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- AllBlankUnitFATE: rof rof sapp legion + 3 hs
- AllBlankUnitFATE: fg sapps, and fg turret?
- zeus010101: nice
- solderq1: gg
- ideasoup: sorcery sold
- solderq1: @blank u got fg legion???
- Jan 19 - 10:18PM solderq1: when did that heppen XD
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no siree
- zeus010101: fg?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: just asking
- ideasoup: jup gets rekt, ohl let me just cloak real quick
- solderq1: oh
- solderq1: well in theory, yes
- solderq1: all sapps, legion guns should fg
- zeus010101: whats fg?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: frame glitch
- solderq1: that's why I debated whether rof rof legoin> shield sd sapp legion
- Jan 19 - 10:19PM solderq1: in theory ofc
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it means the ship shoots at maximum speed the game allows
- solderq1: 10 fps
- AllBlankUnitFATE: 1 shot per game frame
- zeus010101: hey some one told me not to do that
- solderq1: why not?
- ideasoup: not to do wht?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the reason this is good is moving from 1 shot every 2 frames, to every 1 frame, is it doubles your Damage
- solderq1: it's not really a glitch
- zeus010101: the acid mosquito cloaked
- solderq1: its just a funny game mechanic
- Jan 19 - 10:20PM solderq1: ...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: its kinda a glitch in a way
- solderq1: what does mosquito have to to with frame glitch
- solderq1: lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: its just bad math
- AllBlankUnitFATE: by cww
- solderq1: yeah bad rounding lol
- ideasoup: i thought i was fighting solderq, zeus, ive been trolling him with annoying rush builds
- zeus010101: ah
- AllBlankUnitFATE: there is no reason that +70% fire rate, should make a weapon do 3 times the damage it should
- Jan 19 - 10:21PM solderq1: @fate it's called... math!
- ideasoup: are you some kind of commie? whats wrong with that lol
- solderq1: XD
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so it definitely feels like an error by cww
- solderq1: you have to realize
- solderq1: 1.99=fg
- AllBlankUnitFATE: a glitch is the difference from intentional
- solderq1: so in reality only dropped 2.01 frames
- solderq1: but that's considered fg
- AllBlankUnitFATE: all programming is math
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and logic
- Jan 19 - 10:22PM solderq1: yeah im kinda confused why they all rounded down
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so there is never such a thing as an error
- solderq1: most fg exploits would be solved by normal rounding
- AllBlankUnitFATE: all programs do what you tell them to do
- ideasoup: its completely possible things were unforseen ya know
- solderq1: ie 1.5=2, 1.49=1
- AllBlankUnitFATE: exactly idea.
- AllBlankUnitFATE: unforseen = glitch
- solderq1: yeah
- ideasoup: ha, good way to describe it
- Jan 19 - 10:23PM AllBlankUnitFATE: I forget who started calling it a glitch, and I disagreed with the name at first too
- Evernewb: whataglitch?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: frame glitch
- ideasoup: "but then i got a 3x rof laser and stopped whining"
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and whether than is a correct naming
- ideasoup: XD
- Evernewb: oh...I'm not sure either
- Jan 19 - 10:24PM AllBlankUnitFATE: nah soup. I was doing the glitching long before :)
- Evernewb: I remember the conversation but I don't remember who coined it
- ideasoup: heh
- AllBlankUnitFATE: its just, I didnt name it
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I was just exploiting the game engine
- solderq1: lol
- zeus010101: im lagging so bad
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the name frame glitch caught on, and thats history
- ideasoup: ya when legions stack always gets crazy
- Jan 19 - 10:25PM Evernewb: it's catchier than 1:1
- solderq1: fglitch aka how do coax rediculous dps from what would otherwise be mediocre ships
- solderq1: trident became a star almost overnight lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yarrrrr.
- solderq1: liek once ppl caught on
- ideasoup: and then BANG
- Evernewb: you get simmilar dps from the normal damaging ships
- Evernewb: not sure why people forget that
- Jan 19 - 10:26PM solderq1: normal damaging ships?
- solderq1: hard to match 530 dps on trident...
- Evernewb: beam halo with the same rof is more damage than a trident
- solderq1: fair enough yeah
- zeus010101: carrier with freeze and thermal on the other
- edsung: any qm?
- Jan 19 - 10:27PM solderq1: @evern but bhalo is much more expensive...
- Evernewb: same for most of the other weapon based ships
- AllBlankUnitFATE: might be fun to make a list of ships cost vs their dps
- solderq1: maybe yeah
- solderq1: but range, other factors come in too
- ideasoup: so a more comprehensive and simple wiki? yes that would be fun...
- ideasoup: if you made it
- solderq1: for example just consider why 2-frame hammerhead is so good
- Evernewb: range is the big reason that a FG trident isn't all that amazing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I wouldnt compare much to a bhalo, its too unique
- Jan 19 - 10:28PM Evernewb: heh: that's why it caught on
- solderq1: yeah bhalo is something else
- Evernewb: you have an acronym shortening for frameglitch
- zeus010101: fg
- solderq1: I can rush level 80 camp with 2 fraem hh
- solderq1: :)
- ideasoup: is 3x rof on a bhalo upgrade possible?
- solderq1: sure
- solderq1: why not
- ideasoup: good goood gives me something to dream about
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Ive never heard of someone with one tho
- ideasoup: lol
- Evernewb: it's possible, 1 range 2 rate is likely stronger
- solderq1: well its possible
- Jan 19 - 10:29PM solderq1: no reason it shouldn't exist
- ideasoup: true
- AllBlankUnitFATE: sure it is.
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I think most prefer the range tho
- ideasoup: perhaps then range rnage shield a is the best bc HS have no cost as a tech
- solderq1: yeah
- Evernewb: the whole reason that Bhalo works so well is the next cap in line picks up some of the work whenever targets get farther into the range of the first
- AllBlankUnitFATE: frame glitch only really applies to quick firing weapons
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so a bhalo is slow, it doesnt fg
- ideasoup: for sure i got off topic a bit lol
- Jan 19 - 10:30PM Evernewb: most notably the next cap in line gets a lot of the fighters from carriers since it is waiting to fire instead of recharging
- solderq1: mmhmm
- solderq1: I really wish there was an artillery doctrine....
- AllBlankUnitFATE: trident was supposed to be the newbie cap. weakish, but kind of all around
- Jan 19 - 10:31PM solderq1: heheh
- Evernewb: ...come to think of it, I never DID get around to getting a proper dps for a rof/rof plasma halo
- solderq1: yeah no
- solderq1: it is the best all-purpose cap
- solderq1: but its not weakish lol
- Evernewb: even have the turret, just forgot to do it before selling the plasma tech for space
- AllBlankUnitFATE: before fg, only the newbies newbs flew trids
- Evernewb: @Fate I think trident was intended as a super-mid it's an excelent support ship but a poor standalone cap
- AllBlankUnitFATE: mastos are still in that category
- Jan 19 - 10:32PM AllBlankUnitFATE: of "meant to be weak" placeholders
- ideasoup: gg zeus
- zeus010101: you have 3 yards 1 cap and 2 fighter yards gg
- edsung: gg
- solderq1: gg
- Evernewb: even a 1:1 trident is still serving as bullet spam more than anything else
- AllBlankUnitFATE: trid also find love of course for being anti FY
- ideasoup: my scorpions are have pbay with emp :)
- Jan 19 - 10:33PM AllBlankUnitFATE: and anti carrier
- zeus010101: nice i like my angel
- Evernewb: eeeeyup, it's a supporter extraordinaire
- AllBlankUnitFATE: while poor cata weeps in the corner.
- solderq1: ^ main reason imo
- Jan 19 - 10:34PM Evernewb: cataclysm gets screwed over by a tiny margin on so many game mechanics
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I think maybe cww should return missile doctrine to buffing arties
- ideasoup: lata yall
- Jan 19 - 10:35PM AllBlankUnitFATE: not enough missile ships
- AllBlankUnitFATE: lates
- zeus010101: later
- solderq1: gg
- edsung: gg
- Evernewb: it's fire rate is just a hair to slow to get major damage jumps in the right number of mods and techs, it's movement speed is a hair to fast, it's tracking is...actually it's tracking is entirely horrible
- solderq1: oh yeah
- solderq1: pls buff arty rof...
- Evernewb: not just a little bit
- solderq1: for the hammerheads!!!
- AllBlankUnitFATE: (id also randomly change factions to have phalanxes)
- Jan 19 - 10:36PM solderq1: hmm this change I like less
- solderq1: XD
- AllBlankUnitFATE: :)
- AllBlankUnitFATE: that way, sometimes red would have them instead of shields. 50/50
- Jan 19 - 10:37PM Evernewb: give them semi-random starting defensive structures?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yeah
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Im not sure if it should be 50/50
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or, a mix
- zeus010101: 3 glad bays and this orange isnt dying
- andrewonderer: fate qm?
- Evernewb: ...phalanx+tac is a bit of a combo, might want to give them a chance of dud structures too if you do that
- solderq1: @allblank that woudl be unfair to purple faction tho
- AllBlankUnitFATE: not fighting right now
- Evernewb: like barricades or cloak fields
- AllBlankUnitFATE: what about purple?
- solderq1: purple is useless vs yellow as it is
- solderq1: if other factoin have phalanx
- Jan 19 - 10:38PM solderq1: purple will be permanently neutered
- solderq1: liek in skirmishes, flanks
- AllBlankUnitFATE: well, it would be 50/50 in my mind
- solderq1: I guess...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: half the time, all shields. other half of the time, alll phals
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I mean, a mix might also be ok?
- solderq1: so only neutered half the time
- solderq1: lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like, 1-4 def structs. and they are a random mix?
- Jan 19 - 10:39PM solderq1: sure
- andrewonderer: jeff qm?
- solderq1: in one
- zeus010101: yellow vs orange whos better
- andrewonderer: k
- AllBlankUnitFATE: that would almost guarantee 1 phal per match
- solderq1: orange duh lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and ruin arty rushing
- solderq1: ok
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like, only 20% of the time would there be 0 phals
- gluktar: gg
- solderq1: gg
- Jan 19 - 10:40PM andrewonderer: solder lets go
- solderq1: hmm wrong trid
- solderq1: oh well
- AllBlankUnitFATE: another bufff the AI should get after level 10
- AllBlankUnitFATE: is 50/50 shields
- solderq1: like base shields?
- solderq1: or what kind
- andrewonderer: idk
- AllBlankUnitFATE: mod shields
- andrewonderer: base shields
- solderq1: mod shields on ships?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yes
- solderq1: k
- Jan 19 - 10:41PM Evernewb: ...my miners are clumped to the point that they are providing a sucessfull defense against red's athenas
- Evernewb: neat
- andrewonderer: laaaaaaaaaaag
- andrewonderer: so laggy :(
- AllBlankUnitFATE: level 11+ would be like, 50%of the time everything has shields. 50% everythng is cloaked
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I think it would make each match more unique
- solderq1: well i mean ai get lots of unfair buffs...
- solderq1: their resource multiplier
- AllBlankUnitFATE: they do, but thats a boring buff
- solderq1: makes sense for them to have weaknesses
- Jan 19 - 10:42PM solderq1: ok
- andrewonderer: gg
- solderq1: lol
- andrewonderer: lol
- solderq1: bad reflexes
- andrewonderer: nice strat right
- andrewonderer: yeah
- AllBlankUnitFATE: lets say all ships/turrets had shields
- andrewonderer: my micro wasn't on point
- solderq1: re?
- andrewonderer: lel
- AllBlankUnitFATE: that would require a rethinking of your tactics
- andrewonderer: sure
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and make "1 size fits all" harder to get
- solderq1: @fate i see where this si going
- solderq1: just cause you have 102 highscore
- Jan 19 - 10:43PM solderq1: doesn't mean u havta sabotage others
- solderq1: :P
- AllBlankUnitFATE: lol. well its more that I know how samey it gets
- andrewonderer: rip xD
- solderq1: ...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and I want more situations to tackle
- andrewonderer: heh
- solderq1: @allblank we have one size fits all for a reason
- Jan 19 - 10:44PM solderq1: we don't want to lose lives and pay lots of plat
- solderq1: besides, do you want us resorting to turtling everything?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: well, then stick to low levels
- solderq1: cause i thought u are anti-turtle??
- solderq1: I really don;t get you today...
- andrewonderer: anyone qm?
- zeus010101: in a sec
- andrewonderer: gluktar?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: why would I want the enemies to be boring
- zeus010101: hey gluktar
- Jan 19 - 10:45PM solderq1: why would I want the battle strat to be boring
- solderq1: :P
- andrewonderer: :P
- AllBlankUnitFATE: just to say "hey I reached X level vs boring enemies"?
- solderq1: weak enemy plus interesting strats available> interesting enemies but no viable interesting strats
- AllBlankUnitFATE: also , the more the enemies mix things up, the more interesting it is for more people imo
- zeus010101: andre qm or nah
- Jan 19 - 10:46PM solderq1: Why woudl i want to say I got high level doing boring turtling
- andrewonderer: nah
- andrewonderer: with solder
- AllBlankUnitFATE: imo, people dont go for high levels
- zeus010101: oh
- WildStar123: which is better: engine D or engine B
- WildStar123: ?
- zeus010101: b right
- AllBlankUnitFATE: because its usually just more of the same
- solderq1: :((
- solderq1: stap
- andrewonderer: :""""(
- Evernewb: @wildstar neither
- solderq1: DIE
- solderq1: @fate I do
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you need to think of making a game fun
- andrewonderer: NO
- solderq1: hah
- Evernewb: a blank unit is better than a unit with an engine on almost all ships
- solderq1: and on the contrary
- zeus010101: of the 2 i think b is better
- solderq1: I think ur approach discourages players
- Jan 19 - 10:47PM solderq1: you wil make it so hard they can only turtle
- AllBlankUnitFATE: nah
- andrewonderer: UGHH
- andrewonderer: :(
- andrewonderer: gg
- AllBlankUnitFATE: making the enemies more diverse is fun
- andrewonderer: that first one was luck xD
- AllBlankUnitFATE: imagine if there were no faction
- andrewonderer: cool strat right??
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and just all duels
- AllBlankUnitFATE: boring.
- solderq1: oh hey "I did a boring ass turtle on an interestign ai"
- solderq1: how appealling amiright
- AllBlankUnitFATE: wrong
- Jan 19 - 10:48PM solderq1: wrong, its' not appealing? :P
- AllBlankUnitFATE: turtles are the fate of all
- AllBlankUnitFATE: even now
- solderq1: whaddyou mean?
- solderq1: fate of all?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: level 100+ = turtling
- solderq1: true
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so, your argument is weak
- solderq1: so you want ppl's lives to be miserable sooner
- solderq1: thanks dude lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: its already boring early on
- solderq1: no
- solderq1: its fun with rushing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: thats why people stop
- Jan 19 - 10:49PM solderq1: if u take away rushing
- andrewonderer: then the game gets boring
- solderq1: all fun is gone
- AllBlankUnitFATE: there is already no point
- andrewonderer: idk
- solderq1: idk why you're talking wiht fate
- AllBlankUnitFATE: gear doesnt drop more
- solderq1: but I personally like rushing
- andrewonderer: rushing isnt the funest thing
- solderq1: even if the enemy are boring
- solderq1: see andre agrees lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: beating up weak enemies is boring
- Jan 19 - 10:50PM solderq1: not for me
- solderq1: XD
- solderq1: and not really weak
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like a bully beating up newbs all day
- Evernewb: Fate, think how much more fun the game would be if fighters-from-bay -> mids was a viable option
- andrewonderer: gg
- solderq1: lol gg
- andrewonderer: cheese
- solderq1: ahh bad reflexes again...
- andrewonderer: guess you didnt pay attention this time
- Evernewb: giving the AI free defensive turrets is exactly what makes the game boring as hell
- solderq1: lol
- solderq1: oh yeah
- solderq1: why don't we dubuff ai
- Jan 19 - 10:51PM AllBlankUnitFATE: if the ai didnt have turrets
- solderq1: no more turret spawnage
- AllBlankUnitFATE: we could just rush them 100%
- solderq1: ...
- Evernewb: your ONLY option is to go for either an overwhelm or a 1/0 situation
- solderq1: I sense hypocrisy here...
- Evernewb: literally nothing else works
- solderq1: Fate has been both for and against rushing...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: solder, you just think from a greedy player's perspective
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you're not thinking of the bigger picture
- Jan 19 - 10:52PM solderq1: right I love turtling
- solderq1: yup yup
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like, giving players cheat codes
- solderq1: good for the big picture
- Evernewb: so buff fighters and nerf caps, kinda needs to be done anyways, a capital ship should be slightly stronger than it's resources in mids, and moderately stronger than it's resources in fighters
- AllBlankUnitFATE: isnt fun
- solderq1: let me ask you this
- AllBlankUnitFATE: basically, cheap rushes are cheat codes
- solderq1: is turtling any more fun?
- solderq1: you like turtling much?
- Evernewb: lesser units used in effective combinations should be greater than their cost in capitals
- solderq1: cause YOU stopped playing camp once it was hard to rush :P
- Jan 19 - 10:53PM AllBlankUnitFATE: I like having to adjust to multiple enemies
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no, my goal was level 100
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it always was.
- solderq1: right
- solderq1: but you stop at 102
- solderq1: so you coulda continued
- AllBlankUnitFATE: because I saw that the Difficulty number went up
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the difficulty number on each mission
- solderq1: so?
- Jan 19 - 10:54PM solderq1: idk back to the question
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it increased by 1 digit
- solderq1: you liek turtling?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so you are wrong
- solderq1: I think turtling is the most robotic part of the game
- andrewonderer: anyone qm?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I like changing my strategy vs different enemies
- Evernewb: if you take out the bulshit stiff the AI get and make it so the resource advantage is the primary change then players would get to much higher levels, but they would have FAR more open options for how they play
- AllBlankUnitFATE: for instance
- AllBlankUnitFATE: do I want to fight 1 enemy in pvp all day?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or 100 different players?
- Jan 19 - 10:55PM AllBlankUnitFATE: 1 guy who never changes, 100 times
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or 100 different single players
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I know which is funner.
- Evernewb: fate, the free turrets for AI are one of the problems for players
- solderq1: uhh u avoid question
- solderq1: is turtlign fun?
- solderq1: in general
- Jan 19 - 10:56PM AllBlankUnitFATE: different enemies require different tactics
- solderq1: for example vs purple/yellow/red: spam phalanx/ biolab
- Evernewb: no matter how you try to sell the idea putting a roadblock into the game stoping everything but the end part is an issue
- solderq1: vs orange: phalanx+ ins turret+ biolab
- solderq1: green: ins+phal+ vl
- solderq1: only slight diff actually
- solderq1: most factions are phalanx
- solderq1: if not use ins microlaser
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and more enemy options in a structured way is more fun
- solderq1: soo much variation
- Jan 19 - 10:57PM solderq1: well idk why u talk about the ai defensive turrets then
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like, if they all got shield 50% of the time, freeze spores wouldnt work
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Id have to have plan B
- solderq1: whether yelow has tac shields or phalanx
- solderq1: phalanx spam still works
- solderq1: oh
- solderq1: so vl is the new turtle meta
- AllBlankUnitFATE: because that means arty rush doesnt work that 50%of the time
- solderq1: not much change
- andrewonderer: glad spam too
- solderq1: it will become
- Jan 19 - 10:58PM solderq1: vl spam all day
- AllBlankUnitFATE: early on it wouldnt matter
- solderq1: you're not fixing the problem fate
- solderq1: I want oe3 to have less turtling...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so, lets make all factions 1 enemy
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no phalanxes eer
- solderq1: let me rephrase that
- AllBlankUnitFATE: see. more rushing
- solderq1: why is turtling so boring
- AllBlankUnitFATE: oh, and remove all turrets
- solderq1: turtlign is why I don't liek oe3
- solderq1: ok
- AllBlankUnitFATE: there, even more rushing
- Jan 19 - 10:59PM andrewonderer: gg
- AllBlankUnitFATE: see. I just made the game more fun with Solder logic
- solderq1: ok i see your point
- solderq1: but I don't think more turtling is the answer
- solderq1: turtling isn't much fun either
- solderq1: now instead of giving up at level 100 when turtlign is vital
- solderq1: they give up at like level 70 or something
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so, you think the game is perfectly correct?
- Evernewb: guess why I'm not level 73-78?
- solderq1: is that better, let me ask you
- Jan 19 - 11:00PM AllBlankUnitFATE: cww must be a god to get things so perfect :p
- Evernewb: I absolutely HATE taking 25 minutes a match
- solderq1: of course not
- solderq1: jsut think your approach is wrong
- AllBlankUnitFATE: nah, there isnt anything wrong with my idea
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it would increase your situations
- Evernewb: it decreases your responses
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and what you would have to deal with.
- Jan 19 - 11:01PM solderq1: I still haven't heard your argument for why turtling is so much more fun than rushing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but not in a random way
- AllBlankUnitFATE: early on, rushes could still work
- solderq1: cause your plan is supposedly to stop ppl from giving up boring camp right?
- solderq1: uhh back to the topic
- solderq1: explain why turtling is more fun
- solderq1: go on im listenign XD
- Jan 19 - 11:02PM AllBlankUnitFATE: go on, explain why there shouldnt be only 1 faction with no turrets. go on, im listening
- solderq1: im not arguing against 1 faction
- solderq1: I have no problem whatsoever
- solderq1: I'm just asking why turtling is more fun in your opinion
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you say rushing all enemies is more fun
- Jan 19 - 11:03PM AllBlankUnitFATE: so, I am just making the game more fun with more rushing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and 1 size fits all
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the solder way
- Evernewb: ...
- Evernewb: Fate, you're talking like an equivocator
- Evernewb: stop
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no :p
- solderq1: fate I was just genuinely curious for why turtling is better
- solderq1: stop turning it back to why i support rusing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: diversity is more fun
- solderq1: that's irrelevant ok
- Jan 19 - 11:04PM AllBlankUnitFATE: its not
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and I can easily turn it on you
- solderq1: stop dodging this questoin...
- solderq1: i just want to know ok
- Evernewb: that's kinda why destroying viable options for players is a bad thing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: becuase your argument is just as weak
- solderq1: well this is based on opinions
- AllBlankUnitFATE: if turtling is bad, and rushing is good
- solderq1: how can you quantify opinions
- solderq1: well in your words fate
- AllBlankUnitFATE: then I am making the game better by increasing rushing
- Evernewb: you're proposing to make it so that the only viable option is to build up to an overwhelm point with beam weapons
- Jan 19 - 11:05PM solderq1: yea im quoting you.. "less time spent on battles= better"
- solderq1: don't be hypocritical k
- AllBlankUnitFATE: better is subjective
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you just dont get making the game better
- solderq1: no I see this plan as causing even more 1 size fits all
- solderq1: it's called turtle
- AllBlankUnitFATE: nah
- Evernewb: inotherwords: you are making us into one faction with ONLY turrets, one size fits all
- solderq1: you stifle diversity sir
- Jan 19 - 11:06PM AllBlankUnitFATE: it might make turtling appear earlier
- solderq1: you stifle diversity...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but it overall increases diversity
- solderq1: only turtling with slight differences between the turtles
- solderq1: liek vl vs biolab
- solderq1: only a tiny difference
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you can already be 1 thing
- Evernewb: no, no it does not, if you don't have the ability to plan ahead then you are forced to take only general use options into a fight, which means planning on the part you DO know about
- solderq1: besides
- Jan 19 - 11:07PM AllBlankUnitFATE: you can turtle at level 1
- solderq1: some ppl have build geared specifically to fight orange
- Evernewb: which is the possible combinations you need to defend against
- solderq1: now all there are no specific enemies
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yes
- solderq1: so you HAVE to have one size fits all
- solderq1: how is that not stifling diversity
- AllBlankUnitFATE: now you could have to have a build vs shield orange, or cloak orange
- solderq1: lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: thats boosting how you deal with things
- solderq1: vl for both situations
- solderq1: literally teh same :P
- Evernewb: even moreso you're making the game only 1 attitude, one that most people do not enjoy
- Jan 19 - 11:08PM solderq1: yeah
- AllBlankUnitFATE: not so
- solderq1: soem ppl get a kick out of beatign of weak infest
- solderq1: you make every ai same strength
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so stick to lower levels
- solderq1: all is more monochrome
- solderq1: imo
- AllBlankUnitFATE: beat the crap out of level 10
- AllBlankUnitFATE: just like some people stick to level 1-4
- solderq1: what diff does shield and cloak make??
- solderq1: void lance still kilsl them all
- Jan 19 - 11:09PM AllBlankUnitFATE: and eventually you will reach a level where you are stuck
- AllBlankUnitFATE: even today
- solderq1: your argument doesn't hold water cause the ai doesn't change in a meaningful way
- solderq1: a cloaked shield goli
- solderq1: still dies by a void lance
- AllBlankUnitFATE: of course it holds water
- solderq1: hah nice try
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the cloak isnt meant so much for caps
- solderq1: see above, vl is too mutli purpose
- Jan 19 - 11:10PM AllBlankUnitFATE: its meant more for the fighters
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or meds
- solderq1: for fighers?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but it does cause you to rethink how to deal with each enemy
- Evernewb: stiiiiil making it so that you are attempting to defend in 1 way instead of attack in several ways
- solderq1: yeah
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no
- zeus010101: nice laser in store
- solderq1: I still feel like diversity is stifled
- Evernewb: people enjoy working on winning much more than waiting untill they are allowed to win
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I am giving you reasons to attack in different ways
- Jan 19 - 11:11PM solderq1: waht does attack have to do with it
- solderq1: at high level u have to turtle
- solderq1: defense is priority
- AllBlankUnitFATE: rather than solder, hypocritically saying that he wants "1 size fits all" but now claims he wants lots of way to attack
- Evernewb: he never said that
- Evernewb: you did
- AllBlankUnitFATE: he did
- AllBlankUnitFATE: in other chats
- Jan 19 - 11:12PM solderq1: well by one size fits all
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so wrong :p
- solderq1: I mean one tech setup
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yeah
- solderq1: for example 3 hs
- solderq1: works not only for hh
- AllBlankUnitFATE: thats why I meant too
- solderq1: but gladbio
- solderq1: that's at least 2 strats :P
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I want to increase the diversity of multiple tech set ups
- solderq1: not to mention turtling vs orange
- solderq1: aka u want ppl to lose lives
- Evernewb: if you want to do that then you fix inbalances in the units
- AllBlankUnitFATE: by 50/50 giving the enemy shields
- Jan 19 - 11:13PM AllBlankUnitFATE: it forces you to either come back with a new build
- Evernewb: nobody uses missiles because missiles have shit tracking and are utterly ruined by phalanxes
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or have your set up have a second back up plan
- solderq1: 10/10 for makign ppl quit oe3 cause they are out of lives LMAO
- AllBlankUnitFATE: well, maybe lives shouldnt exist
- AllBlankUnitFATE: :)
- Evernewb: you don't use mids because the vast majority of mids can never recoup their cost in work done
- solderq1: ok
- solderq1: if you get rid of lives
- solderq1: I will support ALL of your suggestions
- solderq1: ok?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: there are other way too
- Jan 19 - 11:14PM Evernewb: you don't use fighters as more than a status effect or chaff because they have no permanence or potency
- solderq1: I can't support not being able ot use one tech setup
- solderq1: if there are lives
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so, your my argument was right. it was the lives that was wrong
- Jan 19 - 11:15PM solderq1: besides, pretty much any tech setup works for turtle tbh
- Evernewb: again with the equivocator bulsith
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Im talking about all gear
- solderq1: 3 hs works just as well as base shield freeze manu for instance
- Evernewb: heh, bulsith
- solderq1: when you turtle
- solderq1: it really doesn't matter your techs
- AllBlankUnitFATE: its not equivicating evern
- Evernewb: gotta love accidentally valid typos
- solderq1: then again who am I talking too...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you position is not unassailable
- solderq1: Fate the master rusher
- Jan 19 - 11:16PM solderq1: fate you realize you can turtle with lots of different techs...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: rushing saves time :)
- Evernewb: you are asserting connections and then attempting to move the conversation on to have them accepted
- solderq1: your suggestions doesn't decrease one size fits all imo
- Evernewb: usually lacing posession of the connection on someone else
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it totally does solder
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no evern, Im saying your position is no stronger
- solderq1: really?
- Jan 19 - 11:17PM AllBlankUnitFATE: yes
- solderq1: cause I could turtle with base shield base canon freeze and battpack for example
- solderq1: no matter the enemy
- solderq1: i can turtle no prob
- AllBlankUnitFATE: if the enemy had ship shields, you may need other set ups
- solderq1: nope
- solderq1: I always use void lance
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so youll have to dig into your inventory
- solderq1: :P
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and find something new to try
- solderq1: Dude
- solderq1: I always have void lance
- Jan 19 - 11:18PM solderq1: ppl will find ways to do one tech setup
- solderq1: very possible, vl is very versatile
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no they wont
- AllBlankUnitFATE: they will TRY
- AllBlankUnitFATE: to find 1 set up
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like I did
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like you did
- solderq1: oh yeah?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: eventually it stops working
- solderq1: if I wanted
- Jan 19 - 11:19PM solderq1: I coudl turtle all the factions with the same tech setup
- solderq1: it would work 10/10
- solderq1: turtling is meant to be versatile...
- Jan 19 - 11:20PM solderq1: since you can buy time with turtling the exact mods/ techs don't matter as much
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yup and just because there is turtling
- solderq1: so it doesn't matter you have a weak hammerhead
- solderq1: you can just keep turtlling
- solderq1: and make 10 of these weak hh
- AllBlankUnitFATE: doesnt mean there arent more ways to deal with a diverse enemy
- solderq1: so the techs really don't matter as much in a turtle
- solderq1: ...
- Jan 19 - 11:21PM AllBlankUnitFATE: Im not just talking just about techs tho
- solderq1: Phalanx+ insured blaster+ lasers+ void lance covers all of them I think
- solderq1: good luck findign counter to that turtle lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I think cloaked ships might slip in
- solderq1: hahaha
- solderq1: good joke sir
- Jan 19 - 11:22PM solderq1: very good joke
- solderq1: they wil fire at the turrets
- solderq1: thereby revealign themselves
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and cause the VL sometimes to misfire
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but that doesnt mean VL cant also be rebalanced
- solderq1: so?
- solderq1: one can make more vl's
- solderq1: haha
- AllBlankUnitFATE: in addition
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the basic principle holds
- solderq1: fate sees a chink in the "turtles are invincable theory", wants to nerf th vl
- Jan 19 - 11:23PM AllBlankUnitFATE: a more diverse enemy, force the player to come up with more solutions
- Evernewb: weakening the only viable methodology simply limits the only viable methodology...
- solderq1: nope
- solderq1: like i say
- AllBlankUnitFATE: in addition, I am always in favor of nerfs
- solderq1: phalanx+ ins blaster+ vl+ damage turrets kills all of them
- AllBlankUnitFATE: nerf a bunch of stuff
- AllBlankUnitFATE: remove FG
- AllBlankUnitFATE: etc
- solderq1: @fate I wonder how much you turtle yourself?
- solderq1: I turtled all my levels before you showed me rushing
- Jan 19 - 11:24PM solderq1: You seem rusty on the mechanics of turtling if I may say so...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I know, thats why you were so slow on getting higher
- solderq1: well im just saying
- solderq1: pls research your topic before you argue...
- solderq1: you underestimate the void lance I think
- AllBlankUnitFATE: my argument isnt wrong tho
- Jan 19 - 11:25PM AllBlankUnitFATE: I never said nerfing wasnt going to happen
- AllBlankUnitFATE: if buffs were to happen to the AI
- solderq1: Uhh well i know you haven't turtled in a while
- AllBlankUnitFATE: why would I also limit changes to players?
- solderq1: but imo, all your changes will have minimal effect
- AllBlankUnitFATE: thats you putting words in my mouth
- solderq1: No matter what the ai is
- solderq1: they can be turtled
- Jan 19 - 11:26PM solderq1: that's what a turtle is
- solderq1: sacrificing time for versatility
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and Ive always said that
- solderq1: Often times I make dumb capitals like mastodon spam from a turtle
- solderq1: cause the turtle is so strong doesn't matter what ships I use
- AllBlankUnitFATE: ok and?
- solderq1: so
- solderq1: doesn't matter how u change ai
- Jan 19 - 11:27PM solderq1: will still be turtle-able
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I am the one who used to say turtling would always win in the end
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so, youre not telling me something new
- solderq1: only op shit in pvp like fg stuff and range range stuff can break turtles
- solderq1: ai don't have access to this...
- solderq1: or am I wrong XDD
- solderq1: ai are weaker than players, can't break turtles well
- Jan 19 - 11:28PM AllBlankUnitFATE: yeah, cww buffed players over and over and over
- solderq1: I mean maybe if phalanx was nerfed...
- solderq1: but idk
- AllBlankUnitFATE: VL usd to not exist
- solderq1: yup
- solderq1: imo
- AllBlankUnitFATE: only biolab was the cap killer
- AllBlankUnitFATE: 1 hitter
- solderq1: vl and phalanx make your argument moot
- AllBlankUnitFATE: cobra didnt exist. cloud was more annoyng
- Jan 19 - 11:29PM solderq1: vl, phalanx, insured micro/blaster
- solderq1: these are the holy grail
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yeah, all sorts of nerfs to players could happen
- solderq1: with these all can be turtled
- solderq1: try to argue how ai could break that turtle
- solderq1: woudl be very hard imo
- AllBlankUnitFATE: for instance, I think VL needs a range nerf
- AllBlankUnitFATE: at the least
- Jan 19 - 11:30PM solderq1: ok
- solderq1: I think we agree that with current unit stats, yoru idea doesn't work
- AllBlankUnitFATE: oh, I also forgot that the AI might have another mod set
- solderq1: turrets are too strong
- solderq1: Without these nerfs you say
- solderq1: turtle is simply too good
- AllBlankUnitFATE: my idea does work
- AllBlankUnitFATE: even with turrets as they are
- solderq1: ok
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but it would drain lives yes
- Jan 19 - 11:31PM solderq1: how to break vl+ range range phal+ insurance freeze blaster turtle
- solderq1: please explain
- solderq1: use campaign ships
- solderq1: maybe throw in base shield for good measure
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but that doesnt matter to my argument
- Jan 19 - 11:32PM solderq1: yeah it does
- solderq1: this setup breaks any ai attack
- solderq1: so your ai buffs are mainly irrelevant
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it makes most players play and experience a difference in the game
- Jan 19 - 11:33PM zeus010101: can you win a fight with glads
- solderq1: very slight diff
- solderq1: skilled people can still turtle
- AllBlankUnitFATE: a difference in how enemies appear, and how most players deal with it
- solderq1: most= don't know how to turle
- solderq1: turtle
- solderq1: kk gotcha lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and thats why I say you dont see the bigger picture
- solderq1: ok....
- Jan 19 - 11:34PM solderq1: I shoudl think like newb
- solderq1: but in the begining
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you only think about from the most knowledgable player perspective
- solderq1: you say you want more people to get to high level
- solderq1: so I thought it was appropiate
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I talk about the bigger picture, from most players perspectives
- solderq1: I see
- solderq1: more borign for the experienced
- solderq1: better for newb
- Jan 19 - 11:35PM AllBlankUnitFATE: you could still press forward
- solderq1: idk
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it would just stop more rushes earlier on
- solderq1: I guess there's nothign wrong with your idea
- solderq1: But this won't make a difference farther down the line, at high level
- solderq1: people will still do one size fits all
- Jan 19 - 11:36PM AllBlankUnitFATE: at level 100, you definitely have to rely on luck and changing ships
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I wouldnt mind at all if this happened earlier
- solderq1: well I suppose I have no authority there
- solderq1: but we should dump the lives system
- solderq1: nothing is more depressing to a newb
- Jan 19 - 11:37PM solderq1: than having no lives, cause unlike an experienced player, newb doesn't have lots of plat to buy more lives
- solderq1: look at the big picture man
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I see why cww made the lives system, Im just not sure he incentivized it enough
- solderq1: newbs will quit if they lose more lives k
- solderq1: your suggestions seem self-defeating
- AllBlankUnitFATE: nice try
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but no
- zeus010101: why not 20 lives for the bottom maps 15 for middlih maps and 10 for advanced and beyond
- Jan 19 - 11:38PM solderq1: go on fate...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: boring missions can also depress a newbie
- AllBlankUnitFATE: see? :)
- solderq1: better a boring mission than none at all :)
- AllBlankUnitFATE: if the enemy is always the sasme old same old
- AllBlankUnitFATE: game dev is a balance.
- solderq1: well if they literally can't play at all...
- Jan 19 - 11:39PM solderq1: there's no bigger turnoff
- solderq1: than being barred from the game
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the point of the lives system
- solderq1: period!
- AllBlankUnitFATE: is to move them to pvp
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so no. not period
- solderq1: heh
- solderq1: where they get crushed by experienced guy
- solderq1: then they quit for good lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but cww didnt really incentivize the lives system right
- Jan 19 - 11:40PM AllBlankUnitFATE: for instance, there is no direct prize for losing in pvp
- solderq1: well going back... you say you want people to keep going with CAMPAIGN.
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and there are no leauges
- solderq1: if they do pvp
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no solder
- solderq1: what does the ai changes matter lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: you want to box me into 1 thing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but I dont let you
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I view the game as a whole.
- AllBlankUnitFATE: bigger picture, bro :)
- Jan 19 - 11:41PM solderq1: right so you envision like 50 different fixes
- AllBlankUnitFATE: also, pvp > campaign
- solderq1: good luck getting cww to do all that :P
- AllBlankUnitFATE: always been my motto
- AllBlankUnitFATE: we're just talking theory here. cww has given up on oe3
- solderq1: yeah ik
- Jan 19 - 11:42PM solderq1: just a cheap jab cause you want soo many different things
- solderq1: I think we've realized oe3 just needs too many fixes...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: well, there are always changes to make
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I dont believe in "good enough"
- solderq1: haha like 100 changes
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or "if it aint broken, dont fix it"
- solderq1: mmmph
- Jan 19 - 11:43PM AllBlankUnitFATE: because in my mind, everything is broken
- AllBlankUnitFATE: that goes for literallly everything :p
- solderq1: I sitll notice how you make these suggestions AFTER you exploited these things and rushed your way to level 100
- AllBlankUnitFATE: of course. Im the pioneer
- solderq1: Ruin the fun for others why don't you
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I break the game
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so I know how to fix it :)
- solderq1: well idk
- Jan 19 - 11:44PM solderq1: fighting cloaked or shielded caps doesn't make them suddenly interestign imo
- solderq1: just another boring turtle...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: it would at least force you to change from
- AllBlankUnitFATE: plop 2 arties, go away
- solderq1: ok
- solderq1: one boring strat replaced by another
- solderq1: *slow clap
- AllBlankUnitFATE: sometimes that would work. other times, you go with plan b
- Jan 19 - 11:45PM solderq1: no,
- AllBlankUnitFATE: 2 strats > 1
- solderq1: always plan a
- solderq1: turtle
- AllBlankUnitFATE: nah
- solderq1: cause plan a always work
- AllBlankUnitFATE: like I said, sometimes the battles would allow for rushes
- AllBlankUnitFATE: because its only 50/50
- AllBlankUnitFATE: that would happen
- solderq1: @fate I think you assume that ppl will do reckless rushes, and retry when it doesn't work
- solderq1: the more conservative will just turtle every battle
- AllBlankUnitFATE: some will
- AllBlankUnitFATE: some wont
- solderq1: thus nullifiying your argument
- Jan 19 - 11:46PM solderq1: well think of it this way
- solderq1: reckless guy loses lives
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I think players see the same enemy over and over, and think its boring
- solderq1: conservative guy doesn't
- solderq1: who gets farther in campaign hmmm...
- solderq1: eventually reckless rusher resorts to turtlign too
- AllBlankUnitFATE: eventually.
- AllBlankUnitFATE: sam as now
- solderq1: cause the rusher is otu of lives
- solderq1: it's only 6 lives lost
- AllBlankUnitFATE: same as now.
- solderq1: thta happens at any level actually
- Jan 19 - 11:47PM AllBlankUnitFATE: all that would happen is people would get stuck earlier, which is fine
- solderq1: ok well... if it's the same how does your modifications change anything for the better...
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the diversity is worth it
- solderq1: well that's what you say
- solderq1: I don't care what faction they are
- solderq1: all the same to me
- AllBlankUnitFATE: right, but thats you
- Jan 19 - 11:48PM solderq1: just phalanx+ ins freeze blaster+ vl
- solderq1: well if you can't rush
- solderq1: you can only turtle
- AllBlankUnitFATE: that also happens at level 100
- AllBlankUnitFATE: same as now.
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or if we find a way to rush, that will still stop somewhere
- AllBlankUnitFATE: maybe 150, etc.
- AllBlankUnitFATE: same idea.
- Jan 19 - 11:49PM solderq1: uhh so what diff does this make then
- solderq1: it stops rushing sure
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or, cww can add another wrinkle to the AI
- solderq1: but turtling is exactly the same
- zeus010101: can the com have 2 caps
- AllBlankUnitFATE: no
- AllBlankUnitFATE: each faction is set to what ships it can use
- Jan 19 - 11:50PM AllBlankUnitFATE: turtling is the same, if you want it to be
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I could turtle level 1
- solderq1: yup
- solderq1: turtling is versatile that's the point
- solderq1: works at all levels
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but even with my changes
- AllBlankUnitFATE: rushes would still work
- solderq1: who would do that?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: they would just get caught earlier
- solderq1: risky and loses lives
- solderq1: definitely not the newbs... they need to save their lives
- AllBlankUnitFATE: lots of people enjoy dealing with risks
- Jan 19 - 11:51PM solderq1: which they can't pay for
- AllBlankUnitFATE: thats why rogue-likes exist
- solderq1: rogue-likes?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but yeah, the live system might change
- solderq1: when newbs lose lives, 95/100 times they just quit
- AllBlankUnitFATE: rogue-likes, a game where you get 1 life
- solderq1: very rarely these days the go to multiplayer
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and have to start over vs a totally random series of dungeons
- Jan 19 - 11:52PM solderq1: oh
- solderq1: but point being
- AllBlankUnitFATE: they are called Rogue-Likes
- solderq1: since when do newbs do multi when they lose lives
- solderq1: they just quit
- solderq1: not a good way to boost the player base
- AllBlankUnitFATE: since Rogue was the first popular game of its type
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Ive seen newbie and middling players go to pvp
- solderq1: yeah...
- solderq1: 1 in 20 newbs
- solderq1: at best
- AllBlankUnitFATE: after they talk about losing their lives
- Jan 19 - 11:53PM solderq1: hahaha
- solderq1: once every blue moon
- AllBlankUnitFATE: well yes, cww said he doesnt want the lives system in oe4
- solderq1: yeah
- solderq1: many times i ask newbs to qm
- solderq1: they say something like "I have no miners"
- solderq1: "I have bad ships so no"
- zeus010101: that was me
- Jan 19 - 11:54PM AllBlankUnitFATE: and they know about miners
- AllBlankUnitFATE: because better players tell them to get them
- solderq1: so I think making more restarts just makes players less liekly to play in general
- AllBlankUnitFATE: or give up
- zeus010101: qm anyone
- AllBlankUnitFATE: but then again, extractor isnt so much worse than blank miner
- Jan 19 - 11:55PM solderq1: come off of it
- solderq1: more lives lost= more newb quitting
- solderq1: that's the simple truth
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Im on my blank account, and have a 1500 rating with it in pvp with extractors something
- AllBlankUnitFATE: ok n lives
- AllBlankUnitFATE: on
- solderq1: look at big picture lol
- solderq1: not every newb can play like you
- hamman247: goodnight
- Jan 19 - 11:56PM zeus010101: night
- solderq1: it's not just about ships, it's about experience and technique
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Im not sure I am defensing lives
- solderq1: uhh well
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I am defending diverse enemies tho
- solderq1: buffing ai= more lives lost
- solderq1: at least the way you put it
- Jan 19 - 11:57PM AllBlankUnitFATE: well, I will bend much more on the live system
- solderq1: you want players to retry, not to do same thing
- AllBlankUnitFATE: than the enemy diversity idea
- AllBlankUnitFATE: the one thing I used to tell cww
- solderq1: well they are connected
- AllBlankUnitFATE: was, to give players something to get when they lose
- solderq1: more diversity is meant to break one size fits all right?
- Jan 19 - 11:58PM AllBlankUnitFATE: newbs are kinda materialistic
- AllBlankUnitFATE: they need something in hand for a loss
- solderq1: mm hmm
- AllBlankUnitFATE: lots of them dont see "learning" as a prize
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so that turns them off
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so, cww put in lives
- AllBlankUnitFATE: that gets them out of camp
- Jan 19 - 11:59PM AllBlankUnitFATE: but how to keep them in pvp?
- solderq1: welp
- solderq1: so you want people to lose camp more?
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I always told cww he needs to give incentives to losers
- solderq1: all that 'diversity"
- solderq1: just designed for more camp loss
- solderq1: gg
- zeus010101: gg longer than last time
- AllBlankUnitFATE: yes, thats why I said
- AllBlankUnitFATE: incentives
- Jan 20 - 12:00AM AllBlankUnitFATE: if the live system is to stay
- solderq1: well all of your multi suggestions are kinda moot
- solderq1: not enough ppl in multi for leagues or whatever
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and since I have talked with cww about this before
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and I used to talk to him about it
- AllBlankUnitFATE: when this chat room had 200 people in it
- solderq1: ah
- solderq1: well too late now lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: I was telling him, we need ranks
- Jan 20 - 12:01AM AllBlankUnitFATE: we need incentives in pvp
- solderq1: all your suggestions mean nothing if no one plays
- AllBlankUnitFATE: so, no
- zeus010101: all right im gonna go to another game to much arguments
- zeus010101: night all
- solderq1: lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: Im not making up these ideas just for you
- AllBlankUnitFATE: and just for todays oe3
- solderq1: well obviously not lol
- AllBlankUnitFATE: surrrrrrre.
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