Sent: Thu Oct 13, 2011 8:34 am
by Valten21
Hey Qant... I just returned from a weeks vacation and see we are being accused of bug jumping, and breaking another agreement. I've already talked to Lady Goo to some extent, one of course being the charterstone jumps at AD, and the other, your water being vandaled.

So.. a few things.. Ainran doesn't work along Pandemonium so much since all respectable leaders stepped down from position, and I'd like to reinforce the agreement between us, and you. Unfortunately I don't really know what the entire agreement was, just things that Burgingham thought would be important to us.




Sent: Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:37 pm
by Qant
Hi. First of all, it wasn't that I intended to accuse you in that post. Maybe I misworded it but I tried to merely inform you that (as we believe) treaties were broken long time ago, and it is pointless referring to them right now. No, it wasn't Ainran guys who broke it, but some Pande guys. Yes, you were pretty much allied with them at that time. No, I didn't refer to the cases you mentioned, in fact, it is first time I hear about you CS jumping in AD (or did I misunderstand you on this part?). Also, no, Portgas (and A.D. town itself, with the exception of maybe 1 or 2 players) do not belong to NNN, so I can't in any way force them to hold agreements you made or will make with us.

Now to the point of reinforcing the agreement. While I don't have problems with the agreement itself, I still have few doubts/reasons which make me think of it as pointless thing. Let me list them.

- First, who are you represent? It seems, that it is just Ainran guys, right? And now I am reading few recent topics in which your guys repeat that no one should trust you :lol: What I want to say is that you are different from Pandemonium in a sense that I can expect from you. to a certain degree, to break any agreement just for the lols of it. Pandemonium at least had to come up with some excuse, though ridiculous , to break it.

- Second thing is that we are already following it to a certain extent. Even though, as I already said, we did not feel restrained by those treaties for longer than a month, we still not bug-raided nor you nor anyone else. And, yes, we could. The reason for this is that, despite what being said about us, we are not very fond of bug-raiding anyone. Bottom line of this point is: what will you expect of us outside of what we are already doing/not doing?

- And the third point.I am doubting usefulness of such agreement for the next simple fact: even setting aside first point, nothing would stop you from instantly breaking it the moment you come up with some reason for it, regardless of its relevance to us. Here we have fresh example of it - you try to raid Portgas/A.D/whoever., he/them bug-jump you, you accuse us. Now, I could see why you assumed that A.D. belonging to NNN, because I never explicitly denied it, but Portgas is different case - I several times told that he isnt in NNN, and yet, it seems, everyone prefer to believe in their assumptions of who belong to whom, and in turn base their actions on it. And all this somewhat render this agreement stuff useless.


Those are my main concerns. If you have some arguments or proposals answering those questions then feel free to discuss it with me via pm or irc.



Sent: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:20 pm
From: Valten21
To: Qant
- I represent only the few people of Ainran. Yes, very true the topic on the forums is not to trust us, and you shouldn't, in game raiding along side us or something silly like these people keep doing. We simply will not bug jump you, we have far to much respect for NNN, earned from the past months of conflict. I can say we have stated this to Pandemonium, and even denied our assistance on one occasion due to them wanting to bug jump. We are having a fun time playing this game with out wall jumps, and on top of that try and uphold a clean image of raiders who do not use such exploits (this is in large contrast to the "chair" jump, and two charterstone jumps done at AD, I will explain) . In short, we simply just cannot make a post saying "RUA RAIDED VIA CS JUMP" and feel at all proud of our work.


- I won't expect anything else of you then has been in the past months, personally I don't care about resources or other agreements, mainly that I will not wake up dead with a charterstone and one thousand signs beside me, but to a ram signed and walled in, so I will be given the opportunity to fight! I guess to be clear, no bug jumping into villages, or using it defensively (ram walls)

- Understand your worries here, I guess it really comes to trust, between us both. let's use Portgas incident as an example, the moment I got home and found out Ainran had used charterstones to jump two walls, I contacted Lady Goo, then you, and here we are. Basically, if someone tries to bug jump us, we will bug jump them, offesnively or defensively. In this case, we placed a ram surrounded by a brick wall, and signs... when we came back the next day the ram was still there, but, so was a charterstone. There is not a doubt in my mind if they got inside they would have hesitated to break the ram.

I'm not really sure how to go about defining who is you, and not you. From my understanding, Echo, CCCP, Earthquake, Fallout, LadyGoo's riverside vault (name I can't remember), and Vitterstard are places I will not bug jump, as I've collected scents from raids involving Lady Goo and Bell and tracked to these places. I understand you might have more places you wish not to reveal so I will say to you, so long as they do not try and bug jump us, we will not try and bug jump them. As for us, Costco, and Ainran belongs to us. Nothing else comes to mind.