Anonymous User 3143: i was enjoying doing work for pac
and i like its story and characters
and want to see it get done
but it always hurts me to see drama and arguments
because i've seen it happen before
i've seen something almost exactly like this happen to a forum
and everyone took sides
and i got along with people on BOTH sides
Anonymous User 61: ^
Anonymous User 3143: i'm xpcynic by the way
Anonymous User 60: Oh, okay.
Anonymous User 3143: if this goes anything like it did last time i witnessed it
then sure, there will be a clean split and you'll be able to keep to yourselves
but there will always be bitter feelings
and, for example
if someone from eightkit stops by #iapl
everyone will almost FEEL the tension
Anonymous User 6141: like right now is just not cool
Anonymous User 3143: even if people on either side don't know each other
Anonymous User 61: Etzali says hi, Soaring
Anonymous User 60: Who is 6141?
Anonymous User 6141: if that's me again, not anyone who matters
Anonymous User 60: Come on, just say.
Anonymous User 6141: I'd rather not, I'm just here to understand things better.
Anonymous User 60: Understood.
me: We've stated that we would not look down on anyone who decided to stay with IAPL as well as 8kit
Anonymous User 3143: well i've got two more things to say really
Anonymous User 2137: I'm sad that my interest in the IAPL only really came up literally today, and now it feels like I can't really join anything
me: I know he says hi, I was in the IRC
Anonymous User 3143: first: i'd be totally ok with joining you guys if you wanted me
me: Er, sorry, catching up on the conversation
Anonymous User 3143: i'd like to do more music and start on modeling once my personal life gets out of the way a bit
Anonymous User 61: As would I, honestly
Anonymous User 3143: and second: don't expect too much from yourselves
you're not a professional company like gamefreak, you've got lives outside of this
Anonymous User 62: I have a question: was this "disorganization" just within the Pacific, or were you referencing the IAPL as a whole?
Anonymous User 70 has opened the document.
Anonymous User 61: I believe it was in a whole
Anonymous User 3143: seems to me like the whole thing is a bit disorganized
Anonymous User 60: A lot of people left, mostly PAC, but it probably affects everywhere.
Anonymous User 3143: i'm actually in sw and kind of beating myself up for letting zeta be the only one working on it
Anonymous User 62: it does affect everywhere
since the IAPL is now crippled thanks to this division
Anonymous User 60: We can pull through this.
Anonymous User 71 has opened the document.
Anonymous User 61: And all I got to show is a script to the 4th Gym
Anonymous User 2137: the IAPL has lost the artists unless they chose to stay on both projects
Anonymous User 3143: iapl can find people on 4chan pretty easily
Anonymous User 61: About 1/4th of the game
Anonymous User 62: not really, they still have trolls to deal with
Anonymous User 6141: as long as our threads aren't total troll threads we can
Anonymous User 60: Well, if the forum goes up fast enough, we have an exilent spriter who works fast.
Anonymous User 950 has opened the document.
Anonymous User 61: Even if the IAPL does get back on its feet, I wouldn't mind working for both, tbh. Not like I don't have assloads of free time
Anonymous User 70: ff
Anonymous User 62: i'm not sure if people here grasp that handling 30 leagues isn't exactly the easiest of jobs.
Anonymous User 60: Take it one or two at a time.
Anonymous User 62: of course a lot is going to slip through their fingers
Anonymous User 71: one at a time
Anonymous User 3143: good thing both music and modeling are the sorts of things that can apply to any region
Anonymous User 62: it doesn't mean that all 30 leagues need to be shot down because 1 wants to work harder.
Anonymous User 447 has left.
Anonymous User 2137: do we still have musicians and modellers on IAPL
Anonymous User 60: Almost anything can apply to any region...
Anonymous User 3143: well, me maybe
Anonymous User 950: hello
Anonymous User 71: What is the main issue here.
Anonymous User 60: Again, we've got a good spriter who works fast (sixfive)
Anonymous User 61: Hi
Anonymous User 2137: ... now that I've finished reading the document feel bad because if I'd come to the IAPL months ago when I first saw a thread on /vp/ my administration experience might have helped
though chances are I would never have been trusted to do that
Anonymous User 60: ^ you are?
Anonymous User 3143: at the very least i can help with design aspects
Anonymous User 63: I'm still around. But I still have things outside IAPL of course. But if other regions need artwork, I'll help where/when I can.
Anonymous User 3143: and help lay things out for programmers
Anonymous User 71: 60 must be milanek.
Anonymous User 60: Indeed.
Anonymous User 71: refering to sixfive.
Anonymous User 60: ^ you are?
Anonymous User 70: Chingling (although I go by Fenix now) here, if anyone for some reason has questions.
Anonymous User 62: I too feel like I could have done something to prevent this
Anonymous User 3143: oh me too
Anonymous User 61: Hey, Ching
Anonymous User 63: (Myrddin, btw)
Anonymous User 71: The discussion seems to be mostly talking about what we can do and what IAPL can do.
Anonymous User 62: I've been a part of the IAPL since september
Anonymous User 61: (Zeta)
Anonymous User 3143: i feel like if i had worked a bit faster i could've helped prevented this
Anonymous User 61: As have I
Anonymous User 62: I'm not revealing who I am.
Anonymous User 6141: it's the most neutral I've seen discussions yet, so I'm rather happy here
Anonymous User 60: We can still fix this.
Anonymous User 70: OKAY
LISTEN
We're not looking for new users.
We have our set group.
Anonymous User 62: I'm not looking to join.
Anonymous User 60: I'm no longer interested in joining.
Anonymous User 70: Then what is the issue? I must have misunderstood.
Anonymous User 71: This topic is now about Questions concerning Eightkit or the split.
Anonymous User 950: how do i know who is who?
Anonymous User 2137: My current issue is that... Pac is fine now, 8kit will be fine unless they fade out and the project turns to vapor... but the IAPL is still not being administrated properly, and after this blow it may only get worse...
Anonymous User 61: Why even bother with the democratic acceptance of entering peeps in it?
If you got your team?
Anonymous User 70: If, later along, we DO need members, we will implement the process.
Anonymous User 2137: that's just how they'll do it if they decide to take someone on I guess
Anonymous User 71: Team members might be added on a need-to-basis.
Anonymous User 60: All that needs to happen is that IAPL's administration issues need to be worked out, the rest comes easily after.
Anonymous User 6141: what do you think needs to change in IAPL administration?
Anonymous User 62: ^
Anonymous User 2137: and of course, even if the problems behind this split were resolved, the split will never reverse
Anonymous User 3143: i'd gladly join if you need modeling and more music
Anonymous User 70: Well, we don't at the moment.
And we're taking questions on eightkit or the split, not how to fix the iapl.
Anonymous User 60: Well, there's a lot of just "Nope" responces, with no explanation to why not, and loose rules, that are inconsistant, plus the overload of trolling...
Anonymous User 61: I'd join if you needed some help writing.
Anonymous User 950 has left.
Anonymous User 70: Again, we don't need any more help.
We have a set team for now, if at some point we DO, I'm sure we'll drop by.
Anonymous User 71: If you are being considered, like to be considered, or wish to make your case known, please contact Jirachi if you can.
Anonymous User 70: ^
Anonymous User 61: I know
I will probably get rejected anyway
Anonymous User 71: If all else fails, please refer to our letter for any information.
Anonymous User 61: Not like people here even like me that much
Anonymous User 6141: I'm not bothering solely for that reason
Anonymous User 61: Probably would be a waste of time, anyway.
me: Zeta, stop that. You know it's not true
Anonymous User 6141: people like you, but they have a number of writers already.
Anonymous User 71: So, what is being said here, in tl;dr, You all either are saying you want to join, or not, and you think that we should know about it?
Anonymous User 72 has opened the document.
Anonymous User 72: oh hi what anon is this
Anonymous User 6141: we were talking about stuff before the question drive showed up
Anonymous User 61: I know it is true, you and bear are probably the only ones who think differently. No one else ever really seemed to like me...
Anonymous User 6141: this is back to stuff taht was said earlier
Anonymous User 61: Just fuck this
I'm out
Anonymous User 61 has left.
Anonymous User 71: I don't mean to be a dick, but as a seperate entity the IAPL's concerns no longer apply to eightkit.
Anonymous User 6141: dammit zeta
Anonymous User 72: am I anon'd?
Anonymous User 6141: yes
Anonymous User 3143: we're all anons
this should be carried out in an irc channel
Anonymous User 6141: I get that. on the other hand, why do you feel the need to moderate a chat bar
Anonymous User 3143: so we're more identifiable
Anonymous User 71: I'm not moderating a chat bar
However, this is a document submitted by a group i am a part of that was meant to be here to answer questions
me: We all know who each person it
is**
Anonymous User 72: go fucking #eightkit
Anonymous User 6141: you're complaining that we're talking about things other than questions
Anonymous User 72: lol
Anonymous User 71: not submit anger
Anonymous User 72: I actually have #pacific registered
on rizon
if you guys want to work on that.
this is muge btw
Anonymous User 3143: i'll go ahead and pop into #eightkit
Anonymous User 6141: meh, I planned to stay anonymous, so this is the end of the line for me then
Anonymous User 62: why can't you guys work as a focused group under IAPL?
me: I don't want to go in the IRC
Anonymous User 3143: no one is in #eightkit :3c
unless it's on a different server
me: I prefer to be on this document
Anonymous User 71: We wish to no longer associate ourselves with the IAPL and establish ourselvse as eightkit due to differing goals in the far future.
Anonymous User 62: then you can't call it the Pacific anymore.
Anonymous User 6141: differing goals in the far future? may I ask what that is?
considering it's the pacific coast, I don't think iapl has any right to that
Anonymous User 62: You're going to have to come up with a different region name if you're going to pull that stunt.
Anonymous User 71: We have no defined what exactly we plan to do as a group, but the intent is there, and we plan to carry on past our "pacific" game.
me: No we don't
This region is based on Pacific
Anonymous User 71: The name of the region has no effect on the IAPL.
me: We have every right to use the name Pacific
Anonymous User 62: Yes it does
you are a direct mirror of the IAPL project
Anonymous User 60: More acuratly, they should have to drop the characters, plot, and names.
me: Actually, as I unuderstand it, Pacific was originally its own project
Anonymous User 71: we are not a mirror nor are we affliated with the IAPL other than by personal connections.
Anonymous User 62: if you're going to separate completely, don't even bother having the same name.
Anonymous User 6141: nah, pacific came from the iapl
or rather, the napl
Anonymous User 71: Also, freemont will make the descion about script usage
Pacific is a public domain geographic region based on the united states
Anonymous User 6141: either way, I was just curious about future projects simply because I don't see this one going too far with such a limited team
me: How is the team limited?
Anonymous User 71: We are not limited, seeing as we are the core group pushing most progress in the IAPL.
Anonymous User 6141: there's a list, that makes it limited
Anonymous User 71: We also have goals that far exceed anythign the IAPL has presented
Anonymous User 60: *cough, cough, bullshit*
Anonymous User 62: I think you guys take yourselves far too seriously
Anonymous User 6141: because the iapl is there to make games for one raeson
Anonymous User 2137: "Pacific" is a goddamn real thing, I don't think the IAPL owns it. What the IAPL community MIGHT have the right to deny usage of is art, script, music, etc etc etc. But as I understand, most of the Pacific content was made by the people who joined 8kit, so...
Anonymous User 62: So? their work went to IAPL, not 8kit
Anonymous User 71: Eightkit stands at a publicly netural stance towards the IAPL.
Anonymous User 6141: well, as long as they credit people, they're fine, as the people who are gone can't complain now
Anonymous User 62: its not theirs anymore
me: And we have a right to take it to 8kit
Anonymous User 62: bullshit
me: No, we made the stuff, we have the right to pull it
Anonymous User 71: We are now prepared to negotiate with Freemont on content usage
me: Never were we made to sign something that said all work submited to IAPL belonged to IAPL only
Anonymous User 71: if you'd like to make a case or statement on this topic please refer to him as he is on your side.
Anonymous User 6141: was there any sort of copyright going into it?
Anonymous User 60: Everyone in IAPL will be against that, you realize this?
me: Thus, we are free to remove and change content as we wish
Anonymous User 3143: what about that near-finished battle song i made with pac in mind
Anonymous User 62: I'm just saying, a simple name change is all I ask.
Anonymous User 3143: or the two attempts to type up a coherent pokedex
Anonymous User 62: unova?
Anonymous User 3143: sure it's not much
but there's at least a couple of other people that put minor work into pac
Anonymous User 71: Nothing will get accopmlished if everyone speaks at the same itme.
Anonymous User 60: And freemont...
me: If you don't want us to use it, we will make another song
Anonymous User 6141: and if no one speaks, nothing will get discussed
Anonymous User 71: Freemont has been notified and is deciding the fate of the content.
Anonymous User 70: Fremont*
Anonymous User 71: Beyond that, the fate of content can be brought to a personal level if neccesary
Anonymous User 3143: well i didn't say i didn't want you to use it but
Anonymous User 71: anyone is allowed to stay they wish their content not to be used by eightkit
Anonymous User 62: I'm sorry for getting a bit aggressive there. I'm just confused as to why we can't revamp the administration in IAPL, instead of having this nasty split.
Anonymous User 3143: ok i do understand that matter now
Anonymous User 71: User 62, I wish you to understand
The IAPL is not an enemy of Eightkit
Anonymous User 62: bull.shit.
Anonymous User 71: we are public neutral, if not civil
Anonymous User 6141: that's not what the members seem to think.
Anonymous User 62: I've read all your farewell letters
Anonymous User 71: As previously stated
Anonymous User 62: all but two of them are one giant FUCK YOU
Anonymous User 71: the actions of individual members of eightkit are not the view of the compnay
Anonymous User 3143: this is what i meant when i said the farewell letters might be a problem earlier
me: The individual actions of the members =/= Eightkit I'm afraid
Anonymous User 62: but the individual letters MAKE UP the company
me: The position of the TEAM itself is that it's neutral
Yes, they do
Anonymous User 71: nor is eighkit as whole resposbile for their actions
me: These were personal statements
Anonymous User 6141: the members make up the view of the "company", regardless of what you say
Anonymous User 62: their views are a part of the company as well
Anonymous User 71: We can argue semantics all day
me: But the members can handle themselves professionally as the team
Anonymous User 62: you can't deny it
if EVERYONE says fuck you, you can't say none of them do
Anonymous User 71: but for the time being, Eightkits views are not what individual members state unless previously notified or voted upon.
me: You are ignoring those who did not say "fuck you"
Anonymous User 71: I believe many "fuck you's" were personally directed.
Anonymous User 62: stop covering your ass, you know this is a big spiteful bite on IAPL and yo uknwo it.
*you know it
Anonymous User 71: not at the IAPL as a whole.
me: This was a final way to let out everything that we wished to say, to cut all ties
If they wanted to say "Fuck you"
That's fine
Anonymous User 70: I know I never said fuck you
me: But you are ignoring the members who wrote thoughtful letters
Anonymous User 70: I may have posted barry with a middle finger.
Anonymous User 6141: you guys aren't cutting ties, you keep coming back and apparently plan to mine us for members in the future
Anonymous User 62: two
two letters
that were thoughtful
me: Not true
Anonymous User 71: Any one wishing to join eightkit does so by own will
Anonymous User 70: ^
me: In addition, that would mean that not everyone is saying fuck you
Anonymous User 71: we motive no one outside our organization
me: We were not coerced
Anonymous User 70: With acceptance of couse
me: We were not pressured in any way
We joined on our own free will
Anonymous User 6141: Do I really have to find the quote?
Anonymous User 71: yes.
Anonymous User 62: Yes, yes you do.
me: It was a difficult decision for many of us
Anonymous User 62: I think it could have been worked out
instead of this happening.
me: Do not degrade those who sincerely had to agonize those who put a significant part of themselves into these letter
s
Anonymous User 71: We never wished to fix the iapl
we merely wished to do what we saw fit
Anonymous User 6141: >Anonymous User 70: Again, we don't need any more help. We have a set team for now, if at some point we DO, I'm sure we'll drop by.
Anonymous User 62: so you wanted to call the shots
Anonymous User 71: Please do not make this harder on us by attempting to rebuild bridges we burned very painfully
me: No what the fuck?
Anonymous User 62: and when you couldn't, you got buttmad and quit?
me: I'm trying to be polite man
Anonymous User 71: Of course not
me: But please, just calm down
And listen to what we're saying
Anonymous User 62: What you're saying is full of selfishness and infallacy
Anonymous User 71: we simply saw a course of action we thought to be a better one, so faced with a difficult choice, we went the other direction.
me: This was not a matter of power-struggle
Anonymous User 62: Yes it was
me: It was never because of that
Then why would people like Tortiss, and I join?
Anonymous User 62: you wanted to do this as you (your organization) seemed fit
Anonymous User 3143: it is kind of cruel to be hard on soaring about this particular matter
Anonymous User 6141: you said yourself people had different reasons for leaving
me: We had free reign anyways
Anonymous User 3143: when it was mainly everyone else that did what you're mad about
Anonymous User 71: Please cease arguments so I might address an issue.
Anonymous User 62: If you're not going to take individual responsibility in saying fuck you, I'm not going to take individual responsibility in attacking you.
wait
lemme rephrase that
Anonymous User 60 has left.
me: What?
Anonymous User 62: and stuff a shoe in my mouth while I'm at it
me: That...that doesn't make sense
Anonymous User 62: exactly, I had a brain fart
I'm sorry, let me rework that