bt

<Gherrit> handhelds are like disposable guns
<CampaignAnon> LiaoScotsman has probably statted it up somewhere
<CampaignAnon> BLAZERS, BLAZERS EVERYWHERE
<CampaignAnon> and not a DHS in sight
<LiaoScotsman> It's not 10 RL 10s, it's 6 RL 20s
<LiaoScotsman> max weapons you can fit in a handheld is 6
<LiaoScotsman> The Atlas Accordion is 6x RL 20 and 1 ton armor (because what the fuck else are you going to put on there?)
<LiaoScotsman> The 6x RL 10 with no armor one is a really light 3 tons, which means 30+ ton mechs can get a lot of throw weight for cheap
<CampaignAnon> I dislike the clunkiness of handhelds
<CampaignAnon> if they prevented arm and same side torso weapons from firing I'd probably like them more
<LiaoScotsman> Well, if there was an option for single-hand handhelds, that would be a thing
<LiaoScotsman> But they're all assumed to be two-handed
<LiaoScotsman> Even the ones that the art shows as 1 handed
<CampaignAnon> I wanna John Woo it up
<CampaignAnon> >Evans as line dev
<CampaignAnon> if true, I want off Mr. Coleman's Wild Ride
<Gherrit> rip
<KlanzPhone> Handhelds aren't worth it as anything but single shot rocketspam weapons until you get TSM
<KlanzPhone> More specifically, pTSM
<LiaoScotsman> or iTSM
<LiaoScotsman> not actually a bad way to get a bunch of industrials armed up for war
<LiaoScotsman> Actually had an idea for a mech like that, a "totally non-military heavy loader biped" with an odd amount of armor and a bit of targeting software that was supposedly "accidentally" left in in order to skirt the stupid RotS imposed military drawdown.
<KlanzPhone> pTSM is actually pretty decent
<CampaignAnon> if I know you have it, I'll carry a ton of green smoke
<LiaoScotsman> Please ignore that the same company makes a line of handheld weapons to increase the versatility of existing mechs in a climate where you can't make more.
<CampaignAnon> though green smoke got nerfed hard in the move to TO
<CampaignAnon> before it was "loltsmgetfucked"
<KlanzPhone> I mean
<KlanzPhone> The same tonnage of inferno ammo
<KlanzPhone> Fucks normal TSM even harder
<KlanzPhone> Than green smoke fucks pTSM
<Crix`> er small laser pistols
<Crix`> pew pew pew pew
<CampaignAnon> OG green smoke made you take 5 points of damage directly to the IS through armor per turn you were in the smoke cloud, randomized
<CampaignAnon> except for the head, iirc
<KlanzPhone> Yeah wow
<KlanzPhone> That'll do it
<Crix`> you have to stay int he smoke thogh
<Crix`> could you just target the hex a mech is standing in though?
<CampaignAnon> Yes, but it doesn't affect it until the next end phase
<Crix`> oh
<Crix`> then just keep moving
<CampaignAnon> saturation fire all day erry day
<Crix`> finally a use for the anubis : ^ )
<KlanzPhone> I'd honestly rather my opponent bring green smoke ammo to fuck a single pTSM mech over them bringing inferno and fucking my BA and normal mechs too
<Crix`> it doesn't really fuck it over
<CampaignAnon> True, but since pTSM has a relatively limited shelf life
<Crix`> just kind of zones it
<Crix`> limited shelf life?
<Crix`> in terms of what
<CampaignAnon> it's in service for a decade?
<Crix`> oh you mnean
<Crix`> like when it was produced
<CampaignAnon> yeah
<KlanzPhone> I mean yeah, it's not happening
<KlanzPhone> But I don't let little things like that stop me
<Crix`> just
<Crix`> memory core meme it
<KlanzPhone> Uh
<CampaignAnon> I generally only use green smoke when historically it would be most useful
<KlanzPhone> TSM was original
<Crix`> MEME
<Crix`> IT
<CampaignAnon> You can use it whenever, idc
<KlanzPhone> Well, they all know how to make pTSM already
<KlanzPhone> Seeing as iTSM is literally the same thing
<KlanzPhone> They don't say it in the rules ever, but if you look at the two side by side
<CampaignAnon> Neat, the Hussar gets a torso mount for its LL
<KlanzPhone> I did have a good 55-tonner omni with a torso cockpit and pTSM
<KlanzPhone> Which had something like 30 tons of modular payload between the implied handheld and the podding
<KlanzPhone> Chem lasers should be IS tech
<CampaignAnon> Agreed
<CampaignAnon> These line dev posts are actually encouraging
<KlanzPhone> Hmm?
<CampaignAnon> assuming Evans can actually deliver
<CampaignAnon> http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1495422598579.jpg
<CampaignAnon> http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1495422535244.jpg
<KlanzPhone> >bills isn't the right guy for the job
<KlanzPhone> No shit
<KlanzPhone> Well, it wasn't quite the doom and gloom predicted a few threads ago
<KlanzPhone> Oh well that last sentence is heartening
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<CampaignAnon> ,grog
<Blakes_Butt> 629 Character becomes a witch, and might encounter witch hunters.
<CampaignAnon> MALEFICARUM
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* Now talking on #Battletech
* Topic for #Battletech is: [Do not eat the purple burd ||| Rookie's Guide: http://pastebin.com/HZvGKuGx ||| Discord server:  https://discord.gg/3KuMhXf]
* Topic for #Battletech set by Tsorovan!Tsorovan@Rizon-87FF726D.dsl.dynamic.casstel.net (Thu Nov 24 19:13:21 2016)
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<valeriyk_> Holy connections batman
<Tsorovan> just being a dead faggot storage facility right now
<Nidhogg> How is a lance of a Thunderbolt, two Crusaders and an Archer for fire support?
<Tsorovan> the whole lance as fire support?
<Nidhogg> Yes.
<Nidhogg> Or just a fire support lance.
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<valeriyk_> what tehc as well?
<valeriyk_> Never been a huge fan of CRD's for the most part, that ammo+heat
<Tsorovan> yeah, I kinda feel like saders are not the best choice.  catapults instead?
<Tsorovan> those jump jets let them easily get to good high spots for lurming
<Nidhogg> Never was really a fan of the catapult.
<Nidhogg> Plus, Lyran so.
<Nidhogg> Catapult is a good machine I'm sure.
<Nidhogg> But what doe sit bring to the table that an Archer doesn't aside from a cheaper BV?
<Nidhogg> And Jumpjets.
<Nidhogg> Which I don't get much use out of most of the time due to them fouling up aim.
<valeriyk_> Eh, depending on terrain Ive found a CPLT better for the '25 era
<valeriyk_> Short on ammo for the ARC isnt too much better
<valeriyk_> fr the role*
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<Nidhogg> Night all =D
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<CampaignAnon> ree this booru
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<Washington> Hey CA
<Washington> r8 this heavy combat lance
<CampaignAnon> 0/10
<CampaignAnon> no lance
<Washington> Beowulf, Sphinx, Flashman 9c (Mod), And either an Argus 2D or an Ostsol 6D
<Washington> Merc 3140 era
<Washington> C3i gone and .5 tons more armor, another DHS, a fifth MPL, and the rear ML also firing forward for the 9C
<CampaignAnon> Beowulf is an odd choice
<Washington> Needed a command mech, and EWAR
<Washington> It's also a decent scout
<CampaignAnon> by odd choice I mean "extinct"
<CampaignAnon> or not
<CampaignAnon> well
<Washington> ??
<CampaignAnon> okay why are you using a Burrs or ROTS mech they don't export
<Washington> Salvage
<CampaignAnon> which variant
<Washington> 12
<Washington> No clantech
<CampaignAnon> >command mech as 45t
<CampaignAnon> visibleconfusion.gif
<Washington> Different command philosophies
<Washington> It finds the enemy, either calls in arty or draws them to the lance, then provides ELINT or flanks while the main body engages
<Washington> Keeping the commander out of heavy combat so he can keep his awareness up
<Washington> Also this was originally for the previous /btg/ makes a merc unit where they were in the Galatean defense force area/thing
<Washington> So a whole bunch of ROTS tech is available IIRC
<CampaignAnon> you just do you
<CampaignAnon> your formation philosophy is silly
<Washington> That and there are no 5/8 heavy command mechs
<Washington> Ever
<Washington> Or at least not any I've seen that aren't the wobbie ARC
<Washington> The commander doesn't always have the heaviest or killiest mech, after all

* Loaded log from Tue May 23 00:37:17 2017

* Now talking on #Battletech
* Topic for #Battletech is: [Do not eat the purple burd ||| Rookie's Guide: http://pastebin.com/HZvGKuGx ||| Discord server:  https://discord.gg/3KuMhXf]
* Topic for #Battletech set by Tsorovan!Tsorovan@Rizon-87FF726D.dsl.dynamic.casstel.net (Thu Nov 24 19:13:21 2016)
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<valeriyk> Im sorry, crashed my machine while reading that
<valeriyk> Beowolf for command when you have an FLS?
<valeriyk> Hell, IMO an Argus would be better because of its role
<valeriyk> CPLT/ARC style
* valeriyk will admit he's lost in '45 but for mechsof the era you're pulling from...
<CampaignAnon> He's wanting mechs with the quirk
<CampaignAnon> Personally that's a silly reason to pick a mech that's 45 tons for a command role
<CampaignAnon> but
<valeriyk> Im an oldfscker, '39retcon is lost on me
<Gherrit> tbh, i hate the 3039 retcons
<Gherrit> and won't be using them in my campaign
<valeriyk> I lost bt around '67
<Gherrit> because they break too much shit down the line
<valeriyk> Got back recently and argue a lot >.>
<valeriyk> Aye, groggish tech and late SW into CI
<valeriyk> I mean...  Reading the novels with VSD didnt know XL/GR/pulse etc into '39 reton is painful
<valeriyk> Im glad 'something' new is going on with the LD but if I _still_ cant buy something from the CGL website
<valeriyk> Without it being more efficient/worthwhile/_actuallygettingtheshit_/ or even having a response
<valeriyk> Ill go through somewhere else. :/
<valeriyk> I mean, look at there CGL is WRT btech or almost any IP for a physical store
<valeriyk> it's sad
<valeriyk> I live roughly an hour fvrom St Louis and noone carries shit
<CampaignAnon> buying from battlecorps was better than drivethrurpg for one reason
<CampaignAnon> no fucking watermarks
<valeriyk> Fuck, I went to store and eveyrone looked at me nuts for bnringing up btech
<valeriyk> Oqwner knew of FASA and he andf I talked about it and he gave me his impressions after MWDAble
<valeriyk> MWDabcle
<valeriyk> And I could see where he came from, thats when I lost interest, not fgrom a monetary stocking a shelf aspect but from my life
<CampaignAnon> debacle
<valeriyk> Anything else you could call it?
<valeriyk> I grew up in it with MPBt ~96, so after CI but rightwhen AOL and such invested money in MPBT
<Washington> 3145, Val
<valeriyk> Got into the MU* asspect and fell from there :/
<Washington> Not 3045
<valeriyk> Aye, when I say '45 I assume you knew whatI meant >.>
<Washington> The other thing is that the Beowulf has a full electronics package
<Washington> TAG, AP, ECM
<valeriyk> And thats another thing, BEO waqs a C*/WOB design right5?
<Washington> With the Argus that allows for ECM fuckery and if you go full energy you have a decently mobile and surprisingly heavy raiding lance that can call arrow IV in
<Washington> Nope
<Washington> GBD
<valeriyk> Ah
<Washington> Odin manufacturing
<valeriyk> Ive always thought of BEO-12 as a C* deisng and their variants
<Washington> Nope
<valeriyk> Ive been meaning to make a post-jihad/mid-jhihad GB/FRR unit and fuck around with it, dunno what source to peruse
<valeriyk> Stupid/silly question, but do you have a post somewhere I could steal a unit comp from?
<CampaignAnon> >ghost bear
<CampaignAnon> try the fuck again
<CampaignAnon> it was made on Tukayyid, then the Swedenese kicked out ComStar
<CampaignAnon> it was a ComStar design until then
<CampaignAnon> FM:3085 has their late war composition
<valeriyk> Somewhere of a mix between Tuk and '85 tbhan?
<CampaignAnon> FM:Updates
<CampaignAnon> which is 3067
<CampaignAnon> then FM:Warden Clans
<CampaignAnon> which is 3060
<valeriyk> So I was correct, BEO-12 was a C*/WOB ride/variants
<valeriyk> lol
<CampaignAnon> yes
<valeriyk> Because it was before/when TRO'67 came out
<CampaignAnon> TRO:3060
<valeriyk> CA, thats what you should do, writeup of when someone came into the game and what they need/want to read to get caught up
<valeriyk> And intreresting material and addons
<CampaignAnon> that's like... half the setting now
<CampaignAnon> most people got out with the DA
<valeriyk> Sadly
<valeriyk> On both counts
<valeriyk> But what aout folks who are like me and interested again
<valeriyk> And those who want to introduce folks
<valeriyk> I hope BMM will satisfy the escond group
<CampaignAnon> okay so here's the rub
<CampaignAnon> do you only want to know "modern" history?
<CampaignAnon> SLDF?
<CampaignAnon> Early Clans?
<CampaignAnon> The 3039 retcon?
<CampaignAnon> Jihad?
<valeriyk> Thats what rubs me off, all that except jihad is retconnd
<CampaignAnon> what the fuck
<valeriyk> and jihad came after
<CampaignAnon> no it isn't
<valeriyk> MWDA to fill the gaps
<valeriyk> SLDF/early clan, pre-retcon '39
<CampaignAnon> only the post 4SW books
<valeriyk> Until ,epw
<CampaignAnon> english
<valeriyk> I mean, take someone who knows BT from pre-battletech into FCCW
<valeriyk> And introduction to battletech, post Tuk, up until '67 before it was cliky and retconned
<valeriyk> I know it's not on you, nor sahould it be unless you wqere paid
<CampaignAnon> FM:3085, F:3145, "how much money do you want to spend"
<valeriyk> But ~200 pages of stuff that;'s not the background of a KF drive
<valeriyk> "Get a website that works without fucking up and making me contact CS"
<valeriyk> Thats the #1 issue of all
<valeriyk> I canty give a friend a book, and bring them into a timeline
<valeriyk> Without ~3-4  books that I _hope_ will interest them
<CampaignAnon> yes you can
<CampaignAnon> there's the introbook
<valeriyk> Which one?
<valeriyk> TW?
<CampaignAnon> the one in the introbox
<CampaignAnon> that summarizes the fluff to 3067 in 20 pages
<valeriyk> (Hopefully BMM works out)
<valeriyk> Is that a physical book I can give someone?
<CampaignAnon> Not outside of the introbox, but it's a pdf
<valeriyk> Im not saying this as someone who hates the game and but thats what kills me
<CampaignAnon> and if they don't have a PDF capable device, it's the twentry first goddamn century, get with the fucking program
<valeriyk> Thats anoter thing, CGL's delivery service is shit
<valeriyk> Someone wants to read a book
<Washington> https://vid.pr0gramm.com/2017/05/22/f4914caf5a17aa6e.mp4
<valeriyk> I can slap a book into someones chesty and make them read it a lot easier than a pdf
<Washington> Dakka
<Washington> :V
<valeriyk> I can show them a picture, in a book
<CampaignAnon> >chesty
<CampaignAnon> seek help, chesty puller is dead
<valeriyk> Have it on a coffee table a lot easier than a pdf
<valeriyk> Im sorry
>CampaignAnon< No offense to you at all, im just frstrated as a fan
<CampaignAnon> Unfortunately as someone who owns most of the series in print
<CampaignAnon> PDF is massively easier
<valeriyk> And there's issues with getting the pdf from cgl
<valeriyk> Ive waited 3-4 days for a link and confirmation before
<valeriyk> Why do retail stores have issues with bt/cgl?
<CampaignAnon> that's the distributor
<valeriyk> On the CGL website?
<CampaignAnon> that would be the third party store they run through now
<valeriyk> So than they should fix that
<valeriyk> Because it's hurting the game
<valeriyk> Quiaff?
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<valeriyk> They should hire another 3rd party who fixes those issues
<valeriyk> Or something
<valeriyk> I mean, I've had a few conversations with retailers and they all say BT is dead/dying for the past few years because nothing works through their distrobuters
<CampaignAnon> how much money do you think catalyst has
<valeriyk> Not much, but it's got a fucking helluva fanbase
<Washington> Enough for a porch?
<Washington> :V
<valeriyk> I mean im 20+ years deep
<valeriyk> At 29
<valeriyk> ...
<CampaignAnon> the implication at its ebb was the game had a fanbase of 15k people worldwide
<valeriyk> ?
<CampaignAnon> they've never released playerbase numbers or sales
<valeriyk> Bullshit, dude, early 1990's btMU* has >200+
<CampaignAnon> and that 150k for the porch nearly killed the company Wash
<CampaignAnon> do you know what an ebb is
<valeriyk> And thats a very niche group of all
<CampaignAnon> I'm talking 2003
<valeriyk> Lowest point, aye, but how long has this game gone on
<CampaignAnon> 1984
<valeriyk> When it was getting devoured by IP lawsuits greater than the unseen issue
<valeriyk> 2003*
<CampaignAnon> that's not then
<valeriyk> And at the same time, the whole IP issue and splitting of it is fucked
<valeriyk> CampaignAnon, again, I dont want to make it seem like I hate on you, I just vent my frustration at you, hopefully ~directed because I love the game :/
<valeriyk> ~directed*
<CampaignAnon> I don't care about the hate, but I know more of the back end because I spent time tracking it down
<valeriyk> shiit, mechassULT WAS '01 ON XBOX AND AFTER THAT MS HAS HAD MOST OF THE vg ip RIGHT
<CampaignAnon> no
<CampaignAnon> christ
<CampaignAnon> FASA sold the video game rights in 99 or 2000 so they could pay off Mike Stackpole
<valeriyk> ...
<valeriyk> Ok?
<CampaignAnon> So Topps/Catalyst can't make mech design programs without MS's okay because FASA were idiots
<valeriyk> Yeah the game is in IP hell, MW3 was '98/'99?
<CampaignAnon> yes
<valeriyk> Thats the most depressing aspect of this, nothing can be 'done' without Topps(lawl) or MS((lwal) aspect on the game
<valeriyk> Id hate to see how much HBS or PGI has to license the game for
<valeriyk> Does Kip own part of the IP for HMP or was he a loosely based 'dont fuck with MS' programmer still?
<CampaignAnon> there is no kip
<CampaignAnon> Rick Raisley licenses from MS
<valeriyk> Fuc, didnt FASA license HMp to 'Kip' Raisley has an exclusive deal with FASA that grandfathers the M S deal
<valeriyk> nm
<valeriyk> Kip was one of the admins from the btmu* and such
<valeriyk> I just wish the game got better TBH
<CampaignAnon> define better
<CampaignAnon> ree is useless
<valeriyk> Being able to say
<valeriyk> 'Giant robots, non japanese style'
<valeriyk> Hand them a book and in two weeks havfe someone come back interested
<CampaignAnon> "a book"
<CampaignAnon> what kind of book
<valeriyk> If they order something from the _official_ cgl website
<CampaignAnon> please just stop
<valeriyk> Not have to wait a week or two foira cvode
<valeriyk> A book, I hope BMM does it
<CampaignAnon> It's a rule book man
<valeriyk> Mech v Mech, basic rules
<CampaignAnon> not fluff
<valeriyk> BMR was the gto, than TW was
<valeriyk> What 'sourcebooks' have given rules besides general guidelines
<valeriyk> If I wanted to introduce someone into 3051, what book would you reccomend?
<CampaignAnon> Era Report: 3052
<CampaignAnon> sourcebooks are fluff, rulebooks are rules
<valeriyk> Write that up
<valeriyk> Please
<CampaignAnon> are you shitting me
<valeriyk> As a somehwat novice
<valeriyk> Yes
<valeriyk> Write what someone would want to read
<CampaignAnon> Are you paying me?
<valeriyk> For someone, who has no inclination for a game except a friend
<valeriyk> I wish
<valeriyk> I would if I could, I appreciate the AtB guide you did
<valeriyk> Thatsa fucked up thing, you should be at least compensated
<valeriyk> Think about how to get someone into the game
<valeriyk> How dop you hand a friend of yours a pdf?
<valeriyk> I dont mean that insultingly, but f the officla website of the ompany takes 2-3 days
<CampaignAnon> the atb guide was for the community because the instructions to run the program aren't great
<CampaignAnon> whereas that's telling people what to buy and would be under CGL's purview
<valeriyk> I guess that falls under what gets people interested in the game besides old fuckers
<valeriyk> What to buy for core rules is common
<valeriyk> Im not much of a TT gamer, at all TBH
<valeriyk> But it sucks to have to descirbe battletech TT 'what bt used to be' it fucking sucks
<valeriyk> Instyead of, 'Yeaho, MWO is sort of like Battletech' and try and eplain it
<valeriyk> Because there is nowhere to get a concise overview, sourcebooks are written as ingame 'knowledge' and 'rumors'