gw complaint

21:59	GreenWolf	Roget: posted about this on the contest hub discussion page, but want to make sure you see it
21:59	GreenWolf	I have concerns about the fact that the theme of this contest was widely known among certain people (mainly staff and friends of staff) over a year before it was announced. I know for a fact at least one person started working on an article for this before the contest was officially announced, and that seems like a pretty unfair advantage.
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22:00	GreenWolf	everybody else is getting 20 days to write their contest entries, but if you were one of the people who were told in advance what the theme would be, you had as much as a year of time to plan and draft and write
22:01	GreenWolf	and that's... super shitty and I want to know if you're planning on doing anything about it
22:01	Cimmerian	GreenWolf: The theme wasn't settled for sure until recently. I'm op staff and can confidently say until I saw the hub draft *today* I wasn't 100% sure it would be horror.
22:02	Decibelle	is this the reason for downvoting?
22:02	tretter	I know a lot of people assumed it was going to be horror, after 2000's was just 'Sci-Fi'
22:02	GreenWolf	that doesn't discount that people were /told/ by /administrators/ that it was going to be horror, and that people started writing articles for it based on it
22:02	GreenWolf	Decibelle: no, I just don't like horror
22:02	GreenWolf	this concern is entirely separate to that
22:03	Decibelle	fair enough then
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22:03	Cimmerian	Those people who were told such weren't told definitive information, I'd say. And this wasn't isolated to any certain group of people. It's been discussed openly in 19 for almost a year.
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22:04	GreenWolf	Cimmerian: iirc, I was told in so may words (although I'm paraphrasing here) by moose that the contest was definitely going to be horror last year
22:04	GreenWolf	I can go back and pull my chat logs to double check
22:04	Cimmerian	any time someone asks about it we'd just reply " I think horror" or "probably horror" regardless of whoever asked.
22:04	Cimmerian	Moose didn't decide the theme here.
22:05	GreenWolf	At the time I thought "hey, maybe it's a fakeout to trick people in case they try to start writing early" but no, it wasn't
22:05	Cimmerian	Like that it ended up horror is related but that's just because the general sense was "probably horror" for such a long time.
22:05	Dr_Leonard	That'd be kind of mean
22:05	Cimmerian	and again, it was publicly available information. Anytime anyone asked the answer was "probably horror" or something to that effect.
22:05	GreenWolf	Dr_Leonard: consider this: for people who frequent chat, they've had as much as a year to plan out and write their articles for htis
22:05	Cimmerian	So I don't see anyone having a clear advantage.
22:05	GreenWolf	but for everyone else, they only get 20 days
22:05	GreenWolf	that's inherently unfair
22:05	Roget	GreenWolf: responded
22:06	Dr_Leonard	GreenWolf I thought about it after I typed that and I gotta say I kinda agree.
22:06	GreenWolf	Cimmerian: "publicly available information" and "widely publicized onsite" are not the same thing
22:06	GreenWolf	if you don't use IRC, you basically had no idea this was coming
22:06	Dr_Leonard	Looking forward to the contest anyway
22:06	rej	But the topic is so general that many people might have concepts or drafts that work, maybe without even knowing the theme
22:06	Cimmerian	Without it being definitive it's really just a matter of asking.
22:06	rej	Horror isn't exactly niche on this sit
22:06	Cimmerian	if someone created a thread on-site asking about it, they'd have gotten the same response
22:06	GreenWolf	What I'd propose is that if you have definitive proof someone started writing their entry ealy, you disqualify that entry from participation
22:06	Cimmerian	from users and staff probably
22:06	GreenWolf	although that is just a suggestion
22:06	Cimmerian	Why?
22:07	Dr_Leonard	Science fiction was a cool theme for 2000
22:07	GreenWolf	Cimmerian: because they had an unfair advantage?
22:07	Cimmerian	We're actually still discussing if that's the case.
22:07	GreenWolf	it's not /right/ that some people get extra time to write and plan their entries
22:07	rej	What if they started writing the draft early without knowing for sure what the theme was?
22:07	Dr_Leonard	That's kinda unavoidable
22:07	Cimmerian	You're putting out a solution before creating a convincing argument that it was an unfair advantage for anyone.
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22:08	GreenWolf	Cimmerian: Quick question did you start writing an entry early?
22:08	Jekeled	My 3000 draft is currently in my sandbox. It was going to just be a regular draft, but now that I know for sure about the 3000 contest topic, I'm changing it to my 3000 draft. Should I be forced to delete it because I was working on it, even though there's no proof that I was attempting to make a 3000 entry?
22:08	Cimmerian	I did not. Haven't put anything to text file yet.
22:08	GreenWolf	because if the answer is yes, I don't think you should be allowed to participate in the discussion of whether this is fair or not
22:08	Cimmerian	I've been thinking about horror themed stuff on the "probably horror" front for a while.
22:08	Cimmerian	but I've written nothing
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22:09	DolphinSlugchugger	i think it'd be neat for everyone to have to start fresh, but that's largely unenforceable
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22:09	salvagebar	I am kind of inclined to agree with rej here - it's the nature of general themes in competitions that everyone has some ideas floating in their head or in their notes that may fit (or can be made to fit)
22:10		GreenWolf shrugs
22:10	salvagebar	The problem of when any writer actually began to write something is a really difficult question
22:10	Dr_Leonard	I actually have a question
22:10	GreenWolf	I can't make you guys do anything, but I just wanted my concerns noted
22:10	salvagebar	And for the record I have no intention of submitting anything
22:11	Cimmerian	GW: Ahh. Noted I suppose.
22:11	Dr_Leonard	What would happen hypothetically if an author deleted their X000 skip?
22:11	GreenWolf	if you decide that it's not an issue, fine
22:11	Dr_Leonard	After it had arleeady won?
22:11	Dr_Leonard	already
22:11	Cimmerian	Dr_Leonard: Since the 2nd place finisher gets to choose their slot I suppose they'd get to choose 3000
22:11	Dr_Leonard	I don't think I'll submit anything because I suck at horror
22:11	rej	Dr_Leonard: we'd replace it with a butt ghost clone
22:11	Dr_Leonard	I wish I'd participated in the history contest lol
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22:11	Dr_Leonard	Rej makes sense.
22:12	DrBleep	Any staff on that might be willing to read a reworked draft?