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  1. I should start by saying that although I will be pushing back at certain places I appreciate that Jenn wrote this and don't even disagree that much, I just want to "correct the record" so to speak.
  2.  
  3. Also I am writing this fast because I'm not trying to do a polished thing, so
  4. think of this as a textual "live reaction" post. (Please like comment and subscribe)
  5.  
  6. # Positives
  7.  
  8. lol, so, all the positives are the things that were developed first to sell the
  9. round proposal.
  10.  
  11. I don't have anything to say here it's just really funny! Like, in brainstorming
  12. the early pitch was "think of all the cool fractal art" we could add here, and then
  13. Brian writes a solid metameta, and then we were like "yoooo that was fun,
  14. okay this round idea seems real let's see what we can do"
  15.  
  16. So, you know, maybe that gives context on why the round ends so strongly. If it
  17. didn't, the round wouldn't have made it past brainstorming. The stuff that made it
  18. weaker were the details later.
  19.  
  20. # Negatives Round 2
  21.  
  22. I briefly talked about this elsewhere, but, yeah as the main author of The Scheme
  23. I'm not so happy with it. So at a higher level, I'm not sure how much I'd try to
  24. fix it. I would much rather nuke it from orbit and start from scratch.
  25.  
  26. But let's say we're going to try to fix it without much change to mechanics.
  27.  
  28. The 45 thing was just a red herring we missed. We had some feeder swaps that could
  29. have made the total length 55. But none of us had counted the perimeter length of
  30. The Legend, so we didn't spot the 1:1 correspondance. And then the batch testsolve
  31. that solved The Scheme right after The Legend didn't notice the 1:1 correspondance
  32. either. Still, not really an excuse, part of the editing / writing job is to predict
  33. problems before testsolving occurs.
  34.  
  35. I suspect, that our post-writing decision to make The Legend be physical reinforced
  36. that incorrect correspondence. IIRC there was exactly 1 testsolve done after we started talking to logistics about manufacturing - our last chance to catch it would have been
  37. to say "btw this is a physical puzzle" in that testsolve. It wasn't puzzle relevant,
  38. so we didn't. But the real solvers didn't know that.
  39.  
  40. As for splitting based on words, I distinctly remember an hours-long discussion on
  41. the exact phrasing of the flavor text. We had testsolved a version that clued
  42. word splitting more strongly - it got solved in about 10 minutes. Which seemed like
  43. the wrong solve time for a meta in the AI section of the Hunt, so we spent the
  44. next few hours debating what we could drop from the flavor text without destroying
  45. solvability.
  46.  
  47. At the end of that debate, we decided that including "words" in the sentence
  48. "What words can help you find your way?" was the best we could
  49. give without fully trivializing the puzzle. Based on the testsolve data we had,
  50. I don't think it was obvious that the eventual stacking hint would be needed.
  51. A stuck testsolve will eventually get around to reading flavortext very carefully, and
  52. that's what we saw in testing, with the a-ha coming at approx the 1-2 hr target
  53. mark. (Those testsolves did not stare at The Legend which was where problems
  54. showed up.)
  55.  
  56. This isn't to say I like the word splitting, I do think it is normally something
  57. you clue much more strongly or don't use at all. Just got too constraint hell-ed
  58. to find a better solution at the time for taking Wyrm feeders and was boxed in
  59. by the "should take > 10 min" context of the Hunt it was in.
  60.  
  61. I will reiterate what I said before - The Scheme is not a fixable meta concept.
  62. There are some small fixes to make but it is a concept that should be nuked from
  63. orbit. We didn't, oh well.
  64.  
  65. # Negatives Round 3
  66.  
  67. The looseness of the correspondence was directly driven from the Wyrm metameta
  68. constraints. I think no one was a fan of it but it was necessary to make it fit
  69. and we had a hard time letting go of the FELLOWSHIP == FELLOW SHIP pun. Like how
  70. often do you find a reasonable meta pun that also fits metameta constraints?
  71.  
  72. The indicator idea seems like a good potential fix for this.
  73.  
  74. Steps 4-6 used to not exist in the puzzle. They got added solely to get some
  75. triangles into the puzzle in some structural way. I can imagine the version of
  76. the puzzle where we just give the triangular sea and put the ships on it with arrows.
  77. It seemed a little lame at the time, we could have shipped (lol) without it but
  78. I don't think it's that big a deal in the overall puzzle to have it.
  79.  
  80. Okay I should be more precise. Steps *3-6* used to not exist. The flag icons in
  81. step 3 were added to introduce a source of info (the flag) for step 4.
  82. If you cut steps 4-6 I think you are supposed to cut Step 3, because only the nautical number
  83. matters, not the ship classification letters, and you don't want solvers to
  84. rabbit-hole on using those. So that's why it feels okay to me. The confirmer
  85. only exists because of the work of steps 4-6. I think the confirm step
  86. would need to look different from the existing puzzle if you strip out that
  87. busywork.
  88.  
  89. Step 7 being index hell, yeah, it just is. We had a small hammer for digital
  90. indexing, it testsolved poorly, so we swapped in a sledgehammer. Eh.
  91.  
  92. On the order of the ships: the ships are ordered by reading order of the extraction.
  93. This is *not* the same as the cycle order of the index. The extract order is
  94.  
  95. USS Favorite
  96. USS Hamilton
  97. USS Midas
  98. USS Underwood
  99. USS San Francisco
  100. USS Jackson
  101. USS Providence
  102.  
  103. The cycle order (for what digits to index with) is
  104.  
  105. USS Favorite
  106. USS Hamilton
  107. USS San Francisco
  108. USS Midas
  109. USS Underwood
  110. USS Providence
  111. USS Jackson
  112.  
  113. (Yes some testsolvers were grumpy about this.)
  114.  
  115. Swapping the order of ships breaks the puzzle, they need to be in that order.
  116.  
  117. It's possible this meta concept was just too constrained to begin with, but, as
  118. the first submeta to get written, it felt like we had the room to afford. The round
  119. template I looked at the most during writing was the Sci-Fi round from Mystery Hunt 2018,
  120. and I'd say Lost at Sea == Blue Sun 6V4-178-B31 Trace Compression Block from that round.
  121. (The meta about Firefly.) Like, reread that puzzle and solution. No disrespect,
  122. it's pretty jank? Of the Sci-Fi metas I think it puts the strongest constraints
  123. on its feeders. It is also eerily similar in construction to Lost at Sea - do semantic pairing
  124. between feeder and actor, bounce through some parts of the dataset, end by doing
  125. an unconventional extraction to get your answer.
  126.  
  127. # Interconnectedness
  128.  
  129. I don't think it's fair to compare Wyrm to Indiana Jones. The Indiana Jones round:
  130.  
  131. * Is based on a character from a well known IP, hence it has low hanging fruit
  132. to reference for resonance. MH2023 needed to build up Wyrm during Hunt.
  133. * Doesn't have constraints on the answers to their metas (as far as I can tell they don't
  134. matter at all)
  135.  
  136. As mentioned earlier I think the 2018 Sci-Fi round is a better comparison. In that
  137. round, the metameta places constraints on both the meta answers and feeder answers,
  138. and the feeders were shared between submetas. I recognize that Indiana Jones uses
  139. paired answers, and so it makes sense to compare on that axis, but the answer constraints
  140. from Sci-Fi were much more similar to our struggles at construction time.
  141.  
  142. There was probably room to play up Wyrm's love of triangles from the creative side
  143. (there's a reason Wyrm's background art is triangular graph paper). I think creative
  144. was just busy on doing so.
  145.  
  146. In general though - yes writing Wyrm metas was a lot. I wrote about this earlier
  147. but basically we were in constraint hell, and then we infected Museum with a bit
  148. of our constraint hell when we decided to repeat feeders. There was a very
  149. deliberate planning discussion, about how much we could allow the Wyrm metameta to
  150. pollute the quality of its feeder metas, and our conclusion was that if we wanted
  151. our round vision to work we'd have to live with that. I remember a rough target of
  152. "2 good metas, 2 meh metas" as the best we could do. I think we hit that
  153. where people mostly liked Legend + Collage and did not like the rest.
  154.  
  155. WHO WOULD WIN?
  156.  
  157. teammate authors spending many hours brainstorming good meta ideas
  158.  
  159. OR
  160.  
  161. one loopy AI
  162.  
  163. (the loopy AI won)
  164.  
  165. # Collage
  166.  
  167. Yeah this definitely has Fridge Logic. Just didn't come up with a good way to
  168. make it not be Fridge Logic. I believe, that the platonic ideal of "a metapuzzle
  169. solvable from 0 feeders that you backsolve later" is the Hall of Innovation meta.
  170. It's super cool! We were not going to be able to pull that trick twice, I
  171. think it's a bit miraculous Innovation exists at all.
  172.  
  173. # Partial Progress
  174.  
  175. This did get brought up in editor feedback, that the round did not have much
  176. exciting to it if your team did not make it to the looping step. The proposed fix for
  177. that was to repeat feeders from the Museum. As I've mentioned earlier, I think
  178. this caused some other problems and wasn't sufficiently "cool" as a hook relative
  179. to the difficulties it introduced. (But maybe this is wrong? If it's enough
  180. of a basis to inspire an entire alternate round concept, maybe it is compelling...)
  181.  
  182. My assumption with most Mystery Hunts is that many teams do not see the whole thing,
  183. but people will usually open the archives afterwards, and so even if they did
  184. not experience it live, they could at least appreciate the structure afterwards
  185. (if they're into that sort of thing).
  186.  
  187. # Fixes
  188.  
  189. Given that I think our decision to plagiarize Museum puzzles was a mistake...it
  190. s is kinda wild to read a round proposal about doing it more?
  191.  
  192. That being said my first reaction was "this shouldn't work" and my second was
  193. "nevermind it should". I think it reads as more constrained than it actually is,
  194. since you are allowed to change the shells of the feeders to extract what you want
  195. pre and post-copy.
  196.  
  197. I will say, that I don't think we would have ever come up with this idea in early
  198. 2022. Good generative AI didn't appear until April 2022 for DALL-E 2 and December 2022 for
  199. ChatGPT, so that storytelling angle wasn't going to exist during Hunt writing.
  200. Wyrm was 100% "do some loopy shit" in my mind. The gimmick of reusing feeders
  201. did not feel like a "Wyrm-sourced" gimmick to me. It felt like a Hunt-wide gimmick
  202. to bridge the Factory and AI rounds, where Wyrm happened to be the bridge.
  203.  
  204. I also suspect, that if the more plagiarism based round proposal was sent, editors would have said "isn't this just Quest Coast from last year?" and asked for changes.
  205.  
  206. # Ending Thoughts
  207.  
  208. So, reiterating the start - yeah I agree with a lot of the criticism around
  209. Wyrm's structure. I'd say the key is "flawed in an interesting way". It does
  210. cool stuff and the flaws are because of what that forces elsewhere. I've read
  211. similar criticism about GPH 2022's structure. A lot of the motivation for the
  212. AI rounds was "let's try some wacky stuff" and I don't think it's so bad if
  213. not all of it landed for people. I've seen enough "Wyrm is my favorite", "Eye is
  214. my favorite", etc. to believe that we at least hit the goal of writing weird
  215. enough things that each round could find its fans, even if it did not attain
  216. broad appeal.
  217.  
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