Lex Lausanne Power Gen

12:41 AM <•Wildbow> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1S7J2WtgNmgrV4gGh8yRCqGoSVrVkvO1uPqEI6muzUC0/edit#bookmark=id.deizm5aw593g - White Knight is Lightningsteps'
12:41 AM <•_> [ WD Lausanne Draft - Google Docs ] - docs.google.com
12:41 AM <Freight> That makes sense then.
12:41 AM <Niveis> I wanted White Knight or Stormy tbh.
12:41 AM <•Wildbow> Take note of the subsequent entry, the other half of the same multitrigger
12:41 AM <Niveis> The numbers totally shocked me.
12:42 AM Teruzi → •Teruzi|GM
12:42 AM <Nonagon> Changer, Master.
12:42 AM Teller → •Teller|Evans
12:42 AM <Freight> I was thinking Thinker...?
12:43 AM <Nonagon> Thinker, sure.
12:43 AM <Freight> I suppose Changer is a big one.
12:43 AM <soulpelt|> Master works too
12:43 AM <Niveis> Changer Master or Brute?
12:43 AM <Freight> I'm not seeing much Brute at all.
12:43 AM <soulpelt|> Master/Changer could be fun
12:44 AM — •Wildbow doesn't really feel the changer per se
12:44 AM <soulpelt|> Master then?
12:44 AM Dolyn → Dol|AFK
12:44 AM <•Wildbow> There's a fundamental acceptance of self.
12:44 AM <Freight> I think Thinker is bigger than Master.
12:44 AM Thalia → Thaliaway
12:45 AM <soulpelt|> Master/Thinker could be fun
12:45 AM <Freight> (This is my first time "officially" triggergenning, so keep that in mind)
12:45 AM <•Wildbow> Anyway, given it's a multi-trigger, I'd suggest instead of one power or a cohesive power, identify maybe 2 classifications for him and 2 for the other trigger.  Make four individual powers that add up into a single package
12:45 AM <soulpelt|> we get so few capes with a Thinker secondary.
12:45 AM <Olivebirdy> Can somebody C&P here/
12:45 AM <AceOfSpade> I'm feeling the Thinker, mental/psychological pain and Master, loss of friends, alienations
12:45 AM <•Wildbow> Is too long, Olive
12:45 AM <•Wildbow> 1-page in a google doc
12:45 AM <Olivebirdy> Woah
12:45 AM <Olivebirdy> why so long?
12:45 AM <•Wildbow> Again, since it's a multi-trigger, maybe a master power, a thinker power, and then 2 for the other trigger
12:46 AM <soulpelt|> oooh right
12:46 AM <•Wildbow> Since the master & thinker are his, then emphasize those
12:46 AM <soulpelt|> grab bag power
12:46 AM <•Wildbow> Make them more complex/fancy
12:46 AM <Galedeep> Well, this person bases their self-worth on taking hits for other people.
12:46 AM <Galedeep> But their trigger is about realizing that people resent that.
12:46 AM <soulpelt|> Minion Master with social Thinker?
12:46 AM <AceOfSpade> Starry feels like a Thinker too but there are shades of struggling with the problem for a long time so maybe some Tinker?
12:46 AM <Freight> I don't think they really struggled with the problem
12:47 AM <Freight> At least, not the problem they triggered from
12:47 AM <soulpelt|> the secondaries.... maybe mover and blaster?
12:47 AM <AceOfSpade> what?
12:47 AM <soulpelt|> wait nvm
12:47 AM — soulpelt| slaps self
12:47 AM — •Wildbow shakes his head at spout
12:47 AM <•Wildbow> You could also take note of striker here.
12:47 AM <soulpelt|> hmmm
12:48 AM <soulpelt|> Striker/Thinker could be fun?
12:48 AM <Galedeep> I'm just getting a 'others suffer to the benefit of the White Knight' vibe, though that may be a little harsh. Or playing it straight and he intercepts harm to others and redirects it to himself.
12:48 AM <soulpelt|> ehhhh
12:48 AM <Freight> I think Striker would be a flavor compared to Master...?
12:48 AM <Freight> So maybe Master/Thinker who in part operates via touch/close proximity?
12:48 AM <soulpelt|> I don't like that without a brute secondary to stop them from dying in their first encounter
12:49 AM <Nonagon> I was thinking some kind of power that helps defend others, if anything. Turn people into giant beetles, maybe.
12:49 AM <soulpelt|> @Galedeep
12:49 AM <Freight> They could have something other than a Brute secondary, such as an interesting flavor when taking damage upon themselves
12:49 AM <•Wildbow> What about an emotion-related master?
12:49 AM <Galedeep> Makes people respect them in some way; could work well, given that he now realizes that everyone he thought liked and respected him didn't.
12:50 AM <Galedeep> He'd have the power to MAKE them, but he would realize that it wasn't genuine.
12:50 AM <Olivebirdy> :/
12:50 AM <Galedeep> Not that bland, but starting out, that would seem to fit the 'address the issue in a way that doesn't resolve the issue'
12:50 AM <Freight> Alternatively, make people feel indebted?
12:51 AM <Galedeep> The more he does for someone, the more they have to return?
12:51 AM <Freight> Perhaps blow feelings of owing them out of proportion?
12:51 AM <Nonagon> Mixed empath thinker/emotion master? Could do single target Striker, maybe - touch somebody, get an idea of what they're feeling, ability to influence that, leverage a bunch of different bonuses from prediction/manipulation.
12:51 AM <•Wildbow> Too passive, Gale
12:51 AM <Freight> Yeah, but not quite a compulsion unless it was a very big favor to begin with
12:51 AM <Galedeep> If he steps into a fight and gets hit, they then throw themselves into the fight to defend him, he keeps defending them, they get more aggressive and keep throwing themselves into danger?
12:51 AM <Freight> Yeah, that's what I was thinking.
12:52 AM <•Wildbow> For Starry Eyes, what are you thinking for classifications?
12:52 AM <Freight> Secondary Thinker power of seeing webs of interdependence, or is that too related?
12:52 AM <AceOfSpade> emotional debt Thinker/Master with touch range? like give them an emotion, then take it away and they suffer negative consequences from the sudden loss of the feeling?
12:53 AM <Galedeep> Starry Eyes: Maybe Stranger/Striker?
12:53 AM <•Wildbow> Emotional debt is hard to quantify and messy
12:53 AM <•Wildbow> Why would you say stranger/striker?
12:53 AM <Nonagon> Starry Eyes: Thinker again, maybe Changer for "disgusted with that part of yourself" and similar. Really abstract, somebody not you is the one hurting, maybe Breaker.
12:54 AM Pink → Pink|Acacia
12:54 AM <Freight> I was seeing Changer/Tinker for Starry Eyes
12:54 AM <Galedeep> They felt ignored, in the background, then felt disgust and triggered when they saw a crowd turn on the object of their affections.
12:54 AM <Galedeep> I would assume they would want to protect that person, maybe feel aggression towards the people that turned on them. Just gave me a 'slip around and retaliate' vibe.
12:54 AM <•Wildbow> Ok.  Neither of those quite feed into the classifications you just named.
12:55 AM <Galedeep> I'll be quiet until I double check the classification suggestions again.
12:55 AM <Niveis> What Wildbro said.
12:55 AM <soulpelt|> Stranger is too much unwanted attention
12:55 AM <Niveis> ^
12:55 AM <Freight> I see at least a Changer flavor from the self-recognition of how they could use this to their advantage.
12:56 AM <Niveis> Master is too little
12:56 AM <Freight> Thoughts on that?
12:56 AM <soulpelt|> hmmm
12:56 AM <•Wildbow> Master works, even if it's isolation from one very important person.
12:56 AM <Freight> Dunno if they really feel isolated from that person though?
12:57 AM <onitan> power granter/booster like Othala or Ingenue?
12:57 AM <Niveis> Have we had that before?
12:57 AM <Freight> Okay, I think definitely Changer
12:57 AM <AceOfSpade> nah Trump trigger involve powers
12:57 AM <onitan> right
12:57 AM <Niveis> Does it have to be giving powers necessarily?
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12:57 AM <Freight> Won't stand up for the guy and realizes that. Tries to figure out how to turn the situation to their advantage and realizes that.
12:57 AM <AceOfSpade> I see the Changer for Starry, with the self disgust and all
12:57 AM <Freight> Anyone disagree?
12:58 AM <Niveis> Like empowerment physiologically?
12:58 AM <Olivebirdy> I agree
12:58 AM <•Wildbow> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1e-H--GkPrbJq4WRNYndBnjjLjE7-2kOZkjwltkP1Ong/edit - triggers & classifications are noted/explained in part here
12:58 AM <•_> [ WD Rulebook: Character Creation - Google Docs ] - docs.google.com
12:58 AM <Olivebirdy> There has to  be a type of empowerment that is not Trump
12:58 AM <onitan> striker like Panacea?
12:58 AM <Galedeep> I've read them through, just wasn't sure if they were a hard and fast rule or more of a suggestion.
12:58 AM <Freight> Definitely, but have we decided on empowerment?
12:58 AM <•Wildbow> I agree with master, thinker, and Striker for Knight.  Stranger and something else for Starry
12:58 AM <AceOfSpade> psychologically empowering like giving a confidence boost? would probably be Master
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12:59 AM <AceOfSpade> Stranger for Starry?
12:59 AM <•Wildbow> Ok, so I'm envisioning something here.
12:59 AM <Freight> Really, Stranger for Starry? I can see it, but dunno if that's really what they triggered from.
12:59 AM <•Wildbow> What's the undue/problematic attention that's driving her to trigger?
12:59 AM <Galedeep> I don't know; a group threatened their emotional wellbeing.
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1:00 AM <Nonagon> White Knight's? If anybody's.
1:00 AM <Freight> I was thinking it was her own weakness. Inability to stand up for him and self-serving thoughts.
1:00 AM <Galedeep> She is, essentially, seeing someone important to her being torn down. Add to that, she catches herself almost wanting it to happen, to benefit, and she hates that as much as she hates everyone else doing it.
1:00 AM — •Wildbow pictures a scenario where both offer a sliver of a master power. Both have master elements, they're never further apart than they are as they trigger, and yet they're in very similar places.
1:01 AM <AceOfSpade> Bow You're the one who just said Stranger as the classification you agree with for Starry
1:01 AM <Freight> I can see Master, a bit.
1:01 AM <•Wildbow> *Changer, my bad
1:01 AM <Nonagon> Ahhh. Okay. That makes more sense.
1:02 AM <Freight> Enough to justify it if Knight is getting a Master power.
1:02 AM <AceOfSpade> thought so
1:02 AM <Olivebirdy> ?
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1:02 AM <Olivebirdy> So, starry eyes gets a Changer morph that WK gets control over, and vice-versa?
1:02 AM <onitan> I saw them as Brute and healer
1:02 AM <soulpelt|> Knight is Master or Striker or Thinker, right?
1:02 AM <AceOfSpade> Thinker/Master for Knight and Changer/Master for Starry?
1:03 AM <Nonagon> WK seems more numerous minions Master (alone in a crowd), SE seems more single minion Master (single individual lost/hurt).
1:03 AM <•Wildbow> Both summon singular entities, like guardians or living chess pieces.  Both have emotion-altering striker abilities, White Knight's is energizing, outgoing, forces action, pushes toward rage.  Starry's is paralyzing, diminishing, calming, with a hint of restoration.  Both have changer powers, which would need to be defined, and both have thinker powers, which would need to be defined.
1:03 AM <Freight> I think with Knight the Master is large while Starry the Changer is large?
1:03 AM <soulpelt|> hmmm that works wilbur
1:03 AM <onitan> attraction and repulsion?
1:03 AM <•Wildbow> Rather than restorative, perhaps affecting someone with hers helps cleanse ongoing master effects or conditions.
1:04 AM <soulpelt|> can work on herself and others?
1:04 AM <•Antioch> Hey, I'm back.
1:04 AM <onitan> a ying and yang duo
1:04 AM <soulpelt|> ayyyy anti
1:04 AM <Olivebirdy> including the partner's?
1:04 AM <•Wildbow> Both have their upsides and downsides.
1:04 AM <•Antioch> Need assistance, with regard to the Lausanne power generations?
1:04 AM <•Wildbow> On it already, Ant
1:04 AM <Olivebirdy> we have all our people working on it.
1:04 AM <•Wildbow> White Knight & his pet are outgoing, aggressive, more frontline.  Starry is more backline, possibly with a ranged pet.
1:05 AM <Galedeep> Even the ones who don't know what they're doing!
1:05 AM <Aarik> ... Fuck it. Minor question, not going to ping, but would Paancea, with only what she remembers from the bank, be able to adjust a bug to block Skitters power and follow it's 'signal' back to her? would resolve a minor petty argument neatly if answered.
1:05 AM <Galedeep> Hooray for helping!
1:05 AM <•Wildbow> Not the place for this, Aarik, nor is it appropriate timing, either.
1:05 AM <Niveis> Head over to #Parahumans
1:05 AM <Aarik> k
1:05 AM <Aarik> sorry
1:05 AM <Niveis> It's fine.
1:05 AM <•Wildbow> (It's not)
1:05 AM <onitan> fire pet and water pet?
1:06 AM <Niveis> No, that's not relevant to the trigger.
1:06 AM <•Wildbow> I was thinking warrior and archer.
1:06 AM <Niveis> What aesthetics can we harvest from the trigger?
1:06 AM <Freight> So are we not saying Knight's Master is strong and Starry's weak?
1:06 AM <Niveis> No, they're just oriented in different ways.
1:06 AM <Niveis> A brute and a blaster basically.
1:07 AM <onitan> should there be "blanks" in each power that they can combine like puzzle pieces?
1:07 AM <Niveis> No.
1:07 AM <Freight> Because I thought that that was most multitriggers—one strong and one weak aspect, switched for each of them.
1:07 AM <AceOfSpade> Starry's minion is probably more frail if it's meat to be used from a distance
1:07 AM <AceOfSpade> meant*
1:07 AM <Niveis> ^
1:07 AM <•Wildbow> What Ace just said.
1:07 AM <Niveis> Doesn't mean it's weaker though.
1:07 AM <Galedeep> Maybe fragile by design. It goes, and it has that calming/paralytic effect as it poofs.
1:08 AM <Galedeep> Easier to make, easier to destroy. His is more durable, meant to last for the duration.
1:08 AM <AceOfSpade> nah not a suicide bomber minion, I prefer the ranged one
1:08 AM <Niveis> ^
1:08 AM <Galedeep> I was just thinking, he's alone, she's part of a crowd.
1:08 AM <Freight> All right, what if we combined aspects?
1:09 AM <Niveis> An archer doesn't have as much armor as a warrior does.
1:09 AM <Freight> Hers creates suicide-bombing dupes and that's the ranged aspect?
1:09 AM <AceOfSpade> she's hangin in the background, he's in front of everyone, it depend on how you see it
1:09 AM <Freight> One level of recursive minion-creating
1:09 AM <Shemetz> Maybe a ranged minion that is hard to find, or hard to track?
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1:10 AM <Freight> That sounds a bit Stranger
1:10 AM <Niveis> Suicide bomber isn't really ranged at all.
1:10 AM <onitan> sniper?
1:11 AM <AceOfSpade> I don't think it's neccessary to make it hard to find, the ranged minion isn't the main power and she has three other...
1:11 AM <Niveis> Wild was trying to articulate a bow-wielder vs a sword-wielder
1:11 AM <Olivebirdy> Don't they need crowd-control?
1:11 AM <AceOfSpade> no?
1:12 AM <Niveis> What about we make the thinker power relevant to hiding and diversion for Starry and the White Knight one relevant to tracking?
1:12 AM <Galedeep> Could be bright/darkness; maybe she can tag people and they get a shadow that calms them, slows them down, breaks them out of other effects?
1:12 AM <Niveis> It supplements the usage of their masters.
1:12 AM <Freight> Why do we need hiding and diversion?
1:12 AM <Galedeep> While his is big, bright, in your face.
1:12 AM <Freight> Also, suicide bombing is ranged when you have minions doing it.
1:12 AM <Niveis> The individuals aren't ranged though.
1:13 AM ⇐ BR quit (BR@net-rfb0u1.resnet.ucsb.edu) Quit: leaving
1:13 AM <Freight> All right.
1:13 AM <•Somecrazyguy> I feel I'm too far out of the loop to help with this one
1:13 AM <•Somecrazyguy> :/
1:13 AM <AceOfSpade> So far we have, Knight with Striker rage, Close combat minion, undefined changer and thinker power, Starry with soothing calming striker power and ranger minion, undefined changer and thinker power
1:13 AM <Galedeep> Hey, I'm throwing stuff out there. It isn't sticking, but I'm giving it a shot, haha
1:13 AM <Niveis> Kudos, Gale
1:13 AM <onitan> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1S7J2WtgNmgrV4gGh8yRCqGoSVrVkvO1uPqEI6muzUC0/edit#
1:13 AM <•_> [ WD Lausanne Draft - Google Docs ] - docs.google.com
1:14 AM <AceOfSpade> remember that the powers aren't neccesarily intermingled, the cape has a striker power, not the minion
1:14 AM <•Wildbow> Writing something up atm
1:15 AM <Nonagon> @scg: http://pastebin.com/zsRZbN7R
1:15 AM <•_> [ wb's outline - Pastebin.com ] - pastebin.com
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1:17 AM <AceOfSpade> that whole, Background and Frontline theme could be present on all their powers, maybe Knight has some kind of fast but short range Thinker power while Starry need a bit more time, a bit more calm to concentrate but has more scope
1:17 AM <Niveis> Maybe intermingle their Changer and Striker abilities, AceOfSpade?
1:17 AM <AceOfSpade> I was just thinking that
1:18 AM <Galedeep> Maybe auras? His is bright, hard light, lashes out around him while he wades in with his striker power, with those he hits getting more aggressive, while hers is shadowy, blasts out gaseous balls that hit and weaken, make the targets slower, more apathetic, eventually stopping them in their tracks?
1:18 AM <Galedeep> Eh. Maybe too generic.
1:18 AM <AceOfSpade> at least for Knight, have the changer ability help with the striker ppower
1:18 AM <Niveis> Mhmn
1:18 AM <AceOfSpade> I was thinking Starry's changer power could help her evade instead
1:18 AM <Niveis> Mhmn
1:20 AM <•Wildbow> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mm9Ggvj7G8D3XDm_m1ISTjzqM02py6CmNp3YhniWMTk/edit?usp=sharing
1:20 AM <•_> [ White Knight & Starry - Google Docs ] - docs.google.com
1:20 AM <AceOfSpade> on the other hand... what is Knight induced rage? something beneficial for his allies, like a berserker rage or something bad for his enemies, like incoherent frothing at the mouth, incapable of defending himself and clumsily attacking
1:20 AM <AceOfSpade> Oh writeup
1:21 AM <soulpelt|> Hmmm I like it
1:21 AM <•Antioch> By the way, Bow, have you formatted SCG's Lausanne logs today?
1:21 AM <•Antioch> If not, I can do that for you real quick.
1:21 AM <Galedeep> Neat.
1:21 AM <Freight> These seem very powerful.
1:21 AM <Nonagon> they'll need 'em
1:21 AM <soulpelt|> mhm
1:23 AM <•Somecrazyguy> Anti you can just go
1:23 AM <•Somecrazyguy> TL;DR archers, scans, met a hero, went to a lodge, traded info
1:23 AM <•Somecrazyguy> bam
1:23 AM <•Somecrazyguy> P.S. Truck
1:23 AM <•Wildbow> I can do 'em.
1:24 AM <Niveis> I'm not sure what you mean by Archer and Warrior aesthetically.
1:24 AM <•Somecrazyguy> Warriors have sabers
1:24 AM <•Wildbow> Big guy in armor.  Woman, formed only from torso up, with bow.
1:24 AM <AceOfSpade> Ranged combat and Melee combat
1:24 AM <Niveis> Humanoid lookng?
1:24 AM <•Wildbow> Yeah.  Well, caryatid humanoid, but yeah
1:25 AM <soulpelt|> I imagined the archer having no legs but a solid base
1:25 AM <Niveis> mhmn
1:25 AM <lightningsteps> Tell me when you're done folks, I have some questions...
1:25 AM <Galedeep> These two would be a scary team.
1:25 AM <Nonagon> Mmm.
1:25 AM <soulpelt|> they are team mates iirc
1:25 AM <Nonagon> They are.
1:25 AM <•Wildbow> If they so decide
1:25 AM <Galedeep> These two will be a scary team.
1:25 AM <Galedeep> :P
1:25 AM <Nonagon> Good powers don't mean anything unless you can leverage them effectively.
1:25 AM <Niveis> Enemies is so much more fun
1:26 AM <•Wildbow> Anyway, complaints, do I need to tone it down?
1:26 AM <AceOfSpade> who got Starry again?
1:26 AM <soulpelt|> nah
1:26 AM <•Wildbow> Lex, IIRC
1:26 AM <AceOfSpade> looks good to me
1:26 AM <soulpelt|> seem good to me
1:26 AM <Shemetz> Both can only have a single minion at a time, right?
1:26 AM <•Wildbow> Yes.
1:26 AM <Nonagon> Yeah, Lex.
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1:26 AM <Shemetz> Can either use their Striker thing on the other one's minion?
1:27 AM <Niveis> It wouldn't matter.
1:27 AM <Shemetz> I guess it's something that can be tested in-game
1:28 AM <•Wildbow> (Might well be counterintuitive in each case)
1:28 AM <AceOfSpade> well Starry's striker power on Knight minion wouldn't be very useful, Knight's rage ont Starry's minion could be scary on the other hand
1:28 AM <Shemetz> ^
1:29 AM <Shemetz> Immobile archer shouldn't be very bothered by inability to retreat :)
1:29 AM <AceOfSpade> downsides of the rage is can't retreat or defend self, but an immobile archer attacking from afar wouldn't care about that
1:29 AM <Nonagon> "Her attacks and her pets’ attacks roll vs. both block & dodge and target the lower value." <- this is the only part I think might be a bit strong. On its own, it'd be pretty mechanically strong, combined with a 100' high-Dex turret you can buff, I think it might be a bit much.
1:30 AM <•Wildbow> A turret that takes a round to get set up, that may end up being fragile, depending on how we assign stats.
1:31 AM <Shemetz> Does that mean that she rolls one attack roll, the enemy rolls twice (once with dodge modifier, and once with block modifier), and then she gets to compare her roll to the lowest of the results?
1:31 AM <AceOfSpade> seem like a fair trade since it's a ranged minion
1:31 AM <Shemetz> Or just that she always targets the lower *modifier*?
1:31 AM <•Wildbow> Yes, Shemetz.
1:31 AM <•Wildbow> Yes.
1:31 AM <•Wildbow> (The former)
1:31 AM Thaliaway → Thalia
1:32 AM <•Wildbow> I like it as is, but if you wanted to change it, we could emphasize the 'free attacks of opportunity vs. the distracted'
1:32 AM <soulpelt|> hmm the archer is fragile but fast shooting?
1:32 AM <Shemetz> So I agree with Non, it might be a little bit too strong as one of four powers.
1:32 AM <•Wildbow> One strong shot/round
1:32 AM <soulpelt|> only has one moderate wound slot before being destroyed?
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1:33 AM <soulpelt|> hey Xaxa
1:33 AM <Cxaxakluth> Hi
1:34 AM Thalia → Tha|AWolfe
1:34 AM <AceOfSpade> one wound slot, normal rules? that way it's take two moderate wounds to kill it, or three minor,
1:35 AM → justlurking joined (justlurking@net-d2vdf5.mn.comcast.net)
1:35 AM — soulpelt| pulls justlurking into the light
1:35 AM <justlurking> kk
1:35 AM <soulpelt|> :p
1:36 AM <Shemetz> Those two sound like a nightmare to fight, even when seperated
1:36 AM <•Wildbow> Hi lurk
1:36 AM <justlurking> hello
1:37 AM <justlurking> I'll try out an easy campaign a guess
1:37 AM <AceOfSpade> eh, I could take Starry without too much problem I think
1:38 AM <Tha|AWolfe> Ooooh, confident.
1:38 AM <Galedeep> "I can take her."
1:38 AM <•Wildbow> @ justlurk - we're just doing character gen now
1:38 AM <justlurking> ahh
1:38 AM <•Wildbow> How satisfied are we with how things stand atm?
1:38 AM <justlurking> uhh in what?
1:38 AM <Nonagon> Hmm. Yeah, with that statline, I think the double targeting is okay. Was imagining a bigger bonus to to-hit. At +1 to-hit, versus an enemy with Guts 4/Ath 3 or Guts 3/Ath 4, 68% chance of hit. At +2, 81% chance of hit. High, but not terrible.
1:39 AM <•Wildbow> She does get more attacks if exercising the thinker power
1:39 AM <AceOfSpade> but it's not going to be an issue since they will probably be heroes, I don't see White Knight going villain, so if they team up they'll both be heroes, and since I'm a hero I won't have a reason to fighr
1:39 AM <onitan> so Starry acta like the spotter and can sense locations via emotions? so she can direct the statue to shoot people she can sense but not see?
1:40 AM <•Wildbow> Also responsible for defending her turret, so to speak, with general clout from changer form.
1:40 AM <Shemetz> I definitely like how almost each of their sub-powers are two sides of the same coin
1:41 AM <•Wildbow> Also, I highly suspect that if played to character/background, they'll find there are a few tricky bits in there.
1:42 AM <Shemetz> They feel like two minibosses in an RPG, who both survive the fight after being defeated and later fight the player together as a single final boss
1:42 AM <onitan> if the statues are broken, how fast can they be resummoned? knight is instantly and starrry is another round in between?
1:42 AM <AceOfSpade> well they both have to roll one flaw and one perk, these can change things faaaaaast
1:42 AM <justlurking> why not give them balanced stats?
1:42 AM <justlurking> I mean
1:43 AM <justlurking> If you haven't
1:43 AM <AceOfSpade> powers aren't balanced, stronger in some areas, weaker in others
1:43 AM <Shemetz> Who are their two players? lightningsteppe and lax?
1:43 AM <•Wildbow> Yeah
1:43 AM <AceOfSpade> yep
1:43 AM <justlurking> I mean like areas like in brawn and dex
1:44 AM <AceOfSpade> the players decide their stats
1:44 AM <•Wildbow> Aye
1:44 AM <•Wildbow> Not that fast, Oni
1:44 AM <justlurking> sorry
1:44 AM <•Wildbow> No worries, JL
1:44 AM <justlurking> I thought they were NPCs
1:44 AM <justlurking> sorry
1:44 AM <•Wildbow> Are we ready for Lightning to roll luck?
1:44 AM <onitan> so how fast?
1:44 AM <Freight> This might get pretty complicated...
1:45 AM <•Wildbow> 1 round + standard 1 round for Knight.  2 rounds +1 round for Archer.
1:45 AM <AceOfSpade> I think the question of how fast the minions are recreated if destroyed need an answer before the luck roll
1:45 AM <AceOfSpade> aaaaaaand it's done
1:45 AM <Shemetz> Well, let's hope the perks don't give them -another- power
1:45 AM <•Wildbow> Ha
1:45 AM <AceOfSpade> lol
1:45 AM <Tha|AWolfe> Let's go power perks!
1:45 AM — Nonagon prays for the opposite.
1:45 AM — Tha|AWolfe howls
1:45 AM <•Wildbow> First of all, Lightning, you had questions?
1:46 AM <•Wildbow> We'll roll luck in a sec
1:46 AM <lightningsteps> Yup
1:46 AM <AceOfSpade> I kinda agree with Non, it could be funny
1:46 AM — justlurking has no idea what is happening
1:46 AM <lightningsteps> First off, have you considered the range of control? And the manner? Can I see what my minions sees etc
1:46 AM <Nonagon> You can't see what minion sees, minion can see what you can see.
1:47 AM <•Wildbow> ^
1:47 AM <Nonagon> "Can see through creator’s eyes (not vice-versa)"
1:48 AM <•Somecrazyguy> I don't know about White Knight
1:48 AM <•Somecrazyguy> I feel like the power doesn't speak as much to the trigger event as I expect
1:48 AM <lightningsteps> What if I had an aerial drone right above the guy (or even simpler, a camera on him) and I'm half a city over. Can I control him?
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1:48 AM <•Somecrazyguy> IE his problem of constantly protecting people should manifest somehow
1:48 AM <•Wildbow> It does, SCG
1:49 AM <•Wildbow> Think about it
1:49 AM <justlurking> hello
1:49 AM <•Wildbow> @ steps - very poorly, I imagine
1:49 AM <Nonagon> It's direct mental control, then?
1:49 AM <onitan> did they have drones in 2002?
1:49 AM <justlurking> I mean
1:49 AM <lightningsteps> Maybe not. They do have tinkers though
1:50 AM <justlurking> yeah
1:50 AM <Freight> Thing that bugs me is that white knight literally controls a knight, but I guess that's forgivable.
1:50 AM <Nonagon> Oh, hmm. "Ranged attack that adds to Starry’s own attack options." Does this mean that Starry and Archer Caryatid can't both attack in the same round?
1:50 AM <onitan> how about a beast?
1:51 AM <•Somecrazyguy> I don't quite get it, but maybe I'm just being dumb. Idk mayne.
1:51 AM <onitan> hunter and beast. Greek mythology theme
1:51 AM <•Wildbow> Beast can work.  Lion?
1:52 AM <Freight> I like the knight/archer theme.
1:52 AM <AceOfSpade> I think lion fits though I'm tempted to suggest Chimera and other mythological monsters
1:52 AM <Shemetz> Frenzy-fighter and archer
1:52 AM <Nonagon> @SCG: The Master and Changer powers make him and his minion a beefy tank that can defend others, and the Thinker power means he knows where enemies are (and thus where to stand to protect allies).
1:52 AM <Shemetz> Wild and Bow
1:52 AM <Freight> Would want another theme that ties together just as well. Having the knight isn't too big of an issue.
1:52 AM <•Somecrazyguy> I get that Non
1:52 AM <onitan> Diana and the stag?
1:52 AM <•Wildbow> @ SCG - the character is driven to protect people, but the methodology is overzealous and aggressive.  Actually defending people is hard.
1:52 AM <Pink|Acacia> attis
1:52 AM <Niveis> a wolf would be cool.
1:52 AM <Pink|Acacia> wolves are so overdone it hurts
1:53 AM <soulpelt|> Fox and hound?
1:53 AM <•Somecrazyguy> ...I thought it would go the opposite way bow, but I guess that works if that's what you're going for
1:53 AM <Niveis> Nah
1:53 AM <Niveis> a bear?
1:53 AM <Shemetz> David and Goliath!
1:53 AM <Niveis> No.
1:53 AM <lightningsteps> Anyhow, next.  Considering that I recreate my knight through the piece of my power that creates me armor and other equipment - Can I recreate parts of my minion (and at what range), if so the speed should be decided as well. Also, what's your image of my minion? Is it hollow inside and could I enter inside of it if I wanted to. That'd be all I think
1:53 AM <•Somecrazyguy> Defending people is way easy with the power but at expense of himself was where I was going
1:53 AM <•Somecrazyguy> but maybe I wanted to hit it too hard on the nose
1:53 AM <•Somecrazyguy> anywho, it works.
1:54 AM <Pink|Acacia> if it's a knight, why not a horse?
1:54 AM <justlurking> perhaps they are linked like if it is damaged he is damaged?
1:54 AM <•Wildbow> I'd say you can't recreate parts of your minion without recreating it wholly.
1:54 AM <Shemetz> It probably isn't hollow, lightning...
1:54 AM <•Wildbow> If it's damaged, you either remake it from scratch or deal.
1:55 AM <onitan> lol Artemis is associated with the deer, bear, and boar
1:55 AM <AceOfSpade> There were carnivorous horses in Heracles twelve labors...
1:55 AM <onitan> Wild and Bow would work
1:55 AM — •Somecrazyguy resists the bopping urges
1:56 AM <justlurking> yes and what happened to the owner of the horses?
1:56 AM <justlurking> hmm?
1:56 AM <AceOfSpade> oh he got eaten but it would be interesting as a minion I think
1:56 AM <justlurking> true
1:56 AM <AceOfSpade> maybe a cross between horse and lion?
1:57 AM <justlurking> maybe a manticore?
1:57 AM <lightningsteps> So, bow - hollow? Not hollow? And how do I roll exactly one perk and one flaw? If you are, indeed, done.
1:57 AM <•Wildbow> Roll 2d2 to decide life vs. power
1:57 AM <•Wildbow> Type $roll 2d2
1:57 AM — Niveis votes for them to be called Freya and Freyr
1:57 AM <soulpelt|> two flaws?
1:57 AM <AceOfSpade> one flaw one perk
1:57 AM <Nonagon> you can do $perk and $flaw, actually.
1:57 AM <Shemetz> @lightning I think if it were hollow it'd be specifically mentioned, and it'd probably have less than 4 guts and 3 armor
1:57 AM <•Wildbow> Or that
1:57 AM <Niveis> Inbred german mythological god twins
1:57 AM <•Wildbow> Just type $perk
1:58 AM <lightningsteps> $perk
1:58 AM <•[ATM]> lightningsteps [Power Perk 72]: Alumnor.  More with others than with themselves, the character has a capability when it comes to nurturing powers.  Two options.
1:58 AM <•[ATM]> The first is that powered individuals will gain power perks after roughly 1.5 months of the character's company, with the time until the next perk doubling for each perk they already have - the Alumnor cape gets the ability to gain a teamwork-related bonus tying into the cape's power (such as minor fire resistance for a pyrokinetic) OR they can have the ability to revoke the perk and instead
1:58 AM <•[ATM]> apply a penalty that inverts that perk (if not possible, roll a flaw; they can cancel the perk and apply the flaw at will).  In short sessions, one ally gets a power perk at reduced effect, can still have pick of two aforementioned possibilities.
1:58 AM <•[ATM]> The second option is that unpowered individuals who spend a prolonged period with the cape have five times the chance to trigger (typically 5%, in a grave situation).  Said characters aren't necessarily loyal, are always weaker than the Alumnor cape, and often are related to the character's theme, style, ideology, powerset or other traits on an abstract level.
1:58 AM <Nonagon> 1.5 months. Ha ha.
1:58 AM <Niveis> Hah!
1:58 AM <AceOfSpade> Lol
1:58 AM <Niveis> They'll last ~10 minutes.
1:58 AM <soulpelt|> interesting
1:59 AM <onitan> apropos
2:00 AM <soulpelt|> one more perk or a flaw now?
2:00 AM <lightningsteps> Is it me that's choosing the option?
2:00 AM <Niveis> Gullinbursti, what is he going with?
2:00 AM <lightningsteps> $flaw
2:00 AM <•[ATM]> lightningsteps [Life Flaw 15]: Fight prone.  The character is reckless, aggressive, more inclined to pick fights, less inclined to run or walk away.  Stepping away from a fight, holding back while being provoked, or being patient while waiting for an opportune moment to strike may require a Guts roll (willpower centered) to do.
2:00 AM <•[ATM]> May have a harder time building relationships with those who aren't of similar mindset or a villainous or fearsome disposition.  As a subordinate, may be able to be managed via. Social rolls.  As a leader, aggressive tendencies may be expressed to eager to please underlings.
2:01 AM <AceOfSpade> appropriate
2:01 AM <•Wildbow> Gotta love when the perks/flaws line up
2:01 AM <soulpelt|> nice!
2:01 AM <justlurking> well
2:01 AM <Shemetz> Indeed
2:01 AM <Nonagon> Alumnor actually is pretty appropriate for White Knight, now that you mention it. Does he get the "one alley gets a power perk at reduced effect" thing since, y'know.
2:01 AM <Niveis> (Gullinbursti = mythological golden boar)
2:01 AM <Nonagon> *ally
2:01 AM <AceOfSpade> I was expecting the luck roll to screw with the background, make him a coward or something
2:02 AM <soulpelt|> sometimes the dice are kind
2:02 AM <Niveis> (It was a mechanized boar made by Brokkr and Eitri as a gift for Freyr.)
2:02 AM <soulpelt|> that's one of the more fun flaws
2:03 AM <Niveis> Mhmn
2:04 AM <justlurking> so...
2:04 AM <justlurking> what's next?
2:05 AM <Nonagon> 'bow decides which Alumnor option to go with, I figure, then Lex rolls his $perk and $flaw.
2:05 AM <AceOfSpade> ^
2:05 AM <Shemetz> And then we get to think of names for the duo!
2:05 AM <justlurking> ahh
2:05 AM <lightningsteps> Oh, one more question, sry guys: how long does it take to summon things on myself, how long do they last, how durable are they and do they have any weight?
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2:06 AM <soulpelt|> I thought the player chose the alumnor thing
2:06 AM <Lex> And for me as well?
2:06 AM <•Wildbow> Ah, you're there, hi Lex
2:06 AM <•Wildbow> Up to 15 minutes depending on how heavy it is, as long as you want it available, Roughly as durable as stone albeit half the weight.
2:06 AM <•Wildbow> Want to roll your perk/flaw, lex?
2:07 AM <Niveis> d0 y0ur 5h17 y0u lucky b4574rd, l3x.
2:07 AM <Lex> Hi, sorry, my browser was being weird, been playing catch up
2:07 AM ← Niveis was kicked by Wildbow (chatzilla@net-49sf0f.user.start.ca)
2:07 AM <Lex> yes I will
2:07 AM → Niveis joined (Niveis@net-40rrjp.ga.charter.com)
2:07 AM <Niveis> Leet earned me death?
2:07 AM <•Wildbow> You've seen the doc, Lex?
2:07 AM <soulpelt|> type $perk
2:07 AM <Nonagon> "[20:06:34] <soulpelt|> I thought the player chose the alumnor thing" That actually is a minor editing thing that should probably be done at some point, making it clear which perks/flaws are "player picks" and which are "group picks."
2:07 AM <Lex> $perk
2:07 AM <•[ATM]> Lex [Power Perk 4]: Possess a kind of magnetism for shards.  Short term benefit is a better first impressions with capes.  Longer-term benefit is that capes are drawn to the character and are more content in character's vicinity, possibly with their flaws to powers being reduced in intensity by a step, or some other tangential benefit.
2:07 AM <soulpelt|> hahahhaha
2:07 AM <•Wildbow> This pair.
2:07 AM <Tha|AWolfe> Oh god
2:07 AM <Shemetz> ...
2:07 AM <•Wildbow> Wow
2:07 AM <Nonagon> That's super perfect, damn.
2:07 AM <soulpelt|> omg
2:07 AM <Freight> Wow.
2:07 AM <Nonagon> Alumnor/magnetism.
2:07 AM <soulpelt|> hahahaha
2:07 AM <AceOfSpade> omg
2:07 AM <Niveis> :O
2:07 AM <onitan> lol
2:07 AM <Nonagon> even the power perks are multi-triggers.
2:08 AM <Shemetz> There's a flaw too, though
2:08 AM <Niveis> :O
2:08 AM <soulpelt|> if they get flight prone....
2:08 AM <Freight> It's probably going to be really good
2:08 AM <•Wildbow> Nah, something else for her.
2:08 AM — Nonagon prays for Coward.
2:08 AM <AceOfSpade> and then the flaw screw everything
2:08 AM <Niveis> "You're not aggressive, and painfully pacifistic"
2:08 AM <•Wildbow> (Or him)
2:08 AM <Nonagon> it's Ruin.
2:08 AM <Lex> do I roll it?
2:08 AM <•Wildbow> Sure
2:08 AM <Niveis> $simurg 100
2:08 AM <soulpelt|> type $flaw now
2:08 AM <Nonagon> yeah, $flaw
2:08 AM <Niveis> $simurgh 100
2:08 AM <•Somecrazyguy> pffthahaha
2:08 AM <Niveis> Please, Smurfy...
2:08 AM <Lex> too much ziz
2:08 AM <•Somecrazyguy> only bow can control smurf
2:08 AM <•Wildbow> Stop being a pain, Nive.
2:09 AM <Lex> $flaw
2:09 AM <•[ATM]> Lex [Power Flaw 17]: Clunky Power.  The power takes a full-round action to use, and/or is easily interrupted, provoking attacks of opportunity from those nearby.  It may come with increased power, but use of the ability is a strategic decision.  If and when the use of the power is interrupted, it tends to go haywire.
2:09 AM <Nonagon> Damn. not Ruin.
2:09 AM <Freight> O.o
2:09 AM <•Somecrazyguy> ohshit.png
2:09 AM <soulpelt|> awww
2:09 AM <Freight> Doesn't it already take a full round?
2:09 AM <onitan> all fitting
2:09 AM <•Somecrazyguy> now it takes TWO
2:09 AM <Lex> So, basically just my power?
2:09 AM <•Somecrazyguy> riggity rekt g
2:09 AM <Shemetz> Well...which of the four is clunky? :)
2:09 AM <Nonagon> yeah
2:09 AM <AceOfSpade> all of them!
2:10 AM <•Wildbow> Beefing up the archer turret a bit more.  Slower to raise it up, longer cooldown to replace.
2:10 AM <soulpelt|> so 2 round to make/replace?
2:10 AM <Nonagon> similar effect with Changer or no?
2:10 AM <•Wildbow> Turning question mark on striker power to a period.
2:10 AM <•Wildbow> Have to grapple to apply striker power to unwilling targets.
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2:11 AM <•Wildbow> 2 rounds to make, 4 to replace.
2:11 AM <soulpelt|> this pair is going to be scary to fight
2:11 AM <•Wildbow> She can plant the seed and then carry on with her actions for the 2 rounds while it grows, though
2:11 AM <justlurking> if I ever join this campaign
2:11 AM <soulpelt|> one's a berserker, the others a wizard/archer
2:11 AM <justlurking> I am steering clear away from everybody
2:11 AM <•Somecrazyguy> JL I will be your best friend
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2:11 AM <justlurking> yay
2:12 AM <•Somecrazyguy> as long as you don't decide to attack me during a parley
2:12 AM <Nonagon> by the time you join this campaign these two will probably be dead. since it's Ziz in like <3 days.
2:12 AM <•Somecrazyguy> in which case I will behead you
2:12 AM <soulpelt|> well given 'bow propensity to treat players like his protagonists.......
2:12 AM <justlurking> I'm going to style myself after duke wellington tho
2:12 AM <justlurking> so have fun :)
2:12 AM <Shemetz> "Buttress" and "Pillbox"
2:12 AM <Niveis> Aren't parleys between enemies though, Scraggs?
2:12 AM <•Somecrazyguy> point?
2:12 AM <onitan> fucking campers
2:12 AM <•Somecrazyguy> Nive go read my session
2:13 AM <•Somecrazyguy> I beheaded the first motherfucker that crossed me
2:13 AM <justlurking> your going to rek me the moment I try to reenact waterloo
2:13 AM <•Somecrazyguy> and I'm probably gonna do it again
2:13 AM <Niveis> Which one?
2:13 AM <Nonagon> first one
2:13 AM <Niveis> Of what campaign, silly.
2:13 AM <•Wildbow> The beheading didn't take though
2:13 AM <Nonagon> lausanne
2:13 AM <Shemetz> Camp and Champ
2:13 AM <Nonagon> It always sucks when that happens.
2:13 AM <AceOfSpade> he didn't just behead him, after that he cut the head into pieces and flushed them down the drain
2:13 AM <Nonagon> @Niveis: https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.google.com/url?q%3Dhttps://docs.google.com/document/d/1xRXg3R5ohVAZyQptEROZT5bQuUp1IrecUczah9iY8X0/edit?usp%253Dsharing%26amp;sa%3DD%26amp;usg%3DAFQjCNHQD2ADSy6DGMarbqgu4m94oFyOcg&sa=D&ust=1452395610219000&usg=AFQjCNHX3GTCOIJJ9MJWAyHfEN0Xzkf61A
2:13 AM <•_> [ Redirecting ] - www.google.com
2:13 AM <AceOfSpade> oh  my god, camp and champ
2:14 AM <AceOfSpade> AHAHAH
2:14 AM <justlurking> so..
2:14 AM <Niveis> I don't get it.
2:14 AM <Lex> So, when it says I can "stack/elaborate" on my changer abillity, what exactly is meant by that? Like, decoration, or extra sharp bits?
2:14 AM <Shemetz> Buttress and Pillbox are better names :P
2:14 AM <Niveis> What'm I missing?
2:14 AM <Nonagon> Camp is a video game term for staying in a single spot and attacking players who near. Starry Eyes builds a turret. Champ = champion = knight defender.
2:15 AM <Niveis> Oh, it was a reference to them. Yea I get it.
2:15 AM <Nonagon> Is Alumnor something you're deciding, 'bow? Do we move on to the next person here?
2:16 AM <•Wildbow> Which Alumnor option would you prefer, Lightning?
2:16 AM <•Wildbow> Either being around you makes others' powers shine, or people in your vicinity have a chance to gain powers, similar to your own.
2:17 AM <soulpelt|> and your partner has a fun power perk
2:17 AM <lightningsteps> The former
2:17 AM <onitan> red oni blue oni
2:17 AM <•Wildbow> Being near Starry calms his aggressive tendencies
2:18 AM <justlurking> for some reason I think this is going to end up with a back stab in some way or another
2:18 AM <•Wildbow> He protects Starry, who is slow to wield the power.
2:18 AM <•Teruzi|GM> Huh, that seems like an interesting relationship
2:18 AM <•Wildbow> Would be perfect, JL
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2:18 AM <•Wildbow> But this wound up fairly poetic.  Pretty good char gen?
2:18 AM <•Wildbow> We can move on if you guys want
2:18 AM <AceOfSpade> Pretty good char gen
2:19 AM <justlurking> yeah I agree
2:19 AM <•Wildbow> Perks & flaws are noted on the first page of the Lausanne doc