<Topal> ah, let's see, todas agenda doesn't look that full :)
<Ricmacas> :)
<Topal> it's here btw: https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/forums/contributors/704557
<Topal> Ricmacas: I guess you want to add one item to that? ;)
<weather15> Didn't we talk about the new support forums last meeting?
<Ricmacas> Topal: I guess you want me to? Sure :)
<Ricmacas> weather15: seems like they are coming SOON
<Ricmacas> like very very soon
<weather15> There live already
<Ricmacas> Huh.
<mjb|mtg> Topal: When are forum mods getting their privs back in the forums?
<Ricmacas> Ok, that "soon" became "already"
<Topal> mjb|mtg: might take a while
<Topal> since this is all new
<Topal> mjb|mtg: but let me ask james
<Topal> weather15: yeah, last week they were still in development, this week they are live
<Ricmacas> Topal: they are live?
* satdav (chatzilla@2E6DE8C8.5715E250.E76ECA32.IP) entrou em #sumomtg
<Ricmacas> let me check
<Topal> Ricmacas: yeah, it was just one day away, but I wasn't sure if they would land it
<Topal> well, they did.
<Topal> Ricmacas: yeah, it's live
<Ricmacas> Oh god, they look beautiful
<Ricmacas> One moment, call incoming
<Topal> Alright, today's agenda:
<Ricmacas> back
<Topal> 1. The new support forums forums
<Topal> 2. Firefox 4 beta
<Ricmacas> 3. the Newsletter?
<Topal> 3. the about:sumo newsletter
<Ricmacas> oh ok, not sure if you were adding
<Topal> Alright, let's get started :)
<Topal> As you can see, the new forums went live yesterday: https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/questions
<Topal> This is the culmination of month of work from a lot of people
<Topal> It's only the first version, so we don't have all the features in yet that we want, but it is an amazing start already
<weather15> That it is
<Topal> best thing probably: immense speed up :)
<Topal> especially when you go back one page. Awesome :)
* Tannn3r (Tannn3r@moz-F7744724.om.om.cox.net) entrou em #sumomtg
<satdav> topal, does it work better on mobiles now
<himorin> it's sppedy, awesome :)
<Ricmacas> Topal: ive noticed questions all start in lowercase... is this a bug?
<Topal> satdav: not sure, didn't test it there
<satdav> kk i will
<Topal> Ricmacas: not for me. see: https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/questions/730775
<Topal> maybe only a few typed like that?
<Ricmacas> i looked at the homepage
<Ricmacas> http://support.mozilla.com/en-US/questions?openpost=1
<Topal> anyway, I wrote up a little post about what the thinking behind the rewrite was: https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/forums/contributors/704556
<Ricmacas> and they were all lowercase
<Ricmacas> nvm i noticed one in uppercase.
<Topal> and about some of the most prominent features
<Topal> Ricmacas: I see seversl
<Topal> several
<Ricmacas> It seems the webpage keeps changing
<Ricmacas> so what I saw wasnt the same when i refreshed :P
<Topal> So, you will notice that really it's not a discussion forum anymore.
<Topal> The questions are the center now and everthing revolves around them
<Topal> give it a try and let us know what you think
<Topal> preferably as a reply to my post
<Topal> We know that there is still a lot to be changed, so let the feedback come :)
<himorin> to this post? > https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/forums/contributors/704556
<Topal> himorin: yes, that one
<Topal> one feature, that came it quite late was the "top contributors" list
<Topal> we will work on that one to make it more useful, but already it gives you a good idea about the most active contributors
<satdav> Topal, do we still have the off topic and contributors forums
<mjb|mtg> satdav: Yes
<Topal> satdav: yes, of course they are staying
<Ricmacas> Topal: Its a very useful update, really, it addresses most of what worried me before.
<Topal> they were rewritten very recently
<Topal> and we are going to update them as well in the next two weeks to add some more features.
<satdav> ok
<Ricmacas> Topal: for example, we now switch from the conversational model to a collaborative model
<Topal> Ricmacas: yes, I'm really happy about it.
<Ricmacas> Topal: before, we used to "talk" to the user or the participating users
<Ricmacas> now we focus on giving answers
<Topal> And also now you can filter for the most requested question for example
<satdav> can someone email me minutes when done
<satdav> dw38438@gmail.com
* satdav saiu (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.8/20100722155716])
<Topal> and you can also filter for the most frequent Firefox 4 beta on win7 issues :)
* mib_uosm3n saiu (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
<Ricmacas> flexibility ftw
<Topal> yeah, check it out and give it a try, it's different and really much better than before
<Topal> That brings me to our next topic, if there are no more questions about the forums
<Ricmacas> Topal:
<mjb|mtg> Topal: This is weird. Why does the old forum still exist?
<Topal> We wanted to start the Firefox 4 beta team in the forums next week, but the plans changed a little
<Ricmacas> Topal: Something is confusing me
<Topal> mjb|mtg: where is that? do you have a url? it shouldn't
<Topal> Ricmacas: what's confusing?
<mjb|mtg> https://support.mozilla.com/tiki-view_forum.php?locale=en-US&forumId=1&openpost=1
<Ricmacas> Topal: We should have all anonymous users a random avatar because the way it is now, it looks like the person who posted is answering his own question
<Ricmacas> Topal: see https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/questions/737966
<Ricmacas> Topal: either that or something to distinguish the thread starter
<Topal> Ricmacas: yeah, that's an issue that will be corrected in an update this week or next
<Ricmacas> Topal: thx
<mjb|mtg> Topal: The link above is whenever someone opens a new question it shows the old format from the old forum.
<Ricmacas> well, Tiki-view_forum
<Ricmacas> that explains it
<Topal> mjb|mtg: just asking james
<mjb|mtg> Topal: Okay
<Ricmacas> zzz
<Topal> mjb|mtg: okay, apparently they are still up
<mjb|mtg> So its a bug?
<Topal> because it's tricky to close them
<mjb|mtg> Ah.
<edo> how much i am behind?
<Ricmacas> edo: discussing the new forums
<Topal> edo: not much ;)
<Ricmacas> :D
<Topal> just discussing the new forums
<Topal> mjb|mtg: could you tell me where you found that link? we shouldn't link to that page anymore.
<Topal> okay, but moving on to Firefox 4 beta team
<Ricmacas> Topal, are the international SUMO pages updated?
<Ricmacas> Topal: I know we have no international forums
<Ricmacas> But some of them link to tikiwiki forums in english
<Topal> Ricmacas: they link to the right page as far as I can tell
<Ricmacas> Topal: thx
<Topal> alright, like I said, we wanted to start the Firefox 4 beta team in the forums next week, but the plans changed a little
<Topal> Firefox 4 beta 3 will not be advertised to end users, since there are still a few blocker bugs
<Topal> so we will wait a little with the team for Firefox 4 beta 4
<mjb|mtg> Topal: When is Beta 3 coming out?
<Topal> I mean: it will give us more time to be even better prepared
<Topal> mjb|mtg: probably tomorrow
<Ricmacas> Topal: have you contacted the possible team members?
<mjb|mtg> Great.
<Ricmacas> Topal: next week, the release was delayed
* mjb|mtg agora chama-se mjb
<Ricmacas> Topal: Firefox Sync blockers delayed code freeze to Monday
<Topal> Ricmacas: no, we are still in the process to see how we can coordinate the initiative the best
<Ricmacas> I'm updated.
<Ricmacas> :D
<Topal> Ricmacas: very much so apparently :)
<Ricmacas> Topal: OK.
<Ricmacas> mjb|mtg: one week more :P
<mjb> :D
<Topal> but an informal question. could you please speak up, if you want to be a member of the firefox 4 beta team in the forums?
<mjb> Aye
<Ricmacas> Oh ya
<Ricmacas> Tanner wanted
<Ricmacas> and tobbi too afaik
<Tanner> hm?
<Ricmacas> Topal: you asked on previous meeting
<Ricmacas> That's from memory though, ill grab the logs
<Topal> Ricmacas: not sure, probably didn't ;)
<Ricmacas> The one before that one?
<himorin>  \me have no more enough time, sorry.. (and want to do some more -ja thing
<Topal> alright, we will have more info about this very soon :)
<Topal> in the contributors forum then
<Topal> himorin: thanks for participating. let me know if you have any questions
<Ricmacas> Ugh, i know you asked before, but logs arent helping
<Topal> :p
<himorin> Topal: of cource, and I'll forward to -ja team members.
<Topal> himorin: thanks!
<edo> ric does it really that matters if or if not he asked!? :P
<Topal> So, moving on to the next topic
<Ricmacas> edo: I could remind him who offered, not everyone's here
<Topal> the about:sumo newsletter
<Topal> Ricmacas: just asking informally, it will be more formal by next week
<Ricmacas> and how I screwed up again
<Topal> with more information and a page for contributors
<Ricmacas> ok
<Topal> Ricmacas: do you want to fill the others in about the idea?
<Ricmacas> ok.
<Ricmacas> The idea is to recreate the about:sumo newsletter
<Ricmacas> It consists in a summary of latest news from the last month
<Ricmacas> and some community content.
<Ricmacas> This content was based on previous ideas
<Ricmacas> I grabbed michaelverdi's interviewing the contributors idea
<Ricmacas> And the idea me and Jan had previously this year, about creating a recognition panel for SUMO
<Ricmacas> Like Friends of the Tree
<Ricmacas> I spoke in a phone meeting and everything about it.
<Ricmacas> :P
<Ricmacas> So, those were some of the ideas.
<Ricmacas> Topal probably also has something for us though,
<edo> ric question..how much actually happens in sumo so we do it monhtly?
* Tannn3r (Tannn3r@moz-F7744724.om.om.cox.net) saiu de #sumomtg
<Ricmacas> edo: much more than you thinkl
<edo> like what?
<edo> this is for end users or for insiders?
<Ricmacas> More for insiders
<Ricmacas> but Topal can confirm that
<Topal> Yeah, so that's up for discussion
<edo> give me last months few examples of news
<Ricmacas> edo: The summit
<edo> skip that
<Ricmacas> thats the newsletter heading
<Ricmacas> Uhhh
<Topal> the idea of the SUMO newsletter was to reach out to potential new contributors as well
<Ricmacas> New forums?
<edo> summit is bi-yearly
<Ricmacas> Mockups?
<edo> topal stupid question for you
<Ricmacas> edo: There are lots of news, just check the SUMO blog
<edo> they want newsletter for end users
<edo> then they also want locale versions
<Ricmacas> edo: I'm sure they post in the blog something new more than once a month
<Ricmacas> edo: We are focusing in the de facto Mozilla language
<Ricmacas> afaik
<edo> isnt it gonna be too much considering the fact that chrome is also in linux etc but doesnt go that far?
<Ricmacas> edo: If we all spoke french in here, then it would be in french
<edo> ric
<edo> idea is good
<edo> consider the fact
<Ricmacas> but?
<edo> end user
<edo> reading about sumo
<edo> first thing would be
<Topal> edo: yeah, this is more of a condensed version of the blog with some extra info. For people who don't follow the SUMO updates every day
<edo> what the heck is sumo
<edo> 2nd would be
<edo> skip that
<Ricmacas> edo: Its an insight about the SUMO community, but you are missing the point
<edo> i am saying from end user perspective
<Ricmacas> edo: If someone manages to subscribe the newsletter, that means they know Mozilla at least
<edo> not from insider
<Ricmacas> edo: Please, its not like we are putting this on front page.
<edo> ric can i be open straight?
<Ricmacas> edo: We are not publishing this to the public, its a newsletter.
<Ricmacas> If you subscribe to receive news of SUMO
<Ricmacas> and you dont know what it is
<Ricmacas> then you just want more spam
<Ricmacas> :P
<edo> starting from me...there are things with fx that should be fixed instead of wasting time on newsletter..
<Ricmacas> edo: I dont have development experience for Firefox, cant speak for topal
<weather15> consider chatting in #firefox
<Ricmacas> So I cant really help more than doing this
<edo> why dont we go global and ask every user for feedback?
<Ricmacas> And this is not a Firefox newsletter
<edo> instead of newsletters
<Ricmacas> it's an insight about the community?
<edo> ric
<edo> you are missing my point
<Ricmacas> edo, You're clearly missing my point too.
<Topal> edo: we did this in may 2009 already, it's an update of that idea.
<Ricmacas> edo: this has nothing to do with end users
<edo> topal its 2nd half of 2010
<Topal> edo: I can see where you care coming from, it's not for end users and we should have more for end users
<Topal> and you are right
<edo> we need more toward them
<Topal> but I have good news: we are working on that one as well
<Ricmacas> edo: Thats not what this is for though
<edo> as for insiders we can always set mailing list
<edo> or rss
<Topal> Right now we are starting a new twitter initiative to really reach out to users, with better content on the wiki
<Ricmacas> edo: This is a mailing list after all
<edo> or some news thing
<weather15> edo: mozilla.org has lots of good information for the public
<Ricmacas> edo: Point is, this is made towards you and the community
<edo> but we need to go soft on end user
<Topal> so, this initiative is different, it is geared towards those that are SUMO contributors already or are interested
<Topal> you have to sign up for it from the sumo page
<Ricmacas> edo, let's focus on the contributors and potential contributors
<edo> ric more you bomb people with info faster you loose them
<Ricmacas> edo: that idea is for other meeting
<Ricmacas> the "users" newsletter
<edo> ok am gonna keep quiet
<Topal> so, this is for people who don't have the time to follow planet or the contributor forums
<Topal> just like the about:mozilla newsletter
<Topal> talking about the content
<Topal> when you look at the last newsletter
<Topal> It's information about recent changes
<Topal> switch of search engines, new localizers dashboard
<Ricmacas> So, what happened, meanwhile, was that I lost internet connection, and I got nervous about the publishing the July newsletter too late, completely forgetting about Topal :P
<Topal> tipps and tricks on how to give support or write articles
<himorin> if it possible, such newsletter might be better posted to some global/wider list.. to contact with the potential contributors.
<Topal> and important support issues
<Ricmacas> So I would like to ask Topal to share his view on the newsletter
<Ricmacas> Since I ran against a deadline without looking to him :P
<Topal> himorin: you're right, it's important that as many people as possible in the SUMO community know about this. Which is not so easy when they don't follow planet or the forums
<Topal> So, my perspective is that this is rather useful. There are people who don't have to follow us all the time, so we can give them very compact information
<Topal> So, IMHO the newsletter should really focus on that.
<Topal> With still some stuff like tips and tricks for contributors
<Ricmacas> Topal: You really need to fill the newsletter with announcements, its rather empty now.
<Ricmacas> :P
<Topal> but really not too long, so people will still take the time to read it
<Ricmacas> Topal: Like the new forums, and stuff that happened that people might have not noticed.
<himorin> Topal: yeah, it is really difficult for non-english natives to follow planets or detailed posts, and who are not mainly working on sumo, etc.
<Topal> Ricmacas: yeah, that should be the main focus of the newsletter
<Ricmacas> Topal: Have you looked into it yet?
<Topal> himorin: exactly :)
<Topal> Ricmacas: yes, I did
<Ricmacas> Topal: Well, I also proposed a Cheat list
<Ricmacas> A list of emerging issues and quick fixes
<Ricmacas> For those who help on SUMO, sometimes a list of these is handy
<Ricmacas> Specially if you were off for say, 3 months
<Topal> Ricmacas: a good idea, but we should talk to zzxc because he is also preparing a page about that
<Ricmacas> For whatever reason
<Ricmacas> Topal: I thought in integration.
<Topal> and a page is probably better suited for that.
<Topal> But I like the idea :)
<Ricmacas> Topal: We could also run some of the content of the newsletter in the page that zzxc is making
<Topal> Future events is also a great idea
<Ricmacas> hehe :)
<Ricmacas> Topal: I also think we should have a space for people to show their appreciation
<Topal> Ricmacas: here is an idea: I'll open up a forum thread in the contributors forum and we can discuss there what should be in there and not
<Ricmacas> Topal: I think we could have at least a summary of the people that have been useful, and a link to a page to say why.
<Topal> because I can imagine not everyone wants to follow this discussion in this meeting ;)
<Ricmacas> Topal: Links make the newsletter more rich without more space.
<edo> guys
<Ricmacas> Ok guys, do you want the subscribe URL?
<edo> this is turning more and more into marketing
<Ricmacas> edo: We are not marketing to anyone outside SUMO.
<Topal> edo: internal marketing ;)
<Ricmacas> edo: It's kind of a "reminder why we are cool"
<weather15> Ricmacas: Yes
<Ricmacas> specially if you were off for a period of time
<Ricmacas> or if you cant keep yourself updated
<Ricmacas> :D
<Ricmacas> Give me a minute to grab the url pleas
<Topal> anyway, I'll start that thread and then we can discuss the actual contents of the newsletter now that we have established the basics
<Topal> +
<Topal> I mean we can discuss in the forums, and finish this meeting, that is running late already ;)
<Ricmacas> http://eepurl.com/Nh9h
<Ricmacas> I bet topal wants to go to the beach :D
<Topal> so, if there is no other topic I'd like to close this weeks meeting.
<Ricmacas> ^^ thats the URL btw
<Topal> Ricmacas: sure I do, but the beach is very far away ;)
<Topal> Alright then.
<Ricmacas> ohhh
<Topal> Thanks everyone for participating in this weeks meeting
<Topal> Hope to talk to you next week, same time, same place
<himorin> ;)
<Ricmacas> Topal: i'll be waiting for that URL, btw, better make the newsletter in august :/
<Topal> Ricmacas: creating the thread now
<Ricmacas> Forum url
<Ricmacas> Topal: do you think we can do this in time to include the summit?
<Ricmacas> Topal: Its kind of pointless to include it 2 months later
<Topal> Ricmacas: Maybe we can start with a first small newsletter and make a better and improved one for Augugst?
<Ricmacas> weather15: btw the url is above
<weather15> got it
<mjb> Bye guys Great meeting
* mjb (mjb@moz-652C6BE0.satx.res.rr.com) saiu de #sumomtg
<himorin> not for meeting, but just for notice, -ja team have posted requests for kitsune :-) : https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/forums/contributors/704552
<Ricmacas> Topal: BTW there was an idea by Tanner, that was new helpers section, where we promote new helpers and encourage people to become one of us
<Ricmacas> who is -ja?
<Topal> himorin: I saw that one, thanks for posting. It's a bit stressy right now, with the new forums and everything, but I'll answer that today or tomorrow
<Ricmacas> japanese, got it
<himorin> yeah of cource, it's not a just time to do NOW for sumo team, (but we will have many events and meetings on aug.. :)
<himorin> Ric: yes, japanese team.
<Topal> himorin: I'll try to speed it up
* weather15 (Mibbit@moz-D82458AC.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) saiu de #sumomtg
<Ricmacas> *course
<Ricmacas> grammar nazi, sorry.
<himorin> Topal: if it possible, we want to discuss on them before we cannot make large changes/modifications on kitsune wiki system. So, discussions are welcome for us!
<himorin> Ric: lol :-D
<Topal> himorin: absolutely.
<Ricmacas> himorin; its stronger than me... you are free to correct me too btw
<himorin> thank you for great discussions, and see u next time. now time to sleep :)
<Topal> Ricmacas: https://support.mozilla.com/en-US/forums/contributors/704560#post-5972
<Topal> himorin: good night to you