Pokemon Sapphire Classic: Neutral Attack Notes [Mar 2026]

Pokemon Sapphire Classic
Neutral Attack Notes
[Updated 6 Sep 2026]

TO-DO
- REROUTE NORMAN!!!
	> Need +6 with high neutral attack to OHKO Vigoroth at L29
	> Might need to do some weird +2/+3/+4 strats at different mid-neutral or really high +attack ranges
- Reroute Winona (Marshtomp):
	> +1 Surf@MW does not kill without Torrent except on good +spatk (notes: https://pastebin.com/d911EiyU)
- Check Geodude/Roxanne defensive damage
- Check Torrent ranges and defensive damage on Rustturf Pooch
- Check damage on Matt 1's Sharpedo (always live from high Torrent?)
- Finalize shopping
- Route in candy pickups/money items
- Check spatk levelups
- Figure out what to do with low speed (8-20IV~); you really don't want to use Carbos unless doing Naive strats, as you'd rather sell it
- Check the WG+MS range on Laura's Meditite (range on bad attack+bad special attack)
- Check WG+MS range on Vivian's Meditite
- Check speed thresholds for Vivian's Meditite
- Check Torrent WG rolls on Brawly; bad special attack can't always get away with safe WG
- Check Strength/MS rolls on Archie 1's Mightyena--is it worth getting L25?
	> Even MSx2 doesn't always kill on really bad attack--check IV ranges
- Look into killing a late-game encounter (around R118/R119)--could that help you get L34 to candy to Swampert before Winona? This would almost certainly have to be combined with late desert candy, making Norman's gym worse
- Look into doing Abra strats--could do "old school" strats, but proceed with early Brawly/Abraless if you don't catch Abra by the time you have enough extra experience (from Granite Cave encounters)
- Look into Abraless+late Brawly:
	> If you get L18 for Grovyle, you get L27 for Machop, even without Laura, so this could be combined with early Laura
	> L27 gets at least a 7/8 MS range on Machop (guaranteed from 27IV~)
	> This also saves an X Attack in the early game, which is nice for money

"Standard" stats indicate:
- Neutral atk/spatk/spe nature with 20/0/9 IV (Hardy, Docile, Serious, Bashful, Quirky, Gentle, Lax)
- +Atk nature with 0-23IV(?)
- +Spatk nature with ??? (check +spatk benefits)
- +Speed nature with 0-25IV (to check)
- In general, these kips will do early desert candy and may need extra experience for Grovyle (L19) and Sharpedo (L26)

Attack Benchmarks
- 24IV for 25-30 MS roll at L18 on Grovyle (else need L19)
- Level-ups (neutral):
	> 12 -> 16 at L7 = 18-19IV (only take if other stats are good; need L19 for Grovyle)
	> 13 -> 14 -> 22 at L11 = 20-23IV (need L19 for Grovyle)
	> 13 -> 14 -> 23 at L11 = 24-26IV
	> 13 -> 15 at L6 = 27-31IV
	> 13 -> 15 -> 22 at L10 = 30-31IV (better rolls on Machop)

Special Attack Benchmarks
- 17IV~/0IV+ gets the Geodude OHKO (0-16IV~ has a 50% range, which is 11 spatk at L6)
- 8IV~/0IV+ gets the better non-Torrent Nosepass roll (11-14, while 0-7IV~ gets 10-12)
- 24IV~/16IV+ gets the better Torrent Nosepass roll (17-20, while 0-23IV~/0-15IV+ gets 15-18)
- Level-ups (neutral):
	> 10 -> 12 at L6 = 17-19IV
	> 11 -> 14 at L7 = 29-31IV
- Level-ups (plus):

Speed Benchmarks
- Reset any +0 on the first three levelups
- 0-7IV~ (too slow to X Speed even on Shawn): 11 at L8 (reset for 12)
- 20IV~/13IV+ outspeeds Nosepass; 13-19IV~/5-12IV+ ties (17 speed)
	> On neutral speed, if 9 at L5, you immediately know that you either tie or are outsped by Nosepass
	> You only find out if you tie IN the fight; watch for 17 upon leveling on Geodude
	> As such, low speed (9 at L5) should always heal to full before Roxanne
- 29-31IV~ (Wattson X Speed strats)
- Archie 1's Golbat:
	> 9IV~/0IV+ outspeeds (33 speed at L25)
	> You could consider resetting 8IV~ (+0 -> 12 at L9), as otherwise you risk a tie, for which you probably die if you lose
- Archie 1's Sharpedo:
	> 17-20IV~/5-8IV+ ties (35 speed); be wary of this and make sure you are out of Crunch range before killing Golbat, especially if outsped
	> If you got a Zig money item, you could use Carbos to fix this, but otherwise you would rather sell Carbos

- Level-ups (neutral, 9 speed at L5):
	> 9 -> 10 at L6 = 4-19IV
	> 9 -> 10 -> 11 at L7 = 6-19IV
	> 9 -> ... -> 12 at L8 = 8-19IV
	> 9 -> ... -> 13 at L9 = 9-19IV (+0 -> 12 = 8IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 14 at L10 = 10-19IV (+0 -> 13 = 9IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 15 at L11 = 11-19IV (+0 -> 14 = 10IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 16 at L12 = 12-19IV (+0 -> 15 = 11IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 17 at L13 = 13-19IV (+0 -> 16 = 12IV)
	> L14 gives no more information; 17 -> 18 = 13-19IV
	> 9 -> ... -> 19 at L15 = 14-19IV (+0 -> 18 = 13IV)
	> L16 gives no more information
	> In general, 14-19IV is probably enough info to go on, and specific stats can be checked for (e.g., 34 or 35 on Sharpedo)

- Level-ups (plus, 9 speed at L5):
	> 9 -> 11 at L6 = 4-19IV
	> 9 -> 11 -> 12 at L7 = 6-19IV
	> 9 -> ... -> 13 at L8 = 8-19IV
	> 9 -> ... -> 14 at L9 = 9-19IV (+0 -> 13 = 8IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 15 at L10 = 10-19IV (+0 -> 14 = 9IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 16 at L11 = 11-19IV (+0 -> 15 = 10IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 17 at L12 = 12-19IV (+0 -> 16 = 11IV)
	> 9 -> ... -> 18 at L13 = 13-19IV (+0 -> 17 = 12IV)
	> L14 gives no more information; 18 -> 19 = 13-19IV
	> 9 -> ... -> 20 at L15 = 14-19IV (+0 -> 19 = 13IV)
	> L16 gives no more information

Defense Benchmarks
- Level-ups (neutral):
	> 10 -> 16 at L10 = 10IV (could try skipping early candy -> 4x late candy for Winona as Swampert)

------------------------------------------------------------

LITTLEROOT
- Get the PC Potion
- Take 13/10/9 atk/spatk/spe
- If 9 speed at L5 with a neutral speed nature, reset any +0 level-up in the first four levels (earliest acceptable +0 is L10)
- Treecko: Tackle spam
- Calvin: Tackle spam
- Catch a Zigzagoon if you see one

PETALBURG 1
- Buy 4 Potions/2 Repels
- Enter/exit center before Wally
- Catch a flyer/Zigzagoon if you see one
- Grab beach Potion (especially if bad defense)
- Menu:
	> Heal
	> Repel
	> Check Zig
- Grunt: Tackle spam
- Grab the Ether
- Get Bullet Seed

RUSTBORO
- Check Zig whenever you heal in the gym
- Josh: Spam Mud-Slap, healing as necessary, then WG
- Tommy: WGx3
- Roxanne:
	> Geodude: WG (0-16IV~ has a 50% range, so just spam WG through heals if you miss it)
	> Nosepass: Spam WG; consider Growl to help survive and get into Torrent

ROUTE 116
- You need extra experience here depending on your attack stat and some other factors
- If 20-23IV attack, fight one of the following:
	> Joey+2 encounters
	> Jose+2 encounters (preferring Jose if you are in Low Kick range)
	> Jose+Winston (before Briney)
	> Do Jose+Winston ONLY if you have Torrent (either before or after Pooch) and you already have a flyer
	> If you are doing Jose+Winston, repel in the Janice pause manip
- If 24-31IV attack, fight one of the following:
	> Joey+1 encounter
	> Jose+1 encounter
	> Joey+Winston
	> Jose+Winston
	> Do the Winston variant only if you already have a flyer
	> If doing Winston, repel in the Janice pause manip
- Jose (323xp): WG spam
- Joey (289xp): WG spam
- Clark: WG spam
- Aqua Pooch: WG(+WG)

RUSTBORO
- Sell TM09 and TM39
- Buy 3 Super Potions/2 X Speeds/4 X Attacks/6 Repels
- Winston: MS
- Take Briney to Dewford

DEWFORD
- Get Stardust if you didn't fight Winston (can skip if you got an early money item)
- Granite Cave menu:
	> Heal to full
	> Use a Repel
	> Check Zig
- Repel through the cave and talk to Steven, then Escape Rope out
- Laura:
	> You outspeed Meditite from 13IV~/0IV+ (12IV~ with 2 extra speed EVs: Joey, wild, or Winston)
	> If you don't outspeed, lead MS; otherwise, lead WG/Tackle
	> Need good offensive stats to 2HKO with MS+WG, so consider double MS (can always get beach Ether for safety)
- Brawly: X Attack, adapt
	> MS spam if BUx2
	> If S-toss/KC->BU, M-slap once before the final MS (or Torrent WG) on Machop to avoid heal range
	> Maku heal range isn't a concern at this attack
	> Be conscious of Torrent HP and WG accordingly
- Machop damage:
	> For neutral attack, 30-31IV~ get slightly higher rolls (29IV too if you fought Joey); this is 24 attack at L10
- Briney boat to Slateport

SLATEPORT/ROUTE 110
- If you don't outspeed Vivian's Meditite (29IV~/19IV+, or 28IV~/18IV+ with 1 extra speed EV: Joey, wild, or Winston), or you lost particularly many MS PP, consider getting the beach Ether for safety
- Get Soft Sand
- Talk to Dock, then take the Museum
- Grunt 1: MS
- Grunt 2: Tacklex2 (WG in Torrent), MS
- Get Thief on the way out
- Pre-rival menu:
	> Repel
	> Equip Soft Sand (check Zig)
	> Take Zig item if you saw one
- Get the Full Heal
- Rival 2:
	> Numel: X Attack x2, X Speed, Super Potion, WG/MS
		* WG is guaranteed from 28 spatk at L17 (19IV~, so basically 11 spatk at L5); if <28 spatk, MS
		* WG is guaranteed on all spatk at L18
	> Grovyle: MSx2
	> Wailmer: MS(+M-slap)
	> Wailmer range: 18IV = 50%; 19-23IV = 9/16; 24-28IV = 12/16; 29-31IV = 14/16
	> Pay attention to your spdef when you hit L19 (either off Numel or Grovyle)
	> Wailmer WG: 12-15 (27 spdef), 11-13 (28-31 spdef), 10-12 (32-37 spdef), 8-10 (38-40 spdef)
	> In general, all but the worst spdef gets at least 11-13
	> You can consider healing if you're on a good run with, say, bad attack/spdef and you're worried about missing the range and could be KO'd by WG; otherwise, just YOLO
	> Check your speed when you hit L20 (31 outspeeds Vivian's Meditite)
- Check Zig in the Edwin menu manip

MAUVILLE
- Get HM06
- Get Mach Bike
- Menu:
	> Use a Potion if you have one (check Zig)
	> Ether MS
	> Teach Rock Smash to Marshtomp or Zig
	> Register and use Mach Bike
- Wally: MS
- Take the gym
- Vivian:
	> You need 31 speed to outspeed
	> You outspeed from 29IV~/19IV+ (28IV~/18IV+ with 1 extra speed EV: Joey, wild, or Winston); you tie on 24-28IV~/14-18IV+ (23-27IV~/13-17IV+)
	> If you outspeed and have good stats, WG+MS (check the range, may want to MSx2 with really bad stats)
	> If you are outsped, MS+WG/Tackle/MS (depending on offensive stats)
	> If you tie, you can YOLO either way
	> The worst is Detect on MS (this is why getting the backup beach Ether may be a nice idea)
- You have 1 X Speed for either Shawn or Wattson:
	> If 30IV~/17IV+ speed (or 29IV~/16IV+ with Joey+1 speed encounter), X Speed on Wattson, else X Speed on Shawn
- Shawn: (X Speed) MSx3
- Heal to full before Wattson if you would have < 41 HP after level-up on Magnemite and you used X Speed on Shawn (check Zig)
- Wattson:
	> (X Speed) MSx3
	> If no X Speed, you really just have to hope for no SS or SS miss

ROUTE 111
- Menu:
	> Use a Potion if you have one
	> Use a Repel
	> You want to survive 2 WA/WG from Wingull, but you may have to Super Potion in the fight if you don't have a Potion
	> Even if you are dead to WA/WG, don't heal to full before CTB; instead, heal turn 1 before setup (and pray no Growl)
- CTB:
	> Tackle+X Attack+Tackle (healing as necessary), MS, M-slap/WG
	> If you crit Tackle and OHKO Wingull, you have to YOLO for MS crit

FALLARBOR/ROUTE 114
- Get the Nugget
- Sell Stardust if you have it (or pickup money item), Nugget, TM47, TM46, TM08
- Buy 3 Super Potions, 11 Super Repels, 11 X Specials, 1-2 X Speed, 10 X Attacks, 1 X Defend, 2 Guard Spec.
	> 8-20IV~/0-9IV+ speed: 2 X Speed
	> 21+IV~/10+IV+ speed: 1 X Speed
	> Technically, on neutral speed you could just look for 10 at L5, but then you need to watch out for specifically 20IV, which ties Vigoroth; you can see this at L25, as detailed in the Archie 1 fight
	> Since you have to buy the X Speeds BEFORE Archie 1, you could either find another level-up that would let you see exactly 20IV, or you could just YOLO the Vigoroth speedtie in the unlikely event that you got the 1/12 20IV
	> +Speed can easily distinguish between 9IV+ and 10IV+ at early levels, so it's not an issue there
	> If you sold a pickup money item and at least 24IV attack, you can buy 2-3 X Speeds/12 X Attacks and do +6 Norman (X Speed count based on the same speed benchmarks as normal, just an extra X Speed in both cases)
- Catch Swablu if you don't have a flyer yet; otherwise, Super Repel (or Super Repel after you catch Swablu)
- Get Carbos
- Use your last regular Repel to pass R116
- Take R116 and get Strength
- In the menu manip:
	> Use a Super Repel
	> Teach Strength over Water Gun
	> Check Zig

MT. CHIMNEY
- If you are 14-19IV~ speed, watch your speed when you reach L25 (either off Mightyena, or just before); 35 ties Sharpedo, 36 outspeeds
- Strength/MS through grunts
- Matt's Pooch:
	> Guaranteed from 29IV~/13IV+ (53 atk at L24)
	> MS if <53 atk at L24 (always guaranteed)
- Before Archie:
	> Swap Marshtomp into slot 2 (lead Swablu if you have it)
	> Check Zig
- Archie:
	> If you have two slaves (Zig+flyer), make sure to sack the first slave, then Guard Spec. on the second one (both have to be fainted for poison deathwarp)
	> Guard Spec. (bring in Marshtomp)
	> Mightyena: X Attack, X Speed, MSx2
	> Golbat: Strength, X Attack, Strength
	> Sharpedo: MS
	> If Sharpedo outspeeds or you're tied, consider healing before you finish off the Golbat

LAVARIDGE
- If you are trying to set up for desert candy skip (e.g., if you got a pickup candy in the past couple checks), you can do early Herb Shop, else wait until after Flannery
- If you are out of healing items and you need to heal before Flannery, do early Herb Shop anyway
- Herb Shop (early): Sell Carbos, buy 4/5/4
- Menu before Flannery:
	> Swap Marshtomp to slot 1 (check Zig)
	> Heal to near full
	> If you aren't skipping desert candy, use a Super Repel
- Flannery:
	> X Attackx4, hoping for Smog poison
	> Throw balls once you are at +4 until you are poisoned
	> Once poisoned, Strength, Strength, MS
	> Make note of your HP; you need 34HP to make it to desert candy, so heal if necessary
- Herb Shop (late): Sell Carbos, buy 7/6/6
- Get desert candy, then bike around until you white out

PETALBURG
- Room order: R, L, R
- Mary: MS, MS, Strength
- Heal to full before Linoone (check Zig)
- Lori: MS, MS, Strength, Strength
	> Outspeed Linoone after 1 MS from 22IV~/11IV+ (39 speed), tie with 19-21IV~/8-10IV+ (38 speed) (assuming Joey OR 1 speed encounter)
	> Higher attack can usually MS+Strengthx3, but especially if you don't outspeed after the first MS, it's advised to MS twice
- Heal to full and use the desert candy before Zangoose (check Zig)
	> If you got a candy pickup and want to do Swampert for Winona, forego candy here
	> Do this only on at least 11IV~ def (any +def IV works too)
- Berke: MS, MS(+Strength/M-slap); MS+M-Slap/Strength+MS if L28
- If you still have M-slap (i.e. if you caught Zigzagoon), consider using it turn 1 on Norman
- Heal to full before Norman (check Zig)

- Norman (standard):
	> Strats below assume early desert candy, which you should almost always be doing with neutral attack kips
	> Slaking 1: X Defend, (M-slap), (X Speed), X Attackx2, MS, X Attack, Strength, MS
	> NOTE: If you M-slap, Strength BEFORE using the third X Attack (to avoid heal range)
	> Because of the heal range nonsense, M-slap may just not even be worth it anyway, unless you're worried about healing items
	> Vigoroth: MS, X Attack, Strength
	> Slaking 2: MS, Tackle, MS/Strength
	> Heal as necessary throughout the fight
	> M-slap Slaking 1 after X Defend if you still have it (i.e., if you taught Rock Smash to Zigzagoon)
	> X Speed if you bought the extra one in Fallarbor (<21IV~/10IV+)
- Norman (+6):
	> Only for at least 24IV attack, if you got a money item and sold it before Fallarbor
	> Slaking 1: X Defend, (M-slap), X Speed, (X Speed), X Attackx6, MS+Strength
	> Vigoroth: MS (favorable range)
	> Slaking 2: MS+MS/Strength
- After Norman, get Surf
- Menu:
	> Use a Super Repel
	> Teach Surf over Tackle
	> Heal?
- Get the pond candy before shopping
- Sell TM42, TM50; buy 3 Super Potions, 1 Escape Rope, 7 X Speeds, 8 X Attacks (buy 6/1/7/3 if doing Swampert for Winona)
- Get 110 candy on the way to Weather Institute

WEATHER INSTITUTE
- Watch for speed level-up for Doduo if you're delaying candy
- Grunt 1: MS
- Candyx2 after Grunt 1 (unless delaying to get Swampert for Winona)
- Grunt 2: Strength, MS
- Consider healing before Shelly, depending on Torrent/spatk
- Shelly: MS, Surfx2
- L33 Torrent Surf range vs. Mightyena
	> 6-8IV~: 1/16
	> 9-11IV~: 1/8
	> 12-14IV~/0-2IV+: 1/4
	> 15-17IV~/3-5IV+: 5/16
	> 18-20IV~/6-8IV+: 50%
	> 21-23IV~/9-11IV+: 9/16
	> 24-26IV~/12-14IV+: 11/16
	> 27-29IV~: 75%
	> 30-31IV~/15-17IV+: 7/8
	> 18-20IV+: 15/16
	> 21+IV+: 100%
	> This is one notable benefit of high +spatk
- Take the bed
- Menu:
	> Use a Super Repel
	> Remove Mystic Water
	> Remove Soft Sand
	> Equip Mystic Water
- Rival 3: X Attackx2, X Speed, Strength, Strength, MS (M-slap+MS if L31) (watch out for speed level-up for Doduo)

FORTREE CITY
- Run from Kecleon, then take the gym
- Heal before Jared if you don't outspeed (check damage)
- Jared (L34; early desert candy, no pickup): Surf
	> Always kills without Torrent, from 17IV-/0IV~
	> Outspeed on 50 speed: 28IV~/16IV+ (27IV~/15IV+ with Joey OR 1 speed encounter)
- Jared (L31; candy pickup+Winona as Swampert): Surf(+Strength)
	> Kills without Torrent from 24IV~/11IV+; 75% range from 14IV~/1IV+ (15/16 from 20IV~/8IV+)
	> Outspeed on 50 speed: 28-31IV+ (27-31IV+ with Joey OR 1 speed encounter)
- If you got the pickup candy and you're doing Swampert for Winona, candyx4 and evolve here
- Kylee:
	> Strengthx2 (or Torrent Surf(+Strength); high +spatk has a favorable range)
	> Surf w/o Torrent if Swampert
- Heal above half for Winona
- Winona (Marshtomp):
	> Swellow: X Special, Surf
	> Pelipper: X Speed, X Attack x6, Strength, healing with Energy Powders/Super Potions as necessary
	> Skarmory: Strength+Surf or Torrent Surf
	> Altaria: Strength
	> This fight is a nightmare because of Swellow DT; you need +1 AND Torrent to OHKO
	> Can consider Strength+Surf on Swellow if you're high enough HP, but it's a crapshoot
- Winona (Swampert):
	> If Torrent, Surf Swellow turn 1 (guaranteed on all spatk)
	> If no Torrent but at least 17IV+, Surf Swellow turn 1 (75% range)
	> +0 non-Torrent Surf vs. Swellow: 17-22IV+ (75%); 23-25IV+ (13/16); 26-27IV+ (15/16); guaranteed from 28IV+
	> If no T1 Surf, X Special+Surf
	> Pelipper: X Attack, X Speed, (X Special), Strengthx2, healing as necessary
	> Skarmory: Surf (can Strength+Surf if no Torrent and bad Surf range)
	> Altaria: Strengthx2 (guaranteed)
	> Non-Torrent +1 Surf vs. Skarmory: 28-31IV~/9-14IV+ (75%); 15-16IV+ (7/8); guaranteed from 17IV+

ROUTE 120/MT. PYRE
- Get the Persim berries before Lilycove
- In the last repel menu before Mt. Pyre, teach Fly
- Sweep grunts and get the candy
- Fly to Slateport, talk to Stern, then fly to Lilycove and take the hideout

AQUA HIDEOUT
- Get the Master Ball
- Matt: MS, MS(+MS), Surf
	> You're always outsped by Sharpedo except on 28-31IV+ (assuming Joey OR 1 speed encounter)
	> You tie Sharpedo on 25-27IV+ (26-28IV+ if no Joey or speed encounter)
- L37 MS vs. Matt's Sharpedo:
	> 18IV~: 13/16
	> 19-24IV~/0-2IV+: 7/8
	> 25-29IV~/3-5IV+: 15/16
	> 30-31IV~/6+IV+: 100%
- Get the Max Elixir on the way out
- Menu: Heal if < 38, Super Repel

MOSSDEEP
- Buy 6 Hyper Potions, 2 Full Heals, 6 Max Repels (could sell Nugget for extra)
- Get Dive
- Take the gym
- Menu: Use a Max Repel, teach Dive over Mud Shot (Mud-Slap if you still have it)
- Samantha: Surfx2 or Surf+Strength
- TnL: X Speed, adapt
- Head south to seafloor cavern after the gym

SEAFLOOR CAVERN
- Shelly:
	> Sharpedo: Some combination of Strength/MS/Surf (prefer MS if you still have it, but you can still Strength for Rough Skin if you need to take damage for Archie 2 Torrent setup)
	> Mightyena: Surf(+Surf/Strength; save 3 Surfs for Archie)
- Archie 2:
	> Mightyena: Guard Spec., X Specialx2, Surf (0IV~ has a 15/16 non-Torrent range, but otherwise it's always guaranteed)
	> Crobat: X Speed, Torrent Surf
	> Sharpedo: Surf
- Get Waterfall and catch Kyogre
- Refer to Kyogre notes for the endgame