[19:59:39] <katiecharm> alright all its approximately 8pm
[20:00:28] <katiecharm> this meeting is for those who couldn't attend the 2pm session. we had several members of the community present and hammered out how we all feel about recent goings on
[20:00:51] <jwinterm> I rapidly scrolled through 2pm meeting
[20:00:58] <katiecharm> it was proposed and heavily liked that we have our hard fork on April 7th
[20:01:03] <jwinterm> I think floam412 and I are the only ones who missed it and are here now
[20:01:45] <jwinterm> hard fork to new variant1 monero pow?
[20:02:05] <katiecharm> in which we will adopt the rebase code, set minimum ring size to 3,and continue to allow a single tx of ring size 1 per block, but totally disallow ring size 2
[20:02:22] <jwinterm> so no change to pow?
[20:02:27] <katiecharm> and yes
[20:02:32] --> retti (~email@example.com) has joined #aeon
[20:02:44] <smooth> jwinterm: the earlier discussion was that we should adopt variant 1
[20:03:03] <smooth> it'll be cn-lite variant 1
[20:03:12] <katiecharm> it was agreed that to prevent an asic butt rush we have to emergency fork to the monero pow, but with our same lighter scratch pad
[20:03:15] <jwinterm> ok, that's pretty quick for hardfork, but not too many people to notify I guess
[20:03:38] <jwinterm> yea, it's not clear that bitmain will work on aeon, but baikal at least seems to
[20:03:48] <katiecharm> I proposed, tho I don't think it met with unanimous approval that we revisit that in 6 months with a possible new hard fork and new algo
[20:04:17] <katiecharm> oh hi smooth, thank you for being at both sessions
[20:04:17] <retti> I'd wouldn't even set a time like "6 months"
[20:04:30] <jwinterm> hyc mentioned argon2d on monero github issue thread
[20:04:38] <retti> Lets get the ffs going and then think about diverging
[20:04:43] <katiecharm> well that was just said aloud, and we can argue it further here
[20:04:58] <jwinterm> that is currently used by unitus and couple other very small coins
[20:05:07] <jwinterm> there is no gpu implementation afaik
[20:05:23] <katiecharm> yes ffs (facial feminization surgery kek) is a top priority
[20:06:33] <katiecharm> once we have a featured forum funding system it will help us be our own blockchain and get out from being Romero's bitch, which we have to be at the moment
[20:06:49] <jwinterm> soon wownero romero's bitch
[20:06:50] <katiecharm> excuse the color
[20:06:59] <jwinterm> needkovri90 disappeared
[20:07:11] <jwinterm> want to come see new monero research labs this saturday
[20:07:26] <katiecharm> west coast? sure
[20:07:50] <jwinterm> yea, I'll ping him on discord if he doesn't get back to me tonight
[20:08:36] <jwinterm> anyway, I guess thanks for accomodating me, the only late meeting attendee
[20:08:44] <jwinterm> o_O
[20:08:49] <katiecharm> so does anyone present object to anything that got wild approval in the first meeting?
[20:09:03] <katiecharm> no don't worry, it's important to me
[20:09:25] <katiecharm> just because you can't make an arbitrary time slot doesn't mean you should get a voice
[20:09:36] <katiecharm> *shouldn't
[20:09:50] <jwinterm> seems good to me, as long as bittrex and big pools are on board to hard fork in 3 weeks
[20:10:09] <smooth> two weeks should be enough once the code is ready, which it is not
[20:10:26] <katiecharm> smooth that sounds like dissent
[20:10:30] <floam412> Dilly Dilly *\o
[20:10:32] <smooth> maybe 2 1/2 a little better
[20:10:38] <katiecharm> do you think April 7th too soon?
[20:10:50] <smooth> not dissenting anything
[20:10:50] <katiecharm> that's 3 weeks
[20:10:57] <smooth> it depends when the code is done
[20:11:05] <katiecharm> hmmm
[20:11:22] <retti> April 25th?
[20:11:43] <smooth> lets finish the code and then set a date, or at least get closer to finishing it
[20:12:11] <katiecharm> are you worried about getting hit with ASICS in the mean time?
[20:12:12] <thinkpol2> finish rebase code? or pow?
[20:12:18] <retti> Concern that asics are going to ruin the network. Oh well to the miners right? *cries in the corner*
[20:12:54] <-- viceroy (uid275197@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zsioiprokehhkaka) has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
[20:12:54] <smooth> the rebase code is mostly done but we cant really fork without finishing up one last item which is removing monero's forks
[20:13:08] <smooth> otherwise our fork will activate other stuff like mandatory ringct
[20:13:17] <thinkpol2> aha, ok
[20:13:35] <smooth> the pow change is very easy, can probably be merged in a few minutes
[20:13:40] <katiecharm> ugh, stoffu would be a nice voice here. hope he sounds off in the Reddit comments. and wow, okay smooth, yah we don't want that wow
[20:13:49] <retti> When can we get that to testnet at least?
[20:14:16] <smooth> i dont know, stoffu said he was working it and it seemed more than trivial
[20:14:34] <stoffu> I'm planning to do that this weekend.
[20:14:43] <katiecharm> yurrrrrssse
[20:14:44] <stoffu> Right now I'm busy fixing small bugs in Monero :)
[20:14:54] <katiecharm> hi and welcome
[20:15:00] <smooth> https://github.com/aeonix/aeon-rebase/pull/4#issuecomment-373269085
[20:15:01] <aeonbux-test> [ Even more minimal version by stoffu · Pull Request #4 · aeonix/aeon-rebase · GitHub ] - github.com
[20:15:10] <katiecharm> Retti my hopes we are logging this meeting too?
[20:15:14] <smooth> sounds great stoffu
[20:15:21] <retti> Yes
[20:15:31] <retti> kekekekek
[20:15:43] <stoffu> Also a good learning opportunity for me as a Monero developer.
[20:15:51] <katiecharm> okay, hmmm, so do you think it isn't a good idea to set a date at all for a fork?
[20:16:02] <katiecharm> asking since we have both of you here
[20:16:12] <smooth> we'll set a date when the code is done, maybe after the weekend
[20:16:15] <smooth> you never know until it is done
[20:16:39] <smooth> i want at least 2-2.5 weeks once we have a tagged release
[20:17:01] --> shigutso (~firstname.lastname@example.org) has joined #aeon
[20:17:12] <katiecharm> okay, so we will agree to revisit this in one week? no irc chat necessary, we will just freeze it for a week
[20:17:24] <thinkpol2> 2 weeks of testing does seem important
[20:18:00] <katiecharm> obvi we'll defer to yours and stoffu's wishes here. so let's freeze this for a week.
[20:18:04] <jwinterm> 2 weeks after code is available seems like good minimum
[20:18:23] <katiecharm> as far as the hard fork date
[20:18:28] <retti> Seems good, so an estimated time would be by the end of April
[20:18:34] <retti> We gotta have something for the memes
[20:18:38] <katiecharm> it would seem so
[20:18:57] <katiecharm> yeah the meme press will just run wild with their own nonsense if we don't leak something
[20:19:43] <stoffu> I'd be uncomfortable to have my code in without moneromooo's review. But I'm not sure if he can spend enough time for us before Monero's release.
[20:20:39] <-> You are now known as moneromooooooooo
[20:20:44] <moneromooooooooo> it's ok stoffu
[20:20:49] <thinkpol2> lol
[20:20:49] <moneromooooooooo> I trust in your code
[20:21:00] <moneromooooooooo> :P
[20:21:00] <katiecharm> hmm, well if monero releases end of March we could ask him to take a peek early April
[20:21:05] <-> You are now known as jwinterm
[20:21:12] <katiecharm> lol
[20:21:14] <retti> hahaha
[20:21:21] <katiecharm> use the force stoffu
[20:21:34] <stoffu> :)
[20:21:37] <katiecharm> just write it all out at once and push to master without running it
[20:22:19] <thinkpol2> whoa whoa whoa, this isn't electroneum
[20:22:36] <katiecharm> okay since we have some heavyweights here and most tech business seems to be nearly agreed upon, I have an issue I wanna bring up
[20:24:18] <katiecharm> it's me and a fellow aeon'ers intention to establish a non profit organization known as the Aeon Foundation. I know there has been a lot of bad vibes regarding these types of organizations, but exchanges and other agencies are increasingly demanding a central organization of accountability for a given blockchain
[20:24:42] <katiecharm> cons: a lot, I know
[20:25:04] -*- jwinterm nods in agreement
[20:25:13] <katiecharm> anything centralized gives a central point of attack. pros: a lot
[20:25:24] <jwinterm> I was just looking at bitcoin foundation wiki the other day tho
[20:25:45] <jwinterm> According to its founding documents, the Bitcoin Foundation's original members included Gavin Andresen, Charlie Shrem, Mark Karpeles, Peter Vessenes, Roger Ver, Patrick Murck and Mehul Puri.
[20:25:54] <thinkpol2> what is the aeon foundations job?
[20:26:02] <jwinterm> shrem, andresen, karpeles, and ver
[20:26:04] <jwinterm> wcgw?
[20:26:34] <katiecharm> lol true jwinterm. lots of slime there and a little luster
[20:26:39] <smooth> how about now? brock pierce?
[20:26:47] <smooth> everyone else with a brain quit after that
[20:27:24] <katiecharm> fact is, exchanges such as bittrex are demanding a central public point of contact for all listed coins
[20:27:38] <smooth> seems kind of easy for these orgs to go off the rails badly
[20:27:57] <katiecharm> I think the Aeon Foundation isn't a great idea, but neither is having this entire coin under the legal hand of me
[20:28:02] <jwinterm> not much better atm: https://bitcoinfoundation.org/about/board-of-directors/
[20:28:04] <aeonbux-test> [ Board of Directors - Bitcoin Foundation ] - bitcoinfoundation.org
[20:28:39] <smooth> haha, i didn't even realize vinny was on there
[20:28:41] <smooth> that fits
[20:28:43] <katiecharm> consider if I died, or got arrested, or etc etc
[20:29:19] <katiecharm> as well, having an organization let's us do legal and official fund raising
[20:29:25] <jwinterm> I don't think it's a bad idea, but if you are the only one controlling the foundation, does it make a difference?
[20:29:38] <retti> She wouldn't be the only one
[20:29:55] <retti> There would be a succession plan at the very least
[20:29:59] <katiecharm> no, it would be my intention to split this among 3 to 5 public names in the community
[20:30:14] <katiecharm> maybe not even colocated entirely
[20:31:08] <shigutso> I agree with the Aeon Foundation idea, it just has to be done very carefully to not be viewed as something centralized by the community
[20:31:30] <thinkpol2> it will be viewed as something centralized
[20:31:36] <katiecharm> I think we all agree that a central foundation is not great, but a single public person being the sole point of failure is much worse
[20:31:40] <thinkpol2> because it is
[20:31:41] <retti> That might be unavoidable to some people's perspectives.
[20:32:29] <katiecharm> I can confidently say I haven't been officially approached by any three letters and my warrant canary is intact, but how long will that last if Aeon gets huge and I have the sole keys to the kingdom?
[20:32:38] <retti> Aeon needs to be dekatiefied. Too much is tied to her and centralized to her right now.
[20:33:02] <retti> Does anyone have other ideas to achieve this?
[20:33:08] <katiecharm> I agree. even if I am. trustworthy, we must guard against being too powerful in a given system
[20:33:43] <shigutso> hmm we should use... multisig for that :)
[20:33:45] <thinkpol2> i wish i did.. how do you decentralize a foundation?
[20:33:56] <katiecharm> lol a blockchain
[20:34:01] <thinkpol2> hah
[20:34:05] <katiecharm> snakes mouth, taste tail
[20:34:43] <jwinterm> eos? eth? some other bullshit token?
[20:34:53] <katiecharm> an Aeon Foundation won't be an ideal solution, but it will be less wrong
[20:35:47] <katiecharm> as is, I have far too much power in what may become a global standard of economy, especially considering I am a narcissistic histrionic undergoing a female puberty ;)
[20:36:23] <shigutso> maybe a multisig wallet with the main devs + main community managers with the keys? or maybe not
[20:36:25] <retti> Ugh...this sounds bad on paper...its not palatable
[20:36:50] <katiecharm> would be better if the keys to that kingdom were in the hands of a legal non profit, which then gave it additional rights above a single human
[20:36:57] <retti> shigutso that is not good enough for bittrex
[20:37:20] <katiecharm> bittrex (and other exchanges) want to cover their ass
[20:37:31] <katiecharm> to do that they need a source to point to
[20:37:37] <smooth> you can mostly tell them to get lost if you are a big coin but not a small one
[20:37:55] <smooth> easy for them to just delist, no real loss for them
[20:37:58] <retti> Until there is a amazing decentralized exchage, we are threatened with delisting.
[20:38:09] <katiecharm> not vague shadowy kids on the interwebz, and not some obscure multi sig min/max solution
[20:38:12] <jwinterm> tradeogre.com
[20:38:20] <katiecharm> they need a name of a person or organization
[20:38:33] <katiecharm> yah, we should not lose bittrex
[20:38:41] <jwinterm> smooth or katiecharm did you get request to avoid price discussion on official forums like /r/aeon from bittrex?
[20:38:45] <jwinterm> just out of curiousity
[20:39:01] <smooth> i dont recall getting one
[20:39:03] <katiecharm> I can confirm I have signed an nda with bittrex
[20:39:06] <smooth> maybe i forgot?
[20:39:21] <retti> Is tradeogre reputable?
[20:39:24] <smooth> i may have ignored it since i mostly dont do price discussion anyway
[20:39:28] <jwinterm> retti: no
[20:39:29] <katiecharm> I need to review it and see if I'm allowed to discuss what is or isn't inside it
[20:39:37] <shigutso> tradeogre is still very small
[20:39:41] <jwinterm> just saw this thread on myriadcoin the other day: https://www.reddit.com/r/myriadcoin/comments/83syi1/price_investing_discussions_not_allowed/
[20:39:41] <aeonbux-test> This setting can be provided in a praw.ini file, as a keyword argument to the `Reddit` class constructor, or as an environment variable. (file "/usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/praw/reddit.py", line 150, in __init__)
[20:39:48] <jwinterm> gd it aeonbux-test
[20:40:03] <jwinterm> see top comment
[20:40:05] <katiecharm> we don't want to lose bittrex. from an economic standpoint, that would be very bad for Aeon
[20:40:07] <thinkpol2> a temporary foundation? to be disolved once aeon gets big enough or decentralized exchanges work?
[20:40:26] <katiecharm> busses into Aeon are necessary
[20:40:35] <smooth> foundations can be dissolved as long as you dont get asshats on the board who want to perpetuate it for no good reason like BTCF
[20:40:37] <katiecharm> we can't go full idealism here
[20:41:02] <shigutso> and one of the reasons the rebase is so important is that aeond won't eat 10GB of RAM anymore, so more Exchanges can consider listing Aeon... so maybe even if we lose Bittrex, we can get listed in many other Exchanges, like Poloniex
[20:41:23] <katiecharm> then we should be very careful who gets on the foundation
[20:41:33] <katiecharm> and sure shig, but that's hypotheticala
[20:41:36] <thinkpol2> that's my worry - foundation has a board, so they make the decisions on what the foundation does
[20:41:46] <thinkpol2> (i say this as a nobody here) :D
[20:41:52] <smooth> im not against a foundation with a properly defined purpose but ill be cautious about turning over the repo or donation fund. That doens't mean i wont, but i'll want to see the foundation well functioning first
[20:42:12] <smooth> However, a foundation can still do its own fundraising, run FFS, etc.
[20:42:20] <katiecharm> we have bittrex now, one of the biggest exchanges in the world - we lose that and Aeon takes a pretty nasty hit. like it or not, XMR success had something to do with polo success
[20:42:32] <smooth> i agree with that katiecharm
[20:42:37] <shigutso> does Monero have a foundation?
[20:42:41] <smooth> no
[20:42:48] <jwinterm> well
[20:43:01] <jwinterm> "core team" is like unofficial foundation
[20:43:03] <smooth> monero is big enough to mostly tell exchanges to pound sand or comply minimally and they still list it
[20:43:07] <jwinterm> not a legal entity I guess
[20:43:19] <katiecharm> yes I would be trepid af about smooth turning over the repo too
[20:43:28] <smooth> its not a legal entity. there have been discussions at various times about having one, but has not gone anywhere so far
[20:43:32] <shigutso> yeah Monero is top 10 in coinmarketcap... Aeon is... 200ish :(
[20:43:40] <jwinterm> is trepid even a word?
[20:43:45] <jwinterm> .dict trepid
[20:43:46] <aeonbux-test> trepid — adjective: 1. timid, timorous, fearful
[20:43:50] <smooth> small coins pay $10 million to list on binance. xmr paid nothing
[20:43:57] <smooth> just to give an idea
[20:44:14] <smooth> arguably listing on bittrex might be worth something like that, so worth not squandering it
[20:44:33] <shigutso> indeed
[20:44:39] <smooth> i cooperate with them as much as possible
[20:45:05] <shigutso> so bittrex is telling it's mandatory to have a focal point for all coins?
[20:45:12] <katiecharm> okay well we don't have to come to agreement on this now btw
[20:45:29] <smooth> shigutso: mandatory for all small coins for sure
[20:45:39] <katiecharm> I just wanted to get this out there that I think it's an idea worth arguing about in the near future
[20:45:53] <katiecharm> I think it's an inevitable evil for Aeon
[20:46:23] <shigutso> do we have a deadline for that? or is bittrex fine if we deliver a "foundation" next year? :P
[20:46:46] <smooth> bittrex is okay for now, this is more of a longer term path
[20:47:23] <retti> What is the current focal point now for bittrex?
[20:47:32] <katiecharm> yes we are gtg on bittrex in a suboptimal but perfectly fine way at the present time
[20:47:38] <smooth> katiecharm is the lead represensative or some such title
[20:47:51] <katiecharm> lead histrionic
[20:47:51] <smooth> something we made up, they dont care as long as someone signs it
[20:47:56] <shigutso> nice
[20:48:05] <retti> And we are worse off with an Aeon Foundationm
[20:48:08] <shigutso> I trust katiecharm :P
[20:48:10] <retti> ?*
[20:48:35] <smooth> retti: i guess katiecharm is uncomfortable being personally responsible and that's not even bad
[20:48:42] <smooth> as she said, what happens if she dies, goes rogue, etc.
[20:48:43] <thinkpol2> i think most people don't know that
[20:49:19] <smooth> a foundation with a board can possible be a more responsible way to handle the business relationships and public affairs
[20:49:23] <smooth> assuming it doesn't go off the rails
[20:49:27] <katiecharm> shig I'm conveniently too basic to be much of a threat to any given blockchain XD XD "sometimes there's a dude... and that dude is the right dude for that time..."
[20:49:30] <shigutso> yeah that's a risk, we could have one or two more community managers
[20:49:53] <shigutso> katiecharm lol xD
[20:50:06] <katiecharm> I'm not uncomfortable. it would just make me a bad node not to question my placement there
[20:50:08] <thinkpol2> hmm so, smooth, would you be a member of this foundation's board?
[20:50:26] <katiecharm> Smooth has so far maintained staunch anonymity
[20:50:39] <thinkpol2> i know, hence the question
[20:50:45] <katiecharm> I intend to respect it, as should the community
[20:50:47] <smooth> i can probably nominate someone to act on my behalf
[20:51:03] <katiecharm> can we get the cash me outside girl?
[20:51:05] <jwinterm> is stoffu anon?
[20:51:06] <retti> Proxy smooth
[20:51:15] <katiecharm> I always wanted to werk with her
[20:51:24] <thinkpol2> that's... weird
[20:51:26] <retti> twerk with her
[20:51:35] <shigutso> wut
[20:51:53] <katiecharm> please keep rando conspiracy speculation to another place thx
[20:51:57] <jwinterm> 'Cash me outside' girl is off probation | Page Six
[20:51:57] <jwinterm> https://pagesix.com/2018/03/15/cash-me-outside-girl-is-off-probation/
[20:51:58] <aeonbux-test> [ ‘Cash me outside’ girl is off probation | Page Six ] - pagesix.com
[20:52:05] <jwinterm> apparently she's available since today
[20:52:11] <retti> kek
[20:52:24] <katiecharm> there are no coincidences in this game gentlemen
[20:52:31] <katiecharm> XD
[20:52:52] <thinkpol2> are you referring to me, rando conspiracy speculation?
[20:53:00] <smooth> i guess we can hire her for security?
[20:53:13] <katiecharm> okay let's shelf this Aeon Foundation talk for now and revisit soon
[20:53:32] <katiecharm> I just wanted to put it in the zeitgeist
[20:53:42] <katiecharm> if I'm using that phrase right
[20:54:03] <jwinterm> Born: March 26, 2003
[20:54:07] <jwinterm> jfc
[20:54:09] <jwinterm> am old af
[20:54:29] <katiecharm> nah, the internet has bound us all
[20:54:51] <shigutso> mfw 15 years old is old af... I must be ancient then
[20:54:56] <katiecharm> I have more in common with 21 year olds than 49 year olds (usually, am 35)
[20:55:10] <katiecharm> okay the hour is ending
[20:55:17] <jwinterm> also 1982er
[20:55:18] <katiecharm> any last official business
[20:55:20] <jwinterm> ok
[20:55:22] <jwinterm> none here
[20:55:31] <katiecharm> Oregon trail generation
[20:55:38] <shigutso> I have only one more thing to add
[20:56:13] <shigutso> after the rebase, are we going to organize a crusade to make aeon available in more exchanges? xD
[20:56:25] <katiecharm> yes absolutely
[20:56:34] <katiecharm> there will be little excuse then
[20:56:49] <shigutso> "let's fill all those forms!!!"
[20:56:51] <retti> We won't have to crusade
[20:57:04] <katiecharm> I think the tux people will be interested
[20:57:08] <retti> Thats on Katie now
[20:57:12] <katiecharm> it's a small exchange, but solid and promising
[20:57:31] <retti> Aeon to Pepecash trading pait ftw
[20:57:48] <_Slack> <needkovri90> jwinterm
[20:57:50] <_Slack> <needkovri90> saturday is on
[20:57:59] <katiecharm> the more exchanges we get listed on (without paying for obvi) the more. decentralized and powerful we become
[20:58:00] <_Slack> <needkovri90> its nothing fancy yet, still moving stuff in
[20:58:00] <shigutso> I'll make sure the miners of my pool will ask the hell out my country's exchange for aeon
[20:58:19] <katiecharm> open invitation nk90?
[20:58:32] <retti> Not fair lol
[20:58:46] <jwinterm> ok, can you post meetup link or pm address
[20:58:54] <jwinterm> not sure I'll get there but would like to
[20:59:46] <smooth> paying a little isn't bad. obviously we aren't paying $10 million but paying a (much) smaller amount could be worth it
[21:00:11] <smooth> ideally no, but its back to being realistic about being a small coin
[21:00:22] <smooth> and not paying is better ofc
[21:00:50] <smooth> right now only being on one real exchange is quite bad
[21:01:24] <katiecharm> yes I would even say dire. we need to construct additional exchanges immediately
[21:01:25] <jwinterm> honestly it's probably better shitopia delisted
[21:01:29] <jwinterm> those guys are scammy af
[21:02:01] <katiecharm> these two chats have been a great step in solidifying our community tho
[21:02:17] <katiecharm> and I wanna thank all the crypto legends who made time to be here and weigh in
[21:02:22] <jwinterm> thanks for having second one
[21:02:36] <katiecharm> and even those luerkers who just watched from the sides
[21:02:55] <jwinterm> gotta go play guitar for kids and get them to sleep
[21:03:03] <jwinterm> hopefully see you on saturday or soon
[21:03:08] <katiecharm> and those who asked innocuous and innoculous questions, and even those who took the time to review this log afterwards
[21:03:16] <katiecharm> thanks all <3
[21:03:22] <-- retti (~email@example.com) has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
[21:03:39] <shigutso> thanks everyone, have a good night!
[21:04:42] <smooth> gn
[21:05:01] <-- shigutso (~firstname.lastname@example.org) has quit (Quit: Leaving)