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- Why TalonFlame Should Be UNbanned From Fire Monotype.
- Talonflame was banned in all mono teams primarily due to good typing and the possession of the ability "gale Wings"
- most people agreed with the ban at the time, as flying needed a Nerf, but i have reason to believe it is needed on fire to give fire checks/counters to pokemon in the meta right now that have the potential to sweep entire fire teams. the reason i am making this thread is an attempt to re balance the types. Fire's weaknesses (rock, water, ground) are some of the hardest weaknesses to deal with, especially considering fires main form of Grass moves (super effective vs all 3 types) comes from the Sun being up, and all fires weaknesses get Weather of there own, and can easily trap Charizard Y and Ninetails into a solarbeam and Kill it swiftly
- TO THOSE CONCERNED ABOUT BUG/GRASS/FIGHTING
- >fighting is a heavily balanced tier, and is run with many sashes and almost always 1/2 scarfs. the scarf forces a talonflame to brave bird, and pokemon like Terrakion live a banded BraveBird and can quickly KO with stone edge
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 256-303 (79.2 - 93.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- Breloom with sash (73.9) can get knocked down to sash and OHKO with rock tomb as Can Sash Infernape (74.2) with Stone Edge
- >although most would disagree, there are checks to talonflame on bug. Armaldo takes a Flare Blitz/Brave bird from a talonflame and can ohko with rock blast (0 Atk investment)
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Armaldo: 169-201 (47.7 - 56.7%) -- 34.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
- Making 2 high rolls needed in order to knock it out in 2 hits.
- Sash Galvantula (83.7) can also kill Talonflame with thunder or volt switch after recoil damage
- >Grass has options for talonflame. Ferrothorn can come in on a brave bird, and dish out Rocky Helmet/Iron barbs damage and then talonflame would go down on recoil the next turn if it flare blitz' as 2x Rocky Helmet/Iron barbs + 2x Recoil taken
- Cradily can also come in and deal with talonflame
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cradily: 172-204 (45.7 - 54.2%) -- 4.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
- Keep in Mind that Talonflame takes 50% from stealth rocks, and does not give fire another defogger.
- All Calcs done for Talonflame are using March 2015 Monotype Sprite Gallery.
- Key match ups that Talonflame could play a critical role in:
- A terrible matchup: 0-30%, red, -2 on the point system
- VS Dragon (Fire wins 24.8%)
- talonflame provides good coverage to common dragon types helping with switch in to ground moves on common pokemon such as Altaria, All variants of Garchomp, and Dragonite, while still not doing enough damage with a CHOICE BANDED Adamant nature to OHKO any of these pokemon, and this is without any defense or hp invested into the pokemon.
- Calcs:
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Altaria: 217-256 (74.5 - 87.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Multiscale Dragonite: 123-144 (38 - 44.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Dragonite: 246-289 (76.1 - 89.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 246-289 (68.9 - 80.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- So as you can see from the calcs, Although talonflame can come in and get a kill on a weakened Pokemon, it can be easily be revenged killed due to low base stats, as well as Recoil damage adding up if the Talonflame is running BraveBird.
- For example, the most common item on Dragonite (March 2015) is Choice Band. Choice band Extreme speed out prioritizes the Brave Bird and does enough to kill a weakened Talonflame, or 2hko any Talonflame, including Max HP Variants.
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Dragonite Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 195-230 (65.6 - 77.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Dragonite Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 195-230 (54.1 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- VS Ground (Fire wins 26.4%)
- Talonflame is needed vs ground as a way to keep Ground type's common high speed pokemon (Garchomp, Landorus, Excadrill and Mamoswine) from spamming Earthquakes that can quickly break down a fire team once Mega Charizard Y is Gone. Talonflame gets walled by Hippowdon, who can quickly set up rocks next turn and Whirlwind/Slack off spam to cripple fire pokemon.
- Calcs:
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 151-178 (35.9 - 42.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Landorus: 256-303 (80.2 - 94.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Garchomp: 208-246 (58.2 - 68.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Gastrodon: 322-381 (75.5 - 89.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- Talonflame is also taking Sand Stream damage as well as brave bird recoil damage, and is swiftly OHKOd by the many rock moves ground teams carry. Excadrills can also easily come in and ohko as well as outspeed with Sand Stream/Sand Rush set (being run on 92.8% of Grounds Monotype teams)
- A bad matchup: 30-40%, light red, -1 on the point system
- VS
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