11:01:26	 From Adrian Hacker : PEW PEW PEW
11:01:33	 From Memelord : if ethhasheth and progpow forked in two distinct tradeable chains, which MKR tokens would the foundation consider real?
11:02:00	 From Mariano Conti : progpow or not, community should consider the eventual chance that the chain splits, and what to do in that situation
11:02:13	 From David : ETH Classic is the real ETH
11:02:18	 From David : jk
11:02:26	 From Memelord : Enjoy DAI Classic
11:02:26	 From bmcmichael : I know which one I'd follow, but no official Maker stance. Agreed it's a risk, we shouldn't have our head in the sand.
11:02:59	 From LongForWisdom : We need to not cause the problem we are trying to avoid though. If we pick the wrong fork early then we could make things way worth.
11:03:02	 From LongForWisdom : worse.
11:03:59	 From Memelord : The real fork is the one trading at a higher price
11:04:19	 From visheshc : interim oracle of delphi?
11:04:56	 From Mitote : ;)
11:05:04	 From visheshc : magic!
11:05:13	 From Timothy Black : Continuing momentum!
11:07:38	 From Aaron Bartsch : Just a light conversation…..lol
11:08:48	 From cmooney : if there ever was a fork, does anyone think that we would not have to decide?
11:09:03	 From cyrusyounessi : Maybe!
11:09:11	 From cmooney : I think we would be forced to make a choice
11:09:12	 From LongForWisdom : I think we would, I just would be against deciding before a contentious fork was confirmed.
11:09:37	 From Chris S : One edge case question: What happens if two whales disagree and they each trigger ESM on each fork? May not totally be up to the majority of the community
11:09:55	 From cmooney : OMG chris
11:09:58	 From Aaron Bartsch : Could we manage both until one comes out on top?
11:10:10	 From LongForWisdom : Potentially. If there was not a clear leader.
11:10:11	 From Memelord : if there were 2 ETHs with the price cut in half for both there would be tons of liquidations
11:10:12	 From Adrian Hacker : Is an Ethereum hard fork coming up, or is this just a drill?
11:10:25	 From David : a drill
11:10:30	 From LongForWisdom : We don't know Adrian, possibly.
11:10:38	 From bmcmichael : If it goes the way of BCH, most of the vaults on the losing chain will be bitten almost immediately.
11:10:40	 From LongForWisdom : Nothing confirmed yet.
11:10:56	 From Adrian Hacker : Preparing for all the possibilities is smart
11:11:02	 From Memelord : it depends which DAI people keep using and valueing
11:11:54	 From David : days*
11:11:58	 From Aaron Bartsch : lol hours
11:12:17	 From Andrew Redden : when is the potential fork!?
11:12:34	 From cyrusyounessi : june
11:12:36	 From cmooney : hopefully never
11:12:37	 From LongForWisdom : There is no confirmed fork, there is just unrest in the community.
11:12:58	 From akivadubrofsky : Using Hashpower to determine a fork is a meme, it really goes by Exchanges and price
11:13:15	 From Aaron Bartsch : Great points
11:13:50	 From Mitote : What is the core issue, something with change in the POW algo right? Could we contribute to the debate and help reconcile the issues?
11:13:53	 From cyrusyounessi : lol
11:14:01	 From Mitote : A fork seems very not good
11:14:12	 From cyrusyounessi : Progpow will take up the entire governance call
11:14:21	 From Mitote : ah
11:14:55	 From bmcmichael : It goes by which client people use. Miners can keep clicking away on a minority chain and it won't matter if exchanges aren't using it.
11:15:04	 From Adrian Hacker : Raise the limit so someone doesn't shut down the system out of unfounded paranoia?
11:15:38	 From nkunkel : DeFi dies on the chain that Maker doesn’t choose
11:15:41	 From bmcmichael : Or just trolling. We could have whales on both sides of the debate. ES is mutually assured destruction.
11:15:48	 From nkunkel : We definitely need to coordinate with other projects
11:16:05	 From cyrusyounessi : We have this power, whether we want it or not. We argued in the forum thread about whether or not we should use it
11:16:25	 From LongForWisdom : Realistically, I think the other projects would follow our lead unless we did something completely ridiculous.
11:16:31	 From cmooney : luckily, we have a governance process
11:16:37	 From scottrepreneur : The ecosystem will no doubt be looking at Maker to lead
11:16:56	 From Richard Lopez : Thanks
11:17:04	 From Memelord : The ecosystem will be looking at which chain has the best memes
11:17:34	 From Timothy Black : Come for the fork stay for the memes
11:17:50	 From nkunkel : Mull Over Mate
11:17:53	 From bmcmichael : Ultimately, the client published by the Eth core devs will probably win. I think the debate right now is to try to get core devs from acting rashly.
11:17:56	 From MakerMan : has anyone talked about what would happen to the Defi protocols now built if a fork happens?
11:18:18	 From cyrusyounessi : DeFi will probably choose the fork with the highest dollar value of collateral
11:18:24	 From cyrusyounessi : Since that’s where they derive their revenue from
11:19:14	 From Memelord : Thinking about some minimal fork management survival handbook is important. The impact on DeFi would be enormous.
11:19:24	 From cyrusyounessi : Noo, lets keep talking about progpow
11:19:29	 From David : lol
11:19:34	 From MakerMan : lol that must be sarcasm.
11:19:48	 From cyrusyounessi : Progpow q&a at the end of the call
11:19:55	 From akivadubrofsky : +1
11:19:56	 From MakerMan : yay chris ;)  ty on that guide.
11:20:05	 From cmooney : ++
11:20:18	 From cmooney : may or may not
11:21:49	 From David : the whales want Rich to work
11:21:50	 From cmooney : same rich
11:22:19	 From David : https://vote.makerdao.com/polling-proposal/qmxvvzb6uei1jawvtxentsbreepfkuzsohaefpw6j4vpn5
11:22:24	 From David : ^^^ Cadence Poll
11:23:07	 From David : https://mkrgov.science/poll/104
^^ data re that poll
11:24:31	 From cmooney : SamM, your technical idea seemed sound to me
11:26:20	 From Memelord : Any idea to let people leave a message along with their vote on the governance platform?
11:26:37	 From David : 52.5%
0x1c11...3bc5
32.2%
0xb583...691c

Two voters swungit
11:26:51	 From jernejml : https://forum.makerdao.com/t/signal-request-reduce-the-frequency-of-the-dsr-spread-governance-poll/1207/27
11:26:51	 From David : (mainly)
11:26:54	 From Nick : Data costs Memelord. Would be expensive.
11:27:15	 From jernejml : @memelord (link)
11:27:18	 From Nick : unless messages were off chain but then another attack vector
11:27:18	 From lix : 0x1c11 is prolific 15k whale
11:27:38	 From David : Voter trollbox
11:27:57	 From Memelord : What if you make them optionally sign a message with their address
11:28:22	 From Memelord : and post it offchain
11:28:37	 From David : +1
11:28:51	 From Nick : Good point, that'd work nicely
11:29:07	 From Timothy Black : AGREE
11:29:08	 From jernejml : Did anyone actually checked if any of the whales already leaved any messages on-chain?
11:29:17	 From LongForWisdom : I have not.
11:29:39	 From Timothy Black : I was thinking the same Jernej
11:29:44	 From lix : where could they leave a message?
11:30:20	 From jernejml : I believe you always append data to the eth transaction data field?
11:30:24	 From bmcmichael : I already love giving my opinion when it's not solicited.
11:30:24	 From David : some UI element that signs with their address
11:30:42	 From Aaron Bartsch : To stay unbiased
11:31:04	 From David : 100%
11:31:07	 From Adrian Hacker : Can someone explain in a couple sentences some of the background on this vote
11:32:00	 From lix : augur has this: https://reporters.chat/
11:32:38	 From David : @adrian
https://forum.makerdao.com/t/signal-request-reduce-the-frequency-of-the-dsr-spread-governance-poll/1207

DSR spread was meant to be a change that reduced governance overhead and changed the framing of how voters decide on the DSR (ie, it's more closely linked to the SF)
11:32:45	 From cmooney : surplus auctions: https://daiauctions.com/flap
11:33:06	 From David : This next step was to ask if MKR voters want to reduce the cadence from asking weekly to asking bi-weekly or monthly.
11:33:21	 From David : The forum poll was split in half on bi-weekly and monthly
11:33:35	 From bmcmichael : Adrian, also, there is some concern that with weekly polls, we're modifying the system and then throwing up a new poll almost immediately without being able to understand the effects of the previous change.
11:33:36	 From David : The on-chain vote asked for a 1-month cadence, it was voted down
11:33:36	 From LongForWisdom : Thanks for supporting links guys :)
11:33:56	 From David : ^^ Brians point is also very key
11:34:42	 From visheshc : those ceiling lamps are pretty dope tho
11:34:47	 From Adrian Hacker : thx everyone
11:35:12	 From visheshc : black screen
11:35:22	 From visheshc : screensharing wrong desktop?
11:35:23	 From Igor Teslya : might be on a diff monitor
11:35:47	 From Memelord : I see ayyyy lmaos
11:36:25	 From visheshc : SAW it
11:36:45	 From MakerMan : grey screen attack.
11:36:48	 From David : ^^
11:36:50	 From kentonprescott : Nik, it’s still grey
11:36:54	 From primozkordez : grey not great nik :)
11:36:55	 From Mariano Conti : This didn't happen when I was Head of Oracles btw
11:36:58	 From Alex Fisher : "grey", not "great" :-D
11:36:59	 From visheshc : oh
11:37:01	 From visheshc : its back
11:37:01	 From MakerMan : there
11:37:04	 From cyrusyounessi : Lol mariano
11:37:08	 From visheshc : yep
11:37:13	 From Memelord : dont maximise it its fine
11:37:13	 From bmcmichael : This screen is ok
11:37:16	 From visheshc : this is fine
11:37:20	 From David : this is fine
11:37:25	 From Timothy Black : TRANSPARENCY
11:37:40	 From MakerMan : push forward..  transparent gray lol j/k
11:39:25	 From Memelord : yikes
11:39:29	 From LongForWisdom : ^
11:39:37	 From lix : ^I think you mean - AWESOME
11:39:44	 From lix : we're the best
11:39:48	 From visheshc : this is fine (:
11:39:51	 From lix : haha
11:39:54	 From MakerMan : sounds right $750M collat under MKR via SCD/MCD.  We are #1
11:39:55	 From cmooney : RE: cadence.  A bunch of us just read "Thinking in Systems: A Primer" by Donella Meadows.  It discusses the pitfalls of trying to influence systems with large feedback loops and how sometimes the best thing to do is wait.  Our cadence may be too aggressive for this process to complete.
11:40:22	 From MakerMan : yep
11:41:04	 From bmcmichael : It got better.
11:41:09	 From David : +1
11:41:19	 From visheshc : 100% this is what I advocate for pretty much every week haha
11:41:23	 From David : delayed feedback loops
11:41:54	 From Adrian Le Bas : ^ sailing analogies play nicely with that
11:42:03	 From visheshc : you have to allow one change to propagate before you make another one or youre chasing your own tail
11:42:11	 From bmcmichael : ^
11:42:37	 From bmcmichael : Best I can do is vote a steady hand on rate polls.
11:42:44	 From SamM : Well perhaps we can surface the 2 week cadence reduction next.
11:42:53	 From visheshc : seriously tho
11:43:27	 From bmcmichael : Is this like how Eth devs keep pulling out ProgPoW every 6 months?
11:44:36	 From Mariano Conti : it's not by the way. Trust me (TM)
11:45:30	 From Rich Brown : Maybe not illuminati clip art for the next demo?
11:45:44	 From cmooney : lol
11:45:54	 From bmcmichael : *silence*
11:46:07	 From mitakash : what about having chainlink as a lightfeed input?
11:46:14	 From Mitote : maybe hes giving us a hint
11:46:19	 From Adrian Hacker : has there ever been an oracle attack on a platform anywhere else?
11:46:21	 From visheshc : woof the illuminati
11:46:35	 From visheshc : meant to make you pay attention to the risk if you ask me
11:46:42	 From lix : chainlink is illuminati. Moon confirmed
11:46:44	 From jernejml : this is proof for future conspiracy theories people
11:46:55	 From cmooney : Adrian, the flash loan attack was basically an oracle attack
11:47:04	 From MakerMan : btw with respect to cadence system tuning and waiting:  We need a forum post regarding the whole system tuning latency issue (not waiting for change to propagate) as well as measuring a real system changes in response to a tuning change.  Literally deal with this daily training people to tune complicated machines.   latency in response and not tuning on noise..
11:47:59	 From MakerMan : the other issue is system feedback response - damped or undamped oscillations.
11:48:19	 From mitakash : also any future plans of using Uniswap V2 oracle feed as an input?
11:48:22	 From jack : When does staking go live?
11:49:22	 From Mitote : Maker_Man Whats the difference between "real systems change" vs "tuning change"?
11:49:44	 From visheshc : oh god... twitter. defi is built on retweets. you heard it here first folks.
11:50:57	 From MakerMan : but don't we still want the spread of the oracle prices as part of the feed data?   I think it is good to medianize and reduce data overall, but will need to give some other data about the feeds (number providing, 3sigma spread, etc.)
11:51:08	 From visheshc : relayer risk... ?
11:51:30	 From visheshc : RT the crap out of a inflated or delated price signal?
11:51:57	 From MakerMan : well if one doesn't have data on the feeds - there is no ability to massage the data to remove outliers etc.
11:52:25	 From MakerMan : I think knowing the number of oracles providing data to the feed is an important data point.
11:52:41	 From MakerMan : as well as the pricing spread.
11:53:07	 From cyrusyounessi : Link fud
11:53:12	 From LongForWisdom : shots fired.
11:53:21	 From bmcmichael : I don't know the code, but it looks like medianizer is on-chain, so hopefully all of those values are in there.
11:53:40	 From Adrian Hacker : If Oprah was a relayer, would she be an Oprahcle?
11:53:47	 From MakerMan : sounded like that data was being removed to reduce storage costs.
11:53:54	 From visheshc : ^^ that was bad adrian
11:54:45	 From jernejml : @MakerMan maybe just 1 transaction with multipledata
11:55:04	 From visheshc : but if relayers are not also feeds, they are not verifying the data, so how are they deciding what price to retweet?
11:55:10	 From bmcmichael : How can I abuse the delay in the case of an ETH flash crash or boom?
11:55:14	 From visheshc : lol
11:55:30	 From visheshc : if ETH price crash you can dump your eth on maker...
11:55:42	 From visheshc : beat the crash by a bit and save some $$
11:55:54	 From bmcmichael : ^
11:55:55	 From visheshc : if boom, i dont think it helps you
11:56:03	 From LongForWisdom : ^ this is why we don't let the debt ceiling buffer get too high.
11:56:11	 From visheshc : +1 LFW
11:56:20	 From Timothy Black : +1
11:56:23	 From David : Will there eventualy be an easier UI for this rather than using the current Gov poll/Exec vote structure?
11:56:29	 From bmcmichael : Also need to consider debt ceiling vs surplus buffer.
11:56:59	 From visheshc : well surplus buffer is a consideration for more than just an oracle delay exploit
11:57:06	 From David : nvm actually
11:57:07	 From visheshc : so i wouldnt rely on the surplus buffer
11:57:52	 From Mitote : How are relayers incentivized? They also paid by the feed stipend?
11:59:35	 From Richard Lopez : does the defi light feed proposal set a criterion for addition of future feeds, or will they be voted in ad hoc?
12:01:34	 From Aaron Bartsch : Seems like we become the middlemen in this situation. Is there a way to do this that doesn’t require us? Is that what Chainlink is doing?
12:01:47	 From Aaron Bartsch : More of an existential question
12:02:17	 From LongForWisdom : They are core to the Maker Protocol. Makes sense that we manage them, imo.
12:02:17	 From visheshc : +1 nik/rich
12:02:24	 From visheshc : important
12:02:32	 From Vamsi Alluri : And they are a source of profits too for the DAO
12:03:26	 From Memelord : Maker: the Chainlink Killer
12:03:46	 From akivadubrofsky : Cant that revenue cause MKR to be classified as a security?
12:04:11	 From lix : so true nik. We could get tons of bonus MKR burn from this
12:04:24	 From visheshc : LOL
12:04:31	 From David : shots fired
12:04:47	 From lix : seriously it's so smart
12:04:59	 From visheshc : MakerDAO Link oracle -> Link -> collateral ? that would be some reflexivity
12:05:04	 From MakerMan : oracle biz could be good
12:05:07	 From lix : beat chainlink at their own game in every way
12:05:23	 From MakerMan : chain unlinked
12:05:41	 From visheshc : thats a frightening degree of dependencies
12:05:43	 From Memelord : Maker can become a feed provider for chainlink
12:05:44	 From Aaron Bartsch : Anyone worried that Uniswap will eventually be all that’s needed as a price feed if they consume all liquidity?
12:05:52	 From Vamsi Alluri : It has actually been Maker’s game all along IMO
12:06:12	 From MakerMan : why would people pay for oracle info if it is on-chain?!  Not being snarky real question.
12:06:14	 From Memelord : dexes have a long way to go before they can be relied on as oracles
12:06:38	 From LongForWisdom : because a smart contract can't consume it without permission
12:06:44	 From Memelord : uniswap price trails spot price and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future
12:06:45	 From LongForWisdom : it would need to go off-chain and then on again.
12:06:46	 From visheshc : I like the idea of stake being necessary for oracles, so that they are at some risk if oracles cause failures
12:06:49	 From Kurt : ^this is trivial to circumvent technically
12:07:00	 From Vamsi Alluri : Only other smart contracts need to pay to read the price because it is behind a whitelist.
12:07:11	 From MakerMan : yeah but if the data is being put on chain seems like anyone can just pull that data from the blockchain directly.  ??
12:07:19	 From Mariano Conti : Just remember that a Uniswap v2 Oracle tracking ETH/Dai is not what the system needs. It needs ETH/USD
12:07:22	 From LongForWisdom : Sure, but taking it off-chain again first re-introduces centralization risk.
12:07:39	 From Aaron Bartsch : Good point Mariano
12:07:47	 From MakerMan : agree with LFW on taking it off-chain introduced centralization risk.
12:08:13	 From visheshc : first taste is free haha
12:08:28	 From bmcmichael : Only from outside. Mariano actually hacks it in daistats. It's much more difficult trying to get it via a smart contract. I'm not prepared to say it's impossible, but I spent a little time last week trying to hack it and couln't get at the data.
12:08:42	 From Kurt : The speed bump will get some people to pay, the ones who really don't want to can still work around, but at some inconvenience (they will have to re-publish the prices to some open contract).
12:08:46	 From MakerMan : lol the new drug - Makeroracle - the first pills are free.
12:09:15	 From Kurt : Oh, actually there's a way you can work backward from open values in the Maker system w/math to get the oracle prices as well :).
12:09:21	 From visheshc : love me some sme
12:09:31	 From visheshc : (clap clap)
12:09:40	 From bmcmichael : I'm concerned more that people will build out contracts with the free tier and then they won't factor in payments, so that's a developer education project.
12:09:56	 From Kurt : There might be a little delay, but you can always poke to get the latest.
12:10:01	 From MakerMan : need to have features in the pay for not available in the free - kinda a biz thing..
12:10:35	 From MakerMan : either slower updates,, delayed updates  that is not the case in the pay for tier.
12:11:11	 From bmcmichael : Yeah, Kurt, good point. I limited my experimentation only to the oracle.
12:11:32	 From visheshc : this is an extremely comprehensive presentation that is well delivered but it raises like 100 more questions about oracles both specific to maker and in general
12:11:50	 From visheshc : no one wants to think about how the sausage gets made
12:11:54	 From MakerMan : +1 vishesh
12:11:58	 From LongForWisdom : Uhoh, floodgates open.
12:12:05	 From Memelord : this
12:12:06	 From visheshc : you cant unlearn this stuff
12:12:40	 From Memelord : its like you need a weekly oracle governance call
12:12:48	 From MakerMan : dang more homework coming. :/
12:12:55	 From David : bunch of babies
12:12:57	 From lix : https://ibb.co/FKcn8zB
60k in extra burn on the table each month
12:13:37	 From MakerMan : Going to need an Oracle Business Development group. lol ;)
12:13:40	 From cyrusyounessi : I would bet that in the next few months we have multiple calls per week
12:13:43	 From Aaron Bartsch : More than that if 75% of DeFi is using our oracles already
12:13:46	 From Timothy Black : MM I actually think that’s a good idea
12:13:49	 From cyrusyounessi : 1 for governance, 1 for risk, 1 for engineering/oracles
12:13:52	 From LongForWisdom : hah, how many more could there be!
12:13:53	 From Richard Lopez : Will all the feedback be in a thread, or will there be some inline commentary capabilities?
12:13:55	 From Timothy Black : ^^^
12:14:26	 From akivadubrofsky : 2 hour call
12:14:28	 From visheshc : (I think rich just called me a random troll)
12:14:29	 From Aaron Bartsch : Migration!
12:14:35	 From visheshc : think cyrus is on the right track
12:14:37	 From bmcmichael : Weekly poll to schedule this meeting for more than an hour?
12:14:37	 From Guilherme Remor : Nik, can you share that presentation?
12:14:40	 From MakerMan : I think we can stick this all into the forum thread with the proposal..  ;)   Lots of stuff to talk about beyond what we can do in 30min on cc.
12:14:40	 From cyrusyounessi : Let’s move to Vishesh’s presentation on progpow
12:14:52	 From Memelord : 1 community call, 1 risk call, 1 engineering call, 1 governance call, 1 oracle call
12:14:53	 From Timothy Black : lol
12:14:58	 From nkunkel : I’ll share the presentation in the Forum in the Oracle section^
12:15:01	 From Richard Lopez : You can get a lot of comments in during a 2 hour call. :)
12:15:01	 From cyrusyounessi : And 1 progpow call per week
12:15:28	 From MakerMan : yes please do I want to review that presentation again in the forum thread.
12:15:29	 From bmcmichael : Fork it. 1 ProgPow call and 1 Anti-ProgPoW call.
12:16:05	 From LongForWisdom : Thanks Nik, that was great :)
12:16:22	 From MakerMan : thank you Nik - excellent presentation
12:16:22	 From MakerMan : 1
12:16:33	 From cyrusyounessi : Awesome presentation nik
12:16:36	 From Memelord : prove me wrong: DAI is above peg because of people taking refuge in a stablecoin
12:16:41	 From Memelord : thank you nik!
12:16:42	 From MakerMan : we also need to put peg context into a 20% collateral price drop.
12:16:51	 From Timothy Black : ^^
12:17:03	 From MakerMan : markets over last 24hrs not in normal mode.
12:17:21	 From MakerMan : wish these had ETH/USD price overlaid.
12:17:28	 From jernejml : @Long can you ask for 7day graph?
12:17:33	 From jernejml : oh.. it's here
12:17:37	 From LongForWisdom : I have ^^
12:17:39	 From MakerMan : we were very good up until about 24hrs ago.
12:17:46	 From lix : I think lots of dydx longs got out of control
12:17:52	 From Memelord : this is what people talk about when referring to needing longer feedback loops. it would be a mistake to lower DSR/raise SF because of this raise in the price of DAI
12:17:54	 From cmooney : Nik++
12:18:04	 From cyrusyounessi : Oasis is closing in on $1bn lifetime volume
12:18:07	 From MakerMan : 20% ETH/USD drop over 24hrs is a somewhat rare event.
12:18:40	 From lix : yep 5x guys had tons of volume on the run up
12:18:44	 From MakerMan : I trade and watch dydx a lot btw.   Mostly due to liquidity issues.   A lot of leveraged players move pretty fast there.
12:18:47	 From lix : that 5x exits much faster
12:18:54	 From lix : puts lots of arb pressure on DAI
12:19:17	 From bmcmichael : 1inch and Dex.Ag are doing their part at evening things out across markets.
12:19:17	 From MakerMan : so they get quite a bit of volatility.
12:19:57	 From MakerMan : a good amount of arb kept those from going much more than 100bps btw which I consider pretty good PEG management while ETH dropped 20%.
12:20:12	 From Memelord : Excel wizardry right there!
12:20:12	 From LongForWisdom : 200% on 2nd and 3rd man...
12:20:31	 From Aaron Bartsch : Hope they have Defisaver lol
12:21:18	 From lix : > 1inch and Dex.Ag are doing their part at evening things out across markets.
ya crazy how fast they took off
12:21:24	 From cmooney : 5,581,248.98 in the migration contract means that 3088 could migrate in one shot in anther ~3mm DAI
12:21:37	 From MakerMan : SAI decline slowing but as % of total still moving 'ok' down.  I am hoping to get to 20M by end of month but that may be optimistic.
12:21:50	 From akivadubrofsky : Bart
12:21:51	 From Memelord : 3088 is waiting hoping not to pay any fees
12:22:08	 From cmooney : do you know 3088?
12:22:09	 From LongForWisdom : We don't know that, do we?
12:22:10	 From Aaron Bartsch : If they hit 13% they could liquidate for cheaper!
12:22:15	 From Mac : 1k EOY
12:22:18	 From visheshc : :)
12:22:25	 From David : good stuff Vishesh :D
12:22:26	 From MakerMan : it is why DAI debt stopped growing and dropped liquidations I think account for most of it.
12:22:29	 From Richard Lopez : very succinct.
12:22:30	 From Memelord : thank you vishesh!
12:22:30	 From nkunkel : Here’s a link to the forum post containing a link to the presentation. Happy to answer any questions.
12:22:31	 From nkunkel : https://forum.makerdao.com/t/governance-oracle/1367
12:22:34	 From MakerMan : thank you vishesh!
12:22:47	 From Timothy Black : Nice thanks Nik!
12:25:21	 From visheshc : seems like we're approaching a steady state of sai/dai ratio
12:25:36	 From visheshc : 20M might be the amount of the holdouts
12:25:37	 From LongForWisdom : Going to ask again to get the 7-day available on descipher Vishesh. I really think it would be useful when people are making voting decisions. (Notwithstanding the question as to whether we should be using the peg in that way)
12:25:49	 From visheshc : :) yep LFW
12:25:58	 From LongForWisdom : <3
12:26:02	 From visheshc : was up almost all night, will try to get it done asap
12:26:12	 From LongForWisdom : Oh man, don't lose sleep over it D:
12:27:50	 From LongForWisdom : I think it would be useful, but it's not mission critical.
12:27:56	 From MakerMan : given we have a lot of SAI in the migration contract I think it might be prudent to just lower the DC so people can't mint SAI in the SCD.  Put it right to 21.3M or whatever the current outstanding is.
12:28:03	 From Aaron Bartsch : Nice
12:28:22	 From visheshc : its just a matter of implementing a CDN/cache or making the site super slow to load all the coinbase prices LFW
12:28:47	 From visheshc : ill figure it out tho
12:29:25	 From LongForWisdom : Could potentially be on a separate page, so it doesn't impact loading for the 24 hour version? Thanks very much for working on it though.
12:29:41	 From visheshc : thats also an option LFW I wasnt sure which would be better
12:29:48	 From MakerMan : all of these numbers have to be put against the totals remaining for proper context imo.
12:29:56	 From LongForWisdom : Whichever is easiest to implement ;)
12:30:13	 From MakerMan : looking at raw numbers doesn't really convey an accurate message as to state imo.
12:31:19	 From visheshc : Primoz do you have a comparison of the amount of these actions in SCD vs MCD currently?
12:31:58	 From Aaron Bartsch : Probably some waiting for higher MKR/ETH prices
12:32:20	 From visheshc : also $835,563 in uniswap
12:32:37	 From Rich Brown : I'd guess rolling the dice on fee forgiveness
12:32:50	 From visheshc : also 1.89M in compound
12:33:03	 From MakerMan : yep.   I have some there ETH/SAI - if anyone wants to know the reasoning I can explain at least from my perspective.
12:33:09	 From visheshc : please do
12:33:37	 From LongForWisdom : Still think it's early to assume that they are dice-rolling. I will agree with that once the migration contract gets above 8mil and he can migrate all at once, and doesn't.
12:33:59	 From MakerMan : two reasons - ETH/SAI will trade up until SCD ES.   Once it ES's the ETH/SAI should PEG which will mean any trading after that will always float around the oracle price.
12:34:06	 From Memelord : migration contract might not ever make it to 8m
12:34:14	 From LongForWisdom : that's true
12:34:26	 From MakerMan : The idea is that SAI will become a contract on ETH and end up at a fixed rate.  I expect those things to trade.
12:35:10	 From MakerMan : especially after the ES since SAI will be a non-expiring option contract on ETH.
12:35:28	 From MakerMan : at least in theory.
12:36:15	 From MakerMan : Also I know for a fact there are others looking at SAI and SCD ES exactly in the same way I am.   Someone is going to have to cover CDP 3088 anyway.
12:38:11	 From David : tysm
12:38:14	 From visheshc : cool thanks
12:38:16	 From jernejml : gsm alarm might effected demand?