2:34 PM] Leonheart: here's what I think happened
[2:34 PM] Spenser: i dont know how many things someone can be forgetful of
[2:34 PM] Spenser: but i literally caught him in a lie at PD about the taser
[2:34 PM] Spenser: when he tried to PG prongs not being deployed
[2:34 PM] Spenser: and we literally had a PICTURE of him rping taking the prongs out of call
[2:34 PM] Spenser: kyle***
[2:34 PM] Spenser: like 45 minutes prior
[2:34 PM] Spenser: way too recently for him to have forgotten
[2:36 PM] Leonheart: he didn't have a record of what Rhea Moraine indicated in /do (though he probably had a chat parser  at the time, it probably didn't occur to him when it should have) because he was not expecting it, at the time Rhea gave the /do specifications to him, to be a case of mistake identity. So when, however long after, Dean showed up insisting that he view the footage, James, realizing that he didn't have a record of what Rhea indicated, added the bit about hair on the head and shaved at the sides
[2:37 PM] Spenser: https://image.prntscr.com/image/ATYyw-MzQaqfsN91uDQS2A.png
https://image.prntscr.com/image/mBLbJiS-RWCm_4xodafxIw.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/516170907585216523/576275525920882689/unknown.png



[2:38 PM] Spenser: yeah, we are in agreement: he retroactively stated the evidence fit kyle brock
[2:38 PM] Spenser: Because he knew that the evidence he ACTUALLY got was so vague that he could never justify it to a lawyer
[2:39 PM] Leonheart: nah, I don't think he knew at the time the lawyers showed up that it was vague
[2:39 PM] Leonheart: he just didn't remember it/have a record of it
[2:39 PM] Spenser: that's even more confusing then
[2:39 PM] Spenser: so he gets given vague evidence. somehow, in his head, decides kyle brock was the guilty man
[2:39 PM] Spenser: and then rewrites the evidence in his own mind
[2:39 PM] Spenser: really no better
[2:39 PM] Spenser: lol
[2:39 PM] Leonheart: I mean, could he have foreseen these events when he responded to the 9-1-1 call and viewed the CCTV (i.e. had Rhea describe it to him in /do)?
[2:39 PM] Leonheart: he couldn't have
[2:40 PM] Leonheart: so he didn't think to save it
[2:40 PM] Leonheart: he forgot what she put
[2:40 PM] Leonheart: the lawyers showed up
[2:40 PM] Spenser: I would have saved it and so would everyone i play with
[2:40 PM] Spenser: Thats why this worked out
[2:40 PM] Leonheart: he panicked because he forgot
[2:40 PM] Spenser: Because everyone saves screenshots
[2:40 PM] Spenser: Because we are cautious
[2:40 PM] Spenser: Youre giving these people too much benefit of the doubt
[2:40 PM] Leonheart: and he assumed that Rhea described the person he arrested
[2:41 PM] Spenser: it's like you expect people outside the ULSA law graduates to be total boneheads, and that they should be forgiven for being boneheads, because thats just the way!
[2:41 PM] Spenser: but that shouldnt be the way
[2:41 PM] Spenser: he SHOULD have taken a screenshot
[2:41 PM] Spenser: i was a cop on a way shittier server for years
[2:41 PM] Spenser: i took screenshots of crap like that
[2:41 PM] Leonheart: [2:40 PM] Spenser: I would have saved it and so would everyone i play with
[2:41 PM] Leonheart: he's made a lot of arrests and responded to a lot of calls
[2:41 PM] Leonheart: I doubt he could have foreseen that this one would end up in court and rely on Rhea's /do
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: of the CCTV
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: so he did not save it
[2:42 PM] Spenser: any smart person would foresee that any arrest can become a case
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: let's not compare with what you'd do
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: or your friends
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: but what officers would do
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: you know what they say about hindsight
[2:42 PM] Spenser: theyd save evidence
[2:42 PM] Spenser: if not, then they suck
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: don't just this from hindsight
[2:42 PM] Spenser: thats the point blank
[2:42 PM] Leonheart: it was not foreseeable
[2:42 PM] Spenser: what hindsight?
[2:42 PM] Spenser: i said the same things on the day of
[2:42 PM] Spenser: this all happened rapidly
[2:43 PM] Spenser: we were literally there right after the arrest
[2:43 PM] Spenser: it's not like we gave it time to get cold
[2:43 PM] Spenser: this cop was negligent and careless
[2:43 PM] Spenser: its either that, or he was malicious
[2:43 PM] Spenser: you have to pick one. he doesnt get to be none of those things
[2:43 PM] Spenser: and whichever one it was, we wasted our time, kyle brock sat in jail
[2:43 PM] Spenser: and i wrote a whole case about it
[2:43 PM] Spenser: to top it off, he taunted us
[2:43 PM] Spenser: and he pged TWICE
[2:43 PM] Spenser: how much benefit of the doubt does he get?
[2:44 PM] Spenser: did he forget he deployed prongs, too?
[2:44 PM] Leonheart: the point is that at 2:30 am when Rhea gave the /do, he did not anticipate it would be needed
[2:44 PM] Spenser: after DELIBERATELY RPING THEM and putting them on the table?
[2:44 PM] Leonheart: this is why he panicked when was asked for
[2:44 PM] Spenser: its still his fault
[2:44 PM] Spenser: you have too much empathy for a bad cop getting caught being a bad cop
[2:44 PM] Leonheart: nobody said it wasn't his fault
[2:44 PM] Spenser: just because the bad cop didnt "see it comin"
[2:44 PM] Spenser: on ngg id have faction banned this guy myself
[2:44 PM] Spenser: and that was NGG
[2:44 PM] Spenser: lol
[2:45 PM] Leonheart: I'm just saying it was accidental because he panicked for not having the Rhea's /do; so he filled it in with what he thought she said
[2:45 PM] Leonheart: simple
[2:45 PM] Spenser: with dire consequences
[2:45 PM] Spenser: and like i said, he stuck to his guns
[2:45 PM] Spenser: he did not once entertain the idea that he misremembered
[2:45 PM] Spenser: he didnt apologize for trying to pg the taser
[2:45 PM] Spenser: he just taunted us and, presumably, told you never to listen to me because im a prick
[2:46 PM] Spenser: maybe i am blinded by my frustration over this, but youre blinded by a bleeding heart
[2:46 PM] Spenser: people can be both nice and assholes at once; i am an example of this in the flesh
[2:46 PM] Spenser: this guy is too, and throughout this entire process, he was an asshole and he was wrong
[2:46 PM] Spenser: he never even once considered the possibility that he was wrong
[2:46 PM] Spenser: so firmly that he just created evidence to fit, because he was so certain he was correct
[2:47 PM] Leonheart: wait
[2:47 PM] Leonheart: if Hayley did not learn of Kyle's arrest until she saw the case....
[2:47 PM] Leonheart: and if Kyle was given an opportunity to contact his lawyers by phone
[2:47 PM] Leonheart: how did you and Dean find out he was in jail?
[2:48 PM] Spenser: we WERE given the opportunity
[2:48 PM] Spenser: but he was very, very difficult about it
[2:48 PM] Leonheart: and how long after his arrest? (the stop was at 3:35 am, not sure what time booking was complete)
[2:48 PM] Spenser: he called us once then immediately hung up
[2:48 PM] Spenser: we called back like 4 times and he hung up on us
[2:48 PM] Spenser: then he finally calls again and says kyle is in jail and called for you
[2:48 PM] Spenser: i think he was literally trying to pretend he couldnt reach us
[2:49 PM] Spenser: at that point, we showed up
[2:49 PM] Spenser: dude, i know i complain a lot, and that maybe that fact serves to delegitimize my complaints about this situation
[2:49 PM] Spenser: but this is literally the worst cop rp that i've ever encountered personally on the server
[2:49 PM] Spenser: ive heard about worse, but this is the worst ive ever experienced
[2:49 PM] Spenser: he botched literally the whole thing from front to back
[2:49 PM] Spenser: and then was a total butthead about it through and through
[2:54 PM] Leonheart: just to be transparent
[2:55 PM] Leonheart: he was what I told Spawn (Rukka and Eyebrows are able to see this as well as the rest of LAS, because it's in LAS chat)
[2:55 PM] Leonheart: 2:21 PM] Jon Campbell / SpawnMatrix :helicopter:: no worries
[2:45 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: If it helps, this is why I think it was accidental:
[2:45 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: Rhea Morrain, the victim, gave James the /do specifications at the VU when he was viewing the CCTV
[2:46 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: at the time, he did not anticipate that Kyle Brock would be arrested and that his lawyers would demand the CCTV footage, so while he was with Rhea, he didn't save or record the /do specifications
[2:49 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: fast forward about hours later, about 30 minutes to an hour after Brock's arrest, James calls the number which Kyle gave him--the number for his lawyer Dean Bell
[2:50 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: Dean shows up with Spenser; James confidently tells them he has evidence (CCTV) and they demand to see it
[2:50 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: James then realizes he did not save the /do specifications with Rhea gave him, because at the time he did not foresee needing it
[2:51 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: He panics and then substitutes what he thought Rhea told him into the /do specifications he gives to Dean,
[2:52 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: That is, he honestly but mistakenly thought Rhea indicated in her /do that the perpetrator had "both the sides of his head shaved, [and was] wearing a dark checkered shirt and grey baggy trousers" (Kyle's hair style and outfit)
[2:55 PM] Spenser: I genuinely hope your argument does not prevail
[2:56 PM] Spenser: This guy deserves repercussions of some sort
[2:56 PM] Spenser: You offer far too much BOTD
[2:56 PM] Spenser: What's your explanation for the taser?
[2:56 PM] Spenser: I see you very cleverly have avoided addressing that at all
[2:56 PM] Spenser: Because you know that one is indefensible
[2:57 PM] Leonheart: 2:55 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: I don't think it was OOC'ly intent on putting an innocent guy in jail
[2:57 PM] Junoz Midsomer / Midsummer: he just saw Dean and Spenser, and details which he didn't have and couldn't remember were being demanded; so he panicked and fill in the blanks
[2:57 PM] Leonheart: the taser was an IC thing
[2:57 PM] Spenser: No, he PGed
[2:57 PM] Spenser: That's not IC
[2:57 PM] Leonheart: he just wasn't complying despite numerous attempts
[2:57 PM] Leonheart: the taser was PG too?
[2:57 PM] Spenser: Yes
[2:57 PM] Spenser: I told you this 500 times
[2:58 PM] Spenser: James Cole lied to us about the taser
[2:58 PM] Leonheart: do you want to see the arrest report?
[2:58 PM] Spenser: I literally sent you that screenshot
[2:58 PM] Leonheart: OOC'ly ofc
[2:58 PM] Spenser: Did you even read it?
[2:58 PM] Spenser: Lol
[2:58 PM] Leonheart: i may have forgotten it (much like James forgot Rhea's /do) (:
[2:58 PM] Spenser: https://image.prntscr.com/image/mBLbJiS-RWCm_4xodafxIw.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/516170907585216523/576275525920882689/unknown.png


[2:59 PM] Spenser: They lied to us directly and explicitly
[2:59 PM] Spenser: They didnt say "I think i didnt do that"
[2:59 PM] Spenser: He flat-out said "I did not do this"
[2:59 PM] Spenser: And we had to confront him with proof that he did it in the manner it says he did it
[2:59 PM] Spenser: And only THEN did they get out of /b
[2:59 PM] Spenser: I dont know how many different ways i have to convey to you the degree to which this scenario was fucked
[2:59 PM] Spenser: And how it was literally all on james cole
[3:00 PM] Spenser: And how, in spite of that, and in spite of all the overwhelming evidence that there is for his having some malicious intent, you are ardent that he's just some silly cop who forgot an RP line
[3:00 PM] Spenser: Maybe he did forget an RP line. But you don't stick to your guns after you know it was untrue
[3:00 PM] Leonheart: malicious intent against someone he didn't know?
[3:00 PM] Spenser: And everyone knew it was untrue very, very soon after
[3:01 PM] Leonheart: yes you and him have history, but you came into the picture longer after the arrest
[3:01 PM] Leonheart: well
[3:01 PM] Leonheart: not log
[3:01 PM] Leonheart: long*
[3:01 PM] Spenser: Not really long
[3:01 PM] Leonheart: the point is, after
[3:01 PM] Spenser: He lied to me
[3:01 PM] Spenser: And I would call it malice
[3:01 PM] Spenser: He was difficult with us the entire time
[3:01 PM] Spenser: We werent even being rude to him, we were just trying to ask questions and get to the bottom of it
[3:01 PM] Spenser: I do not believe he misremembered the taser incident
[3:02 PM] Spenser: It had literally just happened, and he RPed the prongs in pretty good depth
[3:02 PM] Spenser: Just to turn around and say "No prongs"
[3:02 PM] Spenser: If we caught him in a lie that quickly and easily, its really not a leap to be suspicious that the rest is a lie
[3:02 PM] Spenser: He never PGed until we were in his presence
[3:03 PM] Spenser: That is important
[3:03 PM] Spenser: There was IC corruption, sure
[3:03 PM] Spenser: But all the PG began when we entered the picture
[3:03 PM] Leonheart: slow down, too fast for me
[3:03 PM] Spenser: I don't know if he was just ardent that dean and i not win
[3:03 PM] Spenser: But both instances of PG happened in our presence
[3:03 PM] Spenser: And were directed toward us to inform our knowledge of the case
[3:03 PM] Spenser: And then youve got screens of him having more ooc malice for me than even frickin alfis would have lol
[3:04 PM] Spenser: Really not hard links to make. Cop just didnt want to lose, and lose to US of all people
[3:05 PM] Leonheart: aren't you assuming that dry fried prongs can't be removed?
[3:05 PM] Leonheart: I don't think he meant they were vaporized lol
[3:06 PM] Leonheart: [1:11 PM] Félix: literally everything from the moment she took office has been a massive defeat and embarrassment
[1:12 PM] Félix: she should’ve resigned so long ago
[1:13 PM] Félix: “May did indeed inherit a terrible hand. She then proceeded to douse it liberally with petrol and set it alight”
[1:13 PM] Félix: lol
[1:13 PM] Félix: [link to article]
[2:01 PM] Félix: is appellant-plaintiff correct?
[2:01 PM] Félix: i would assume that
[2:45 PM] Félix: [EXHIBIT A] The court transcript of the criminal appeal. The plaintiff's conviction was reversed and the accusations dismissed on the ground that insufficient evidence existed to support the initial conviction. Initial counsel appointed to the case recused himself for personal reasons that we presume have to do with the injustice of the Department's case. [FILE]
[2:48 PM] Félix: a complete misrepresentation of how the case ended and a conspiracy theory-like opinion because of a recusal
[2:49 PM] Félix: imagine if he did this irl lol
[2:49 PM] Félix: im going to admonish smilesville tbh im over it
[3:01 PM] Leonheart: sorry I was AFK for a while
[3:02 PM] Leonheart: like I said before about that remark...
[3:02 PM] Leonheart: he has no concept of the presumption of regularity; it's presumption of irregularity for him
[3:02 PM] Leonheart: lol
[3:07 PM] Leonheart: focus is the latter part, but I included other bits to show you that I wasn't talking about any of the cases Keigo and I are involved in
[3:07 PM] Leonheart: and that he invoked it on his own accord :P
[3:08 PM] Spenser: I didnt show you all the logs but the james cole tried to argue there werent prongs
[3:08 PM] Spenser: We were going to rp looking for prong marks
[3:08 PM] Spenser: The whole debate began because they were like "DRY FIRE! AINT NOTHIN TO SEE"
[3:08 PM] Leonheart: are you sure he didn't mean no prong marks?
[3:08 PM] Spenser: No, he did prolly mean prong marks
[3:09 PM] Spenser: When you RP pulling prongs out of someone, there will be a mark
[3:09 PM] Spenser: Because a prong was IN them
[3:09 PM] Spenser: and then removed from them
[3:09 PM] Spenser: Same difference really
[3:10 PM] Leonheart: i had a friend in high school named Kyle who used that express--"same difference"--a lot
[3:10 PM] Leonheart: i always thought it was a stupid expression lol
[3:10 PM] Spenser: I agree its a stupid expression
[3:11 PM] Spenser: I have never said it out loud
[3:11 PM] Spenser: Lol
[3:11 PM] Leonheart: nor i
[3:11 PM] Leonheart: anyway
[3:11 PM] Spenser: I doubt you've ever even said "bro" or "dude" out loud
[3:12 PM] Leonheart: unless we can be sure that he meant that actual prongs disappeared (not that there would be no prong marks) I don't think we can fairly say that that was a malicious lie
[3:12 PM] Leonheart: the PG over the CCTV was also def not malicious--he didn't even know Kyle before the fateful traffic stop over damn speeding lol
[3:13 PM] Leonheart: a guy speeding on a motorbike caused all of this
[3:13 PM] Leonheart: quite like a homeless guy stealing a sandwich caused Rufus' proceedings lol
[3:22 PM] Spenser: I just don’t see how you take that angle
[3:22 PM] Spenser: He was so ardent
[3:22 PM] Spenser: And he was an asshole
[3:22 PM] Spenser: I genuinely believe that as soon as dean and I came in, he was determined that we weren’t beating him
[3:22 PM] Spenser: You had to be there
[3:22 PM] Spenser: He was like that for over an hour
[3:23 PM] Spenser: Maybe he was wrong by accident, but once we got there, he stuck to it hard as fuck
[3:23 PM] Spenser: There would be prong marks either way
[3:23 PM] Spenser: I don’t see why he gets to determine when there are prong marks
[3:23 PM] Spenser: Without ever having specified it to begin with
[3:23 PM] Leonheart: "(( The link worked. The case was voided because James Cole accidentally PGed by adding information to the CCTV /do you gave him. Please disregard, but thank you for your time. ))"
[3:23 PM] Spenser: He was just covering himself
[3:23 PM] Leonheart: msg to Rhea on facebrowser just now lol
[3:24 PM] Spenser: “Accidentally PGed”
[3:24 PM] Leonheart: that's precisely what it was
[3:24 PM] Spenser: You’re really trying hard to set this poor innocent guy narrative
[3:24 PM] Spenser: Poor cop being bullied by Jameson
[3:24 PM] Spenser: All he did was forget!
[3:24 PM] Spenser: :frowning:
[3:24 PM] Spenser: Poor guy
[3:24 PM] Spenser: Anyone would’ve done the same
[3:24 PM] Spenser: What can we expect?
[3:24 PM] Spenser: :’(
[3:24 PM] Leonheart: if he had remembered the /do or saved it, he would have conferred with it and wouldn't have filled in the blanks
[3:24 PM] Spenser: He should have. I don’t think he’s blameless just because of that
[3:25 PM] Spenser: It’s called negligence
[3:25 PM] Spenser: And it had consequences for everyone else
[3:25 PM] Spenser: And then to top it off he was an asshole
[3:25 PM] Leonheart: exactly, negligent PG
[3:25 PM] Spenser: And PGed the prongs
[3:25 PM] Leonheart: wait no
[3:25 PM] Leonheart: negligence requires foreseeability/prescience!
[3:26 PM] Leonheart: he could not have foreseen, while Rhea was typing out those specifications, that he would need them saved because the course that case would take
[3:27 PM] Spenser: Dude
[3:27 PM] Spenser: No offense to you but i despise that argument
[3:27 PM] Leonheart: don't dude me bro :P
[3:27 PM] Spenser: It undermines literally everything
[3:27 PM] Spenser: He would need them saved because he is putting someone in jail
[3:27 PM] Spenser: If that isnt SOP, then thats why the police suck so bad
[3:27 PM] Spenser: Nobody ever actually saves evidence of anything
[3:28 PM] Leonheart: it undermines that there is apparent animus between you and him, but as I said, that's not relevant because he could not have foreseen your involvement (:
[3:28 PM] Spenser: If theres no evidence, there should be no jail
[3:28 PM] Spenser: The animus isnt about arresting kyle
[3:28 PM] Leonheart: SOP? you can't expect every officer to save and record every /do and /me in case it's needed later on
[3:28 PM] Spenser: The animus is about how he acted once we arrived
[3:28 PM] Leonheart: maybe if there was a rule requiring a trial for EVERY arrest, then you can make this arguement
[3:28 PM] Spenser: And not every /do or /me
[3:28 PM] Leonheart: argument*
[3:28 PM] Spenser: but how about THE /DO OR /ME THAT DIRECTLY SERVES AS THE REASON YOU ARE ARRESTING SOMEONE
[3:28 PM] Spenser: how is this not common sense?
[3:28 PM] Spenser: how can we even be debating this?
[3:29 PM] Spenser: have they brainwashed you?
[3:29 PM] Leonheart: okay, so not every; but how could he have known what course Kyle's arrest would take at the time?
[3:29 PM] Leonheart: he could he have known to save that /do in particular?
[3:29 PM] Spenser: because he was the only cop involved and he did the entire situation from front to back
[3:29 PM] Spenser: lol dude
[3:29 PM] Spenser: because that is the /do that identifies that anything happened atall
[3:29 PM] Spenser: are you trolling me?
[3:29 PM] Spenser: i actually feel like im getting trolled because this is so self-evident
[3:29 PM] Leonheart: I mean for that case in particular, not that /do
[3:29 PM] Spenser: when you arrest someone, you need to know why
[3:29 PM] Spenser: and you need to record why
[3:30 PM] Leonheart: no prescience
[3:30 PM] Spenser: you cant just say "how was he supposed to know someone would come and defend kyle"
[3:30 PM] Spenser: lol
[3:30 PM] Spenser: shitty argument
[3:30 PM] Leonheart: it wasn't negligence or malicious
[3:30 PM] Leonheart: just reckless
[3:30 PM] Spenser: its negligence
[3:30 PM] Spenser: and i hope, sincerely and truly, that your argument does not prevail
[3:30 PM] Leonheart: reckless PG deserves an admonishment
[3:30 PM] Leonheart: that's it
[3:30 PM] Leonheart: (L:
[3:30 PM] Spenser: fuckin cop apologist dude
[3:30 PM] Spenser: actually frustrated now
[3:30 PM] Spenser: lol
[3:30 PM] Leonheart: :D
[3:30 PM] Spenser: guy botches everything ever
[3:30 PM] Spenser: fucks up an entire case
[3:30 PM] Spenser: sends us on a wild goose chase
[3:30 PM] Spenser: acts like a fuckin prick
[3:31 PM] Spenser: and shouldnt be punished
[3:31 PM] Leonheart: taunts like a true Brit
[3:31 PM] Leonheart: oh no, he should be punished
[3:31 PM] Leonheart: just with an admonishment
[3:31 PM] Spenser: he should be removed from pd
[3:31 PM] Spenser: he was once, he should be again
[3:31 PM] Spenser: some people dont change it looks like
[3:31 PM] Spenser: its not fair to kyle for him to be "admonished"
[3:31 PM] Leonheart: removal is for intentional acts
[3:31 PM] Spenser: but regardless, youre not the authority
[3:31 PM] Spenser: so ill save it for the admins
[3:31 PM] Leonheart: not negligent acts, and certainly not reckless oversight
[3:32 PM] Spenser: theres enough here that i think i can make a good argument hes entirely unfit for the pd
[3:32 PM] Spenser: either on an IC or OOC level