summary

>marowak or raikou, which is _more_ broken / are either broken?
>probably worth reading the discussion b/c it's not so easy to summarise but some of it regards comparison with zam / espy, and restrictiveness and whatnot
>discussing how houndoom warps the tier
>bunch of crazy powerful psychic types in the tier. They're all barely seen b/c hound beats them or forces them to run really janky sets that don't do much.

☆Disaster Area: i mean its not like houndoom is even that ridiculous
☆Disaster Area: its just that any psychic type that could get past houndoom without running a bad set
☆Disaster Area: is gonna break the tier

>stupid walls keep the tier in check. Mainly chansey / registeel.
>physical side: strong normal type physical attackers. Bunch of crazy physical walls however to make up for it, lix / regirock / registeel
>normal types also really hard to use bc of its lack of synergy to really rarely seen early on in the tier
>marowak
>only proper counters are meganium and maybe weezing, plus some checks
>special nukes are stronger, but because the special walls are so ludicrous, the physical attackers often feel more ludicrous to handle.
>spikers janky so we'll see janky ass spiker sets

☆Disaster Area: i mean defensive ice type with 80s across the board in the tier below 1u
☆Disaster Area: sounds really weird once u go beyond rby lol

>diglett
>can fuck with a bunch of key mons

☆Disaster Area: but it has hilarious stats that means if it takes a hit it just dies
☆Disaster Area: if it's not immune
☆Disaster Area: so it's super gimmicky in a lot of ways but if u can get it in safely that first stage mon
☆Disaster Area: could cause havoc
☆abyssinian kid: yeah diglett is really strange

>can threaten chansey
>diglett+raikou cores?

☆Disaster Area: makes your brain literally melt
☆Disaster Area: every pokemon player
☆Disaster Area: sees that and goes
☆Disaster Area: something is severely wrong

>nod to trapinch
>smeargle
>spikes
>spore
>BP shenanigans. No drumpass/ingrainpass, anything else fair game
>cmpass/ddpass not outclassed.
>fullpass is a potential thing too

>charizard blaziken sceptile
>huge movepools, strong, can beat most mons with the right set
>really hard to use and figure out however and feel really ineffective when they don't work
>would be really dangerous threats if half the tier weren't already crazy strong

☆Disaster Area: and also
☆Disaster Area: with no sand
☆Disaster Area: and priority moves blowing
☆Disaster Area: there's so much potential
☆Disaster Area: for endrev and endflail
☆Disaster Area: but that's a strat that either
☆Disaster Area: fucking sucks or is fucking broken
☆Disaster Area: with a very fine line in between
☆Disaster Area: that's less true when there's either
☆Disaster Area: lots of sand / hail
☆Disaster Area: or lots of priority
☆Disaster Area: or at least a bit of both
☆Disaster Area: but since there's neither here
☆Disaster Area: we're gonna have to find the line
☆Disaster Area: which is extra hard when the tier is new

>nod to jumpluff. wishes spikes were better.

>belly drum
>LINOONE
>hypnodrum - poliwrath mainly

>entei - 101 hp sub version of raikou
>easier to wall its stabs on paper, but special attackers struggle breaking subs once its boosted up a bit

>all that said, we don't have the players - quantity or quality or dedication - to make sense of this tier in a timescale anywhere close to how we did in RBY

>ghost types
>dusclops
>focus punch / eq only options for hound. Both suck b/c focus reliability / not wanting to stay and take an attack to get eq 2hko
>doesnt even beat much else anyway, also spikes and eq vulnerable

>shedinja
>sheddypass + diglett, for hound. Besides that, lack of spikes is somewhat nice.

>sableye
>great typing with recover
>stats JUST low enough to make it not able to put its typing and movepool to good use.

>misdreavus
>doesnt really have the stats or the moves to actually be good at this point

>haunter
>faster, toxic and ground immune
>but this shit is only ok in NU lol...
>still, maybe the best spinblocker and the only one to ever spinblock me successfully

>just remembered there's a bunch of random crap like random sing users like marowak

☆abyssinian kid: i think the main thing is, it will take a vastly different approach to the meta to make reliable teams
☆abyssinian kid: than what most advers are used to