Meeting between Walter Balazic and Jai the gridhopping kid

DATE: 02/11/2013 - Location Littlefield Office OSGrid
Meeting attended by - Walter Balazic, Jaiden Silvercloud (Jai the grid explorer kid), Ashton Nobilis

[15:04] Jaiden Silvercloud: good, that worked :D
[15:04] JulieWest Baxton is online.
[15:04] Ashton Nobilis: hi Jaiden
[15:04] Jaiden Silvercloud: greetings
[15:04] Walter Balazic: hello Jaiden
[15:05] Walter Balazic: making a special exception here in your case
[15:05] Walter Balazic: just so you understand, because we don't generally

allow child avi's on the regions because of some of the adult content here
[15:05] Selea Core is offline.
[15:05] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, on this account though i have grown my

avatar shape to look more adult though so i can be on plazas
[15:06] Walter Balazic nods
[15:06] JulieWest Baxton is offline.
[15:06] Jaiden Silvercloud: since i am on osgrid now purely as an

information seeker
[15:06] Walter Balazic: right
[15:06] Walter Balazic: just out of curiosity
[15:06] Walter Balazic: since you said that
[15:06] Walter Balazic: why bother?
[15:06] Walter Balazic: if you don't want to be here
[15:06] Walter Balazic: why do you care really what's going on here?
[15:06] Jaiden Silvercloud: because, i used to be a proud member of the

community, even had a sim in OSgrid. so it interests me greatly
[15:07] Walter Balazic: so why not continue?
[15:08] Jaiden Silvercloud: well, my region is now gone because it was

hosted thru someone named "free regions".....i could get another one, but

the atmosphere here no longer seems welcoming, that and given the broad

term not allowed on osgrid regions, that rule could be changed at any time

to encompass the whole grid, and my work would be wasted
[15:08] Walter Balazic: well
[15:08] Walter Balazic: what makes you think it's not welcoming here
[15:08] Walter Balazic: because you choose to have a child avi, and they

aren't permitted on the 5 plaza regions
[15:09] Walter Balazic: I mean, you are I'm sure aware that several of us

are involved in the BDSM lifestyle
[15:09] Walter Balazic: and my family isn't allowed there with collars or

cuffs for anything of that nature
[15:09] Walter Balazic: doesn't stop me from being on the grid
[15:09] Walter Balazic: I don't do that there out of respect for what they

are asking on "those" regions
[15:10] Jaiden Silvercloud: well when i first heard from iro he said

"osgrid regions" which could have implications beyond the plazas in the

near future. but it is more than that though..to bar an avatar from

attending the townhall meeting seems rediculous. It is no different than if

one was to ban furries or neko's..that is a persons choice
[15:11] Walter Balazic: no
[15:11] Walter Balazic: there's a considerable differnce
[15:11] Walter Balazic: the rule is
[15:11] Walter Balazic: no child avis
[15:11] Walter Balazic: no adultish avis
[15:11] Walter Balazic: on the main plaza
[15:11] ZZ Bottom is online.
[15:11] Walter Balazic: just like I can't go there to the meeting naked
[15:11] Walter Balazic: because that's not allowed
[15:11] Walter Balazic: they don't allow child avi's
[15:11] Walter Balazic: not that I'd go naked anyway
[15:11] Walter Balazic: but you get my point
[15:12] Walter Balazic: is it too much to ask to have an adult avi for

things like town hall meetings, or things on the OSGrid operated regions?
[15:12] Walter Balazic: I mean nobody is telling don't have one anywhere on

OSGrid period
[15:12] Walter Balazic: they are making a simple request to not have

particular things on the public plazas
[15:12] Walter Balazic: is that really too much to ask given all they

provide for us here?
[15:13] Patti Mallory is offline.
[15:14] Caro Fayray is online.
[15:15] Jaiden Silvercloud: well it is there choice to decide what is

allowed and what isn't. but if you are going to ban child avatars or any

avatar for that matter then atleast provide reasoning for it....and that is

beside the point, the way hiro has talked to individuals with such avatars

in the past has been highly offensive, statig they have mental disorders

and throwing profanities there way in some circumstances. when things like

that occur it only adds fuel to the fire. And the child av. issue would not

be a large one and would be respected if it just did not come out of the

blue, it is only something recently enfoced, and suddenly so the commuity

barely had time to react
[15:17] Ashton Nobilis: yes, that's true, but I expect that also comes from

the transitioning of OSgrid from Nebadon to Hiro
[15:17] Walter Balazic: well, Hiro can be a bit difficult sometimes, you

have to split his "personal" thoughts on the matter from the actual "grid"

thoughts on the matter
[15:18] Walter Balazic: I mean, not for nothing people have been nothing

but offensive to me in blogs, around the grid etc...
[15:18] Walter Balazic: fact is, I just don't deal with them then, or... I

avoid those sims where those people are
[15:18] Walter Balazic: and keep in mind Hiro makes the OSGrid decisions

"with" Dan, Key, and Neb
[15:19] Walter Balazic: you may hear it "coming" from him... but it is a

collective agreement
[15:19] Ashton Nobilis: that is true, it wasn't a unilateral decision
[15:19] Jaiden Silvercloud: exactly. right on the money there....when the

administration acts in such an improper manner, it paints a bad picture for

everyone underneath them or even associated with them. that is why

assumptions are made, and that is why people are attackig you and others

randomly...which i was also guilty of.
[15:20] ZZ Bottom is offline.
[15:20] Walter Balazic: well no I don't disagree there
[15:20] Walter Balazic: the thing is people take something Hiro says

"personally" and turns it into a grid dynamic
[15:20] Walter Balazic: for example.. the whole "no furries" thing
[15:20] Walter Balazic: that isn't what Hiro said at all
[15:21] Walter Balazic: what he said specifically was "he likes furries, he

could do without things like my little pony and things like that running in

circles around the LBSA landing zone"
[15:21] Walter Balazic: that.....
[15:21] Walter Balazic: got turned into a "the grid doesn't want non-human

avis"
[15:21] Walter Balazic: which isn't at all true
[15:21] Walter Balazic: Just because Hiro doesn't like "my little pony"

doesn't mean it isn't permitted
[15:22] Walter Balazic: also, let me give you a little background on why

the child and child related things are not permitted in the main landing

zone
[15:23] Walter Balazic: at one point in time there was a grid called Meta

7, which was as I understand it a heavily "pedophile" based grid. This is

what was explained to me anyway.
[15:23] Walter Balazic: when that grid closed, alot of them migrated here
[15:23] Walter Balazic: this was about 2 years ago from what I remember
[15:23] Walter Balazic: this is not to say "all" child avi's are pedophiles
[15:23] Walter Balazic: but.....
[15:23] Walter Balazic: just like you can't carry a gun on an airplane

because nobody knows your "true" intent
[15:24] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes i am aware of what happened, meta 7

refugees fled to osgrid and carried on sexual ageplay here, and yes 2 years

is correct. as a result there was much division in the community and many

avatars who had nothing to do with the migration were also affcted
[15:24] Walter Balazic: they are trying to prevent any misconceptions of

what is happening when people arrive here and see child avis
[15:24] Walter Balazic: well sure, and it's unfortunate that happened
[15:24] Walter Balazic: but Hiro and I had discussed for example a Sonic

the Hedgehog avatar
[15:24] Walter Balazic: now consider this for a moment
[15:25] Walter Balazic: you are a 9 year old and somehow managed to end up

in OSGrid
[15:25] Walter Balazic: maybe it's unlikely, I don't know
[15:25] Walter Balazic: but just for the sake of argument
[15:25] Walter Balazic: and an adult pedophile is running it... Again...

not saying that an adult pedophile DOES run it, or that all sonic avatars

are pedophiles
[15:26] Walter Balazic: but for the point... let's supposed a pedophile is

using that avatar
[15:26] Walter Balazic: and he's on LBSA
[15:26] Walter Balazic: now a 9 year old child comes into lbsa
[15:26] Walter Balazic: thinking osgrid is a videogame
[15:26] Walter Balazic: and encounters Sonic the Hedgehod
[15:26] Walter Balazic: Hedgehog
[15:26] Walter Balazic: and is drawn to talking to him because he looks

like a "fun" child related avi
[15:27] Walter Balazic: and the person operating Sonic might even tell this

child he is also a child
[15:27] Walter Balazic: are you following me?
[15:27] Walter Balazic: that...... is why they are trying to keep ALL of

that from occurring on the plazas
[15:27] Akira Sonoda is offline.
[15:27] Walter Balazic: even ONE child being hurt because of OSGrid would

be a tradgedy
[15:27] Walter Balazic: wouldn't you agree?
[15:28] Walter Balazic: I'm not saying that the prohibition of those

avatars "guarantees" safety
[15:28] Walter Balazic: but it does help remove THAT particular situation

from happening
[15:29] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, i understand what you are getting at. but

regardless of what measures one takes a rl child may still end up accessing

the service. the same goes for sl as well, but being in a child avatar does

put rl children at risk any more than what another avatar might. ideally,

if a child does get into the grid there likely not going to want to be a

child anyway, there gonna be there favorite tv chracter or a big buff

guy...or they can be anything for that matter
[15:29] Walter Balazic: true, but if they want to keep it off the FIRST

place that someone might land
[15:29] Walter Balazic: as well as the public areas
[15:30] Walter Balazic: is that unreasonable?
[15:30] Walter Balazic: if they think that it helps even cut down on ONE

child being hurt
[15:30] Walter Balazic: isn't it worth doing that?
[15:32] Jaiden Silvercloud: if they think that would actually help yes,

they do own the grid essentially anyways. but my main concern is it

possibly spreading beyond the plazas, as is the concern of many others.

actually at this point the child avatar issue is minor in many peoples

eyes, now that the rid has cut off trael to metropolis and discontinued

townhall meetings theres alot other things on peoples minds which are much

more important issues
[15:32] Walter Balazic: well
[15:32] Walter Balazic: why do you think it's gone beyond the plazas?
[15:32] Walter Balazic: I mean we don't allow them here
[15:32] Walter Balazic: but that's our choice
[15:33] Walter Balazic: it's not a gridwide "rule"
[15:33] Walter Balazic: you can have a region here full of child avi's if

that's what you want
[15:33] Walter Balazic: nobody is saying that anyone can't do that right?
[15:33] Walter Balazic: you actually could start your own little meeting

area sim
[15:33] Walter Balazic: like we did for the adult community
[15:33] Walter Balazic: we knew it was inappropriate to discuss certain

things or dress a certain way at the plazas
[15:33] Walter Balazic: so we started our own little adult meeting area
[15:34] Walter Balazic: no reason you all couldn't do the same thing right?
[15:34] Jaiden Silvercloud: right, but take into consideration the fact

that the rule on plazas went from no sexual ageplay to no child avatars

PERIOD within the matter of a month. it is understandable that alot would

be concerned it could spread futher than that just as fast
[15:35] Walter Balazic: well, honestly
[15:35] Walter Balazic: it was always a guideline that wasn't really

enforced because the admins were really overwhelmed with other matters
[15:35] Walter Balazic: this is something Hiro is trying to correct
[15:35] Walter Balazic: he's trying to put people in place that will

"assist" new users and give them the optimum "first visit" impact
[15:36] Walter Balazic: I know for a fact, and Hiro and the Admins have

said it several times
[15:36] Walter Balazic: there is no plan to "ban" all child avatars and

activity on the grid
[15:36] Walter Balazic: that I'm aware of
[15:36] Walter Balazic: as long as it isn't "childplay" if you get my

meaning.
[15:38] Jaiden Silvercloud: and that very same statement coming from hiros

mouth would help the situation tremendously. simple things like

communicationg to the public your true intent will prevent much drama and

many rmors from being spread. that is the main problem here, a clear lack

of communication to the ublic on matters
[15:38] Ashton Nobilis: sorry guys, AFK a bit
[15:38] Jaiden Silvercloud: kk hb
[15:38] Walter Balazic: well that's true, but the public has had several

"real" comments from Hiro
[15:38] Walter Balazic: and they pick some lines out
[15:38] Walter Balazic: post them
[15:38] Walter Balazic: twist them
[15:38] Walter Balazic: and then the rumor mill starts
[15:38] Walter Balazic: so even though he's said that (child avis not on

the Plazas but on the grid ok)
[15:39] Walter Balazic: nobody... has listened
[15:39] Walter Balazic: everyone has used it as a weapon and pulled only

what they wanted to see there
[15:39] Walter Balazic: and put it in blogs
[15:39] Walter Balazic: to make the grid, and Hiro appear bad
[15:40] Jaiden Silvercloud: well as for his actual chats with me i posted

the whole conversation and he said "osgrid regions" which can be taken

numerous ways. is there documentation that shows where he himself stated

plazas only?
[15:40] Walter Balazic: well yes
[15:40] Walter Balazic: and that was a misunderstanding
[15:40] Walter Balazic: since then
[15:40] Walter Balazic: he's said several times
[15:40] Walter Balazic: "osgrid OPERATED (plazas) regions"
[15:40] Walter Balazic: that's what he meant
[15:40] Walter Balazic: because where you are sitting right now
[15:40] Walter Balazic: is not an OSGrid region
[15:40] Walter Balazic: for example
[15:40] Walter Balazic: so that comment was a misunderstanding
[15:41] Walter Balazic: keep in mind
[15:41] Walter Balazic: Hiro inherited a grid that was losing it's asset

server because of the loss of UCI funding
[15:41] Walter Balazic: he was scrambling to come up with alternative

hardware
[15:41] Walter Balazic: and move things with minimal interruption
[15:41] Walter Balazic: he was trying to take over control of the landing

zone and what people "see" in LBSA when they arrive
[15:42] Walter Balazic: he was trying to figure out all the ins and outs of

running this grid
[15:42] Walter Balazic: which is no small feat
[15:42] Walter Balazic: and... on a personal standpoint
[15:42] Walter Balazic: his mother is dying of cancer and is in hospice

care right now
[15:42] Walter Balazic: and he's been travelling back and forth to see her
[15:42] Walter Balazic: and STILL is here maintaining the grid everyday for

free on his own personal time
[15:42] Walter Balazic: if everyone would give him just a few months to get

everything "cleaned up" and under control
[15:43] Walter Balazic: there wouldn't be the rumor mill
[15:45] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, i understand he is having rl issues right

now and that is quite unfortunate. but some of the things he is doing is

being taken very questionably by the community...like the metropolis issue

and townhall meetings. he needs to clarify his intentions there, WHY he did

it. and for metropolis the explanation that one user came in and caused

trouble just worsens the situation. banning a grid from hypergate travel

because of 1 user is not seen in good light by many
[15:45] Walter Balazic: well
[15:45] Walter Balazic: how do you know it's one user?
[15:45] Walter Balazic: the same way you knew Littlefield had people in the

greeters group?
[15:45] Walter Balazic: because that information was totally inaccurate
[15:46] Walter Balazic: this wasn't "1" user
[15:46] Walter Balazic: my understanding was there were several occasions

where people from Metro grid were HG into LBSA
[15:46] Jaiden Silvercloud: because it was stated that 1 user came into the

plaza named naruto somethig oor another and caused trouble for the

administration. and curently that is all the public has to go off of so if

it is not the case a true reason needs to be clarified
[15:46] Walter Balazic: and asking people at a landing zone for a grid to

go to Metro instead because OSGrid is a bad place to be
[15:47] Walter Balazic: trying to talk the greeters into leaving
[15:47] Walter Balazic: etc..
[15:47] Walter Balazic: it was more than one user
[15:47] Walter Balazic: and it was Neb that actually did that ban
[15:47] Walter Balazic: not Hiro
[15:47] Walter Balazic: did you know that?
[15:48] Walter Balazic: the reason that's all the public has is because

that's what they "want" you to see
[15:48] Jaiden Silvercloud: that much i was aware of yes, so i said the

administration....i did not specifically mention hiro in that. or i dont

think i did lol
[15:48] Walter Balazic: are you getting the picture?
[15:48] Walter Balazic: well everyone has said "hiro" in regard to that ban
[15:48] Walter Balazic: and in fact
[15:48] Walter Balazic: it was Neb that implemented that
[15:48] Walter Balazic: and given the hostility that was going on from the

people on that grid
[15:48] Walter Balazic: I honestly can't blame him
[15:49] Walter Balazic: did you see ONE post that said "Metro grid sucks

they are assholes" etc..?
[15:49] Walter Balazic: from anywhere?
[15:49] Walter Balazic: I didn't
[15:49] Walter Balazic: but I saw TONS from Metro grid residents

badmouthing this grid
[15:49] Walter Balazic: badmouthing the Admin staff
[15:49] Walter Balazic: not to mention me personally which frankly if

that's entertaining for them they are welcome to do so
[15:49] Walter Balazic: "your" blog btw
[15:50] Walter Balazic: caused probably 70% of that friction
[15:50] Walter Balazic: your blog poured gas on the fire and made things

much worse
[15:50] Walter Balazic: course mine didn't help either in response to yours
[15:50] Walter Balazic: but that is what started alot of this spiraling out

of control
[15:51] Walter Balazic: what I haven't figured out yet is, if everyone

hates OSGrid and is so enamored with Metro, why is the HG block such a big

deal?
[15:51] Walter Balazic: that's a personal question it's not coming from the

Admins or anything like that
[15:52] Walter Balazic: it's simply my curiosity
[15:53] Jaiden Silvercloud: because OSgrid for many years has been the

central hypergrid port so to speak, many people used to know lbsa

particularly as a meeting oint. OSgrid was the center of commerce and

peaceful interactions between all grids regardless of there theme. and even

though all of this stuff has come down, everyone who is old enough to

remember those times is still sad to see OSgrid cut off access to another

grid. it is the pastbond they had
[15:53] Walter Balazic: well
[15:53] Subgirl Magic is online.
[15:53] Walter Balazic: maybe if the Metro community stood up and said

"stop it"
[15:54] Walter Balazic: and had the users badmouthing OSGrid stop posting

things that are untrue and slanderous
[15:54] Walter Balazic: then people all over this grid and I'm sure the

OSGrid administration would take different view on it
[15:54] Walter Balazic: wouldn't you say that would be a good way to to?
[15:55] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, but the OSgrid administration made no

effort to contact metropolis owners on the issue. and that is not rumor, as

it was stated in an official announcement by one of the owners of

metropolis themselves
[15:55] Walter Balazic: oh I know that's a fact
[15:55] Walter Balazic: I have seen it
[15:56] Walter Balazic: however, as residents of that grid
[15:56] Key Gruin is offline.
[15:56] Walter Balazic: maybe if YOU did the right thing
[15:56] Walter Balazic: YOU meaning the residents
[15:56] Walter Balazic: and stood out and took the high road
[15:56] Walter Balazic: and said "stop bashing OSGrid, we like that grid,

and this is not right"
[15:56] Snik Snoodle is online.
[15:56] Walter Balazic: then.... I think things would probably be much

different wouldn't you think?
[15:57] Walter Balazic: I mean most of what I see out there, are people who

are complaining about a grid that they don't even belong to
[15:57] Walter Balazic: they don't participate here
[15:57] Walter Balazic: they don't contribute
[15:58] Walter Balazic: and then they want to sit on another grid and yell

about policy on OSGrid
[15:58] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, it is true that if the community had been

a bit more calm aout the osgrid issue then things may not have occured the

way they did. but once again, people were reacting to rumors they heard,

and the rumors they heard boiled down to a miscommunication. siply because

soething was worded the wrong way
[15:58] Walter Balazic: that really doesn't make any sense to me
[15:58] Walter Balazic: well right
[15:58] Walter Balazic: so let's see, essentially
[15:58] Walter Balazic: if I understand correctly
[15:58] Walter Balazic: this all started
[15:58] Walter Balazic: because you couldn't have a child avi at the Town

Hall
[15:58] Walter Balazic: right?
[15:59] Kayc Skytower is online.
[15:59] Walter Balazic: I mean I know now it's the whole Metro thing
[15:59] Walter Balazic: and the Town Halls being cancelled etc..
[15:59] Walter Balazic: but the reality is
[15:59] Jaiden Silvercloud: no this all started at lbsa plaza as the first

incident with me when hiro said child avis were not allowed on osgrid

regions and i was to leave. but while my blog has been a big portion of the

conflict it was not me alone though
[15:59] Walter Balazic: THAT is where it all started right?
[16:00] Walter Balazic: well this is what I'm asking though
[16:00] Trex Blessed is online.
[16:00] Walter Balazic: the reason this grid sucks
[16:00] Walter Balazic: was because Hiro said no Child avis on OSGrid

regions?
[16:00] Walter Balazic: that's why this grid sucks?
[16:00] Walter Balazic: I mean ALL this turmoil over that?
[16:00] Kayc Skytower is offline.
[16:01] Walter Balazic: I mean granted, wrong wording "OSGrid regions"
[16:01] Walter Balazic: but 5 mins worth of investigation would have

cleared up the right meaning to that
[16:01] Jaiden Silvercloud: no, it is much more than that that now. at

first that was an issue to many yes, but not nearly everyone as there were

people who did not like child avs to begin with and they did not

care.....then other things haened with metropolis and th townhall meetings

and gosh knows what else and it became everyones concern
[16:01] Walter Balazic: I know NOW it is...
[16:01] Walter Balazic: I'm asking what started it
[16:01] Walter Balazic: I mean the primary reason for all this
[16:01] Walter Balazic: was
[16:02] Walter Balazic: Hiro said to you
[16:02] Walter Balazic: no child avatars right?
[16:02] Walter Balazic: just trying to get to where this all began
[16:02] Walter Balazic: I mean clearly it's way beyond that now
[16:02] Walter Balazic: just curious what sparked the fire of hatred so to

speak
[16:03] Jaiden Silvercloud: as far as my blog goes yes, my own little part

of the intternet. but i am sure i wasnt the only one though, before i even

knew about any of this soeone posted about hogwarts leaving and that whole

speil. so before me there was that
[16:03] Walter Balazic: so in general
[16:03] Walter Balazic: and hogwarts, another child avatar based region
[16:04] Walter Balazic: the bottom line is that because Hiro made clearly

the wrong wording "OSGrid Regions"
[16:04] Walter Balazic: regarding child avatars
[16:04] Walter Balazic: all this hatred ensued
[16:04] Walter Balazic: I mean frankly I'm kinda stunned to be honest
[16:04] Jaiden Silvercloud: essentially yes, and that is most regretable
[16:04] Walter Balazic: yes it is
[16:04] Walter Balazic: it doesn't really shed a good light on the people

promoting "good" use of child avatars
[16:05] Walter Balazic: again, our "adult" situations aren't welcome around

alot of sims
[16:05] Walter Balazic: and absolutely not on the public plazas
[16:05] Ashton Nobilis: while it was an unclear choice of words to choose,

rational people would have asked for clarification before assuming the

worst
[16:05] Walter Balazic: but....
[16:05] Walter Balazic: we didn't start a hatefest over it
[16:05] Walter Balazic: we just said "ok, understood"
[16:05] Ashton Nobilis: which, honestly, makes people question the motives

of the child avs
[16:05] Walter Balazic: because it doesn't help our lifestyle to do that
[16:06] Walter Balazic: that little spark btw
[16:06] Walter Balazic: is what created this WHOLE thing
[16:06] Walter Balazic: you can track all this turmoil
[16:06] Walter Balazic: back to the people defending the child avatars at

the Plazas causing this firestorm
[16:06] Jaiden Silvercloud: well consider this though. say an individual

walked u to hiro and he said "no furries on osgrid regions" that could have

equally sparked a similar debate about furries because the wrong wording

was used. i just hapened to be a kid avi, and the rule just happened to be

that they were not allowed and not another type of avi
[16:07] Walter Balazic: actually
[16:07] Walter Balazic: there was a question about that
[16:07] Walter Balazic: by a furry friend of mine
[16:07] Walter Balazic: because she heard that from Hiro
[16:07] Walter Balazic: know what she did?
[16:07] Walter Balazic: she asked......
[16:07] Walter Balazic: she didn't put a blog out saying "OSGrid sucks they

banned all furries"
[16:07] Walter Balazic: she asked around "is this right?"
[16:07] Walter Balazic: she asked me
[16:07] Walter Balazic: she asked Neb
[16:07] Walter Balazic: she asked Doro
[16:07] Walter Balazic: and several other people
[16:08] Walter Balazic: and we said "no that's a misunderstanding"
[16:08] Walter Balazic: and there was no hatred or animosity came of it
[16:08] Walter Balazic: her reply to it was "oh no problem, I'll go as my

human avi if it's a big deal"
[16:08] Walter Balazic: and really......
[16:08] Walter Balazic: that's all anyone had to do
[16:09] Walter Balazic: but fact is, he didn't even say that
[16:09] Walter Balazic: but before the rumor mill got way outta hand
[16:09] Walter Balazic: she asked around
[16:09] Walter Balazic: I know alot of furries
[16:09] Walter Balazic: and they are shunned around SL alot
[16:09] Walter Balazic: and around some areas
[16:09] Selea Core is online.
[16:09] Walter Balazic: but generally you never see a furry putting out a

hate blog or post like that
[16:10] Walter Balazic: that's why this looks so bad
[16:10] Jaiden Silvercloud: right, i should have checked and made sure

which is something i failed to do, that was my mistake. but essentially,

freedom of avatar choice regardless of type of avatar is a big issue to

many. because most hate started in sl toward certain avatar

groups...kids..furries..nekos...and as such that strong feeling of keeping

commuites safe and respected travels with people from sl into the metaverse
[16:10] Walter Balazic: well
[16:10] Walter Balazic: alot of us left SL
[16:10] Walter Balazic: and got our OWN sims
[16:10] Walter Balazic: so we didn't have to deal with that
[16:11] Walter Balazic: you could absolutely do that here
[16:11] Walter Balazic: nobody is stopping that at all
[16:11] Walter Balazic: but........
[16:11] Walter Balazic: the plazas
[16:11] Walter Balazic: aren't ours to dictate policy
[16:11] Walter Balazic: that's the OSGrid admin's realm
[16:11] Walter Balazic: just like these sims are under my control
[16:11] Walter Balazic: or yours are under yours
[16:11] Walter Balazic: and freedom of avi on YOUR sim, is great, that's

why Opensimulator is wonderful
[16:11] Walter Balazic: but....
[16:12] Walter Balazic: you can't "force" what you want on someone elses

home right?
[16:12] Walter Balazic: I mean you wouldn't like someone forcing something

you didn't like on your sim right?
[16:12] Walter Balazic: if you felt it didn't belong going on on your sim,

you'd ask them to leave or stop doing it I'd imagine
[16:12] Walter Balazic: no?
[16:13] mattie mcbride is online.
[16:14] Jaiden Silvercloud: right, which is why i originally got so worked

up because i thought it was either meant to be enforced on all osgrid

regions, or there was a possibility of such. while it does still upset me

there not allowed on plaas, that i would still respect for it would be

there choice. as i said, it boiled down to miscommunication which i should

have doublechecked for the correct meeting. but i did not, which was my

mistake.
[16:14] Walter Balazic: well then, I don't see any reason you couldn't have

a nice region here right?
[16:15] Walter Balazic: I mean obviously you like the place
[16:15] Walter Balazic: you wouldn't be here otherwise
[16:15] Walter Balazic: and you wouldn't care what was going on if you

didn't
[16:15] Walter Balazic: and as for the plazas... like I said, do your

community a favor
[16:15] Walter Balazic: make a nice meeting area for all of them
[16:15] Walter Balazic: no reason you can't toss up a sim and do that
[16:16] Walter Balazic: then you don't need to go to the plazas
[16:16] Michelle Argus is offline.
[16:16] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes i still do love osgrid, thats why i have

been so vocal. i am an avid builder and have worked on many projects here

and have been proud to have them on the grid in the past. it is unfortunate

though that most fo my builds are gone because it sems korgi no longer

exists but maybe that data is still somewhere
[16:17] Walter Balazic: well I would think that it's still there
[16:17] Jaiden Silvercloud: im not really sure how the whole ban appealemtn

thing goes if there is such a thing, and if not how i would get it back but

its worth askig i guess
[16:18] Walter Balazic: yes
[16:18] Jaiden Silvercloud: i mean i was not ip banned so that in itself

says something...i was never cut off from osgrid entriely so there must

have been good reason for it
[16:18] Walter Balazic: well here's a tip in dealing with Hiro
[16:18] Walter Balazic: first of all
[16:18] Walter Balazic: he's under alot of pressure
[16:18] Ashton Nobilis: yes, a lot
[16:19] Walter Balazic: so not being confrontational, is a good rule of

thumb
[16:19] Walter Balazic: he's busy as a 1 armed paper hanger
[16:19] Walter Balazic: a public apology would go a long way I'm positive
[16:19] Jaiden Silvercloud: i actually spoke with hio earlier today and

offered him an apology, and that apology is now on my blog
[16:19] Walter Balazic: and a personal one also I'm sure he'd be interested

in hearing
[16:19] Walter Balazic: well
[16:19] Walter Balazic: I mean something a bit more elaborate
[16:20] Walter Balazic: maybe something a little more understanding toward

the OSGrid "grid"
[16:20] Walter Balazic: since you do in fact like it here
[16:20] Caro Fayray is offline.
[16:21] Jaiden Silvercloud: i offered him a personal apology and posted one

on my blog. he said he would speak with me if i kept it up for a week so

its a start
[16:21] Caro Fayray is online.
[16:21] Walter Balazic: :)
[16:21] Walter Balazic: that's a good start
[16:21] Walter Balazic: honestly
[16:21] Ashton Nobilis: well, that's a good thing, yes
[16:21] Walter Balazic: as brash as Hiro appears
[16:21] Walter Balazic: he's a good person
[16:21] Walter Balazic: and he has alot of insight and is actually quite

understanding and will listen if approached properly
[16:22] Walter Balazic: he's not the maniac dictator everyone makes him out

to be
[16:22] Snik Snoodle is offline.
[16:23] Walter Balazic: as for the other 2 things cause you have asked

about them a couple times
[16:23] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, i see that now. I should have made more

effort on my part to contact him personally. it n=did not help matters any

when i brought up the issue to a couple of friends and they confiremd the

worst and i bit into it
[16:23] Renee Wilson is online.
[16:24] Walter Balazic: Hiro, Neb, Dan and Key are very level headed and

organized
[16:24] Walter Balazic: well yes
[16:24] Walter Balazic: that's how things start
[16:24] Walter Balazic: there's some people out there that LOVE to do this
[16:24] Walter Balazic: because they LOVE hate and drama
[16:24] Ashton Nobilis: right, and then it spreads like wildfire
[16:24] bigtaz wolfhunter is offline.
[16:24] Walter Balazic: as for the ban on Metro
[16:24] Walter Balazic: I'd be shocked if that goes on for too long
[16:25] Ashton Nobilis: agreed
[16:25] Walter Balazic: the admins here are good people
[16:25] Walter Balazic: they didn't do that lightly
[16:25] Walter Balazic: they were trying to STOP a bad situation
[16:25] bigtaz wolfhunter is online.
[16:25] Walter Balazic: and I think they did that, I don't think there's

any reason to believe that's a permanent ban, although I can't speak "for"

them, that's the indication I get.
[16:26] Ashton Nobilis: well, they understand the need for an open

metaverse
[16:26] Ashton Nobilis: so yes, I would expect the ban is temporary as well
[16:26] Walter Balazic: and, you did ask about the town halls
[16:26] Walter Balazic: let me elaborate on that one
[16:26] Trex Blessed is offline.
[16:27] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, please walter
[16:28] Ashton Nobilis pokes Walter
[16:28] Jaiden Silvercloud: lol
[16:29] Walter Balazic: sorry
[16:29] Walter Balazic: lol
[16:29] Walter Balazic: one moment
[16:29] Walter Balazic: water
[16:29] Ashton Nobilis: hehe
[16:29] Walter Balazic: lol
[16:29] Jaiden Silvercloud: hehe silence scares me right now caus i think

im disconnected sinece internets actin up :P
[16:29] Jaiden Silvercloud: lol :P
[16:29] Ashton Nobilis: that uncomfortable 60 seconds before you get logged

out, yes lol
[16:30] Snik Snoodle is online.
[16:30] Jaiden Silvercloud: hahaha yeah i hate it. your standing there

askin why the silcene.......then...DING! :P
[16:30] Ashton Nobilis: yup hehe
[16:31] Ashton Nobilis: while we're waiting on Walter to get back around,

I'd just like to say that I wish more people would take the time to re-

evaluate their stance on this issue Jaiden
[16:31] Ashton Nobilis: and good posts on your blog, btw
[16:32] Selea Core is offline.
[16:32] Jaiden Silvercloud: thank you very much. well, i do not wish to do

anything incorrect or wrong, and when i do i try my best to correct the

situation.
[16:33] Ashton Nobilis: absolutely, my hope is that we all arrive at the

truth
[16:33] roni MK is online.
[16:34] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, it iwll put this whoe situation at ease

and then people can move on to discussing other things. improvements to

opensim software, aurorasim, community events around the metaverse. theres

been far too little of that lately
[16:34] Ashton Nobilis: I agree
[16:34] Ashton Nobilis: infighting hurts the OpenSimulator community as a

whole
[16:34] Walter Balazic: sorry little coughing thing there
[16:34] Walter Balazic: LOL
[16:35] Walter Balazic: needed some water
[16:35] Ashton Nobilis: hehe wb Walter
[16:35] Jaiden Silvercloud: aww...wb ^^
[16:35] Walter Balazic: as for the stopping the Town Halls
[16:35] Walter Balazic: have you read those town hall meeting logs?
[16:36] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes i have read every one of them thus far. in

the last hiro does not really explain why he is doing this, only that it is

taking place and there shall be suggestion boxes placed instead
[16:36] Walter Balazic: mess
[16:36] Adelle Fitzgerald is offline.
[16:36] Walter Balazic: those town halls accomplish nothing at the moment
[16:36] Walter Balazic: you have to admit
[16:36] Walter Balazic: it's like a disorganized shouting match
[16:36] Walter Balazic: then what comes out of it is 1/2 answers
[16:36] Walter Balazic: that get blogged all over
[16:37] Walter Balazic: misunderstood
[16:37] Walter Balazic: and things like what's going on right now happens
[16:37] Walter Balazic: so basically the logic is this
[16:37] Walter Balazic: they are going to put these boxes out
[16:37] Danger Lytton is online.
[16:37] Walter Balazic: so people can put what they would have yelled out

at a meeting in them
[16:37] Walter Balazic: then the whole admin team can discuss it
[16:37] Walter Balazic: and come up with an intelligent decision "not" on

the fly
[16:37] Walter Balazic: and give the answers to everyone
[16:38] Walter Balazic: frankly it's like a 24x7 town hall that way
[16:38] Walter Balazic: it's not really a bad option and people will be

more likely to get the questions actually answered
[16:38] Snik Snoodle is offline.
[16:39] Jaiden Silvercloud: i see. and THAT right there, explained by the

administration like you said would help out a great deal. the natural

reaction that most individuals get right now is that by stoping the

townhall meetings they are cutting out people and restricting there right

to speak out and be vocal in a public setting. they see it more and more as

a dictatorship, i know this as i talked with many
[16:40] Walter Balazic: well it's a group dynamic with all the admins
[16:40] Walter Balazic: and they have all made it clear that they ALL make

these decisions
[16:41] Walter Balazic: the unfortunate thing is that Hiro is the

mouthpiece at the moment because he's the quote unquote "head" Admin
[16:41] Walter Balazic: so it looks like it's a dictatorship
[16:41] Walter Balazic: and honestly....
[16:41] Walter Balazic: this grid isn't a democracy is it?
[16:41] Walter Balazic: I mean the Admins should be able to determine what

is and isn't going to happen here wouldn't you agree?
[16:42] Walter Balazic: it isn't that they don't take what people say into

consideration
[16:42] Walter Balazic: they absolutely do, I've seen it in action
[16:43] roni MK is offline.
[16:43] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes to a point i would agree on that. although

they own the servers, they invite everyone in the grid and there has been a

community formed here. any good grid listens to its residents, for it is

the residents who make a grid what it is..without a community a grid is

nothing. witout leadership there is no community. and up until recent

events i hae had no problem with the administration of osgrid, but again

the problems now come down to communication. if they ar doin things in

everyones best interes they need to communicate that clearly with logical

reasoning
[16:44] Walter Balazic: well keep in mind
[16:44] Walter Balazic: this grid JUST got moved to a new server
[16:44] Walter Balazic: just got a new Admin on the team
[16:44] Walter Balazic: etc..
[16:44] Walter Balazic: things don't happen overnight
[16:44] Walter Balazic: it's hard for them to "communicate"
[16:44] Walter Balazic: when they haven't even ironed out the policies yet
[16:47] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, that is true and i can understand that.

but clear communication with the residents on why they are doing things and

speaking clearly about it goes a long way. also, not letting your person

feelings toward a group of people get out in the open goes a long way. hiro

made many mistakes in communication and said some trather nasty things in

public which ruined his public view for many, even those against certain

avatars. it really does all boil down to how you communicate and how you

handle yourself in a leadership position
[16:48] Walter Balazic: well
[16:48] Walter Balazic: does retaliating with similar "bad dialog" help

that at all?
[16:48] Walter Balazic: because that's what everyone has been doing out

there in the VW blogs and whatnot
[16:49] Walter Balazic: I won't point out exactly who, but someone for

example that we helped out ALOT here and we considered a friend of ours has

gone on a daily "Littlefield/Walter" bashfest on every blog I see
[16:49] Walter Balazic: how exactly is that helping anything?
[16:49] Jaiden Silvercloud: no, and i admitedly was wrong there to do such

a thing. but without those comments in the first place there would be no

retaliation to them. just as you retaliated to me, i may not have liked it

but none the less it happened
[16:49] Walter Balazic: I mean everyone wants the OSGrid admins to

communicate effectively
[16:49] Walter Balazic: but everyone else out there is running wild
[16:49] Walter Balazic: and saying whatever they want
[16:49] Walter Balazic: well that was a personal thing between you and Hiro

though
[16:50] Walter Balazic: the picture you painted was that it was the "grid"
[16:50] Walter Balazic: not Hiro personally
[16:50] Walter Balazic: and that.... is the problem with these things out

there right now
[16:50] Walter Balazic: everyone is using this as an excuse to personally

attack people
[16:50] roni MK is online.
[16:50] Walter Balazic: and it's all being attached to grids
[16:51] Walter Balazic: it's "walter said, and osgrid sucks because of it"
[16:51] Walter Balazic: or "Hiro is a dictator so the grid sucks"
[16:51] Walter Balazic: there's alot more to the grid than Hiro
[16:51] Walter Balazic: or any one individual on the grid wouldn't you say?
[16:52] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes ofcourse. but with things going on right

now, hiro is being painted as the leader of OSgrid. and as such anything he

says personally to many people has become what the grid itself feels to

many people. which i agree now, is quite incorrect
[16:54] Walter Balazic: well he is the leader of the grid but, it's a union

of what he, key, dan and neb come up with
[16:54] Walter Balazic: everything you see from Hiro, is something that

comes from the 4 of them collectively
[16:55] Jaiden Silvercloud: right, and as the leader most people will take

what he says as applying for the grid. because when you become a leader you

personify what you are leading, you become a human representation of

whatever body you govern
[16:56] Walter Balazic: well I have to agree there, and given time to get

everything settled, I think you'll find Hiro is alot more amenable and

approachable than he is at the moment
[16:56] Walter Balazic: he's just very focused on trying to get things done

here
[16:56] Walter Balazic: and people are coming from all angles with "hate"

and "misinformation" aimed squarely at him
[16:56] Walter Balazic: and the grid he is working so hard to maintain and

make a better place for everyone
[16:57] Jaiden Silvercloud: right, being in a leadership position is

difficult for sure, i realie that full well. but one should never make

there personal animosities publicly known, that will always stir up trouble
[16:58] Walter Balazic: well
[16:58] Walter Balazic: there is this too
[16:58] Walter Balazic: and correct me if I'm wrong
[16:58] Walter Balazic: you know there's a problem with child avi's here

right?
[16:58] Walter Balazic: yet knowing this
[16:58] Walter Balazic: you went to Key and asked "anyone is allowed?"
[16:58] Walter Balazic: then came in with a child avi to the meeting
[16:58] Walter Balazic: now you know better than that
[16:59] Walter Balazic: why did you do that KNOWING that child avi's were a

problem
[16:59] Walter Balazic: you obviously knew it was a problem, that's why you

asked Key
[16:59] Walter Balazic: and you didn't say to Key "is it ok if I come in a

child avi"
[16:59] Walter Balazic: you asked "is it open to everyone"
[16:59] Walter Balazic: am I right?
[16:59] Subgirl Magic is offline.
[16:59] Jaiden Silvercloud: because i realied also that the townhall

meetings used to be open to all avatars. and i went there to discuss the

point of avatar expression. yes i should have worded my question

differently
[17:00] Jaiden Silvercloud: right i did, and i should have been specific to

child avis
[17:00] Subgirl Magic is online.
[17:00] Walter Balazic: well.... see
[17:01] Walter Balazic: it's ok if "you'" create a misunderstanding
[17:01] Walter Balazic: but when Hiro does... he's a dictator
[17:01] Walter Balazic: is that fair?
[17:02] Jaiden Silvercloud: no it is not, but i have apologied for my

misdoings as well. Also as the public sees it....someone in a leadership

position acting wrong is usally overshadowed by the normal individual doing

something wrong. which of course is not always correct
[17:03] Walter Balazic: true
[17:03] Walter Balazic: but, that was kind of the basis for the start of

your blog
[17:03] Walter Balazic: "I asked Key if everyone was invited"
[17:03] Jaiden Silvercloud: in a way really the individual has more power

than the leader. for the individual is on the same level as the people and

therefor there word is more readily taken. so as such my acting the way i

wich i did was worse. i realize tis now
[17:03] Walter Balazic: and you KNEW very well that there was a child avi

issue
[17:04] Walter Balazic: I mean, why not come as an adult
[17:04] Walter Balazic: would have solved the whole thing and you could

have participated
[17:04] Walter Balazic: and the whole thing would have been avoided right?
[17:04] Walter Balazic: I mean there were goreans there
[17:04] Walter Balazic: but none of them were wearing silks
[17:04] Walter Balazic: because they know it's not permitted
[17:05] Walter Balazic: I mean would have been good to have you participate
[17:05] Walter Balazic: but you kind of appeared to be trying to "cause" a

situation by coming to the plaza in a child avatar
[17:05] Walter Balazic: knowing they aren't allowed in LBSA
[17:06] Walter Balazic: so you should "guess" that that would go for all

Plaza's right?
[17:06] Walter Balazic: I mean you seem like a bright guy, I think you

could figure that out pretty easy
[17:06] Walter Balazic: I would have
[17:06] Jaiden Silvercloud: well i had alot of exterior influence to go

along with it which i should not have followed, but essentilly my reasoning

was it was a sign of peaceful protest to the issue. coming as myself with

nothing innapropriate at all, just me in my normal osgrid shirt and pants.

and since i was going to have a logical discussion on avatar rights i

figured it was appropriate at the time
[17:06] Walter Balazic: yes that's what I thought
[17:06] Walter Balazic: it was intended as a protest
[17:07] Walter Balazic: so, continuing in that vein
[17:07] Walter Balazic: these "protests"
[17:07] Walter Balazic: are why there are problems here on the grid
[17:07] Cuteulala Artis is offline.
[17:07] Walter Balazic: again, this isn't a democracy
[17:07] Walter Balazic: this grid doesn't owe us anything
[17:07] Walter Balazic: going to that meeting with the intent to "disrupt"

it
[17:07] Walter Balazic: was really counterproductive don't you think?
[17:08] Walter Balazic: then to turn it into a "hiro threw me out" thing
[17:08] Walter Balazic: just made it worse
[17:08] Walter Balazic: because you went there knowing he was going to do

it
[17:08] Walter Balazic: and it gave you fuel for your blog
[17:08] Walter Balazic: right or wrong?
[17:09] Jaiden Silvercloud: i wasnt trying to disrupt it though. i went

there speaking kindly to all people who teleported in there and was going

to have a logical discussion on the issue. i do not go into a place

griefing or shouting profanities, that accomplishes nothing. but peaceful

and logical debate does...and i figured it would have the most impact if i

went as myself, to show i was sincere to my cause
[17:09] roni MK is offline.
[17:09] Walter Balazic: ok so
[17:09] Walter Balazic: going to protest
[17:09] Walter Balazic: by wearing the child avi
[17:09] roni MK is online.
[17:09] Walter Balazic: wasn't intended to be disruptive?
[17:10] Walter Balazic: you didn't think that would cause a disruption

really?
[17:10] Walter Balazic: I mean you knew it was going to happpen...
[17:10] Walter Balazic: you even said it was a protest
[17:10] Walter Balazic: so you were quite aware that was going to cause

SOME impact
[17:10] Walter Balazic: right?
[17:10] Walter Balazic: and just so we are clear
[17:10] Walter Balazic: "your cause"
[17:11] Walter Balazic: is that you want the admins to not be in control of

their regions
[17:11] Walter Balazic: and that you should make the policy
[17:11] Walter Balazic: is that what you mean by "your cause"
[17:11] Walter Balazic: just trying to make sure I understand
[17:11] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes i knew it was going to cause some impact,

and with the demeanor i presented myself i had hoped for it to be ostive.

so people would think "well hey hes not being disrupttive, hes just sitting

there asking qustions" or "well hes not a big deal, i dont know why there

not allowed"
[17:11] Walter Balazic: well if I recall the meeting
[17:11] Ladee Ember is online.
[17:11] Walter Balazic: he did ask you to remove the avi right?
[17:12] Walter Balazic: and what did you do
[17:12] Walter Balazic: I mean he didn't say "get out"
[17:12] Jaiden Silvercloud: i just sat there, i did not say anything after

that. however, i was eing im'ed at the time and i had about a 1 minute

window before i was booted and banned. i should have acted more quickly on

that
[17:12] Walter Balazic: he said "you can't have the child avi here change

it"
[17:13] Walter Balazic: well I read it
[17:13] Walter Balazic: and I saw where he asked you to change it
[17:13] Walter Balazic: and you said
[17:13] Subgirl Magic is offline.
[17:13] Walter Balazic: "Key said anyone is welcome"
[17:13] Walter Balazic: no?
[17:13] Walter Balazic: or did I misread that
[17:13] Walter Balazic: I mean let's put the cards on the table here Jaiden
[17:13] Jaiden Silvercloud: that was not within the actual chat that took

place at the townhall, that was my commentary on my blog to the situation.
[17:13] Walter Balazic: you went there with the child avi
[17:14] Subgirl Magic is online.
[17:14] Walter Balazic: knowing what the response from Hiro would be
[17:14] Walter Balazic: and in a big public setting
[17:14] Jaiden Silvercloud: the chat is all there in the townhall log. i

said nothing after he asked me to change the avi
[17:14] Walter Balazic: that the log could be used to fuel an anti-OSGrid

sentiment
[17:14] Walter Balazic: and pretty much throw Hiro under the bus am I

right?
[17:14] Walter Balazic: I know unfortunately you can't tell what was in IM
[17:14] Walter Balazic: but I do remember him asking you to change it
[17:15] Walter Balazic: so it wasn't like he immediately just tossed you

out
[17:15] Walter Balazic: so something happened inbetween "change your

avatar" and you being ejected I'd assume
[17:15] Jaiden Silvercloud: right, and looking at that in retro-spect i was

wrong to do so. I was acting on the notion that it wasgrid wide, which i

realie now was incorrect
[17:15] Walter Balazic: well
[17:15] Walter Balazic: lol
[17:15] Walter Balazic: so if it was grid wide
[17:16] Renee Wilson is offline.
[17:16] Jaiden Silvercloud: othing happened between me answering someones

personal im, and me deciding where to teleport to lol
[17:16] Walter Balazic: you would have been causing a scene either way

right?
[17:16] Walter Balazic: I mean if it was gridwide
[17:16] Walter Balazic: you coming with that avi would have been a

violation also yes?
[17:16] Walter Balazic: I mean you know now it isn't gridwide
[17:16] Walter Balazic: but either way gridwide or plazas
[17:17] Walter Balazic: being there with a child avatar was bound to cause

a commotion
[17:17] Walter Balazic: I mean this is a meeting held by the OSGrid

administration on THEIR region on THEIR grid
[17:17] Walter Balazic: I'm curious why you think it's justified to tell

them how they should run any of those 3 things
[17:17] Caro Fayray is offline.
[17:18] Walter Balazic: I mean they wouldn't tell you who to admit to your

sim right?
[17:18] Walter Balazic: that'd be up to you
[17:18] Walter Balazic: it's your sim
[17:18] Walter Balazic: don't you agree?
[17:18] Caro Fayray is online.
[17:18] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes indeed. If i had known at the tie it was

not grid wide, or that it was not going to become grid wide i would have

never went there. But if they were to ban them from all regions, wether

owned by individuals or not then yes im going to protest it and THAT was

the asumption i had.
[17:18] Walter Balazic: well again
[17:18] Walter Balazic: protest what?
[17:19] Walter Balazic: not being able to do something on a grid you don't

own
[17:19] Walter Balazic: or a sim you don't own
[17:19] Walter Balazic: I mean would it be ok to come to your house and

bring a bunch of people and do whatever I feel in protest?
[17:19] Walter Balazic: just because I feel like it?
[17:19] Walter Balazic: It's your house
[17:19] Walter Balazic: that would just be wrong wouldn't it?
[17:19] Walter Balazic: it's not my house
[17:19] Walter Balazic: I don't own it
[17:19] Walter Balazic: or pay for it
[17:20] Walter Balazic: I mean I can't see how I can protest on someone

elses property really
[17:20] Walter Balazic: what am I protesting
[17:20] Walter Balazic: "how dare you not let me do what I want on your

property"?
[17:21] Walter Balazic: that doesn't seem very social, or fair do you

think?
[17:21] Walter Balazic: how was causing that scene there helping the

community
[17:22] Jaiden Silvercloud: well from the viewpoint of the community, many

individuals have called osgrid home for a long time. if they were to make a

rule sudenly banning a community from the grid then that would be

devestating. once you put time and effort into making a grid home and then

find out you are no longer welcome there because of the choice of your

avatar. I have no issue at all with grids that ddo not allow child avatars

as there was no commuity there to begin with, none that called it home so i

simply wont go there. but osgrid ws my home so i felt strongly about it.

and i was again...under the asumption it was covering all regions,

privately owned by individuals or not so i reacted as strong as i did

because of that. the plazas alone arent necessarily an issue with me
[17:22] roni MK is offline.
[17:23] Subgirl Magic is offline.
[17:23] Walter Balazic: well even though you call a place home
[17:23] Walter Balazic: that we all basically "use" free of charge
[17:23] Walter Balazic: and I know yes people donate
[17:23] Walter Balazic: and make content etc...
[17:23] Walter Balazic: but the bottom line is
[17:23] Walter Balazic: it's not "ours"
[17:23] Walter Balazic: it's OSGrids
[17:23] roni MK is online.
[17:23] Walter Balazic: just because we "think" it's home doesn't mean we

have any right to tell them how to run it
[17:23] Walter Balazic: wouldn't you agree?
[17:24] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes
[17:24] roni MK is offline.
[17:24] Walter Balazic: honestly, this hurt the community and grid that you

are telling me you call home
[17:24] Walter Balazic: was really a bad plan I think
[17:25] Walter Balazic: you lost your home, and now alot of people that

were here and called it home left
[17:25] Walter Balazic: all started by a child avatar protest
[17:25] Walter Balazic: which really was a misunderstanding to begin with
[17:25] Walter Balazic: right?
[17:25] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes correct
[17:26] Walter Balazic nods
[17:26] Walter Balazic: shame
[17:26] Walter Balazic: now look at the mess
[17:26] Walter Balazic: I think maybe you could help clear it up maybe
[17:26] Walter Balazic: don't you think?
[17:26] Walter Balazic: probably go a long way
[17:26] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes i agree
[17:26] Walter Balazic: would absolutely help the community
[17:27] Walter Balazic: and that's the kind of help this needs to get all

this ironed out I think
[17:27] Walter Balazic: someone like you who kind of instigated this whole

thing coming out "pro" OSGrid
[17:27] Walter Balazic: and "pro" what is going on here
[17:28] Walter Balazic: would really help bolster this and really show that

we are all trying to work together for a better community
[17:28] Walter Balazic: wouldn't you say?
[17:28] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes i would agree on that
[17:28] Walter Balazic: I think that'd be great
[17:28] Ashton Nobilis: absolutely
[17:28] Walter Balazic: and I'm sure I can get Hiro and the Admins to see

that and maybe this can get this all cleared up
[17:29] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes, i shall work on a blog entry with the

information that you told me tonight and present the facts you spoke to me

of so it is all out in the open, the 100 % truth of it
[17:30] Walter Balazic: aweseom
[17:30] Walter Balazic: ack
[17:30] Walter Balazic: awesome
[17:30] Walter Balazic: :)
[17:30] Ashton Nobilis: hehe
[17:30] Ashton Nobilis: and yes, that's graet
[17:30] Walter Balazic: I'm planning to copy this whole conversation btw
[17:30] Ashton Nobilis: great*
[17:30] Walter Balazic: and putting it in a pastebin for everyone
[17:30] Walter Balazic: so they can see how this all just was a big

misunderstanding
[17:30] Walter Balazic: :)
[17:31] Jaiden Silvercloud: as am i hehe.....actually its already copied on

my hard drive now, i have it actve on this viewer i think so now i can look

back more easily
[17:31] Jaiden Silvercloud: ecellent ^^
[17:31] Walter Balazic: :)
[17:31] Jaiden Silvercloud: excellent
[17:31] Walter Balazic: totally
[17:31] Walter Balazic: I think this was real productive
[17:31] Ashton Nobilis: I think so too
[17:31] Walter Balazic: and you can always e-mail me, you have my address
[17:31] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes indeed...this was a very productive meeting

for sure. :D
[17:32] Walter Balazic: well e-mail me anytime Jaiden
[17:32] Walter Balazic: and I really better eat
[17:32] Walter Balazic: LOL
[17:32] Walter Balazic: is 8:30 here
[17:32] Ashton Nobilis: hehe
[17:32] Walter Balazic: I'll get this posted up
[17:32] Jaiden Silvercloud: lol haha its 8:30 here too XD
[17:32] Walter Balazic: and hopefully we can get all this smoothed over
[17:32] Walter Balazic: and get everyone happy and having fun again
[17:32] Jaiden Silvercloud: yes indeed
[17:32] Walter Balazic: nice to meet you and I hope to talk to you soon