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TVTropes: Unpleasable Fanbase example sec - August 13, 2010

Nate-Spidgewood May 24th, 2012 831 Never
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  1. !!Examples
  3. [[foldercontrol]]
  5. [[folder: Anime & Manga]]
  6. * The ''{{Naruto}}'' fanbase. After 85 solid weeks of bitching about the endless filler, they are now dissecting every facet of ''Shippuden'' with a passion. For example, people that dislike Sasuke don't just claim it's a [[SpotlightStealingSquad case of author favoritism]] but actually say he has a PerverseSexualLust for his own character.
  7. ** And there's plenty members of the show's EstrogenBrigade that hate ''any'' female except Tsunade and Temari because "[[GirlsNeedRoleModels they're not strong enough]]" and accuse Kishimoto of being biased against women... [[RealWomenNeverWearDresses while they act even]] ''[[RealWomenNeverWearDresses worse]]''.
  8. ** And let's not get started on complaints concerning Naruto's portrayal and how main characters ''have'' to be awesome [[BoringInvincibleHero and effortlessly better than everyone else]].
  9. *** And then when one arc really gives him time to shine everyone complains about everyone else being "useless".
  10. ** There's also people that have a liking for some of the LoadsAndLoadsOfCharacters and thus hate anything involving ''the main cast'', generally assuming any secondary character with only a vaguely established personality would automatically make for a more interesting story than one about a well-established one that has opportunities for CharacterDevelopment (ignoring any problems ''that'' story might have with its execution, or what it could even be about). Really, way too many people fall into the trap of judging the quality of stories as bad the second they find out it's about a character they don't like.
  11. ** Chapter 449 is a primary showcase: People complained about [[spoiler:Kakashi, Fukasaku, and even Shizune dying]] but when [[spoiler:they end up coming BackFromTheDead]], people were still upset that [[spoiler:the characters couldn't "evolve" from these characters' deaths.]]
  12. ** Almost any time [[EvilEye the Sharingan]] is used in a battle you'll have people complaining about it being [[SuperpowerLottery overpowered]] and it being [[KryptoniteIsEverywhere continually]] [[TheWorfBarrage useless]].
  13. ** Naruto and Sakura's recent decisions regarding Sasuke get quite a bit of this. Naruto is criticized for initially breaking down over [[spoiler:the order to kill Sasuke]], but then gets criticized again when he regains his resolve and plans on bringing Sasuke back himself. Similarly, Sakura gets attacked for [[spoiler:trying to kill Sasuke herself, and then for not being able to go through with it]]. [[ShiptoShipCombat And don't even get fans started]] on her [[spoiler:claiming to love Naruto, only for him to denounce it as a lie]] in Chapter 469...
  14. * ''NeonGenesisEvangelion'': fans were pissed with the TV ending, then they were upset over the film's redone ending (your mileage varying on whether or not Director Anno was screwing with the fans doesn't help). They were upset that there is no merchandise for ''Evangelion'' then they're pissed when there is. They don't like how dark and depressing the series is, then scream about the levity of the commentary (which had to be done otherwise the people behind it would have slit their wrists). Some fans treat the show as serious business, turned up all the way to eleven.
  15. ** And let's not even begin on the FanDumb rage over the ''{{Rebuild of Evangelion}}'' movies, or the AlternateUniverse high school mangas.
  16. * Anime {{Dubbing}} and translation in general. Especially the [[SubjectiveTropes debates]] surrounding which dubs are {{Woolseyism}}, {{Macekre}}d, or a PragmaticAdaptation.
  17. ** For one good example, a thread discussing the announcement trailer for the ''TengenToppaGurrenLagann'' dub devolved into this before any actual dubbing had taken place. No actual voice acting was featured in the trailer (being a humorous overview of the series with fast-talking narrator), so the commentators immediately started criticizing the announcer, and theorizing that the dub was so bad they didn't want to show any of it. A second trailer was eventually made with Simon and Kamina.
  18. *** On at related note, there are a ridiculous number of people condemning the dub based ''entirely'' on Kamina's voice.
  19. ** There will always be a group who completely hate any dub despite the quality. This includes even respected dubs like ''CowboyBebop'' and ''SamuraiChamploo'' and the Disney produced dubs of StudioGhibli films. For them, having Chihiro in ''SpiritedAway'' say "It's a bath house?" in a scene that originally had [[LullDestruction no dialogue]] is unforgivable. They will ignore any defense that western audiences wouldn't recognize a Japanese-style bath house without that comment. Never mind that HayaoMiyazaki approved the dubs.
  20. *** There are even those who have been excessively overcritical on the voice actors involved in the Ghibli dubs, claiming that they have "utterly destroyed" the characters and the movies they're in just because they're celebrity stars. Even when the trailer for the newest movie, ''Ponyo'', was released, there were people already planning to hate it simply because it casts two icon child stars as the child protagonists.
  21. ** Then there are the dub haters that insist on continuing to download illegal fansubs for shows rather than buy legitimate subtitled releases. The companies can't win either way.
  22. *** This also extends to North American anime companies in general. [[FanDumb Some so-called fans]] insist that [[{{Macekre}} industry practices]] are the same as in the 90's (regardless of mountains of evidence to the contrary), and will use ''any'' perceived slight as an excuse to boycott a company forever, even if the company fixes the problem that was being complained about in the first place. Every company releasing anime has this to some extent, but {{Funimation}} seems to have really fallen victim to it. So has VizMedia, albeit with a bit more justification.
  23. ** And ''{{Gundam 00}}'' fans have already started to whine about the dub. Specially over Haro's voice. HARO'S VOICE! Oh, and how dares Alex Zahara say "Stratos" as "Stratus".
  24. *** In the case of ''{{Gundam 00}}'', director Seiji Mizushima actually called the audience out as an UnpleasableFanbase in one interview, saying (paraphrased): "The people on the Internet who complain about the show were going to hate it no matter what I did, so I don't really care about their opinions."
  25. ** ''OnePiece'' dubs. Understandable when 4Kids was at the wheel, but Funimation was also considered "not good enough" by a number of fans. 4Kids haters say those voices were too silly and didn't fit the characters at all. Meanwhile, Funimation haters say their voices are bland, too serious, and generic.
  26. *** On that note, Streamline's previous dubs of ''Akira'' and ''Laputa'', both produced for the Hong Kong market but briefly released here, were often derided by fans. Ironically enough, when there were new dubs produced for both of these films by Disney, many of those same naysayers said that the OLDER dubs are better and totally trash the new versions, shooting down any arguments of benefit that the new productions may have. [[FanDumb It's an argument that still rages on. If you happen to mention you like the new dubs of these movies to any of these hardcore fans, beware; they'll rip you apart for doing so, never shutting up about how bad they think the new dubs are and why you're wrong.]] (Actually, this could also count as InternetBackdraft)
  27. ** Some theorize that a lot of the dub hate is about people trying to rationalize their anime piracy. They pirate it before it's licensed, but when it ''is'' licensed, [[CommonKnowledge everyone knows]] the dub will be terrible (usually before a single casting, let alone any recording, has actually been done, no less), so they won't buy the Western home release. [[CompletelyMissingThePoint And then they complain that dubs cost too much.]]
  28. *** Some take it a step further, and make it a point to insult and berate those people who actually like English dubs and/or support legitimate releases. Many dub fans, sick and tired of being flamed, simply avoid any discussion of anime outside their own circles, making it seem like there are no dub fans on the internet (or anywhere, [[SarcasmMode since as we know, all anime fans spend their lives online]]).
  29. * The ''DeathNote'' Fandom. Definitely. It was better when L [[spoiler: was alive, it was better when L died]], Mello and Near were good characters, Mello and Near were dislikable characters. The series should have ended when [[spoiler: L's life did.]] The Movies sucked, the movies ruled, Misa's voice is annoying, Misa's voice sounds less whiny in the dub. The dub made Light sound like a pompous ass by describing himself eating a potato chip in a scene that was there in the manga...The manga was better, the anime was better, the movies are better, the movie is fanfiction, the actors don't fit, Ryuuk looks unnecessary, Ryuuk is there too much, Ryuuk isn't there enough. They spend too much time one-upping each other, they don't spend enough time one-upping each other, Higuchi was there for no good reason... practically the only thing you ''can'' get them to agree on is that they like DeathNote.
  30. * The ''CodeGeass'' fanbase is approaching this status at light speed. It doesn't look like the end of the series has stopped them either.
  31. * ''SamuraiChamploo'' is frequently criticized either for being too much like ''CowboyBebop'', or not enough like ''CowboyBebop''.
  32. * Several ''TengenToppaGurrenLagann'' fans have criticized Gainax for giving Kinon ''CharacterDevelopment'', stating that they would rather have her old stereotypical MoeMoe personality (where the only difference between the three sisters were their breast sizes), rather than her new personality as Rossiu's most loyal supporter and the only person who truly understands him.
  33. * ''{{Pokemon}}'' gets this a lot. So much that even people unfamiliar with the show hate it already and apparently always have. When the new seasons offered to introduce new characters, people kept complaining that their favorite characters were done, despite the fact that one of the biggest complaints was that it didn't have more themes from the game in the first place. Oddly enough, the more recent movies (according to the IMDb) are actually getting better scores.
  34. ** It even at times gets to the point where they complain about so much that you sometimes have to wonder if they're actually being serious. Some examples include: "This show sucks! [[WallBanger The floors are too shiny!]]" Or the ever popular, "[[TheyChangedItNowItSucks I hate the name Dialga!]] [[SpellMyNameWithAnS Diaruga was SOOO much better!]]."
  35. *** So new games get announced, along with the titles. Guess what? Half the people like them for being classical and going back to the color system, the other half find them boring and uncreative. Ignoring, of course, that when Diamond, Pearl, and Platinum were announced, [[MisBlamed Nintendo]] was supposedly running out of ideas when they continued to name it after metals and gems...even if they were ''ALSO COLOURS''. (What, you've never heard "Ruby" or "Sapphire" to describe something red or blue respectively? Or Pearl to describe something white?)
  36. * Sometimes it seems like certain people in the ''{{Bleach}}'' fandom complain every single time any character wins or loses.
  37. ** Or the people who complain that there's "too much fighting" but also that the non-fighting, character development parts are "boring."
  38. * ''{{Tenchi Muyo}}'' was, and to a point still is, like this for older anime fans in North America. With the difference in time between the 2nd and 3rd OVAs, the ''{{Tenchi Universe}}'' TV series, which was actually a fairly good adaptation of the 1st OVA series for TV, and the fact that much of the material which is available in Japan, and explains everything, is not available otherwise, you can be sure that the reception was mixed. The number of {{spinoff}} series, which each developed their own rabid fanbase, particularly the ones revolving around Sasami, doesn't help matters at all.
  39. * ''{{Ranma}}'' was also notorious for this, and it isn't uncommon even today for someone to harp on the virtues/faults of a specific fiance.
  40. * ''AxisPowersHetalia'' proved to have plenty of this over time, starting out small with complaints and debates about which nations were introduced or not, [[DieForOurShip shipping wars]], debates on the male to female ratio which went sour, and arguments on which strips were offensive or not. The release of the [[GagDub English language]] [[RatedMForMoney adaptation]] and the [[CrossesTheLineTwice liberties taken in the script]] only guaranteed this status (and how).
  41. [[/folder]]
  43. [[folder:ComicBooks]]
  44. * DC Comics reportedly has a hard time getting writers to work on ''{{Legion of Super Heroes}}'' because many writers feel that "you're doomed no matter what you do". It doesn't help that each iteration of the Legion has its own fanbase that considers all other versions "fake". A recent mini-series, ''Legion of Three Worlds'' is trying to fix this by establishing that ''all three'' Legions are canonical.
  45. * If you don't want to be annoyed by a flame war, don't visit the {{Supergirl}} board at DCComics, because half of the people that post there think that the latest Supergirl, a.k.a Kara Zor-El, is entering a DorkAge, while the other members think that Supergirl is exiting a DorkAge.
  46. * Whenever a gay character and/or couple is introduced. Usually, in addition to the part of the fanbase that does not want gay characters, the other part of the fanbase does not want a long running character to have SuddenlySexuality, but will claim any new characters as a CaptainEthnic or a PetHomosexual. When a gay couple is established, the criticisms continue that characters are underdeveloped, too realistic, not realistic enough, get too much attention, or not enough attention. After a while there's a question of whether or not the criticisms are valid opinions on bad writing or a symptom of UnpleasableFanbase inspired CreatorBreakdown.
  47. ** When a kiss was announced to finally be shown in ''TheAuthority'' between two gay characters, it was criticized that it was a gimmick and violated the idea that these were [[StraightGay two-superheroes-who-happened-to-be-gay]] instead of [[CaptainEthnic two gay superheroes]]. Once the kiss turned out to be entirely unnoticeable (casual and in the background of a party), the book was criticized for not making the kiss out to be a big deal and disappointed a lot of fans.
  48. * Peter David wrote a book called ''Mascot to the Rescue!'' that [[LampshadeHanging lampshades]] the tendency for comic fans to do nothing but complain. It also [[{{Deconstruction}} deconstructs]] the fans' requests (by a narrow margin in a vote) to kill off [[TheScrappy Jason Todd]].
  49. * Prior to PowerGirl getting her own ongoing series, fans generally derided her for being a one note [[MostCommonSuperPower cheesecake]] character with no real personality. After she got her series which gave her a consistent setting, supporting cast and a lighthearted personality, another batch of fans began complaining about the lack of [[DarkerAndEdgier action, anger and punching]] PG was originally known for.
  50. * In June 2010, WonderWoman's new costume was revealed, [[http://io9.com/5576588/almost-everyone-hates-wonder-womans-new-costume and promptly hated]]. There are some arguably valid complaints about the event it's coming in with, and the likelihood that it'll be retconned back to the classic outfit shortly, like {{Superman}} Blue, but there's also a lot about the costume itself. You'd think a fanbase that jokes about her lack of pants wouldn't be complaining so much about her ''getting pants''.
  51. [[/folder]]
  53. [[folder:Film]]
  54. * ''StarWars'' [[http://www.jivemagazine.com/column.php?pid=3381 fans]] have taken HypeBacklash to a ridiculous level by hating on the man who made the franchise in the first place, GeorgeLucas (you need to look no further than the page for GeorgeLucas himself to notice it). What truly makes this belonging on this page is the fact that ''StarWars'' franchise obviously [[CashCowFranchise does well under his management]].
  55. ** Practically any part of ''StarWars'' franchise, except (maybe) the first two films of the original trilogy, seems to have its own dedicated circle of haters. And even those are now immune mostly due to NostalgiaFilter. You can read about it in greater detail [[http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Ruined_FOREVER here]].
  56. * Critics are split half and half on the film adaptation of ''{{Watchmen}}''. Some praise the film for staying faithful to the comic, breaking the cycle of bad adaptations based on AlanMoore's works. On the other hand, others criticize it for being ''too faithful'' to the source material, and that director Zack Snyder didn't do enough to insert his own interpretations and creative vision into the film.
  57. * StarTrek fans have often complained about the portrayal of Orion women, the original GreenSkinnedSpaceBabe. Some people were upset about all Orion women being slave girls who were in great demand as "consorts" and dancers. {{Enterprise}} attempted to retcon this by saying that the women were really in charge and using their pheromones to seduce men. People complained that it was making women out to be manipulative harpies who you just couldn't trust. The new film introduces Gaila, an independent Orion enrolled in Starfleet Academy (confirmed by WordOfGod to have made her way out of the system by means of an underground railroad) who still likes having lots of sex. Matter settled with honor to both sides, right? People complained about a line by Kirk; [[HypocriticalHumor "How many men have you slept with?"]] Including a crowd scene, Gaila appears in the movie for ''less than ten minutes''.
  58. * KevinSmith seems to find the unpleasable portion of his fanbase highly amusing. "Long live me, internet guy!"
  59. * Older fans of JamesCameron were livid at ''{{Titanic}}'' being the most popular film ever and spent a decade or so sulking about how he "should" go back to sci-fi. Then ''{{Film/Avatar}}'' is announced and kept under very tight wraps, and said fans hyped themselves into a frenzy, based on nothing more than "Cameron's making a sci-fi film again!". When the actual trailer was released, the HypeBacklash over it's [[RecycledInSpace arguable unoriginality]] was rather...''loud''. And then ''Avatar'' actually came out and made Cameron director of ''two'' of the highest grossing films ever--though one might not know it for the ''endless'' venom spewed about the film to this very day all over the internet. Not even the knowledge that his next movie is a live-action adaptation of ''BattleAngelAlita''--and any studio will give him all the funding he wants--has slowed the complaints.
  60. * The {{Godzilla}} fandom certainly applies. Whenever a movie is released starring a new monster for [[FanNickname Goji]] to fight, fans complain that Toho didn't include classic monsters like Mothra or Ghidorah. So, what happens when Toho makes a Godzilla film featuring more classic foes? The fans complain about the lack of originality.
  61. ** Heck, Godzilla ''himself'' falls under this. A movie portrays him in a more light-hearted manner? People complain that Godzilla is "SeriousBusiness" and should be DarkerAndEdgier. A more grim and serious portrayal? Complaints that Godzilla should be fun to watch.
  62. [[/folder]]
  64. [[folder:Literature]]
  65. * ''HarryPotter'' may be the largest existing fanbase ''in the world''. So naturally, there are ''numerous'' examples of this trope in play, including:
  66. ** There was no way JK Rowling could end the series so that everyone would be happy, so "fans" continue to whine endlessly about how she screwed it all up. Particularly unpleasable are Slytherfen, Snape fangirls, and bitter shippers. [[http://www.journalfen.net/community/the_hms_stfu/ Here are the most mindboggling examples]].
  67. * ''{{The Wheel of Time}}'': Pick a ''Wheel'' character, any character. Got your character? Good. Anywhere from 30 to 90 percent of the vocal fans hate that character.
  68. ** It's the same with ''{{A Song of Ice and Fire}}''.
  69. * TerryPratchett {{lampshade}}d this in an interview with the following quote:
  70. ** "Of course I listen to my readers! So the next book will be: Set in Ankh-Morpork/not set in Ankh-Morpork. With lots of the good old characters/with a whole cast of new characters. Written like the old books, which were better/written like the later books, which were better. With lots of character development/none of that dull character development stuff, which gets in the way of the jokes. Short/long. You want fries with that?"
  71. * The ''WarriorCats'' fandom... just... the ''WarriorCats'' fandom. They complained about the crappiness of ''The New Prophecy'', but then it suddenly became almost as good as their precious ''[[NostalgiaFilter Original Series]]'' when they started to hate on ''Power of Three''. They reach another level of annoyingness when every time a new book comes out, people begin praising it, and saying they finally "brought ''Warriors'' back", and then about a week later, they start insulting ''the very same book that they said was awesome''. Yeah. Their complaints constantly reach WallBanger levels.
  72. ** And of course, how they keep whining about all the [[StarCrossedLovers forbidden loves]]. Admittedly, this plot device does have more of an impact the first time around than the seventh, but they think if it's forbidden, it instantly sucks, or is "overused". Pretty much the ''entire fandom'' acts like this, and threatens to stop reading the books if there is another forbidden romance. No matter how well written, or how great the pairing is. This even includes people who ship ''other'' forbidden pairings. Ironically, depending on what you would consider a forbidden love, their precious first series actually has more forbidden love than the second and third series ''combined''.
  73. *** In fact, a popular complaint is that the third series revolved around romance, despite having almost no romance whatsoever. Apparantly, [[WallBanger the involvement of characters who are the offspring of two characters who had a romantic relationship constitutes romance]].
  74. *** This all relates to their DoubleStandard against newer books: for example, these fans have come up with a list of reasons for why they hate these pairings, every single one of which applies to [=SiverstreamxGraystripe=] in incredible amounts. But even though this pairing takes everything they hate in {{Shipping}} and [[TurnedUpToEleven Turns Them Up To Eleven]], it is the only pairing in the entire series that is ''universally liked'', simply because it was the first major pairing in the series.
  75. ** Of course, because of NostalgiaFilter, the first series is completely immune to any criticism. This often leads to their complaints applying to the first series as well, sometimes even more so than the book they are complaining about.
  76. *** Anything irrelevant to the plot in the first series is "an interesting sub-plot", but anything irrelevant to the plot in the later series is "boring filler".
  77. ** They complained because the first three books of ''Power of Three'' had mostly independent plotlines and didn't have very much of an overarching storyline. Then they complained about the last three books because each book lead directly into the next, didn't have their own independent plots, and followed the overarching plot that leads into the fourth series. Translation: [[FanDumb They hate some books for having what other books they hate lack, and vice versa]].
  78. ** Some fans are capable of complaining about both [[ItsTheSameNowItSucks the series being too repetitive]] and [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks how different the newer books are from the older ones]] at the ''exact same time''.
  79. ** They also complained about the lack of death in ''Power of Three'' (even though there were only two or three opportunities for the author to kill off any characters), but then when the author finally killed [[spoiler:Honeyfern]], some complained that it was "overdone" and "pointless" (even though the majority claimed to have [[TearJerker cried during that scene]]), or just complained about her dying in general.
  80. *** Subsequent deaths of minor characters caused complaints about how the deaths were pointless since they didn't care about these characters. And then there were complaints about how the authors were killing off characters they liked, and that they should kill off less important characters.
  81. *** Other death related complaints involve the fourth series having too many or not enough deaths, depending on who you ask.
  82. ** Another popular complaint is that [=ThunderClan=] is overpopulated.
  83. *** Vicky can say that the other Clans have just as many cats as [=ThunderClan=], and that they just aren't listed in the [[DramatisPersonae Allegiances]], until she's blue in the face; [[FanDumb fans just won't get it]] ([[ScapegoatCreator or they'll twist her words around so they can say something negative about the series or insult her, or just say she was lying to make herself look good]]). They also accuse [=ThunderClan=] of being perfect. As in the Clan that is constantly facing pressure from [=WindClan=], was invaded in ''Eclipse'' and on the verge of losing the resulting battle, and in ''Sunrise'', was facing the threat of a potential three-Clan alliance against them. Yes, that [=ThunderClan=]. Apparantly the fact that their leader has a sense of morals makes all of this, as well as the flawed characters within the Clan, a moot point, meaning they are all {{Mary Sue}}s.
  84. *** Hell, being anything but a villain or a JerkAss makes you a MarySue in their eyes.
  85. ** There are also a few {{Straw Feminist}}s among the fanbase who complain about the author being sexist, complaints having even gone so far as ''accusing her of wanting to be a man''. Considering this is a series focussing on a society where males and females are equal, with many well-developed and important female characters, it seems like nothing short of explicit female supremacy will satisfy them. One noteworthy example would be how ridiculously hyped and praised the character Mapleshade was ''before she even made an appearance'' simply because she's a villain that doesn't have a penis. As if the fact that they basically acknowledged that [[spoiler:Hollyleaf]]'s FaceHeelTurn didn't count for some reason wasn't enough, it seems like if Mapleshade isn't a massive DiabolusExMachina VillainSue who constantly kicks [[BigBad Tigerstar]]'s ass and manipulates and bosses around all of the other villains, they are going to be ''pissed''.
  86. ** Back when the 2011 ''[[ExpandedUniverse Super]] [[DoorStopper Edition]]'' was planned to be about the earlier days of the Clan before the series started, fans were excited about it. When plans were changed so that the ''Super Edition'' would be about Crookedstar, people complained that they weren't going to get any "Early Clan Days". Now that the fifth series has been announced to be just that, people are complaining about how it's a bad idea.
  87. ** The [[{{Aesop}} lesson]] behind this wall of text is: There are two kinds of people who read ''[[WarriorCats Warriors]]'': People who like ''Warriors'', and ''Warriors'' fans. If you happen to be the former, stay the hell away from any of the latter for the sake of your health.
  88. *** ''[[WarriorsWish Warrior's Wish]]'' obsessors who are showing the above symptoms of unpleasable fanbase, try taking a break from the forum for about a month before and during the next book release. I cured my unpleasableness!
  89. [[/folder]]
  91. [[folder:LiveActionTV]]
  92. * If you're hoping to be one of the writers/producers of ''[[TwentyFour 24]]'', know this...you will '''NEVER''' please the whole fandom. Don't try because no matter what plotline or character, somebody will complain, ''loudly''. Seriously, Jack Bauer has a better chance of stopping an invading horde of vampires in 24 hours with nothing more than a toothbrush.
  93. * Pick a SoapOpera, any SoapOpera. Way too many soap fans want to [[DieForOurShip die for their ship]]. And then when they get it, they complain it's too boring.
  94. * Absolutely anything to do with [[ReTool the last two seasons]] of ''StargateSG1''. For that matter, the splits started around the time of [[TropeNamer THE]] JonasQuinn, were not as...vocal, shall we say...as they became after season 9.
  95. ** ''StargateAtlantis'' has entered this territory in the past couple of seasons, due to back-to-back cast changes, as well as the persistent apparent bastardry -- and not the magnificent kind -- of the cast. Gate World Forum battles still blaze between "Carter vs. Elizabeth vs. Woolsey as leader" and "Carson vs. Keller as chief medical officer."
  96. * This is a huge topic of debate among the ''StargateUniverse'' fanbase between the camps of those who like the more realistic character-driven approach, and the traditionalists who long for more of the classic Stargate style.
  97. * The fanbase of the American ''BigBrother'' is extremely unpleasable, especially the fanbases of individual players in the show. "They should go back to basics, "The basics are boring after awhile, let's spice it up with some TWISTS!!", "You should be able to play the game from start to finish," "You should NOT be a huge threat" and a big one... "You should be able to win Head of Household twice in a row!". You can bet the people who want this wouldn't be saying ''that'' when a player they really dislike chain-wins Head of household all the way to the finals
  98. ** The recent season has a ''lot'' of unpleasability. Jessie should be around...now JEFF should be around! The ''coup d'etat'' made the game...no the ''coup d'etat'' '''BROKE''' the game because Jessie was evicted! Jordan was riding coattails, no NATALIE was riding coattails, Kevin should have won, no, NATALIE should have won, no, JEFF should have won! Every season something like ''this'' happens.
  99. * ''StarTrek'': This is largely a result of the sheer ''length'' of the saga. The fanbase was already winding down at the end of ''[[StarTrekVoyager Voyager]]'', but Paramount wanted another series. Addressing many of the complaints about ''Voyager'' (and some about ''DeepSpaceNine''), the producers decided to create a prequel series in ''{{Enterprise}}''. This was to try and make "[[CatchPhrase strange new worlds]]" seem exciting again. Unfortunately, too many of the debates were on whether the theme song was appropriate for Trek and TheAestheticsOfTechnology and {{Zeerust}} that clashed with the 35 year old StarTrekTheOriginalSeries.
  100. ** [[http://www.theonion.com/content/video/trekkies_bash_new_star_trek_film This Onion News Network video]] pretty accurately reflects the attitudes of longtime ''Trek'' fans towards [[Film/StarTrek the new movie]]. It's worth noting that these same fans were complaining about the series being cancelled with ''{{Enterprise}}''.
  101. * ''BattlestarGalactica'' has this in spades with two distinct fandoms ([=TOaSters=] and [=GINOs=]), a massive amount of ([[ShipToShipCombat competing]]) shipping in the new series, and very vocal elements regarding the finale and what it means to the rest of the series.
  102. * For two seasons, ''{{Lost}}'' fans complained that there were some 30 other survivors of Flight 815 whom we never got to meet. So the writers introduced Paolo and Nikki, only to have the fans complain about being expected to believe they were there all along.
  103. ** Among the fanbase at any time - but particularly during the airing of Season 6 - exactly half of the fanbase is clamouring for resolution and demanding that the writers start answering their questions, while the other half is bemoaning the series for "losing the mysterious feel" of the earlier seasons.
  104. *** The classic example of this is the fan response to "the Others" - in Season 1 and 2, a mysterious, almost unseen presence. Fans demanded answers about them, and Season 3 shed a lot of light on them - so then fans started complaining that the Others weren't scary or mysterious anymore.
  105. * On ''{{Supernatural}}'', this comes up nearly every time a female cast member is introduced to the show. Season 2 was attacked for the character "Jo" being an unrealistic goody-goody female hunter, so for Season 3 the writers created two female antagonists, thinking that EvilIsSexy. The Season 3 characters were loathed so much that many viewers actually started saying they missed Jo. And now that Ruby has been [[TheNthDoctor Nth Doctor]]ed, some people are actually saying they miss the old one. Whether or not the show's issues with these characters is due to an UnpleasableFanbase, ExecutiveMeddling, or a case of WriterOnBoard is up for debate, but the first seems very likely. [[DieForOurShip Some fans seem to hate anyone either brother expresses any romantic interest in]]. This extends to ''real life''.
  106. ** They can't win when it comes to the boys, either. Dean acts like a jerk and the Dean!Girls think the writers are Mean To Dean and only care about Sam. Sam acts like a jerk and the Sam!Girls think the writers to Mean To Sam and only care about Dean. Dean acts nicely and the Sam!Girls think they're making him out to be a saint at the expense of Sam's character. Sam acts nicely and the Dean!Girls immediately hate him for being Saint!Sam. Seriously, unless they both act like good little choir boys, nobody is going to be happy.
  107. *** This was recently acknowledged in an episode dealing with a prophet of God who wrote a series of novels entitled "Supernatural", which detailed the boys' adventures. While reading fan comments about the books online, Sam says "Boy, these people sure complain a lot." And people complained about ''that'', saying that Eric Kripke is "having too much fun playing." Ladies and gentlemen, we have a SugarWiki/MostTriumphantExample.
  108. ** Half of the female population of the fanbase (most of it), complains about misogyny when Dean--who is openly a [[JerkAss dick]]--calls a ''female demon'' a "bitch". The other half of the fanbase [[DieForOurShip calls her a bitch]]. There's probably some overlap. You see the problem here.
  109. *** One excellent example of this schizophrenia was [[http://community.livejournal.com/supernatural_tv/2053123.html the reaction post on the LJ community for "Abandon All Hope"]]. [[spoiler:Jo decides go out in a HeroicSacrifice, and the fans complain they were just starting to like her. Fair enough. Then Ellen decides to join her, and they start complaining about how the show treats female characters. Fair enough. Then Castiel gets one over on the demon Meg. "KILL HER!"]]
  110. ** In the season 5 finale, "Swan Song", [[spoiler:Satan-in-Sam--and Michael-in-Adam--end up back in Satan's cage, and Dean goes to start a normal life, just like Sam made him promise to. Lisa, the woman Dean went back to. slept Dean and who has a kid who may be his. A few episodes previous, Dean went to her and made sure she would be safe in the event of the apocalypse, and she invited him to look her up for a beer next time. She's a single mother, independant, financially, emotionally, and mentally stable, and represents a more or less average woman and a good role model on a show that's constantly accused of misogyny. The fanbase immediately complained that her being Dean's "true love" "came out of nowhere". The extent of their interactions at the end of the episode was ''a beer and dinner''.]]
  111. * ''{{Legend of the Seeker}}'', and really any show that adapted from another medium. Part of the fanbase who are devout book fans are furious about both minor details (Darken Rahl is blond in the books! BLASPHEMY!!!) and the fact that the show is, at best, a loose adaptation. However, TV fans have some trouble with some of the parts held over from the books. For example, Richard's transformation takes place over several LONG books. They've tried to keep this in the series, but that's left his transformation from a naive farmboy to a battle hardened man going at a glacial pace, and leaving many fans saying he's the most boring character on the show.
  112. * ''Series/{{Heroes}}''. Oh ''Heroes'', you just can't win. New powers? They're ridiculous. Old powers? Not original enough, make some new ones. Too much time travel/not enough time travel. Character X is too powerful/Character X needs to become more powerful, he's boring. Also, people too damn stupid to listen to stuff, and thusly declare everything as plot holes.
  113. ** This even happens in the professional media. An ''Entertainment Weekly'' cover story accused the show of ''both'' not having enough new powers and having too many, and when Elle was killed off shortly after ''TV Guide'' decried the show's reluctance to kill characters off, their response was basically "We didn't mean her!"
  114. * ''SaturdayNightLive'' was better three years ago. ''Saturday Night Live'' has always been better three years ago.
  115. ** Lampshaded in an interview with one of the original writers, who pointed out that people have ALWAYS complained that the show used to be better. "I think it started with episode two of our first season."
  116. * Fans of ''America's Next Top Model'' always complain when a talented, quiet, high-fashion contestant loses over a more commercial, outgoing girl that made for better television. So, what happens every time the quiet, high-fashion girl actually does take home the prize? They all complain that she was too boring and high-fashion and the commercial, outgoing girl should have won instead because she made for better television. Then again, ''Top Model'' fandom has always been more of a {{Hatedom}} anyway.
  117. * ''PowerRangers'' fans. It's most visible when it comes to originality: If a Power Rangers series does not resemble its SuperSentai counterpart, they've [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks "ruined" it]]... but if it ''does,'' the complaints of lack of originality are just as loud (see ''PowerRangersMysticForce.'')
  118. * ''{{Babylon 5}}'''s creator was annoyed that people complained about aliens acting too human and about aliens acting too different.
  119. ** He was also irked by the flak he got regarding the [[LesYay Talia/Ivannova ship]], which he [[ShipTease teased]] a bit but never officially canonized. Paraphrased from memory:
  120. -->''If you do nothing, you get yelled at for ignoring it. If you do a little, you get yelled at for not doing more. If you do more, you get yelled at for not doing it sooner. Screw it. Do what the story needs, when the story needs it."
  121. * TheBigBangTheory. Mainly among shippers. Most of the vocal fans ''hate'' the cannon Penny/Leonard ship and ''love'' the mind-boggling Sheldon/Penny. Needless to say, Season 3 has created this trope. Don't mention the romantic sub-plots unless you wanna start a flame war. It'll only get worse if they continue the [[spoiler:possible relationship for Sheldon]] next season.
  122. * Almost any Reality Competition that doesn't revolve around trapping a bunch of strangers together and watching them play person politics to win has unpleasable fanbases, divided over what makes the show good:
  123. ** ''TheAmazingRace'':Do the fans want to see the teams scrambling for public transportation, or do they think that's boring? Do they want more remote locations or do they want more beautiful locations? Should the tasks be fun to watch or difficult? (And if difficult, should they be physically demanding or mentally demanding?) Is using the Yield and the U-Turn just part of the game, or playing dirty? And so on...
  124. ** ''TopChef'' runs into the same thing: Do you want to know more about the contestants as people or do you just to see more cooking? Are the challenges too gimmicky? Should they be given bigger budgets, more time, fewer twists or the reverse? Which should be grounds for elimination: serving a poor dish, or following the letter but not the spirit of the challenge? Do the judges really judge solely on the chefs' performance that day, or do they take past performances into account? Should they cut a chef some slack for a poor dish if that chef has made other, ''really good'' dishes in the past?
  125. ** ''{{Survivor}}'': Twenty people is too many - they should go back to sixteen! No, sixteen people is too boring - let's try eighteen or twenty. Tribal swaps ruined the game. Tribal Swaps made the games less one-sided. I wanna see some rehashes of challenges, I hate seeing them redo challenges! Hidden Immunity Idols ruined the game, hidden immunity idols made the game more interesting. They don't do enough Survival - No that's ''boring'' when they sit around the camp all the time, I wanna see them fight and argue. They have a bunch of [[RealityShowGenreBlindness idiots playing the game]]. No, GenreSavvy players would ''ruin'' the game because they'd make it boring! The first season was the best, The first season was boring - let's watch ''Samoa''. ''Fiji'' sucked! ''Fiji'' had a ''brilliant'' move - what're you talking about? People who vote personally ruin the game. No, Crystal&Randy and Coach&Sierra ''made'' Gabon and Tocantins respectively! They should do another ''All-Stars'', ''All-Stars'' sucked! ''Heroes vs. Villains'' is gonna be another [[SpotlightStealingSquad Russell Clip Show!]].
  126. * [[http://www.imdb.com/board/bd0000123/nest/149710429 This IMDB post]] points out the endless problems that would arrive if the much-wanted Classic Nickelodeon network was to come into existence. They're mostly due to this.
  127. * Lily and Rufus were a popular ship on ''GossipGirl'', so when Bart Bass [[DieForOurShip passed away]] and Lily was free to be with Rufus, many people were happy. One season later most fans have begun to loathe the pairing and wish that Bart hadn't died, many now feeling he was much better for her than Rufus.
  128. * Oh boy, {{Smallville}}'s fandom most definitely falls into this category. If Clark appears to be in love with any of the three main girls, the fans of the other two will angrily rant online about how "he isn't 'worthy' of our favorite girl anyway!"
  129. ** There are some shippers who don't seem to even ''like'' Clark, and merely view him as some sort of trophy to award to their favorite female character.
  130. *** It also extends to the amount of screentime each female character gets. Is Lois getting a lot of screentime and character development? The Chloe fans will angrily claim that the writers are destroying Chloe to make way for Lois. Is Chloe getting a lot of screentime? The Lois fans will complain that Chloe is a waste of time since she's not in the comics. Is Lana getting a lot of screentime? EVERYONE outside of Lana's small-but-devoted fandom will complain.
  131. **** Then there are the rabid comic book purists who angrily rant for several pages about how the show differs from the {{Superman}} comic books, and act as though the show's writers have thus [[{{Serious Business}} committed religious heresy of some sort]].
  132. * Anything in ''DoctorWho'' ever. It doesn't matter what is being discussed, it will always end in a FlameWar.
  133. [[/folder]]
  135. [[folder:MetaConcepts]]
  136. * {{Shipping}}. Full stop.
  137. [[/folder]]
  139. [[folder:Music]]
  140. * All {{Vocaloid}} fans agree that Vocaloid should become an anime. The problem is, no one can agree on what the anime should actually be ''about''
  141. * Ricky Martin. When he sang in English, the Latino fangirls thought he sucked and watered down his material. Now that he sings in Spanish again, the Anglo fangirls from the late 90s disavow his existence and the American music press call him a joke, but his Latin career has never been better and he remains fairly popular in Latin America. (Compare his Spanish material to the lower-quality English [=CDs=], and it becomes clear he brought it on himself, though.)
  142. * LinkinPark. When they released their sophomore album ''Meteora'', some decried it for being ''[[ItIsTheSameNowItSucks Hybrid Theory, Pt. 2]]''. When their third album ''Minutes to Midnight'' dropped, others complained about the [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks departure from rapcore/nu metal present on their previous albums]].
  143. * HIM frontman Ville Valo once lampshaded this during an interview with Metal Hammer regarding the album ''Dark Light'':
  144. -->"It's pretty much going to be like CradleOfFilth, but without the heavy guitar riffs, or the thundering drum and bass lines, or the leather, or the Goth imagery, or the eroticism, or the strippers, but essentially it's going to be like Cradle Of Filth, and I'm thinking of changing the name from HIM to The Fluffers, what do you think?"
  145. * XJapan. It manages to be both an UnpleasableFanbase and a BrokenBase all at once (depending on whether there's a FlameWar or not) but there is no way of pleasing the fans, and the fans [[{{GIFT}} like to make their voices heard]] even if it means pushing the bandleader [[YoshikiHayashi Yoshiki]] into a psychiatric breakdown and off the internet.
  146. * BlackMetal - sometimes it seems as if every album that wasn't recorded in a garbage can on a 4-track while the band were too drunk to stand and on the lam from burning a church will ''always'' suck in the eyes of the trve and the kvlt of the black metal fanbase.
  147. ** Fortunately, most of the black metal fans over 16 years of age think the kvlt-kiddies are an utter joke. Still, even a reasonable black metaller tends to dislike super clean production on black metal albums, mostly because a rough and raw sound adds a certain dark texture that was integral to classic black metal.
  148. * {{Metallica}}. This trope could easily be called Metallica's New Album Sucks.
  149. * 1/2 of ToriAmos' fanbase became this. ''American Doll Posse'' was Tori's angriest album in years, yet a lot of fans were not pleased. ''Midwinter Graces'' was her most piano-based album in years, and she still managed to not please some fans. It seems that Tori would have to release a piano-based album resulting from some extreme CreatorBreakdown in order for the whining to stop.
  150. * MyChemicalRomance fans. It's difficult to pick one album that was the point of contention...but so far, it seems to be all three albums.
  151. ** Some in the fandom have already decided the unnamed new album sucks. It's not even out yet. Hell, it's not even ''done'' yet.
  152. * [[DreamTheater Mike Portnoy]], in the middle of a CreatorBreakdown, wrote a song about fandom's unpleasability. It's called "Never Enough". Quoting just a fragment of it is impossible. [[http://www.darklyrics.com/lyrics/dreamtheater/octavarium.html#6 You have to read it yourself]].
  153. [[/folder]]
  155. [[folder:NewMedia]]
  156. * ''ZeroPunctuation'' by Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw is a series of video reviews which ''always'' AccentuateTheNegative, with a few exceptions in the 100+ videos so far. Fans badgered him incessantly to do a review of ''SuperSmashBros Brawl'', [[http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/35-Super-Smash-Bros-Brawl which he did]]. Many fans were then ''surprised'' that he accentuated the negative. ''Their'' response was so large and loud that he created a [[http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/37-Mailbag-Showdown response]] to their emails. However, a good majority heaped excessive praise on him for ripping into the game they hated (and also bug him to review certain games ''just'' so he'll give it a bad review), and plenty of the people sending him e-mails are probably trolls just trying to piss him off. These were probably most of the people that complained about him giving ''{{Psychonauts}}'' and ''{{Portal}}'' good reviews. It's more of a BrokenBase than anything else.
  157. ** Arguably, Yahtzee himself is a pretty good example of an unpleasable fanboy.
  158. * ''{{Yu-Gi-Oh The Abridged Series}}'' hung a lampshade on this. In ''Cr@psule Monsters: Episode 2'', Joey gets attacked by birdlike monsters that are essentially [=LittleKuriboh=]'s unpleasable fanbase. Any of Joey's (and by extension, [=LittleKuriboh=]'s) reasoning gets drowned out by constant squawks of "Where's the new episode?" and he eventually gets attacked. (Granted, YGOTAS often goes months between updates.)
  159. * {{Facebook}}. Oh, dear heavens, ''Facebook''. Every - and I mean ''every'' - single solitary change to the website will be followed up with five million different groups cropping up saying "I hate this new change!" It happened with the Mini-Feed, it happened with Applications, it's happening with New Facebook...
  160. ** Any large Web site will be subject to this trope.
  161. * [=YTMND=]. Anytime a new fad catches on in this site, it's instantaneously spammed endlessly by angry trolls and members who think it's unfunny, with the random person yelling "cry more".
  162. * One particular furry art website changes its banner every month to reflect that time of the month. It's usually followed by people crying over how horrible the banner looks and this happens ''every single month'', which could basically mean every year.
  163. ** There are two mascots to this site, a male and a female one. The male is in pretty much every single banner, and as of 2009, has been the sole mascot portrayed in the banner for literally ''every single month'', with the exception of the special banner like the Chinese New years, which had the female one by herself. So yes, there are people saying they would like to see more of the female mascot - especially since the ''one'' banner that featured her exclusively (that wasn't a holiday one) intended to be up for the month was taken down within two weeks and replaced with one featuring both, which remained for the rest of the month. But what happens whenever the female mascot gets to be the center feature? "OMG That's not something a REAL woman would do!!!!", "How typical that it was designed by a man" and "omg where's the male one?! I wanna see ''HIM''!!".
  164. *** Part of this stems from how the female mascot originated as an April Fools Joke.
  165. * With complaints of "He's being too horrible", "He's being too nice", "He's being too sane" or just the usual HePannedItNowHeSucks, TheNostalgiaCritic's fandom has a reputation for being this. But hey, [[FanDumb what do you expect from a group of people]] that sent him death threats for leaving out [[{{Transformers}} Optimus Prime's death]] in the ''Top 11 Saddest Moments'' review or poking fun at Mako in his TMNT review?
  166. * GaiaOnline. Whenever a new Cash Shop item is released, half the users will complain about the smallest detail, while others will praise the item. Anytime anything resembling a cross is released, expect there to be shouts of how it's "offensive" even though the site has ''several'' items connected to other religions. (There are bhuddist robes and "monk" and "nun" wigs, a spaghetti item featured a pose for the Flying Spaghetti Monster, there's Cuthulu items, etc.) No one ever takes that into consideration.
  167. * {{NeoPets}}:
  168. ** The unpleasability seemed to start with the Lost Desert comic of 2005. It had a [[WallBanger stupid ending]] where two characters who had never met [[StrangledByTheRedString declared their undying love for each other]] at their first meeting, and the jackass who had spent the entire plot terrorizing the kingdom got a [[KarmaHoudini happy ending]]. Other problems included a completely anticlimactic resolution and the completely predictable [[TheReveal "revelation"]] that our heroine was a princess. OK, one bad plot - big deal, right?... yes, [[SeriousBusiness big deal.]] Such a big deal, in fact, that TNT ("The Neopets Team," I.E. the site staff) [[FanDumb apparently got huge numbers of flaming e-mails]]. With this incident, constant biting criticism of TNT became fashionable and it still hasn't stopped.
  169. *** To be fair, the huge negativity did create a small backlash of equally rabid TNT-worshippers. It's mainly only visible in the editorials these days, however - the trend of typing "* gives cookies* " or the like when sending in a question, which so confuses TNT themselves, began right about this time and continues to this day.
  170. ** When Viacom bought neopets in 2005, the users panicked, assumed TNT had been fired and replaced, and started to blame Viacom for everything wrong with the site. But judging by the changes made, it appears that TNT still has nearly full control over the site's content - it seems the only Viacom-related change was the addition of more revenue-producing features.
  171. *** One of those revenue-producing features is the NC mall, where you use real money to buy clothes and items for your pets. The feature's optional, and the items are strictly for show, so it doesn't affect the neopian economy in any way. Which didn't stop claims that neo was RuinedForever and loud accusations that they had "sold out". [[MoneyFetish Because wanting profit makes you a sicko]].
  172. **** That had more to do with how you were only allowed to keep items in the MC Mall for a month or two originally. They've since changed that, but some still say they sold out.
  173. ** Then there are all the claims of "unfair freezing" (Freezing = the on-site term for banning). While there are legitimate cases, they are usually quickly rectified; eighty percent of the time, the person claiming they were punished unjustly is either lying, did not know the rules well enough to realize they broke them, or had their account inactivated when their security was compromised and assumed the worst.
  174. *** One such claim once led to a full-scale riot on the neopets chat boards; hundreds of people got in on the act just for the lulz, posting thousands of obscene and threatening messages. The flow was far too fast for the relatively small moderating staff, and so the boards were ''locked completely'' for a day or two in order to allow all the necessary warnings and bans to be dealt.
  176. [[/folder]]
  178. [[folder:ProfessionalWrestling]]
  179. * {{Smart Mark}}s degenerate into this from time to time. For example, when smark favorite CM Punk beat Edge for the World Heavyweight Title, smart marks - rather than celebrate that one of their poster boys had won one of WWE's top titles - instead bitched about the fact that Punk won it by pinning Edge after he had been beaten up by other wrestlers, supposedly making Punk look "weak" and "cowardly". Never mind that Edge had previously won the title in that ''exact same way'' months ago, and Punk defeating him in that fashion was (from a storyline perspective) karmic backlash for the {{heel}} Edge.
  180. ** Rumor has it Hulk Hogan wants to get rid of Vince Russo and put wrestlers in charge of TNA's direction. Fans are already whining about the rumor, many of the same fans who blamed everything wrong with TNA on Vince Russo.
  181. * WWE fans often accuse anyone who doesn't like the WWE product of being an UnpleasableFanbase.
  182. * The Internet Wrestling Community (IWC) definitely qualifies.
  183. * The latest example for WWE is coming from their changing of the names of several of their pay-per-view events.
  184. * And don't forget the commenters on any wrestling website. Write an article that's positive at all, and you'll be accused of being a fanboy, a mark, a shill, and whatever else. Write an article that's negative at all, and you'll be accused of being a bitter, unpleasable [[SmartMark smark]] who [[StrawFan lives in his parents' basement]]. Write an article that gives the good and bad of something? Expect ''both'' types of flames to be rained down upon you.
  185. * One of the most common complaints by the IWC is that WWE never pushes new talent. But whenever a newer superstar (most recently, Jack Swagger) gets pushed, smarks will complain that the superstar in question "didn't pay his dues" which is a fancy way of saying that because it wasn't a guy ''they'' like, it doesn't count.
  186. * Anytime WWE or TNA do a gimmick match or title match on the weekly show The column writers and recappers bitch about them giving away big matches on free TV. Then they also bitch about how nothing exciting happens on the free TV shows anymore.
  188. [[/folder]]
  190. [[folder:Radio]]
  191. * Try getting HowardStern fans to agree on what specifically they find entertaining and not entertaining about his show.
  192. [[/folder]]
  194. [[folder:TabletopGames]]
  195. * The complaining that ensues from many new editions of [[RolePlayingGame [=RPGs=]]].
  196. * The ''{{Yu-Gi-Oh}}'' card game fandom will often complain that "they don't have enough support for X theme", or "they don't have X anime card, yet". On the rare occasion that Konami actually ''listens'' to these complaints, they're met with further complaints that the cards they've given are either too broken or too restrictive to the point of uselessness.
  197. * Regarding the 4th edition of ''{{Dungeons and Dragons}}''. The fanbase is divided between the "old school" and the "new school," the "roleplayers" and the "roll-players." The phrase "I don't want your anime in my Dungeons and Dragons" was repeatedly seen in the [=WotC=] messageboards. You have to wonder about the "you" they are talking about.
  198. ** Also, don't forget the "you're getting your WOW in my tabletop RPG" crowd, and the massive rage against salami-slicing the classes and monsters into several PHBs, DMGs and MMs.
  199. * Speaking of ''{{Dungeons and Dragons}}'', the D&D Miniatures line follows a set pattern with every release: After the first previews, each set is "the best set ever." Right around release time, it becomes "the WORST set ever," regardless of what is actually in it. Every aspect, from sculpting, to paint jobs, to figure selection will be absolutely hated by the same people who buy ten or twenty factory-sealed cases (This includes people who only play older editions, and thus would not use the figures in RPG). However, as soon as another set is released, that previous set suddenly becomes "The best set ever" once more.
  200. ** For additional irony, the "I don't want your anime in my D&D" line was also extended to the ''[[{{Splat}} Book of Nine Swords]]'' which was intended to help even out the LinearWarriorsQuadraticWizards equation for physical fighters. Opponents of use of that book often decried it as too much anime... and many of the same people who hailed the [=Bo9S=] for giving some parity to melee combatants decried the changes of Fourth in the exact same manner as their predecessors.
  201. *** ''Book of Nine Swords'' is better known as the Book of Weeaboo Fightan Magic on 4chan's /tg/. Arguments over it and 4e were largely started because impotent neckbeard rage is an entertaining thing to behold.
  202. ** Before 4th Edition, the most common complaint was that [[CharacterTiers the different classes were too unbalanced]] in terms of power levels (with the Cleric and Druid [[GameBreaker ranking at the top]]). Then Fourth Edition comes out... and many of those same people cry that the classes are ''too'' evenly matched and similar to each other.[[FailureIsTheOnlyOption Wizards just can't win, it seems]].
  203. * ''[[{{Warhammer40000}} Warhammer 40,000]]'' is subject to this, especially by several communities on the net. People cry that 4th/5th Edition rules suck, and long for the good old days, others who (rightly) claim that 2nd Edition was a shoddily-constructed WallBanger, and others who are [[TheWoobie just waiting]] for the Dark Eldar update. Complaints regarding minor points of background also seem to be popular, especially concerning non-tabletop adaptations.
  204. ** Anytime a new codex is introduced, fans instantly pounce with the rage of the entire Warp. Necrons? The ultimate [[TheWesley Wesley]]. Tau? [[HumongousMecha Animu wannabes]]. Daemons? [[ThisIsSPARTA TOO MUCH CHEDDER]]! Of all the new codices, the Chaos Space Marine codex caught the greatest amount of [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks flak]] for their omission of lesser Daemons and units dedicated to each of the Chaos gods. The fans [[FanDumb complained so much]] that Games Workshop is actually rumored to be releasing individual Chaos God codices. [[OneGameForThePriceOfTwo Or maybe they planned it this way all along...]]
  205. *** New codexes tend to be unbalanced in the new codex's favour. That's how they sell. So, every time a new codex is released, whoever was praising the new codex as the best ever is angry that race x is now top gun. It's funny.
  206. * ''[=~Magic: The Gathering~=]'' has this every three months when a new set comes out, and also between when sets come out, and on days that end in "-day". It has been said that Wizards of the Coast could put $100 bills in the booster packs, and there'd be threads in the message boards that they were folded wrong.
  207. * ''WarhammerFantasyRolePlay'' has this in spades. For many fans, the pinnacle of [=RPG=]s is the Enemy Within Campaign, so any change or addition is blasphemy. Particularly when it's done by Games Workshop.
  208. [[/folder]]
  210. [[folder:Scale models]]
  211. * If a model is in any way difficult to put together, it has fit issues. If you can build it by turning the box upside-down, then accuracy was sacrificed for fit.
  212. * Expect the StopHavingFunGuys to go over absolutely every tiny detail with digital calipers and obscure, out-of-print reference books. A scale millimetre off, even though this could just as well be measurement error from the printed plans? The bastards might as well have reached into your wallet and ''stolen'' your money!
  213. * If the standards of casting are poor, it's cheap and nasty. If they're not, it's too expensive.
  214. * Modellers will complain about the same old WW2 models being released and then complain there aren't enough WW2 non-combat vehicles if a company releases anything else.
  215. * If Dragon Models Limited does ''anything'', it's wrong.
  216. * If the model is released at a perfect price point, perfectly detailled, and every detail beyond reproach, the fans will either complain it wasn't made sooner or just criticise the box.
  217. [[/folder]]
  219. [[folder:Toys]]
  220. * ''{{Transformers}}'' is another good example of the "fractured fanbase" variety, and Hasbro and whoever works with them tend to wind up in a bit of a balancing act. Everyone wants something different. The movie figures are too stylized, I hate these gimmicks, the new ''Animated'' figures look too cartoony, when are we gonna get realistic animal modes again it's been ten years, [[BeastWars Trukk Not Munky]], etc. Of course, when we ''do'' get die-cast toys, they can't hold their arms up, etc. And this is just the ''toys''... Don't ''start'' people on either movie, any cartoon, the comics, or... anything, really... Some of us are laid-back about the whole thing, while others are... erm... not. To be fair, the ''fanbase'' knows this more than anyone, and are generally quick to voice what they ''like'' to drown out the chorus of hate when it doesn't need to be heard. Of course, ''{{Transformers}}'' fandom being ''{{Transformers}}'' fandom, they've actually managed to turn this very trope into a meme, known as "[[http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Ruined_FOREVER Ruined FOREVER]]!" [[RuinedFOREVER We]] are not [[http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Ruined_FOREVER the only wiki]] to 'borrow' it.
  221. ** One user on a ''Transformers'' forum leveled complaints about the Transformers in the movie not looking enough like their G1 counterparts. Then, when ''Animated'' was coming out, the ''same fan'' was complaining that the theme song was too similar to the G1 cartoon, even when it was clear that referencing the old 'toon was half the point of ''Animated''.
  222. * Take just about everything said above for ''{{Transformers}}'' and make it about ''GIJoe'' instead. Smaller fanbase, less media, but same complaints more or less.
  223. * AmericanGirl. Oh, American Girl. When Mattel purchased Pleasant Company in 1998 (and wholly took over production by 2000), many of the older fans insisted that anything that Mattel created was awful and shoddy and not sized right for the chubbier older dolls. (Which it's not, but still...) Some "reviewers" will insist things are made of plastic even when it's clear they aren't. Yet a majority of collectors keep buying the newer things--[[{{FanDumb}} all the while complaining that the stuff is nowhere as good as PC stuff.]]
  224. [[/folder]]
  226. [[folder:VideoGames]]
  227. * Related to the above, this trope is present almost ''all. The. Time''. Gamers will cry for developers to try something new - and even will reviewers. So then companies like Nintendo and Sega try a few new things, and they instantly get "It's a Gimmick so it sucks!" thrown on them and they refuse to even give them a chance.
  228. ** It was particularly amusing when the Wii was accused of being a "gimmick" by PS3-fanboys, right up until the SIXAXIS was announced. Their response was ''deafening silence''.
  229. *** And this has been taken straight out the other side with the Playstation Move, which is now being touted as either the "Wii killer" or the "Wii HD."
  230. * Many gamers were frustrated with FakeDifficulty in the early days. However more recent games have gotten rid of this for the most part, but fans still complain that "It's too Easy".
  231. * Many {{MMORPG}}s.
  232. ** ''FinalFantasyXI'': See SquareEnix section.
  233. ** ''{{City of Heroes}}'': After the release of the standalone ExpansionPack ''{{City of Villains}}'', the developers spent a content update on it, only to have the ''{{City of Heroes}}'' players complain about being neglected. The next content update focused on ''{{City of Heroes}}'', promptly leading the ''{{City of Villains}}'' players to complain about being neglected. Subsequent updates have tried to bring equal focus on both halves of the game, which predictably resulted in both sides complaining that they were being neglected.
  234. *** The official forums were recently upgraded, after years of incessant complaining about the matter. Four posts (or twelve, if one is charitable) into the official feedback thread? "The old forums were better, change it back."
  235. * ''{{EVE Online}}'' is another serial offender for people complaining about changes. Every patch contains a 'nerf', even the patch touted by the developers as 'the boost patch' (though naturally, one man's boost is another man's nerf). Recently an even more extreme example occurred during the graphical overhaul where all the ships were given updated models, the colour of which for the Gallente races ships was deemed 'offensive' by a significant portion of players and eventually caused enough uproar that the colour was changed shortly after.
  236. * ''{{Kingdom of Loathing}}'' has this with its [[SpeedRun speed-running]] players, who look at the game in terms of 'optimal' content (in other words, things which allow them to play faster) and 'non-optimal' content (in other words, things which don't allow them to play faster). While not a [[VocalMinority statistically common percentage]] of the game's players, the game's forums are regularly dotted with suggestions to improve the "speed game", mainly by [[DummiedOut streamlining things]]. [[WordOfGod Jick]] has commented at least once that most speedrunners' suggestions are requested in order to justify their time / money spent on speed-running in the first place.
  237. ** [[MemeticMutation Last year's Crimbo was the best. This year's sucks.]]
  238. * [=JRPGs=] have turned into this. Either they complain that the games in a franchise or the genre as a whole are too similar, or they complain when someone tries to genuinely create innovation in the genre that it is not true to the "spirit" or they're not a ''real'' RPG. See ''FinalFantasy'' in the SquareEnix section below.
  239. ** ''TalesSeries''. "It should be more like ''[[TalesOfDestiny Destiny]]''! There was no point after ''[[TalesOfDestiny Destiny]]''!", "No, I like the flex-range systems better." "''[[TalesOfSymphonia Symphonia]]'' sucked, let's play ''[[TalesOfHearts Hearts]]''." "The Flex-Range ''ruined'' Tales of! It's not linear motion even though you still have to be on a plane!" and of course, the biggest faction are the fans who want [[NoExportForYou the other games to be released on European and American shelves.]] (Because Europe hasn't seen ''[[TalesOfLegendia Legendia]]'' or ''Abyss'', despite having received the PSP-port of ''{{Tales of Eternia}})
  240. * MonsterHunter is also in danger of this. A spinoff game of it with cute graphics and chibi monsters was announced, ticked off lots of fans, and they flamed EVERY FREAKING trailers of that game on Youtube. They complained that they should not waste time on this and work on Monster Hunter Freedom 3 instead.
  241. * Possibly the ultimate UnpleasableFanbase might be the exceedingly loud and vocal No Mutants Allowed forum inhabitants. These fans have become infamous throughout the game industry not only for their immense whininess, but for their tendency to whine about ''every little thing.'' It has been said that "[[http://www.nma-fallout.com/content.php?page=features&id=14 All of the normal people are no longer a part of the 'Fallout Community,' they're just fans of the games. The people who are a part of the 'Fallout Community' have been refined and distilled over time into glittering gems of hatred]]." It's gotten to the point where, somehow, someone who enjoys the original ''{{Fallout}}'' games is instantly branded as one of these just by how loud the NMA forumgoers are. (In the interest of fairness, the ''{{Fallout}}'' series has had a [[ScrewedByTheNetwork very rough history]], [[http://www.nma-fallout.com/article.php?id=34542 which can be better explained here]].)
  242. ** There is also the "[[http://www.penny-arcade.com/2007/04/20 And the sound is like a hundred thousand bats shrieking as they swirl around a jutting spire of obsidian]]" comment by Jerry "Tycho" Holkins of ''PennyArcade'', concerning the opening of the ''{{Fallout 3}}'' forums.
  243. ** Speaking of F3, the Let's Play by Spoiler Warning consists of mostly complaining, even though they mentioned Fallout 2 was also very flawed. So much so, in fact, that [[http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=8509 it made it into their drinking game]]. And this is a game they say they essentially ''like''.
  244. * Really, there's ''nothing'' in ''GuildWars'' that hasn't triggered this. Every new campaign, heroes, [=PvE=] skills, skills being overpowered, skills getting nerfed ''for'' being overpowered, Shadow Form (I don't even want to think what'll happen if they nerf it, since it's the go-to farming build at the moment), etc.
  245. * Much of the ''MortalKombat'' fandom is like this. An example: when Khameleon (the female, as opposed to the male Chameleon) wasn't a playable character in the X-Box and [=PlayStation=] 2 versions of ''Armageddon'', fan demand eventually forced Midway to include her in the Wii version. Then ''those same fans'' argued that Khameleon looked and played ugly and generically. Further, when it was revealed no character bios were in ''Armageddon'', fans petitioned to have them made...which about a third of them were, before being cancelled. The ones that ''were'' made, though, were more or less panned by those fans for being terribly written.
  246. ** And then there's then there's the ever-present backlash when the series went 3D which of course, doesn't seem to make much sense either since digitized actors is very outdated.
  247. * The particularly vocal elements of the ''{{Halo}}'' fanbase had such a violently negative reaction to the inclusion of ''bosses'' in ''Halo 2'' that there were no boss-like enemies in ''{{Halo}} 3.'' Naturally, ''{{Halo}}"' fans then complained about the lack of a decisive confrontation with the Gravemind.
  248. ** Not to mention the flame wars raging over the Assault Rifle. In Halo 1, people thought it was worthless. In Halo 2, people wanted it back. In Halo 3, now that they had it back, they complained about how it sucked and was weak and innacurate.
  249. *** And don't even bring up dual weilding unless you want to have flames intense enough to melt your monitor.
  250. ** Similar with the Battle Rifle. It was a game breaker in Halo 2 and people cried out for Bungie to remove it. In Halo 3, they complained about how the Battle Rifle had been {{nerfed}}. Then, there was more crying in ODST about how there was no Battle Rifle. Then in the reach Beta, people were outraged over its omission, resulting in groups literally going through the forum indices and reporting Battle Rifle vs DMR (Designated Marksman Rifle) threads.
  251. ** When Halo 2 came out, fans screamed TheyChangedItNowItSucks. When Halo 3 came out, fans screamed ItIsTheSameNowItSucks. Who knows what they're complaining about for Halo Reach, but knowing the unpleasable, they'll find a reason.
  252. * Since ThereIsNoSuchThingAsNotability... GaiaOnline. To an absurd level. In fact, it seems like some people think hating ''everything'' make you cool. Brilliantly parodied in [[http://gaiaonline.com/forum/gaia-community-discussion/zomg-new-gaia-sucks-f-k-new-gaia-grrrgjhghglrhglj/t.33839363/ this thread]], which has become a sort of meme on the forums. Though, some people seem to like emulating the comic...
  253. ** As soon as an announcement is released, there are ten threads complaining about its content, its wording, its images...
  254. * ''{{Sonic the Hedgehog}}'' fans are no exception to this trope, if anything '''the''' textbook example. There seems to be no way to please them all, despite numerous attempts to do so after the series entered into the 3D era (in fact, each attempt just splintered the fanbase further). Even Sonic's returns to 2-D couldn't please these people. Sonic Rush is an infamous example: it was well-received overall, but to some unfortunately vocal fans, it sucked. Why? Who knows, they all have different reasons. Too hard one minute, too easy to blow through the levels at super speeds the next. Sometimes a mixture of the two. Don't try to think too hard about it.
  255. ** ''{{Sonic the Hedgehog 4}}'' is "a return to speed and a return to 2D" which is based on the complaints of Sonic's nostalgia fans. Sega's plan to appeal to fans with the initial teaser trailer (back when it was known as ''Project Needlemouse'') failed because those fans couldn't recognize ''their most famous Title Screen''. Everything from animations, to ''the size of the rings'' have been complained about. And come the official reveal, the arguments continued to rage on...
  256. *** There's a group actually petitioning to boycott Sonic 4 by buying Sonic 1......you figure that one out.
  257. ** [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgHid5fZsDk This rant]] calls fans out on complaining over ''two seconds'' of gameplay, among other things. Given that the video has mostly positive ratings, the complainers may just be a VocalMinority.
  258. ** And now they've changed the voice actors, which they've been requesting since 2005, and they're ''still'' complaining about it.
  259. * The ''{{Xenosaga}}'' trilogy falls under this. Players complained of "too much story" in the first game, as well as a few other things. Granted, there ''was'' a half-hour cutscene in the first few hours, but still... Cut to Episode II. For the most part, the creators listened to the US players (who had bought the highest percentage) about flaws in Episode I. This one game alone sparked the most controversy, from people complaining that "I can't get the battle system! I want something simpler!" ''despite'' it already being simple and less complicated than say, certain [=MMOs=], to say, the change in the animation style (granted, those who played the games consecutively did have bit of a shock), hell, even the reduced story focused on the "other" main character. The players ''begged'' for the game to be like this. Cut to Episode III, the last due to the previous failure as well as certain issues in Namco. ''Again,'' they listened to the fans, and ''again'' they tried to fix the problems. Cue the weakest battle system, a return to the main character (and more plot, obviously), etc. and people ''still'' complained about this. Again, keep in mind that most of the decisions were made due to loud voice from the US market.
  260. * There's a good chance that ''StarControl II'' will never get an official sequel because of the intra-fanbase dissent about what could possibly improve on the predecessor. If one ever does get released, expect reactions similar to the ones the second ''StarWars'' trilogy produced (i.e., the wait will have been too long for the product to meet the fans' expectations).
  261. ** Well it DID get an official sequel... we just don't like to talk about.
  262. * Most of the SilentHill fandom will readily admit that the first three games are the best in the series. However, there's a portion of the fandom that completely idolizes the original trilogy, [[HateDom and hates any following games with a fiery passion.]] As details emerge about any upcoming Silent Hill game, expect to see a lot of posts how the developers just [[RuinedFOREVER DON'T UNDERSTAND]] Silent Hill, no matter what those details actually are.
  263. * Never go on the ''RockBand'' forums and check out the DLC request/discussion section. People get very, very angry when certain songs/bands don't show up. Regardless of genre. Tool fans have been known to be very, very vocal, but many people get over-excited and often assume that the announcement of "something big" is TheBeatles and LedZeppelin ''finally''. It starts with one person saying "is it Beatles and Zeppelin?", and then people begin to think it ''is''. Then they get ticked off when it isn't.
  264. ** There's either too much metal or not enough. Then there's the definition of metal, the various types of metal, among other things.
  265. ** Don't mention Rock Band Japan to the otakus in the crowd. You'll never hear the end of how it's being neglected for the main stuff.
  266. ** The sheer numbers of unpleasable fans for ''RockBand'' seem to grow with each [=DLC=] release. Some gems from 4th quarter of '08 include the lack of key Nirvana songs in their downloadable pack, the offering of songs from ''{{Nickelodeon}}'' TV programs, and the especially bile-tastic response to, * GASP* Country!
  267. ** And don't forget the 20 songs they released for free as DLC for buying Rock Band 2. That's right, 20 extra songs for free, and people complained.
  268. * The ''TeamFortress2'' fanbase is the closest one can get to NMA in terms of bitching about everything. The [[http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=80 official forum]] is constantly besieged by players deciding they know better than Valve how the game should be designed and what each class should receive as new weapons (which aren't supposed to be upgrades, just alternatives, anyway). This also includes suggesting new classes.
  269. ** Dear ''God'', the Scout update. The instant the update came out the fandom was split into people who that the Sandman was overpowered and the people who thought the Sandman was an excellent, well-balanced weapon. The argument eventually fell overwhelmingly to the former side, and Valve released an update that {{nerf}}ed the Sandman, which split the fandom ''three'' ways - those who think the new Sandman is perfect, those who think the new Sandman is stupid and should be scrapped entirely, and those who think the game has been RuinedFOREVER by removing such a perfect weapon.
  270. *** Don't forget the pyro: since ''TeamFortress'' Classic it was the cherry-tapper class: pre-pyro update you almost never saw one on a server. Post update... well. Now [[FanHater you're a noob for playing one.]]
  271. ** With each new (free) update, truckloads of topics about how much the update sucks get posted every day for weeks, and for each complaint topic, there's 2 topics telling everyone to stop complaining.
  272. ** The system about how new weapons are doled out was based on players getting X amount of Achievements for Y item. This resulted in people creating servers so they could basically LevelGrind for the items. As of the [=Spy/Sniper=] update, the new items are more or less random. Combined with [[http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2535 Valve being maddeningly vague]], and fans complained that they wanted to ''earn'' their new stuff.
  273. ** [[http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/3547/1237669770019.png This]] image perfectly sums up the level of unpleasability the [=TF2=] fanbase has achieved.[[spoiler:[[DontExplainTheJoke Note the contradictions in most of the "Improvements".]]]]
  274. ** Oh ''dear Tzeentch'', the Cheater's Lament. After Valve decided to act on the idling system after three months of not saying anything, they decided to remove all illegally-obtained items from player's backpacks. Those that took the "moral high ground" received a new hat for all the classes, a glowing halo called the Cheater's Lament. The fallout from this? There are Medics who don't heal anyone with a Halo, there are Medics who don't heal anyone ''without'' a Halo; servers will ban you if you have a Halo or others will hand out bans for ''not'' having one. Plus, the script for the account checker was so buggy that it would remove entire inventories at once. Thankfully, Valve did patch that. Steam Forums is the best place to see the mayhem.
  275. ** Initially, [[CompanionCube the Sandvich]] was near-universally considered a fun idea, but not a viable alternative to the shotgun. Many cried for a buff, and Valve listened. Now the situation is similar to that of the Sandman: one camp thinks it's perfect, one thinks it's still underpowered and the third thinks it's ''overpowered''.
  276. ** And now the Golden Wrench as a promo tool for the Engineer update caused similar complaints. With things like the system aparantly not being as random as first thought. Mass Crafting (Many crafting away there hats just for one golden wrench). And the fact that only 100 of them were given out.
  277. * ''ResidentEvil''. People complained the series was getting stale, because all of the previous "main" games occurred within the same few weeks with basically the same gameplay. In comes [=RE4=] with real-time graphics, drastically revamped gameplay, and no zombies. People complained that it wasn't a SurvivalHorror game anymore. [=RE5=] seems to be well on its way, what with people complaining it's even farther from the series survival horror roots, and some critics decrying it for not "innovating".
  278. ** The run-up to the release of ''Resident Evil: Outbreak'' was like this. Previews accentuated the idea that voice chat should be left out, because it would "ruin the experience". The game comes out, and what does every single person bitch about? "Why isn't there voice chat?"
  279. * ''GuiltyGear''. The first was quirky, but generally accepted as bad since the Instant Kill moves could be done without much risk. X got a lot of the inside community interested, but it broke down to how quickly Millia could kill you with her fast rushing moves and high-low games. Then XX came out, which got everyone crazy... until they figured out Eddie's ability to parallel attack easily was the bee's knees. XX has had three revisions - #Reload, Slash and Accent Core, with the [[StopHavingFunGuys fanbase]] divided down the line about all three. As it turns out, some people will argue that Eddie being broken was a GOOD thing and balance is actually bad. It doesn't make sense to me, either.
  280. * ''MetalGear Online.'' "The M14 is overpowered! No, wait, [=SMGs=] are! Survival sucks! Bwaaaa!"
  281. ** As long as we're on that series, there's the people who liked Raiden and want to see more of him, and the people who hated even his non-playable appearance in [=MGS4=]. Kojima Productions has announced he's getting his own game. [[InternetBackdraft Reactions were about as expected]]. at E3 that this new Metal Gear game would be released on the XBox 360, much to the displeasure of numerous PS3 fanboys.
  282. ** HideoKojima is best known for the ''MetalGear'' series. Some people think he should move on to a new IP. Since the start of MGS, he's released two ''{{Boktai}}'' and ''{{Zone of the Enders}}'' games, completely original [=IPs=], which caused other people to complain he should be working on the next ''MetalGear'' game.
  283. * Semi-averted in ''UrbanDead''... which actually ''lost'' a huge chunk of its fanbase when a massively unpopular (at least, for the humans) zombie buff appeared to increase zombie morale (Not really - there was a HUGE siege going on, involving almost every major group, and the creator, Kevan, made an update that allowed zombies to block attempts at securing a building with objects. Within a week, the attacks doubled.) Whole groups actually dropped out of the game, and still are - one of the most famous zombie groups just recently disbanded. However... checking most of the group's forums, and you see bitching about zombie accuracy, or bitching about zombie buffs more than human buffs.
  284. * The video game industry in general is frequently criticized for its portrayal of women; see {{Stripperiffic}} and its subtropes, MostCommonSuperpower, etc. Along comes ''[[MirrorsEdge Mirror's Edge]]'' with its protagonist Faith, who has a slim, athletic build suitable for her job, and clothing and appearance even more so. Shortly before the game's release, [[FanBoy someone]] [[http://kotaku.com/5062933/faith-from-mirrors-edge-fan+ designed-for-asian-tastes took a piece of publicity art and edited it]] so she looked younger, and-of course-gave her bigger boobs with the nipples poking through her top, to wide acclaim. Among the cheers was the claim that the previous version was ugly and "looked like Lucy Liu".
  285. * Ponder ''{{Killzone}} 2'', why don't we? After the [=E3=] video a few years back was admitted to be fake, Sony promised the game would look and play like the video. Fast forward a few years, and from the review scores, Sony seems to have delivered, serving out a solid, if not particularly original, game. The Sony {{fanboy}}s have been, naturally, crowing about all the positive reviews and flaming anything less than 9.0. One outlier [[http://g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/post/692992/Sesslers-Soapbox-Killzone-Mailbag.html took issue with XPlay's 5 out of 5 score]](video {{NSFW}}). Specifically, he said that the voiceover sounded "reluctant" to admit the game was worthy of full marks. You may boggle now.
  286. * Surprised that the ''GrandTheftAuto'' fanbase hasn't been mentioned yet. Go to GTAForums, and you'll find a fanbase that is not only unpleasable, but almost [[BrokenBase broken]]. One side feels that Rockstar shouldn't have abandoned the canon established in [[GrandTheftAutoIII GTA III]]; the other argues that the GTA III canon was already wrapped up, and that it was a smart move to reboot the franchise with [[GrandTheftAutoIV GTA IV]]. One side argues that the DarkerAndEdgier tone of GTA IV hurt it, and that it should go back to the lighter feel of past games; the other thinks that it did the game wonders. One side wants more character customization, sometimes to the point of being able to create your own character; the other feels that customization should be left alone. And nearly everybody complains that, multiplayer aside, GTA IV has less replay value than past games. The argument even goes beyond reactions to official announcements from Rockstar - on the "GTA Next" board, where the as-yet-unannounced next full-length entry in the series is discussed, people argue over where the next game should be set (should it follow the pattern of Liberty City, then Vice City, then San Andreas? Should it be in London? Detroit? Tokyo? Serbia?), what features it should have, and everything else you can think of. Talk about an unpleasable fanbase.
  287. * So, everyone was really upset with BioWare for only releasing one small DLC pack in for ''MassEffect'' in 2007 and then ignoring it, complaining that BioWare wasn't supporting their game. So BioWare finally announces new DLC (which in the past they had promised would be bridging the first game and its sequel) in the same announcement of the sequel's release timeframe...and the new complaint is that ''MassEffect'' is no longer relevant and they're wasting time when they should be programming the sequel. Even though announcements on other BioWare games before that one were met with still more complaints begging for more DLC.
  288. ** Mass Effect 2 is known for this. People complained about the MAKO in ME, then they complained that the MAKO was not in ME2. People complained about the inventory system in ME and people complain about the streamlined system. Worse, [[FanDumb you hear complainers cry that]] [[InsaneTrollLogic ''Mass Effect is ''NOT'' an RPG and ruins the definition of the RPG'']], despite that fans wanted these changes. I think it's offical that the Mass Effect fanbase is unreleasable because no matter what Bioware does, people still complain.
  289. *** They removed the MAKO, and the vehicle that was supposed to replace it was DummiedOut. The Firewalker, while quite fun to use, is only availible for use as a 1 hour long dlc. Anyone who likes vehicle combat, but disliked the MAKO, well, sucks to be you says bioware. The [[HyperspaceArsenal inventory system]] wasn't so much streamlied as removed. Weapon drops were disabled [[GameMod (for most)]] and you now have a shooter style weapon selection screen at the start. This is expected. The lead game designer, Christina Norman, said that she dropped all rpg aspects of combat, and decided to focus on making it a fps. GenreShift leads rpg fans pissed. YourMilageMayVary. This trooper hated it, and modded the bad things away, but it got such huge sales that clearly a lot of (different) people loved the changes.
  290. **** To the above troper, well though I have basically the opposite opinion to yours you can find many people who agree on the forums, and frankly what I would be angry at would be if Bioware followed half of the unpleasable morons on their forums. Not those like you that hate the game but admit that they can't do much about it, but those who rant on and on and on about how the game is awful and a kitten dies for every person who admits to liking Mass Effect 2. I abandoned the Bioware forum after about 2 months of reading about how every single product released after 2008 was a tool of Satan, and how Bioware have been bought out and are corporate tools. Harsh though it may be I advocate banning of duplicate threads and replies on every single forum discussing a game, movie or book if only to prevent idiots from screaming the same thing everywhere (seriously check the bioware forum, search for something concerning say Mass Effect 1 weapons and i guarantee that at least one reply will be bashing either the first or the second game usually followed by some troll or other), well I am stopping now since this is turning into an Author Tract.
  291. * Find any extended gameplay video for any highly- or moderately-anticipated upcoming game on a website like Joystiq, Kotaku, or Gametrailers. Watch the video, then check the comments. If the person playing did well, then the game looks too easy. If they did poorly, [[DoubleStandard then they're a terrible player]]. Either way, the people commenting are judging gameplay of something they won't get their hands on for months or more.
  292. * Even the ''prices'' of video games have unpleasable fanbases!!! So far, the Playstation3 is the ''only'' system in existence where people whine and demand price drops ''before the system was even RELEASED'' and continue to do so for years; then after it's dropped enough, people who already own it whine that they paid full price and wasted money for it. Unless it's the Playstation3, people who bought a system or even PC Parts before a price drop of any size and complained about them were always told "lol you noob you should have done the reading first!", "lol you missed your chance", and to "Cry more noob". Amazingly no one else whines about someone getting something like a Dreamcast for $35 when the people who got it when it was new paid around $200.
  293. * ''Left4Dead'' has an unpleasable fanbase as well. First, people wanted more maps/campaigns, new modes, more maps for VS mode, and new guns. When a recent update gave survival mode (plus a new map just for that mode), people then complained Valve was lazy by using the crescendo events in each level for survival mode. Then they also complained how some of the new maps in VS mode have invisible walls on rooftops, [[{{Nerf}} preventing Hunters from doing great damage from a big pounce]], and people are still whining about no new weapons. The fanbase completely ignores the problems that new guns could create for the entire game.
  294. ** Valve recently announced a sequel to ''Left4Dead''. It was announced to have more weapons, a different setting, and a more fleshed out story with new characters. Some people were happy, but most of the fanbase was not pleased. [[http://steamcommunity.com/groups/L4D2boycott At least 36,000 of 'em, in fact]]. The biggest complaints being that the original Left 4 Dead is not even a year old when the sequel was announced and the price for the new game is (supposedly) $60 instead of a lower price (the fans feel the sequel is more of an expansion pack). Not to mention that they're forgetting the notoriously long time Valve usually takes between sequels, as the people who are still waiting to even so much as hear some news that Half Life 2: Episode 3 is even so much as ''in development'' will tell you. Whether done as a joke to mock the angry fans or to show Valve support, there are also several Steam groups boycotting the boycotters of ''Left4Dead2''.
  295. ** Steam group leaders announced that Valve invited them to their headquarters to let them play test the game and addressed all their concerns for it and the original game. The boycott leaders were mostly satisfied. The only problem is that this announcement has split up the boycott group. Now people who still insist they won't buy the sequel are now calling the group leaders soft and easily bribed by Valve. Just recently, the group leaders have announced they are closing down the group, saying they accomplished what they came to do. Now there's even more whining, with people saying the boycott should go on or how the leaders are still sell outs.
  296. *** Speaking of which, the new Special Infected, the Charger got their attention too. Interesting to note that the Charger concept seems to be drawn from a forum post started by one user. New ideas and concepts were meshed in by the forum community, until the sequel was announced. There was an inkling of rejoice that said idea got into the game, before a FaceHeelTurn occurred and the one user wanted credit for the idea - this turned into displease over the sequel. The thread now serves as debating ground for Charger lovers and haters.
  297. **** The sequel has a slew of new complaints for everyone to sort through. A patch nerfed the Spitter's acid in elevators so that it fades faster. People natrually complained that they can't incap the survivors in a closed space anymore. Left 4 Dead 2 has a slew of new guns, but people still whine how there are no flamethrowers or knives to free yourself from Hunters or Smokers. The new DLC campaign called The Passing will have the Left 4 Dead 1 survivors helping the new survivors, but they are not playable and people whined about that and how that shot down their dreams of having an 8 vs 8 Versus mode. Versus mode itself is complained about by many people for making the scoring system scrubbed down (most of the points comes from distance travled) compared to Versus in the first game (where most of the points comes from just making it to the end).
  298. * NipponIchi has had problems with this recently. Listening to those clamoring for faster releases, they've attempted to cut down on the translation time, resulting in scattered spelling errors and some very unfortunate {{Game Breaking Bug}}s. The recent announcement that ''PhantomBrave'''s UpdatedRerelease will only have an English voice track instead of including both tracks has drawn plenty of scorn and accusations of them cutting corners and 'selling out'.
  299. * Ubisoft has earned plenty of gamer ire for releasing shovelware on the DS and Wii. This makes everything they do screwed. The early previews for ''SplinterCell Conviction'' had Sam, on the run, looking like a hobo. People complained. A recent trailer has shown him clean-shaven, with shorter hair. People complained they wanted him looking like a hobo.
  300. * There are normally two reactions to ''StarWars [[KnightsOfTheOldRepublic The Old Republic]]'', an {{MMORPG}} being made by {{BioWare}} [who made also made ''[=KotOR=] 1'']:
  301. ** #1- SWEET! BioWare is making a ''StarWars'' MMO that will [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_Galaxies not suck for once]]! Yay!
  303. *** Some people also split the difference.
  304. *** It doesn't stop there. BioWare has recently released news that not only will players be able to play as species like the Sith Purebloods, which have never, ''ever'' been explored before, but the Miraluka as well. Yes, ''those'' [[KnightsOfTheOldRepublic Miraluka]]. And now people are bitching because BioWare didn't say they could play as ridiculous things like Hutts and Yoda's species.
  305. * LucasArts became rather reviled in recent years for abandoning all of their old, beloved adventure game [=IPs=], letting them go out of print, canceling all developed projects, and preventing others from doing anything with them. All the while, gamers complained about how they were now doing nothing but Star Wars games. So, fast forward to July 2009, when they finally decide to stop jerking around and actually do ''exactly'' what the fans begged for - make new games based on the old [=IPs=], remake one of them, plan for more, and announce plans to finally re-release their old, out of print titles on Steam. If you think the fans were happy, you have not read this page. No, what was the new complaint? "How dare they! They should be making new ''StarWars'' games!" This has continued into every single non-''StarWars'' announcement since.
  306. * Similar to ''{{Diablo}} 3'', when it was announced that ''SeriousSam III'' was going to be more gritty, fans opinions separated to the point that their vision about which point of SlidingScaleOfShinyVersusGritty should ''SeriousSam III'' settle.
  307. * ''BackyardSports'' has gradually lost its fandom by making bad moves, such as discontinuing online play and removing beloved characters.
  308. * The ''Warriors'' fanbase in general. One example is when ''DynastyWarriors 6'' came out, many complained about several characters having identical movesets/weapons, and for a good reason. Then comes the PS2 version of the same game which gave several characters new, unique movesets... and people complained that Ma Chao went from a spear user to a {{BFS}} user. As for ''SamuraiWarriors'', when ''SamuraiWarriors 3'' was announced as a Wii exclusive, people started complaining for no apparent reason that is was on the Wii ''before screenshots of the game even came out''.
  309. * "TheSims 3" has a particularly unpleasable fanbase, mainly centering around allegedly {{Game Breaking Bug}}s. The main offenders tend to be: The sims are doughy and unrealistic, The sims are FAR more realistic than the ones in the prequel, There isn't enough stuff in the basegame, There's actually MORE stuff in the basegame by comparison to the other games, There should be MORE in the game because half of it's in the Store to milk our money, The Store is, indeed, evil, The creators need pay somewhere so the store is a little justified, Story Progression and traits are awesome!, Traits are bland and Story Progression sucks! -- to name a glaring few. The only thing people seem able to agree on at all is the fact that EA dropped the ball somewhere in making this game.
  310. * Most PC games are pirated at a rate estimated to be upwards of over 50%. Whenever a developer complains about piracy, there are one of three responses. If the game sold well, piracy apologists will say that the devs have lots of money anyway. If it was mediocre to poor, they'll say the devs don't deserve their money in the first place. If a critically acclaimed game sells terribly, the pirates are suddenly nowhere to be found. The ones that do stick around say that the pirates probably wouldn't have bought the game in the first place.
  311. ** Let's not forget other forms of pirates...Whenever people complain about not having their console or PC repaired because they violated the terms of service, either the complainers are idiots who should have read the Terms of Service (which they ''should have'' done in the ''first place''), or the developers are being draconian. Whenever an MMORPG company shuts down private servers violating the Terms of Service, bans people for using mods (Specifically ones that are considered exploits or cheats), or bans botters, the developers are either being unfair or the fans are just idiots who deserved to be banned.
  312. * ''{{Call of Duty}}: ModernWarfare'' was a critically acclaimed game with a few {{Wham Episode}}s. The sequel was accused by some disgruntled fans of making plot coherence secondary to maximizing the amount of {{HSQ}} and {{Wham Episode}}s. In other words, fans complained the developer tried(and arguably failed) to make the game ''too awesome''.
  313. ** There's also a lot of TheyChangedItNowItSucks ''and'' ItIsTheSameNowItSucks, for the textbook definition of this trope.
  314. *** And let us not forget the constant bitching from the multiplayer crowd. "Oh God the online sucks because Javelin glitch!" They fix it and suspend people who do it. "Oh God the online sucks because Ranked Private Matches and instant 10th prestige and hyper-chipmunk-speed!" They patch up the servers. "Oh God the online sucks because Model 1887s have the range of [=SMGs=] when Akimbo is on them!" They fix that. "Oh God the online sucks because oops you forgot to fix it when it has Bling with FMJ on it!" They fix it again. "Oh God the online sucks because infinite Care Packages and Emergency Airdrops!" They make it so you can't use the D-Pad when you vault onto a ledge. "Oh God the online sucks because all this enjoyable shit is gone I'm going to noobtube people now and spam grenades and rockets WAAAAH!" '''Goddamn.'''
  315. *** Anyone remembers that before the game was released, Infinity Ward asked fans to send suggestions about what they'd like to see in ''ModernWarfare 2''? No? There's nothing like reading a few dozen comments begging for an AC-130 killstreak on an article eight months before the release, only to see everyone complaining about it later and calling Infinity Ward the worst developers ever, nevermind that they made three universally acclaimed games before ''ModernWarfare 2''.
  316. ** Some fans complained that [=MW2=] was effectively an extended MissionPackSequel. Fair enough. Once the multiplayer teaser for ''CallOfDuty: Black Ops'' was released, showcasing such new toys such as ballistic knives, exploding RC cars and dynamite crossbows, fans immediately started to complain that the game looked "gimmicky".
  317. * The LegoCrossoverGames have this going sometimes, when one of the games was released, some people didn't like it because "The style is getting repetitive, we need something new", when Lego Indiana Jones 2 was released, establishing the problems (such as the Co-Op) and doing something new... Some reviewers bashed it, saying they wanted it to go back to the old system, for kind of an example, go to IGN.
  318. * DownloadableContent, full stop. Many people see it as simply a way for the developer to extract money from the players beyond the initial purchase. Many see it as extending the worth of a game. People [[Left4Dead will complain bitterly about a game being "unfinished" if there's any DLC at all; regardless of the length of the original game, and they will complain if they feel they're not getting enough]]. Remember, ''all'' DLC are ''entirely optional purchases''. [[InternetBackdraft Do not hang around if it turns out that the content was on the disc in the first place]].
  319. ** Occasionally you'll hear fans that complain about the lack of DLC if the company has no plans to release any, or very little. Yet you still hear fans still complaining if they decide to make DLC by popular demand later on for the current game and/or in the sequel. Mass Effect is an example to this. The first game only had two DLC packs; one was released just before the sequel came out, and fans complained that Bioware didn't offer more. The second game gave fans plenty of DLC, both paid and for free (although the free required a code included on new copies or for $15), but the fans still complained that Bioware was trying to milk gamers.
  320. * ''SimCity'', especially past 3000 and 4, have spawned an enormous UnpleasableFanbase towards Maxis and Will Wright. Indeed, ''Societies'' was a bit easier and removed a lot of features (such as railways and zoning), but had you gone to a forum for [=SC4=], you'll see many a [[StopHavingFunGuys skilled player]] complaining how pointless railroads are and how it's better to "plop" your buildings instead of zoning things out.
  321. ** It's a real nightmare more so for those who want to create and mod custom content into the game though. If you do something actually creative, you get attacked for being an idiot and not knowing anything about realism, and if you do something that resembles what Maxis would have done, you get attacked for being a lame copycat.
  322. * GameplayAndStorySegregation. You just ''know'' that if [[ChronoTrigger Frog was eternally strong enough to cleave mountains in half with a sword mid-game]] that people would complain that the game is ''far too easy'' when he hits enemies for 9999 damage when other characters are dealing 1-200; or how characters who [[ResidentEvil can't use firearms in cutscenes]] likewise stumble with them in gameplay that the game would be [[FakeDifficulty needlessly hard]].
  323. ** The Masumune isn't noted to be especially good at cutting enemies, on great at opening barriers. It later removes a bosses invulnerability shield. And lots of people have requested that resident evil does the opposite and makes them good with guns in cutscenes. What you're talking about is called SilentHill.
  324. * The ''MegaMan'' series has this in spades, people complained about the Charge Shot and Slide in the games, claiming that they made the games "Too Easy", but when they weren't put in ''9'', people complained that they didn't have the charge shot, later these features were applied to Protoman, didn't stop the fandom from complaining. There was also a lot of people complaining that the game's best days were the 8-Bit ones, but when it was announced ''9'' was in {{Retraux}}, others started complaining that they weren't using Next Generation graphics. And then there's the whole "Ending" thing, most of the games have not ended and probably won't for a while, and when they do, you can expect to see people complain.
  325. * ''{{Elemental War of Magic}}'' already has some elements of this in the beta discussions, mainly along the lines of "too simple" vs. "Too complex". There were several forum threads, for example, of whether the game should have separate magic damage types (Fire, Lightning, Ice, etc.) with some arguments about the entire game being dumbed down if these types weren't included. Fortunately this is a more extreme example.
  326. * ''[[AceAttorney Miles Edgeworth: Ace Attorney Investigations]]'' had recieved some flack for either being [[ItsTheSameNowItSucks too similar to Phoenix Wright's games]] or [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks not being the same at all.]] Then you have the fans who whine how there should have been a playable trial in the game. Bonus points if they suggest to be able to play as Edgeworth going against Phoenix in court.
  327. * [[TheLordOfTheRingsOnline LOTRO]] has had this with every update. Originally, they released a 24-man raid. But the relatively small community meant that getting 24 people together was extremely difficult, so they released a 12-man raid. That was too easy, dumbing down the game. Except for all the people who could never get into the 12-man raid because it took several hours to complete. So, in the expansion, they broke the next raid up into several six-man instances with a one-boss raid at the end. This made things too easy. Only some of the six-mans were too hard, and the gear from raids was too powerful and we needed to go back to the pre-expansion days, when "raid" gear was only slightly better than crafted gear. So they took out the % damage boosts and made it easier to get raid gear - which made the raid gear "pointless" unless you were raiding, as it was used to "gate" the bosses (without sufficient raid gear, you spent most of your time cowering, unable to fight). Oh, and it made getting raid gear a grind. Oh, and the one-boss raids are stupid. So they released a three-boss raid, which was too easy. Or too hard, depending on which class forum you read. Also, Turbine never listens to the fanbase, so they started a weekly "Tell the Devs" thread, which is now the source of flames because ZOMG nothing we say is ever immediately implemented!!!! There's a million others (tank classes are useless/why are they forcing us to use tanks now?, crafting is useless/why did they make crafting so overpowered?, we need more things to do outside of combat/god fishing is the most boring thing ever). And don't even mention the lore debate, Legendary Weapons, goats, or Soliloquy of Spirit. All are flamebait.
  328. * There is no game "fanbase" - ''none whatsoever'' - that can even be compared to {{Runescape}}'s when it comes to this. Forget what was said about being unable to please everyone: As far as the forum is concerned, this could easily be changed to "''It's not possible to please'' '''''anyone'''''". Ever since they made the bold effort to remove gold-selling by implementing trade limitations and removing free PVP, every single update has incited ire from so many people that it's unknown why the creators have not just said [[CreatorBreakdown "You know what, screw it. You tell us what's good for you guys, and we'll do it, regardless of whether it destroys the company or not."]] by now. Case in point: a new quest that's been a year in the making (the Fairy Tale questline for those in the know) - There was constant hostility on the forums about it all this time...[[SarcasmMode But surely they would appreciate the update when it came out, right?]]
  329. * ''[[{{Godzilla}} Godzilla: Unleashed]]'' had fans complaining on all sides ever since it was first announced with some complaining that it'll never be as good as ''Save The Earth'' and others growing increasingly excited over its release.
  330. ** People complained over the lack of monsters in the previous game (''Save The Earth''). So, what does Atari/Pipeworks do? Add new monsters and create two original ones (IE: Obsidious and Krystalak). What do the fans do next? Complain that there's STILL not enough monsters, complain that Obsidious and Krystalak are [[ReplacementScrappy poor replacements]] for classic Toho monsters, and then complain that ''their'' favorite monsters were not used.
  331. *** Fans complained about Battra not being playable in ''Save The Earth''. When he was included in the PS2 version of ''Unleashed'', fans...complained that he was a [[PaletteSwap "clone" of Mothra]].
  332. *** To be fair, these guys seem to be concentrated on the forums. The reviews for Godzilla: Unleashed on gaming sites range from high 7s to low 8s (which is pretty much double of the average mainstream critic reviews).
  333. * The '''[[NoExportForYou European]]''' PlaystationNetwork. With the [[{{Understatement}} quite poor]] "line-up" of [[PSOne PSOne Classics]], Sony's European branch (SCEE) is basically ''creating its own'' UnpleasableFanbase. Let's just say that if you're an American user, browsing our European store is a CrowningMomentOfFunny. Yes, you're free to laugh at us (exceptions: CrashBandicoot, KulaWorld, MetalGearSolid, FinalFantasy, {{Rayman}}, {{Tekken}} - [[NotSoFastBucko currently only the second]] - {{Medievil}} and the [[SarcasmMode so needed]] Disney licensed games; the rest is about 90% [[{{Understatement}} rather obscure]] games). And the Playstation Blog, as far as I know (Italian user), every week discussing the update results in either [[WallBanger enraged]] comments, [[FacePalm simply indifferent]] comments or in comments [[FlameWar that defend SCEE in every possible way]]. And the only few times there has been a CueCullen moment, it was because of [[FinalFantasyVII oh]]-[[FinalFantasyVIII guess]]-[[FinalFantasyIX who]]. The situation can be basically summed up with what, as for today (11th of August, 2010), a user said in the Italian blog: ''"But then... I ask myself: if Sony [[DigitalPiracyIsEvil doesn't want us to buy stuff on other Stores]], [[FridgeLogic why doesn't it try to make the European store as filled-with-contents as the other two are?]] The day before yesterday I was browsing the American store [[SuspiciouslySpecificDenial (without buying anything, mind you)]] and I was almost on the verge of TearsOfJoy when I saw how long their PSOne Classics page is."''.Need I say more?
  335. [[/folder]]
  337. [[folder:Blizzard Entertainment]]
  338. * Fans spent the better part of a decade crying to Blizzard to make ''{{Diablo}} 3''. It's announced, video and screenshots are shown, and fans complain that it looks too colorful. [[http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2008/8/6/ Some went as far as photoshopping the screenshots back to brown.]] Some compared it to "WoW gayness". [[http://multiplayerblog.mtv.com/2008/08/04/diablo-iii-designer-turns-tables/ Blizzard's response was entertaining.]]
  339. ** If you thought that was funny, check out the [[http://www.boothenet.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/d3rainbowlogo.jpg logo the lead designer wore on his t-shirt]] at the following Blizzcon.
  340. * ''{{World of Warcraft}}'' forums are full of people complaining about a class being too weak or too strong, especially after the latest efforts of Blizzard to balance things. And don't think more than two people will be able to appreciate added content. For the rest, it will either be repetitive or out of their focus.
  341. ** That's not even getting into the massive arguments that Blizzard is "obviously" biased towards one of the two factions. Interestingly (but unsurprisingly) enough, the Alliance players think that Blizzard favors the Horde, and Horde players think Blizzard favors the Alliance.
  342. ** Before the release of the second expansion pack, the developers made little to no attempt to balance the Paladin or Shaman classes so that they would be able to serve any function that the other can in a [=PvE=] or [=PvP=] situation. But in [=PvE=], they ultimately wound up to be treated as healers when they were in fact supposed to do whatever, as were Druids, who were most specced towards healing since for a little while, that was the only feasible build. Everyone who played the Druid, Paladin, and shaman classes screamed loud and hard because they were advertised as a jack-of-all-master-of-none class in theory when in practice they were little more than a healing and support character, while the priests, who were dedicated healers, were often ''encouraged'' to spec Shadow for an offensive build.
  343. ** When ''Burning Crusade'' was released and the Horde got their paladins and the Alliance got their shamans, more people were complaining that they took the lazy way out instead of balancing the classes.
  344. ** When Druids and paladins were finally fixed so they ''could'' function as tanks, healers, or Damage-dealers if they were specialized (And geared) to do so, they wound up becoming perceived as too powerful and then the tanks, damage-dealers and healers complained that they were never even needed. This happens to come after thousands of complaints from warriors wanting to be damage-dealers being "Forced into tanking".
  345. ** [=PvP=] gear has apparently been killing the game...Nobody seems to remember how back in 2005, everyone was complaining about how the ''lack of'' dedicated [=PvP=] gear was destroying the game, especially since damage-dealing classes could wear their gear made for [=PvE=] into battlegrounds and utterly dominate everyone stuck trying to get [=PvP=] gear ''by actually doing [=PvP=]''.
  346. ** Apparently, more uniform sets that don't require one to keep as many sets of gear in their inventory is ruining the game - whereas extremely gear-dependent classes like Druids, Warriors, and Paladins were popping Champagne and launching fireworks.
  347. ** Then there are the complaints about the playable characters' appearances. The tauren and troll females, as well as the blood elf male, were all altered before the release of the game (or, in blood elf male's case, the ''Burning Crusade'' expansion). Apparently The Troll and Tauren females did not look attractive enough and the blood elf male looked too waifish. Of course, there are those who bemoan the changes and complain that the Troll and Tauren now look too human and not enough like their male counterparts, and that the blood elves, being [[strike:drug]] magic addicts, are more realistic as thin. Never mind that the model change for blood elves was mostly done for technical reasons because of skeleton bugs with the old model, and they ''still'' have the thinnest, most effeminate men in the game even after the bulk-up.
  348. ** The next round began with the second expansion, ''Wrath of the Lich King'', going into the beta stage. The developers are changing their design towards more uniform classes that don't require as many different kinds of equipment and are viable in any situation, but of course everyone who plays one of the popular classes in raids or [=PvP=] is up in arms about that, despite many extremely gear-dependent classes like Warriors, Shamans, and Druids were popping champagne and launching fireworks in celebration after it was announced.
  349. ** Speaking of raids, the minority that raids the big stuff is outraged at the notion of having 10 man versions for every raid, even though Blizzard was quick to assure that the 25 man versions are still going to have better and more loot. And the tanks are upset about the idea of another tank class even though most servers have a severe lack of tanks (to the point where tanks still can almost instantly queue for a dungeon), and tanking classes have been complaining since the start about being "Forced into tanking".
  350. ** The UI also gets this too. The UI was really not the best at the start, and it was incredibly easy to mod. (Modding was seen as a SureWhyNot.) But after every patch...the beloved UI mods would be made useless. And not after every major content patch...even small emergency patches meant to fix the occasional GameBreakingBug would render UI mods useless for a couple days. Considering most mods would ''drastically'' modify UIs, Blizzard decided to incorporate some features from popular mods (That were also considered "Required" if you wanted to raid or [=PvP=]) into their default UI. Then some people in support of mods cried that Blizzard hates mods (Despite the fact that this allowed modders to be more specific or to customize them even more) even when they do not mind you modding the game and the only mods they have actually cracked down on were borderline bots in the first place and gave people an unfair advantage over people without the mod. The biggest example of crying was from when they cracked down on Decursive and declared it an exploit. The mod Decursive would find a debuff on another player, and if the player who used it could remove it, removes it without even having to target them. It literally trivialized fights to debuff-removing characters to just hitting one button over and over again. People actually ''complained'' that because of Decursive, ItsEasySoItSucks. But then they ''remove'' decursive, a fanbase that continues to cry that ItsEasySoItSucks complained ''that it made the game too hard!''
  351. ** Hell, even the storyline is subject to this. For instance, since ''WarcraftIII'', the [[OurOrcsAreDifferent Horde]] has been ''ChaoticNeutral'' by nature instead of being [[AlwaysChaoticEvil totally evil]], with some [[NobleDemon individuals]] who actually have a good sense of morality such as Thrall, Saurfang, and Cairne as some of their leaders. One of their major objectives is to not invoke any further conflicts with TheAlliance. This was likely done because the Horde in the first two games weren't generally that interesting save for the hilarious gaglines most of the units had. Since then, there has been a small group of individuals who complain about how because the Horde is now a bit LighterAndSofter... [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks they aren't "awesome" anymore]], when really they made the Horde into something a bit more complex than the stereotypical [[BeautyEqualsGoodness Ugly Savage Guys = Evil]] archetype that's already too common in modern fiction. And that's just one of the more tame complaints, leaving out the story from the recent ''Wrath of the Lich King'' expansion and the numerous examples of {{retcon}}ning.
  352. ** You know an MMORPG is balanced when every character class is screaming that every other character class needs to be nerfed.
  353. *** And in the third expansion Blizzard announced that they were going to focus on the old world...ever since the first expansion pack was released, people whined and complained about how it received such a piss-poor treatment with the only new content being for levels 1-20 on both sides. (only once has there been an instance that wasn't made for high-levels made, and that was years ago when people actually did them.) Now instantly everyone complains about having to retread old ground despite the fact that so many changes will be made it'd feel rather different. Then they even announced that Shadowfang Keep and The Deadmines will be given a heroic revamp, and boss fights like Ragnaros and Nefarian, who the raiders complained were made worthless and trivialized by the expansion were also going to be revamped for the level 85 cap. Then the FanDumb whined about how Blizzard has no creativity by reusing old content and "Revamping dungeons that don't need to be revamped". Yes, they're revamping the ''two most loved instances in the bloody GAME'' that ''to this day'' are still praised on the forums. Revamping dungeons that don't need it would be if Blizzard had chosen such [[ThatOneLevel Scrappy levels]] as Uldaman or Gnomeregan, which even the ''developers'' admit they screwed up with.
  354. **** Gnomeregan is going to be retaken by the Gnomes come a later patch before Cataclysm comes out and will be their central city in Cataclysm. The same is happening with the Trolls and Echo Isles for the Horde. Already there are players crying about the loss of one of the most boring and hated old-world instances in the game.
  355. ***** [[spoiler:Apparently, the instance is still in the game, since the gnomes only liberate the parts up to the instance portal]].
  356. ** Apparently, the new cross-server instances are killing the game, when those of us who were stuck trying to find groups to do simple heroics or even normals on wasteland servers where everyone wants to instead do 10-mans and 25-mans are thanking Blizzard for the early Christmas present or saying stuff like "About freaking time!", because finding groups for lower-level dungeons is a nightmare.
  357. ** There was one poster at the WoW forums who summed up the fans' attitude very neatly in this signature:
  358. ->More content = more whining.
  359. ->Less content = more whining.
  360. ->Static content = more whining.
  361. * ''{{Starcraft}} II'' is another nasty example of this trope. The biggest points of contention are the changes to the UI which include: allowing players to select more than 12 units at a time, being able to select more than one building at a time, and allowing workers to automatically gather minerals after being built when the player sets a rally point to it. These changes have caused enormous amount of arguing between the hardcore players who believe these changes are ruining the "macromanagement", or economical, portion of the game, and casual players who believe these UI changes are beneficial and should be included without question.
  362. ** The UI debatealso caused even more fighting about the whole concept of macromanagement in general from those who believe that base/economy management is essential to a Real-Time Strategy game, and those who believe that those aspects of the game are "boring" and should focus more on the army fighting instead.Blizzard has attempted to placate both crowds by keeping the UI changes in the game, but implementing "macro mechanics" that boost resource gain when utilized. This has simmered down the UI debate mostly, but debates still continue to spring up from both sides of the debate who accuse Blizzard of "caving in" to the opposing crowd.
  363. ** Yet another hot-button issue was the decision to release ''{{Starcraft}} II'' as a trilogy, where each part has one large campaign dedicated to one race instead of three small campaigns dedicated to each race. Blizzard's reasoning is that the trilogy allows them to greatly enhance the game's storytelling quality by allowing them to add in much more content, characters, and lore for each race without having to squeeze it all into a tiny 10-mission campaign. The fanbase is split as to whether this is an improvement in single-player RTS quality or a money grab.
  364. ** Now that the beta has been released, some critics are complaining [[{{ptitlezx89c5u5txaj}} it's too much like the original]]. For those of you who don't get it, the original ''{{Starcraft}}'' is frequently held up as [[SoCoolItsAwesome the perfect RTS]]. It's not clear what changes the critics were expecting for the sequel. Perhaps they thought the game would come with a kitten n' lollipop dispenser?
  366. [[/folder]]
  368. [[folder:Nintendo]]
  369. * Everyone complains about how Nintendo is just milking the same franchises over and over again, and how they claim that they and other second-parties need to come up with new franchises - except for some odd reason, ''nobody notices them when they are announced''. Nintendo can run an entire E3 lineup with only ''one'' Mario game, and all sorts of second-and-third party exclusives that are ''entirely'' new franchises, and the fans will fixate exclusively on the Mario game and ignore ''all'' the new franchises.
  370. ** Amusingly, Nintendo has either developed or published a total of ''Twenty Five'' new Intellectual Properties in the past ''six years''. Yet if you ask anyone about stuff like ''EndlessOcean'' or ''HotelDusk'', they'll probably give you a blank stare and continue saying "WE WANT MORE FRANCHISES!!" Even if they publish an old IP, people ignore this too. (''{{Glory of Heracles}}'', anyone?)
  371. * The ''[[SuperMarioBros Mario]]'' fanbase is no better. During the days of ''SuperMario64'', the base was divided up by people who loved the new 3D gameplay and people who hated it and insisted 2D was better. ''SuperMarioSunshine'' was bashed for not living up to the standards of ''SuperMario64'', complained about the "gimmicky" water pack, and whined that some parts of the game were simply too hard. Speed up to ''SuperMarioGalaxy'' and the fanbase now complains that it's way too easy to get to the final boss after collecting 60 stars, despite the fact that the game has several challenges that can almost be considered NintendoHard. Oh, and when ''New SuperMarioBros'' was released to appeal to the old school 2D fans, but some thought the game was too easy and [[PowerupLetdown the new power-ups were useless or gimmicky]]. Some of the Mario fans even go so far as to loathe the spin offs like ''MarioKart'' for being a milking machine, even though most reviews agree that the spin offs are pretty good. Poor Mario simply can't please everyone.
  372. ** Bowser's "Koopaling" children have gotten their own UnpleasableFanbase. In Nintendo's early days, they only appeared twice; once each in ''SuperMarioBros 3'' and once each in ''SuperMarioWorld''. They pulled a ''{{Metroid}}'' and simply disappeared for several years, leaving fans confused. When ''SuperMarioSunshine'' revealed Bowser Jr. as Bowser's new kid, fans cried foul and wanted their precious Koopa children back. There was an attempt to placate this part of the base when ''Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga'' brought the Koopalings back as [[GiantSpaceFleaFromNowhere bosses with no lines or role in the game]].
  373. *** Now that the Koopalings are coming back alongside Bowser Jr. for ''New Super Mario Bros. Wii'', fans are complaining about having two Toads acting as players three and four as opposed to <insert character(s) here>.
  374. *** Made worse when Miyamoto gave a response (though it could be just a joke) on why Princess Peach isn't playable in the game. Fans were naturally not happy.
  375. * Speaking of ''MarioKart'', don't even mention Snaking to ''Mario Kart'' Fans ever. Some say it's the only true test of skill, and others say it's just a cheap GameBreaker.
  376. * ''[[TheLegendOfZelda Zelda]]'' fans often suffers from this trope, it's really quite funny to see fans' hatred of the last Zelda game (currently ''WindWaker'') be replaced by their hatred of the newest game (now ''TwilightPrincess''). So it goes on, when the next ''Zelda'' game comes out a load of people will be "disappointed" and suddenly ''TwilightPrincess'' wasn't bad at all...and then it will have to deal with ''{{Ocarina of Time}}''. ''ToughActToFollow''.
  377. ** After ''Wind Waker'' was released, many articles were written suggesting that all the playing with the formula was bad and that Nintendo shouldn't muck about with three-day time limits or oceans - most articles requesting a game like ''{{Ocarina of Time}}''. When that game did come in the form of ''TwilightPrincess'', the same people asserted that the Zelda formula was "played out" and that Nintendo ought to try new things with the franchise instead of sticking to the old stuff.
  378. ** A recent trend/fad has surfaced for people to decry ''{{Ocarina of Time}}'' as "bland, overrated, and generally not good" now that ''TwilightPrincess'' is released, while singing the never-ending praises of ''[[MajorasMask Majora's Mask]]''. This from the same groups who lauded ''Ocarina'' as perfect and untarnishable during ''TheWindWaker''-era, stating that ''[[MajorasMask Majora's Mask]]'' was "too different; too short; hard to play" etc. The flip-flopping is headache inducing.
  379. *** ''{{Ocarina of Time}}'' and ''[[MajorasMask Majora's Mask]]'' use ''the same game engine.'' Liking one over another is fine, but saying one is good and the other is bad...generally doesn't make much sense given their intense similarities.
  380. *** When ''TwilightPrincess'' was in development, Nintendo was inundated by complaints about an apparent lack of Ganon. Interviews constantly asked for his presence, and the fans decried that the serious tone of ''Twilight Princess'' deserved to have Ganon appear in the game and that leaving him out would make for an empty experiences. Nintendo only mentioned that he would be in the game, but never released any screens featuring him, leading many to accuse them of lying about his presence. When the game came out and Ganon was TheManBehindTheMan...the complaints changed to accusing Nintendo of being too cliché and complaining that they should have left Ganon out and focused a new villain instead, declaring the plot having been HijackedByGanon in their rage.
  381. ** Now that ''[[TheLegendOfZeldaSkywardSword Skyward Sword]]'' has been revealed in all of its splendor, ''[[HistoryRepeats sure enough]]'', there are people who are complaining about the art style--now that it's "simply an unintelligible puddle of the ''The Wind Waker'' style '''and''' the ''Twilight Princess'' style." Basically, the only way they would stop complaining would be if it looked like ''Ocarina of Time''. [[FailureIsTheOnlyOption Nintendo simply cannot win, can they]]?!
  382. *** That wouldn't work. ''Twilight Princess'' looked quite a bit like ''Ocarina of Time'' in its graphical style, and people just found other things to whine about.
  383. ** And it just doesn't stop there. The upcoming Ocarina of Time remake for the 3DS is also receiving crap for reportedly having the Water Temple fixed so that it will not be the ScrappyLevel it was years ago, and dumbing down the game. Of course, being a remake, it's a given that they will complain about it not being a new game.
  384. ** The unpleasability of the Zelda FanDumb is humorously (and accurately) portrayed in [[http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i320/therewster1996/The_Fanbase_of_Zelda_by_darknartura.png this illustration]].
  385. * The Virtual Console service from Nintendo's Wii has also sparked an UnpleasableFanbase, mostly within {{GameFAQs}}. Every week when the games are announced, the fans are divided into the following:
  386. *** "Oh wow, I loved that game!"
  387. *** "OMG THIS GAME SUCKS!! I DON'T CARE IF IT HAS TOO MANY [[ExiledFromContinuity LICENSING ISSUES!!]] I WANT ''[[EarthBound EARTHBOUND]]''!"
  388. *** "Ugh, more shovelware? Another crappy week."
  389. *** "Pfft, I could get those games on a collection disc."
  390. *** "Five bucks for an NES game?! Bulltonk!"
  391. *** "Just get the ROM!"
  392. *** "Man, Xbox Live has it and better."
  393. *** "[[ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontWatch I've never heard of this game, therefore it sucks]]."
  394. *** "Where's my ''[[WorldOfMana Secret of Mana]]'', N.O.E.? Don't [[NoExportForYou screw me over]], dood."
  395. * Some people complained that ''[[AnimalCrossing Animal Crossing: City Folk]]'' for the Wii lacks the NES games that the GameCube version had, despite the above-mentioned Virtual Console allowing people to buy NES games.
  396. ** What about Wild World, that didn't have NES games, and people didn't complain then.
  397. * The ''FireEmblem'' fandom tends to be a YourMileageMayVary series in itself, but one of the most glaring examples of unpleasable fanbase happened between ''Path of Radiance'' and ''Radiant Dawn''. A large number of the fans complained that Path of Radiance was ridiculously easy (it doesn't help that the series is infamous for its violent arguments over CharacterTiers). So when the sequel was made more difficult, just as many fans came back and complained it was too hard.
  398. * For that matter, remake ''any'' video game and you're guaranteed to have people complain that the game doesn't stay true to the original while other people love the said remake. Hell, remake any level or port a level over (such as in ''MarioKart Wii'' or ''SuperSmashBros Brawl'') and you'll get people who hate the levels themselves or liked it in the past and now claim it sucks.
  399. * Speaking of ''SuperSmashBros.'', ever since the Japanese release, various forums were inundated with complaints about the roster, mostly due to such complaints as many characters not being playable, [[{{ptitlei015gc004kw4}} Mewtwo]] not being in the game despite Lucario attempting to be [[{{Expy}} a refinement of his movelist]], and most vehemently, three characters from ''StarFox'' with essentially the same special moves, including "identical" [[LimitBreak Final Smashes]].
  400. ** Since both "casual" and "professional" players play this series, there are two equally large groups of people who have opposite opinions of what the series should be like.
  401. *** Some people are complaining that it's not different enough from ''Melee'', the stages are too gimmicky (earlier there was a complaint to the effect that the stages all looked like they were going to be dull Battlefield retreads), etc.
  402. *** Others are complaining that it's not ''Melee'' enough with the removal of Wavedashing and L-Cancelling, among other things.
  403. *** Hilariously, some people claim Brawl is what fractured the Super Smash Bros fan base. That fanbase has always been broken, it just got bigger and more noticable with each new instalment.
  404. *** It only goes down from here. People have actually [[http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=199260 hacked the game and changed the physics to make it be like Melee again]].
  405. * ''[[{{ptitlei015gc004kw4}} Pokémon]]'' has several examples of these in nearly every facet. In the anime, people complain about how characters are [[FlatCharacter too dull]] or [[SpotlightStealingSquad overshowcased]], while some still complain about other characters [[OutOfFocus being dumped]] or [[DemotedToExtra left out altogether]]. In the games, people complained that there were too many new Pokémon and were unable to enjoy their old favourites, now they introduced new evolutions and people greatly dislike them. Another example could be in ''Pokémon Colosseum''. People wanted a Pokémon RPG on the console and they wanted it to be {{Darker and Edgier}}, they got it in ''Pokémon Colosseum'', but then fans complained that it wasn't like the original games. Case in point - many fans think double battles are pretty lame in general, so making a game featuring ''nothing but'' was a pretty bad move; others love doubles battles, because it forces players to think of a different paradigm for building teams, as some moves become more useful and some become much less so.
  406. ** To say nothing of the main games themselves. There was almost constant outcry prior to the release of Diamond and Pearl in Japan about just about every piece of information found about the games. This ranged from "''Pokémon X'' Sucks!" to "Physical/special move split?! ''Pokémon'' is RuinedFOREVER!" When the games came out, things quieted down. But you still get people complaining that Game Freak is running out of ideas for new Pokémon.
  407. *** When [[strike:Kotone]] Lyra came into the picture the fanbase broke into four groups. People that like her, and people that don't. People that think she is "Kris" and people [[ReplacementScrappy who don't.]]
  408. ** And of course, "I want different Pokémon games! ItsTheSameSoItSucks!" and "They should make a sequel" cries of how similar most Pokémon games are (Especially by non-fans or people who abandoned it at Red, Blue, and Yellow). Then come games that are different like ''Pokémon Snap'', ''Pokémon Ranger'', and ''Pokémon Mystery Dungeon''. And what are the number one complaints? That they're not like the mainstream Pokémon games!
  409. *** "I want ''Pokémon'' to be DarkerAndEdgier! And focus more on plot!" Then comes stuff like ''Colosseum'' and ''XD'', and nobody's buying them. Either that, or they're saying "...It's not like Red, Blue, and yellow! Therefore, IT SUCKS!".
  410. ** And the most recent amount of stupidity? The original games were named after colours. Red, Blue, and Yellow. The next generation named them after metals, but they were also colours. Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald were named after gems, but they were ''also'' colours. Fire Red and Leaf Green were ''also'' colour-themed names, but also elements. Diamond, Pearl and Platinum were then named after two gems (A pearl is often considered a gem despite being different), and a metal. All three of which, are ''also colours'' - and then [[ScapegoatCreator Nintendo]] was told by the HateDumb that "They're running out of ideas" and "I liked it better when they were named after colours". Then Generation V has games announced. And what are they? ''COLOURS'' - and then the fandom either brought about "Huh, interesting. I thought they'd have done this sooner", or "WTF?! YOU'RE RUNNING OUT OF IDEAS!!!!"
  411. ** Whenever a new Pokemon is shown, the responses are...
  412. *** "[[MisBlamed Nintendo]] [[ScapegoatCreator is running out of ideas!]]
  413. *** "WTF is this?"
  414. *** "That actually looks kinda cool."
  415. *** "Ooooh. nice type combo!"
  416. *** "Hey, why didn't they put this in sooner?"
  417. *** "[[NostalgiaFilter I LIKED GENERATION I BETTER!!!]]"
  418. ** The Card game also gets a lot of hate, mostly due to it being around for so long and people who drop out look at the new stuff that's come out and think "It's all gimmicky and stupid". Similar events have even happened to constantly-evolving-trading card games that are still around (and popular!) like MagicTheGathering and YuGiOh.
  419. * The most common cry from Nintendo gamers as a whole is to demand more creativity and originality, such as new [=IPs=], and moan about the flood of sequels and never-ending franchises. However, whenever Nintendo makes a shot at it, they will turn around and complain that Nintendo has stopped making video games for the "core". Don't ever expect a definition of "core" by the way - to these guys, even ''{{Metroid}}'' has to be a casual game for this argument to work. For example: Nintendo releasing ''Metroid'' is "milking", while Nintendo releasing ''WiiFit'' is "abandoning the core". With the announcement of a new ''[[PunchOut Punch-Out!!]]'' and a Treasure-developed sequel to import darling ''SinAndPunishment'', [[AndTheFandomRejoiced the doomsday prophecies have stopped]]...''[[OrIsIt for now.]]''
  420. *** They're back in full-force: the same people who bitch and moan that gaming is more obsessed with good graphics than good gameplay have done nothing but bitch and moan that ''{{Sin and Punishment}}'' looks like a Dreamcast game.
  421. *** And ''Punch-Out!!'' is getting heat for being too old-school; lacking options and features and being called "a $50 NES remake".
  422. *** On top of that, people whined about the lack of multiplayer, but when it was announced to have local multiplayer only, everyone then whined about the lack of online play.
  423. **** They tried to do this to Excite Bots, the sequel to Excite Truck, bemoaning the addition of minigames and a kiddy look... Then they realized that the 'minigames' are done AS one races and allows you to earn more trick stars, that the bot designs facilitate it, [[AndTheFandomRejoiced that it plays like Excite Truck but uses the Wii Wheel, that it's online, and that trick meter goes up at least 25 instead of 5]]. Now it's praised for taking everything loved about Excite Truck and cranking it UpToEleven.
  424. * Not even ''TheConduit'' is safe. While most critics and some gamers are excited that the Wii is getting a decent first person shooter, most gamers are snuffing the game as "just another generic FPS". Note that the fans (possibly the same people) wanted some good FPS games on the Wii in the past.
  425. * Let's just face facts: Nintendo games ''in general'' suffer from unpleasable fanbases. ''StarFox'' has fans who want more variety and fans who just want to fly in their Arwing. ''DonkeyKong'' has fans with the desire for a new 2D game but hated ''Donkey Kong Jungle Beat''. ''{{Metroid}}'' has fans who hate the ''Prime'' Subseries, but also hated ''Metroid Fusion''. ''Even back when Nintendo was test marketing the '''original''' NES'', everyone in the test group said they hated it.
  426. * ''Wii Music'', the cornerstone of the E3 2008 Press Conference, went straight to XPacHeat to [[FanDumb some gamers on the internet]].
  427. * The fanbase can't be even pleased with the way Nintendo treats third parties. Either Nintendo was too strict for putting up many arbitrary rules they had to follow or they're too loose for letting them make anything they want.
  428. ** Nintendo has been blamed multiple times for scaring developers away by "treating them poorly" during the Gamecube days, though [[CommonKnowledge good luck getting an example or source backing that up]]. They are being blamed for "letting" too much crap games onto the Wii. Their standards haven't really changed at all. Sony of America is in fact the strictest of any of the branches of any of the three console makers. Much of the so called shovelware on the Wii are actually ports of European and Japanese PS2 games.
  429. *** Speaking of Nintendo and 3rd parties, some people believe that [[CommonKnowledge bringing back the "Nintendo Seal of Quality" will end the shovelware the Wii has been getting]]. People seem to forget that the Seal of Quality does not have anything to do with the game's content, but was a measure taken by Nintendo to counteract the problems Atari faced with shoddy, unauthorized games flooding the market and killing their profits (a huge factor in the video game crash of 1983). The Seal of Quality simply tells the buyer that the game is a genuine Nintendo-certified product. If ''Superman 64'' could get the Seal of Quality, what does ''that'' tell you?
  430. *** I just checked my copies of Rayman: Raving Rabbids and LEGO Star Wars: The Complete Saga, and they both got the seal of quality, so it's also an example of DidNotDoTheResearch
  431. **** Then you must be from a PAL region country, since those complains come from North America, where the "Seal of Quality" was replaced with "Official Nintendo Seal".
  432. * Nintendo's Wii Motion + is getting tons of flack (it's an accessory that gives 1:1 motion controls or close to it). First people whined that it should have been in the controllers from day 1 (and they ignored Nintendo's comment that it would have made the controllers expensive at the get go) and when the price for the add on was announced for $20, now people are whining that it's too much money. When it comes to the virtual console or Nintendo's add-ons, the fans decry Nintendo as being greedy for profits.
  433. * The ''MetroidPrime'' Trilogy has been announced; all three games in the trilogy, the first two with updated graphics and controls for the Wii, for only the price of one new game. Fans promptly started complaining about ''the rerelease they've been asking for'' screwing over "the fans", and how Nintendo doesn't care about their loyal fans, etc, just because the announcement mentions that not every Wii owner owned a Gamecube. Also because of the rumoured--I repeat, ''rumoured''--fourth game in the series not being announced yet. Yes, even ''rumours'' are Nintendo's fault now.
  434. * Things get worse at E3 2009. Nintendo announced a sequel to ''SuperMarioGalaxy'', something you'd think people would want after all the years of crying and lamenting about it being "forgotten" and ignored in favor of ''WiiFit'', but after seeing a 1 minute trailer, [[TaintedByThePreview everyone now says Galaxy 2 will suck because it's just a rehash of the first]]. They also ignore the fact that you can use Yoshi this time and new things still have to be revealed down the road. People have been dying for a new Zelda game and when ''Spirit Tracks'' was announced, people bashed it just because it was on the DS and not on the Wii. Oh, and then there's ''Metroid: Other M'', the long-demanded full-3D platformer iteration of the franchise being produced by Team Ninja and coming completely out of nowhere...and everyone's complaining that it has too much action and now they all want ''Prime'' back.
  435. **** This is doubly ironic, because when Prime first came out, some fans of the original were complaining it was too FPS-y, and FPS fans were complaining about all the platforming. Not ''many'' of them, mind you.
  436. * Club Nintendo. Most of the fans blasted Nintendo of America for not having this (a customer loyalty program) since Japan and Europe had it for years already. Nintendo of America announced around 2008 that they would get into the Club Nintendo business. People that registered games and systems would earn coins that could be used to redeem rewards. Many fans complained that the current rewards were garbage compared to the other rewards from the other regions. Once the elite rewards were announced (special gifts for members who reached gold or platinum status by the end of the club year), the complaints rose again for the rewards being not as good as the other regions - the EU and Japan programs have Wii Points and video game OST/OSV's available, while the priciest item for the American version is a deck of Hanafuda cards.
  437. * Nintendo fans even went as far as accusing Nintendo of being evil when it came to updating the Wii to combat piracy. Through a certain exploit in the Wii's system, people can install hombrew programs that let them do many things, such as using cheats for games (which is why there are lots of cheaters in the online games), playing VC games for free, use the Wii as a DVD player, play burned copies of games, etc. Naturally, Nintendo does what it can (despite being trounced almost in a day) to stop the piracy and somehow, by the fans' view, it is somehow wrong for Nintendo to remove stuff that you were not allowed to install because you agreed not to do so on the terms of service!
  438. * ''GoldenEye'' has started to get this ever since a remake for it was announced. Fans who been wanting Goldeneye again for ages now complain that the remake will suck because Activision is making it instead of Rare and how James Bond in the game is not based on the same actor they modeled off of from the N64 version.
  439. * Nintendo [[CommonKnowledge is known]] for releasing new iterations of their systems with improvements users requested. (This is largely confined to the handheld systems.) Fans will then complain about how Nintendo "always" releases new [=SKUs=]. So if Nintendo does nothing, people complain, and when they do make improvements, people complain about "being forced" to buy the new hardware.
  440. [[/folder]]
  442. [[folder:SquareEnix]]
  443. * ''FinalFantasy'' in general suffers from an unpleasable fanbase. As every game is set in a functionally different world, with different characters, and lately completely different gameplay styles it is unsurprising that virtually everyone has a different opinion on which games are best, or worst, and which characters and plots are best and worst, etc. Essentially every time a fan likes a certain game, the next one will be so different than the one he or she liked originally that they'll immediately hate it. "I wanted a game like Final Fantasy Q but instead I got this Final Fantasy R thing that I never wanted!" is the gist of what the average fan will say. And this was going on * before* Square decided to make direct sequels and spin-offs of individual titles, which often were strange gameplay experiments that rarely were similar to the original title. For example ''FinalFantasyVII'' is a traditional RPG, but its sequel ''DirgeOfCerberus'' was a third-person-shooter, and its prequel ''CrisisCore'' was an action RPG. ItGotWorse for the FinalFantasy series in recent years when the row-based combat (essentially the only thing tradition FinalFantasy games had in common) was ditched thus making the last three or four main FinalFantasy games next-to-unrecognizable as even being in the same series. Recently the head of Square Enix even expressed concern over ''FinalFantasyXIII'''s negative response.
  444. ** And what happened when they did start making direct sequels after years of begging for more games set in the individual game universes? The fans complained that they were just [[ItsPopularNowItSucks milking the popularity.]]
  445. * On the topic of gamers clamoring for originality - for all the harping about Square Enix for continuing to make ''FinalFantasy'' games, there's an equal amount of fury every time they release a non-''FinalFantasy'' title on the basis that they should be releasing more ''FinalFantasy'' games. This year sees them launching several new franchises, and what does everyone focus on instead? That ''FinalFantasy XIII'' isn't out yet.
  446. ** Everyone also doesn't seem to realize that SquareEnix tends to experiment with gameplay mechanics per game, and will be ''very'' quick to complain about how generic gameplay is.
  447. * ''FinalFantasyXI'': Changes were made to two-handed weapons, which people complained about being inferior to one-handed weapons, only for a sizable portion of the fanbase to complain that they were ''[[GameBreaker too powerful]]'', even some of those that wanted the change.
  448. ** Hey, the purported purpose was to make both 1 and 2 handed weaponry on par with each other. It took FOUR patches for them to get the damage calculations right; very few people complain about it now. The initial changes simply changed people from one 'onry' to another and prove that the players are the testers - no _practical_ pre release testing happens.
  449. ** Every time Square-Enix releases an patch, each item in the patch notes (no matter how minor or requested it was) will be complained about by at least one forum-goer.
  450. *** Pre-Patch teasers that don't interest a particular group of forum-goers will usually result in at least two pages of bitching about them, followed by two pages of people bitching about people bitching (chocobo racing related teasers usually meet with this type of treatment on endgame forums).
  451. ** Less than a day has gone by, and people are ''already'' up in arms over the announcement of the Square Enix Security Token, which is to be used to keep accounts from being hacked by RealMoneyTrade groups. The complaint? ''It costs money.'' While it's understandable to be worried about the [[CrackIsCheaper SE Tax]], the security token is a ''physical object'', and would obviously cost money to make and ship. ''{{World of Warcraft}}'' has such a token, as well, and it isn't free, either.
  452. * ''FinalFantasyXII'', which replaced the traditional turn-based random encounters with a seamless world map of visible enemies and an innovative AI-controlled party system and was immediately accused of being untrue to the spirit of the franchise. And this was after multiple reviews and fans complained upon FFX's release that using a turn-based system on a next-gen console was too dated.
  453. ** And there is the story: FFX was criticized for its linear plot, the over-abundance of cutscenes, the cheesy love story, the fact that the reveal was too obvious, the classical "evil cult" syndrome... so they made a game with a [[ThirtyXanatosPileup very complex set of opposing factions]]; lots of sidequests; made sure that most information would come from the {{NPC}}s and not from long expositions; the existence of [[TheManBehindTheMan Venat]] and [[DefectorFromDecadence its motivations]] came very late; the main female character was a widow and her relation with the [[TheIshmael "protagonist"]] never went beyond the [[BackToBackBadasses war buddy level]], while [[BodyguardCrush all the]] [[UnluckyChildhoodFriend other]] [[BattleCouple potential]] [[LoveTriangle "couples"]] were played [[UnresolvedSexualTension subtly]]; the main religion was ruled by decent people who took care of war refugees... FFXII's story was the most criticized FF storyline since the eight installment.
  454. * ''FinalFantasyXIII'' hasn't even been released in the U.S. yet, and the fans are already in an uproar. After a news report in the Japanese-Culture website, Sancaku Complex, mentioned ''FinalFantasyXIII'' is "as linear as a piece of string", and showed a long strip that is your map for the first six hours, one reader posted this little number in the comments section:
  455. -->"Players enter dungeon. Too convoluted. Game is s** t. Players enter dungeon. Too simple. Game is s** t. Players get to in put in commands over and over for the party. Game is redundant. Players get to put in commands over and over for the party leader, and then change each member's role in battle. Game is overly simplified. Players grind to get more skills. Game is tedious. Players progress through the game without a hitch. Game is too easy. Players get complex equipment system. Game is confusing. Players get simple equipment system. Game is dumbed-down. Players get simple, straightforward story. Game is linear. Players get branching story. Game is lolWTF. Players assume the role of an effeminate character. Game is g* y. Players assume the role of a masculine character. Game is for f**** ts. Players get a dramatic story. Game is emo. Players get a non-dramatic one. Game is as cold as rock. Players get lots of missions and sidequests and mini-games. Game takes a lot of work. Players get few mission and sidequests and mini-games. Game needs much more. Players get fanfare music played after every battle for ten straight installments. Game gets rage. Players get new fanfare music. Game gets more rage."
  456. * While we're at it, let's look at ''FinalFantasy'' and its history, from ''VII'' to ''XII''. Square released ''FFVIII'', and people too accustomed to Materia hated the Junctions. Then ''[[FinalFantasyIX FFIX]]'' returned to the preset Jobs, and people bitched ''again''. Later, ''FFX'' used the infamous Sphere Grid, and it was "too hard to understand". Then ''X-2'' was released, and fans... vomited at its girly look and "not having anything better to do at end-game than to max job levels".
  457. ** ''FFIX'' was commonly criticised for its throw-back, chibi art style and the cartoony look of the characters... which is, in true UnpleasableFanbase style, in stark contrast to the complaints about VIII moving toward a more realistic design ethic that abandoned the light-hearted and cartoonish style of the earlier games.
  458. *** Never mind the fact that FFIX was ''[[CompletelyMissingThePoint SUPPOSED]]'' to be like the earlier games. As (I think) Sakaguchi said it: "FFIX is a celebration of all things ''FinalFantasy''".
  459. *** It's happening ''again'' with ''FinalFantasyGaiden'', which is using a super-deformed art style again, to complaints about how terrible and cartoonish the graphics are and how it should be a high-definition PSP title instead. This from the ''same'' group that complains about how graphics are becoming more important than gameplay and how modern gaming only cares about "style over substance".
  460. * Don't forget the original ''VI'' die-hards. Any game from that point on, when the series had the gall to become [[ItsPopularNowItSucks popular]], is immediately declared to be utter filth that any True Fan should decry as blasphemy upon the glorious 2D age.
  461. * And how about the GBA remakes, which were by the way begged for, for years upon end, so the unwashed masses could see what a "real" ''FinalFantasy'' should play like: "It is humanly undoable without LevelGrinding", "There are too many [[LostForever missables]]" or "Half the characters are useless after getting the InfinityPlusOneSword or the LastDiscMagic".
  462. ** Plus the storylines! The recent remake of ''FinalFantasyIV'' had nostalgia gamers aiming slings at it for either changing too much or not enough. And yet if Square completely rewrote the story, you can bet they'd be the first in line to complain about the sullying of the original text to pander to casual gamers. (Despite how the SNES Script really wasn't what one would call a "complex script")
  463. * ''FinalFantasy'' storylines are always criticized either for being too {{Wangst}}y and serious, or too silly and light-hearted. ''FinalFantasyX'' is a textbook case - the original was criticized for being too dark and miserable, the sequel for being too upbeat and perky.
  464. ** The ''[[FinalFantasyTactics Tactics]]'' series has the same problem - either complaints of too much politics and not enough fantasy, or too little politics and too much fantasy.
  465. *** In fact, most fans that started with ''FinalFantasyTactics'' disregard ''Advance'' and ''A2'', branding them as "too childish" for the storyline compared to the original ''Tactics''.
  466. *** Which is funny because those same people will turn around and call another JRPG (that's not made by SquareEnix) the best game ever, despite it having the exact same story conventions that they were complaining about existing in ''FinalFantasy'' games, and yet another game that has everything they were complaining about has the better story.
  467. * [[http://kotaku.com/5026918/this-guy-needs-a-heaping-helping-of-get-a-grip Final Fantasy XIII will be multi-platform?!]] ''Multi-platform games can only suck!'' I paid $400 on a PS3 for ''nothing!'' Never mind the fact that I own the only Blu-ray player worth having, and I still get to play the game--''someone besides the tiny majority can play the game now!'' Is nothing sacred!? And God help you if you tell them [[DidNotDoTheResearch that every FF from the first to eight plus FFXI is multi-platform now...]] This has earned Square many accusations of "hating" Sony, despite the fact that they are one of few dedicated third-parties supporting the PSP as much or possibly even more than the DS.
  468. ** They also ignore that the PS3 version of the game is the superior version when it comes to graphics and sound.
  469. ** See also ''DevilMayCry 4'' for this last complaint, in which Capcom had to publicly dismiss a petition put together by PS3 fanboys demanding that they cancel the 360 release.
  470. ** Every time that something, anything, is announced or revealed about FF13, someone out there will be whining and bitching.
  471. ** Relatedly, the idea that ''FinalFantasy'' is a Sony series. There are fans who complain about any ''FinalFantasy'' that isn't on a Sony system while happily ignoring Square and Nintendo's relationship from 1987 to 1994. The series has moved in stages of sorts with Square moving to where the audience is. For the first six games, the audience was with Nintendo, from VII to XII, the audience (and technology) was with Sony and from XIII on, the audience is multi-platform.
  472. ** What might tick off the fanboys even more is the US commerical, which can make the game be construed as an Xbox 360 exclusive title, due to the ''Final Fantasy XIII'' spedial edition 360 and the Xbox logo at the end, logo normally reserved for 360 exclusive titles.
  473. * Even the art style has an unpleasable fanbase! Between ''FinalFantasyVI'' and ''FinalFantasyVII'', the lead artist switched from YoshitakaAmano to Tetsuya Nomura. They have two distinctly different art styles and Nomura's has become synonymous with the series entirely because of the popularity of ''FinalFantasyVII'', which quickly riled the 2D nostalgia crowd. Furthermore, even though Nomura [[MisBlamed actually hasn't been the sole artist]] and has been a designer as early as ''FinalFantasyV'', his art is frequently accused of being filled with RummageSaleRejects from the BlueBishonenGhetto. Meanwhile, Amano was known for...drawing willowy, long haired, effeminate men in RummageSaleRejects. With blue lipstick. Many fans criticized Kuja for being typical of Square Enix's "new" approach, when in fact that character was designed by Amano and looks very typical of the kinds of characters he draws. ''FinalFantasyXII'' took identical flak for "Nomura's" horrible designs when again, the art was handled by long-time Tactics series and ''VagrantStory'' artist Akihiko Yoshida. Clearly, one can tell that they DidNotDoTheResearch.
  474. ** Just look at the artwork for ''[=~Dissidia: Final Fantasy~=]'', which had characters designed by both Amano and Nomura and an art style that was a mix between the two artists. That is to say, Nomura did the artwork for ''Dissidia'' in the style of Amano. The only difference was a lack of zippers and an excess of earrings and lipstick. Compare [[http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/finalfantasy/images/d/de/AmanoKuja.jpg Amano's concept of Kuja]] to [[http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/finalfantasy/images/6/68/Dissidia_Kuja.png Nomura's]]. Nomura actually made him ''more'' masculine.
  475. ** Many people also only seem to think of Nomura's trends when Amano indeed has his own trends outside of Kuja...Line up all the heroes drawn by Amano. The NostalgiaFilter excuses them all. Just take one look at Nomura's designs for ''Dissidia'' and the in-game sprites for Bartz...You see that he has brown hair, right? Well look at Amano's art of Bartz...in which he looks like Cecil with a haircut.
  476. * The ''DragonQuest'' fanbase teeters on this from time to time. They create a fan-site (the now dead [=SlimeKnights=]) for DQ games in the US, they release the niche ''Rocket Slime'' and ''DragonQuestMonsters: Joker'' titles in the US, and have even recently trademarked names that could only be the "missing" Dragon Quest IV, V, and VI DS games... and yet, they're still considered "The enemy" by the fanbase.
  477. ** There are some old wounds amongst ''DragonQuest'' fans. There's some bitterness over the translations of ''DragonQuestMonsters: Caravan Hearts'' and ''DragonQuestV'' PS2 being lost in the shuffle during the merger, as well as ''DragonQuestIV DS'' coming out with a weak localization after having been released for several years in Japan ''with an English script as an option''. The North American localization also featured the inexplicable removal of the Party Talk feature, and a truly botched attempt at the AccentAdaptation that had actually been done ''well'' in ''DragonQuestVIII''. However, the response to these slights by some parties is truly disproportionate compared to everything they've done ''right''.
  478. ** ''DragonQuest'' fans do have a lot to be bitter about over the number of games that still get [[NoExportForYou left in Japan]], as well as the incredibly lengthy waits for the games that do come over when compared to other Squeenix franchises that have a speedier turnaround. Of any of the groups in this section, they at least have years of actual ill treatment to nurture their bitterness on.
  479. *** Consider also that as of February 4, 2010, over seven months after its Japanese release, the only news we've had of an English version of Dragon Quest IX has been an interview from July 2009 stating that we wouldn't be getting it before April 2010 if we even got it at all. That's right, a month after the game came out they still hadn't decided if they were even going to give it an international release at all. Meanwhile ''FinalFantasyXIII'' was given an English release date several months before it was even released in Japan. Oh yeah, we're bitter all right.
  480. **** There's finally a North American release date for IX, but SE has apparently decided that DQ isn't worth investing any money in outside of Japan, as it's being published by Nintendo.
  481. ***** Actually, it turns out that the opposite is ture: SE has struck a publishing deal with the big N to bring DQ to the fore-front of western-gaming conciousness with the release of IX. To wit, airing commercials staring ''Seth Green'', running an eleven page spread focusing soley on DQIX in the July issue of Nintendo Power, and setting up out-door advertising in large cities. Oh yes, the new era of Dragon Quest is here at last friends.
  482. ** And let's not forget the complaining over ''DragonQuestVIII''. "It violates the spirit of ''DragonQuest'' games by allowing you to customize characters!" (We'll disregard the class systems allowing you to do the same in the past, okay?), "They hate America, Europe, and Australia and gave Japan a better version!" (Despite that they actually ''had'' no voice acting and the soundtrack was fully orchestrated in the localization), "It's not even ''DragonQuest'' anymore! It's like ''FinalFantasy''!" (Despite that the extent of the similarities it has with most ''FinalFantasy'' games are defining genre characteristics), "TheComputerIsACheatingBastard" (Forget that they ''always'' did that), "The game has too many difficulty spikes and requires LevelGrinding!" (Once again, ignore that is a staple of the series), and most annoyingly, "I don't have a choice in my party! I only have four characters!" (Which, once again, is something that appears to be disregarded in other games doing the ''exact same thing'', and not even allowing flexible character-roles like making Hero or Yangus heal the party while Jessica and Angelo WhipItGood and fire arrows at the enemy)
  483. * As time goes by, ''KingdomHearts'' is starting to reveal itself to have an unpleasable fanbase. The first one was the best! The second one was the best! ''One'' was so mindbowingly hard that its impossible to finish! ''Two'' was nothing but button mashing, you could close your eyes and beat the hardest boss! The games are too cute and fluffy! They made the second game too edgy! The card system in ''Chains of Memories'' sucked! They {{Nerf}}ed the magic system! The intro in two was stupid! They should have made Roxas the main character! The Nobodies should have had more of a backstory! What the hell is with the Nobodies, make them go away! More Disney! Less Disney! On and on and on. Oh, and if you think we forgot something, just check the [[MetaConcepts top of the page]].
  484. ** Also of note is that before September 19, 2008, the people were pissed that [[NoExportForYou Square was keeping]] ''[[UpdatedRerelease KH2 Final Mix + ]]'' [[NoExportForYou to Japan]]. After that one date, a number of them are now angry that ''[[EnhancedRemake Re:Chain of Memories]]'' will be released in America as a standalone title or that they spent their money on an import or that Square is too slow or yadda yadda yadda.
  485. *** Although honestly, any anger at Square-Enix for their NoExportForYou shenanigans is justified...
  486. ** Ah yes, and regarding the ''FinalFantasy'' characters...Nomura has stated before that he would ''not'' include any characters he did not design, which is why Setzer showed up but not Terra from ''FinalFantasyVI''. (Because, you know, Nomura originally ''designed'' Setzer but people ''still'' don't seem to realize this) Meanwhile fans are saying that they should have other characters like [[FinalFantasyIV Rydia]], [[FinalFantasyII Emperor Mateus]] or [[FinalFantasyIX Beatrix]]; when you just ''know'' that if Nomura included them (for some unknown reason), the same people would complain about how Nomura "ruined" them by including them in the first place, or how they look "out of place".
  487. ** And that's not even getting into FanDumb over the main characters. ''Every'' main character, with the sole exception[[strike:s of Terra and]] just Aqua now, due to many complaints that Terra is a "recycled Zack design," has developed a {{Hatedom}}. Any attention, or lack of for that matter, given to a character will cause a large uproar with fandom.
  488. * Of course despite the very vocal members of the fanbase, ''FinalFantasy'' has not lost an inch of popularity; people continue buying games in the millions of copies as if none of this has ever happened. In fact, it's often theorized that the majority of the fanbase, if the sales are any indication, are fine with the state of the franchise - they just feel no need to [[SilentMajority scream about it on the internet.]]
  489. ** Said "Silent Majority" will also immediately start screaming the moment sometime happens that they ARE pissed off at. The Final Fantasy Series likely has the most unpleasant fanbase of any Video Game Franchise EVER, bare none, if only for the Sheer Variety of Unpleasantness available to you.
  490. * ''ChronoTrigger'' and its ContestedSequel ''ChronoCross'' have a fandom that comes to blows quite easily. In one corner are the fans of ''ChronoTrigger'' that argue whether ''Cross'' was really a sequel at all, for reasons that are too numerous to discuss on this page but usually boil down to being completely different in mechanics and tone from ''Trigger'' and the SuddenSequelDeathSyndrome of pretty much everyone in ''Trigger''. In the other corner are the ''Cross'' fans who point out its positive critical reception, its good sales, and what they felt to be a deeper and more satisfying storyline with an epic GainaxEnding. The easiest way to find examples of this is to head over to the well-meaning, and perhaps most active fansite, [[http://www.chronocompendium.com/ Chrono Compendium]] and say you like ''Chrono Trigger'' better, which you then will receive a dressing down from several posters for not appreciating the genius of ''Cross'', followed by them being dressed down by several other posters for not appreciating the genius of ''Trigger'', followed by a potential FlameWar. Needless to say, both games are treated as classics as they both have received near perfect to perfect scores.
  491. ** It is never outright proven that the SuddenSequelDeathSyndrome effected everyone that mattered, which only makes things worse.
  492. *** Whether that trope is actually canon or not can start some pretty nasty flame wars by itself, even among people who ''liked'' ''ChronoCross''.
  493. ** There's also flame wars about the role of Masato Kato in the franchise. ''ChronoTrigger'' was a collaboration of four people - Kato, AkiraToriyama, Hironobu Sakaguchi, and Yuji Horii. The initial scenario of ''Trigger'' was Horii's, with input from Sakaguchi, and then scripted by Kato. ''ChronoCross'' only included Kato (with Sakaguchi as executive producer). Suggesting that the dissonance of the two games could be related to this will get you flamed to hell and back in some parts.
  494. *** Some say he was the only good writer of the whole game, who deserved to write up ''ChronoCross'', while others would go on to compare Cross to a professionally written FanFic.
  495. *** It's also unclear what role Horie even had. While he did write an entire draft for the scenario, Sakaguchi apparently scrapped most of it. There are various extremely early screenshots in existence that show a rather different setting, that looks like it would've been more strictly fantasy-themed and less sci-fantasy than the final product.
  496. *** It's not even clear who came up with what for different parts of the story. The only thing known for certain is that Kato wrote the entirety of the Zeal plotline - which many consider the best in the game.
  497. ** And let's not even go into the DS remake that actually improved the horrible, horrible lag times the PSX remake had, vastly improved the dialogue so that different time periods not only "sounded" different ''and'' didn't feel like a teenager came up with it, and that finally had Item, Tech, and other names for things make a lot more sense than the original. Yet after years of people asking for this port, all anyone wanted to do was complain about it and wish it was still using the old Woolsey script they claimed they hated for all these years.
  498. *** And that's not all. To illustrate the utter hypocrisy, mentioning the inconsistencies in Woolsey's script (Namely Frog speaking in YeOldeButcheredeEnglishe when ''absolutely nobody'' in the same time period spoke that way, especially when even ''he'' didn't when he was human) in 2007 would have gotten people mentioning that either everyone should have spoken with YeOldeButcheredeEnglishe or that he shouldn't. Nowadays, the people claiming they disliked the Woolsey script are suddenly nowhere to be found, and even pointing out the inconsistencies the Super Nintendo script had will earn you a lecture on how sometimes they ''have'' to change it around and that it was better when they did. Ironically, this ''only'' happened there...had this not been protected by the NostalgiaFilter or had Woolsey even been a good writer, everyone would have cried "AdaptationDecay! '''ADAPTATIONDECAY!!!'''" for doing the same thing he did.
  499. **** A fan pointed it out somewhere on a forum complaining about this issue...
  500. ----> "How ''DARE'' they make it more like the original script?! BRB - Complaining at another adaptation for deviating from the script!"
  501. *** The connection to ''ChronoCross''... ever since ''before it was even announced'' as a remake, people wanted a solid connection. Then comes the whole optional scene with an optional boss...and now it has either [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks ruined the game]] or wasn't good enough, with some fans saying it shouldn't have even been included altogether. WallBanger points to poor Square, knowing simply porting it to the DS would have gotten people complaining "WHY NOT PUT IT ON THE VIRTUAL CONSOLE! '''''EXTORTION!!'''''". And of course, the DS remake has had people cry "extortion - IT SHOULD BE ON THE VIRTUAL CONSOLE!", despite the fact that it clearly ''was not'' just a mere port.
  502. ** While the fanbase just about unilaterally agrees on the need for a sequel, one can only imagine the kind of outcry that would rise up were such a game to actually materialize. Making the game more similar to ''Trigger'' would inevitably outrage the half of the fanbase that liked ''Cross'', and vice versa, and unless SquareEnix somehow manages to reunite ALL of the developers from one or both of those games (which would be virtually impossible) SOMEONE will cry foul that Hironobu Sakaguchi[=/=]Yuji Horii[=/=]Masato Kato[=/=]Hiromichi Tanaka[=/=]Yasuyuki Honne[=/=]somebody else isn't involved with the project. People think that Square Enix is being stingy by holding out on a sequel, but maybe they're just being wise.
  503. ** Never mention the ''FanFic/CrimsonEchoes'' project. Ever. Don't even question whether or not SquareEnix had legitimate grounds to shut it down, even if they had the right to do it anyway. The replies to the second comment in [[http://www.gamepolitics.com/2010/02/04/au-court-lets-isp-hook-over-illegal-downloads this article]] will show you why.
  504. * So, after a year of solid bitching that ''[[FinalFantasyIVTheAfterYears Final Fantasy IV: The After Years]]'' was being unfairly condemned to [[NoExportForYou never leave Japan]], you'd think the fans would be ''grateful'' that the ESRB just rated it for the US, meaning we can actually play it. You must not have read this page. Now that we can actually play it, the fans are complaining that it's a pile of crap and should never have been released at all.
  505. ** Most of that is due to the game [[ConsoleWars only being rated for the Wii]], even though Retraux games tend to sell best on WiiWare, considering how many has been announced so far.
  506. ** The release has been met with accusations of price-gouging and franchise-milking. There have also been complaints about the games presentation, completely ignoring the fact that the game was made ''for cell phones''.
  507. * This is the only fanbase where people ask for the remake of [[FinalFantasyVII a game]] and complain about it being milked at the same exact time.
  508. ** Only if you don't count Nintendo fans as a fanbase. See above.
  509. ** Case in point - before the announcement of ''FinalFantasyGaiden: {{The Four Warriors of Light}}'', there was much speculation and complaining that it was going to be another remake. When the game was finally announced as a new, original title, there were complaints that it ''wasn't'' a port or remake of ''FinalFantasyV'' or ''FinalFantasyVI''.
  510. * Ask any ''FinalFantasy'' fan, and they'll most likely tell you that ''FinalFantasyVIII'' is either the best in the series, or the absolute worst. ''No exceptions''.
  511. * ''FinalFantasyXII'' is [[strike:arguably the greatest rpg ever]] a pretty good RPG, but people hate it because it's not like the other games, even though NONE OF THEM ARE LIKE ANY OF THE OTHERS!
  512. * ''StarOcean''. The second version, for many, the first (And perhaps only) Star Ocean game they ever played was remade on the PSP, and given a new translation and significantly improved the voice acting. Immediately cries of how TheyChangedItNowItSucks show up for adding "Nonsensical characters" and other such "nonsense" to "ruin the game". To demonstrate how powerful the NostalgiaFilter and the unpleasable fanbase are, fans actually liked the PlayStation version ''better'' despite the fact that the Voice acting was a laughable rush job (Characters saying "I'm e-I'm erasing you!", saying "Craude" instead of "Claude", and some of Rena's spells ''not even being recorded in English'' leading to a massive inconsistency) as was the translation. Another funny is how Square-Enix and TriAce actually didn't change that much of the game outside of graphics, voice acting and translation...if anything it was actually an ''enhanced port'' rather than an actual remake; The first game (First Departure) meanwhile had ''more'' changes made not only to the graphics, translation, and voice acting but the storyline itself. (E.g. including a way to recruit Erys, therefore adding two characters with just Welch, adding [=PAs=] for T'Nique, and removing Ashlay's injured arm altogether)
  513. [[/folder]]
  515. [[folder:Webcomics]]
  516. * The ''DominicDeegan'' fandom consists of three boards. Reportedly, they're set up to be "critics, flamers, and cheerleaders," but it's hard to see anything universally or even generally positive posted about any of the author's work in the last four years.
  517. ** Then there's the Giant in the Playground threads, which spend each day nitpicking, strip slaying, and making pseudo-scientific theories (called ''Dominology'') based on Mookie's day-to-day strips.
  518. ** A few good examples of this phenomenon: for the longest time, many fans complained about Luna's continued angst, self-loathing, and emo-ness, but when she started growing and changing, becoming confident in herself, and even BadAss, it was decried as her turning into a MarySue. Many fans thought Gregory was horribly superpowered, especially after the Super Greg arc; but when the Infernomancer depowered him by literally ripping the White Magic out of him, people complained about this being pointless and ruining his character. Many fans during arcs such as Shadow of Siegfried, Two Thief Or Not to Thief, and the vacation arc were constantly demanding to know what was going on in Maltak, but now that they have gotten to see they're complaining about it as the longest, most useless and heinous arc ever. Even the awesome showdown between Celesto and the Infernomancer which had been long-awaited got savaged as nonsensical and contradictory. Granted, some of this can be explained as disliking what was given to them to read as being out of character, poorly written, or without proper development and planning, but even so it's pretty clear Mookie is damned no matter what he does.
  520. * And hey, let's not leave ''{{Order of the Stick}}'' out of this either! If Rich posts a comic that focuses on one character, he alienates the fans of the other characters, and vice-versa. Though for this very reason, Rich never takes his script from the fans' ideas or requests.
  521. ** Not to mention the people who take him to task for any action shown in the comic that seems to violate the rules of D&D (or even failing to show the average statistical outcome of whatever they think the stats are for the characters). Not one strip goes by without a near-flamewar about whether such-and-such a character could possibly have survived said damage, or what spell would have been MORE effective than the one they cast -- even if there's no evidence the character even knows the spell, much less prepared it that day.
  522. * Amber of ''[[DanAndMabsFurryAdventures Dan and Mab's Furry Adventures]]'' had this sort of problem with her comics falling somewhere between wacky gag-a-day strips and developing story, and fans unable to decide which they preferred. [[http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_872.php Amber's response was entertaining.]]
  523. * Parodied in ''SabrinaOnline'', in [[http://www.sabrina-online.com/strips/SabOnline397.GIF this comic]].
  524. * ''{{Collar 6}}'': Oh boy, where to even start. The series was initially a gag a day comic, but then a strip featured Laura being drugged without her knowledge or consent. [[InternetBacklash Some fans]] [[DudeNotFunny were not happy]]. Initially, the author felt their complaints were unjustified because it was a fantasy world, but upon further review came to agree with them, leading into the series' flirtation with CerebusSyndrome, as the [[CharacterFilibuster character's discussed]] [[AuthorFilibuster why their behavior had been totally unacceptable]]. At this point [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks some fans felt that the comic had become too serious]] [[GrowingTheBeard while others felt that it added depth to the characters that had previously been lacking]].
  525. [[/folder]]
  527. [[folder:WebOriginal]]
  528. * Fans of ''[[RedVsBlue Red vs. Blue]]'' are divided over which videos were better: the early humor-oriented videos or the dramedy trilogy starting with "Reconstruction". When Rooster Teeth returned to its comedy-focused roots, fans that came in after the ReTool cried foul. Likewise, the fans of the earlier stuff blame the newer fans (often [[WildMassGuessing Wild Mass Guessers]]) for "ruining" the series in the first place.
  529. ** Let's not even get started on the new CGI scenes. There are people who stopped liking the show before and have now gone back to liking it because of the CGI, people who are starting to dislike the show for it's overuse of the CGI, people who still think the show is awesome and is just evolving and people who think it's just bad CGI.
  530. * ThatGuyWithTheGlasses... Where do we begin? Let's start with the Nostalgia Critic fanbase, in general, when the Nostalgia Critic starting throwing out that the movie can give off some good points, the fans were mad because he wasn't as vitriolic and didn't yell that much, when he started being vitriolic, they complained he was being completely unfair, and the cycle just doesn't stop. He at one point asked the audience if they had Multiple Personality Disorder.
  531. ** The Spoony One of TheSpoonyExperiment, who has videos on TGWTG, has to put up with this from his fans complaning about his collaboration with other TGWTG members. It got bad enough that he put up a notice on his front page appealing for manners from his fans, and change the way people comment on his main site after taking down a video of him accepting the Open Web Award for funniest person to follow after less than a day because of the vitriol tword his girlfriend who appeard in it. He still has people on his Forums who do this all the time. It's gotten to a degree where he's concered about it harming his relationship with TGWTG because his "fans" generate so much toxicity no reviewer will want to go near him. That's not mentioning the people who complain about the pace of the updates, whether its a full review or a Vlog, what genre he is reviewing, what game or movie he's reviewing, and how he reviews it. Or the people who complain about the decorations in his room.
  532. ** Let us also not forget the sheer amount of FanDumb and hating unfairly directed at {{Kickassia}} for being... exactly what it was supposed to be? The complaints? That Spoony did not get a big enough role (despite practically being the second lead, behind only Doug Walker himself), and that the writing had plot holes and nonsensical moments. What? A story in which nerds take over a Micronation and then come within an inch of destroying it within a few days during events that involve ''Santa Christ'', a teleporting President, Dr. Smith, Dr. Insano, a man being used as a flagpole, and endless amounts of other ludicrous happens that happen for the sake of comedy was supposed to make perfect logical sense? You'd almost think you weren't supposed to take the whole thing seriously. So yeah... Makes one shudder to think how these people would react to your standard Leslie Nielsen comedy...
  533. ** While this applies as a whole to TGWTG (except possibly Linkara), this is especially the case with Spoony and the Nostalgia Critic. First they complain that they yell to much and are unfunny because of this. So they yell less and introduce sketches and add more complexity to the reviews. Either [[TheSpoonyExperiment he's trying to hard,]] [[NostalgiaCritic or he's being too nice]]. And that's not getting into all the hate they get from [[HePannedItNowHeSucks their more controversial reviews...]]
  534. [[/folder]]
  536. [[folder:WesternAnimation]]
  537. * Ever since the Academy Awards added the Best Animated Feature and Best Animated Short Film categories, animation fans have been complaining that the award "ghettoizes" animation.
  538. * ''TheSimpsons''' fanbase. The [[StrawFan Comic Book Guy]] exists largely so that the writers can comment on the phenomenon.
  539. ** In fact, the episode that introduced his catchphrase ("Worst. Episode. Ever.") took ''another'' shot at this trope by showing the creator of Itchy and Scratchy attempting to focus test the fans to figure out what they wanted to make the show better. The children in the focus group all have myriad, contradicting suggestions for improving the series that are utterly useless to the writing staff.
  540. * The fanbase of the {{DCAU}} cannot seem to move on now that said DCAU has ended, and will automatically despise any new DC show that comes along as a result. This includes ''TeenTitans'', ''LegionOfSuperheroes'', and (most infamously) ''TheBatman'' [[strike:Probably gonna happen with]], and ''[=~Batman: The Brave and the Bold~=]''.
  541. ** It seems to have mellowed with the last one, but it still has its hatedom.
  542. ** It was much worse a few years ago back when ''JusticeLeague'' was still on the air. There seemed to be no end to the complaining in forums such as World's Finest over George Newburn's voice not being right for Superman or the Cadmus arc not living up to expectations.
  543. * The ''{{Daria}}'' fanbase gets quite violent about {{Shipping}}, even several years past the end of the show and the regular airing of reruns. Especially when the subject of Tom comes up.
  544. ** Not so much, anymore - especially with the fandom shifting more over towards the ''Daria Expanded Universe'' (which include fan-based works) and some of the better ships with fanon characters. Richard Rawlings, Michael Fulton - the day of the T(h)om-haters has passed.
  545. * ''KimPossible''. The main argument here is if Kim is the victim of {{Chickification}} or not.
  546. * Disney's ''{{The Princess and the Frog}}'' is their first movie to have a black Disney Princess. It's been plagued with controversy from its announcement, with some people decrying her original name "Maddy" (later changed to Tiana) as stereotypically a lower-class slave name, to her position as a chambermaid (several of the "Disney Princesses" were also of low station), to the original title of "The Frog Princess" apparently being racially insensitive, to people getting angry over the racially ambiguous prince being too white. You can still find a video on Youtube complaining about how Disney thinks all black girls "have" to have a little badonk-badonk. For context, publicity shots of Tiana were the ''only'' human character images released at the time. Other images show a diverse series of character types, including a Creole witch doctor (also racist!), a black voodoo godmother who helps the main characters (labeled a MagicNegro before ''anything'' was revealed about her character), and then the requisite animal characters.
  547. ** For a more recent example, read the [[http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1162718/Disney-feature-black-princess--critics-complain-falls-love-WHITE-prince.html DailyMail]] milking this for all its worth. Oh, the irony.
  548. ** To be fair, Disney does have a nasty track record of UnfortunateImplications in past attempts to appeal to minorities. ''{{Pocahontas}}'' was heavily criticised for resurrecting the stereotype of the NobleSavage or their supposed usage of Naomi Campbell when trying to come up with the image of an actual historical Native American woman. (She was actually based on her Native American Voice Actress) Fifty years ago they did some racially insensitive portrayals of black characters (See ''{{Song of the South}}'' or ''{{Dumbo}}'' for just two such examples). The problem is more that the vast majority of cries about "racism" for this project are seriously overblown make it hard to take even the legitimate concerns seriously.
  549. ** [[http://community.livejournal.com/froglegss/13736.html The Livejournal Community for the movie has this discussion on this topic]] which has fans (many of them black) saying how they actually disagree with all of the "racism" cries. Read it and breathe a sigh of relief. It's hard to take someone seriously when they're decrying a Randy Newman jazz song as a "Negro Spiritual".
  550. ** Many have expressed outrage over Ray the firefly being a blatant black stereotype, even though he has spiky red hair and a pretty well done Cajun (read: white) accent. Now, it would be just as wrong to mock the Cajun people, but there've been funny accented Disney sidekicks before, and they usually outshine the leads in terms of personality and character development. Keep in mind all we've seen of the character so far is him smiling at the camera, saying two inoffensive lines and flying away.
  551. ** Following the announcement of ''The Princess and the Frog'' having the first African American Disney princess, people immediately started crying racism, from the princess's original name (Maddy, apparently too close to "mammy") to her original job as a chambermaid (conveniently forgetting that Disney/{{Cinderella}} and SnowWhite were also in servitude in their movies). Even after Disney changed the name and job, people still complained about Tiana's "ghetto" accent (ignoring the fact that she was a resident of New Orleans), her character not being drawn attractive enough, and her character being drawn as a "stereotypical" black girl. Her prince, Naveen, has come under fire as well. Disney deliberately made him AmbiguouslyBrown, leading one half of complainers to scream that Disney is balking at their first interracial romance and the other half whining about how little African American boys won't have a Disney prince for the African American girls' princess.
  552. ** Let's not forget the dust kicked up when AlanMenken was replaced by RandyNewman as the film's score composer.
  553. * For all of their complaints about the AnimationAgeGhetto, 3D animation fans decry ''any'' 3D film not made by Pixar, regardless of its own merits. Somehow, [[ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontWatch they all have penguins]].
  554. ** [[http://io9.com/5501472/latest-despicable-me-trailer-packed-with-orphans-kitties-and-tiny-yellow-minions This post on]] ''DespicableMe'' is an excellent example of the DoubleStandard. Even if having an evil or amoral character being given kids to take care in order to humanize him is arguably derivative, Pixar's [[ToyStory flagship franchise]] is based on the very, ''very'' old idea of childhood toys being alive when you're not looking, and ''{{Up}}'' was another Pixar film with several similar plot elements as DM.
  555. ** Inverted with the Pixar fanbase itself, which is probably the most easily pleasable fanbase in the world. It helps that the fanbase seems to [[BiasSteamroller include many critics]].
  556. * For ''{{TMNT 2003}}'', there is the Fast Forward season, which was reviled upon announcement, and was met by Critical Backlash by many 2003 fans, who preferred the grim tone (Can you blame them?), but when Back To The Sewers was announced to be going back to New York, some fans went insane, this is probably because of news that, among other things, [[AndTheFandomRejoiced there was going to be a Triceraton Shredder]] in the scrapped second season, but the season wasn't produced because of general unpopularity with the fans.
  557. * ''ScoobyDoo'' fandom (and FanDumb)
  558. * Many ''{{Futurama}}'' fans complained that Leela was constantly being portrayed as a GodModeSue, so the show's writers tried to redress the balance by showing her to be a terrible Blernsball player in "A Leela of Her Own" - which promptly became the most hated episode in the show's history, with the most common criticism being that it made Leela look bad. Admittedly a lot of the hate was due to some substandard jokes and the DownerEnding, but the episode's treatment of Leela was by far the biggest complaint.
  559. * How could we forget ''[=~Avatar: The Last Airbender~=]''? It seems ''nothing'' Mike and Bryan can do is good enough in the eyes of FanDumb.
  560. * In ''TheFairlyOddParents'' "Wishology" trilogy, Trixie kisses Timmy. Tootie shippers are mad. Then at the end, Jorgen Von Strangle erases the memories of Timmy's helpers, including Trixie's memory of kissing Timmy. Trixie shippers are mad, and Tootie shippers are still mad, because Tootie wasn't even in the movies. Nobody's happy.
  561. ** The LiveActionAdaptation that they're working on, ''Grow Up, Timmy Turner!'', also appears to be heading for this. Among what's revealed of the plot so far is that a now-adult Timmy falls for [[SheIsAllGrownUp a now-hot Tootie]], which should make up for her absence from "Wishology", but instead the fans are focusing complaining about the mere fact that it's in live-action. (Not to mention the bitter Timmy/Trixie shippers.)
  562. * The Disney fandom are at it again with ''Rapunzel''. It was originally being directed by Glen Keane, then it got handed over to Byron Howard and Nathan Greno. Some are complaining about it being rendered like 2D, but using CGI. Then there is the absolute ''[[SarcasmMode travesty]]'' of the title change to ''{{Tangled}}'' and the apparent switch of character focus to the prince Flynn Rider. HeadDesk, very much so.
  563. * All it took was to change the entire concept of American Dog to what ultimately became {{Bolt}}, (complete with the removal of Christopher Sanders from the project altogether) and suddenly John Lasseter is turning into Michael Eisner.
  564. [[/folder]]
  566. [[folder:RealLife]]
  567. * Controversial real-life example - deal with any religion in any medium, and no matter how respectful you are there's ''still'' going to be someone who'll kick up a fuss about some "blasphemy" or "ignorance" that you'll be somehow committing.
  568. ** And then there's the equally frequent commenter who rags on you for not being disrespectful ''enough''.
  569. * The American news media. You have Conservatives claiming that the news media has a liberal bias. Then you have the Liberals claiming that the media does not report enough! The media has it worse than Sega.
  570. ** For that matter, American politics in general. To quote Dave Barry, "It would be easier to get the entire population of Tokyo to wear matching outfits than to get any two randomly selected Americans to agree on pizza toppings."
  571. *** BarackObama deserves special mention. First people complain about the "[[CatchPhrase CHANGE]]" guy not actually doing anything for a year and change, then when his health care bill rolls out, there's widespread complaining, up to the level of people ''[[http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100325/ap_on_re_us/us_health_care_threats throwing bricks through windows]]''.
  572. *** For that matter, ''ANY'' person who is in a position like the Prime Minister or the president has people do the exact same thing - mostly because they don't seem to realize [[MisBlamed that this isn't actually a single-person dictatorship where the head person can do whatever they want]] and that [[YouFailGovernmentForever acts actually have to go through OTHER PEOPLE]] before getting to them in the first place. (Didn't ''ANYONE'' pay attention to SchoolHouseRock?!?)
  573. * Health Care. It was described by this person on a forum...
  574. --> "The sound of the health care debates are like that of a million bats and howler monkeys riding a 90 thrill ride through every maternity ward from China to Portugal."
  575. * Hardcore Gamers. You will be very hard-pressed to find a self-professed hardcore gamer that actually spends more time ''playing'' video games as opposed to whining and crying about them.
  576. ** Gamers in general play two games. The Crying Game and the actual games themselves. The ones who cry the most and get catered to are the winners. Never mind that Gaming is an actual business and catering solely to fans would cause so many companies to release projects that would '''lose''' money due to it catering to specific fans that won't pay enough to make it worthwhile.
  577. * Entertainment example: Orlando Bloom fans. Nothing he does is ever good enough for his [[FanDumb fangirls]] anymore, and his actions are exaggerated to the point of parody. If he goes a while without a movie role, he's lazy. If he DOES accept a role, the movie sucks. If a set of candid photos shows up, he's whoring himself out to the papes. If he falls off the grid for while, it's because no one cares about him anymore. If he's spotted with a drink in his hand, he's a hopeless alcoholic who is self-medicating. If he appears to have any kind of visible injury, he's self-destructive. Heaven forbid he should spend any length of time in LA, because then he's a sellout. Any woman he dates is the devil and proof that he has lousy taste in women ([[ShipToShipCombat unless it's Kate Bosworth]]). Trolls rarely show up to start trouble...they don't have to! Ironically, the tide seems to be slowly turning in his favor regarding the entertainment media, who [[ItsPopularNowItSucks tore him to shreds when he was popular]].
  578. ** The man fell three stories and not only survived breaking his back, ''wasn't paralyzed'' and recovered completely. No matter how popular he is or isn't, ''that'' will never be anything less than epic.
  579. *** Can we please just link that to CrowningMomentOfAwesome? Please?
  580. ** God, even the fans who like him are alarming. [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGIydk-sTwE EAT SHIT, JESSICA, IT'S CARROT!!]]
  581. * Sports example: NHL fans about any rule change, ever. Change a rule that the fans complain about, they'll start bitching about the new rule, and how it ruined the game and it's disrespecting the traditions of the game, etc. Example: the crease rule. For years, fans complained that there was a goal review every time someone scored, and that half the goals were waved off because someone's skate lace was in the crease or something. So they abolish the crease rule, and now everyone complains about how no one's protecting the goaltenders. And let's not even start on the instigator rule...
  582. * Another sports example: MLB fans. They whine about how sick and tired of hearing about the Yankees/Red Sox/Cubs/Mets/Dodgers...then once all five of them are eliminated from contention, they whine about how "no one wants to watch (team that outlasted this group) play (other team that outlasted this group)!" If we're ''lucky'', this whining doesn't start until the World Series. If we're unlucky, it starts earlier. Take this current (2008) World Series for example. They whine about how ratings are going to be bad before it even begins, then whine even more about the fact that no one's watching because Game 3 got delayed an hour and a half by rain. They also complain about the weather in Game 5, how it should've been stopped earlier (maybe true), how they shouldn't have even started (bullshit--it only just started sprinkling when the game began, and the weather forecast ''did'' say that the heavy rains weren't supposed to come until later). But if you suggest that maybe they should make every team get a dome, you're just begging to be {{Flame}}d--and the other ballpark in this Series is example number one as to why domed stadiums are an affront to the game. (Never mind the fact that there are "traditional" ballparks with design quirks much more game-altering than the Trop's catwalks--like foul territory with oddly angled walls and a garage door, a 37-foot-high wall with a slightly protruding scoreboard near the base and a not-so-slightly protruding ladder halfway up, and another set of odd angles in right center known as "The Triangle"--and this is my favorite team's home ballpark I'm talking about.) Also, the games themselves have been pretty close so far, with one exception, and to a baseball purist, this has all the makings of an all-time classic. Now all it needs is a [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_World_Series dramatic Game 6]] [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1975_World_Series extra-inning walkoff homer]] and an [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_World_Series equally dramatic Game 7,]] and it can contend for the title of greatest ever. [[WhatDoYouMeanItsNotAwesome Not bad for something that "sucks", huh?]]
  583. * Another one with an unpleasable fanbase in fans of American Open Racing. For 12 years two US championships for open wheel racing existed. CART (Championship Auto Racing team, which was formed in the 70's, then became Champ Car World Series in 2003) and IRL (Indy racing league, but the series is called Indycar Series) The difference between the two championships were that CART/CCWS ran both ovals and road/street circuits (p until 2006 when in 2007 it was just road/street circuits) while IRL ran just ovals (Up until a few years ago when it then started to add road and street circuits to their schedule.) When the two series merged in 2008 to have one series for the national championship people were still pissed. People were either pissed because of the cars the IRL used (Most people claim them as ugly which I've seen worse), a lower horsepower engine (650HP for IRL compared to the 900 some that CART ran in the mid 90's and 720 to 850 used by CCWS.) The unhappy fans go on and on about what can be done to fix it, and it's like dude Rome wasn't built in a day and neither is this. It will take time for AOW to be what it used to be and the merger was just the start.
  584. ** This could even be taken to a more general level with racing fans of any series (NASCAR, F1, etc). Some changes gets made and you have people on both sides who bitch about it (For a NASCAR example, the COT or Car of Tomorrow. Some people like it, some hate it.)
  585. * Any rating organization. If they have loose guidelines, they're accused of making the guidelines arbitrary and subjective. If they have precise guidelines, then they're laughed at for taking subjective matters too seriously.
  586. * Many radio stations tend to fall victim to this. Whenever radio stations tweak their music format, there'll be the old fans who are unhappy with the change. Note that this isn't really about radio stations changing their format completely. It's about radio stations that are [[NetworkDecay more subtle]] in tweaking the format, while acting as if they're the same radio stations that they always were.
  587. * Politics. Now let's all just walk away...
  588. ** Let's take one step further, America's Armed Forces deployments. Controversy in all 31 flavors. Invade a nation; American is labeled a bunch of imperialist cowards who hide behind big guns. Sit back and try to use tact and diplomacy instead; America gets labeled a bunch of soft dreamers who've lost their backbone and have failed the world by not using their superior firepower to uphold peace. And the best part is, this comes from... Americans by and large. You just can't freakin' win.
  589. ** British Prime Ministers are either too presidential and controlling (Margaret Thatcher & Tony Blair) or too weak and wishy-washy (Jim Callaghan, John Major).
  590. ** Taiwanese politics. In the right corner, the diehards of the Nationalist party (KMT), who still haven't gotten over their defeat against Mao in 1949 and cling to the utterly unattainable goal of reuniting China under their banner. In the left corner, the new and already corrupt legions of the Democratic party (DPP), who wish for Taiwan to become independent, ignoring the neighbouring superpower who claims it as its rebelling province. KMT supporters do not want to let Taiwan be Taiwanese, since it is part of China. DPP supporters do not want to let Taiwan be Chinese, since it is better off alone. Meanwhile the country's entire future hinges on their ability to trade and do business with China without losing their independence to the big guys...
  591. * Believe it or not, the fanbase of General Motors. Lets just say there is VEHEMENT disagreement over what GM should/shouldn't do, or what each of its brands should stand for.
  592. * Most forum software fanbases, apparently. For example, the vBulletin support forum has a ridiculous amount of whining in the hidden custom feedback forum, resulting in everything from insult meme pictures being posted as responses to people threatening to sue the company for merely $50-100 and fad avatars with little lock icons in response to locked topics. To be honest, it sometimes more resembles a gaming fanboys forum than a customer support forum on some days.
  593. * Heather "[[http://www.dooce.com/ dooce]]" Armstrong has a very popular blog, and frequently [[http://www.dooce.com/2009/08/28/containing-capital-letter-or-two makes fun of the people who complain about everything she does]]. She's not exaggerating; just look at any post with the comments open.
  594. -->It happens every single time I write something. Every. Single. Time. I am so in tune with human nature now that I've been dealing with it for eight and a half years that I can predict what someone will send me in an email in response to a word or sentence or paragraph that I've written that is totally and completely innocuous. At times I feel like an accidental puppeteer.
  595. * Apple Inc's legion of iFanboys ([[NamesTheSame which have nothng to do with the podcast of the same name]]). For years now whenever there has been a build-up to a major product launch (Apple famously refuse to comment themselves on any upcoming releases, most of the time even refusing to confirm that ''there is going to be'' a new product coming out) the rumour mill goes into overdrive, and then once the product is finally revealed the rumour sites and technology blogs will be filled with people complaining about how it isn't revolutionary enough, how it lacks basic no-brainer features, how it's not as pretty as the model it's replacing, and how it spells the beginning of the end for the company. Of course, Apple go on to sell millions of these new products and increase their user base every time, as they have done successfully now for the last decade.
  596. * '''Microsoft'''. XBox gets complained about for being heavy. 360 is maligned for its frequent failures, lack of backwards compatibility, and the mere existence of the Arcade version. The Zune is belittled for being curbstomped by the iPod in every possible way (which isn't even Microsoft's ''fault''). Office 2007 for spending Gateloads on changing the interface to try and be more accessible to new users [[http://www.collectedcurios.com/sequentialart.php?s=605 and accidentally confusing the veteran ones]]. Windows 98 was denigrated for breaking Windows 95 drivers. Windows 2000 and NT were...pretty good, actually. Windows ME was talked down to for being [[SoBadItsHorrible a buggy, broken mess]]. Windows XP was lambasted for being a candy-coated version of Windows, and changing the Start menu. Windows Vista was taken to the cleaners for breaking XP's drivers (an issue which has been mostly addressed by 2010, [[CommonKnowledge but people think it's still extant]]), and the irritating User Account Control. Finally, people have griped about [[TheAce Windows 7]] being everything Vista should've been out've the gate. [[{{TakeThat/Commercials}} A certain campaign by Apple hasn't helped]] with any of these.
  597. * The film version of ''Oliver!'', Lionel Bart's well-known musical version of ''OliverTwist'' was banned in Israel for portraying a Jew as a villain. It was also banned in a number of Muslim states for portraying a Jewish crime master too sympathetically. [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgment Now let's all just back away...]]
  598. * For years, people have complained about LeastCommonSkinTone; the lack of Black or other minority characters in sci-fi. ''{{Firefly}}'' had ''two'' black leads, as well as [[AmbiguouslyBrown whatever Inara was supposed to be]]. People promptly complained about the lack of Asians[[hottip:* :Admittedly an oversight in a series where the culture has heavy Asian influences. Of course, given that Joss was getting ScrewedByTheNetwork at the time, it may have slipped his mind.]].
  599. ** One of Joss's most acclaimed traits is his tendency to write Strong Female Characters in greater numbers and prominence than are normally seen in Hollywood. One of his most criticized traits is his alleged habit of killing off Strong Female Characters in greater numbers and prominence than are normally seen in Hollywood. People want him to have female characters who are equal to men in every way ''except'' the [[AnyoneCanDie mortality rate]].
  600. * People complain too about paying too much taxes... Even when they complain about ''what their tax money is fixing.'' I mean really, you complain about too much traffic and too much potholes, but when it comes you have to pay tax money to fix it, you bitch about paying taxes! I mean, what the hell?
  601. * Anything that has to do with The United States of America. '''And I mean Anything!''' If they help others in need, they're criticised. If they don't help others in need, they're criticised. People complain about America having arrogance when it comes to patriotism ([[{{Hypocrite}} even if their own countries do the same thing]]), yet they still complain when they embrace other cultures. And whatever the government does, whether good or bad, someone will always find a way to bash the government and especially the president. I can go on, but whatever the reason, someone will still find a reason to complain about anything American, whether it's from an American, or not.
  602. [[/folder]]
  603. * Pretty much anything is subjected to this. Even if it's a Win-Win situation for everyone, someone will still find a reason to complain.
  604. ----
  605. <<|{{Fan-Speak}}|>>
  606. <<|WebcomicTropes|>>
  607. <<|UnexpectedReactionsToThisIndex|>>
  608. <<|{{Fandom}}|>>
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