Well I never played with or met SGF, these are just my thoughts
<DarnellJermaine> I'm not saying they have to be this way, that's just how I'd personally prefer it
<BobaFettuccine> My biggest problem is that I get told something is OP for a char and then I look and some of the older characters have powers that make the one I wanted look like nothing.
<DarnellJermaine> I don't even hate the system the way it is now, I'd just like things like that a lot more
<DarnellJermaine> what boba said too
<DarnellJermaine> or random lore that hasn't been put together
<EndPhone> Can someone give an example on that power thing?
<DarnellJermaine> like when Neon put all that work into a ghost char and was told "nah ghosts aint real"
<DarnellJermaine> but Catriona is a char that literally revolves around ghosts
<Kioku> ERm...
<DarnellJermaine> Idk, it's not really taht's it's complicated math
<DarnellJermaine> more than it feels like tons of equations rather than rp and spirit in a power
<Kioku> No, the ghosts thing is right on a page, and Cat doesn't have anything to do with ghosts.
<Kioku> She has to do with spirits...
<DarnellJermaine> unless she reworked cat, I remember it doing with ghosts
<DarnellJermaine> or spirits or whatever
<EndPhone> those are different
<DarnellJermaine> watch me check it and it's different than when I first entered the RP
* Kioku shrug
<DarnellJermaine> or summoning demons or devils or literally /bringing students back from the dead/
<DarnellJermaine> but then you can't have a specific variant of elf or a ghost char or something
<BobaFettuccine> I mean, Mads's power has like 8 different things in it, and any 1-2 of which would be a power on it's own.
<Kioku> Although, something like a rank 6, tier 3 power /should/ be a lot stronger than someone can get starting out with a rank 3-4, tier 0.
<EndPhone> that's a problem with this lore system: you have to be sure to use the exact synonym, or you're dealing with something very different
<MobileSavy> Pls don't bring me in this thank u
<DarnellJermaine> there are people who literally already have op af chars
<DarnellJermaine> that's not necessarily you savy or an insult on those people
<DarnellJermaine> I think those things are fine, I just don't why some crazy things are ok and other crazy things aren't
<EndPhone> Darnell, explain why they're so OP?
<MobileSavy> The devil thing and bringing character back from dead is v specific :/
<EndPhone> I'm hearing a lot of statements, but no way to verify them
<DarnellJermaine> there's only 1 char (pandora) that brings people from the dead
<DarnellJermaine> and there are like 8 demon/devil chars
<DarnellJermaine> el summons devils, daniel is a demon, sebastian is a demon, sierra was an angel, moby was literally fucking immortal
<EndPhone> uh... no there aren't
<DarnellJermaine> there's more than 1 char that can do that now?
<Kioku> Eh?  I can think of two or three that revive, but only maybe.... five that have to do with demons at all?
<Kioku> Actually, less than that.
<Kioku> Unless you count familiars
<EndPhone> Claire is the only actual Demon PC
<DarnellJermaine> none of these are bad concepts and I have nothing against them
<DarnellJermaine> I just don't see how some insane stuff is canon and others don't in very specific manners
<SpookyBee> Milli is a demonhost
<DarnellJermaine> this isn't supposed to be an attack on anyone's characters, just a statement that the char creation and mechanics systems are a little wonky to me
<Kioku> Well canonity hasn't much to do with OP or not, really.
<DarnellJermaine> they're too separate statements
<DarnellJermaine> two*
<EndPhone> Darnell: I still want examples of what was disallowed
<Kioku> Ah
<MobileSavy> Sebastian was in fact a demon
<DarnellJermaine> I think red or one of those previous players
<DarnellJermaine> had a char that could literally give /other characters powers/
<MobileSavy> And I thought you meant bringing a dead character back
<DarnellJermaine> and spells
<MobileSavy> Siobhan
* SavanahHolland (Savanah@2601:3c2:100:xriv:itrh:toj:klnm:mxrt) has joined
<DarnellJermaine> and then I remember saying something about pills that could give really simple pyromancy or water powers and that would be "too crazy or invalidate others powers"
<Kioku> Claire could bestow a few spells and very minor powers, aye
<Abby`> Soo question about dorms!
<Abby`> IF my character does her approved
<Kioku> That was a thing - Abby!  Yes?
<Abby`> Who'll she be sharing it with?
<SavanahHolland> mew
<DarnellJermaine> I hope I don't sound too aggressive, not trying to start fights, just make points and criticisms about the system
<Abby`> Also, how old do the characters have to be?
<Kioku> Not /necessarily/ anyone.
<DarnellJermaine> rather than dodge points
<DarnellJermaine> I think the age limit is 14-18
<SavanahHolland> 14 - 17 I believe
<EndPhone> ^
<SavanahHolland> ah what Darnell said
<DarnellJermaine> but it's recommended to be 14 or 15 so they stick around a while
<Abby`> Oooh
<Kioku> The rooms are singles, but every two rooms share a bathroom between them
<Abby`> Got it!
* EndPhone stares awkwardly at Malissa
<Kioku> But there are few enough students still that there's a fair number of pairs of rooms that are both unoccupied.
<DarnellJermaine> and you can earn moneys to up your room and get bigger rooms n stuff
<Kioku> So you could end up sharing space with someone, or going full solo.
<DarnellJermaine> if you ever wanna bunk with some peeps
<SavanahHolland> bunk with morgan
<SavanahHolland> shell take pictures of you while you sleep
<Abby`> lmao
<Abby`> Well, I'll keep that in mind!
<SavanahHolland> aka don't bunk with morgan
<SavanahHolland> worst perv
<Abby`> Oh come now
<Abby`> You make that sound like a challenge
<SavanahHolland> Snrk, I challege everyone
<DarnellJermaine> but yeah I guess my main point is as of now RP seems to prioritize Mechanics and Levelling/Strength Comparison > Creativity and putting spirit and heart into rp
<Kioku> Aaand basically yeah.  Characters /basically/ have to have a birth date of January 1, 2002 or later, up to (whatever makes them age 14 as of their first scene)
<Abby`> Yeah, I read that in the settings
<Abby`> But hey, pervy as this Morgan might be
<Abby`> I assume everything will stay PG! ;P
<DarnellJermaine> I think limit is pg-13
<DarnellJermaine> and you can go farther but it's gotta be private room or pms
<EndPhone> same thing~
<Abby`> And not get any XP from it? How dare you!
<SavanahHolland> Morgan is kid friendly!
<SavanahHolland> Sorta
<BobaFettuccine> I mean you only get XP weekly or from official runs anyways.
<EndPhone> I mean, you can get your development otherways
<BobaFettuccine> (and some other stuff but meh)
<EndPhone> or development scenes, club scenes, or forum journal entries
<EndPhone> 1 XP each, maximum 2 per month
<Abby`> It just sounds like whole bunch of fun
<Abby`> Development Scenes, Clubs, and stuff
<EndPhone> Or creative writing and writing challenges (also forums, CW once a month)
<Abby`> You can even learn stuff from other characters
<Abby`> And have classes! (I think)
<DarnellJermaine> those parts are lots of fun
<DarnellJermaine> I used to be really active about tutor and development stuff
<EndPhone> there aren't really class scenes
<DarnellJermaine> but once I got 5 chars, it became too much to manage and I gave up on it all together xD
<Kioku> I'm still waiting for someone to do a scene that takes place during class <_<
<Abby`> Unless you're all just going to teach me stuff like Mathematics and Geography
<Abby`> I've left that life IRL already!
<DarnellJermaine> you could have class scenes, you'd probs just need a gm that's willing to do it
<EndPhone> or ignore the teacher
<Kioku> ^That's what I was meaning
<DarnellJermaine> the only problem with class scenes kiki is you can't talk freeform as much and you need someone as a teacher
<EndPhone> say s/he's giving you time to work on a project
<DarnellJermaine> UNLESS
<DarnellJermaine> a fun scene would be in class
<Kioku> Although, I suppose I could/should do a scene of some sort with Morgan some time.
<DarnellJermaine> and 2 people talking telepathically
<DarnellJermaine> that'd be interesting
<Abby`> Well, looking forward to it! And will hopefully finish my character sheet as soon as possible!
<Abby`> I might need to know what tier is next time
<Kioku> I had something all lined up with Einin, but... Duno666 stopped coming around...
<DarnellJermaine> :c I miss duno666
* Kioku wobbles at Abby
<Uracilo> I think tiers are a crappy game construct
<Kioku> Maobl
<DarnellJermaine> tier doesn't come into play til you've been around a while
<DarnellJermaine> I have been playing for 3 months and 1 of my chars is tier 1
<Uracilo> So no, it does not make sense that higher tier chracters have more powerful powers
* Abby` leaves catnip on floor
<DarnellJermaine> and I development scened and did runs with him
<Uracilo> Because that doesn't make any sense in-universe
* Abby` has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
<SavanahHolland> i miss dunooooo
<EndPhone> it kinda does, but not on the condensed scale
<Uracilo> In-universe powers run the gamut. Supernatural stuff grows from whichever place and no run or event has tiered NPCs
<DarnellJermaine> I don't like tier either
<Kioku> ... In what way does getting better general control of your powers over time regardless of /specific/ effort into each one not make sense in-universe?
<DarnellJermaine> I get the concept, doing stuff and being around more makes you stronger
<DarnellJermaine> but there's a big divide between GMs and other old players that have t ier 4 and 5s
<DarnellJermaine> and newer people with tier 0's and 1's
<Uracilo> Because tiers say nothing about getting more control over time
<DarnellJermaine> there are hardly any in betweens from what I've seen
<Kioku> That's what adding tier to powers represents! @_@
<DarnellJermaine> and the high tier chars are untouchable in combat, which is problematic since the system is leans towards mechanics
<EndPhone> I mean, what's "in between"?
<DarnellJermaine> tiers 2-3
<Uracilo> You get more powers, or your powers get stronger. Someone could make a character that instinctively knows their power inside and out and they'd have to start at Tier 0 because it's a game construct that doesn't represent the reality of the character's life in any way
<EndPhone> I have character sin both those tiers
<DarnellJermaine> you're a rare exception cuz you got booted for a while
<DarnellJermaine> but were around for old stuff
<DarnellJermaine> and then let's say LT's fighting tournament had taken off
<Uracilo> Also, willpower as a skill is ridiculous and invalidates mental powers to a ridiculous extent
<DarnellJermaine> old chars woulda just dominated no competition if they had any combat skills
<Kioku> Err, actually it's just because of making new characters more recently.
<EndPhone> Yeah
<EndPhone> Eponnie is nearly T4
<Uracilo> To mention somethign that was said earlier
<DarnellJermaine> right, but that doesn't mean it couldn't use fixing
<EndPhone> and I made her in December
<DarnellJermaine> Social Security made sense and worked when baby boomers happened
<DarnellJermaine> so 16 young people per old person
<Uracilo> And yes, the pedantry with the word demon is getting on my nerves at this point
<DarnellJermaine> now there's a lot of troubnle cuz it's like 3 young people per old person
<DarnellJermaine> weird political example
<DarnellJermaine> but my point is a system needs to change and bend as the situation does
<Kioku> Nnno, it really doesn't invalidate mental powers.  It would be outright stupid to /not/ have a mental defense sort of skill to deal with those.
<DarnellJermaine> now that there are shitloads of new people, tiers leave this giant divide
<Kioku> :-\
<Uracilo> Please stop pretending it means something everyone should know. The word demon still refers to monsters and devils and everything that you'd find in a dictionary
<Uracilo> They're not just a thing that exists in this setting
<DarnellJermaine> ^
<DarnellJermaine> that too
<DarnellJermaine> the differentiations between devil, demon, blah blah
<DarnellJermaine> they're the same thing just flavored to fit with the complex canon
<Uracilo> Spirits and ghost, too
<DarnellJermaine> like no ghosts but spirits are totally ok
<EndPhone> any large lore system has that, though
<DarnellJermaine> it feels weird and convoluted
<DarnellJermaine> yeah but that's why large lore systems have universe resets
<DarnellJermaine> so they don't stumble over themselves
<EndPhone> Except those never work
<DarnellJermaine> every big name large universe that continually is added upon has universe resets
<Uracilo> It's not a large lore system, it's ridiculous to go out of your way to use it as a point against someone in a discussion
<DarnellJermaine> YES THEY DO
<DarnellJermaine> literally every comic book character or continuing franchise you can think of has had 1 or multiple resets
<Uracilo> Also, there are canonical ghosts in Sunnybrook
<EndPhone> But that's resetting events, not established facts and such
<Uracilo> I was in a run with one
<DarnellJermaine> yes it is, endphone
<EndPhone> er, like, creatures and shit
<Uracilo> Are you retconning that ghost?
<DarnellJermaine> you do reset all of that
<EndPhone> IDK
<Kioku> I can get people mistaking what demon means just because it's not a super common use of the term, but the ghost/spirit thing is easy and very common.
<DarnellJermaine> you just stick to the concept
<EndPhone> I've never seen that
<Kioku> :-\
<DarnellJermaine> name a comic book hero you like
<DarnellJermaine> or a movie even
<DarnellJermaine> even the movies have had universe resets
<Kioku> Honestly I've never seen demon used for what we've got, and wouldn't have picked that as it, but...
<Uracilo> This is all besides the point, I think
<Kioku> I've never seen ghost /not/ used as a psionic imprint made in the moment of death.
<Kioku> Well
<EndPhone> Yes, but they don't take /all/ the ideas for creatures and explaination and throw them out
<Kioku> Except digital ghosts
<DarnellJermaine> it's called a reset
<EndPhone> Sure, a couple things might get changed
<DarnellJermaine> because they reset all the events and a lot of the lore, powers, and personality
<DarnellJermaine> take the basic concept, and redo it
<Uracilo> What I'm saying is the lore can support pretty much anything because it won't break just because of it. Stop using it as an excuse to stonewall people's ideas
<EndPhone> But we tried that, and literally every player hated it
<DarnellJermaine> I hate to use it cuz everyone knows I'm obsessed, but right away jojo has a reset that does add new things in a timeline that didn't exist at that time before
<DarnellJermaine> like making Jesus canon and having stands in the 1800s
<DarnellJermaine> completely new shit
<Kioku> Indeed, we did try to make a total reset happen a while back
<DarnellJermaine> I know superman has been different a lot of times
<Kioku> But it was nigh full rejec