Notice how Destiny didnt ask science questions when Ryan was around? And waited until he left? This is gonna be long sadly.

The 1790 immigration and naturalization law, that Destiny ignores when he isnt butchering the views of the Founding Fathers, says "white" and permitted what we see as Whites now. Irish and Italians too. Ben Franklin may have said some things about Germans but that's a fallacy of division. The laws and the collective opinions about race they had are more consistent with Tara's idea than Franklin wanting to exclude Germans (who weren't excluded). Moreover, I dont think the Founders being stricter than the Nazis pwns white nationalism, otherwise it's saying that a past devolution of what is American justifies all further devolutions. If one wants to defend the changes from the 1964 act, do so. And Rome was not multicultural until the end when they began tolerating more disparate identities

Destiny, even saying this on his stream, just stuck to normative claims to avoid the descriptive claims he doesnt like because they challenge his normative claims about society. All his benefits of immigration are short term falls in the cost of goods, whereas this suggests that the long term demographic consequences will be pretty dire. And kvetched about what other race realists say, which was false in many cases. Race Realists dont claim they know all there is to know about intelligence, and that it is entirely genetic. A claim he repeated several times.

If he wants to debate ethnostates, he should debate ethnostates rather than argue about race realism. If you want to argue about what Ryan thinks, argue with Ryan. Ryan wants an ordered top-down partition like the USSR. An ethnostate would just be promoting a eurocentric demography, not kicking out all the color. The definition of ethnostate is just a state which secures demographic hegemony for the group. So Singapore is an ethnostate for keeping a Han Supermajority. It's about trends.
And also, IQ differences arent really the justification. More just breaking the mainstream narrative on race and equality, showing that it isnt a lack of effort and empathy that races have tension and gaps.

Cthulhu guy was odd. He doesn't like eugenics so I guess he is marrying a crack-whore? Marrying your college sweetheart and having kids with them is eugenics really. As Jean said, decisions which influence the genes in the next generation are eugenic decisions. Destiny I understand. He at least tried his gotchas, which were too highly specific when we're talking about general trends. And he seemed to not grasp that selective migration can happen even if the policy doesn't actually try to select for them. He can say we are more connected or whatever, but what he is advocating isn't actually connecting the world more in a meaningful way since only a small fraction of the 3rd world can immigrate to the 1st world. And this experiment of 'browning America' is never actually justified, despite it being an irrecoverable change if it does occur.


And civic nationalism is bad (imo) because it is either toothless hand-wave when someone like Roaming Millennial says it, or just used as a political bludgeon based on who decides what our values are when a Progressive uses it. When really the West has never had unified sets of values but an often contradictory diversity of ideas. And they will go out of fashion when the balance of power changes.

Ironically, his example of "city-stamping" is a good argument for why race matters and (excessive) multiracialism doesnt work imo, it cant be concealed and leads to inevitable extrapolations. Race is "city-stamping" you cant stop. And despite Warski agreeing (for some reason) that telling people they cant come in to a nation is bad, Andy still used an appeal to consequences to low-key argue we shouldn't discuss this. He says he wants to use the info to bridge the gaps as much as we can, but we've spent a lot of money on that. Its failure is a huge argument for race realism.

Illegal African Immigrants
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2016/09/20/illegal-immigration-united-states-mexico-asia-africa/90735292/

Also, "you can use protection" is a dumb argument for incest. People have unwanted pregnancies. Also, why enable severe deviancy with no clear gain?

https://altright.com/2016/07/26/what-the-founders-really-thought-about-race/

I think there is a middle ground. Ethnically Aware Civic Nationalism. Which is what a nation like Singapore does explicitly: allow people who will be productive and fit in, but not exceed a threshold of the population you favor. In Singapore's case it is the Han demographic (which is pretty subjective yet somehow that hasnt stopped this from working).

Singapore is the only nation which seems to see a genuine rise in international test scores due to immigration despite already having a very high IQ population. Other cognitively elite civic nationalist regimes like Canada and Australia still do not

Also, nations ape what the US does. Especially on issues of race. So yea, Tara's concern is valid