needlemouse - Today at 12:17 PM
hey, um. are you around to talk?
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:18 PM
sort of. im on mobile and still in bed but im (mostly) awake
needlemouse - Today at 12:18 PM
if you'd rather wait until you have access to a for realsies keyboard we can do that
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:19 PM
thatll be a while might as well try and do mobile
needlemouse - Today at 12:21 PM
okay
well. i have... a lot of things to go over. that i (and others) definitely should have brought up before now. i'm going to try not to stop every 2 seconds to apologize for that, i'm just going to put it out there here and now that yes, i know. we should have said something. that's on us, and i'm sorry.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:24 PM
yeah...
needlemouse - Today at 12:28 PM
there have been a number of repeating issues with you that are causing a lot of latent frustration and driving people away. It's leaking out into everything else and poisoning every single interaction anyone has with you, and alana for that matter. i know alana already told you i talked about all of this with her first.

i'm here now basically as an attempt to keep things from completely exploding. because you are my friend, at least, and i'd really, really rather it didn't. i am not here out of malice, and i really, really want that to be clear
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:29 PM
okay...
needlemouse - Today at 12:31 PM
i'ma go about this one thing at a time. a lot of it is just me copy/pasting and slightly modifying from my convo with alana yesterday, so she's already seen basically all of this. this isn't in any real order, it's just how i was thinking of it at the time, and it still seems to be an ok order now, so
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:32 PM
ye ok
needlemouse - Today at 12:35 PM
One, the anti-het mentality is upsetting to a lot of us. I know that's just how you are, and I don't expect to change that. And I will say that bits of it have improved since I brought it up to you before! But there are other bits that haven't.
For example, you & alana saying things like "x is totally gay" when x is, in fact, bi. And I know you're both kidding? But because you haven't been shy about being anti-het in the past, it winds up reading as bi erasure to people - like you'd rather say they're gay because you don't want to acknowledge the other part. I know that's not your intention, but that's how it's coming across. It's hurting feelings.

on this note - I know you're just doing the same thing that a lot of us bis do when we look at someone of the same sex and go "wow they're hot i'm gay." I know it's infeasible to go "x is gaaaay (right now, i am aware they are bi)" at all times. I don't really know what the answer is, here, but it's come up and I wanted you to know about it
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:36 PM
yeah i know alana already told you but i absolutely am used to circles of fellow bis fighting for the RIGHT to use 'gay'
needlemouse - Today at 12:37 PM
Yeah, no. I am 100% aware of what you're doing. But I think maybe just publicly assuring people that's what you're doing and you never meant otherwise might help? Maybe? [psyduck]...
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:37 PM
and tbh im bi, and my gay feels are gay, and i think gay things are gay, and i dont... really want to stop that. it has next to nothing to do with my feelings on het stuff
im sorry if this sounds flippant, but what i want to suggest is these people be told that its their wrong assumption
my feelings on m/f doesnt color this at all, this is my gay as hell bi thoughts on fellow gay as hell things
needlemouse - Today at 12:40 PM
I mean, I can do that. I'm hoping just having said "I have talked to them, they confirmed that was never their intention" will help, but if it comes down to it, they may want to hear it from you and not me.
I'll try first, though.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:41 PM
well i cant do that if they still want to use a middleman
needlemouse - Today at 12:41 PM
That's fair enough. I'm not here because anyone asked me to be in their stead, btw.
I'm here because they'd all rather bottle it up and not say anything and let things go to hell and I'm not willing to watch that happen anymore.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:42 PM
i hust mean, i cant talk to anyone if i dont know who to talk to because theyre hiding
needlemouse - Today at 12:43 PM
I can tell you specifically who's brought these concerns up, if that would help you.
On the condition that you wait until you and I are done, solely for my own ability to balance things going on. x_x;;
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:43 PM
if thats not going to make them feel like their confidance is broken, sure
needlemouse - Today at 12:43 PM
I'll ask them and confirm.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:44 PM
bc i know ppl like their privacy
by the way when were done
and im really sorry for asking this
but can i share some issues ive just been venting at alana until now?
needlemouse - Today at 12:47 PM
yes.
although, i have a feeling they may come up during this, but.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:47 PM
i havent been going to you because i know everyone else does and its not fair to you and i tried to promise i wouldnt do it too
needlemouse - Today at 12:47 PM
yes in general
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:47 PM
but as much as other people say im hard to approach
im finding some of them extremely hard to approach
i at least had alana to vent to but i have wanted to actually get something done about some of them but i am... a lot more shy and afraid than i think anyone in this group realizes
needlemouse - Today at 12:50 PM
Yeah. That's kind of why I'm trying to work things out, too.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:50 PM
a lot of the things i DO say take like a bunch of time of self-pumping-up ahead of time to say
and theres more i dont say because im just scared
needlemouse - Today at 12:51 PM
I don't enjoy the status quo things have been sitting at. I'm frustrated and angry at everyone, myself included.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:52 PM
i know the issue is gonna come up about how im defensive and fighty and. its really a defense mechabism. im scared
im always scared
and sometimes my first extinct is to puff up because i feel like i need to
because i think i need to be scarier than whats scaring me
i dont normally admit this but pretty much everyone in this group scares me on some level excrpt for a few exceptions
even YOU scare me
i think the only people who dont are alana, endless, and cai
and i actuqlly still feel scared at alana sometimes
and it has nothing to do with trust btw
well sort of
bc sometimes its the people i trust most that scare me most
needlemouse - Today at 12:55 PM
I get that.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:56 PM
sorry. i rambled
needlemouse - Today at 12:56 PM
And I'm not offended by knowing that, even if I'm kind of like ??? at the idea anyone would find me scary, but like. Brainmeats don't make sense, mang. I get it
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:56 PM
its because i want you to like me
and im scared of being judged
needlemouse - Today at 12:57 PM
I do like you. If I didn't, straight-up, I would not be bothering with this.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:57 PM
i know but yaknow.
needlemouse - Today at 12:57 PM
I'm just confirming. :heart:
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:57 PM
im sure everyone here has had someone they liked, and liked them that. stopped liking them
needlemouse - Today at 12:57 PM
Because sometimes seeing it written down helps.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:57 PM
or started judging them
needlemouse - Today at 12:58 PM
Yep.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 12:59 PM
another thing that i think makes me look defensive and bellilgerent, and i know IS a problem, and im aware of it and trying to work on it but i dont think ive gotten anywhere is
when i do slip up and i know i have
i think im too prideful. and im too embarrassed to say sorry
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:00 PM
so i just vanish and wait for it to pass and pretend it didnt happen and i guess expect everyone to read my mind and know ive slid into the shame corner and that im sorry but thats unreasonable
but eveb though i know o do this im. having a hard time not doing it
needlemouse - Today at 1:01 PM
I think a lot of people would feel a lot better if you did just say sorry, yes.
It's not fair of anyone else to ask you to intuit how they feel, but it's also not fair of you to ask them to intuit an apology, y'know?
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:02 PM
i know its a problrm. and im aware of it. but i am aware of it because ill literally be sitting there thinking "say sorry you fuck" and brain is like OVER MY DEAD BODY
im aware of it. and i know its a problem. and im trying to improve but its. so far still in the internal phases
of me mostly just beating myself up but still not able to just fucking swallow my stupid pride
its not fair to anyone else
and i dont know what else to do about it bust say im sorry im a prideful jerk like this
needlemouse - Today at 1:07 PM
I don't really know what to do, either. Because the only real answer that's fair to anyone else is to say "I know it's hard, do it anyway." Because, honestly... if you can't force it, and soon, you are going to lose people. I understand what you're saying, but that doesn't make it fair to anyone else to have to put up with it.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:07 PM
i know
i tell myself that too
im trying its just. needlessly hard
needlemouse - Today at 1:10 PM
But while we're on this topic, since it was something I was going to bring up anyway, I guess I may as well just point out the exact issues with being defensive and fighty, rather than just leaving it at that.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:17 PM
if youre waiting on me, go ahead
needlemouse - Today at 1:17 PM
i'm not, i'm just making sure i've said everything i want to say, haha
so you're gonna be getting a wall of text, jsyk
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:21 PM
okay
needlemouse - Today at 1:21 PM
i just want to make absolutely sure i've said everything so that way i don't get distracted and forget to mention things
i'm still typing but i moved over to notepad :D;;
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:21 PM
got it
needlemouse - Today at 1:32 PM
- it's been pointed out that you do a thing others find frustrating, and you'll respond that "(x) does it too!", but you seem to be missing context. Maybe (x) does do it, too, but usually not to the same extent or with massively different context.
The first example that comes to mind here is the Dark Souls stuff, and you trying to say Kini and I were as bad with Cold Steel stuff. Sure, we talk about our fandom a lot, too, I'll grant you that... but not nearly as much as you were. And half the time when we were talking about it, someone else had brought it up first. That wasn't the case with you - you were the one starting it. Also, she and I try to involve ourselves in other people's conversations, as well - we'll talk about their characters and their stuff. You have a tendency to just speak over whatever conversation is happening and start talking about your own things.
So the context, here, was very different. And it hurt to be shut down and thrown under the bus like that.

- semi-relatedly - alana is not a good source on whether or not something you're doing is okay. and i say this because i talked to alana last night. alana, due to her own issues, is going to enable you, because she's too scared to say no. and that's something you two need to work out between yourselves, but you need to know that's happening, and it's not healthy.
- there's also a lot of feelings like if anyone brings anything up, you're going to deflect the conversation - usually to the tune of "but what about my feelings?" And... listen. I am really, really not trying to say your feelings aren't important. I am just trying to say that everyone else's feelings are important, too, and they are under no obligation to have theirs align with yours.

the thing yesterday is a really good example. No one was trying to attack you. Alisa and Kini were screaming into the void about their own issues. They felt like you stepped in and tried to make their issues about you. (They're also concerned that you may be acephobic, and they're upset about that.)
And I understand that you have issues triggered off of some of what they were saying, but... I'm going to be blunt with you. If your issues are triggered by other people's issues, it's not fair to ask the other people to be silent. You cannot ask people not to vent because their venting upsets you. You need to learn to cope with that.
There was also something a bit ago where Alisa and Alse mentioned thinking dicks look strange. That's not an attack on you, that's just their feelings on things. They aren't judging you for your feelings on things. It is perfectly okay if you like dicks and they don't.
In general - it's not fair to ask the asexuals not to say "man, I dunno, this makes me uncomfy" - it has nothing to do with you. Those is 100% their experiences. Yours are your own, and they're happy to respect your opinions and feelings, as well, so long as you're willing to respect theirs. The problem is that they don't feel like you do.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:37 PM
my issue yesterday had nothing to do with the actual ace stuff and i dont care about that! my issue was that alisa (and it wasnt even kini, i had no issue with what kini said at all) made some comments that may not have been intentially gross, but they came off as gross. and im feeling like you guys keep reminding me that i need to remember that other peoples feelings matter and despite you saying here mine do too- thats not the impression im getting.

let me make an example. imagine if someone vented about a straight dude being gross. and i made comments like alisas, but inplied gross things about people with m/f attraction, using vulgar and flippant language like alisa did (ie the swapping fluids thing). like if i had said "theres nothing wrong with not wanting penises in vaginas" or idk something of that nature


would you guys have responded well to me?
and on that note- literally just earlier you brought up the whole 'is byrd erasing bi by saying gay?'. and the fact that you have asked me before not to talk about het hate around here. so it feels odd to be sensitive about things i am saying, and that i need to be hyperaware of everyine elses feelings but... when other people arent expected to watch themselves when THEY are venting, even if it hurts, say, me and alana
it feels like this is not being applied evenly
if i nust be aware to not hurt the feelings of my friends when i vent about het stuff thay bithers me- or not even talk about that at all- i think the same should apply to ither people in similar scenarios.
and its not fair that it isnt.
needlemouse - Today at 1:43 PM
re: your first point - ...honestly, yeah. I would have. Because that's you and your experience, and that has nothing to do with me.

I happen to like penises in vaginas, sure. And I happen to enjoy swapping bodily fluids. But that's me. No one's saying it's wrong for me to enjoy that, or that it's all I enjoy. Just that they don't, and they aren't wrong for feeling that way.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:43 PM
thing is my experience with you says otherwise
because you have asked me to keep mum about het stuff
because it wss sore on your feelings
and i understand that
and i would like it if other people would watch their language with their venting at the very least
i know it wasnt the intention. i realize that. but my vents were never about you either
but they hurt you anyways.
and you asked me not to
literally yesterday couldve been hunky dory if literally all the things said were exactly the same, just minus the unintential implication that people who arent ace are into swapping fluids or consider sex end all be all.
they didnt mean me or alana
but it applied to us anyways
and it hurt
heck some of those things couldve even stayed if they were just qualified with a "like this guy"
needlemouse - Today at 1:48 PM
The generalized "you" is a thing that exists and people will expect you to intuit. People say things as if it applies to all people, when in reality, they're just speaking about the specific problem person.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:48 PM
i am aware.
unfortunately, it still makes alana and i feel like "is this what they think of people like us?"
needlemouse - Today at 1:49 PM
I brought my concerns to you because it was a lot of things, building up. Not because of one specific instance.
So this is, again, a case of "but you do it, too" - Different context. Context matters.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:49 PM
i disagree that this is much a different context
i realize its somethind i did more, but i shouldnt have to wait and see if they do it more before i voice asking if they could not make such implications
i was hoping my feelings could matter too
needlemouse - Today at 1:51 PM
But in doing so, you took their venting and made it about how it hurt your feelings. Would you enjoy it if someone did that to you?
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:51 PM
you did!
and i didnt!
but i tried to suck it up!
needlemouse - Today at 1:52 PM
Then, I am sorry.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:52 PM
i just want this to be evenly applied
needlemouse - Today at 1:52 PM
And I will try to keep my own advice in mind for the future.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:53 PM
if i must watch myself when i vent about things that disgust or bother me, so that my friends dont feel like im implying things about them or their relationships
then k think others should do the same
its a two way street but it feels one-way right now
i realize i did it more. but i shouldnt have to wait for it to build up to equal what i did before im allowed to remind everyone that its not just their feelings thay matter
needlemouse - Today at 1:54 PM
It feels one way from our end, too. It feels like you expect us to walk on eggshells for you, when you can't even respect us in turn. And it's not strictly about things like this that make people think you don't respect them.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:54 PM
i feel the same way the other way around though. i really do feel like i am being held to standards that other people arent
and its been coloring some of my interactions as well because i dont feel like my feelings matter sometimes
needlemouse - Today at 1:56 PM
Other people are being held to those standards. If I have issues with people, I typically DM them and work it out. I don't feel like I can with you, because you'll just say "but why aren't other people being treated like this?" And that's exactly what's happening now.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 1:56 PM
because i am not seeing other peiple being held to the same standards
im sorry, but i am not
you may think they are but i disagree
i am expected to walk on eggshells about when i vent about things that some of you may fall under, so i dont hurt feelings. but it seems like when its others, i need to clam up if my feelings are hurt, or i will get defensive blowback. you say that you would let me do that too but you literally have not.
needlemouse - Today at 2:01 PM
...here's something I was trying not to bring up, but I think it's important.

You frequent anoncomms that are outright heterophobic and acephobic. You are not shy in saying as much. It was not hard to find them, or to find a lot of people that sound very much like you as a result.

It is very, very hard not to separate that mindset from you, now. It would be like if you found out I frequented a place that was regularly viciously anti-gay. You would not be comfortable, I'm sure. And rightfully so.

That's how we feel, now. And that's really what pushed me into feeling as upset as I did.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:01 PM
i go there to talk about hating het
thats all
because it was the only place i could find that i wouldnt get blowback for it
i have nothing to do with the acephobia there
...and i mean one of the things my stalkers there hate me for is they think im ace
because ive been on record defending it
needlemouse - Today at 2:03 PM
I think that's a large part of why Alisa in particular is so upset right now. Because she knows about those places, and when you tried to input your feelings into her venting, it made her think you were acephobic, too.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:04 PM
w4w is also massively racist, antisemitic, and hugely nbphobic
my god the things they say about nb people there has made my blood boil
but i just stick to just talking about hating het and the ships i like
i kinda go out of my way to try and avoid the wanks there bc ive already got too much anoncomm drama on my back
i want to keep my nose clean
im not in the ace discussions
i know i cant prove it but
needlemouse - Today at 2:06 PM
But do you kind of understand what it looks like from the outside? It's an anoncomm. We have no way of confirming who's saying what. And I, personally, right now, believe you.
But can you understand why others would be wary?
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:06 PM
yes i do. i know i cant prove it but all i can hope for is my word means enough
i actually quit the place a while back
but i started going back again because... i had no where else to vent about hating m/f
because i try not ti bring it up around you/this group anymore, at least not the level i go to w4w for
thats where i took it all
if it means anything at all, endless is probably one of the acest people in this group and i think endless is a nearly flawless human bean
and flaws would be things like 'poops sometimes'
needlemouse - Today at 2:09 PM
Like... I have to wonder how much of yesterday would have been an issue otherwise? I still think it would have been, but... maybe you would have been able to get through to each other and come to an understanding.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:10 PM
i try not to let w4w color my feelings on things. theyre stupid.
needlemouse - Today at 2:10 PM
Rather than where it is, which is you think Alisa thinks you're disgusting and Alisa thinks you think she's disgusting.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:10 PM
nonas? are dumb
and i... okau i do have issues with alisa. thats not one of them, at all
i wouldnt be in this group if i had an issue with this
i dont think shes disgusting
but i did think a couole of the things she said yesterday, esp in the context of being in a group of lgb and t individuals, was vulgar and hurtful. but not her herself or her feelings
i also dont think she actually thinks alana and i are disgusting. but i still think things like that cant be said in a vacuum, and dont have to be meant to be hurtful
its microaggressions
you dont have to believe it to accidentally engage in it
it especially stings when bi people have been hypersexualized so much and people think were crazed selfish horny sex machines
and when trans people have been long believed to be sexual deviantsd
needlemouse - Today at 2:16 PM
It wasn't said in a vacuum, though. That's the thing. It was said in the context of "people pressuring me about how they can change my views on sex."
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:18 PM
that context unfortunately wasnt communicated well and when alisa brought the vulgar comparisons up, it didnt feel like it applied only to people who try to change someones mind on sex. it didnt exist in a vacuum, exactly.
and because it didnt exist in a vacuum, it accidentally applied too broadly, and it hurt a couple people in the room
again it was literally only those two sentences that bothered me
needlemouse - Today at 2:21 PM
The context was that it was in reply to what Kini was saying. And, again... generalizing a "you" like that is something you absolutely will be expected to intuit.
I'm sorry if you don't think that's fair. But that's how socializing works.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:22 PM
theres a difference between a general you and making it about an entire demographic
it felt like the latter
needlemouse - Today at 2:23 PM
The demographic was "people who pressure us about sex." So, guys like what Kini was saying, or people Alisa has dealt with personally. It was not about Everyone Who Has Sex, Ever, and assuming it was meant that way ignores everything about the previous conversation.
I agree she didn't word it perfectly.
I just went back and re-read.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:23 PM
"there is nothing wrong with not wanting to swap bodily fluids with someone"
its not a statement i inherently disagree with. but it is vulgar and sexualizing and it does not exist in a vacuum and does not only apply to these specific people
and especially since the context by that statement had changed
it was no longer about just harassing guys like what kini was talking about
alisa herself had changed the subject to make it about ace people, non ace people, and acephobia in general
she was speaking to everyone
she was speaking to anyone who could be acephobic, thus anyone who wasnt ace, and then followed it up with the swapping fluids thing
that was the moment i took issue
and thats why i tried to say i support her but please dont say things like that
you can say "dont be acephobic" without reducing people who arent ace as "wanting to swap bodily fluids".
needlemouse - Today at 2:31 PM
...I honest to god still don't understand how that's a sexualizing statement.

Like, at the end of the day, that's what sex is, same as all our thoughts are technically just little particles firing around in our brains. Sure, it's not a pretty way to put it, but it's not wrong.

And for someone whose feelings on the subject are very deeply linked with her sensitive sensory perceptions of things, that is exactly what sex seems like to her. because she's sex-repulsed, at least as far as RL is concerned.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:31 PM
its not that black and white
especially in a context of a room full of lgbt people, especially, because again it doesnt exist in a vacuum, its going to unintentially play on the stereotypes of bisexuals being sex obsessed and trans people being sexual deviants.

and ace vs non ace isnt even inherently ABOUT sex. sex didnt need to be brought up. it can be stopped at attraction. some ace people like and enjoy sex. some non ace people arent ace but are sex repulsed or have a complicated relationship with sex
its not black and white and it didnt need to reduce it to "ace people are the ones who dont like to swap bodily fluids" with the implied unsaid statement of "unlike everyone else"
i for one, aside from being wary of microaggressions of being bi and trans, also have an extremely complicated relationship with sex
i feel attraction so im not ace. but "wanting to swap fluids" is something else
needlemouse - Today at 2:36 PM
asexual != aromantic
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:36 PM
yes and?
im not talking about romance
im talking about attraction
as far as ive understood it for over a decade ace was about not feeling attraction, which is different from not feeling romance
but whether or not someone wants to have sex or "swap fluids" still isnt relevant
and it didnt need to be mentioned so vulgarly in a room full of gay, bi, and trans people and people who may have complicated feelings about the act of sex despite experiencing physical attraction
needlemouse - Today at 2:44 PM
1. sex is inherently a part of the discussion of sexuality, i'm sorry. it's a COMPLICATED part of the discussion, sure, but it's a part of it.
2. "bodily fluids" are literally one of alisa's biggest squicks? that's why she worded it like that. it's about her.
3. again. it was a sex-repulsed ace person venting about her own frustrations. it had nothing to do with you. nothing. taking alisa's personal brainspiders and turning it into a "microaggression" is projecting, massively. thinking for a second she was saying that to attack you is straight up "i am uncomfortable when we are not about me."
i don't know how to tell you that in a way that isn't blunt. i'm sorry.
like. honestly. if you cannot understand that this was never about you and that you are projecting anti-lgbt sentiment onto a statement that never had it, i'm not sure this conversation is worth continuing.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 2:53 PM
it had everything to do with me and everyone else when she was specifically making a general statement to everyone in the room. i disagree that sex needed to come into it, especially without nuance or a consideration of others feelings because hers arent the only ones that matter when shes talking in a group.

you also missed what i meant by microaggressiin because im pretty sure i specified that it didnt even have to be directed at me. thats the point of microaggressions. theyre rarely targeted and are often things the person doesnt even agree with to perpetuate. microaggressions is absolutely saying non ace people inherently want to "swap fluids", microaggressions is absolutely using that kind of vulgar language when on the topic of nonace people. for unrelated examples, microaggressions would also be someone saying they think wide or hooked noses are inherently ugly around people from ethnicities of which its a common trait (black, middle eastern, respectively), or that all religions are inherently inferior, when a jewish person is right there with dead family from the holocaust, or a native individual whose spritiuality has all but been erased.

thats what microaggressions are. theyre small. theyre usually not intended to be hurtful. they are anyways, and can often reflect certain issues.
she doesnt need to even have that sentiment to commit hurt to it
if you cannot understand that statements cannot exist in a vacuum and it doesnt have to be about someone to hurt someone, and that more than one persons feelings matter even if theyre not the one venting, then sure. maybe we should move on.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 3:00 PM
call it a different context all you like if it eases your conscious to say "but it was different when i did it", but when things were about my repulsion and squicks you asked me to cool it.
i felt it was similar. i tried to ask nicely that she not do that one thing.
needlemouse - Today at 3:03 PM
she was talking in response to kini, who did not take any issue in what she was saying, so no. karu, who was a part of the convo, also took no issue with it. no one else was involved in the conversation.

yes, it was said in a semi-public space, but it was definitely in the context of that conversation. as you were not a part of that conversation, it had nothing to do with you.

also, again - 'swapping fluids' is nowhere near as vulgar as any of what you've said. you're projecting, massively. you're putting two issues as equally painful when they're not. you saying "I HATE HETEROSEXUALITY" to me, in a heterosexual relationship? THAT'S something like what you just described. Being kind of fast and loose about describing sex - which, again, isn't fucking wrong, that's literally what it is - is not on that level. At all. You "felt it was similar," because you are projecting.

this, right here, is what i mean about walking on eggshells for someone who can't respect us. And if you can't understand why they are upset or I am upset here, then honestly? We're done here. Totally.

I hate to do this. I really, truly do. But I can't ask people I care about to put up with you when you refuse to see past yourself to how you're hurting other people. As it is, I was trying to do this because the others had already basically given up on trying to see eye-to-eye with you, and I thought maybe, maybe, you might listen to me.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 3:04 PM
itss just feeling like the equation of venting about squicks and repulsions (>/<) someones feelings changes depending on the person
and the thing is, maybe you forgot, but i used to loudly say i hated heterosexuality. it was one of the reasons you asked me to stop.
and its because i am het repulsed
because of my experiences and my traumas
it was never about you
needlemouse - Today at 3:10 PM
Byrd. I am a bisexual woman who has been recieving nasty looks from my entire family and my boyfriend's entire family since I came out and have been the subject of gossip about how "worried" people are for my boyfriend because I'm bisexual, so obviously I'll leave him to jump the next body that comes along.

I know what being hypersexualized is. It fucking hurts.

"Swapping fluids" is not hypersexualizing. If you think it is, I'm sorry, but that's your problem to deal with, because none of the rest of us saw it that way. You. Are. Projecting. And what you are saying boils down to "it was about me because I said so."

I am not willing to continue this conversation, nor am I willing to continue this in general. I cannot ask people I love to put up with someone who is going to make everything about them and call anything that mildly disagrees with their viewpoint of the world a "microaggression." I cannot, for my own health, put up with it myself.

I am going to be leaving our mutual servers, and telling the others that they're free to do the same. Yours and Alana's Christmas keychains are done. Tell me where to send yours and I'll send it out ASAP.

Until you can come to understand that not everything is about you, I can't keep this going. I just can't.
Potente Byrd Mæmes - Today at 3:20 PM
if thats how youre going to word it to villainize me, then i just want to point out i was the one in this argument arguing that everyones feelings matter, not just one persons at a time. you can word it as me making it about myself so you can feel good thinking you shot down someone selfish. but i was the one arguing that venting doesnt make it so other peiples feelings are on pause and arent important naymore jusy because its "not about them". other peoples feelings matter. you keep saying that to me but youre the one who doesnt seem to understand that

so you can ruminate on that.


and for the record the dirty laundry i wanted to air was that alisa is an incredibly passive aggressive and patronizing person and my interactions with her have been colored ever since we first met and before i knew her god damned name she was talking to me so condescendingly and disrespectfully like she had any idea who i was or like she had a right to speak to me that way.