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Stuff about the R.E.T.C.O.N. and Pumpernickel

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Jan 5th, 2016
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  1. [12/6/2015 8:30:47 PM] Hoeloe: has anyone made a pumpernickel boss?
  2. [12/6/2015 8:30:58 PM] Hoeloe: thinking of maybe doing so at some point
  3. [12/6/2015 8:31:18 PM] Wasabi: Wait I'll show you my idea, super quick sketch
  4. [12/6/2015 8:35:32 PM] Wasabi: http://imgur.com/TmkGgx7
  5. [12/6/2015 8:36:02 PM] Wasabi: pupil turns into mouth, legs turn into clawed arms
  6. [12/6/2015 8:36:40 PM] Wasabi: then floating or spidering around
  7. [12/6/2015 8:38:56 PM] Wasabi: but yeah just an idea
  8. [12/6/2015 8:39:13 PM] Hoeloe: I like the idea of his legs stretching and spidering about
  9. [12/6/2015 8:39:13 PM | Edited 8:39:25 PM] rockatrockabutt: That should totally be a second form
  10. [12/6/2015 8:39:40 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: a little One Winged Pumpernickel
  11. [12/6/2015 8:40:23 PM] Chaoxys _: I now want to hear a remix of sepheroth's theme but have it chant "pumpernickel" in the bg
  12. [12/6/2015 8:40:42 PM] Hoeloe: we should have original final boss music tho
  13. [12/6/2015 8:40:49 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: PUMP ER NICK
  14. [12/6/2015 8:40:57 PM] SAJewers: all the uncles and eow bosses should
  15. [12/6/2015 8:41:10 PM] Wasabi: original boss music that chants pumpernickel
  16. [12/6/2015 8:41:11 PM] Hoeloe: yeah
  17. [12/6/2015 8:41:16 PM] Rednaxela: [Sunday, December 6, 2015 8:39 PM] Hoeloe:
  18.  
  19. <<< I like the idea of his legs stretching and spidering aboutI'm reminded of Mimi from one of the Paper Marios now
  20. [12/6/2015 8:41:16 PM] Hoeloe: yes
  21. [12/6/2015 8:41:23 PM] rockatrockabutt: PUUUUUUMP EEEEER
  22. NIIIIICK EEEELLL
  23. DEEEEEENNNIIIISS
  24. [12/6/2015 8:41:29 PM] Wasabi: Yeah that was half the idea red haha
  25. [12/6/2015 8:42:06 PM] Wasabi: I really liked mimi's transformation
  26. [12/6/2015 8:42:59 PM] rockatrockabutt: I'm tempted to whip up a tune using a bunch of samples of other final boss themes
  27. [12/6/2015 8:44:18 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: we should totally have PUM•PER•NIC•KEL chanting in the background though
  28. [12/6/2015 8:44:22 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: of the song
  29. [12/6/2015 8:45:19 PM] rockatrockabutt: all the popular chanting and choir and timpani and orchestral stuff, sample all of it and use it to make some weird twisted kind of... like, I don't know the proper genre name
  30.  
  31. Also halfway through it suddenly cuts to ragtime piano with an old-timey radio filter, and then from that to like death metal or something
  32. [12/6/2015 8:45:37 PM] Wasabi: omg yesssss
  33. [12/6/2015 8:45:41 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: that would be super neat
  34. [12/6/2015 8:45:44 PM] Wasabi: Chaotic Jukebox
  35. [12/6/2015 8:45:58 PM] Chaoxys _: Then make it into a dance remix for good messure
  36. [12/6/2015 8:46:13 PM] Wasabi: OMG
  37. [12/6/2015 8:46:17 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: oh rocky
  38. [12/6/2015 8:46:18 PM] Wasabi: Schroedinger's Jukebox
  39. [12/6/2015 8:46:22 PM | Edited 8:46:29 PM] rockatrockabutt: ya pichu?
  40. [12/6/2015 8:46:44 PM | Edited 8:46:50 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: you could use some sick electric guitar heavy metal chaotic solos as the transitioning section into the loop
  41. [12/6/2015 8:47:15 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: like it goes completely out of control
  42. [12/6/2015 8:47:19 PM] Wasabi: death metal ragtime is my favourite genre
  43. [12/6/2015 8:47:22 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: hahaha
  44. [12/6/2015 8:47:55 PM] Wasabi: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tds0qoxWVss
  45. [12/6/2015 8:48:13 PM] Chaoxys _: I'm more of a ska/polka/heavy metal guy myself
  46. [12/6/2015 8:48:25 PM] Hoeloe: what we could do
  47. [12/6/2015 8:48:33 PM] Hoeloe: it have multiple people work on the track for pumpernickel
  48. [12/6/2015 8:48:46 PM] Hoeloe: like, everyone has distinct styles
  49. [12/6/2015 8:48:48 PM] Hoeloe: and so if we get people to do like a few instruments
  50. [12/6/2015 8:48:49 PM] Wasabi: omg yessss
  51. [12/6/2015 8:48:59 PM] Wasabi: that'd be so neat
  52. [12/6/2015 8:49:04 PM] Hoeloe: would have to be well managed though
  53. [12/6/2015 8:49:23 PM] Wasabi: I mean well you and rocky will do one
  54. [12/6/2015 8:49:27 PM] Chaoxys _: Would an acapella part be possible
  55. [12/6/2015 8:49:28 PM] rockatrockabutt: I'm all for that idea, but yeah, who'd get to do the ragtime part?
  56. [12/6/2015 8:49:29 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: I’m not great at music but I could attempt a thing
  57. [12/6/2015 8:49:29 PM] Wasabi: We just need other musicmaker peeps
  58. [12/6/2015 8:49:48 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: bwarch?
  59. [12/6/2015 8:50:02 PM] Wasabi: ragtime would be fun
  60. [12/6/2015 8:50:03 PM] rockatrockabutt: I'll ask him next chance I get
  61. [12/6/2015 8:50:16 PM] rockatrockabutt: which is right now
  62. [12/6/2015 8:52:01 PM] Wasabi: I'd do music but finding instruments and stuff seems like it'd be really hard
  63. [12/6/2015 8:54:29 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: http://vocaroo.com/i/s0qSRRoUaMh6 attempting some kind of pandamona voice
  64. [12/6/2015 8:54:34 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: I
  65. [12/6/2015 8:54:38 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: hello enter key
  66. [12/6/2015 8:55:14 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: I’m going for a more nasally, sorta “little creature trying to sound evil” voice I guess?
  67. [12/6/2015 8:55:54 PM] Wasabi: it reminds me a lot of freedom planet for some reason
  68. [12/6/2015 8:58:00 PM] rockatrockabutt: Bwarch said no :c
  69. [12/6/2015 8:58:10 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: :(
  70. [12/6/2015 8:58:14 PM] Wasabi: awh dang
  71. [12/6/2015 8:58:16 PM] Chaoxys _: I like what you are going for, although I'm curious if you can make it a tad bit higher or maybe a bit shrill?
  72. [12/6/2015 8:58:34 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: sure thing
  73. [12/6/2015 8:58:44 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: shrill and high is my specialty™
  74. [12/6/2015 8:59:34 PM] Chaoxys _: Not sure if that would actually improve it, I'm just curious as I think it would fit with what you sound about her trying to sound evil.
  75. [12/6/2015 8:59:46 PM] SnoruntPyro: if you guys ever need hilariously bad singers I volunteer to voice that
  76. [12/6/2015 8:59:58 PM] Chaoxys _: Like when a tiny dog tries to sound tough, but has a sharp yap instead
  77. [12/6/2015 9:00:01 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: if you guys ever need regular singers I volunteer to voice that
  78. [12/6/2015 9:00:06 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: yeah I get what you’re saying
  79. [12/6/2015 9:00:33 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: I know of a character whose voice I’m thinking of but I can’t for the life of me remember their name
  80. [12/6/2015 9:00:39 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: or like anything about them
  81. [12/6/2015 9:00:42 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: I just remember the voice
  82. [12/6/2015 9:01:42 PM] rockatrockabutt: any lines of dialogue we could google or anything like that?
  83. [12/6/2015 9:01:59 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: oh you know what
  84. [12/6/2015 9:02:05 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: maybe I’m thinking of clown man?
  85. [12/6/2015 9:02:24 PM] SnoruntPyro: I could totally see panda with clown man's voice
  86. [12/6/2015 9:02:39 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: well it’s not what I was thinking of
  87. [12/6/2015 9:02:44 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: upon listening
  88. [12/6/2015 9:02:46 PM] rockatrockabutt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxOXGZ7aX6k
  89. [12/6/2015 9:02:47 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: but that would kinda work
  90. [12/6/2015 9:03:40 PM] rockatrockabutt: you know what clown man's voice reminded me of?
  91. [12/6/2015 9:03:41 PM] Chaoxys _: I think something like that would be fitting
  92. [12/6/2015 9:03:49 PM] rockatrockabutt: Sonic from that one OVA
  93. [12/6/2015 9:03:58 PM] rockatrockabutt: STRANGE, ISN'T IT
  94. [12/6/2015 9:04:18 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: yeeeahhhhh
  95. [12/6/2015 9:04:19 PM] Chaoxys _: It's weird. I've never watched the OVA, but I was going to guess "Sonic from the old cartoon"
  96. [12/6/2015 9:04:29 PM] Chaoxys _: One of the lines he said made me thing of sonic for some reason
  97. [12/6/2015 9:04:57 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: also I think I was thinking of MMPU Roll
  98.  
  99. ...
  100.  
  101. [12/7/2015 1:53:19 PM] Duvi: You missed Kood's pet's introduction, you missed how Pumpernickel and Broadsword leave the story and the EoW8 takes place in the R.E.T.C.O.N.
  102. [12/7/2015 1:54:21 PM] Duvi: and you missed me fixing Frenzy Citadel
  103. [12/7/2015 1:54:32 PM] Duvi: so it's approved now, due to the changes
  104. [12/7/2015 1:55:01 PM] retchthehaycook: Not EOW8, but a true final level accessible from the hub after EOW8
  105. [12/7/2015 1:56:06 PM] retchthehaycook: Where the RETCON goes from a mini-hub area to a full-fledged level that has you going into the machine's inner workings to get to the core
  106. [12/7/2015 1:56:24 PM] SAJewers: couldn't that just be W9?
  107. [12/7/2015 1:57:00 PM] retchthehaycook: Isn't W9 supposed to be the postgame zebraspace or equivalent?
  108. [12/7/2015 1:57:05 PM] Duvi: the boss of W9 is Serac, too
  109. [12/7/2015 1:57:12 PM] SAJewers: W9 is a cannon world
  110. [12/7/2015 1:57:15 PM] Duvi: and she's supposed to appear in all 4 of the games
  111. [12/7/2015 1:58:03 PM] retchthehaycook: gimme a sec to quote the post
  112. [12/7/2015 2:00:20 PM | Edited 2:00:50 PM] retchthehaycook: You get back from W8 and suddenly there's alarms everyone's panicking. You can go around the hub one last time, then you enter the RETCON as a level.
  113.  
  114. The level starts with the same layout as the hub form but various branching sections previously accessible are blocked off by debris/lockdown security/some other thing, so you eventually have to move through the inner workings of the machine to get to the core, where Pumpernickel is fought in the raw chaos form Wasabi proposed further up.to sum up the rest, you get the ending where Broadsword sacrifices himself to save the krew, leaving him and pumpernickel trapped in a pocket of spacetime but Demo and company are safe and the universe isn't destroyed. Roll credits, reload save file, move on to W9
  115. [12/7/2015 2:01:20 PM] Duvi: and Serac now doesn't just hate you
  116. [12/7/2015 2:01:23 PM] Duvi: she DESPISES you
  117. [12/7/2015 2:01:32 PM] Duvi: her only mission in life becomes to avenge her husband
  118. [12/7/2015 2:01:38 PM] SAJewers: i thought we planned for Broadsword to be part of the main cast in Ep3?
  119. [12/7/2015 2:01:46 PM] SAJewers: and how does W9 fit into all this?
  120. [12/7/2015 2:01:55 PM] Duvi: Serac's torture realm
  121. [12/7/2015 2:02:29 PM] Duvi: She taunts the main cast by telling them she has a universe-destroying device and will set it off unless they catch her in time
  122. [12/7/2015 2:02:40 PM] Duvi: turns out this device is a lie
  123. [12/7/2015 2:03:05 PM] Duvi: but she traps the main cast in an attempt to put them through the exact pain her husband is going through that very moment
  124. [12/7/2015 2:04:07 PM] Duvi: of course, you guys beat up serac, escape somehow, roll final final credits, get post-postgame stuff, end of episode 2
  125. [12/7/2015 2:04:20 PM] SAJewers: and how does this set up Ep3?
  126. [12/7/2015 2:06:32 PM] Duvi: So what I imagine is, Serac has a prototype of Wind's stasis device and attempts to freeze the main cast in time
  127. [12/7/2015 2:07:00 PM | Edited 2:07:15 PM] retchthehaycook: Whatever happens, it should involve Papi Earthquake as the last chicken wing
  128. [12/7/2015 2:12:02 PM] Duvi: and I imagine Serac having stolen this prototype from Grandpa Wind before it's complete because, hey, she only needs to freeze THESE goons in time
  129. [12/7/2015 2:12:43 PM] Duvi: so basically, after you beat her up, Wind comes in, angrily takes it back, spits a fireball at her, and leaves
  130. [12/7/2015 2:20:50 PM] Duvi: So as for the Elder and Uncle designs, I like all of them but one, and it's the one raocow famously had no opinions on
  131. [12/7/2015 2:21:56 PM] Duvi: Pumpernickel's design doesn't really fit the character we set up, the visual theme of any of the cyclopes, and it doesn't exactly look that good
  132. [12/7/2015 2:21:59 PM] SAJewers: the main thing I'm concerned with is how W9 fits into Ep2's plot
  133. [12/7/2015 2:22:15 PM] SAJewers: and how it will give us a starting point for Ep3
  134. [12/7/2015 2:22:48 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: you are beginning to be punished for your ep2 hubris
  135. [12/7/2015 2:22:57 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: that's what w9 does
  136. [12/7/2015 2:23:01 PM] Duvi: That's easy, SAJ
  137. [12/7/2015 2:23:23 PM] Duvi: Serac is trying to torment the main cast on their way to finishing them off, and she's using a device she stole from Wind
  138. [12/7/2015 2:23:34 PM] Chaoxys _: Wait, I just realized, I've never even seen pumpernickle's design. Is it really that unfitting?
  139. [12/7/2015 2:23:44 PM] retchthehaycook: http://talkhaus.raocow.com/viewtopic.php?t=13539&start=1025#p223230
  140. [12/7/2015 2:23:51 PM] Duvi: Pumpernickel is kind of like a headless turtle with a ruby on his back?
  141. [12/7/2015 2:24:07 PM] Duvi: it's super unfitting imho
  142. [12/7/2015 2:24:26 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: the ruby is the eye
  143. [12/7/2015 2:24:34 PM] Duvi: yeah I gathered that much
  144. [12/7/2015 2:24:46 PM] Duvi: OH
  145. [12/7/2015 2:24:52 PM] Duvi: I thought it was in a glass case
  146. [12/7/2015 2:24:57 PM] Duvi: like Science's eyeball
  147. [12/7/2015 2:25:25 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: it may well be, but let's say it's a sclera
  148. [12/7/2015 2:25:30 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: actually let's keep it ambiguous
  149. [12/7/2015 2:26:00 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: sclera sclera sclera
  150. [12/7/2015 2:26:07 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: English has so many specific words
  151. [12/7/2015 2:26:08 PM] Duvi: Like, I'd be willing to do all the spritework for a different design of Pumpernickel
  152. [12/7/2015 2:26:09 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: I like them a lot
  153. [12/7/2015 2:26:12 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: wish I knew them
  154. [12/7/2015 2:26:16 PM] retchthehaycook: http://talkhaus.raocow.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14371&p=242644&hilit=pumpernickel#p242644
  155. [12/7/2015 2:26:35 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: oh
  156. [12/7/2015 2:26:36 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: huh
  157. [12/7/2015 2:26:45 PM] retchthehaycook: http://talkhaus.raocow.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14371&hilit=pumpernickel&start=825#p319329
  158. [12/7/2015 2:26:45 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: you made pumpernickel's feet be that way
  159. [12/7/2015 2:26:56 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: I assumed he was kind of wide and facing forwards in that picture
  160. [12/7/2015 2:27:02 PM] Chaoxys _: http://i.imgur.com/4pjieV8.png
  161. [12/7/2015 2:27:07 PM | Edited 2:27:12 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah, only realizing now that I may have misinterpreted the image :D
  162. [12/7/2015 2:28:50 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: anyway, I say staying true to raocow's design is like... important
  163. [12/7/2015 2:29:08 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah
  164. [12/7/2015 2:29:28 PM] Duvi: yeah, but 1: he doesn't think so
  165. 2: he specifically doesn't care about Pumpernickel
  166. and 3: pumpernickel looks JANK
  167. [12/7/2015 2:29:34 PM] retchthehaycook: except now I know my interpretation isn't completely true to it either >_<
  168. [12/7/2015 2:30:31 PM] Chaoxys _: Honestly, I like the concept for his design, but I think it could use some tweaking
  169. [12/7/2015 2:30:37 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: 2. he didn't give him a personality writeup, true
  170. 3. big lebowski quote I think
  171. [12/7/2015 2:31:40 PM] Duvi: alright, so unless we're gonna argue "because original design" because it's not like every other ABCD was raocow's design
  172. [12/7/2015 2:31:57 PM] Duvi: I propose we either scrap or retool Pumpernickel
  173. [12/7/2015 2:32:08 PM] Duvi: and if need be, I'll do 100% of the spritework
  174. [12/7/2015 2:32:23 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: I'm against that notion
  175. [12/7/2015 2:32:34 PM] SAJewers: let's stick with what raocow gave us
  176. [12/7/2015 2:32:52 PM] Chaoxys _: Why not ask raocow's opinion on the matter?
  177. [12/7/2015 2:33:02 PM] retchthehaycook: I'll ask raocow through PM or patreon if he could whip up new reference images of pumpernickel- yeah, was just saying that
  178. [12/7/2015 2:33:10 PM] retchthehaycook: from different angles and stuff
  179. [12/7/2015 2:33:14 PM] Duvi: he'd probably answer "I have no opinions on that dude"
  180. [12/7/2015 2:33:22 PM] retchthehaycook: still worth a try
  181. [12/7/2015 2:33:27 PM] SAJewers: IMO what he drew is what we go with
  182. [12/7/2015 2:34:18 PM | Edited 2:34:24 PM] retchthehaycook: but we're not 100% clear on how to interpret what he drew
  183. [12/7/2015 2:34:54 PM] Hoeloe: I always saw him as wide
  184. [12/7/2015 2:35:25 PM] Hoeloe: like a big wide turtle thing with an eye on top
  185. [12/7/2015 2:35:56 PM] SAJewers: looks to me in that reference image they're all facing front
  186. [12/7/2015 2:36:19 PM | Edited 2:36:35 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah, that was a stupid mistake on my part when making the cinematX sprites
  187. [12/7/2015 2:37:09 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: so it seems I agree with Hoeloe
  188. [12/7/2015 2:37:11 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: alright
  189. [12/7/2015 2:37:42 PM] Hoeloe: I think pumpernickel would look good sort of side on - but maybe a little smaller than in rocky's sprite - less long at least
  190. [12/7/2015 2:38:47 PM] retchthehaycook: so if those aren't back legs, what are they?
  191. [12/7/2015 2:38:59 PM] Hoeloe: oh I think they are back legs
  192. [12/7/2015 2:39:00 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: they are?
  193. [12/7/2015 2:39:21 PM] Hoeloe: pumpernickel is a quadruped turtle thing with a big eye on top
  194. [12/7/2015 2:39:23 PM] Hoeloe: in my view
  195. [12/7/2015 2:39:25 PM] retchthehaycook: that was part of duvi's objection to his design
  196. [12/7/2015 2:39:29 PM] SAJewers: he's like Science
  197. [12/7/2015 2:39:41 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah, he could be a UFO or something
  198. [12/7/2015 2:40:13 PM | Edited 2:40:25 PM] retchthehaycook: which is why I think we should try asking raocow for another image at a different angle or something
  199. [12/7/2015 2:40:24 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/00/8f/52/008f52f7dc2ae27006b9dbda17d3d386.jpg
  200. [12/7/2015 2:40:44 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: my proposal is to keep the dome status inconsistent
  201. [12/7/2015 2:40:54 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: sometimes it's sclera, sometimes it's glass
  202. [12/7/2015 2:41:04 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: part of his whatever ability he has
  203.  
  204. ...
  205.  
  206. [12/7/2015 7:17:52 PM | Edited 7:18:10 PM] retchthehaycook: So I PMed raocow about Pumpernickel and this was the response:
  207.  
  208. "He's basically a big headless turtle with like an eye sticking out of the top"
  209. [12/7/2015 7:18:47 PM] retchthehaycook: and also awesome job, chaoxys
  210. [12/7/2015 7:19:13 PM] Wasabi: So you were right with your design rocky
  211. [12/7/2015 7:19:27 PM] ♀Lily {Pichu}: that is awesome
  212. [12/7/2015 7:19:31 PM] Wasabi: 4 legs ahoy!
  213. [12/7/2015 7:20:06 PM] Chaoxys _: Now I want to design him standing like gamera for fun
  214. [12/7/2015 7:20:15 PM] retchthehaycook: I was right in that he has 4 legs, wrong in that it's not a glass dome around a jewel and he's wide, not long
  215. [12/7/2015 7:20:32 PM] Wasabi: Oh I thought it was an eye
  216. [12/7/2015 7:20:36 PM] Wasabi: in your sprite
  217. [12/7/2015 7:21:47 PM] Wasabi: It looks like one
  218. [12/7/2015 7:22:48 PM] retchthehaycook: I s'pose it does, but even so I'm going to need to make some tweaks
  219.  
  220. ...
  221. [12/7/2015 11:30:00 PM | Edited 11:30:28 PM] retchthehaycook: Also, may I suggest that Demo and company have to return to the RETCON after each world in order to progress the story and open up the next world? On one hand, it could get repetitive, but on the other the final level being the RETCON itself would be part of a pattern, and it could tie into the worlds split up into two parts.
  222. [12/7/2015 11:30:09 PM] retchthehaycook: Perhaps the krew returns from the city/factory world early and come back to learn Rewind had stolen a crucial component of the RETCON, so then they need to go to the second half of the wait a second that's world 7 now nvm
  223. [12/7/2015 11:33:01 PM] Wasabi: well yeah it's the hub town
  224. [12/7/2015 11:33:12 PM] Wasabi: I thought we already talked about that?
  225. [12/7/2015 11:33:16 PM] retchthehaycook: I thought the RETCON was a separate mini-hub area
  226. [12/7/2015 11:33:25 PM] Wasabi: It's like the spaceship
  227. [12/7/2015 11:33:38 PM] retchthehaycook: with the main hub being the Chronotron town/city around it
  228. [12/7/2015 11:33:38 PM] Wasabi: Well it's chronotown with RETCON in it
  229. [12/7/2015 11:33:39 PM] retchthehaycook: ah
  230. [12/7/2015 11:33:43 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah
  231. [12/7/2015 11:33:44 PM] Wasabi: But you'd arrive through retcon
  232. [12/7/2015 11:33:46 PM] Wasabi: Cause
  233. [12/7/2015 11:33:50 PM] Wasabi: that's the time thing
  234. [12/7/2015 11:34:11 PM | Edited 11:34:36 PM] retchthehaycook: ah, okay, I figured there'd be a separate spacetime portal
  235. [12/7/2015 11:34:26 PM] retchthehaycook: maybe nearby, but not part of the machine itself
  236. [12/7/2015 11:34:51 PM] Wasabi: I'd assume it'd be in/near enough to the machine to do your idea
  237.  
  238. ...
  239.  
  240. [1/2/2016 7:02:49 PM] raucouschao: Hoeloe, since you're doing the w8 Pumpernickel battle will you be doing the final battle as well?
  241. [1/2/2016 7:03:04 PM] SAJewers: ...that is the final battle?
  242. [1/2/2016 7:03:48 PM] raucouschao: there's going to be the final level in the R.E.T.C.O.N. after W8
  243. [1/2/2016 7:04:01 PM] SAJewers: ???
  244. [1/2/2016 7:04:28 PM] SAJewers: I don't recall any of this
  245. [1/2/2016 7:04:52 PM] FrozenQuills: I think the story page mentioned this
  246. [1/2/2016 7:05:39 PM] SAJewers: well, what I'm working on this is basically the final level
  247. [1/2/2016 7:05:54 PM] SAJewers: like "final level" in ep1
  248. [1/2/2016 7:06:55 PM] raucouschao: http://pastebin.com/HVZfradz
  249. [1/2/2016 7:06:58 PM] SAJewers: could we not make the retcon thing world 9's castle?
  250. [1/2/2016 7:07:36 PM] raucouschao: ...wait, wrong chat logs, sorry
  251. [1/2/2016 7:08:15 PM] raucouschao: hm, maybe I didn't archive that particular discussion
  252. [1/2/2016 7:08:31 PM] raucouschao: but it was mentioned in the forum
  253. [1/2/2016 7:08:41 PM] raucouschao: and brought up a few times after that
  254. [1/2/2016 7:08:41 PM] SAJewers: I do not recall this at all
  255. [1/2/2016 7:10:08 PM] FrozenQuills: http://asmbxt.wikia.com/wiki/Story/A2XT_Episode_2#R.E.T.C.O.N.
  256. [1/2/2016 7:10:35 PM] FrozenQuills: this was discussed in the chat a few weeks ago
  257. [1/2/2016 7:10:41 PM] FrozenQuills: I forget if SA was there
  258. [1/2/2016 7:11:40 PM] Hoeloe: it was discussed a few times and i'm pretty sure SA was there for at least one of them
  259. [1/2/2016 7:12:01 PM] SAJewers: well, i was not planning around that
  260. [1/2/2016 7:12:38 PM] raucouschao: You edited the story page to remove all instances of "krew", you should've seen that stuff at the time. And you asked about it when it was brought up one time, and I quoted a previous post about it.
  261. [1/2/2016 7:12:48 PM] raucouschao: http://pastebin.com/YCreDw4v
  262. [1/2/2016 7:13:46 PM] SAJewers: i was just spellchecking, not actually reading it
  263. [1/2/2016 7:14:06 PM] Hoeloe: still there was that chatlog where this entire thing was discussed with you present
  264. [1/2/2016 7:14:18 PM] raucouschao: which I just posted
  265. [1/2/2016 7:14:42 PM] SAJewers: i do not remember that at all
  266. [1/2/2016 7:14:47 PM] SAJewers: odd
  267. [1/2/2016 7:15:12 PM] Hoeloe: the idea was basically that you have a pumpernickel w8 boss, then return to the hub, which doubles as a mini level itself before a second phase endboss
  268. [1/2/2016 7:15:31 PM] Hoeloe: it's all part of the same sequence, really
  269. [1/2/2016 7:15:41 PM] SAJewers: oh, ok then
  270. [1/2/2016 7:15:45 PM] Hoeloe: just tied into the overall plot in a cool way
  271. [1/2/2016 7:15:51 PM] SAJewers: so this changes very little then of what i was doing
  272. [1/2/2016 7:15:58 PM] Hoeloe: yeah, more or less
  273. [1/2/2016 7:16:14 PM | Edited 7:16:25 PM] raucouschao: Yeah, we can still have like a Bowser's/King Charles' final castle-type level as the EOW8 level
  274. [1/2/2016 7:16:15 PM] SAJewers: the idea i was going for was akin to ASMT's final castle
  275. [1/2/2016 7:16:31 PM] SAJewers: ok, good then
  276. [1/2/2016 7:16:33 PM] Hoeloe: it's basically just rather than fighting pumpernickel at the EOW8 level and the game being done, you fight him there, then get a second round afterwards with a more dramatic conclusion
  277. [1/2/2016 7:16:39 PM] FrozenQuills: [Saturday, January 2, 2016 7:16 PM] SAJewers:
  278.  
  279. <<< the idea i was going for was akin to ASMT's final castlethat'd be rad
  280. [1/2/2016 7:16:46 PM] FrozenQuills: I was thinking the same
  281. [1/2/2016 7:16:50 PM] SnoruntPyro: oh, does this mean the whole castle will be a massive colab relay thing?
  282. [1/2/2016 7:16:54 PM] SnoruntPyro: that would be awesome
  283. [1/2/2016 7:16:55 PM] SAJewers: i have it mostly done up, just doing my screen now
  284. [1/2/2016 7:16:57 PM] SAJewers: yeah
  285. [1/2/2016 7:17:07 PM] SAJewers: 3 floors, 4 doors each, 1 person per door
  286. [1/2/2016 7:17:08 PM] SnoruntPyro: should we make a talkhaus thread for this?
  287. [1/2/2016 7:17:12 PM] SAJewers: like asmt/a2mt
  288. [1/2/2016 7:17:37 PM] SAJewers: yeah, I'll make one in a bit
  289. [1/2/2016 7:17:45 PM] Hoeloe: the way I see the final "level" thing in the hub going is literally just turning up in the hub to find it all chaos, with some talking NPCs, and you just walk up to the RETCON, enter a door, and you're straight into the boss
  290. [1/2/2016 7:18:03 PM] SAJewers: probably make it for all boss levels, to keep it separate from the bosses themselves
  291. [1/2/2016 7:18:05 PM] Hoeloe: the transition solely there to tie the story into the gameplay itself in a cool way
  292. [1/2/2016 7:18:15 PM] SAJewers: ok cool
  293. [1/2/2016 7:18:33 PM] raucouschao: straight to the boss? I was thinking it'd be one last level through the inner workings of the RETCON
  294. [1/2/2016 7:18:36 PM] FrozenQuills: will the castle "sections" be individual level files?
  295. [1/2/2016 7:18:47 PM] Hoeloe: and the whole "broadsword saving the day and being trapped in a pocket universe with pumpernickel" happens within the RETCON
  296. [1/2/2016 7:18:47 PM] SAJewers: no, individual sections
  297. [1/2/2016 7:18:52 PM] Hoeloe: we could do that rocky
  298. [1/2/2016 7:19:03 PM] FrozenQuills: it might make collaboration a bit easier if that was allowed but ok
  299. [1/2/2016 7:19:06 PM] Hoeloe: I don't honestly know which would work better
  300. [1/2/2016 7:19:16 PM] SnoruntPyro: the final level should be in space, like a space castle, to climax the sky world
  301. [1/2/2016 7:19:17 PM] Hoeloe: I feel like it would lose some of the tension to have a full level in the middle
  302. [1/2/2016 7:19:28 PM] raucouschao: It could be a short level
  303. [1/2/2016 7:19:29 PM] SAJewers: pyro: got the intro set up already
  304. [1/2/2016 7:19:41 PM] Hoeloe: i mean, you're still pumped up from phase one, don't want to lose the pace
  305. [1/2/2016 7:19:44 PM] SAJewers: rocky: maybe do something like the computer sublevel in asmt's final castle
  306. [1/2/2016 7:19:46 PM] SnoruntPyro: well you can change the background to a space background
  307. [1/2/2016 7:20:05 PM] SnoruntPyro: also i agree with hoeloe here
  308. [1/2/2016 7:20:18 PM] raucouschao: yeah, the way I imagined it, he's literally tearing through the machine to get to the core
  309. [1/2/2016 7:20:34 PM] raucouschao: You enter the level through the hole he tore in the side of it
  310. [1/2/2016 7:20:36 PM] Hoeloe: yeah, but there is also such a thing as "too much"
  311. [1/2/2016 7:20:48 PM] raucouschao: and that's a fair concern
  312. [1/2/2016 7:20:49 PM] Hoeloe: if there weren't a world 8 castle i'd be 100% on board
  313. [1/2/2016 7:20:59 PM] Hoeloe: but since we've already established that there is
  314. [1/2/2016 7:21:07 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: so yeah, short level section in between
  315. [1/2/2016 7:21:17 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: some torn-up machine
  316. [1/2/2016 7:21:18 PM] raucouschao: I'm not saying "this is the way it has to be", just elaborating on the original idea
  317. [1/2/2016 7:21:18 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: or
  318. [1/2/2016 7:21:23 PM] Hoeloe: a short level, maybe autoscroll or with a time limit idk
  319. [1/2/2016 7:21:24 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: or
  320. [1/2/2016 7:21:29 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: Maybe design it like
  321. [1/2/2016 7:21:34 PM] Hoeloe: it has to maintain the tension, which would be hard
  322. [1/2/2016 7:21:47 PM] Hoeloe: if we can't keep the tension very high, then it's best not to have anything there at all
  323. [1/2/2016 7:21:51 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: "this would have been a much longer level, but it has had a big hole torn through it which makes for a shortcut"
  324. [1/2/2016 7:22:24 PM] SAJewers: maybe something like these sublevels from asmt? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x25LlloXMaM
  325. [1/2/2016 7:23:04 PM] Hoeloe: idk i feel like it needs to be incredibly tense
  326. [1/2/2016 7:23:07 PM] SnoruntPyro: did you choose the music for the w8 castle yet, sajewers?
  327. [1/2/2016 7:23:10 PM] Hoeloe: most levels aren't?
  328. [1/2/2016 7:23:11 PM] SAJewers: yep
  329. [1/2/2016 7:23:25 PM] Hoeloe: autoscroll or a timer would help with that as it adds pressure
  330. [1/2/2016 7:23:52 PM] SAJewers: main reason why i'm starting this, i found maybe the perfect song for a final level
  331. [1/2/2016 7:24:44 PM] Hoeloe: i'm not saying we shouldn't have a level btw
  332. [1/2/2016 7:24:54 PM] Hoeloe: just that if we do, we need to be VERY careful not to kill the pacing
  333. [1/2/2016 7:24:59 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: it just needs to be a fitting one
  334. [1/2/2016 7:25:04 PM] SAJewers: i don't care either way
  335. [1/2/2016 7:28:09 PM] raucouschao: some ideas:
  336. - Minimal actual danger, but elements that convey a sense of urgency like the alarms, visible damage, scripted events like stuff falling in the foreground tense music, etc.
  337. - maybe the usual entrances of some of the rooms of the RETCON hub are blocked off by rubble or a security system something, but Pumpernickel tears new entrances through the walls, so the path to the core includes one or more sections of the hub during the level
  338. [1/2/2016 7:28:31 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: I like these
  339. [1/2/2016 7:28:34 PM] Hoeloe: definitely on the last point
  340. [1/2/2016 7:28:53 PM] Hoeloe: the ending sequence of Fable (the original) is a good reference for that
  341. [1/2/2016 7:29:05 PM] Hoeloe: the first point could be done too
  342. [1/2/2016 7:36:31 PM | Edited 7:36:52 PM] raucouschao: And as for the final battle, which sparked this whole discussion, the idea was that Pumpernickel would have a new, more chaotic form. Maybe he's feeding on the time energy from the RETCON's core, or his outer shell was damaged in the EOW8 fight and what's left is a heart of pure chaotic energy, or he changes form simply because he felt like it/because he can/because he thought the game needed a more climactic final battle, or something.
  343.  
  344. iirc Wasabi proposed a design, and I think he and Duvi were going to work on it.
  345. [1/2/2016 7:38:17 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: oh man
  346. [1/2/2016 7:38:28 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: Duvi actually getting to redesign Pumpernickel
  347. [1/2/2016 7:38:30 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: everyone is happy
  348. [1/2/2016 7:41:48 PM] raucouschao: Not sure what the status is on that though
  349. [1/2/2016 7:48:54 PM | Edited 7:50:08 PM] raucouschao: http://imgur.com/TmkGgx7
  350.  
  351. This was it
  352. [1/2/2016 7:48:55 PM] SAJewers: while we're at it, who has claimed which boss and who has claimed which boss level?
  353. [1/2/2016 7:49:15 PM] FrozenQuills: we probably need a post/new thread for that
  354. [1/2/2016 7:49:30 PM] SAJewers: Gonna make a post in the boss thread
  355. [1/2/2016 7:50:02 PM] SAJewers: or should we have separate threads for each boss?
  356. [1/2/2016 7:50:45 PM] raucouschao: Separate threads for each boss would help keep discussion more organized
  357. [1/2/2016 7:51:30 PM] SAJewers: ok, then whoever's claimed a boso, make a thread
  358. [1/2/2016 7:51:49 PM] SAJewers: boss*
  359. [1/2/2016 8:13:18 PM] Wasabi: Hrmmm
  360. [1/2/2016 8:18:43 PM] raucouschao: Hey, wasabi! You and duvi still working on the graphics for Pump's final form?
  361. [1/2/2016 8:20:25 PM] Wasabi: Heya
  362. [1/2/2016 8:20:45 PM] Wasabi: I have no idea, I thought that was duvi hating his normal form and wanting to change it
  363. [1/2/2016 8:21:20 PM] Wasabi: My hrmm is in relation to the W2 boss
  364. [1/2/2016 8:22:19 PM] raucouschao: he did, then when he was asking if there was any spritework or anything he could do I told him you were working on Pump's final form and he seemed to be interested in helping you with that
  365. [1/2/2016 8:22:53 PM] Wasabi: Ohhh okay cool I'm down with that then :)
  366. [1/2/2016 8:26:05 PM | Edited 8:26:33 PM] raucouschao: That said, it'd be cool if you guys could work particles and/or openGL poly stuff into the design. Probably won't be able to make him completely out of programmed effects since I believe we still can't layer ogl stuff with the player/NPCs, but yeah
  367. [1/2/2016 8:26:46 PM] Wasabi: I mean if he's fighting Broadsword that's not a big deal
  368. [1/2/2016 8:27:54 PM] SAJewers: question: is broadsword v pumpernickel in w8 or at retcon?
  369. [1/2/2016 8:28:02 PM] Wasabi: Retcon
  370. [1/2/2016 8:28:48 PM] Hoeloe: btw, i gave spinjumps a trail for fun and thought it looked cool
  371. [1/2/2016 8:28:49 PM] Hoeloe: http://i.imgur.com/7MMtUzi.webm
  372. [1/2/2016 8:29:23 PM] raucouschao: I agree with that opinion
  373. [1/2/2016 8:29:38 PM] Hoeloe: doesn't mean broadsword can't be involved in the w8 level
  374. [1/2/2016 8:29:58 PM] Hoeloe: but just not the main focus - and should sweep in at the end as a heroic "GO SAVE YOURSELVES!" moment
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