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[00:01:46]	<reynir_>	good night
[00:06:17]	<Zarutian>	reynir_: (run length encoded bf): 72+.13-.4-.12+..13+.58-.
[00:06:25]	<Chase-san>	-.-
[00:08:48]	<Chase-san>	I don't think i'm a bad programmer, I just been writing most of my dasm when I am dead tired... so don't do as many tests as I ought to.
[00:08:50]	<reynir_>	what?
[00:10:06]	<Chase-san>	but hope that is forgivable given current state of the game
[00:12:02]	<reynir_>	Zarutian: what?
[00:14:45]	<reynir_>	Chase-san: maybe you should just be honest about that when you publish code. Then all is fine I guess.
[00:15:52]	<Chase-san>	suppose I could attach a warning
[00:16:07]	<Chase-san>	if I can remember in those conditions to do so :)
[00:19:15]	<reynir_>	one can use the normal memmove with zero length. The reason I didn't do the check is because 1) it's a text editor so there's almost always new text 2) you usually dont have to
[00:19:35]	<Chase-san>	oh thats you?
[00:19:40]	<Chase-san>	on the forums
[00:21:02]	<Chase-san>	I think I should refrain from making any edits, tired :)
[00:21:47]	<Chase-san>	would probably end up causing it destroy france or something
[00:22:59]	<Zarutian>	reynir_: are you really going to run bf on your missile interception system?
[00:24:15]	<reynir_>	Zarutian: lol
[00:24:51]	<Zarutian>	reynir_: so you decoded my message ;-)
[00:25:32]	<reynir_>	no, I made a typo
[00:30:49]	<Zarutian>	maybe the inter ship network will based on http://cap-lore.com/Economics/DSR/SilkSec.html
[00:43:36]	<Tobba>	.q Tobba 14
[00:43:36]	<scybot>	Tobba: [14/14] 2012-04-16 <Tobba> GAS is for jews
[00:43:39]	<Tobba>	wait shit
[00:43:42]	<Tobba>	.q Tobba 13
[00:43:42]	<scybot>	Tobba: [13/14] 2012-04-16 <Tobba> is now known as notch
[00:43:49]	<Tobba>	trying to find that one
[00:43:50]	<Tobba>	.q Tobba 12
[00:43:51]	<scybot>	Tobba: [12/14] 2012-04-16 <Tobba> I have 11 quotes / my ego is expanding from owning half of this channels quotes
[00:43:54]	<Tobba>	aha there it is
[00:44:27]	<Tobba>	its only 1/3 now
[00:44:30]	<Tobba>	need more quotes
[00:47:03]	<reynir_>	this guy http://www.0x10cforum.com/forum/m/4932880/viewthread/2819195-minesweeper/post/15960125#p15960125
[00:47:32]	<Tobba>	0x10cforum should die
[00:47:46]	<Tobba>	in a fire
[00:47:47]	<Tobba>	with all its users
[00:47:49]	<NakedFury>	why?
[00:48:10]	<Tobba>	entire thing is shitter
[00:48:28]	<NakedFury>	but why do you think that?
[00:48:37]	<Tobba>	because everyone on it is fucking retarded
[00:49:33]	<Tobba>	and the owners appear to have a wheelbarrow of dicks up their ass
[00:49:41]	<Tobba>	Oh god that came out both wrong and well
[00:50:46]	<superjoe>	Tobba: that's quite a vivid image you've painted in my head
[00:50:56]	<Tobba>	.q add Tobba and the owners appear to have a wheelbarrow of dicks up their ass
[00:50:56]	<scybot>	Tobba: quote added.
[00:52:00]	<mappum>	the owners are canadian
[00:52:07]	<superjoe>	so... who besides me has started working on a programming language that compiles into DCPU16?
[00:52:09]	<Tobba>	that explains everything
[00:52:14]	<mappum>	superjoe: everyone
[00:52:17]	<superjoe>	lol
[00:52:30]	<superjoe>	is everyone else's go-like as well?
[00:52:48]	<mappum>	no, it's all c-like
[00:52:59]	<reynir_>	superjoe: I have made a compiler in dasm that targets the DCPU
[00:53:20]	<yrrebnarg>	I'd love a lightweight Go for control systems
[00:54:00]	<mappum>	for the love of god, someone make a js interpreter
[00:54:10]	<reynir_>	>.<
[00:54:14]	<yrrebnarg>	*twitch* :)
[00:54:15]	<reynir_>	garbage collection
[00:54:43]	<mappum>	we have unlimited ram, no need for garbage collection
[00:54:52]	<Tobba>	also
[00:54:54]	<reynir_>	i forgot
[00:54:59]	<Tobba>	this is the source of all good insults: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6pqu-85u2U
[00:55:00]	<scybot>	Tobba: Double Nigger Part 1 re-upload archived - length 4m 6s - rated 4.69/5.0 (537) - 35,865 views - cr4bc4kes on 2011.03.20 - NSFW
[00:55:46]	<Tobba>	might not want to watch in public location
[00:55:47]	<Tobba>	:V
[00:57:54]	<Zorix>	what the hell is that
[00:58:09]	<Tobba>	I actually have no idea
[00:58:32]	<Zorix>	i dont know if i should laugh or be offended
[00:59:34]	<Tobba>	SHITWAFFLES
[00:59:56]	<reynir_>	I'm watching south park, the episode where Cartman fakes tourettes
[01:00:04]	<reynir_>	ASSCHEEKS
[01:00:09]	<lifthrasiir>	jdiez17: did you mention me?
[01:00:26]	<lifthrasiir>	ah reynir that was.
[01:01:06]	<lifthrasiir>	hah, I *can* write in Brainfuck but it always results in a miserable code..
[01:01:25]	<Tobba>	seriously though the entire thing is great
[01:01:29]	<reynir_>	hehe :P
[01:01:40]	<Tobba>	if you dont mind "NIGGER" being shouted every 10 seconds, but its hilarious
[01:02:00]	<gerph>	hello
[01:02:10]	<Zorix>	i can do without racial stuff
[01:02:50]	<superjoe>	Zorix: why? as someone who frequently experiences racial prejudice, I have no problem with it.
[01:02:50]	<Tobba>	"SHUT THE FUCK UP YOU TEN ASSED SHIT STOPMPING DICK SHELP"
[01:03:49]	<jmcarthur>	i'm making an ML-like language
[01:03:53]	<lifthrasiir>	oh my, minesweeper thing is so great that I can hardly breathe
[01:04:59]	<jmcarthur>	Tobba: wtf
[01:05:49]	<Zorix>	superjoe, im just not comfortable with it, i think it shows ignorance.. im all for stupid humor but humor that involves putting down a race of people is just wrong
[01:07:32]	<superjoe>	lifthrasiir: what is this minesweeper thing
[01:07:42]	<lifthrasiir>	?minesweeper
[01:07:43]	<scybot>	minesweeper http://0x10co.de/lqnit
[01:08:14]	<Tobba>	i was gonna sleep
[01:08:17]	<Tobba>	fuckin cat woke me up
[01:08:30]	<Tobba>	haha oh god this thing
[01:08:37]	<Tobba>	Did the display spec get updated or some shit, this is awesome
[01:08:46]	<superjoe>	this is mappum's thing right?
[01:08:54]	<superjoe>	his emulator, I mean
[01:09:36]	<Tobba>	Oh god dangit
[01:09:41]	<Tobba>	I almost finished minesweeper
[01:09:44]	<jmcarthur>	Tobba: custom font
[01:09:45]	<Tobba>	in a 50/50 scenario
[01:10:06]	<Tobba>	that intro though
[01:10:10]	<Tobba>	how the fuck
[01:11:44]	<Tobba>	that was amazing
[01:16:02]	<Tobba>	Okey, he didnt even use a fast memcpy function for it
[01:16:11]	<Tobba>	wonder how he got it to work so fast
[01:21:05]	<rmmh>	Tobba: pretty sure he didn't use anything but the 0x10c spec and the display spec to do this
[01:22:25]	<Tobba>	rmmh: yeah, its pretty cool
[01:24:08]	<Tobba>	that intro is fucking rad though
[01:25:49]	<Tobba>	im gonna make ferrous chloride thermite later
[01:25:52]	<Tobba>	shits gonna be rad as fuck
[01:33:21]	<OBudista2>	crap
[01:33:30]	<OBudista2>	this sucks
[01:44:03]	<Blecki>	.
[01:44:41]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	..
[01:44:43]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	win
[01:44:52]	<Tobba>	god dammit
[01:45:02]	<Tobba>	Mixed Metal Oxide Anodes are fucking hard to find
[01:45:27]	<superjoe>	Tobba: what are you doing?
[01:45:34]	<Tobba>	electrolysis
[01:45:41]	<Tobba>	graphite gets completely DESTROYED after a while
[01:46:08]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	I blame society
[01:46:43]	<Tobba>	my copper cathode corrodes into Cu2O but thats not an issue because its conductive
[01:46:52]	<Tobba>	I think im gonna exchange the cathode for mercury later if I can get some
[01:49:30]	<Tobba>	either that or i need an inert solvant
[01:49:39]	<Tobba>	both ethanol and acetone have resulted in fanshit
[01:51:24]	<Tobba>	dichloromethane would almost work but it'd react with the chlorine and become chloroform
[01:51:41]	<Tobba>	why am i ramblinb about this here
[01:52:11]	<superjoe>	I hate to be like this, but Tobba think maybe you could take it to #0x10c-dev-offtopic?
[01:52:46]	<Tobba>	possibly
[01:52:57]	<MostAwesomeDude>	There isn't really an offtopic for this channel, is there?
[01:53:08]	<superjoe>	No.
[01:53:09]	<Tobba>	#0x10c-blah i guess
[01:53:30]	<superjoe>	that's because nobody wants to hear about off topic stuff.
[01:54:01]	<MostAwesomeDude>	Makes sense.
[01:54:04]	<startling>	0x10C IS LIFE
[01:54:35]	<Blecki>	So notch posted some puzzle..?
[01:54:36]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	0x10c can't be life
[01:54:43]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	we don't have relativity in there
[01:54:44]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	:<
[01:55:25]	<startling>	.twitter notch
[01:55:26]	<scybot>	startling: 2012-04-17 01:05:21 notch: @_matthias a puzzle with a reward at the end
[01:55:35]	<startling>	.twitter notch -1
[01:55:35]	<scybot>	startling: error: invalid request
[01:57:01]	<startling>	the website is http://www.eample.com
[02:33:53]	<rmmh>	woah notch posted a puzzle??
[02:34:50]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	puzzle of what
[02:34:57]	<startling>	yeah. I could find anything extraordinary
[02:35:19]	<startling>	there are a bunch of links in the source though, I may have missed some.
[02:35:42]	<rmmh>	http://www.reddit.com/r/0x10c/comments/sdeq2/notch_posts_a_puzzle/
[02:38:37]	<startling>	oh, was I looking at the wrong thing?
[02:40:40]	<startling>	is 48 a fibonacci number?
[02:41:29]	<oldtopman>	startling: lemme check
[02:41:46]	<startling>	it's not
[02:42:22]	* oldtopman has broken his fibonacci number calculator
[02:42:25]	<oldtopman>	feh
[02:42:25]	<startling>	reddit says there are 48 red, 57 green, and 105 blue. 48 + 57 = 105
[02:42:29]	<oldtopman>	stupid programmers...
[02:53:31]	<Ymgve>	wish I could play fez
[02:53:39]	<Ymgve>	but my xbox is probably banned from live
[02:54:21]	<Blecki>	There are exactly 64 unique symbols in this puzzle.
[02:54:57]	<Rick>	port it to dcpu
[02:55:25]	<Blecki>	That's based on on exact pixel match, after background noise is discarded.
[02:56:27]	<Blecki>	There's exactly 26 + space if I discard colors.
[02:56:30]	<Ymgve>	are you counting color?
[02:57:14]	<rmmh>	Blecki: base64 you think?
[02:57:16]	<Rick>	what's fez
[02:57:18]	<Rick>	is it a console game
[02:57:23]	<Ymgve>	yes, xbox 360 game
[02:57:26]	<Ymgve>	apparently very cool
[02:57:32]	<Blecki>	rmmh, I'm going to explore the cryptogram angle.
[02:57:49]	<rmmh>	Blecki: you saw the translation right
[02:57:51]	<Rick>	it's not a cool game if it's only on the 360
[02:58:00]	<Blecki>	rmmh, ..translation?
[02:58:07]	<Blecki>	If it's been solved don't tell me.
[02:58:08]	<rmmh>	FEZ IS AN AMAZING GAME GREAT JOB GUYS IT IS VERY INSPIRING AND I THINK IT HAS CHANGED HOW I THINK ABOUT GAME DESIGN AND PLAYER REWARDS IN A PROFOUND WAY
[02:58:11]	<rmmh>	THAT SAID HERE IS AN ENCRYPTED MESSAGE IN TRINARY LEADING TO MY CURRENT DCPU16 AS AN APPLET
[02:58:14]	<rmmh>	XOXOXOXO NOTCH
[02:58:17]	<rmmh>	efb
[02:58:20]	<rmmh>	that's only half of it
[02:58:27]	<Blecki>	Mother fucker.
[02:58:37]	<rmmh>	:( sorry
[02:58:50]	<Blecki>	I WAS GOING TO SOLVE THAT PART.
[02:58:53]	<MostAwesomeDude>	Heh.
[02:58:57]	<Rick>	?
[02:58:58]	<Rick>	solve what
[02:59:01]	<Rick>	is this some notch thing
[02:59:04]	<rmmh>	Rick: http://www.reddit.com/r/0x10c/comments/sdeq2/notch_posts_a_puzzle/
[02:59:05]	<superjoe>	so nobody's found the link yet?
[02:59:10]	<Blecki>	So, the background noise must be the encrypted link.
[02:59:11]	<MostAwesomeDude>	It's *always* some Notch thing.
[02:59:19]	<Rick>	I disagree, notch smells
[02:59:31]	<Rick>	also reddit isn't loading \o/
[02:59:37]	<MostAwesomeDude>	It's a sign.
[02:59:52]	<Blecki>	Well that's an hour of my life wasted.
[03:00:09]	<MostAwesomeDude>	> implying you aren't wasting every minute spent in this channel
[03:00:19]	<superjoe>	My prediction: Within 24 hours from now, someone will have found the link to the applet, decompiled it, deobfuscated it, and fixed 3 bugs in Notch's code.
[03:00:28]	<Blecki>	Probably.
[03:00:45]	<Blecki>	Notch needs to add profit sharing to this game.
[03:01:39]	<NakedFury>	notch needs to take time and bugfix his games
[03:02:48]	<Blecki>	So do I discard the glyphs then? Hrm.
[03:03:01]	<Obu|LFRelJump>	my kingdom for relativism
[03:04:01]	<Blecki>	Trinary doesn't translate nicely into ascii. I'll have to assume 4-bit numbers.
[03:05:17]	<Ymgve>	it might just be misdirection, but there are actually eight different pixel colors
[03:05:20]	<Blecki>	But the background noise is binary.
[03:05:29]	<Rick>	its a png file
[03:05:32]	<Rick>	there shouldnt be background noise
[03:05:35]	<WhyNoEinstein>	tell me about it
[03:05:40]	<WhyNoEinstein>	I'm implementing FAT12
[03:05:41]	<Ymgve>	black, white and two slightly different for each primary color
[03:05:48]	<WhyNoEinstein>	it's all 12 bits :P
[03:05:55]	<Blecki>	Rick, I'm assuming the background is intentional.
[03:06:23]	<Blecki>	Ymgve, no, the primary colors don't variate.
[03:06:36]	<Rick>	there's a piece of the background missing too? wat
[03:07:07]	<rmmh>	yeah the bottom left
[03:07:07]	<Blecki>	Assume it's orientated the same as the cryptogram; not enough data to fill the space.
[03:07:35]	<Blecki>	If I discard portions covered by glyphs, the remaining data is binary. :|
[03:08:10]	<Rick>	oh
[03:08:13]	<Rick>	only the alpha differs?
[03:08:14]	<Rick>	hmmmm
[03:08:35]	<Blecki>	Only in the background, and it seems to be just between two values.
[03:08:52]	<Blecki>	The alpha for the glyphs is also constant.
[03:08:57]	<Ymgve>	I see lotta noise in the alpha
[03:09:42]	<Rick>	I only see 0xFE000000 and 0xFF000000
[03:09:47]	<Rick>	but that's just me mousing around randomly
[03:09:48]	<Blecki>	Yeah.
[03:09:51]	<Rick>	havn't processed the image at all
[03:11:08]	<Blecki>	I'm working on that part.
[03:11:46]	<Zorix>	interesting stuff
[03:12:50]	<startling>	could it be cellular automata?
[03:16:53]	<Blecki>	Hrm. It's 8535 bits long. :(
[03:16:58]	<Zorix>	must be something to do with the missing part at the bottom left
[03:17:18]	<superjoe>	the key probably has something to do with fez
[03:17:34]	<Blecki>	That's enough bits to be valid 'trinary', if there were 3 values.
[03:18:24]	<startling>	morse code? morse code is trinary
[03:19:15]	<Blecki>	Morse code is a 3-bit binary encoding.
[03:19:27]	<startling>	Blecki: hm?
[03:19:28]	<Blecki>	Dots = 0, dashes = 1.
[03:19:46]	<startling>	spaces are significant in morse code, too.
[03:19:53]	<Ymgve>	128 * 96 bits it looks like
[03:20:17]	<Blecki>	Ymgve, that's 8535?
[03:20:18]	<Rick>	you're kidding
[03:20:19]	<startling>	Blecki: oh, I see what you mean.
[03:20:30]	<rmmh>	there are 210 glyphs
[03:20:31]	<Ymgve>	Blecki> you\ve counted wrong I think
[03:20:34]	<startling>	that's a multiple of the size of the dcpu16 screen
[03:20:43]	<startling>	*4
[03:20:43]	<rmmh>	I'm thinking 42 5-trit letters
[03:20:45]	<Rick>	thats the size of the dcpu screen in pixels
[03:21:04]	<startling>	oh right
[03:21:11]	<rmmh>	(210 rgb glyphs)
[03:21:13]	<startling>	*4 width and *8 height
[03:21:16]	<Blecki>	Ymgve, no, I've counted every pixel that isn't a glyph and isn't the missing bit at the bottom.
[03:21:46]	<Blecki>	Notch said it was a url.
[03:21:57]	<rmmh>	he said it would lead to a url
[03:22:38]	<Blecki>	I'm going to see if it makes sense interpretted naivly.
[03:24:23]	<Blecki>	Also dyslexia.
[03:24:26]	<Blecki>	It's 8353.
[03:25:15]	<Rick>	where was the message encoded? the glyphs?
[03:25:21]	<Blecki>	Yeah.
[03:25:32]	<Ymgve>	'\xc13Congratulations, you found the correct bit order!
[03:25:33]	<fullwall>	rgb of a dcpu screen?
[03:25:46]	<Ymgve>	getting closer!
[03:25:50]	<Blecki>	Drop color and there are 26 unique characters + space.
[03:25:53]	<Blecki>	Ymgve, ?
[03:25:53]	<Rick>	ah
[03:25:58]	<Rick>	Ymgve you fukken hacker
[03:26:03]	<Rick>	this reminds me of spore
[03:26:09]	<Blecki>	Ymgve, what is this?
[03:26:21]	<Blecki>	What is the correct bit order? Cause I got the bits.
[03:26:26]	<Ymgve>	(FYI, extract alpha, rotate screen counterclockwise, then save as raw, load back in raw as 128x96 bits)
[03:26:52]	<superjoe>	the irony of all this is that mappum's javascript emulator is in all likelihood faster, more correct, and more convenient than notch's applet
[03:27:13]	<Blecki>	superjoe, the applet probably represents the 'updated spec' too.
[03:27:16]	<Ymgve>	http://i.imgur.com/tzhFp.png
[03:27:18]	<Zorix>	yea but the dcpu spec is likely going to change
[03:27:38]	<fullwall>	the applet might have the actual game so far in as well
[03:27:55]	<Blecki>	Ymgve, the glyphs make big blocks in that.
[03:28:16]	<Ymgve>	ignore the blocks
[03:28:22]	<Ymgve>	for now at least
[03:28:33]	<Blecki>	I've got those bits sans-glyphs.
[03:28:40]	<Blecki>	I just don't know how to decode them yet.
[03:29:29]	<Ymgve>	are there any online disassemblers?
[03:29:32]	<fullwall>	THE LOW BITS OF THE ALPHA CHANNEL OF THIS IMAGE CONTAIN A DCPU PROGRAM
[03:29:46]	<startling>	Ymgve: how big is it?
[03:29:57]	<Ymgve>	128x96 bits
[03:30:00]	<Rick>	where'd you find that fullwall
[03:30:01]	<Rick>	:o
[03:30:06]	<Rick>	also low bits heh
[03:30:06]	<fullwall>	reddit ;)
[03:30:06]	<Zorix>	reddit
[03:30:07]	<Zorix>	heh
[03:30:12]	<rmmh>	dcpu.ru
[03:30:13]	<Rick>	and uhh
[03:30:14]	<startling>	dcpubot can disassemble, and I've got a disassembler
[03:30:15]	<Rick>	disass...yeah
[03:30:15]	<startling>	<<
[03:30:16]	<dcpubot>	startling:
[03:30:17]	<Rick>	what rmmh said
[03:30:20]	<Zorix>	i wonder if all this is causing reddit to be slow today
[03:30:26]	<startling>	Zorix: doubt it
[03:30:31]	<Rick>	there arn't enough nerds hacking dcpu to do that
[03:30:36]	<startling>	only us
[03:30:40]	<Zorix>	just never seen it so slow
[03:30:55]	<startling>	Zorix: are you serious
[03:31:02]	<Rick>	now the question is
[03:31:03]	<startling>	Zorix: how long have you been going to reddit?
[03:31:10]	<Rick>	did he assemble his program with his non-spec assembler
[03:31:11]	<Rick>	lmao
[03:31:14]	<startling>	hahaha
[03:31:18]	<fullwall>	apparently these are the low bits http://pastebin.com/RBGCyfZf
[03:31:19]	<Zorix>	maybe 2 years, but not constantly
[03:31:19]	<Blecki>	Reddit seems to think the trinary is in the colors.
[03:31:48]	<startling>	that'd make sense.
[03:31:48]	<rmmh>	The ternary message is this:
[03:31:48]	<rmmh>	THE LOW BITS OF THE ALPHA CHANNEL OF THIS IMAGE CONTAIN A DCPU PROGRAM
[03:31:50]	<rmmh>	welp
[03:31:51]	<Zorix>	i got a message saying they are under heavy load, and nothing else is going on at 11:30pm
[03:31:59]	<Blecki>	Mother fucker.
[03:32:20]	<Rick>	pimp yo
[03:32:55]	<Ymgve>	http://0x10co.de/q9ep
[03:32:58]	<Ymgve>	disassembled program
[03:33:20]	<rmmh>	seriously?
[03:33:24]	<Ymgve>	yes
[03:33:31]	<rmmh>	okay the fuck is this
[03:33:33]	<Rick>	dat dat dat
[03:33:45]	<rmmh>	that's ascii
[03:33:52]	<Ymgve>	raw opcodes: http://pastebin.com/abvXZQNx
[03:33:53]	<Rick>	yeah
[03:33:57]	<Twisol>	allo.
[03:33:58]	<Rick>	thats the congrats message ymgve said earlier
[03:34:03]	<rmmh>	'Congratulations, you found the correct bit order!'
[03:34:16]	<rmmh>	okay what now
[03:34:19]	<Ymgve>	well, this is boring, the program doesn't display anything!
[03:34:23]	<superjoe>	lol
[03:34:28]	<superjoe>	what a n00b notch is
[03:34:29]	<rmmh>	what's that end dat
[03:34:34]	<Zorix>	its looping
[03:34:43]	<Blecki>	Probably the dissassembler not disassembling all of it.
[03:35:12]	<Rick>	SET [I+0x8140], [I+0x2543]
[03:35:21]	<startling>	looks like wrong-endian
[03:35:25]	<startling>	or strings
[03:35:38]	<startling>	anyone have it in hex?
[03:35:40]	<rmmh>	wrong-endian????
[03:35:45]	<Twisol>	Any news from Notch?
[03:35:48]	<rmmh>	wait no
[03:35:48]	<Rick>	this screams 'needs to load it as a full dat'
[03:35:52]	<rmmh>	it's been obfuscated
[03:35:55]	<rmmh>	do you see the lcg there
[03:35:56]	<startling>	rmmh: when you put things in a file, they can be either endianness
[03:36:25]	<rmmh>	startling: but the diassembly makes sense otherwise
[03:36:50]	<startling>	rmmh: you sure?
[03:36:58]	<startling>	rmmh: it could start with a lot of dats
[03:37:03]	<Ymgve>	we probably need to find the correct values for I and J
[03:37:28]	<startling>	does anyone have it in hex?
[03:37:29]	<Blecki>	It loops until X is the position of the last word in the dat - 300.
[03:37:38]	<Ymgve>	startling: look up
[03:37:41]	<Ymgve>	I pastebinned it
[03:37:52]	<Rick>	got it
[03:38:03]	<Rick>	http://0x10co.de/6u9cu
[03:38:04]	<Blecki>	Line 27 is obviously writing to the screen.
[03:38:07]	<Rick>	needed to run it via dat
[03:38:15]	<Twisol>	What's going on?
[03:38:16]	<Rick>	running disassembled code = no worky because of offset shifts
[03:38:38]	<Blecki>	http://dcpu.com/highnerd/
[03:38:45]	<fullwall>	nice work
[03:38:58]	<rmmh>	dude
[03:38:59]	<rmmh>	awesome
[03:39:04]	<Blecki>	I feel like I participated even though all I did was watch.
[03:39:28]	* superjoe claps
[03:39:32]	<Zorix>	that jar doesnt do crap hmm
[03:39:35]	<rmmh>	Rick: you own <3
[03:39:40]	<rmmh>	it contains something zorix :3
[03:39:41]	<Rick>	not really
[03:39:44]	<Rick>	that was ymgve's work
[03:39:47]	* Twisol is still confused.
[03:39:48]	<Rick>	I just figured disassembling was a bad idea
[03:39:54]	<Blecki>	Yeah the jar doesn't work. :|
[03:39:57]	<Rick>	because it would mean the reassembled code would have different offsets
[03:40:06]	<Ymgve>	Rick: wait, the raw dats work?
[03:40:07]	<Rick>	yeah
[03:40:08]	<Ymgve>	ahh
[03:40:17]	<rmmh>	it has the proper dcpu specs
[03:40:18]	<Rick>	I saw the hardcoded offsets and went 'hmm'
[03:40:33]	<fullwall>	it has the virtual keyboard/screen + proper dcpu
[03:40:52]	<startling>	how do I make it do stuff?
[03:41:04]	<startling>	I just get marquee-ing text
[03:41:28]	<superjoe>	Hi! Feel free to play around with this. Feedback is appreciated! / Notch
[03:41:32]	<Rick>	I doubt you're meant to directly edit it
[03:41:35]	<Rick>	there's a mem.dmp
[03:41:36]	<Rick>	in the jar
[03:41:39]	<Rick>	which is presumably that app
[03:41:48]	<Blecki>	Yeah. The jar itself doesn't run.
[03:41:49]	<rmmh>	nothing special
[03:41:56]	<Blecki>	Probably need to update java.
[03:41:59]	<fullwall>	the mem.dmp just gets compiled
[03:42:04]	<fullwall>	err
[03:42:05]	<fullwall>	put into ram
[03:42:07]	<Rick>	yeah
[03:42:16]	<rmmh>	http://www.reddit.com/r/0x10c/comments/sdeq2/notch_posts_a_puzzle/c4d5wfn?context=3 omg
[03:42:23]	<Rick>	going to decompile and diff
[03:42:26]	<Twisol>	rmmh: :D
[03:42:35]	<Ymgve>	that bastard stole our glory!
[03:42:39]	<rmmh>	:#
[03:42:40]	<rmmh>	:3
[03:42:44]	<Rick>	rmmh is scaevolus
[03:42:45]	<Rick>	;p
[03:42:50]	<rmmh>	sorry Ymgve
[03:42:57]	<Ymgve>	never forgiven
[03:43:01]	<Rick>	haha
[03:43:04]	<rmmh>	hey we have proper keyup/keydown events now
[03:43:09]	<Rick>	oh yeah
[03:43:11]	<Rick>	sec
[03:43:12]	<startling>	rmmh: where did you get that?
[03:43:15]	<Rick>	i'll decompile
[03:43:16]	<Rick>	and diff
[03:43:18]	<startling>	what do you do with the jar?
[03:43:30]	<Blecki>	Run it.
[03:43:35]	<Blecki>	It's a java executable.
[03:43:42]	<Ymgve>	no, it's an applet
[03:43:48]	<Ymgve>	so you can't run it directly
[03:44:22]	<Zorix>	hate applets
[03:44:28]	<Blecki>	Well notch's webpage doesn't work.
[03:44:28]	<Rick>	ah
[03:44:31]	<Rick>	he switched over to using AWT
[03:44:34]	<Rick>	instead of the old keyevent
[03:45:10]	<mappum>	Blecki: get outta here, go back to your ld friends
[03:45:35]	<superjoe>	seriously? no results for "java decompiler" in ubuntu's package manager?
[03:46:01]	<fullwall>	:<
[03:46:04]	<Zorix>	jd-gui
[03:46:15]	<Rick>	lmao
[03:46:20]	<Rick>	ok
[03:46:21]	<Rick>	diff coming up
[03:46:39]	<superjoe>	goddamn tarbombs
[03:46:46]	<Zorix>	it works
[03:46:59]	<Blecki>	Great. Get it working for the rest of us too.
[03:47:00]	<Rick>	minimal changes all around
[03:47:09]	<Zorix>	no i mean jd-gui not the applet
[03:47:13]	<Rick>	http://pastie.org/private/to03bv10exlrc1dwoeua
[03:47:44]	<rmmh>	still didn't fix the colors
[03:47:49]	<Zorix>	whered that diff come from
[03:48:06]	<Rick>	I just pasted it
[03:48:11]	<rmmh>	oh
[03:48:13]	<superjoe>	Rick: think that's an accident?
[03:48:14]	<Zorix>	what was diffed
[03:48:16]	<rmmh>	so [reg+imm] costs cycles
[03:48:23]	<Rick>	applet code vs leak code
[03:48:35]	<Zorix>	ahh
[03:48:42]	<Rick>	if(i == 6)
[03:48:42]	<Rick>	- g += 85;
[03:48:42]	<Rick>	+ b += 85;
[03:48:45]	<Zorix>	yea i looked at the leak a while ago
[03:48:52]	<rmmh>	wait
[03:48:53]	<Rick>	?rick-display
[03:48:54]	<scybot>	rick-display http://pastie.org/pastes/3772655/text?key=xw0dmiwx5khzoagoemyww
[03:48:54]	<rmmh>	did we just lose jsr?
[03:48:59]	<Rick>	no rmmh
[03:49:04]	<rmmh>	no, just his bizarre one
[03:49:07]	<Rick>	the leak had two nonbasic ops
[03:49:14]	<Rick>	jmp as 1
[03:49:15]	<Rick>	jsr as 2
[03:49:23]	<Rick>	ie he removed jmp
[03:50:11]	<Zorix>	thought he said he wouldnt include a jmp
[03:50:14]	<Rick>	so non-bright green is now yellow
[03:50:17]	<startling>	Rick: what did jmp do differently from set pc
[03:50:19]	<Rick>	instead of puke like green
[03:50:22]	<Rick>	startling: no idea
[03:50:24]	<Rick>	I didn't investigate
[03:50:27]	<startling>	Rick: huh
[03:50:33]	<Rick>	mappum you around?
[03:50:40]	<mappum>	no
[03:50:53]	<Rick>	:D
[03:50:53]	<Twisol>	I might be able to help :P
[03:51:01]	<Twisol>	something to do with the emu?
[03:51:10]	<mappum>	the input?
[03:51:10]	<Rick>	oh I was just going to suggest fixing the color, but I just remembered mappum never fixed it before I think
[03:51:16]	<Rick>	I'm still reading input code
[03:51:25]	<mappum>	did you get another leak or something?
[03:51:26]	<Blecki>	Well I can't get the applet to run and I have no experience with java.
[03:51:38]	<Twisol>	mappum: Notch posted a puzzle. They solved it
[03:51:40]	<Rick>	mappum: dcpu applet
[03:51:49]	<Twisol>	It lead to... apparently Notch's DCPU emulator.
[03:51:51]	<mappum>	what was the solution? i saw the puzzle
[03:52:00]	<Twisol>	dcpu.com/highnerd/
[03:52:03]	<Rick>	the solution was Ymgve
[03:52:03]	<Zorix>	yea applet wont run, shrug
[03:52:04]	<Rick>	:D
[03:52:06]	<Rick>	runs here
[03:52:10]	<Rick>	just had to enable java
[03:52:54]	<startling>	rmmh: I like how you told notch about the colors thing
[03:53:13]	<mappum>	oh, that's actually a functioning emulator?
[03:53:18]	<Rick>	mappum: the program turned out to be http://0x10co.de/6u9cu
[03:53:28]	<Rick>	mappum: it's just notch's dcpu stuff in an applet
[03:53:34]	<Twisol>	Heeey it works on 0x10co.de :D
[03:53:41]	<mappum>	:D
[03:53:44]	<Blecki>	"Functioning".
[03:53:46]	<Blecki>	Riiight.
[03:53:49]	<mappum>	does it have the input code?
[03:53:53]	<Zorix>	funny part is that you need an emulator to get the emulator
[03:53:53]	<mappum>	i know that changed
[03:53:53]	<Rick>	yeah
[03:53:54]	<Rick>	i'm reading it now
[03:54:04]	<Rick>	it has events for pressed/released now
[03:54:09]	<Twisol>	aw sweet.
[03:54:10]	<startling>	Rick: what
[03:54:15]	<mappum>	i saw he tweeted that
[03:54:25]	<Blecki>	What kind of events?
[03:54:34]	<Rick>	I dont mean events in the context of dcpu
[03:54:37]	<mappum>	key events
[03:54:41]	<Blecki>	Still the ring buffer, event in high bits?
[03:55:04]	<Rick>	ok
[03:55:06]	<Rick>	looks like
[03:55:11]	<Rick>	keypress = key
[03:55:16]	<Rick>	keyrelease = 0x100 | key
[03:55:25]	<Blecki>	So what I said then.
[03:55:30]	<Twisol>	:D
[03:55:45]	<Twisol>	Eeeexcellent.
[03:55:50]	<Rick>	key values come from "KeyMapping.getKey"
[03:55:57]	<Rick>	it ignores everything < 80 and > 255
[03:56:38]	<mappum>	word
[03:56:39]	<Blecki>	Really? How does it get ' '?
[03:56:40]	<Twisol>	< 80?
[03:56:43]	<Rick>	oh
[03:56:46]	<Rick>	keymapping is notch's code
[03:56:46]	<Rick>	sec
[03:57:15]	<fullwall>	KeyMapping is just a map<integer,integer>
[03:57:26]	<Rick>	......LOL
[03:57:26]	<Blecki>	Look for 0x30
[03:57:27]	<Rick>	welp
[03:57:36]	<Rick>	keypressed/keyrelease apparently only work for arrow kes
[03:57:43]	<Rick>	if i'm reading this right
[03:57:46]	<Twisol>	D:
[03:57:49]	<mappum>	i would be sad if that code didnt work
[03:57:52]	<mappum>	but im so happy it does
[03:58:01]	<mappum>	thanks for all the sneaky reverse engineering, rick
[03:58:06]	<WhyNoEinstein>	anyone seen einstein?
[03:58:16]	<Twisol>	.seen einstein
[03:58:17]	<scybot>	Twisol: I've never seen einstein
[03:58:18]	<mappum>	Y U NO EINSTEIN
[03:58:21]	<mappum>	i think he died
[03:58:29]	<WhyNoEinstein>	shame
[03:58:34]	<WhyNoEinstein>	because we need relativity in here
[03:58:41]	<Rick>	yup
[03:58:46]	<mappum>	relative jumps?
[03:58:47]	<Rick>	keypressed/released only works for arrow keys because notch is dumb
[03:58:54]	<Rick>	but if you ask me
[03:58:57]	<WhyNoEinstein>	yep
[03:58:58]	<Rick>	go ahead and implement everything that way
[03:59:06]	<Rick>	instead of just arrow keys
[03:59:09]	<Rick>	because i'm sure notch will fix it
[03:59:12]	<mappum>	WhyNoEinstein: did you seriously use that name, jsut ot make that joke?
[03:59:23]	<WhyNoEinstein>	I've a lot of free time
[03:59:24]	<lifthrasiir>	you guys are freakin. (just back from lunch)
[03:59:24]	<WhyNoEinstein>	:<
[03:59:27]	<superjoe>	"i'm sure notch will fix it"
[03:59:28]	<superjoe>	LOL
[03:59:31]	<Twisol>	lol.
[03:59:38]	<Rick>	also
[03:59:41]	<mappum>	D:
[03:59:43]	<Rick>	there's no way to distinguish a typed vs pressed event
[03:59:52]	<Twisol>	Rick: What's the difference?
[03:59:59]	<Rick>	idk, ask a java developer
[04:00:11]	<Twisol>	?
[04:00:15]	<xNotch>	:D
[04:00:21]	<xNotch>	0x10co.de is the best
[04:00:23]	<xNotch>	noooo
[04:00:26]	<Twisol>	quick ghost him
[04:00:29]	<Twisol>	d'oh
[04:00:38]	<mappum>	>:/
[04:00:44]	<Rick>	http://pastie.org/private/iiagssvg1zgrygj5requq
[04:00:49]	<Twisol>	Rick: is that like the difference between JS's keypress vs. keydown?
[04:00:50]	<rmmh>	so I still don't understand how the trinary message was encoded
[04:00:50]	<xmappum>	\:<
[04:00:55]	<startling>	D:
[04:00:59]	<lifthrasiir>	hmm, his (internal) address mapping is a bit strange
[04:01:01]	<lifthrasiir>	0x0000..ffff for RAM, 0x10000..10007 for general registers, 0x10008 for SP, 0x10009 for PC, and then 0x10010 (not 0x1000a) for O
[04:01:11]	<dcpubot_>	lifthrasiir: SET A, 0xfff
[04:01:12]	<Fishspill>	Good job figuring it out guys! :d
[04:01:21]	<Rick>	so
[04:01:32]	<Blecki>	rmmh, colors of the letters.
[04:01:33]	<lifthrasiir>	maybe he confused decimals and hexadecimals somehow?
[04:01:36]	<fullwall>	rmmh: there's ruby code in the reddit thread
[04:01:52]	<Twisol>	guys, cut out the nameswapping :(
[04:01:54]	<hachque>	ping Cr8
[04:02:01]	<rmmh>	lifthrasiir: that's just implementation detail, but yeah
[04:02:06]	<startling>	Twisol: I'm me now.
[04:02:07]	<Rick>	values for arrow keys are: 0x26 (up), 0x28 (down), 0x25 (left), 0x27 (right)
[04:02:08]	<rmmh>	lifthrasiir: it's how he's faking pointers :V
[04:02:17]	<fullwall>	http://www.reddit.com/r/0x10c/comments/sdeq2/notch_posts_a_puzzle/c4d5oj0
[04:02:19]	<lifthrasiir>	rmmh: yeah, that doesn't really matter for the spec but still strange :p
[04:03:05]	<hachque>	.tell Cr8 strcasecmp is a Linux function and doesn't work on other platforms; we need a macro function for this.
[04:03:06]	<scybot>	hachque: I'll pass that along.
[04:03:44]	<Rick>	oh
[04:03:46]	<Rick>	I could be wrong actually
[04:03:53]	<Rick>	yeah I got that backward
[04:03:57]	<Blecki>	lifthrasiir, maybe he does the actuall math in 0x1000F.
[04:04:04]	<Rick>	up/down/left/right are 0x80, 0x81, 0x82, 0x83
[04:04:17]	<startling>	hm
[04:04:24]	<Twisol>	Rick: so arrow keys have the high bit set?
[04:04:28]	<Rick>	pressed/released events only occur for them
[04:04:37]	<Rick>	but i'm sure that will change
[04:04:53]	<Rick>	keytyped is still getkeychar
[04:04:56]	<startling>	rmmh: "Thanks! That explains a lot." like he noticed that and couldn't figure it.
[04:04:58]	<Rick>	so unicode value of character
[04:05:03]	<Twisol>	haha.
[04:05:08]	<Rick>	rather
[04:05:10]	<Rick>	not unicode value
[04:05:17]	<Twisol>	ascii? scan code?
[04:05:26]	<Rick>	well
[04:05:30]	<Rick>	character value
[04:05:34]	<Rick>	unicode value
[04:05:35]	<Rick>	but
[04:05:42]	<Rick>	everything out of the range of 0 and 127 is dropped
[04:05:49]	<Twisol>	so ASCII value
[04:05:51]	<Rick>	(see why arrow keys got mapped to 0x80..?)
[04:05:56]	<Twisol>	since that's where unicode and ASCII match up
[04:06:05]	<startling>	ι ςαντεδ το τυπε ιν γρεεκ, τηοθγη. :(
[04:06:09]	<Rick>	so yeah
[04:06:10]	<Twisol>	Mhm, he's just utilizing the upper range for special keys.
[04:06:14]	<Rick>	yup
[04:06:19]	<Rick>	so what I would do
[04:06:24]	<Rick>	is add support for keypress/release
[04:06:27]	<Rick>	for all keys
[04:06:33]	<Rick>	limiting it to arrow keys is dumb
[04:06:34]	<Rick>	big dumbs
[04:06:52]	<Twisol>	startling: Gah. I actually tried to read that upside down before I realized. -_-
[04:07:24]	<Rick>	so yeah
[04:07:33]	<Rick>	the jmp removal and keypressed are the only tangible changes
[04:07:34]	<startling>	Twisol: haha
[04:07:48]	<Rick>	there's some stuff related to colors
[04:07:50]	<Twisol>	I'm like, "the heck's theta in there for?"
[04:07:53]	<Rick>	but that's to actually emit the right color
[04:07:54]	<rmmh>	Rick: hey, we got bright yellow \o/
[04:07:55]	<Rick>	as a light
[04:07:58]	<Rick>	rmmh: dark
[04:08:00]	<startling>	Twisol: it's an upside-down theta
[04:08:03]	<startling>	Twisol: duh
[04:08:06]	<Rick>	green is now puke yellow / brown
[04:08:07]	<Twisol>	;_;
[04:08:15]	<lifthrasiir>	if ((i < 80) || (i > 255)) return;
[04:08:18]	<lifthrasiir>	what the hell is this code
[04:08:23]	<lifthrasiir>	isn't he supposed to write 0x80 instead of 80?
[04:08:35]	<Rick>	oh shit
[04:08:39]	<Rick>	that means I was wrong
[04:08:42]	<Rick>	I totally read it as 0x80
[04:08:43]	<Twisol>	??
[04:08:51]	<fullwall>	"By the way, could I get a quick example of [SP+next word] in action? I can't quite figure out how to use it properly. "
[04:08:53]	<Rick>	actually
[04:08:54]	<Rick>	hahahahaha
[04:08:57]	<Rick>	that has to be a bug
[04:09:00]	<Rick>	that's P
[04:09:03]	<lifthrasiir>	VirtualKeyboard.{keyPressed,keyReleased} has a bug
[04:09:08]	<Twisol>	lol, dear god
[04:09:13]	<Rick>	but
[04:09:16]	<Rick>	the bug doesnt actually matter
[04:09:19]	<lifthrasiir>	which accidentally pushes a plain character twice into the queue
[04:09:20]	<Rick>	since only arrow keys have a mapping
[04:09:27]	<Rick>	<Rick> since only arrow keys have a mapping
[04:09:28]	<lifthrasiir>	ah
[04:09:32]	<Rick>	:p
[04:09:32]	<Twisol>	quick, storm Notch with bug tweets
[04:09:35]	<rmmh>	I will implement all of those changes
[04:09:36]	<Rick>	lmao
[04:09:37]	<rmmh>	FUCK YES
[04:09:38]	<rmmh>	FUUUCK YES
[04:09:39]	<lifthrasiir>	ah, you are right, it returns -1 for non-existant mappings
[04:09:42]	<rmmh>	\o/
[04:09:42]	<Rick>	yeah
[04:09:43]	<lifthrasiir>	non-existent*
[04:09:44]	<rmmh>	~o~
[04:09:45]	<startling>	Rick: that's probably why he didn't do all of the keys
[04:09:57]	<rmmh>	guys
[04:10:00]	<rmmh>	I need example code
[04:10:13]	<NakedFury>	spam his twitter account with bugs
[04:10:13]	<startling>	rmmh: example code?
[04:10:16]	<rmmh>	with [SP+imm] addressing
[04:10:25]	<Rick>	ummm
[04:10:26]	<Rick>	but
[04:10:28]	<Rick>	you can't do that
[04:10:33]	<rmmh>	[–]xNotch 1 point 5 minutes ago
[04:10:34]	<rmmh>	I will implement all of those changes.
[04:10:34]	<rmmh>	By the way, could I get a quick example of [SP+next word] in action? I can't quite figure out how to use it properly. I trust people when they say it would be useful, but I'd like to know what clever trick I'm missing. :D
[04:10:37]	<Blecki>	rmmh, hang on 30 seconds I'll change DCPUC and generate some.
[04:10:41]	<rmmh>	thanks Blecki
[04:10:44]	<Rick>	oh
[04:10:46]	<Twisol>	[SP] for first on the stack, [SP+0xFFFF] for second, etc...?
[04:10:53]	<Rick>	well
[04:10:53]	<rmmh>	Blecki: a real compiler output will be the most useful :v
[04:10:56]	<Twisol>	wait, imanidiiot
[04:10:59]	<lifthrasiir>	okay, summary: normal characters work as is, special characters get separate codes (UP=0x80 DOWN=0x81 LEFT=0x82 RIGHT=0x83) and 0x100 bit is set when the key is about to be released, right?
[04:11:03]	<Rick>	[sp+0xFFFF]
[04:11:06]	<Rick>	for [sp-1]
[04:11:10]	<Rick>	etc
[04:11:11]	<Blecki>	rmmh, yeah I need to change it in like four places so give me a sec,.
[04:11:11]	<Twisol>	SP comes down from 0xFFFF anyways
[04:11:11]	<lifthrasiir>	(i.e. normal characters do not distinguish keypress and keyrelease)
[04:11:14]	<rmmh>	kk
[04:11:15]	<Twisol>	so it's just SP, SP+1, etc...
[04:11:25]	<fullwall>	notch is in the IRC here?
[04:11:28]	<Rick>	no
[04:11:32]	<Twisol>	we wish
[04:11:33]	<fullwall>	"edit: This was meant to the entire community here. I've been watching a couple of places on and off since I posted the image, and you were the first people to get it right! Well done! Also, seriously, check out fez, it's full of tricksy things like this."
[04:11:38]	<Rick>	lifthrasiir: yup
[04:11:56]	<lifthrasiir>	reasonable.
[04:13:25]	<Twisol>	well, at least the "eval b before a" suggestion will be easy to adjust...
[04:13:28]	<Rick>	Twisol: do you have access to updating 0x10co.de?
[04:13:46]	<rmmh>	Twisol: most assembly code should stay working
[04:13:57]	<startling>	ugh tons of changes woooh
[04:13:58]	<Twisol>	Rick: No, I only have contributor access to the emulator core itself.
[04:14:02]	<Rick>	ah
[04:14:06]	<Rick>	tons of changes my ass
[04:14:09]	<rmmh>	though the signed IFs will fuck things up
[04:14:10]	<lifthrasiir>	"I will implement all of those changes." oh my?
[04:14:11]	<rmmh>	I guess
[04:14:11]	<Rick>	it's three tangible changes
[04:14:38]	<Rick>	or do you mean ~the future~
[04:15:01]	<Twisol>	5-bit opcodes should also be easy, hallelujah for mapping opcodes to an enumeration already
[04:15:12]	<Rick>	yeah
[04:15:16]	<rmmh>	5-bit basics and 6-bit specials
[04:15:19]	<startling>	I bet he won't make all of those changes
[04:15:26]	<rmmh>	I edited my proposal at the last second to go back to 6-bit specials :V
[04:15:34]	<rmmh>	since special opcodes with immediates might be useful
[04:15:41]	<rmmh>	(one-words specials with literals)
[04:15:42]	<Twisol>	yeah
[04:16:07]	<Twisol>	literal range shift should be a four-chracter change... :D
[04:16:19]	<rmmh>	literal range shift could just be changing an & to a -
[04:16:29]	<Twisol>	mmm, true
[04:16:38]	<Blecki>	rmmh, how complex do you think this example needs to be?
[04:16:47]	<rmmh>	Blecki: just show a function that would spill to the stack
[04:16:53]	<rmmh>	Blecki: that complex arithmetic one you have should work ?
[04:17:03]	<rmmh>	where it's a * b + c / d - e + f; or w/e
[04:17:33]	<Rick>	you could probably just paste him the output of an x86 disassembly
[04:17:34]	<Rick>	:p
[04:17:39]	<Blecki>	rmmh, meh, I wrote a simpler example. The change is really juse 'SET J, SP / SET ?, [n+J]' -> 'SET ?, [n+SP]'
[04:18:59]	<Blecki>	https://github.com/Blecki/DCPUC/blob/dev/sp%2Bnext_word.txt
[04:19:18]	<rmmh>	thanks
[04:20:58]	<mappum>	chessmaster42: hey, i know you
[04:21:43]	<chessmaster42>	mappum: I recognize your name, emulator site?
[04:21:47]	<Blecki>	rmmh, the 'feature test' output is a good example too, if you can pick 'spill' out of it. https://gist.github.com/2403424
[04:22:00]	<mappum>	chessmaster42: yeah, and you just commented on my reddit post
[04:22:15]	<lifthrasiir>	rmmh: a bit late for suggestion, but I suggest to map literal -1 to 0x3f and 0..30 to 0x20..3e.
[04:22:33]	<rmmh>	?
[04:22:45]	<lifthrasiir>	in the DCPU-16 revision suggestion
[04:22:47]	<rmmh>	lifthrasiir: literals can be implemented with subtraction
[04:22:52]	<rmmh>	if -1 is 0x20
[04:23:15]	<lifthrasiir>	hmm
[04:23:22]	<rmmh>	yeah, it's a bit uglier for hardware
[04:23:44]	<chessmaster42>	mappum: Yeah, I've been pretty busy with AtlasOS. Was browsing /r/0x10c and saw the puzzle. Now I'm reading the source of the applet and updating the OS to be compliant with everything *cross fingers*
[04:24:14]	<mappum>	chessmaster42: oh, that's you? pro
[04:24:49]	<mappum>	chessmaster42: hang out here, we're the first o be compliant :P
[04:25:18]	<chessmaster42>	mappum: Your EMU was the first I used when writing DCPU code btw :)
[04:25:25]	<mappum>	woot
[04:25:32]	<Blecki>	Me too.
[04:25:33]	<Fishspill>	Me too :D
[04:25:54]	<mappum>	it's changed a lot
[04:25:55]	<Fishspill>	I used it back when it was just on the Github, when it barely worked. :p
[04:25:58]	<rmmh>	chessmaster42: hm, the atlas abi isn't quite the same as what we were going to do~
[04:26:05]	<Blecki>	In fact, I've tested everything outputted by DCPUC against your emulator and rarely against anything else.
[04:26:07]	<chessmaster42>	mappum: Right now, though, we're using DCPU Studio because it has been the most accurate and the fastest. Plus the features it has are nice, sorry :/
[04:26:22]	<mappum>	most accurate? idk about that...
[04:26:31]	<rmmh>	DCPU studio doesn't have the new input/graphics
[04:26:39]	<chessmaster42>	rmmh: Our ABI is still a draft, needs updating
[04:26:40]	<rmmh>	also doesn't have nice assembler features
[04:26:41]	<Fishspill>	Yeah, it's actually kind of off in some regards.
[04:27:04]	<chessmaster42>	Well, the "new" graphics and input are still speculatory unless I've missed something from the decompile
[04:27:11]	<Blecki>	chessmaster42, https://github.com/0x10cStandardsCommittee/0x10c-Standards/blob/master/ABI/ABI%20draft%202.txt
[04:27:15]	<chessmaster42>	We still don't have a char map location. The font is from a png
[04:27:18]	<Blecki>	chessmaster42, conform to that one.
[04:27:19]	<Rick>	?rick-display
[04:27:19]	<scybot>	rick-display http://pastie.org/pastes/3772655/text?key=xw0dmiwx5khzoagoemyww
[04:27:22]	<Rick>	read that chessmaster42
[04:27:41]	<Rick>	oh I need to edit it to reflect the changes in the applet
[04:28:18]	<chessmaster42>	So, right now 0x10co.de is the most updated that we know of?
[04:28:34]	<mappum>	i think startling's conforms, too
[04:28:41]	<mappum>	(sixteen)
[04:28:52]	<mappum>	ive only used my own though :/
[04:28:53]	<rmmh>	co.de's debugger is really glitchy though
[04:28:58]	<mappum>	true dat
[04:29:05]	<rmmh>	hey mappum, dogfooding
[04:29:08]	<rmmh>	do it ;)
[04:29:10]	<chessmaster42>	Rick: Yeah, Plusmid and I have been reading the standards committee ABI doc but there aren't much details to go on yet
[04:29:46]	<mappum>	i dont even write dcpu code though, i've only ever written it for testing the emu
[04:30:01]	<rmmh>	exactly
[04:30:09]	<Rick>	chessmaster42: that's not the ABI, that's how the display works in the leak
[04:30:12]	<Rick>	(my link I mean)
[04:30:17]	<rmmh>	chessmaster42: how did you pick your LCG constants for your rand function
[04:30:24]	<Rick>	and yes, as far as I know 0x10co.de is the only one that does display IO correctly
[04:30:37]	<Rick>	hmm
[04:30:46]	<Rick>	I should put the spec up on my github
[04:31:05]	<Lerc>	How does this work for peoples? should be able to do a whole level. http://fingswotidun.com/dcpu16/pac.html
[04:31:07]	<chessmaster42>	rmmh: Don't recall, I think that Plusmid came up with that one
[04:31:16]	<Blecki>	chessmaster42, I rewrote it to hopefully be clearer.
[04:31:23]	<Blecki>	chessmaster42, anything confusing about it?
[04:31:30]	<chessmaster42>	Blecki: Reading ...
[04:33:33]	<superjoe>	Lerc: this is really impressive
[04:33:43]	<Blecki>	Lerc, ha, that's awesome. But, AFAWCT, there's only the one graphics mode.
[04:33:56]	<Blecki>	So this isn't going to work in the game.
[04:34:01]	<Blecki>	Also, is it blurry?
[04:34:20]	<Lerc>	That's the canvas scaling.
[04:34:43]	<rmmh>	Lerc: are you the guy behind that?
[04:34:48]	<Blecki>	No way to set point sampling?
[04:35:23]	<Lerc>	I'm hoping that the game wlll make a fairly compelling case for the display mode and sprites.
[04:35:31]	<Lerc>	rmmh: Yup.
[04:35:58]	<Blecki>	Lerc, I'm hoping for something far simpler.
[04:36:01]	<Rick>	.remember rick-display https://github.com/gibbed/0x10c-Notes/blob/master/VirtualMonitor.txt
[04:36:02]	<scybot>	Rick: forgetting "rick-display http://pastie.org/pastes/3772655/text?key=xw0dmiwx5khzoagoemyww", remembering this instead.
[04:36:10]	<rmmh>	Lerc: why go with a fixed 16-color palette rather than a user-controllable one?
[04:36:40]	<Blecki>	Lerc, I'd like a simple 16 color display. 4 pixels per word.
[04:36:55]	<Blecki>	What are the dimensions of the screen?
[04:37:14]	<Lerc>	rmmh: The only reason for the limit is 80's nostalgia.
[04:37:34]	<Lerc>	Settable palette would be trivial to add.
[04:37:42]	<Blecki>	Lerc, yet you use Arne's NICE palette instead of a REAL one.
[04:37:47]	<rmmh>	C64 had palettes, didn't it?
[04:37:57]	<Lerc>	But if it's a fixed pallete, why not have a really good one :-)
[04:38:08]	<rmmh>	BECAUSE I DEMAND MAGENTA
[04:38:14]	<Lerc>	rmmh: 61 only had 16 colours, and no bright red.
[04:38:29]	<rmmh>	Blecki: code helped convince notch, thanks :v
[04:38:30]	<Lerc>	*c64
[04:38:40]	<Blecki>	rmmh, twitter?
[04:38:49]	<rmmh>	http://www.reddit.com/r/0x10c/comments/sdeq2/notch_posts_a_puzzle/c4d6hnz?context=3
[04:39:07]	<chessmaster42>	Anyone have an offline assembler+emu comparable to DCPU-Studio? It's badly out-of-date as I've noticed now ...
[04:39:27]	<rmmh>	chessmaster42: hachque has something, as does startling
[04:40:05]	<Rick>	https://github.com/gibbed/0x10c-Notes/commit/d5ab81ab70f7d9d1dae9bfa9d0aade4af56d8767
[04:40:08]	<Lerc>	I tried to build DCPU studio but it duses BadSector's weird help system, and started feeling like dependency hell.
[04:40:34]	<chessmaster42>	Yeah which is why it probably hasn't been updated :P
[04:40:35]	<rmmh>	Rick: I pointed that out, so he might fix it...
[04:40:48]	<Rick>	which part, the fact that it's now puke yellow?
[04:40:53]	<rmmh>	yes
[04:40:55]	<Lerc>	Blecki: a 4 bit/pixel display mode uses a lot more ram and much slower to move.
[04:41:02]	<Rick>	what color is it "supposed" to be?
[04:41:06]	<rmmh>	brown
[04:41:21]	<Blecki>	Lerc, I know but I'd like it as an option.
[04:41:30]	<rmmh>	.w cga
[04:41:31]	<scybot>	rmmh: CGA may stand for: -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CGA
[04:41:36]	<rmmh>	.w computer graphics array
[04:41:37]	<scybot>	rmmh: no results found
[04:41:40]	<rmmh>	fff
[04:42:13]	<Rick>	:v:
[04:42:37]	<rmmh>	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_Graphics_Adapter#With_an_RGBI_monitor
[04:43:09]	<Rick>	ah
[04:43:19]	<Lerc>	Blecki: That could be Graphics mode 2. My one allows for moving the screen plus brings back many of the pixel art challenges of picking colours really well. One of the few things left people can do better than computers.
[04:43:31]	<Rick>	there, updated the paste so it points to my github
[04:43:34]	<chessmaster42>	And EGA being Extended Graphics Adapter. Yay 80's tech nobody uses anymore
[04:44:04]	<mappum>	im psyched for 0x10con
[04:44:10]	<superjoe>	is that a joke
[04:44:12]	<Rick>	0x10...con?
[04:44:17]	<Blecki>	Mother of..
[04:44:22]	<startling>	chessmaster42: mine's up-to-date, yeah.
[04:44:25]	<Blecki>	I'd actually have to go to that.
[04:44:26]	<mappum>	buy tickets nao
[04:44:36]	<superjoe>	I went to minecon because I thought #mcdevs would be there, but instead they just gave me shit for going to the con :(
[04:44:37]	<startling>	(well, until an hour ago it was)
[04:44:38]	<Lerc>	fun fact: I designed a modification to cga that would have made it have much better display mode colours. Invert the R of RGBI
[04:44:41]	<chessmaster42>	startling: Link? I haven't used yours yet
[04:44:46]	<startling>	?sixteen
[04:44:46]	<scybot>	sixteen https://github.com/startling/sixteen
[04:44:47]	<mappum>	ill preorder them for you, send me $200
[04:45:04]	<mappum>	superjoe: well we'll go to this one
[04:45:05]	<startling>	mappum: you're probably the person who has made the most money off of 0x10c so far
[04:45:13]	<mappum>	ha yeah, more than notch
[04:45:19]	<rmmh>	you've made money? wat
[04:45:24]	<startling>	yeah. greedy bastard
[04:45:32]	<Rick>	wait what
[04:45:36]	<Rick>	give me some of the pie
[04:45:37]	<Rick>	you bastard
[04:45:37]	<Rick>	8)
[04:45:46]	<mappum>	it was $160 in donations
[04:45:51]	<Rick>	I kid
[04:45:54]	<mappum>	but shit tons of people offering free hosting, too
[04:45:59]	<rmmh>	congrats mappum
[04:46:00]	<chessmaster42>	Quick, everyone grab mappum. Take his google wallet :P
[04:46:03]	<Rick>	I don't beg for donations enough
[04:46:15]	<mappum>	:P
[04:46:24]	<mappum>	i didnt want to, someone told me to
[04:46:31]	<startling>	haha
[04:46:34]	<mappum>	the netherlands guy
[04:46:36]	<mappum>	cand think of his name
[04:46:48]	<mappum>	i also got like 200 twitter followers
[04:46:51]	<mappum>	but i want maor
[04:47:35]	<Rick>	I have like 1000
[04:47:36]	<Rick>	I forget
[04:47:41]	<mappum>	:O
[04:47:44]	<mappum>	who are you?
[04:48:34]	<startling>	guys I have like 20 tumblr followers
[04:48:35]	<rmmh>	gibbed
[04:48:42]	<startling>	i'm pretty cool too
[04:48:45]	<rmmh>	Rick: I have 500 twitter followers, they're all from minecraft :v
[04:48:50]	<Rick>	http://twitter.com/gibbed
[04:50:00]	<chessmaster42>	I wish I didn't have to be up for work in the morning. Considering calling in to work on AtlasOS and get it working in the updated assemblers + emu ;)
[04:50:22]	<rmmh>	chessmaster42: not a good idea ;)
[04:50:33]	<Rick>	nothing is ever a good idea
[04:50:36]	<chessmaster42>	rmmh: I know but it's so tempting, you know?
[04:51:50]	<chessmaster42>	Meh, I'll probably be working on it on one of my other machines at work. I work with Java for a living and debugging stuff on handsets can get boring at times
[04:51:56]	<Lerc>	Righty reddited http://www.reddit.com/r/dcpu16/comments/sdqx1/making_the_case_for_sprites_and_graphics_mode_the/
[04:52:40]	<rmmh>	Lerc: you should give the ghosts some AI
[04:52:47]	<rmmh>	(it's really simple)
[04:55:22]	<rmmh>	"Then again, I assume people already verified against the leak, which I'm fine with people playing around with, by the way. :D
[04:55:26]	<rmmh>	:3
[04:56:16]	<chessmaster42>	Quick question, I'm updating our keyboard driver to work with the new ring buffer. However the key input is severly delayed. Any quick thoughts that might save me time?
[04:56:27]	<rmmh>	what language
[04:56:28]	<Twisol>	delayed in what way?
[04:57:22]	<Blecki>	rmmh, link me that list of suggestions again.
[04:57:29]	<Twisol>	https://gist.github.com/2341455
[04:57:36]	<rmmh>	?fixes
[04:57:36]	<scybot>	fixes https://gist.github.com/2341455
[04:57:38]	<Twisol>	Blecki: ^ still had it open
[04:57:51]	<Blecki>	rmmh, I'm hoping his comments on reddit mean he WON'T be doing what failoverlow wanted.
[04:57:56]	<chessmaster42>	Erm, here: http://pastebin.com/y1SzFXXF
[04:58:04]	<superjoe>	argh, i want to work on more 0x10c stuff, but I'm too tired to be productive, and if I go to sleep I have to work all day before getting back to it
[04:58:11]	<chessmaster42>	Working copy, just drop in 0x10co.de and you'll see what I mean
[04:58:25]	<rmmh>	chessmaster42: have you considered doing JSR [page_reserve] rather than JSR page_reserve ?
[04:58:37]	<rmmh>	it saves a few cycles and a few words
[04:58:49]	<chessmaster42>	rmmh: Haven't gotten to optimizing anything yet :S
[04:58:50]	<Twisol>	chessmaster42: no RESERVE opcode, what is that meant to do?
[04:59:13]	<chessmaster42>	twisol: Oh, that is from DCPU Studio. I thought I removed that
[04:59:16]	<chessmaster42>	Just comment out the line
[04:59:51]	<Twisol>	Huh, weird.
[05:00:17]	<chessmaster42>	I'm too tired right now to figure it out but I'm to anxious to get it updated that I'm basically rolling my face on the keyboard to fix it :P
[05:00:34]	<Twisol>	chessmaster42: I haven't written much DCPU assembly, but the Minesweeper implementation seems to be doing something right: http://0x10co.de/lqnit
[05:00:36]	<scybot>	Twisol: that url has been posted 4 times in the past 7 hours by mappum, rmmh, startling, and Zarutian (last linked by Zarutian 5 hours, 14 minutes ago).
[05:00:45]	<Twisol>	chessmaster42: so it might help to look at how it does key input
[05:01:12]	<Blecki>	rmmh, alright, everything on this list is great, except I'd like to see IGE and ILE (>= <=) too.
[05:01:23]	<Rick>	why?
[05:01:46]	<Blecki>	Oh I can just flip operands can't I?
[05:01:48]	<Rick>	oh my god
[05:01:51]	<Twisol>	:D
[05:01:52]	<Rick>	that minesweeper startup logo
[05:01:53]	<Rick>	that owns
[05:01:56]	<rmmh>	ikr
[05:01:58]	<rmmh>	it's amazing
[05:02:03]	<chessmaster42>	I was like O.o when I saw it earlier today
[05:02:13]	<Rick>	it's done really well
[05:02:14]	<rmmh>	Blecki: there's only one edge case where flipping them will be different, where you have a short-form literal in b
[05:02:33]	<rmmh>	but that should be convertible to the other type
[05:02:58]	<mappum>	Rick: and its his first assembly evar
[05:03:20]	<rmmh>	but he's done game dev before
[05:03:48]	<Rick>	now you need to implement voting
[05:03:51]	<Rick>	cos I want to upvote it
[05:03:58]	<Rick>	that's really well done
[05:04:00]	<rmmh>	vote by spamming it with requests
[05:04:01]	<Blecki>	rmmh, yeah. Supporting more comparison operators is pretty high up my DCPUC todo list.
[05:04:17]	<mappum>	so many crappy text editors :/
[05:04:20]	<Blecki>	rmmh, I've been putting it off because implementing < in terms of > is a pain.
[05:04:54]	<rmmh>	Blecki: plus I gave you unsigned ops! :3
[05:05:01]	<rmmh>	err
[05:05:02]	<rmmh>	signed
[05:05:14]	<rmmh>	(assuming he implements them)
[05:05:47]	<Blecki>	WUT SO I CAN COMPLICATE DCPUC??
[05:05:52]	<rmmh>	yase
[05:05:58]	<Blecki>	Thanks, now I need add a type system.
[05:06:03]	<rmmh>	you thought you could get away without a type system >:3
[05:06:10]	<Blecki>	Or differentiate signed operators somehow...
[05:06:25]	<Blecki>	Operator -*!
[05:06:38]	<rmmh>	.* ?
[05:06:48]	<Blecki>	Signed-mult.
[05:07:47]	<Blecki>	I'll probably add a type system then. I was going to have to for structs anyway.
[05:08:09]	<Blecki>	Though it will be mostly ignored.
[05:08:16]	<Blecki>	var a:signed = ....;
[05:09:13]	<Blecki>	Also this minesweeper is fucked.
[05:09:33]	<Blecki>	It's giving me one mine.
[05:09:41]	<rmmh>	the rng is hilariously bad
[05:10:24]	<mappum>	really? i was confused at how it was different every time i ran it
[05:11:04]	<Rick>	it's cheating
[05:11:05]	<Rick>	:p
[05:11:23]	<startling>	?minesweeper
[05:11:24]	<scybot>	minesweeper http://0x10co.de/lqnit
[05:11:39]	<Blecki>	rmmh, click->win.
[05:11:45]	<Blecki>	I R BEST SWEEPER EVAR. etc.
[05:12:00]	<Blecki>	rmmh, also thanks for the name-drop.
[05:12:45]	<rmmh>	didn't know what nick you wanted to go by, so I just mentioned DCPUC
[05:12:55]	<Blecki>	That is the relevant name.
[05:13:00]	<Blecki>	And I'm Blecki on reddit.
[05:14:20]	<startling>	?rick-display
[05:14:21]	<scybot>	rick-display https://github.com/gibbed/0x10c-Notes/blob/master/VirtualMonitor.txt
[05:14:31]	<chessmaster42>	Got my keyboard driver sorted out. Now to clean up the mess ...
[05:32:13]	<Qwerty0>	Anyone here?
[05:32:23]	<Rick>	of course not
[05:32:26]	<Rick>	we're over there
[05:32:37]	<Qwerty0>	over there sounds good too
[05:32:48]	<lifthrasiir>	and some are beyond there
[05:33:22]	<Qwerty0>	I thought I'd come ask the sages here whether anyone's figured out how to actually run their code in Notch's VM
[05:33:31]	<Rick>	which one
[05:33:36]	<Qwerty0>	dcpu.com/highnerd
[05:33:37]	<Rick>	the applet?
[05:33:40]	<Qwerty0>	yeah
[05:33:45]	<Rick>	you'd need to edit the jar and replace mem.dmp with your raw data
[05:33:51]	<Qwerty0>	hmm
[05:34:09]	<Qwerty0>	assemble, and insert into mem.dmp
[05:34:10]	<Qwerty0>	makes sense
[05:34:39]	<lifthrasiir>	also note that it contains a proper "main" method for benchmark
[05:37:27]	<Qwerty0>	lol, beginning bytes of mem.dmp in ASCII: "C.o.n.g.r.a.t.u.l.a.t.i.o.n.s.,. .y.o.u. .f.o.u.n.d. .t.h.e. .c.o.r.r.e.c.t. .b.i.t. .o.r.d.e.r"
[05:38:09]	<Rick>	yeah ymgve saw that initially
[05:39:03]	<Qwerty0>	well i think i'll put this knowledge on reddit
[05:39:32]	<Qwerty0>	..unless you feel protective of it ;)
[05:39:39]	<mappum>	we copyrighted it
[05:41:17]	<Qwerty0>	yeah, i figured this community was pretty serious about IP
[05:41:41]	<startling>	Shoulda seen what we did to Rick after he read the leak.
[05:42:20]	<hachque>	wait what's going on
[05:42:26]	<hachque>	someone tl;dr me the last 6 hours
[05:42:57]	<Twisol>	startling: I was going to make a SoIaF joke but it was too gruesome :(
[05:43:02]	<rmmh>	hachque: tl;dr "from xNotch: I will implement all of those changes."
[05:43:10]	<hachque>	what changes?
[05:43:11]	<hachque>	where
[05:43:12]	<hachque>	who
[05:43:13]	<hachque>	how
[05:43:14]	<rmmh>	hachque: http://www.reddit.com/r/0x10c/comments/sdeq2/notch_posts_a_puzzle/
[05:43:14]	<Twisol>	?fixes
[05:43:14]	<scybot>	fixes https://gist.github.com/2341455
[05:43:25]	<Rick>	rmmh's changes
[05:43:27]	<Rick>	CHANGES CHANGES CHANGES
[05:43:33]	<Twisol>	tree fiddy
[05:44:36]	<hachque>	so
[05:44:43]	<hachque>	all of the suggestions on the gist are being implemented?
[05:44:58]	<hachque>	because if so
[05:44:59]	<hachque>	fffffffffffffwork
[05:45:32]	<Qwerty0>	yeah its pretty awesome
[05:45:43]	<hachque>	god damn it notch
[05:45:47]	<hachque>	I have university assignments
[05:46:47]	<hachque>	so it will literally be the dcpu-16.txt?
[05:47:29]	<rmmh>	idk
[05:47:34]	<rmmh>	maybe, maybe not~
[05:47:36]	<hachque>	fffff
[05:48:09]	<hachque>	ping Cr8
[05:48:16]	<Cr8>	pong
[05:48:25]	<hachque>	yeah just saw the email and figured you were online
[05:48:40]	<hachque>	are you the one who was working on a forth compiler?
[05:48:41]	<Cr8>	got back fron doing stuff
[05:48:46]	<Cr8>	i am not
[05:49:04]	<Cr8>	perhaps you are thinking of MostAwesomeDude
[05:49:06]	<rmmh>	hachque: MostAwesomeDude is
[05:49:07]	<rmmh>	efb
[05:49:10]	<hachque>	ah right
[05:49:23]	<Cr8>	anyway i'ma sleep
[05:49:32]	<hachque>	oh okay
[05:49:33]	<hachque>	cya then
[05:49:40]	<Cr8>	later
[05:51:35]	<hachque>	yeah anyway, I was thinking of refactoring my compiler so that it could compile other languages
[05:51:50]	<hachque>	and the backend focuses as just writing out assembly based on what the language compiler wants to do
[05:51:58]	<hachque>	compile ALL the languages and whatnot
[05:52:15]	<Rick>	all of them
[05:52:16]	<Rick>	at the same time
[05:52:44]	<hachque>	technically yes, since the linker will mean you can feed the compiler files written in different languages and it'll produce a single runnable image
[05:52:48]	<startling>	hachque: mostawesomedude and hellige are doing forths
[05:53:15]	<hachque>	so you could use a Forth library with C for your main application and some raw assembly for speed
[05:53:20]	<hachque>	and it all works
[05:53:47]	<Lerc>	The sprite spec I'm working with on my experimental emulator. http://fingswotidun.com/dcpu16/sprites.txt Pacman is only using mode 0 sprites because it only needs tiny sprites.
[05:54:29]	<rmmh>	Lerc: notch mentioned he might go to ega (or palettes in general)
[05:55:50]	<hachque>	tbh I really want modular hardware
[05:55:56]	<hachque>	so that there aren't just hard coded positions for hardware
[05:56:15]	<startling>	agreed.
[05:56:28]	<hachque>	that would mean that you could have as many different types of hardware components as you like
[05:56:38]	<hachque>	but realisitically the DCPU would only be able to be connected to a few hardware components
[05:56:47]	<hachque>	depending on how many words they expose / require
[05:56:48]	<startling>	"realistically"
[05:56:54]	<Twisol>	did someone here just follow me on twitter? :o
[05:57:00]	<Rick>	no
[05:57:05]	<startling>	notch crossed out "hard science fiction"
[05:57:05]	<hachque>	yeah, because you only have 0x10000 words of RAM, so you can't fill it all up with hardware :P
[05:57:16]	<hachque>	i didn't mean that kind of realistically
[05:57:21]	<hachque>	I meant, in terms of memory available
[05:57:29]	<startling>	hachque: oh, got it. I thought you meant "you can only have so many parallel ports"
[05:57:35]	<hachque>	nah
[05:57:42]	<Twisol>	i was thinking, couldn't you expose a mode-switch word that you'd set to change the behavior of the mapped region?
[05:57:55]	<Twisol>	0 means display output, 1 means font mapping, 2 means palette...
[05:58:03]	<startling>	that'd be cool.
[05:58:08]	<hachque>	Twisol: thought of that, but not every kind of hardware is going to need the same size of RAM
[05:58:16]	<Twisol>	hachque: It's not a generic mechanism
[05:58:18]	<startling>	memory paging could be done that way in general.
[05:58:19]	<hachque>	and that would give control to the DCPU about what hardware it has
[05:58:25]	<Twisol>	hachque: It seems like it could work really well for the display itself though
[05:58:45]	<hachque>	I think it would be much cooler if the DCPU was told what hardware was available, and you just had to cope with what you got
[05:59:19]	<lifthrasiir>	rmmh: hmm, what should "SET A, 0x8000; SET B, 0xffff; DVI A, B" set to A?
[06:01:24]	<Lerc>	Twisol: A display mode word is what I put on my exp-emulator
[06:01:31]	<chessmaster42>	For those who are interested, AtlasOS has been updated and now runs properly in 0x10co.de and other emulators. Enjoy!
[06:01:38]	<chessmaster42>	Now I must sleep. G'night all!
[06:01:51]	<rmmh>	lifthrasiir: the result of the div, not the extra
[06:02:02]	<rmmh>	oh wait misread
[06:02:03]	<lifthrasiir>	but it will overflow (-0x8000 / -1 = 0x8000)
[06:02:04]	<rmmh>	idk
[06:03:33]	<rmmh>	lifthrasiir: 0 in A, 0 in O would be okay
[06:03:37]	<rmmh>	idk, that's not a very common case
[06:03:48]	<deltab>	what's the I in DVI?
[06:03:55]	<lifthrasiir>	right, I was just to clarify the spec
[06:04:15]	<deltab>	suggest "S" for signed :-)
[06:04:24]	<lifthrasiir>	DVS MLS is not sexy :(
[06:04:48]	<deltab>	or U for unsigned
[06:04:56]	<Rick>	div.u
[06:04:57]	<Rick>	:v
[06:05:43]	<Twisol>	what's the point of a hard-to-remember mnemonic?
[06:05:50]	<Twisol>	isn't that an oxymoron?
[06:07:46]	<deltab>	Lerc: if you don't already know: no randomness in pacman; there are sites explaining exactly how it works, including the individual ghost ai
[06:08:59]	<Lerc>	deltab: Yeah. I was just going from memory. To get more authentic I suspect I'd have to do a lot of research.
[06:09:30]	<Lerc>	But hey. I started this on sunday afternoon.
[06:09:47]	<deltab>	yeah, pretty awesome regardless
[06:13:04]	<deltab>	I have a book of tactics for playing Space Invaders, Asteroids, and similarly old games. I used to wonder why they had arcane rules like "if the second and third digits of the score are equal, display a bonus: if they are 11, show the running show; if they are 22, ..." etc.
[06:13:35]	<deltab>	now I know it's because it's cheaper than running a PRNG
[06:15:15]	<Twisol>	the player is basically the PRNG
[06:15:22]	<Twisol>	the score being directly affected by their actions
[06:15:51]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	Has anyone been able to get other programs running on the emulator that notch released earlier today, via the puzzle you guys solved?
[06:48:15]	<Twisol>	mappum: I has simplified literal value handling now
[06:48:32]	<mappum>	how so?
[06:48:37]	<Twisol>	there were tons of if (isLiteral()) checks before, and I just rolled them all into get() and set()
[06:49:07]	<mappum>	cool
[06:49:30]	<Twisol>	I made it so literals are flagged with 0x10000, which I think I saw in some pasted code by Notch earlier, and it's actually a lot tidier.
[06:50:05]	<mappum>	hmm, ok
[06:50:24]	<Twisol>	I can leave it in my repo if you want to inspect it more closely.
[06:51:03]	<mappum>	i dont care, as logn as it works and doesnt change the interface with stuff thats already interfacing with it
[06:51:19]	<Twisol>	unless you're using CPU#get() and #set() directly, it shouldn't
[06:51:37]	<mappum>	im not
[06:58:19]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	I ask again, has anyone been able to get other programs running on the emulator that notch released earlier today, via the puzzle you guys solved?
[06:59:29]	<Twisol>	Lord_DeathMatch: this is about when the channel goes quiet, so if nobody pokes you soonish I'd try back later on
[06:59:53]	<migerh_>	notch released an emulator?
[07:00:11]	<Twisol>	sorta
[07:00:13]	<Twisol>	migerh_: http://dcpu.com/highnerd/
[07:00:14]	<scybot>	Twisol: Blecki linked that 3 hours, 21 minutes ago.
[07:00:15]	<mappum>	http://dcpu.com/highnerd/
[07:00:16]	<scybot>	mappum: that url has been posted twice in the past 4 hours by Blecki and Twisol (last linked by Twisol 0 minutes ago).
[07:00:17]	<mappum>	dmanit
[07:00:18]	<Twisol>	:D
[07:00:23]	<Twisol>	.remember highnerd http://dcpu.com/highnerd/
[07:00:23]	<scybot>	Twisol: done.
[07:00:36]	<migerh_>	thx
[07:00:39]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	Righteo; only 3PM in the afternoon, here though :P
[07:00:40]	<Twisol>	no problem
[07:00:53]	<Twisol>	Lord_DeathMatch: yup, just observing.
[07:01:07]	<Twisol>	it's midnight here :)
[07:01:08]	<mappum>	Lord_DeathMatch: where is that?
[07:01:25]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	this is Australian Eastern Standard Time :P +8
[07:01:32]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	woops
[07:01:35]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	Western
[07:01:39]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	silly me
[07:01:40]	<migerh_>	it's 9am here
[07:01:46]	<migerh_>	fells like midnight
[07:01:47]	<Twisol>	exactly opposite US eastern, I suppose
[07:01:50]	<mappum>	12 am for me :/
[07:02:18]	<Twisol>	It's not easy being an international channel. :D
[07:02:18]	<mappum>	(and twisol)
[07:02:19]	<migerh_>	i suppose that's east of me because west would be atlantic ocean
[07:02:37]	<mappum>	Twisol: ikr? I work with a guy in switzerland and a guy in tel aviv
[07:02:44]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	huh. Righteo; though the mem.dmp in the jar seems to be where the code is stored?
[07:02:51]	<Twisol>	Yeah.
[07:03:04]	<Twisol>	if I understand what people talked about earlier, you'd change that to contain your binary
[07:03:17]	<Twisol>	and then re-run (maybe recompile?) the emulator
[07:03:47]	<Twisol>	.down 0x10co.de
[07:03:48]	<scybot>	Twisol: http://0x10co.de seems to be down
[07:03:53]	<Twisol>	mappum: you may want to get on that.
[07:04:40]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	what ive done so far is just copy a new mem.dmp into the jar using winrar, no real results as of yet :( (though this method is a little brute force :P )
[07:04:43]	<mappum>	well shit, its not startng D:
[07:04:44]	<Mortomes|Work>	hordes of 0x10cers want their money back, mappum!
[07:04:56]	<mappum>	D:
[07:04:59]	<mappum>	i'm rebooting
[07:05:00]	* Lord_DeathMatch laughs
[07:05:12]	<Twisol>	^_^
[07:06:30]	<migerh>	.showtells
[07:06:36]	<mappum>	fuck, i guess this is a good time to migrate to the new server
[07:06:42]	<migerh>	right, that was the other one
[07:06:51]	<migerh_>	.showtells
[07:07:11]	<migerh>	?log
[07:07:11]	<scybot>	log http://vps.thomascomputerindustries.com/logs/freenode/0x10c-dev
[07:07:18]	<Twisol>	mappum: any idea what's going on?
[07:07:55]	<mappum>	nope
[07:08:13]	<Twisol>	ick.
[07:13:59]	<migerh>	wait. i'm wrong. 12am is midnight, right?
[07:14:12]	<rmmh>	.wa midnight
[07:14:12]	<Twisol>	eys
[07:14:13]	<scybot>	rmmh: Time difference from now (2:14:11 am): 2 hours 14 minutes 12 seconds ago
[07:14:14]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	yeah, it is
[07:14:15]	<Twisol>	*yes
[07:14:33]	<Twisol>	just pretend 12am == 0am
[07:14:39]	<migerh>	k
[07:14:48]	<startling>	mappum: this is ridiculous. There's no way we'll let you organize 0x10con now!
[07:14:56]	<mappum>	:(
[07:14:56]	<startling>	Twisol: that's how harvest moon does it.
[07:15:04]	<mappum>	im fixing it :(
[07:15:07]	<Twisol>	Well, I can't say I blame them. :D
[07:15:37]	<Twisol>	Wouldn't it be crazy if a convention was organized for a game that wasn't even released? Oh wait.
[07:15:38]	<Twisol>	;P
[07:16:02]	<migerh>	hm, 9 hours west from me is us west coast, right?
[07:16:08]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	mappum: what was the last known server load, out of curiousity?
[07:16:21]	<mappum>	i havent been watching
[07:16:24]	<mappum>	thats not the problem
[07:16:29]	<mappum>	i messed up some network settings
[07:16:39]	<Twisol>	West coast USA is -8
[07:16:40]	<startling>	those are always fun
[07:16:41]	<mappum>	but now im just moving to the new server (which ive been meaning to do)
[07:16:48]	<migerh>	and i'm +1
[07:16:57]	<Twisol>	altogether 9 hours apart
[07:17:35]	<Twisol>	so it's still Monday there?
[07:17:46]	<migerh>	tuesday 9am
[07:17:51]	<Twisol>	hrm
[07:17:54]	<Twisol>	oh, I see
[07:17:55]	<migerh>	+9 ;)
[07:17:56]	<Twisol>	was going the wrong way D:
[07:18:29]	<migerh>	been there once, in mountain view.
[07:18:42]	<mappum>	woot mountian view
[07:18:43]	<Twisol>	Cool.
[07:18:58]	<Twisol>	Sometimes I'm a little upset at all the attention north CA gets. :(
[07:19:12]	<migerh>	fun fact: with an american sim card i could call to germany cheaper than with my german sim card from germany to germany
[07:19:17]	<mappum>	if you cant beat em join em
[07:19:33]	<mappum>	they have computers in north CA
[07:19:34]	<Twisol>	mappum: not when I'm going to college down here, I'm not
[07:19:45]	<mappum>	go to stanford
[07:19:55]	<mappum>	or just drop out
[07:19:56]	<Twisol>	good grief, mountain view is far north
[07:20:05]	<Twisol>	Heh :P
[07:20:08]	<mappum>	im norther
[07:20:22]	<mappum>	any norther and in be in Canada
[07:20:27]	<Twisol>	yeah :P
[07:20:30]	<MostAwesomeDude>	?
[07:20:32]	<Twisol>	Hai.
[07:20:36]	<mappum>	!
[07:20:43]	<MostAwesomeDude>	You're norther than me?
[07:20:56]	<mappum>	yeah dude
[07:20:56]	<Twisol>	.google define:norther
[07:20:57]	<scybot>	Twisol: http://www.norther.net/ -- THE OFFICIAL NORTHER HOMEDEATH: "Due to rough work travels and schedule, Kristian is unable to play the already confirmed shows with us. He has requested some time-off from Norther, so for the ..."
[07:21:02]	<Twisol>	aww, it didn't work
[07:21:10]	<mappum>	.wiki norther
[07:21:10]	<startling>	mappum: isn't there like another couple states up there?
[07:21:10]	<scybot>	mappum: Northern Ireland ( , Ulster Scots: Norlin Airlann or Norlin Airlan) is one of the four countries of the United Kingdom. -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Ireland
[07:21:28]	<MostAwesomeDude>	mappum: Corvallis, north of Eugene. You?
[07:21:40]	<Twisol>	West coast has California, Oregon, and Washington.
[07:21:43]	<mappum>	the middle of buttfuck nowhere, east of Seattle
[07:21:54]	<startling>	oh, i thought you were california. never mind
[07:21:58]	<mappum>	me, MAD, and Twisol are the whole coast
[07:22:03]	<Twisol>	Ahaha.
[07:22:41]	<Twisol>	mappum: You live in the same state that Twilight is set in.
[07:22:44]	<Twisol>	^_^
[07:22:51]	<MostAwesomeDude>	I live in the city where Twilight was filmed. :c
[07:22:54]	<mappum>	:'(
[07:23:03]	<Twisol>	I live -nowhere- related to Twilight.
[07:23:06]	<mappum>	Twisol: you would think of that
[07:23:13]	<MostAwesomeDude>	Although, I grew up near the place where Animal Farm was filmed. Does that make up for it?
[07:23:16]	<Twisol>	My name has nothing to do with that series. :(
[07:23:19]	<mappum>	Twisol: you live in LA, where the companies that produced Twilight are from
[07:23:32]	<Twisol>	Ugggh beaten.
[07:23:41]	<Twisol>	And not quite LA, not even the same county
[07:23:44]	<Twisol>	but close enough I guess
[07:23:47]	<mappum>	people from CA in OR pretending to be in WA
[07:23:48]	<startling>	i live in a town the unabomber lived in!
[07:24:08]	<mappum>	startling: :P
[07:24:10]	<startling>	there are books in my library dedicated to him. no joke
[07:24:26]	<Twisol>	startling: got the Necronomicon?
[07:24:57]	<Twisol>	yeah, look, don't even ask me how I make these weird connections :P
[07:25:17]	<startling>	Twisol: I tried reading it once a while back. I couldn't get into it and sold it to this crazy middle eastern dude.
[07:25:42]	<Twisol>	There is a reference I'm missing here. :(
[07:25:52]	<startling>	:)
[07:27:08]	<mappum>	database, TRANSFER FASTER
[07:27:14]	<mappum>	it's only like 200m
[07:27:19]	<mappum>	and nothing ever been deleted
[07:27:29]	<mappum>	but considering its only text, i guess thats a little impressive
[07:28:04]	<Twisol>	mappum: I'm slightly worried about how long it will take to flush the DNS cache.
[07:28:05]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	ahh crap. i think the construction workers just took out the power cable. thank god for laptops and UPS's
[07:28:10]	<mappum>	Twisol: i know
[07:28:22]	<mappum>	i'll try to get a redirect up on the old server
[07:28:33]	<mappum>	if i can get it to serve stuff at all :/
[07:28:38]	<Twisol>	*nod*
[07:28:49]	<Twisol>	er
[07:28:55]	<Twisol>	a redirect to where exactly? :S
[07:29:10]	<Twisol>	the plain IP?
[07:29:15]	<mappum>	yeah
[07:29:20]	<Twisol>	eeuergh, but okay.
[07:29:27]	<Twisol>	no chance of using nginx to proxy to the new server?
[07:29:40]	<mappum>	i already updated the NS record
[07:29:43]	<mappum>	i guess i could
[07:31:37]	<Rick>	also mappum idk how server intensive this would be but you should probably autodelete invalid programs after a few hours
[07:31:46]	<Rick>	ie ones that fail to assemble
[07:31:47]	<mappum>	yeah i will
[07:31:56]	<mappum>	i have tons of CPU on the new server, so thatll be fine
[07:32:02]	<mappum>	hex core :D
[07:32:06]	<Twisol>	that should be easy to do, actually, since dcpu16.js works on both sides...
[07:32:13]	<Twisol>	Oh, speaking of which
[07:32:43]	<Twisol>	mappum: Thinking of splitting up dcpu16.js and supporting Browserify for front-end. Thoughts?
[07:32:54]	<mappum>	i dont even know what it is
[07:33:03]	<Twisol>	essentially client-side require
[07:33:10]	<mappum>	oh, right
[07:33:20]	<Twisol>	you bundle your packages server-side, and serve them as a single file
[07:33:25]	<Twisol>	which exposes require() to the browser environemtn
[07:33:56]	<Twisol>	It's been pretty great in my experience.
[07:33:58]	<mappum>	i dont like giving people more dependencies
[07:34:07]	<mappum>	and it's already a small enough API to be easy
[07:34:14]	<mappum>	but possibly
[07:34:36]	<mappum>	or do they not need another script to get require
[07:34:39]	<Twisol>	Yeah. I don't think it's a big issue, but I don't like dealing with big files
[07:34:41]	<mappum>	would that be built into dcpu16.js
[07:34:50]	<Twisol>	Well, lets put it this way
[07:35:25]	<Twisol>	it's sort of like what npm does for the server. You use browserify to bundle whatever dependencies you want, and at that point your bundle has no extra dependencies.
[07:35:28]	<Twisol>	so it can be served on its own
[07:35:58]	<Twisol>	What people -would- need browserify for is to bundle dcpu16.js, together with whatever other packages they want.
[07:36:29]	<Twisol>	no reason a dcpu16-only bundle couldn't be produced for them, I suppose.
[07:39:14]	* hachque reads back
[07:39:27]	<hachque>	mappum: server transfer? o_o
[07:39:38]	<mappum>	yeah
[07:40:04]	<hachque>	too much traffic? :D
[07:44:14]	<mappum>	well it worked, now we just wait for the NS to update
[07:44:14]	<mappum>	http://199.26.85.31/
[07:45:02]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	hurruh!
[07:45:10]	<Twisol>	NS?
[07:45:17]	<Twisol>	so you switched nameservers too?
[07:45:34]	<mappum>	no
[07:45:39]	<mappum>	just updated the record
[07:45:54]	<Twisol>	wouldn't that be an A record then?
[07:46:17]	<mappum>	yeah
[07:46:35]	<migerh>	already working here :)
[07:46:38]	<mappum>	we're just waiting for ISPs and stuff to get the new IP
[07:46:41]	<mappum>	sweet
[07:47:39]	<migerh>	surprisingly. the NS of my university is usually the last one who gets any dns update...
[07:49:11]	<Twisol>	I'm using Google's DNS... looks like it'll be a while, according to dig.
[07:50:53]	<mappum>	it could be a day or two for some people D:
[07:51:04]	<mappum>	.down 0x10co.de
[07:51:04]	<scybot>	mappum: http://0x10co.de seems to be up
[07:51:09]	<mappum>	:P
[07:51:39]	<mappum>	and now i have a backup of the db on separate hardware
[07:51:52]	<Twisol>	hmm
[07:52:09]	<Twisol>	nevermind, I am -not- using Google's DNS. Must've changed it back.
[07:52:18]	<migerh>	the reverse proxy twisol suggested would be a good solution then
[07:53:13]	<mappum>	well that server is being shitty
[07:53:31]	<mappum>	it runs minecraft but not http >:/
[07:53:58]	<Twisol>	Hah.
[07:54:28]	<mappum>	i had the server off for a while and all my players were sad :(
[07:54:49]	<Twisol>	at least you know they enjoy your server :P
[07:54:58]	<mappum>	the ones that dont grief it
[07:55:06]	<mappum>	it's basically just anarchy
[07:55:07]	<Twisol>	we don't care about those
[07:55:09]	<Twisol>	:D
[07:55:25]	<mappum>	once we had like 30+ people from the UK grief it
[07:55:28]	<mappum>	we saw on the logs
[07:56:15]	<Twisol>	mappum: out of curiosity, how attached are you to how the gh-pages emulator works/looks?
[07:56:25]	<Twisol>	since you have 0x10co.de now and all
[07:56:26]	<mappum>	i'm not
[07:56:31]	<mappum>	do whatever you want
[07:56:34]	<Twisol>	kk!
[07:56:43]	<mappum>	but i feel like its a waste of time to work on that
[07:56:55]	<Twisol>	Mostly I'd be tearing stuff out, not improving it. >_>
[07:57:02]	<mappum>	i c
[07:57:04]	<Twisol>	Making it more of a test thing
[07:57:09]	<mappum>	gotcha
[07:57:25]	<Twisol>	like for example, a stdout. :D
[07:57:34]	<Twisol>	something I can just dump characters into without worrying about display
[07:57:51]	<Twisol>	*adding a stdout
[07:58:14]	<mappum>	hah, that IO was so early. looking back on when i made that, it feels like such a long time ago
[07:58:23]	<mappum>	it was before i hung out in IRC
[07:58:29]	<Twisol>	*nod*
[07:58:31]	<mappum>	and I was just bored and done with the emu
[07:58:34]	<Twisol>	lol.
[07:58:46]	<Twisol>	still bored? :D
[07:58:47]	<mappum>	back in the days when i instantly fixed each issue reported on github...
[07:59:02]	<mappum>	now theres too many things to fix that i dont fix anything
[07:59:07]	<Twisol>	Hah. issue != bug, and what we have now isn't exactly critical. S'fine.
[07:59:16]	<mappum>	true
[07:59:23]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	mappum: when you view the forks of a particular program, the title image path gets messed up
[07:59:26]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	ie, http://199.26.85.31/forks/lqnit
[07:59:56]	<mappum>	Lord_DeathMatch: thanks
[08:00:03]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	welcome :)
[08:00:24]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	ups is running, out, goodbye
[08:00:32]	<mappum>	stay fresh
[08:00:38]	<mappum>	it's like an 0x10c ship D:
[08:00:59]	<Twisol>	What is?
[08:01:07]	<mappum>	running on limited power
[08:01:09]	<Twisol>	oh :D
[08:02:30]	<startling>	ls
[08:02:35]	<startling>	oh right
[08:02:44]	<Twisol>	XD
[08:03:02]	<mappum>	this isnt a console
[08:03:13]	<mappum>	sudo rm -Rf /
[08:03:29]	<Twisol>	> Please enter your password:
[08:03:37]	<startling>	Delete the files in \? [y/N]
[08:03:44]	<startling>	er
[08:03:45]	<mappum>	my hand went to the key where my passwor dis by instinct
[08:03:52]	<Twisol>	hunter2
[08:03:59]	<mappum>	startling: i used -f which is force, it wouldnt ask me that
[08:04:00]	<startling>	heh
[08:04:02]	<migerh>	mappum, the logo is broken in this fork list
[08:04:13]	<startling>	mappum: some shells ignore it
[08:04:14]	<migerh>	maybe prepending a "/" would work?
[08:04:14]	<mappum>	migerh: someone just reported that :P thanks though
[08:04:17]	<migerh>	k
[08:04:37]	<mappum>	migerh: yeah, thats what i need to do
[08:04:52]	<Twisol>	mappum: I'm looking into browserify for dcpu16. All you'd need to do for 0x10co.de is add dcpu16 to the package.json and add a .use(browserify()) line to your app.js
[08:05:09]	<Twisol>	and naturally probably change the src of a <script>...
[08:05:25]	<Twisol>	...oh, and require() it. I forget these things because they're simple :P
[08:07:42]	<mappum>	frakkin nameservers
[08:21:44]	<mappum>	errbody should do ludum dare this weekend
[08:21:47]	<mappum>	ERRBODY
[08:24:56]	<Twisol>	What -is- Ludum Dare?
[08:26:34]	<mappum>	you have 48 hours to make a game
[08:26:52]	<mappum>	you have to make everything you use (you're allowed to use open source code from before, though)
[08:26:53]	<Twisol>	I've never made a game ;(
[08:26:56]	<mappum>	D:
[08:27:08]	<Twisol>	Does it have to be graphical? I'm good with MUDs.
[08:27:13]	<Twisol>	^_^;
[08:27:18]	<mappum>	nope, do whatever you want
[08:27:25]	<Twisol>	Hmm.
[08:27:29]	<mappum>	notch was a big member of the ludum dare community before minecraft
[08:27:36]	<mappum>	Blecki is from there, too
[08:27:37]	<Twisol>	So I've heard.
[08:27:38]	<Twisol>	Neat.
[08:27:47]	<mappum>	ludumdare.com/compo/
[08:27:51]	<mappum>	you should do it :P
[08:27:54]	<mappum>	http://ludumdare.com/compo/
[08:28:42]	<Twisol>	yeah, reading
[08:28:48]	<Twisol>	I see a "jam" thing there too
[08:29:11]	<Lerc>	I'm a Ludumdarer also http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/author/lerc/
[08:30:11]	<Twisol>	Hmmm. So by "open source libraries", that means that I could use Node.js and use almost any npm module out there?
[08:30:22]	<Twisol>	wait
[08:30:25]	<Twisol>	"publically available"
[08:30:29]	<Twisol>	but comes to the same question
[08:31:38]	<mappum>	they don't investigate whether or not you're cheating, people just don't cheat
[08:31:43]	<mappum>	theres no prize or anything
[08:31:50]	<mappum>	just the joy and respect of winning
[08:32:06]	<Lerc>	It's a personal challenge more than anything.
[08:32:11]	<mappum>	yeah
[08:32:28]	<Twisol>	*nod*
[08:32:32]	<mappum>	im warming up my music-making skills :P http://mappum.com/ld48.mp3
[08:34:04]	<Twisol>	Nice.
[08:34:13]	<mappum>	tons of people on 0x10code and its not even working for me >:/
[08:34:22]	<Twisol>	how many is "tons"?
[08:34:27]	<Twisol>	up from "40"?
[08:34:45]	<mappum>	it is 40
[08:34:48]	<Lerc>	Ludum dare was much smaller before Notch went and got himself famous,
[08:34:49]	<mappum>	all on minesweeper
[08:35:00]	<Twisol>	Haha. Never knew minesweeper was so popular.
[08:35:05]	<Twisol>	Quick, someone write Freecell!
[08:35:12]	<mappum>	:P
[08:35:15]	<mappum>	this isnt microsoft
[08:36:36]	<mappum>	many of them are coming from some russian forum
[08:36:43]	<mappum>	http://habrahabr.ru/post/142211/
[08:40:15]	<startling>	I may do ludum dare next weekend also
[08:40:35]	<Hourd>	its next weekend?
[08:41:49]	<Twisol>	this weekend, no?
[08:42:02]	<startling>	oh right it's tuesday
[08:42:06]	<startling>	yes, this weekend
[08:42:23]	<Hourd>	damn
[08:44:42]	<mappum>	its suuuuper fun
[08:44:56]	<mappum>	but really rough
[08:45:08]	<mappum>	gotta take mini naps
[08:45:15]	<mappum>	drink lotsa caffeine
[08:45:33]	<startling>	I might actually write a js thing. gui work in anything else is painful
[08:45:44]	<mappum>	we have converted you
[08:45:52]	<mappum>	yes, strike me down
[08:45:57]	<mappum>	use your anger
[08:45:58]	<mappum>	it makes you stronger
[08:46:24]	<Twisol>	startling: that's exactly why I was writing a MUD client in the browser
[08:46:40]	<Twisol>	the client I was using was... well, great for what's out there, but not really as good as I wanted :P
[08:50:19]	<startling>	mappum: heh. i like js as a language, I just don't use it much
[08:50:32]	<startling>	I tried writing a game a while back but it got shelved
[08:50:38]	<mappum>	i c
[08:50:49]	<mappum>	well canvas is pretty damn fast
[08:50:54]	<startling>	mhm
[08:51:01]	<mappum>	and easy
[08:51:09]	<mappum>	adn there are 3d libraries for it (and webgl)
[08:51:13]	<startling>	the idea was to keep levels as json in Gist and have people forking them
[08:51:18]	<startling>	I'm still fond of that idea
[08:51:31]	<mappum>	http://mrdoob.github.com/three.js/examples/webgl_geometry_minecraft_ao.html
[08:52:20]	<mappum>	startling: thats a cool idea
[08:53:06]	<Twisol>	mappum: Okay, node-ification of dcpu16 is basically done. I also added myself as a contributor to package.json, hope you don't mind that :P
[08:53:25]	<mappum>	sweet deal
[08:53:28]	<Twisol>	haven't pushed it into your repo yet
[08:53:36]	<mappum>	ok
[08:53:39]	<mappum>	im gonna go to bed
[08:53:42]	<Twisol>	okay
[08:53:46]	<Twisol>	mind checking it out in the morning?
[08:53:51]	<mappum>	ill merge it tomorrow
[08:53:52]	<mappum>	ya
[08:53:52]	<Twisol>	I don't want to merge it in without another set of eyes
[08:53:53]	<Twisol>	kk
[08:54:00]	<Twisol>	g'night
[08:54:07]	<startling>	me too. goodnight
[08:54:11]	<mappum>	well i never notce problems until post-merge
[08:54:21]	<mappum>	stay fresh
[08:58:32]	<OBudista>	Twisol does it allow for relative jumps?
[08:59:45]	<Twisol>	OBudista: the emulator?
[08:59:52]	<Twisol>	do you mean using SUB/ADD PC?
[09:10:33]	<noodlekraft>	?projects
[09:10:33]	<scybot>	projects http://www.0xwiki.com/w/index.php?title=Project_List http://0x10cwiki.com/wiki/Developer_Tools
[09:11:21]	<OBudista>	why won't a shrimp share?
[10:18:27]	<_notch>	oh look at that
[10:18:34]	<shamanas>	Hey, does anybody have any resources for getting into emulation?
[10:21:16]	<_notch>	I verified this being me on twitter
[10:21:45]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	oh. wow. hi
[10:21:49]	<shamanas>	:D
[10:21:50]	<shamanas>	cool
[10:21:57]	<_notch>	hi!
[10:22:29]	<_notch>	I'm going to implement all the changes I got linked to on github, and add some kind of interrupt support. Probably both hardware and software interrupts
[10:22:53]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	erm... is there any easier way of giving the emulator you released today a program to run, other than copying it into the jar?
[10:23:13]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	also, im honoured
[10:23:16]	<_notch>	yeah, unzip the jar and run it from a directory with a batch file
[10:23:20]	<shamanas>	thats the most amount of community interaction i have ever seen from a game developer :D
[10:24:05]	<_notch>	:D
[10:24:08]	<Rick>	D:
[10:24:09]	<Qata>	:D
[10:24:12]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	seconded
[10:24:13]	<lifthrasiir>	_notch: hello there!
[10:24:24]	<Jerub>	_notch: it would be nice if your cpu spec explicitly defined what operations are signed and unsigned :)
[10:24:27]	<_notch>	I would've done more, but I was sooooo deeply in code before, and now I'm kinda busy with other stuff for a few dats
[10:24:33]	<hachque>	o_o
[10:24:44]	<_notch>	they're all supposed to be unsigned, but with wrap-around
[10:24:57]	<_notch>	so adding 0xffff is the same as subtracting 1
[10:25:05]	<hachque>	oh it is the real notch ^_^
[10:25:06]	<_notch>	but I think there are a few bugs in the wraparounding
[10:25:24]	<Rick>	swank
[10:25:32]	<xorinzor>	hi guys
[10:25:37]	<Qata>	hachque: Yeah he just tweeted that he was on here, so there'll be an influx in a second.
[10:25:41]	<hachque>	hehe, visited #0x10c-dcpu before I see :D
[10:25:44]	<Rick>	:v:
[10:25:51]	<xorinzor>	hachque: yep :P
[10:25:53]	<Jerub>	_notch: also, defining your hardware interfaces would be nice. i want to write a testing framework for development
[10:25:56]	<ar>	omg, Notch?
[10:26:04]	<Rick>	o-m-g
[10:26:04]	<_notch>	I didn't even mention the server it's on haha
[10:26:05]	<Rick>	HEH
[10:26:15]	<_notch>	yeah, I will document the hardware stuff
[10:26:19]	<Jerub>	great.
[10:26:20]	<xorinzor>	_notch: using google isnt too hard ;)
[10:26:35]	<hachque>	haha, so many people are joining #0x10c-dcpu... and then leaving :(
[10:26:36]	<_notch>	I will also make it all memorymappable in runtime, so you'll have to ask what hardware is connected and map it manually from within the program
[10:26:37]	<Ste_>	I used my Notch sense to find you.
[10:26:43]	<hachque>	_notch: :D
[10:26:49]	<Rick>	is that channel a thing?
[10:26:51]	<ar>	_notch: btw, why didn't you stick with the 6502 you tried to use before?
[10:26:52]	<Rick>	first i've heard of it
[10:26:53]	<_notch>	as a fun side effect, that will allow you to do double buffering with the monitor
[10:27:05]	<Jerub>	_notch: :D
[10:27:12]	<_notch>	6502 was too slow to emulate in java because of all the unsigned bytes. java only has signed bytes
[10:27:26]	<hachque>	_notch: re memory mappable hardware, I was actually going to write an RFC for suggesting that, but it seems you're already going to do it :D
[10:27:27]	<jtauber>	ar: the DCPU-16 has a much nicer, orthogonal instruction set than the 6502 too :-)
[10:27:37]	<_notch>	I'd LOVE suggestions
[10:27:40]	* Lord_DeathMatch is beyond words
[10:27:42]	<jtauber>	i've only written two emulators in my life: 6502 and DCPU-16 and the latter was much easier :-)
[10:28:15]	<hachque>	_notch: I think you should probably have like, at 0x8000 a smaller memory area which indicates <type> <position> <param1> <param2>
[10:28:21]	<hachque>	which repeats for I dunno, some limit
[10:28:35]	<hachque>	that way you could have 1 0x9000 60 60
[10:28:38]	<hachque>	and have a 60x60 screen
[10:28:45]	<hachque>	(as an example for what the parameters could be used for)
[10:29:05]	<hachque>	of course, that area would be read-only because it tells what hardware is available; writing to it doesn't affect anything ;)
[10:29:26]	<jtauber>	_notch: are you basing the memory mappable hardware off any particular machine from the 70s/80s? (I'm only familiar with how the Apple II did stuff)
[10:29:45]	<_notch>	well, it's kinda inspired by text mode cga
[10:30:17]	<hachque>	_notch: did you see Lerc's graphics mode 1 at all?
[10:30:28]	<_notch>	it's 128 pixels wide for aesthetic reasons (still looks somewhat readable at a distance in the game), and it fits in a 2^n texture.
[10:30:43]	<_notch>	I saw the game of life stuff
[10:30:46]	<hachque>	I thought it was a really interesting way of giving more access than just ASCII characters (I'm not familar with CGA to be honest)
[10:30:50]	<Lerc>	mrph?
[10:31:06]	<_notch>	I intentionally made it not possible to do full per pixel stuff, haha. I love limitations like that
[10:31:08]	<hachque>	Lerc: what's that link to the graphics mode 1 spec (image)?
[10:31:09]	<Lerc>	http://fingswotidun.com/dcpu16/pac.html
[10:31:10]	<Rick>	oh they mean a custom system
[10:31:13]	<Rick>	yeah that
[10:31:18]	<_notch>	when the sprites are in, you can cover even more area with unique pixels
[10:31:31]	<Lerc>	http://fingswotidun.com/dcpu16/GraphicsMode1.png
[10:31:32]	<WooKi>	?projects
[10:31:32]	<scybot>	projects http://www.0xwiki.com/w/index.php?title=Project_List http://0x10cwiki.com/wiki/Developer_Tools
[10:31:33]	<jtauber>	_notch: what about other hardware? the Apple II had the notion of hardware slots that each had 256 bytes of soft switches mapped to region in 0xC000, for example
[10:31:42]	<ar>	_notch: also, have you fixed the shaders, where you passed 4 arguments instead of 3 (which kinda works with nvidia drivers, but meh)
[10:31:59]	<Rick>	I doubt notch cares about non-dev hardware atm
[10:32:11]	<xorinzor>	so many people :o
[10:32:18]	* Hjax heard that notch was visiting our irc channel
[10:32:23]	<_notch>	No, I haven't worked on making the shaders correct yet. I'm just toying around with the look still
[10:32:37]	<Hjax>	Hi notch_ :D
[10:32:56]	<_notch>	Going to eventually rewrite the cube shadow maps to not use cubemaps, too. those require very modern shader support
[10:33:10]	<_notch>	Or, well, 1.5 year old.. But that's VERY new on laptops
[10:33:11]	<hachque>	_notch: maybe I misunderstood the tweet, but did you mention a few days that you wanted to have different versions of the DCPU supporting different hardware features or something like that?
[10:33:29]	<xorinzor>	_notch you mean from the graphics card?
[10:33:38]	<_notch>	The plan is if I ever update the DCPU, it will be new cpus in the game as well
[10:33:43]	<_notch>	so old stuff won't change, you'll have to upgrade the cpu
[10:33:45]	<Rick>	_notch: I believe a few people were wtf'ing at your use of immediate mode + shaders :p
[10:33:55]	<qFox>	they were
[10:33:56]	<_notch>	I'm not using immediate mode.
[10:34:18]	<_notch>	I have my own wrapper that looks like immediate mode, but builds array lists or vbos in the background
[10:34:31]	<_notch>	so the number of gl calls are very few
[10:34:36]	<hachque>	_notch that could be one way of offering more fine pixel control without immediately making it available to people; my concern lies with making non-text-based games ;D
[10:35:03]	<_notch>	the nes also has tiles and sprites, you'll be fine. :)
[10:35:26]	<Rick>	I think the only limitation atm with tiles is coloring, other than that the system is fine
[10:35:30]	<spasm>	pfft, per pixel graphics... roguelikes ftw
[10:35:47]	<qFox>	_notch: can you tell when you're ready to release a new dcpu spec? maybe some specs for how you plan the memory map, io, and such?
[10:35:48]	<hachque>	spasm: quick! port libtcod to DCPU :D :D
[10:35:52]	<spasm>	:D
[10:35:55]	<Rick>	shudder
[10:36:00]	<Shadikka>	hachque: :D
[10:36:00]	<_notch>	hah, the spectrum had two colors per tile as well, and nobody complained back then. ;D
[10:36:02]	<_notch>	(ok, they did)
[10:36:15]	<jtauber>	haha
[10:36:16]	<Rick>	I don't know, I'm not that old :)
[10:36:54]	<FCatalan>	it was awful when to sprites were close and the colors sorta bled from one to the pther
[10:37:02]	<Lerc>	_notch: I sort of modeld my mode on spectrum. Just smaller cells and a tweak to make them fit nicely into 16 bits.
[10:37:03]	<jtauber>	_notch: the Apple II had crazy limitations on hi-res colour which made emulation a lot of fun :-0
[10:37:14]	<Qata>	_notch: Phosphorous green and black? Please say yes.
[10:37:29]	<jtauber>	with burn in :-)
[10:37:35]	<Qata>	Aw yeah.
[10:37:37]	<_notch>	I am considering doing burn in! :D
[10:37:38]	<Shadikka>	Simulated burn-in <3
[10:37:39]	<FireFly>	I really like the fact that direct per-pixel access isn't available
[10:37:45]	<_notch>	but that takes away from the clean polygon look
[10:37:46]	<jtauber>	_notch: that'd be awesome
[10:37:47]	<Rick>	FireFly: sure there is
[10:38:13]	<FireFly>	Rick, hm?
[10:38:19]	<coral_>	twitter storm
[10:38:20]	<jtauber>	_notch: support different monitors? the cheap ones have burn in?
[10:38:21]	<FCatalan>	jordan mechner just uploaded the prince of persia sources to github, go port it someone!
[10:38:25]	<hachque>	_notch: random thought, what about making it so that the burn in doesn't smoothly fade away?
[10:38:56]	<hachque>	maybe that might keep the clean polygon look if the pixels don't fade, but kind of, the burn disappears in steps
[10:38:57]	<Jerub>	monitor? we don't need no stinking glass terminal. The only I/O should be a tape printer and the ship's thrusters.
[10:38:59]	<spasm>	_notch: scrap the whole project, people clearly want a burn-in simulator
[10:39:11]	<Rick>	FireFly: make your pixels big, or go with 64x64 display? :p
[10:39:21]	<jtauber>	spasm: haha
[10:39:31]	<Mozzfly>	Cheers to the guy who figured out the puzzle.
[10:39:40]	<FireFly>	Rick, even with 64x64 you're still limited to two colours per "actual characters" though
[10:39:41]	<Rick>	that was rmmh + ymgve + few others
[10:39:50]	<FireFly>	I like the limitations, is all
[10:39:53]	<Rick>	oh sure
[10:40:23]	<Rick>	mappum what's the new IP for co.de
[10:40:24]	<Rick>	>:|
[10:40:42]	<FCatalan>	my own javascript emulator has a dirty glass overlay, scanlines, fuzzy trembling characters, the whole retro thing. very immersive
[10:40:56]	<spasm>	199.26.85.31
[10:40:58]	<spasm>	afaik
[10:41:03]	<Rick>	spasm: thanks
[10:41:10]	<hachque>	haha oh my god: http://0x10co.de/ufm9w
[10:41:18]	<hachque>	that is amazing
[10:41:19]	<Hjax>	spasm beat me to it, Rick you can just ping the address to get the IP
[10:41:37]	<Rick>	Hjax: no, my DNS is still out of date
[10:41:39]	<Rick>	that's why I asked
[10:41:46]	<lifthrasiir>	hachque: fuel 65535? XD
[10:41:49]	<Hjax>	Rick: ah
[10:41:53]	<spasm>	I figured thats why you wanted it
[10:41:58]	<hachque>	haha
[10:42:10]	<Rick>	too lazy to query a nameserver
[10:42:41]	<Hjax>	hachque: that game doesnt have obsticles come towards you and when you run out of fuel it goes to 0xFFFF :P
[10:42:42]	<Rick>	nice @ fuel wraparound
[10:42:56]	<Rick>	at least you know big values render properly
[10:43:02]	* Hjax high fives Rick
[10:43:18]	<hachque>	Hjax: yeah I realised, I just saw pretty trees and and stuff and got excited :D
[10:43:29]	<Hjax>	hachque: it is awesome :D
[10:43:50]	<noisse>	from twytter
[10:43:51]	<STenyaK>	_notch: sprites? just wait for someone to port aalib to DCPU16 :-)
[10:44:31]	<Hjax>	_notch: your sheer presence here is causing the channel to grow larger
[10:44:40]	<doppel>	hello.
[10:44:41]	<Rick>	well naturally
[10:44:53]	<Rick>	STenyaK: http://0x10co.de/hprhb
[10:44:57]	<Hjax>	i find it amusing :P
[10:44:58]	<doppel>	being an assembly programmer myself, i was drawn here.
[10:45:05]	<WillWill56>	Well, hello!
[10:45:13]	<Hjax>	Ive been coming here for about a week
[10:45:16]	<_19th>	hey everybody !
[10:45:17]	<slvr2>	There are probably alread a million emulators, but: http://i.imgur.com/7nv6J.png (Incorrect colours and stuff, but still.)
[10:45:32]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Are you even working on 0x10c atm, or are you still on vacation?
[10:45:33]	<WillWill56>	Cool, I kinda just rushed here cause Notch said he was here :P
[10:45:53]	<shamanas>	I wanna make an emulator (in ooc) too
[10:46:00]	<shamanas>	but I dont know where to start
[10:46:02]	<_19th>	i think _notch on vacation
[10:46:07]	<Hjax>	Rick: that is amazing
[10:46:10]	<shamanas>	never wrote anything of this kind . . .
[10:46:30]	<hachque>	Rick: oh wow
[10:46:53]	<Shadikka>	shamanas: I'd start at making a DASM parser. :) But that's up to you.
[10:47:41]	<shamanas>	Shadikka: I have wrote a couple of compilers and interpreters so I'm not really interested in building an assembler... Just want to write the emulator part
[10:47:42]	<jtauber>	actually, a disassembler can be a good way to start
[10:48:22]	<jtauber>	if you start with a disassembler, you'll be able to reuse most of the code in your emulator
[10:48:25]	<_19th>	minesweeper is really cool!
[10:48:37]	<hachque>	shamanas: just grab an existing assembler then; there's tons on the project page
[10:48:40]	<doppel>	i've been pondering lately about writing some crossassembler...
[10:48:47]	<WillWill56>	So yeah, I'm not gonna pretend I know anything about what's being discussed in this channel... I can barely program... but it sounds interesting. How much experience do people have with this stuff?
[10:48:56]	<Fugiman>	jtauber, other way around is better. Write an emulator than add disassembly ;)
[10:49:02]	<doppel>	with assembly stuff?
[10:49:18]	<WillWill56>	Oh, I guess.
[10:49:19]	<Hjax>	WillWill56: i think most of us knew a programming language or two before we came here
[10:49:22]	<Rick>	almost 15 years? (I got started with z80 :)
[10:49:29]	<jtauber>	Fugiman: well, a disassembler is trivial once you have the emulator
[10:49:35]	<AlexLeporiday>	Assembly (For DCPU-16) is far more simple than a lot of others but there are still some neat tricks it can do. :P
[10:49:38]	<Shadikka>	shamanas: Ah. Sorry, my bad. :) I'd probably start an emulator by making the actual CPU class/whatever
[10:49:53]	<WillWill56>	Rick: Wow, awesome.
[10:49:54]	<doppel>	well, i've been messing with 2600 and nes coding for years
[10:50:05]	<doppel>	also studying z80
[10:50:10]	<_notch>	brb
[10:50:15]	<jtauber>	WillWill56: 30 years; but haven't had this much fun with assemblers since the 80s :-)
[10:50:16]	<Hjax>	this is my first thing i did with assembly but i program in python
[10:50:17]	<Hjax>	gtg
[10:50:27]	<Rick>	admittedly my z80 experience came from TI calculators
[10:51:08]	<_19th>	in university i was learning RISC-16
[10:51:35]	<_19th>	it was cool stuff
[10:51:38]	<Shadikka>	jtauber: Dunno, I've had some fun with MIPS and ARM stuff :)
[10:51:44]	<shamanas>	So the CPU should basically be a representation of the stack, then i just run the program tick by tick and change the values of the stack, then use those for the graphical representation and more generall I/O
[10:51:56]	<doppel>	i also like to reverse-engineer stuff sometimes
[10:52:05]	<hachque>	shamanas: check the spec; the whole thing is just one big contigious chunk of memory
[10:52:36]	<WillWill56>	I didn't grow up with programming :/ and I wish I did.
[10:52:36]	<jtauber>	shamanas: you don't need to implement the stack explicitly
[10:52:39]	<hachque>	hint http://hastebin.com/fatiladopu.avras
[10:52:42]	<hachque>	:D
[10:53:02]	<jtauber>	shamanas: just have the memory and the stack is part of that (from 0xFFFF down to SP)
[10:53:09]	<_19th>	WillWill56: I think the same about myself :D
[10:53:12]	<FCatalan>	shamanas: the cpu is just a couple of arrays, the emulator basically a switch/case statement over the instruction set
[10:53:15]	<shamanas>	hachque: oh thanks
[10:53:18]	<entrusC>	Hi everyone!
[10:53:21]	<_19th>	hey
[10:53:32]	<shamanas>	thanks everyone this should be enough to get me started :D
[10:53:43]	<derinerkan_>	i learned a little c but now i'm learning assembly just for DCPU :P
[10:53:56]	<doppel>	the dcpu spec doesn't define the computer
[10:54:17]	<WillWill56>	:O as in for Notch's emulated CPU?
[10:54:18]	<derinerkan_>	it does define the bit of computer we have right now
[10:54:19]	<doppel>	i.e. memory, i/o, etc
[10:54:34]	<doppel>	yeah the cpu
[10:54:48]	<derinerkan_>	it does describe memory... or do you mean like an EPROM?
[10:54:51]	<entrusC>	so this is all about the emulated CPU from notch's most recent game?
[10:55:08]	<hachque>	entrusC: yup
[10:55:16]	<shamanas>	well I see it as an opportunity to get into emulation
[10:55:25]	<shamanas>	and assembly
[10:55:27]	<jtauber>	shamanas: yeah, it's a great way to do it
[10:55:28]	<Jerub>	notch was just saying that all hardware will be mmapable in runtime, so you can map devices into memory you select and stuff.
[10:55:56]	<migerh>	?cat
[10:55:57]	<scybot>	cat http://0x10co.de/ot84o
[10:56:00]	<derinerkan_>	why not leave like hardware "pins" that hardware can be hooked up to, and put the pin states in specific addresses?
[10:56:09]	<STenyaK>	is there any compiler in progress for DCPU16? (as in, a backend for GCC, or whatever)
[10:56:29]	<Shadikka>	LLVM target, yes
[10:56:30]	<jtauber>	STenyaK: there's an llvm backend
[10:56:45]	<Shadikka>	?llvm
[10:56:45]	<migerh>	STenyaK, many, actually
[10:56:45]	<scybot>	llvm https://github.com/DylanLukes/DCPU16-LLVM-Target and https://github.com/krasin/llvm-dcpu16/
[10:56:46]	<hachque>	STenayK: there are also non-LLVM based backends :P
[10:56:48]	<derinerkan_>	so that for example, toggling memory address 0x10 would toggle the output that goes to 0x10
[10:56:53]	<migerh>	?projects
[10:56:53]	<scybot>	projects http://www.0xwiki.com/w/index.php?title=Project_List http://0x10cwiki.com/wiki/Developer_Tools
[10:57:23]	<hachque>	if you don't want LLVM
[10:57:28]	<hachque>	then there's
[10:57:29]	<hachque>	?dcputoolchain
[10:57:30]	<scybot>	dcputoolchain http://dcputoolcha.in/
[10:57:58]	<FCatalan>	hellige: I'm toying with your forth right now
[10:58:09]	<entrusC>	is there any os available yet for the dcpu-16? I saw something C64 like in notch's game ...
[10:58:13]	<migerh>	hachque, you moved to cmake?
[10:58:23]	<deltab>	if start-of-screen in particular is software-controllable, we can do hardware scrolling (or debug visualization)
[10:58:27]	<derinerkan_>	entrus i think that's just printing some text on the screen
[10:58:30]	<hachque>	migerh: actually just finishing up the cmake stuff now
[10:58:34]	<derinerkan_>	i think it might be a text only screen
[10:58:38]	<jtauber>	FCatalan: hellige oh nice; I'll have to check it out; I'd made a start but will be fun to see how others did it
[10:58:39]	<kierenj>	hey guys
[10:58:40]	<Jerub>	derinerkan_: I'm interested in what you're saying, and I admire the simplicity of the concept, but I would assert there are problems with that design, for instance upgrading your hardware would require recompiling your code to avoid addresses it was previously using as scratch space.
[10:58:40]	<hachque>	Cr8 made a few changes which made it Linux only haha
[10:58:55]	<derinerkan_>	there is a problem like that
[10:58:56]	<Jerub>	derinerkan_: and the idea of being able to elect where devices are mapped into memory would enable better engineering.
[10:58:59]	<migerh>	hachque, nice! gotta test it some time soon, then
[10:59:01]	<entrusC>	i see
[10:59:01]	<hachque>	?0x42c
[10:59:01]	<scybot>	0x42c https://github.com/jdiez17/0x42c
[10:59:04]	<hachque>	entrusC: ^^
[10:59:08]	<derinerkan_>	yeah jerub i agree on that
[10:59:11]	<STenyaK>	ok, thanks all
[10:59:22]	<hachque>	migerh: I should have a proper CMake set up done in an hour
[10:59:38]	<FCatalan>	jtauber: I had started porting jonesforth, was going slowly, then found helliges working version and was a bit bummed
[10:59:48]	<hachque>	migreh: I also want to get 0x42c building under CMake as well
[10:59:50]	<jtauber>	FCatalan: I was porting jonesforth too :-)
[10:59:53]	<migerh>	hachque, i'm at work right now, i won't be able to test it before +5h
[11:00:02]	<jtauber>	derinerkan_: Jerub that's why I was suggesting something Apple II like where you have hardware slots, each of which gets 256 bytes memorymapped
[11:00:03]	<FCatalan>	I think DCPU16is sort of a sweet spot for forth
[11:00:15]	<jtauber>	FCatalan: agreed, although two stack pointers would be even better
[11:00:23]	<hachque>	?forth
[11:00:24]	<scybot>	forth https://github.com/MostAwesomeDude/cauliflower
[11:00:27]	<kierenj>	didn't know this channel existed.. I'm one of the two working on 0x10c-devkit. hey
[11:00:46]	<hachque>	0x10c-devkit?
[11:00:53]	<migerh>	we got a chicken over here ^^
[11:01:00]	<derinerkan_>	alright, just came up with an even weirder solution for hardware...
[11:01:03]	<bungao>	hey everyone, i've been working a bit on the AtlasOS
[11:01:12]	<kierenj>	hachque - unofficial development kit with unoriginal name, 0x10c-devkit.com
[11:01:24]	<entrusC>	I think someone should write a JVM for the dcpu-16 - so we would have a java virtual machine running on a java emulated dcpu-16
[11:01:33]	<derinerkan_>	then run 0x10c on that
[11:01:39]	<hachque>	entrusC: not possible
[11:01:50]	<spasm>	lies
[11:01:51]	<FCatalan>	i got a bit sidetracked, too. started porting jonesforth, needed a macro assembler so I made one, then made my own emulator, then lost steam
[11:01:54]	<derinerkan_>	then upload the JVM to the in-in-game dcpu
[11:01:56]	<entrusC>	derinerkan_: exactly!
[11:02:02]	<hachque>	spasm: NOT POSSIBLE! >:[
[11:02:04]	<Lerc>	Heya all the newcomers.
[11:02:07]	<hachque>	:D
[11:02:10]	<spasm>	LIES!
[11:02:15]	<hachque>	kierenj: oh hmm
[11:02:18]	<derinerkan_>	eventually we'll get a in-in-in-in-in-ingame DCPU
[11:02:20]	<jtauber>	FCatalan: given it's python, there should be better reuse between it and dcpu16py :-)
[11:02:23]	<entrusC>	hachque: why shouldn't that be possible? It stays turing complete after all - doesn't it?
[11:02:26]	<WillWill56>	I know someone called spasm...
[11:02:27]	<hachque>	that reminds me, I should see where that guy is at; he said he wanted to make an IDE for DCPU Toolchain
[11:02:31]	<hachque>	entrusC: memory
[11:02:49]	<spasm>	is he me?
[11:02:56]	<WillWill56>	I don't know.
[11:02:57]	<STenyaK>	why not create a client that is always connected to 0x10c, offers an API to whichever ship computer you want, and have the client do all the computing much faster than the virtualized DCPU16s in-game?
[11:03:00]	<entrusC>	hachque: how much memory does the dcpu-16 have again?
[11:03:02]	<hachque>	I really can't stress how tiny 64kb is in comparison to *today's programs*
[11:03:03]	<SpacemanSpiff>	hi there gods of programming ^^
[11:03:06]	<WillWill56>	I know a sPaAsM.
[11:03:09]	<jtauber>	entrusC: 128k
[11:03:14]	<kierenj>	128kb (64 x 16-bit words)
[11:03:20]	<kierenj>	umm, 64k x 16-bit words
[11:03:23]	<derinerkan_>	stenyak that is a good idea... but it's kinda cheaty
[11:03:26]	<migerh>	hachque, why is a jvm impossible? just curious
[11:03:36]	<derinerkan_>	memory and processing power
[11:03:39]	<spasm>	ok, so not me :)
[11:03:46]	<entrusC>	ok - but there are java vms for microcontrollers - but I don't recall how much ram they have ...
[11:03:47]	<hachque>	migerh: memory. check how much the JVM uses on your computer in your average program
[11:03:55]	<Shadikka>	STenyaK: Don't worry, somebody's going to do it very probably. :P
[11:03:56]	<hachque>	hint: the memory options for java are measured in megabytes
[11:04:01]	<migerh>	hachque, there's nanovm
[11:04:12]	<migerh>	hachque, http://www.harbaum.org/till/nanovm/index.shtml
[11:04:17]	<derinerkan_>	hachque mine says 1mil KB
[11:04:22]	<derinerkan_>	i'm running minecraft
[11:04:26]	<migerh>	this things runs on atmel devices with a few kb mem
[11:04:37]	<migerh>	and 8bit atmels
[11:04:46]	<migerh>	*should* be portable
[11:04:57]	<entrusC>	migerh: exactly.
[11:04:59]	<WillWill56>	:O I have an Arduino, I should try nanovm... if I knew how... :/
[11:05:00]	<spasm>	hachque is just close minded :)
[11:05:05]	<derinerkan_>	1,000,000,000bytes on my current JVM process...
[11:05:06]	<FCatalan>	I also have a half done scheme compiler following the famous ghuloum article. But everyone nad his cat is also doing that
[11:05:08]	<hachque>	oh wow that's some crazy shit
[11:05:11]	<derinerkan_>	using the drivemaker's kilobyte
[11:05:16]	<entrusC>	and an atmega8 has few memory than the dcpu
[11:05:21]	<hachque>	where in the hell do you put the standard library? :P
[11:05:27]	<derinerkan_>	not here
[11:05:49]	<entrusC>	no one sayd something about the standard library ...
[11:05:56]	<kierenj>	there may be external IO/storage of course: 1.44MB floppy needn't be read-only. could have a self-extractor and use the remaining space as swapfile/working space
[11:06:24]	<spasm>	someone should write a fully working computer like the dcpu, except it runs on the dcpu, so we can get a computer in our computer in our computer
[11:06:27]	<derinerkan>	i want to build a mainframe...
[11:06:42]	<derinerkan>	we need mainframes made up of DCPU's
[11:06:56]	<_notch>	Yeah, you can connect real computers through the game to the dcpu in the game, and there's no way for me to stop that, so I won't even try
[11:06:57]	<jtauber>	spasm: in AOCP, Knuth writes a MIX emulator for the MIX
[11:07:06]	<spasm>	:D
[11:07:17]	<derinerkan>	notch: why not measure speed of inputs?
[11:07:20]	<_notch>	but it kinda goes against the fun, though
[11:07:31]	<entrusC>	so we just would need a c compiler for the dcpu and we could have a nano java vm up and running in no time ;)
[11:07:35]	<WillWill56>	Yeah, I was thinking that, sounds like cheating.
[11:07:38]	<derinerkan>	if a player computes too fast, boot them out of the server?
[11:07:49]	<_notch>	well, yeah, I guess.. But it's a neverending uphilll battle..
[11:07:52]	<Rick>	'computes too fast'
[11:07:53]	<Rick>	ahahahaha
[11:07:59]	<derinerkan>	i mean, at the speeds a computer runs, a player would destroy a keyboard doing it legitly
[11:08:03]	<_notch>	if it turns into a problem, we'll start adding checks against it
[11:08:04]	<Rick>	best counter against offloaders is to provide features that make them not want to offload
[11:08:09]	<hachque>	kierenj: what's the devkit licensed under?
[11:08:10]	<kierenj>	define 'computes too fast'. you could have an array of ships across the universe collecting data, sent to a central PC, then one ship can make movement with very little data transfer, with loads of intelligence behind it
[11:08:12]	<migerh>	entrusC, exactly. would be an interesting thing to do.
[11:08:13]	<entrusC>	notch: how can you connect real computers to the dcpu?
[11:08:26]	<derinerkan>	kieren i'm talking about a player who moves too fast
[11:08:28]	<entrusC>	migerh: yes it would be :)
[11:08:33]	<kierenj>	hachque: it's free, you can use it in any way you like, apart from maliciously, etc
[11:08:37]	<derinerkan>	using external computing power ingame
[11:08:42]	<hachque>	kierenj: no, I meant, source code license
[11:08:43]	<doppel>	a dcpu would need a 68k cpu, i think, to emulate it at a reasonable speed w/o too much bloat
[11:08:43]	<_notch>	well, even if I just stream the video output, people can capture that, then send keyboard commands from their computer
[11:08:50]	<Lerc>	At some stage I'll be making a DCPU emulator with a interface to Linux. I was designing my own VM to do this anyway, but now there's one for tools already made. Aiming to use it for low mem usage, persistant programs,
[11:08:53]	<kierenj>	hachque: the source code is not available now
[11:08:54]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Wouldnt that be malicious in the fact of creating an ingame password capturer or something?
[11:08:58]	<bungao>	_notch: dind't you say that the computer's will be run on servers? the lag could decrease the speed of any interface
[11:09:07]	<entrusC>	notch: i see ...
[11:09:29]	<WillWill56>	_notch: I'd like to enquire about the Duct Tape feature of the game...
[11:09:30]	<_notch>	yes, on the multiverse, the dcpu runs server-side. (even when not logged in)
[11:09:31]	<FCatalan>	notch: will cheap sensors, turrets etc.. have builtin innacuracy, would be cool to compensate that in software
[11:09:34]	<doppel>	or perhaps a 65816.
[11:09:41]	<_notch>	yes, FCatalan :D
[11:09:52]	<doppel>	something with 16-bit reg operand support
[11:09:55]	<_notch>	duct tape will fix ANYTHING temporarily. Even cracked cpus
[11:09:55]	<Caemyr>	hmm
[11:10:02]	<hachque>	haha
[11:10:05]	<Caemyr>	is _notch The Notch?
[11:10:08]	<entrusC>	notch: I hope u limit the speed on the server side as well ;)
[11:10:09]	<derinerkan>	notch: are we going to be able to network generators or DCPU's together?
[11:10:10]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Will ducttape get heated up and melt onto the cpu?
[11:10:11]	<FireFly>	Caemyr, yup
[11:10:12]	<derinerkan>	yes he is
[11:10:14]	<Caemyr>	\o/
[11:10:16]	<entrusC>	Caemyr: yes
[11:10:24]	<FCatalan>	notch: very cool, I just took a course on programming for robotics, migh come handy
[11:10:29]	<Rick>	he's the other notch, the notch behind the notch
[11:10:31]	<doppel>	unless you wanna sit around fiddlin' with high and low bytes, and DEAR GAWD lil vs big endian stuff
[11:10:34]	<migerh>	.twitter notch
[11:10:34]	<scybot>	migerh: 2012-04-17 10:21:02 notch: So much cool DCPU-16 stuff is going on. There's a dedicated irc channel with over 150 people on it! Holy moly! :D (on there as _notch now)
[11:10:34]	<Caemyr>	_notch: cant wait till your next coding stream
[11:10:36]	<_notch>	yes, you can network. If you want a HUGE ship in the multiverse, you will need multiple generators
[11:10:43]	<derinerkan>	awesome!
[11:10:48]	<hachque>	gah IRC!
[11:10:52]	<Caemyr>	_notch: it was always awesome experience
[11:10:55]	<_notch>	the monthly fee will cover one generator, and we'll work out the math so we cover the cost of emulating everything a generator can power
[11:10:55]	* hachque hurries back to work
[11:11:00]	<King_Rat__>	i'm getting rather excited about this
[11:11:14]	<_notch>	so the cost of the game kinda goes hand in hand with the resource management of a generator. :D I'm quite happy with that
[11:11:16]	* kierenj is supposed to be releasing a software upgrade for a major international airline, but can't peel away from the screen
[11:11:17]	<Rick>	it's a long ways off
[11:11:17]	<entrusC>	_notch: yes you should stream your coding again - I've never seen someone programming with hot code replacement that much as you did ;)
[11:11:20]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Will we be able to host our own little private multiverse?
[11:11:21]	<King_Rat__>	the idea of notch making another minecraft is rather interesting
[11:11:28]	<_ikke_>	_notch: do you have any idea about monthly fees, or is that still to be considered?
[11:11:31]	<derinerkan>	don't want to hog questions too much, but will multiple generators "fight" each other as happens with true AC, forcing players to make separate busses?
[11:11:33]	<King_Rat__>	by "another minecraft" i mean one as equally original
[11:11:34]	<_notch>	No, Mozzfly. Or rather, that won't be officially supported
[11:11:44]	<Caemyr>	_notch: do you plan some kind of economical system? or will it be minecraft-alike, all to be organized by players?
[11:11:47]	<jtauber>	_notch: charging for generators seems an awesome approach
[11:11:48]	<_notch>	it would be possible to hack it, but don't charge for it or distribute hacked clients if you do
[11:11:55]	<Shadikka>	_notch: Why not go the EVE way of economy :) (I'm joking... mostly.)
[11:11:58]	<Rick>	so you'll tolerate it?
[11:11:59]	<doppel>	a "generator"?
[11:12:09]	<_notch>	I'm considering having some kind of credits system in the game
[11:12:10]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Will you be fine with someone editing the net code to make there own server files?
[11:12:27]	<_notch>	Mozzfly: Well, yes, as long as it doesn't promote piracy
[11:12:27]	<Rick>	you don't edit netcode, you implement it :p
[11:12:41]	<_notch>	the game won't support that out of the box, though
[11:13:00]	<entrusC>	notch: you mean piracy like the guy that wanted to play quake against you?
[11:13:13]	<_notch>	we did the math on cpus and such, and the monthly cost will be quite a lot lower than, say, wow
[11:13:18]	<_notch>	plus the multiverse is optional
[11:13:21]	<FCatalan>	_notch: are you thinking about markov-chain generated names for systems/planets using real languages as source? works great in eve
[11:13:24]	<migerh>	that would be some serious inception. pirating a game INSIDE that game.
[11:13:26]	<derinerkan>	notch: would editing the netcode after purchasing the game to run a custom server hurt mojang, or you? after all, you're taking loads off the real multiverse
[11:13:37]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Sounds good thankyou for the answers.
[11:13:48]	<_notch>	No, it won't hurt us, but it could split the game up into too many shards
[11:13:52]	<_notch>	I have big plans for the multiverse
[11:13:55]	<derinerkan>	that's what I was thinking
[11:14:02]	<_notch>	for example, even in single player, you will get to access parts of the multiverse
[11:14:11]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: for free?
[11:14:14]	<derinerkan>	like what?
[11:14:18]	<_notch>	if someone builds a huge trading station, and you have an internet connection, your client will download that station so you can use it
[11:14:19]	<_notch>	for no fee
[11:14:30]	<Caemyr>	_notch: great!
[11:14:43]	<_notch>	of course, you using it won't affect the multiverse in the other direction, as single player games aren't verified serverside
[11:14:43]	<FCatalan>	so your local copy reflects changes fromthe onlibne version? cool
[11:14:46]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Have you considered paying a 6month term type of thing for the players?
[11:14:52]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Instead of per month.
[11:14:54]	<_notch>	yes, but one-way only for hacking reasons
[11:14:55]	<entrusC>	notch: when do you plan the game to be finished? This year? Next year?
[11:15:09]	<_notch>	first release this year, no idea when finished
[11:15:10]	<Rick>	undefined
[11:15:14]	<derinerkan>	entrusc: like minecraft, never :P
[11:15:25]	<_notch>	mozzfly: Whatever model makes the most sense. :)
[11:15:28]	<Rick>	I'd be surprised if _notch gets a playable game out before the end of the year
[11:15:35]	<hachque>	I wouldn't
[11:15:38]	<kierenj>	_notch - I'm interested in payment providers. I've looked around before and found the paypal API great (amazon is good for microtransactions but everyone needs an amazon account).. do you have anything marked for that?
[11:15:39]	<King_Rat__>	how rude
[11:15:42]	<derinerkan>	there IS a playable game so far
[11:15:42]	<_notch>	there will be an initial cost to the game to discourage too many "free" accounts, but you'll get included multiverse time with that
[11:15:44]	<kierenj>	in terms of the game, ofc
[11:15:51]	<entrusC>	I meant first release - beta - the best games never get finished at all ;)
[11:15:52]	<FCatalan>	notch. do you fear or await eagerly things like the whole of GoonFleet migrating to 0x10c :D ?
[11:15:55]	<derinerkan>	we can toss cubes around while notch makes the game :P
[11:15:56]	<hachque>	tbh Notch has been dev'ing at a crazy rate
[11:15:57]	<_ikke_>	_notch: Would you also pay fees for the alpha end beta?
[11:15:59]	<FireFly>	derinerkan, depends on the definition of "playable"
[11:16:06]	<_notch>	yes, ikke, just like minecraft
[11:16:09]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Will the servers for multiverse be located in different parts of the world? So we could get the best ping?
[11:16:20]	<derinerkan>	firefly: i count resizing cubes and other shapes to be playable :P
[11:16:23]	<_notch>	i have no idea about payment providers, that's up to the web team and our ceo. :D
[11:16:27]	<Rick>	FCatalan: pfft, anyone can have a huge fleet with sufficient skills :p
[11:16:33]	<_notch>	Not sure where the server will be
[11:16:40]	<Rick>	(assuming what _notch plans comes to fruition)
[11:16:46]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Or will everyone be located on the one centrelized multiverse?
[11:16:59]	<derinerkan>	notch: buy server space from TPB's LOSS :D
[11:16:59]	<_notch>	it will be the same multiverse, but it will be sharded
[11:17:07]	<WillWill56>	_notch: Someone needs to say this amongst all these boring comments. You (and the entire Mojang) are awesome.
[11:17:13]	<Caemyr>	_notch: any range for mothly fee? like below/above 10 eu?
[11:17:26]	<_notch>	so the economy is shared, and large bases and structures are shared, but your adventures and skirmishes are sharded
[11:17:37]	<_notch>	thank you WillWill56! =D
[11:17:54]	<_notch>	Caemyr: I can't promise anything yet, but I'm aiming at below 10
[11:18:06]	<hachque>	_notch: what do you mean by sharded? as in, different for different groups of people?
[11:18:13]	<entrusC>	I hate to work for a big company - so I don't really have time to follow this interesting chat - brb ...
[11:18:21]	<_notch>	the more we can optomize the dcpu emulation, the cheaper the hosting can be as well, heh
[11:18:39]	<_notch>	hachque: Like guild wars. You choose who you want to play with
[11:18:39]	<derinerkan>	this is a snippet from the universe's code: if(!IsNotchAwesome()) selfDestruct();
[11:18:56]	<hachque>	_notch: Ah right
[11:19:10]	<Caemyr>	_notch: one last thing, any more of your awesome coding sessions?
[11:19:13]	<_notch>	I'm hoping to do randomly generated abandoned ships floating around in space
[11:19:20]	<_notch>	you'll find loot in those. and aliens and robots.
[11:19:25]	<King_Rat__>	half the channel seem to be attempted to hump notch's leg
[11:19:28]	<qFox>	_notch: are you planning to release more of hte dcpu spec soon? or should i stop refreshing for a bit ;)
[11:19:29]	<kierenj>	optimisation.. well being a .NET guy.. maybe Java can emit bytecode that can be JITted? or, you can store a 0x10000 array of function pointers, so to run an instruction at X, you do ramLookup[X](); ...
[11:19:32]	<King_Rat__>	attempting*
[11:19:43]	<derinerkan>	notch: will we be able to salvage and use those abandoned ships?
[11:19:44]	<_notch>	right now I'm not working at all due to awesome personal stuff
[11:19:51]	<hachque>	kierenj: that's asking for trouble :P
[11:19:56]	<qFox>	well at least it's awesome :)
[11:20:01]	<_ikke_>	_notch: so paying for the generators stimulate people to coop to combine power?
[11:20:02]	<_notch>	the live streams are fun, but I get scared of experimenting when I do them
[11:20:05]	<kierenj>	it's really quick.. have done a few times before
[11:20:12]	<_notch>	hopefully, _ikke_
[11:20:16]	<Mozzfly>	_notch: Will these ships be raidable for goodies like screens and more cpu's?
[11:20:19]	<tristanC>	Hi :D
[11:20:24]	<_notch>	hopefully
[11:20:33]	* King_Rat__ licks fullwall.
[11:20:41]	<_notch>	but let's talk about dcpu stuff instead. ;D
[11:20:46]	<derinerkan>	:D
[11:20:47]	<_ikke_>	_notch: right
[11:20:48]	<_notch>	I'm giving out too many secrets now
[11:20:49]	<bungao>	haha server farm of raided dcpu's
[11:20:51]	<kierenj>	:)
[11:20:52]	<tristanC>	_notch: did you read the open_letter from 0x10c Standard Committee ?
[11:20:53]	<Rick>	yes, I was about to complain about that (this is -dev after all)
[11:21:08]	<_notch>	OH, also!! If you have spare wattage on your generators, you might want to use to to charge batteries
[11:21:15]	<Mozzfly>	brb
[11:21:16]	<_notch>	on the multiverse, power will become valuable
[11:21:19]	<Caemyr>	_notch: its awesome to watch, hours wasted easily, plus great music
[11:21:20]	<_notch>	so you can sell charged batteries
[11:21:21]	<derinerkan>	oh?
[11:21:28]	<kierenj>	that's niiice
[11:21:31]	<derinerkan>	or you could use it for bursts of cloak
[11:21:31]	<doppel>	i notice the dcpu has no interrupts
[11:21:32]	<qFox>	power is money, gosh :p
[11:21:37]	<derinerkan>	think about it
[11:21:42]	<FCatalan>	the live streams are what made me a notchfan. I don't even own or like Minecraft, I dislike java, but the LDs and Mojam, that I loved
[11:22:07]	<kierenj>	idd interrupts or a paging (virtual memory/mmu) would certainly open things up for an OS..
[11:22:09]	<derinerkan>	if the overhead is too small to run something directly, charge batteries, run in bursts. nothing will have to shut off to increase overhead
[11:22:16]	<Caemyr>	_notch: do you plan some advanced engineering when constructing ships? something like ship mass vs power ratio
[11:22:19]	<doppel>	so i guess there won't be any hardware exception type things
[11:22:22]	<Caemyr>	size vs capacity?
[11:22:41]	<hachque>	FCatalan: that's because rapid indie game development is awesome :D
[11:22:48]	<BlamBear>	0x10co.de down?
[11:22:54]	<avdg>	again?
[11:22:55]	<Rick>	BlamBear: in server migration
[11:22:58]	<_notch>	it will get interrupts soon! :D
[11:22:58]	<migerh>	BlamBear, moved
[11:22:59]	<BlamBear>	ahh ok
[11:23:01]	<_ikke_>	BlamBear: nope
[11:23:15]	<migerh>	BlamBear, use 199.26.85.31
[11:23:15]	<_notch>	I tried to avoid them, but I do see the point. I would LOVE community suggestions on how to implement them
[11:23:17]	<fullwall>	King_Rat__: ?
[11:23:22]	<_notch>	I've always been afraid of them personally
[11:23:36]	<Rick>	I think rmmh had suggestions on that, or someone else did
[11:23:46]	<hachque>	_notch: I feel like interrupts kind of make it too easy
[11:23:55]	<hachque>	in the same line as you were talking before with per-pixel access to the screen
[11:24:13]	<kierenj>	PC-style interrupts are OK: an instruction to enable, disable, then a jump table in low RAM for each interrupt. easy to manage, chain. my 2c
[11:24:14]	<BlamBear>	too easy? :\
[11:24:14]	<_notch>	people wanted it for threading and os stuff
[11:24:20]	<hachque>	If I have to read from the keyboard buffer every now and then to make sure input doesn't get lost, then that's a challenge
[11:24:29]	<kierenj>	idd, a timer interrupt and you can do multithreading
[11:24:32]	<hachque>	you can do threading without interrupts
[11:24:37]	<spasm>	_notch: do you have a rough eta on an official dcpu emulator?
[11:24:44]	<gaborsz>	howdy
[11:24:46]	<_notch>	i uploaded one last night :D
[11:24:47]	<kierenj>	only if all apps regularly call to a yield function, hachque
[11:24:53]	<hachque>	exactly :)
[11:24:59]	<Rick>	.remember highnerd http://dcpu.com/highnerd/
[11:24:59]	<scybot>	Rick: forgetting "highnerd http://dcpu.com/highnerd/", remembering this instead.
[11:24:59]	<scybot>	Rick: that url has been posted 4 times in the past 8 hours by Blecki, mappum, and Twisol (last linked by Twisol 4 hours, 24 minutes ago).
[11:25:05]	<Rick>	oh, someone already did that
[11:25:21]	<doppel>	interestingly the atari 2600 has no interrupts either, so they aren't essential
[11:25:22]	<FCatalan>	I think the design needs some corners so asm wizards can do their magic, it's good that us mere mortals can fiddle, but masters will need their fun with harder stuff
[11:25:24]	<gaborsz>	can I ask @notch Will you be able to terraform dead planets in 0x10c? Can you set up defenses or a land base for your stuff? :) Thanks
[11:25:35]	<Lerc>	You'd potentially need an interrupt PC register. unless you don't mind hurting people playing silly buggers with the stack.
[11:25:36]	<doppel>	but yeah they do make some things easier
[11:25:52]	<doppel>	like timing tasks
[11:25:55]	<_notch>	what about only a 60 hz timer hardware interrupt? Nonmaskable? :D
[11:26:00]	<fullwall>	.logs
[11:26:02]	<fullwall>	.log
[11:26:04]	<migerh>	?log
[11:26:05]	<scybot>	log http://vps.thomascomputerindustries.com/logs/freenode/0x10c-dev
[11:26:07]	<doppel>	yes notch
[11:26:14]	<WillWill56>	_notch: How central will programming be to the game? I'd love it if I learned to program well because of this game.
[11:26:15]	<ngc0202>	WillWill56 lost the game!
[11:26:19]	<FCatalan>	for example the orthogonal instruction set is sweet, but sometimes feels like easymode
[11:26:24]	<Lerc>	I'd be happy with a 60Hz timer interrupt.
[11:26:25]	<doppel>	50 hz if you live in europe ;-D
[11:26:27]	<WillWill56>	D: I lost the game?!?!?!?!
[11:26:28]	<ngc0202>	WillWill56 lost the game!
[11:26:30]	<kierenj>	60hz.. 1666 instructions between interrupts. should be OK?
[11:26:39]	<WillWill56>	:(
[11:26:44]	<_notch>	cycles, not interrupts
[11:26:45]	<kierenj>	*cycles
[11:26:47]	<kierenj>	:)
[11:27:06]	<_notch>	yeah, and if you spend longer than that in an interrupt, you get ANOTHER ONE in the middle of it
[11:27:14]	<Shadikka>	Hmm. Wonder if that's just an autoresponder to "the game"?
[11:27:15]	<ngc0202>	Shadikka lost the game!
[11:27:16]	<hachque>	haha
[11:27:27]	<doppel>	only 1666 cycles?
[11:27:32]	<Shadikka>	Yes, it is. :|
[11:27:33]	<Lerc>	_notch: I've had that happen in real life.
[11:27:36]	<Rick>	someone kick that guy :p
[11:27:43]	<doppel>	that seems like a very small amount of time.
[11:27:44]	<kierenj>	could be a virtual vsync or something
[11:27:54]	<jtauber>	doppel: how did the Atari 2600 do it with the 6507?
[11:27:55]	<_notch>	yeah, 60 hz.. haha
[11:28:02]	<Sky___>	good luck notch =D i'll be quiet now and listen ;)
[11:28:03]	<bungao>	_notch: what about a table of interupts for different events (stored outside memory) setting the table for each event would point it to memeory location, when the event happens it would set the pc to that memery location
[11:28:08]	<doppel>	in 6502 terms, for example, that only corresponds to roughy 10 or 11 scanlines
[11:28:19]	<_notch>	you can of course have your own "ignore interrupt" flag by checking a memory location manually in the interrupt
[11:28:21]	<doppel>	well on the nes anyway
[11:28:46]	<Lerc>	You knew exactly what time it was on the 2600. Otherwise you couldn't draw anything.
[11:28:49]	<mozzfly>	back
[11:28:56]	<FCatalan>	_notch: have you seen TouchOSC for iOS or Android? You need to have a look if you haven't already
[11:28:59]	<doppel>	well the vertical blank was handled by the programmer
[11:29:07]	<kierenj>	changable timer frequency I think is a bad idea, could cause incompatibilities. for lower-freq stuff and measuring could have a RTC mapped. I think 60Hz and allow people to subdivide themselves would be OK
[11:29:55]	<mozzfly>	_notch will there be a sort of ingame appstore for code for dcpu-16
[11:29:56]	<ngc0202>	mozzfly lost the game!
[11:29:57]	<kierenj>	could even have a memory-mapped cycle counter, RTC, and CPU status info like CPUID instruction
[11:30:03]	<_notch>	i hope so, mozzfly
[11:30:08]	<FireFly>	<< 0081 00c1
[11:30:08]	<dcpubot>	FireFly: SET [A], A / SET [Y], A
[11:30:14]	<doppel>	you had to draw the line scanline by scanline
[11:30:15]	<FireFly>	hm
[11:30:16]	<qFox>	selling apps for batteries :p
[11:30:31]	<_notch>	ideally people would make their own, but I think I might cheat and build one in java instead of in DCPU-16 code..
[11:30:37]	<doppel>	then handle game logic on the "off-time"
[11:30:50]	<_notch>	sharing software will be quite central
[11:30:59]	<mozzfly>	_notch thats what i was thinking
[11:31:02]	<derinerkan>	player made app stores are the way to go i think
[11:31:06]	<WillWill56>	_notch: I'm thinking of uses for the DCPU... could you program it to automatically aim your cannons at the enemy or something?
[11:31:10]	<doppel>	fortunately there was a timer in the 6532 that sorta made it easier
[11:31:13]	<kierenj>	don't know if you saw the devkit thing, but I put in memory-mapped web access (write a URL to a port, read response back).. reckon something like that might make it into the game? :)
[11:31:20]	<_notch>	oh, and floppy disks. THats how you carry programs around
[11:31:21]	<BlamBear>	player made app stores would split the community?
[11:31:23]	<derinerkan>	like you go to a trading center, each one has a different app store
[11:31:28]	<derinerkan>	no they might not
[11:31:29]	<BlamBear>	but then again so do player made operating systems
[11:31:35]	<derinerkan>	not more than factions or governments
[11:31:50]	<avdg>	we need a huuuge floppy disk database!
[11:31:52]	<avdg>	:-)
[11:32:02]	<derinerkan>	DCPU controlled of course
[11:32:09]	<Rick>	you could call it... a zip drive!!
[11:32:10]	<Rick>	8)
[11:32:11]	<FCatalan>	_notch: MSX ROM cartrigdes were wayyy cooler
[11:32:17]	<derinerkan>	like, a room full of floppies
[11:32:25]	<mozzfly>	_notch will we be able to have drones itd be cool to have my own c3po
[11:32:26]	<derinerkan>	you ask the dcpu for a file
[11:32:33]	<derinerkan>	it takes it and brings it to you
[11:32:47]	<Rick>	getting too far ahead of yourselves
[11:32:58]	<mozzfly>	there are so many things to do lol
[11:33:17]	<FCatalan>	in fact now that I think of it they weren't rom, you could write into them, they replaced the builtin ram probably
[11:33:18]	<doppel>	the last thing we need is another droid that nobody cares about upsetting
[11:33:23]	<_notch>	writing sensors and outputs will be fun
[11:33:29]	<kcj>	wat
[11:33:35]	<doppel>	trying to beat wookies at games nobody understands
[11:33:45]	<kcj>	Notch is here!
[11:33:46]	* mozzfly ductapes 10 floppy disks together
[11:33:57]	<_notch>	one "goal image" I have is putting a dcpu on a platform with wheels and a large battery on it, giving it a mineral sensor and a digging module, then sending it off on a planet surface
[11:34:11]	<kierenj>	aww, yeah
[11:34:17]	<kierenj>	..swarm!
[11:34:24]	<Guizzoni>	that's awesome, _notch!
[11:34:25]	<kierenj>	radio comms :)
[11:34:26]	<Sky___>	awesome idea!
[11:34:40]	<ehd>	so there'll be physics simulations for vehicles on planets/asteroids? neat :P
[11:34:53]	<WillWill56>	Would be interesting making players learn 3D math to translate the position of the enemy's ship from sensors into angles for their cannons to use in aiming.
[11:34:54]	<_notch>	yeah, that's the plan
[11:34:56]	<Ronald_>	How are you going to handle the ships atmosphere? it seems to be impossible to check for air leaks in the ships design
[11:35:01]	<Jerub>	_notch: pfft. the real way to do asteroid mining is to tether the ship against the asteroid, use the rocket motor to melt the entire rock, then spin it until the gold is near the outer edge. ;)
[11:35:23]	<_notch>	I will make it impossible to design a ship that isn't air tight. You give it a bounding volume first, then dig out rooms after
[11:36:10]	<FCatalan>	I recommend taking the udacity.com CS373 course to anyone wanting to automate sensors and stuff
[11:36:11]	<mozzfly>	_notch how different will planets be. Will we have to travel so and so lightyears to get to a copy or replica of the planet
[11:36:23]	<qFox>	so we'll be seeing many enterprises? :p
[11:36:27]	<doppel>	that wouldn't work unless the gold was less dense than the rest of the asteroid material.
[11:36:51]	<ehd>	qFox: i can see it coming. star wars fanboys vs. star trek fanboys vs. /b/
[11:36:52]	<spasm>	_notch: are you planning on making smaller/larger dcpus? like a dcpu8 or something to put in drones that requires less power, but is obviously less capable?
[11:36:55]	<_notch>	as many planet types as I can think of
[11:37:02]	<FCatalan>	it's an awesome introduction to robotics programming from the guy making the Googole self driving car
[11:37:15]	<_notch>	spasm: I'm thinking underclocking it. Set it to 10khz, and it uses 10% of the power
[11:37:24]	<ehd>	FCatalan: thanks.
[11:37:25]	<Lerc>	re sprites/gfx: I thought 16 8x8 sprites would work. c64 had 8 but could reuse going down the screen. Drew a test pic to see how much coverage you could get with 8x8's http://i.imgur.com/0K2zn.png
[11:37:29]	<_notch>	or 1khz if you're only doing basic sensor stuff
[11:37:30]	<Salgar_>	Can I have a lightsaber?
[11:37:33]	<spasm>	ok, thats even better
[11:37:35]	<doppel>	ehd: she made the kessel run in less than 12 parsecs
[11:37:38]	<mozzfly>	i wonder if overclocking will be achieved
[11:37:57]	<WillWill56>	Well, hope _notch enjoys developing the game, I know I'm looking forward to it. I'm off.
[11:38:03]	<qFox>	ehd: there's your holy war. right there!
[11:38:15]	<kcj>	_notch, Will the cpu be able to control the ship (thrust, direction and what not)?
[11:38:19]	<mozzfly>	bye will
[11:38:22]	<_notch>	you will be able to find more efficient DCPUs laying around in abandoned ships
[11:38:25]	<qFox>	i'll be on the star trek side, peewing you away with photon torpedo's. on wheels. :p
[11:38:45]	<_notch>	one that does 112 khz at 94% power usage, for example, might be valuable
[11:39:05]	<Sky___>	Notch do you have plans for player-death in multiplayer? ;)
[11:39:13]	<doppel>	i'll be on the star control side, pewing away with hellborne cannons on my precursor ship.
[11:39:14]	<ehd>	i'm with /b/, commanding the giant you-know-what shaped planet penetrator
[11:39:15]	<mozzfly>	_notch ram upgrades?
[11:39:15]	<_notch>	kcj: you control the engines, not the ship. The engines do push the ship around, however
[11:39:22]	<kierenj>	that timer, RTC or CPUID would be invaluable so we can determine the frequency it's running at :)
[11:39:28]	<kcj>	oooh
[11:39:29]	<_notch>	no ram upgrades, it's not adressable
[11:39:33]	<kierenj>	or even more fun, if it's faulty, it could be variable
[11:39:56]	<_notch>	fly in highly radiated areas, and random bits in ram will flip
[11:39:59]	<Sky___>	how about display- upgrades?
[11:40:12]	<kierenj>	eeeee. i hope you're keeping some secrets too :)
[11:40:21]	<FCatalan>	you should introduce a couple deliberate obscure bugs in the emulator
[11:40:24]	<_notch>	sorry, I'll stop talking about features. ;)
[11:40:31]	<doppel>	i bet you're all just dying to know how to play frungy
[11:40:34]	<Shadikka>	Note for self: Start implementing error-checking.
[11:40:37]	<_notch>	I'm just brainstorming a bit, very excited about getting back to work on this
[11:40:38]	<Lerc>	_if you can boot linux on an 8 bit ATMega with swapping, you can do plenty swapping in and out of 128k
[11:40:44]	<spasm>	how about getting a big metal disc and some magnets and making a big oversided hard disk?
[11:40:59]	<Shadikka>	Lerc: Yeah, eight hours to a Bash prompt or what was it? :P
[11:41:00]	<lucian>	_notch: maybe someone already asked, have you considered generating jvm bytecode to speed up the emulator, so you'd have more freedom with the subscription price?
[11:41:13]	<kcj>	_notch, I'm kinda hoping we can write viruses to literally crash other peoples ships in a fun, rare occurrence kind of way.
[11:41:16]	<kierenj>	right, I gotta go do some stuff.. have fun all. I guess someone will be redditing a summary anyway.. bbl
[11:41:17]	<sbp>	_notch: any plans to incorporate some of the ideas that people are putting in their emulators? thinking of BRK in mappum's emulator specifically, but I know a lot of people are architecting their own I/O stuff too. just wondering how much you're looking at that and planning to incorporate
[11:41:18]	<_notch>	lucian: I plan on rewriting in it jasmin once it's stable
[11:41:22]	<lucian>	_notch: and also, have you considered provisions for source code that isn't dcpu assembly, like C or something. and compilers?
[11:41:27]	<lucian>	_notch: i see, cool
[11:41:30]	<ehd>	kcj: that'll be possible, see 0x10c wiki faq
[11:41:36]	<kcj>	:)
[11:41:46]	<_notch>	or do you mean for runtime stuff? MAYBE.. The problem is that the code can modify itself at any time
[11:41:58]	<kcj>	gah smc
[11:42:13]	<pairofdice>	will there be a "safe-zone" ala EVE empire or will it just all depend on the players?
[11:42:15]	<_notch>	sbp: I want to design my own stuff, so I don't look at that yet
[11:42:29]	<sbp>	whoops, forget I mentioned BRK then... :-)
[11:42:44]	<_notch>	you choose who you play with a la guild wars, so you're safe by default
[11:43:20]	<migerh>	?gol
[11:43:23]	<migerh>	?gameoflife
[11:43:42]	<mozzfly>	_notch will mouse input be possible?
[11:43:49]	<_notch>	undecided
[11:43:52]	<migerh>	?log
[11:43:52]	<scybot>	log http://vps.thomascomputerindustries.com/logs/freenode/0x10c-dev
[11:44:03]	<ehd>	but... joysticks!
[11:44:03]	<_notch>	i like the old school feeling of no mouse input
[11:44:07]	<_notch>	joysticks, yes
[11:44:12]	<ehd>	JOY!
[11:44:12]	<mozzfly>	yay
[11:44:27]	<kcj>	I like the no mouse thing.
[11:44:30]	<FCatalan>	_notch: About the possible MIDI interface for controls, have you seen TouchOSC? Would be awesome to control the game with that
[11:44:48]	<Sky___>	will there be displays with different sizes?
[11:44:54]	<Lerc>	_notch: I'd have [pointer device] X,Y. Empty if no device. Then just add it one day.
[11:45:23]	<kcj>	Anyway, I have to do other things. _notch, Enjoy the mountains of questions.
[11:46:06]	<mozzfly>	will the cpu be able to have burstable work loads
[11:46:15]	<gaborsz>	_notch Can I ask if planets can be terraformed? What will be the scale of a solar system?
[11:46:54]	<dowgird>	Spec question: which value of SP gets pushed with SET PUSH, SP? Pre- or post-decrement?
[11:47:39]	<spasm>	_notch: will we have to worry about cooling the dcpu(s)?
[11:47:41]	<FireFly>	"0x1a: PUSH / [--SP]" ← pre-decrement
[11:47:54]	<derinerkan>	cooling the dcpu's is an interesting issue
[11:48:01]	<FireFly>	er
[11:48:02]	<FireFly>	well
[11:48:05]	<derinerkan>	you could just put it outside
[11:48:09]	<FireFly>	the value that gets pushed is the new value after the decrement
[11:48:18]	<derinerkan>	but then a well placed gunshot would kill your computer
[11:48:20]	<FireFly>	since a is (currently) evaluated before b
[11:48:53]	<dowgird>	@fireFly: hm... does the spec really define the order of evaluation?
[11:49:15]	<migerh>	?spec
[11:49:15]	<scybot>	spec http://0x10c.com/doc/dcpu-16.txt
[11:49:37]	<migerh>	dowgird, a is always handled by the processor before b
[11:50:30]	<FireFly>	As far as I can tell, it does
[11:50:42]	<doppel>	if it was post-decrement, probably it would say [SP--], am i right?
[11:50:43]	<dowgird>	Ah, right - it is in the spec.
[11:50:46]	<doppel>	heh
[11:51:28]	<Ymgve>	spasm: back in those days passive cooling were enough
[11:51:37]	<spasm>	true
[11:52:20]	<SmokestormX>	Hi peeps
[11:53:29]	<doppel>	hewwo
[11:54:15]	<derinerkan>	ymgve: not for mainframes though... people will want more DCPU power and build mainframes
[11:54:35]	<Ymgve>	well, the DCPU isn't a mainframe
[11:54:50]	<derinerkan>	we can make it as such by networking
[11:54:57]	<doppel>	i see a few familiar names here
[11:54:59]	<derinerkan>	suddenly there are 20 heat sources instead of 1
[11:56:26]	<pairofdice>	The generator + weapons will surely generate a lot more heat than the DCPUs
[11:56:41]	<Lerc>	Depends of course. Space is cold, but there's not much to conduct heat away.
[11:57:40]	<_notch>	space is not cold!!
[11:57:47]	<_notch>	vacuum has no temperature at all
[11:57:54]	<Heliosmaster>	?log
[11:57:54]	<scybot>	log http://vps.thomascomputerindustries.com/logs/freenode/0x10c-dev
[11:58:01]	<pairofdice>	background radiation
[11:58:23]	<kierenj>	unless you're near a sun.. (I would say if I wasn't working)
[11:58:45]	<_notch>	well, yeah, you can receive heat from radiation. And you can lose heat from radiation. But the vacuum doesn't have any temperature at all
[11:59:05]	<Lerc>	space isn't a vacuum. It's got pressure, just not a lot.
[11:59:08]	<FCatalan>	still, better wear a hat when outside!
[11:59:18]	<kierenj>	no molecules to be vibrating I guess
[11:59:18]	<spasm>	slip slop slap
[11:59:20]	<_notch>	not enough pressure to act as an efficient carrier of heat
[11:59:31]	<Montezuma>	If your Spaceship is in Space then its not a vacuum because your Ship is in :D .... GENIUS
[11:59:32]	<pairofdice>	Nope, just radiation
[11:59:35]	<Heliosmaster>	yeah, the density is very low, ~ some molecules per square meter
[11:59:50]	<_notch>	the particles that are there are cold if far away from a star or warm if directly lit by a nearby star. So nyah.
[11:59:53]	<Anteras>	*cubic meter
[12:00:21]	<gaborsz>	_notch Can I ask if planets can be terraformed? What will be the scale of a solar system?
[12:00:48]	<_notch>	most solar systems will be a brown dwarf with very few surviving planets
[12:01:12]	<_notch>	sorry, star systems. Not solar. :D
[12:01:16]	<SpacemanSpiff>	and the size of the planets? realistic or exporable?
[12:01:27]	<_notch>	realistic
[12:01:32]	<SpacemanSpiff>	nice
[12:01:33]	<gaborsz>	there won't be any young stars at all? maybe 1 in a 1000?
[12:01:34]	<_notch>	unless that's not fun
[12:01:39]	<SpacemanSpiff>	right
[12:01:40]	<spasm>	_notch: I remember reading that there will be lots of black holes. wormholes? and by extension hopefully wormhole traversal?
[12:01:42]	<Heliosmaster>	the sun will be a black dwarf since a long time :P
[12:01:55]	<ehd>	i guess "unless that's not fun" is true for every early design decision :P
[12:01:57]	<_notch>	Maybe extremely few young stars
[12:01:58]	<Ymgve>	How will intersolar travel work?
[12:02:07]	<Montezuma>	Notch can we build stuff like Vehicels ? :D
[12:02:10]	<_notch>	but I'm aiming at an explorable number of stars in total due to most being dead
[12:02:23]	<_notch>	and by "explorable", I mean maybe 100k.
[12:02:32]	<Meltdown>	_notch What about flight physics? Will we have to (read: do we get to) write orbit calculation systems?
[12:02:37]	<SpacemanSpiff>	awesome :)
[12:02:43]	<gaborsz>	_notch I'm sure many of us would LOVE that. At least ..some.. star systems may be habitable.
[12:02:46]	<Heliosmaster>	spasm: most of the "big" stars of now, will be a black hole in the (not so near) future
[12:02:53]	<rrivera>	Was there any further discusson on this "leak"? Just appeared out of nowhere. Apologies if this was pre-discussed.
[12:02:56]	<_notch>	yes, meltdown. Or, well, you don't have you, you always orbit. ;) The question is just if you like the orbit you're in
[12:03:06]	<Anteras>	What about planets that do not belong to any solar system? They could be fun as there wouldn't be any indication that they existed and would make nice hidden bases.
[12:03:26]	<_notch>	yes, well, that is my favorite explanation for dark matter.
[12:03:33]	<Meltdown>	I do not like orbits that run me into planets.
[12:03:36]	<SmokestormX>	And all the words lead to minecraft servers
[12:03:41]	<_notch>	the odds of running into one are redonculously low, however
[12:03:42]	<Lerc>	Elite was good having lots of stars, but you could still get a feel for regions. Frontier had so much that it all felt meaningless.
[12:03:55]	<FCatalan>	will you let discoverers name the systems (within reason?)
[12:03:59]	<Anteras>	True but that would make finding one even more rewarding.
[12:04:08]	<Visioneer>	So this is about the ships/crew. Will there be ship to ship/planetary airspace communication?
[12:04:22]	<_notch>	I don't think the game will show any planet or star names at all unless you make your computer to do
[12:04:27]	<pairofdice>	How about stealth, I figure it's really hard to detect ships ...
[12:04:34]	<derinerkan>	i think it should be obvious visioneer
[12:04:42]	<Lerc>	But I did find the star UrQuan in Frontier which was cool.
[12:04:44]	<_notch>	we're getting into spoiler discussion again!!
[12:04:47]	<pairofdice>	:D
[12:04:51]	<_notch>	haha, I can't help myself, I'm very excited
[12:04:52]	<derinerkan>	OH NO
[12:04:56]	<EmergedDragon7>	A question, Will there be land/sea vehicles? Ground combat?
[12:04:59]	<FCatalan>	I like what you implied
[12:04:59]	<_notch>	keep in mind all of these things can change
[12:05:00]	<Heliosmaster>	_notch: i like it a lot the approach that you are taking: leaving people build stuff and figure out what to do and how to do :)
[12:05:07]	<pairofdice>	we all are, _notch, we all are
[12:05:17]	<mozzfly>	_notch will u be making a custom HUD type thing
[12:05:30]	<FCatalan>	umm will you hire me? I suck at nerf gunning so i will always miss
[12:05:41]	<spasm>	excited developer = win
[12:05:49]	<mozzfly>	for temps for the cpu etc
[12:05:54]	<SmokestormX>	I really like the hyperspace analyzer in frontier, detecting where people had jumped to
[12:06:15]	<Montezuma>	when does the alpha came out :D
[12:06:26]	<Heliosmaster>	pairofdice: ditto
[12:06:26]	<Sankina>	okay wow I'm sure somebody has asked bug will there be different computers with varying IO but all with the same CPU?
[12:06:31]	<Sankina>	that would be neat
[12:06:57]	<_notch>	I won't answer anything more non-dcpu-related :D
[12:07:00]	<kcj>	_notch, Worried that freenode may asplode if you idle here for too long?
[12:07:11]	<Ymgve>	_notch: when will you tell us how ship control/IO will work?
[12:07:20]	<qFox>	_notch: planning to codify any memory maps?
[12:07:23]	<Sankina>	hey, that *is* dcpu related!
[12:07:29]	<Montezuma>	When came the alpha with the DCPU ? ;)
[12:07:40]	<avdg>	_notch: then whats the most fun dcpu program you found yet? :-)
[12:07:43]	<_notch>	memory mapped hardware all of it, I'm thinking
[12:07:44]	<Sankina>	also I should get my computer, phone typing is annoying
[12:07:53]	<_notch>	so for an engine, you map the power and possibly rotation of it to a memory region
[12:08:05]	<qFox>	so you define that yourself?
[12:08:08]	<derinerkan>	notch wouldn't that be 3 addresses per io
[12:08:18]	<gaborsz>	_notch Thank you for your answers!
[12:08:19]	<Heliosmaster>	_notch: imho one of the exciting aspect of this game will be that it enables youngsters like me (i'm 20ish) to have a grasp of the dawn of the computing. so, kudos!
[12:08:22]	<Sankina>	I like that
[12:08:27]	<Meltdown>	Damn. That makes automated ship takeover much more difficult. D:
[12:08:28]	<derinerkan>	one bit flag (in/out), one location marker, another bit flag (on/off)
[12:08:29]	<Sankina>	various memory mapped components
[12:08:36]	<sbp>	avdg: Minesweeper is pretty popular: http://0x10co.de/lqnit
[12:08:37]	<scybot>	sbp: that url has been posted 5 times in the past 14 hours by mappum, rmmh, startling, Twisol, and Zarutian (last linked by Twisol 7 hours, 8 minutes ago).
[12:08:39]	<EmergedDragon7>	_notch: A question, Will there be land/sea vehicles? Ground combat?
[12:08:44]	<_notch>	Heliosmaster: Yesss!! That's what I was hoping for! :D I want to relive those days
[12:08:50]	<Sankina>	you could seal out monitors
[12:09:01]	<Sankina>	swap*
[12:09:04]	<derinerkan>	notch you've succeeded in that i think
[12:09:05]	<_notch>	the minesweeper intro is great :D
[12:09:11]	<avdg>	sbp: lol?
[12:09:13]	<Heliosmaster>	definitely succeeded :D
[12:09:14]	<Ymgve>	_notch: btw, add a clock!
[12:09:15]	<qFox>	_notch: like, every object that dcpu could interact with is able to hook into the cpu by giving it a memory offset? then it would do i/o through that/those addresses?
[12:09:20]	<derinerkan>	i'm the only one in my age group learning assembly and most of the computer age :P
[12:09:25]	<_notch>	yeah, qFox
[12:09:28]	<kcj>	_notch, Will cosmic rays cause random bit-flipping in the DCPU's memory?
[12:09:29]	<Meltdown>	Heliosmaster: +1. I missed out on the early hacker culture. Hoping to get some of it through this game.
[12:09:33]	<Montezuma>	when we will see a new Screenshot :)
[12:09:36]	<Lerc>	+1 on the clock.
[12:09:37]	<Sankina>	age doesn't matter; I knew ask years ago
[12:09:37]	<qFox>	awesome, simple and effective
[12:09:38]	<Sky___>	I'm 17 and never got to play around with 16-bit computers! Thank you notch!
[12:09:39]	<_notch>	kcj: Yes, but only in high radiation areas
[12:09:42]	<Sankina>	asm
[12:09:44]	<kcj>	Sweet.
[12:09:48]	<derinerkan>	i know but when does matter
[12:09:51]	<_notch>	so not realistic, where it can happen anywhere
[12:09:54]	<derinerkan>	so age indirectly affects it
[12:10:22]	<derinerkan>	oh wow
[12:10:29]	<derinerkan>	just got an idea for a new weapon
[12:10:32]	<derinerkan>	radiation beam
[12:10:36]	<derinerkan>	like an EMP, but directional
[12:10:53]	<FCatalan>	are unsigned numbers set in stone or will you consider native 2-complement?
[12:11:13]	<Jerub>	derinerkan: a ship that needs to travel a large fraction of the speed of light needs to be able to protect its occupants from hardcore radiation.
[12:11:21]	<derinerkan>	right
[12:11:30]	<EmergedDragon7>	_notch: I hate to spam, but could you please answer if there is going to be land/sea vehicles and ground combat? Or at least vaguely answer one of the questions?
[12:11:35]	<Montezuma>	how we gona save and share the programms in the Game ? kinde of CD´s oder Data-Tapes ;) ??????
[12:11:35]	<_notch>	FCatalan: I will consider it!
[12:11:38]	<Sankina>	interrupts are sti unplanned?
[12:11:41]	<Sankina>	still
[12:11:43]	<derinerkan>	oh, it's the same effect with more rain hitting a windscreen the faster you move
[12:11:50]	<Toqu>	_notch: would you consider memory banking for ram extensions?
[12:11:52]	<kcj>	_notch, Will high radiation cause harm to the player?
[12:11:59]	<_notch>	I won't answer more non-dcpu-questions now, EmergedDragon7. I've been promising too much, haha
[12:12:02]	<kcj>	Ah.
[12:12:09]	<derinerkan>	but still, radiation guns for internal use is a possibility
[12:12:10]	<Jerub>	derinerkan: if you're discussing game ideas, not cpu dev, maybe #0x10c would be better.
[12:12:15]	<_notch>	Toqu: That's how harddrives and disk drives will work. MD
[12:12:16]	<EmergedDragon7>	Ah, okay, didn't know, sorry _notch
[12:12:17]	<pairofdice>	I love the fractal planets btw
[12:12:25]	<derinerkan>	yeah, it simply stemmed from the rad-based bitflipping
[12:12:33]	<mozzfly>	_notch do u have an old 16bit pc laying around
[12:12:34]	<ar>	_notch: Will NUMA/SMP be possible?
[12:12:35]	<derinerkan>	went a little OT with that
[12:12:36]	<FCatalan>	I was worried, because we are going to need every cycle for complex calcualtions, and if you need an extra layer to have negative numbers everything would be slowwwww
[12:12:38]	<Lerc>	_notch: Any thoughts on changeable Palette? I went with Arne's Generic 16 colours for a fixed palette. Changable palette is getting into the 8 bit console/ 16 bit computer era.
[12:12:40]	<Heliosmaster>	_notch: any chance of seeing you livestreaming? I liked it a lot
[12:12:51]	<EmergedDragon7>	_notch: I'm just really excited :D
[12:12:58]	<pairofdice>	Also yes, livestream was gold, despite the chat
[12:13:01]	<_notch>	lerc: Yeah, I think I will do the EGA way. 16 colors onscreen, 64 in total, editable palette
[12:13:05]	<King_Rat>	I'm really quite impressed by all this
[12:13:14]	<King_Rat>	notch is being so communicative ^_^
[12:13:17]	<Sankina>	okay, I got a computer
[12:13:19]	<mozzfly>	Heliosmaster hes on holidays i think
[12:13:27]	<Montezuma>	_notch : how we gona save and share the programms in the Game ? kinde of CD´s oder Data-Tapes ?
[12:13:28]	<ar>	_notch: NUMA would be nice, especially if one would have bigger number of computers/cpus on a ship
[12:13:39]	<SmokestormX>	I think 1.44 floppies right?
[12:13:42]	<derinerkan>	floppies
[12:13:42]	<_ikke_>	Montezuma: only dcpu questions will be answered
[12:13:45]	<Meltdown>	Oh, I like the tapes idea.
[12:13:47]	<sbp>	Solarized palette? :-)
[12:13:51]	<Montezuma>	its Dcpu i think :O
[12:13:52]	<snooze82>	*dumdidum
[12:13:55]	<derinerkan>	it is a borderline dcpu question
[12:14:04]	<derinerkan>	we ARE talking about the programs after all
[12:14:12]	<Montezuma>	how do i save my DCPU programm on/with/under/in the DCPU
[12:14:14]	<Meltdown>	Especially with the added challenge of seek times on tape media. Much higher than disc media.
[12:14:15]	<_conehead>	_notch: Is the "puzzle with a reward at the end" dcpu-related? d:
[12:14:16]	<SmokestormX>	Yea i suppose it is the era of tapes, and bleeps and bloops
[12:14:21]	<Sankina>	_notch: any plans for, say, multiple monitors with different IO registers, which you could swap manually? (one could be tile-based..)
[12:14:47]	<kcj>	multiple monitors lol
[12:14:54]	<derinerkan>	haha
[12:14:55]	<Sankina>	I don't mean both connected at once
[12:15:03]	<_notch>	Not sure, at the moment, I'd rather have only the one I have now. I REALLY like limitations like that, it makes developing something that looks good a lot more interesting
[12:15:06]	<SmokestormX>	Will there be a way to network DCPU's ?
[12:15:09]	<Lerc>	a base of 64 is awkward, 6 bits doesn't go into 16 in nice chunks.
[12:15:10]	<derinerkan>	it's easy actually if DCPU and monitor isn't connected
[12:15:13]	<mozzfly>	triple screen ingame
[12:15:19]	<_notch>	well, yeah, you should be able to connect mutiple monitors if you want later on
[12:15:21]	<Sankina>	mhm
[12:15:28]	<derinerkan>	just use relays to move screen output
[12:15:29]	<sbp>	SmokestormX: I've been wondering that too, and somebody suggested DCPU mainframes earlier
[12:15:36]	<_notch>	memory map them to different regions if you want multiple images, or to the same if you want to split the image
[12:15:45]	<Sankina>	anyway, swappable memory would be nice, but only if you can get fast enough hardware
[12:15:48]	<derinerkan>	it was me :P
[12:15:49]	<ar>	_notch: "I'd rather have only the one I have now." - that was about cpu cpu numbers?
[12:15:58]	<Ymgve>	the talk about radiation reminds me of this contest: http://web.archive.org/web/20060224022835/http://www.symantec.com/specprog/university/
[12:15:59]	<_notch>	no, the monitor
[12:16:02]	<Sankina>	I'd expect access to floppies taking a few cycles
[12:16:08]	<derinerkan>	i really really want to make a mainframe
[12:16:16]	<sbp>	o hai derinerkan
[12:16:22]	<derinerkan>	o hai sbp
[12:16:36]	<sbp>	so there's the question of mainframes, and the question of interstellar-networking
[12:17:07]	<SmokestormX>	If its floppies i'd really love disk accessing sounds.. sounds wierd, but i remeber all the sounds my old ocmputers used to make , and i think it would be good for the computer systems to have a "feel" too
[12:17:11]	<snooze82>	vax mainframes ^^
[12:17:16]	<derinerkan>	mainframes might be built on space stations, then with interstellar networking DCPU's of docked ships serve as thin clients
[12:17:28]	<EmergedDragon7>	_notch: Any chance of tape backups?
[12:17:34]	<Sankina>	right, there will have to be a form of networking
[12:17:35]	<reynir>	is 0x10co.de down?
[12:17:38]	<ehd>	so when there's duct tape for ships, will there be coffee for pilots?
[12:17:40]	<Ymgve>	ugh, tape
[12:17:48]	<Montezuma>	0x10co.de is most time down...
[12:17:50]	<derinerkan>	tape! yes!
[12:17:55]	<reynir>	tape sorting algorithms \o/
[12:18:00]	<SmokestormX>	reynir , its being moved to a new site. http://http://199.26.85.31 works
[12:18:03]	<kcj>	tape!
[12:18:04]	<sbp>	Montezuma: they just moved servers, should be okay now
[12:18:06]	<ehd>	Montezuma: IP has been updated to 199.26.85.31
[12:18:14]	<derinerkan>	tapes are relatively high maintenance so it should work
[12:18:14]	<ar>	having multiple CPUs sharing memory and other resources in a NUMA-like fashion (i.e. - addressing resources from other computer nodes being more costly than local resources) would rock
[12:18:21]	<derinerkan>	would be interesting
[12:18:30]	<Montezuma>	i want a website not a ipadress ^^
[12:18:34]	<Sankina>	...
[12:18:37]	<mozzfly>	cloud networking
[12:18:50]	<Montezuma>	ipad ress höhö
[12:19:13]	<Meltdown>	It'd be neat if local ship networking worked by just sharing a small segment of memory between the systems.
[12:19:21]	<EmergedDragon7>	I love the idea of tapes, simply to add diversity to storage mediums.
[12:19:34]	<Rick>	_conehead: yes, and it was already solved
[12:19:41]	<_notch>	bbl!
[12:19:41]	<derinerkan>	maybe after connecting through a "modem" a specific range of memory can be edited by either side?
[12:19:48]	<_conehead>	Rick - Ah, what was the solution?
[12:19:49]	<derinerkan>	flow control
[12:19:51]	<Montezuma>	another puzzel :O
[12:19:52]	<mozzfly>	ciao notch
[12:19:54]	<Meltdown>	Right
[12:20:05]	<ar>	Meltdown: inter-ship firewire/infiniband networking!
[12:20:11]	<reynir>	SmokestormX: that IP doesnt work for me :o
[12:20:13]	<EmergedDragon7>	_notch: bye, thank you for working on this awesome game!
[12:20:16]	<vidocq_3>	_notch : have you considered providing ROM modules besides floppies ?
[12:20:27]	<SmokestormX>	yea i couldn't do ther trinary part.. i have a notepad full of 0s 1s and 2s
[12:20:28]	<Montezuma>	Notch <3
[12:20:29]	<derinerkan>	so basically, if a computer wants to send it would flip its own RTS, and the other dcpu wouldn't write to that memory
[12:20:30]	<Sankina>	they would probably be more expensive
[12:20:33]	<ar>	Meltdown: with iommu, so that one couldn't get full memory access
[12:21:12]	<derinerkan>	just connect some pins together using a modem, use two as RTS and the rest for data
[12:21:23]	<derinerkan>	6 pins minimum for 4 bit packets
[12:21:25]	<Meltdown>	Well, it couldn't get full memory access anyway. It writes to the addresses that a shared, and if it writes beyond that, it's just writing to its own local memory.
[12:21:28]	<Ymgve>	I wonder how finding other ships will work - space is BIG
[12:21:31]	<derinerkan>	yeah
[12:21:36]	<Meltdown>	That are* shared
[12:21:37]	<derinerkan>	that was my thoughs
[12:21:55]	<Rick>	_conehead: several layers of obfuscation, followed by an hidden dcpu program which led to
[12:21:58]	<Rick>	?highnerd
[12:21:58]	<scybot>	highnerd http://dcpu.com/highnerd/
[12:21:59]	<derinerkan>	ymgve: GPS
[12:22:08]	<derinerkan>	or astroinertial navigation
[12:22:18]	<Ymgve>	derinerkan: that doesn't make sense
[12:22:23]	<ar>	UPS - unversal positioning system
[12:22:24]	<ar>	;)
[12:22:29]	<reynir>	I dont trust that java applet
[12:22:30]	<Ymgve>	derinerkan: GPS doesn't allow you to find other people
[12:22:37]	<derinerkan>	agree on coords
[12:22:42]	<derinerkan>	meet at the coords
[12:22:44]	<Sankina>	I expect a radar of sorts
[12:22:54]	<Ymgve>	I mean finding ships that don't want to be found
[12:23:00]	<derinerkan>	radar
[12:23:02]	<Rick>	that's easy
[12:23:04]	<Rick>	(don't find them)
[12:23:05]	<Rick>	:p
[12:23:21]	<Rick>	also, make it so scanning is active
[12:23:29]	<Rick>	so you can't scan and stay hidden
[12:23:30]	<Ymgve>	One. Ping. Only.
[12:23:53]	<Meltdown>	Alright. Class time. Peace.
[12:24:06]	<Sankina>	NOOOOOOOOOOOO
[12:24:15]	<Rick>	he said bbl
[12:24:18]	<Rick>	it's not like he's gone forever
[12:24:18]	<Rick>	sheesh
[12:24:22]	<Sankina>	(I was joking.)
[12:25:05]	<Ymgve>	I hope it won't be long before we get an alpha where you actually go around in space
[12:25:21]	<Ymgve>	doesn't matter if it's local, just something that lets you get the feel for moving around in space
[12:25:34]	<cparrot>	Hi. any ETA on the spec update ?
[12:26:04]	<FireFly>	NaN seconds
[12:26:20]	<WillWill56>	I just read the entire quick starter on assembly on the wiki, took about 20 min. So easy to understand, I want to start coding NOW!
[12:26:29]	<sbp>	WillWill56: go ahead!
[12:26:30]	<FireFly>	Then do it
[12:26:42]	<cparrot>	FireFly: always better than NaN minutes ;)
[12:26:59]	<WillWill56>	Kinda have to sleep now though... :P
[12:27:10]	<FireFly>	Ah
[12:27:12]	<sbp>	you'll be dreaming in assembler
[12:27:40]	<WillWill56>	Goodness, hope I do dream in assembler.
[12:28:07]	<WillWill56>	Seeya 'round.
[12:28:51]	<reynir>	I dreamt in brainfuck :(
[12:28:56]	<Sankina>	"assambler" is not a language but a program which converts assembly to bytecode
[12:29:07]	<Sankina>	please don't misuse the term, pet peeve :(
[12:29:21]	<reynir>	"assambler" is not a program, if you really want to nit pick
[12:29:53]	<Sankina>	typo
[12:29:58]	<Sankina>	:c
[12:30:03]	* Sankina runs
[12:30:59]	<SinZ>	?projects
[12:31:00]	<scybot>	projects http://www.0xwiki.com/w/index.php?title=Project_List http://0x10cwiki.com/wiki/Developer_Tools
[12:32:26]	<rrivera>	stabbed that leaked client until i got its glsl shaders working on ati now ;p
[12:32:39]	<Rick>	?shader_fix
[12:32:43]	<Rick>	?fixed_shader
[12:32:44]	<brendel>	?log
[12:32:44]	<scybot>	log http://vps.thomascomputerindustries.com/logs/freenode/0x10c-dev
[12:32:47]	<migerh>	o/ reynir
[12:32:50]	<Rick>	?fixed_shaders
[12:32:51]	<Rick>	hrrrrm
[12:32:55]	<rrivera>	oh was it sorted already
[12:32:59]	<Rick>	yeah
[12:33:02]	<Rick>	trying to remember the thing
[12:33:04]	<Rick>	?fixedshader
[12:33:07]	<Rick>	?fixed_shader
[12:33:10]	<Rick>	?fixed-shader
[12:33:12]	<rrivera>	ah ok no worries
[12:33:13]	<Rick>	:|
[12:33:20]	<migerh>	?life
[12:33:21]	<scybot>	life http://0x10co.de/75xza
[12:33:22]	<migerh>	?li*
[12:33:29]	<migerh>	some wildcards would be nice
[12:33:45]	<FireFly>	Apr 12 18:58:27 <^5> .remember fixed_shader http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4838268/dcpu.jar
[12:34:07]	<Rick>	guess someone did a forget
[12:34:30]	<reynir>	hey migerh
[12:34:59]	<reynir>	migerh: did you see my easily fixable bug in your memmove? :)
[12:35:28]	<entrusC>	is anyone here still interested in minecraft or are you all about 0x10c now?
[12:35:38]	<migerh>	yes. check for C == 0 should suffice, right?
[12:35:39]	<reynir>	the fix was ife len, 0 set pc pop :)
[12:35:42]	<reynir>	yea
[12:35:49]	<migerh>	did you fix it in the gist?
[12:35:50]	<reynir>	it's kind of a corner case :P
[12:35:55]	<reynir>	uh, sorry no
[12:35:56]	<spasm>	what is this minecraft you speak of?
[12:36:05]	<migerh>	np, i'll fix it
[12:36:24]	<entrusC>	lol - i see ...
[12:36:31]	<spasm>	:P
[12:36:47]	<reynir>	migerh: it's also kind of silly to ask to move 0 bytes :P
[12:37:02]	<entrusC>	it's just that I'm currently developing some kind of scifi minecraft ...
[12:37:44]	<migerh>	reynir, people are silly
[12:37:58]	<spasm>	well, this channel is for dcpu development
[12:38:12]	<reynir>	Actually I think the "move 0 bytes" is a bug in my editor :o
[12:38:22]	<reynir>	I'm not copying the newline
[12:38:53]	<SinZ>	what is the easiest way to test DCPU-16 ASM
[12:39:04]	<reynir>	SinZ: making a proof
[12:42:06]	<entrusC>	.. yeah - but I'm still interested in notch's new game as well, of course :)
[12:42:57]	<SinZ>	entrusC: who isn't
[12:43:08]	<spasm>	my mother?
[12:43:24]	<SinZ>	alot of people want to play minecraft on the DCPU
[12:43:48]	<reynir>	is that true?
[12:44:24]	<SinZ>	reynir: people that dont understand computers, yes
[12:44:42]	<Ymgve>	you might be able to port minicraft
[12:46:12]	<entrusC>	lol - it surely won't work on a DCPU - because it's too slow for realtime 3D graphic ...
[12:46:41]	<SinZ>	that and alot of 32bit computers cant handle minecraft
[12:46:42]	<entrusC>	did notch say anything if he will return later?
[12:46:45]	<SinZ>	how will a 16bit one handle it
[12:46:48]	<entrusC>	true
[12:46:50]	<SinZ>	he said bbl
[12:47:07]	<entrusC>	but 16bit is not the main problem I think ...
[12:47:53]	<reynir>	main problem? for what?
[12:47:56]	<Ymgve>	no, the main problem is the 100khz speed
[12:50:11]	<rmmh>	man, I missed notch?
[12:50:27]	<rmmh>	fucking timezones
[12:50:43]	<spasm>	lol
[12:50:49]	<gaborsz>	:D
[12:50:57]	<Ymgve>	Has Notch detailed anything about ship movement? Do we have inertia, and are there local warp/intersolar warp like elite?
[12:51:06]	<rmmh>	Ymgve: probably haven't gotten there yet
[12:51:12]	<FireFly>	.quote add <rmmh> man, I missed notch? <rmmh> fucking timezones * _notch has joined #0x10c-dev
[12:51:12]	<scybot>	FireFly: quote added.
[12:51:30]	<Anderkent>	>13:51 -!- _notch is now known as Guest40256
[12:51:36]	<Guest40256>	omg
[12:51:43]	<King_Rat>	rmmh, i love you and i love skybot
[12:51:48]	<Anderkent>	kinda breaks the quote
[12:52:11]	<Sky___>	Hey guys! Ive taken a few screenshots and posted them on the 0x10c forum so that people could see some of Notch's ideas if they missed him on IRC:
[12:52:12]	<Sky___>	http://www.0x10cforum.com/forum/m/4932880/viewthread/2824408-notch-chats-about-gameplay
[12:52:13]	<rmmh>	_notch: (I'm scaevolus from reddit / mcregion etc)
[12:52:13]	<gaborsz>	There's part of the log with _notch from earlier: http://pastebin.com/sERj38F7
[12:52:20]	<_notch>	hi rmmh!
[12:52:26]	<rmmh>	hello!
[12:52:29]	<_notch>	you're a talented guy!
[12:52:48]	<FireFly>	Anderkent, well, same hostname as before
[12:53:00]	<Anderkent>	I just wish the 0x10cforum wasn't so cluttered
[12:53:07]	<Anderkent>	FireFly: I have joins ignored, so maybe :P
[12:53:22]	<Anderkent>	anyway
[12:53:34]	<Anderkent>	13:50 < Ymgve> Has Notch detailed anything about ship movement? Do we have inertia, and are there local warp/intersolar warp like elite?
[12:53:41]	<Anderkent>	13:50 < Ymgve> Has Notch detailed anything about ship movement? Do we have inertia, and are there local warp/intersolar warp like elite?
[12:53:42]	<rmmh>	_notch: thanks, though it's easier to polish someone else's code than make it yourself
[12:53:45]	<Anderkent>	sorry
[12:53:46]	<Anderkent>	i hate my client
[12:53:53]	<Zackman94>	there is inertia
[12:54:18]	<_notch>	you think? I'm the exact opposite. Perhaps that makes us compatible, haha
[12:54:26]	<rmmh>	_notch: did you see the minesweeper game? http://0x10co.de/lqnit
[12:54:40]	<gaborsz>	_notch You don't mind about the chat logs right? :D
[12:54:50]	<gaborsz>	I mean posting them
[12:54:58]	<_notch>	yeah, loved the minesweeper intro
[12:55:14]	<_notch>	and feel free to post! I'd appreciate a notice saying I might change my mind though, haha
[12:55:28]	<gaborsz>	did do :D
[12:55:28]	<rmmh>	Sky___: why screenshots instead of text?
[12:55:30]	<_notch>	it bugs me when people claim I've promised stuff I only brainstormed about
[12:55:38]	<Sky___>	The 0x10c is great for letting your imagination run wild, we are all totally cool with notchs decisions! ;D
[12:55:45]	<Anderkent>	no way, you're legally bound to provide the functionality detailed in the log now
[12:55:46]	<Zackman94>	_notch will there be any of these weapons? http://www.0x10cforum.com/forum/m/4932880/viewthread/2823033-weapons-what-might-me-see
[12:55:55]	<kcj>	_notch, Think you could spend some time in #0x10c later to ask some general questions?
[12:56:10]	<_notch>	at the moment, I want to keep my mind as open as possible
[12:56:20]	<_notch>	but yes
[12:56:21]	<Stushla>	_notch, is building a ship going to work similiarly to GMod? i.e. objects have input/output that you connect up to things in various ways
[12:56:34]	<_notch>	Sounds like a good way to do it, yes
[12:56:35]	<rmmh>	_notch: oh, wrt cga/ega-- how about letting people define custom 16-color palettes? you could do the cool palette switching tricks from the 80s to do rainbow effects
[12:56:49]	<_notch>	yeah :D
[12:56:50]	<Sky___>	you're an inspiration notch =D
[12:56:57]	<_notch>	oh thank you!
[12:57:08]	<King_Rat>	i think i probably agree
[12:57:10]	<kcj>	Of course he is. :)
[12:57:38]	<Zackman94>	_notch's reaction to the inspiration comment: http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/oh-stop-it-you.png
[12:57:39]	<Lerc>	I just did a test of 16 from EGA 64, I deem it to be acceptable :-)
[12:57:45]	<Ymgve>	_notch: can I borrow your xbox so I can play Fez?
[12:57:56]	<_notch>	haha, yeah, pretty accurate
[12:57:57]	<King_Rat>	are we posting meme faces now?
[12:57:59]	<_notch>	and NO, IT IS MY XBOX
[12:58:21]	<Ymgve>	the xbox is distracting you from coding 24/7!
[12:58:34]	<_notch>	I will allow that. :D
[12:58:43]	<_notch>	sleep and tf2 take up more time than the xbox anyways
[12:58:44]	<kcj>	Is there or will there be a nop instruction?
[12:58:47]	<Zackman94>	If he coded 24/7 we would get a game centered around coding... wait..
[12:58:52]	<rmmh>	kcj: SET A, A is good enough for me~
[12:58:59]	<King_Rat>	I didn't know you were still tf2ing
[12:59:14]	<Stushla>	_notch, why are there no interrupts for the DCPU-16?
[12:59:18]	<_notch>	set 1, 1 works too, haha
[12:59:25]	<Ymgve>	btw, how do display refresh work on the DCPU?
[12:59:31]	<rmmh>	Sky___: can you remove your link in the forum?
[12:59:32]	<_notch>	because I kinda dislike them. :/
[12:59:36]	<sstagg>	so, are there actually video interface specs yet?
[12:59:37]	<reynir>	kcj: there are plenty of nop operations
[12:59:42]	<derinerkan>	it refreshes display
[12:59:43]	<_notch>	screen immedately refreshes all the time
[12:59:52]	<reynir>	mod 0, 0 is my favorite
[12:59:57]	<Baughn>	Will any kind of DRM be possible for our apps?
[12:59:59]	<_notch>	you can to double buffering later on by switching the memory mapped regions
[13:00:04]	<reynir>	lol Baughn
[13:00:05]	<_ikke_>	Baughn: I hope not
[13:00:10]	<_notch>	the dcpu won't have any DRM support
[13:00:12]	<Stushla>	because that means we'll have to have a cycle of checking all sensors or something like that which could eat some power
[13:00:17]	<Baughn>	Then I shall just have to obfuscate them horribly.
[13:00:18]	<Sky___>	rmmh which link? the one to the IRC chat?
[13:00:21]	<rmmh>	yes.
[13:00:28]	<Sky___>	will do that! sorry
[13:00:32]	<derinerkan>	baughn that's the beauty of being able to write code :D
[13:00:33]	<Ymgve>	Speak for yourself, I will make my software DRMd!
[13:00:36]	<rmmh>	just don't want to get flooded right now
[13:00:41]	<Ymgve>	if it's not in my ship, it won't work
[13:00:47]	<derinerkan>	do what you want cause a pirate is free
[13:00:58]	<derinerkan>	i will pirate your code ymgve >:D
[13:01:01]	<reynir>	_notch: have you seen my brainfuck compiler written in dasm? 0x10co.de/sqll6
[13:01:01]	<Lerc>	Anhoo _notch, please do consider this layout for pixel data as a graphics mode. Light on memory and gets decent expressiveness, but not so much a good pixel artist can't do magic.
[13:01:04]	<_notch>	I am so confused about how to think about the dcpu. I mean, it's a fictional CPU that I just emulated because I want to have it in the game in that setting
[13:01:07]	<rmmh>	_notch: cpu-triggered interrupts are useful for OSes also
[13:01:07]	<_ikke_>	Ymgve: Nobody would want your software anyway
[13:01:09]	<Baughn>	derinerkan: I'm making up a scheme dialect for the thing. :P
[13:01:10]	<_notch>	does that mean it's a real cpu or not? haha
[13:01:13]	<Ymgve>	_ikke_: that hurts
[13:01:16]	<Lerc>	http://fingswotidun.com/dcpu16/GraphicsMode1.png
[13:01:32]	<Baughn>	rmmh: Not.. really. int 0x20, etc.?
[13:01:41]	<derinerkan>	notch: it's not as it doesn't have any hardware
[13:01:42]	<_ikke_>	Ymgve: Sorry, was a shot for an open goal ;)
[13:01:45]	<Baughn>	Not without memory protection
[13:01:52]	<SinZ>	_notch: we just need someone to actually build the DCPU and make hardware for it...
[13:01:55]	<Ymgve>	_ikke_: i will come for you and destroy your tiny ship
[13:01:59]	<derinerkan>	like you haven't designed how the actual chip will be like so it's not a real cpu
[13:02:00]	<Stushla>	There should be a collector's edition of 0x10c which comes with a fully functioning DCPU-16.
[13:02:04]	<_ikke_>	Ymgve: I'm waiting for it
[13:02:07]	<vidocq_3>	_notch : have you considered providing some kind of ROM modules besides floppies ?
[13:02:10]	<_notch>	oh god that would be aweome
[13:02:11]	<SinZ>	ultimate merchindice, actual computer parts from the game
[13:02:18]	<_notch>	floppies and hdds
[13:02:24]	<Baughn>	vidocq_3: Tape! :3
[13:02:26]	<Anderkent>	derinerkan: I thought someone designed the dcpu in VHDL
[13:02:27]	<Stushla>	you have the moneyz, you can make it happen!
[13:02:28]	<Baughn>	Would be nifty
[13:02:29]	<vidocq_3>	:)
[13:02:30]	<gaborsz>	_notch if you'll allow two out of topic questions: will there be probes with their own hardware? can you take over another ship completely?
[13:02:31]	<Anderkent>	so it's fairly close to being real
[13:02:39]	<reynir>	argh, too much text
[13:02:44]	<derinerkan>	it's a real cpu then
[13:02:46]	<Ymgve>	_notch: will there be an action replay mk 6
[13:02:49]	<Baughn>	Some kind of slow, linear, but high-capacity storage
[13:02:50]	<kcj>	_notch, Floppies, tape drives or both?
[13:02:51]	<Baughn>	I.e. tape
[13:02:53]	<Zackman94>	God we should make the collectors addition happen!
[13:03:05]	<Zackman94>	* edition
[13:03:15]	<derinerkan>	tape reading would especially be slow
[13:03:16]	<Baughn>	Hehe, wonder how long it'll be 'till someone implement Zippy for it
[13:03:22]	<derinerkan>	but it's also easier to do
[13:03:30]	<_notch>	no tape! floppies and hdds :D
[13:03:37]	<kcj>	Aw.
[13:03:42]	<Baughn>	HDDs?
[13:03:47]	<kcj>	^
[13:03:51]	<_notch>	hard drives. 10 megs! WOW
[13:03:52]	<Baughn>	I still remember the giant 20MB module I had. That kind of thing?
[13:04:01]	<_notch>	or whatever. Something tiny. :D
[13:04:02]	<SinZ>	_notch: can we play minecraft music via multiple floppies?
[13:04:03]	<Zengief>	I thought the cost of fabbing new chips was in the 100k range
[13:04:04]	<Anderkent>	So is communication between ships made by shooting floppies at each other?
[13:04:11]	<Anderkent>	Or do we get laser internet
[13:04:16]	<kcj>	SinZ, lol
[13:04:17]	<derinerkan>	make HDD's as big as a pallet :P
[13:04:20]	<Anderkent>	shooting floppies would be so cute
[13:04:22]	<Baughn>	No internet, but we'd better get radio. :P
[13:04:24]	<_notch>	100k? I wonder how much a collectors edition would sell..
[13:04:27]	<Baughn>	Then we can make internet.
[13:04:31]	<sbp>	rmmh: I've been running your Life simulator for a while now
[13:04:33]	<derinerkan>	we want radios
[13:04:36]	<sbp>	rmmh: it's almost stabilised!
[13:04:38]	<Stushla>	We need a way to play MIDIs, I want to fly with Bubble Bobble int he background.
[13:04:43]	<_ikke_>	what would be the radio latency
[13:04:44]	<Stushla>	in the*
[13:04:51]	<Baughn>	_ikke_: Distance/C
[13:05:08]	<Ymgve>	if you don't play this while flying you suck: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3iki3-v6vY
[13:05:09]	<_ikke_>	How is C defined in the game?
[13:05:09]	<scybot>	Ymgve: c64 music elite docking music. - length 2m 18s - rated 4.64/5.0 (11) - 4,410 views - ratcliffave on 2010.03.31
[13:05:10]	<SinZ>	Can we have a worlds useless robot in the ship?
[13:05:13]	<reynir>	what
[13:05:18]	<_notch>	there will be radios. Several kinds. Normal ones work within your game session. Multiverse communicator arrays work across the multiverse. Hyperverse commuication arrays lets you talk to real world servers
[13:05:22]	<reynir>	what's the new IP for 0x10co.de?
[13:05:26]	<Zengief>	A thousand people at $100 ...?
[13:05:34]	<Ymgve>	_notch. wait what
[13:05:38]	<migerh>	reynir, 199.26.85.31
[13:05:39]	<Zackman94>	_notch, will cloaking take up a lot of processing power? that might be a good way to limit it...
[13:05:40]	<bia>	Im working on an emu. Have notch announced any memory map yet?
[13:05:50]	<_notch>	no, but a lot of generator power
[13:05:54]	<Anderkent>	Within your game session? As in only what you see?
[13:05:57]	<Ymgve>	_notch: hyperverse? wouldn't that enable people to exploit real-CPU power?
[13:06:04]	<_notch>	only people in your shard
[13:06:05]	<rmmh>	_notch: I had a radio proposal for in-system radios https://gist.github.com/2322687
[13:06:14]	<reynir>	_notch: http://199.26.85.31/sqll6 <-- optimizing brainfuck compiler \o/
[13:06:16]	<_notch>	Ymgve: There's no way to stop that, and the communcation will be kind of slow
[13:06:20]	<SinZ>	_notch: This better be possible >:( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IY0mDRrqcVU
[13:06:20]	<scybot>	SinZ: Still Alive (on Floppy Drives) - length 2m 5s - rated 4.98/5.0 (5358) - 444,843 views - sammy1am on 2011.10.22
[13:06:22]	<Stushla>	Will the generator run on any sort of fuel or just have a constant wattage which is consumed by components?
[13:06:26]	<bia>	Oh notch is here :d
[13:06:28]	<_notch>	constant wattage
[13:06:32]	<Stushla>	:(
[13:06:42]	<Zackman94>	Infinite power!
[13:06:47]	<_notch>	science magic! It survived for 0x10c years, after all, haha
[13:06:47]	<Baughn>	_notch: Can we also have a form of passive stealth through /not/ emitting lots of energy?
[13:06:50]	<Stushla>	Can we at least have oxygen that runs out?
[13:06:59]	<_notch>	yes baughn that's the idea
[13:07:03]	<Anderkent>	Well that's the only thing that makes sense, otherwise why didnt it run out when players were sleeping
[13:07:07]	<Ymgve>	Baughn: you can probably have passive stealth by staying the fuck far away from any planets
[13:07:14]	<Zackman94>	it seems your generator runs on troll science...
[13:07:37]	<Stushla>	I guy standing on a sheet of metal holding 2 magnets
[13:07:42]	<Zackman94>	FLIGHT!
[13:07:51]	<Baughn>	How much energy will be needed to heat the ship and run life support, anywya?
[13:07:59]	<derinerkan>	anderkent: they probably didn't breathe in cryo sleep
[13:08:06]	<Baughn>	Seems to run into kilowatts in apollo, but..
[13:08:07]	<Anderkent>	I was talking about generator fuel
[13:08:09]	<Anderkent>	not oxygen
[13:08:18]	<derinerkan>	turn engines off
[13:08:19]	<derinerkan>	drift
[13:08:22]	<reynir>	can we please talk about code?
[13:08:26]	<bia>	_notch: when will you release info about hardware mapped RAM? :)
[13:08:27]	<reynir>	programming*
[13:08:28]	<derinerkan>	use thrusters to fix direction
[13:08:29]	<SinZ>	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjfkcdzPpLw&feature=relmfu
[13:08:30]	<scybot>	SinZ: Want You Gone (Portal 2 Credits) - length 2m 16s - rated 4.99/5.0 (1729) - 91,526 views - sammy1am on 2011.12.07
[13:08:33]	<derinerkan>	will go for a while
[13:08:47]	<rmmh>	guys, please try to keep volume low
[13:08:49]	<Jerub>	rmmh: sounds incredibly simplistic. what about speed of light propagation and redshift?
[13:08:51]	<derinerkan>	we want floppy disc choirs!
[13:09:06]	<rmmh>	Jerub: it's also possible to emulate on the server efficiently.
[13:09:14]	<Baughn>	Radio propagation delays are not hard
[13:09:21]	<SinZ>	derinerkan: its worth the waste of power
[13:09:23]	<Anderkent>	Jerub: assumption is local systems are not that large
[13:09:27]	<Baughn>	I wouldn't suggest emulating relativity..
[13:09:32]	<derinerkan>	of course
[13:09:32]	<Anderkent>	I wouldn't say 'solar systems' in that proposal
[13:09:43]	<Zackman94>	So you said the single player is free? does that mean entirely free or buy the game then pay to play online?
[13:09:43]	<derinerkan>	floppy choirs or MACHINE GUN CHOIRS
[13:09:46]	<Ymgve>	you can't really do relativity in a multiplayer environment
[13:10:08]	<Baughn>	Yeah, that's the problem. :P
[13:10:12]	<SinZ>	We need sci-fi doors, with the proper sound effects!
[13:10:15]	<Anderkent>	yep, the server reference frame will always be priviledged
[13:10:23]	<warlordluke>	_notch how far along in the DCPU16?
[13:10:35]	<Stushla>	did 100 people joing this channel after Notch?
[13:10:43]	<hachque>	pretty much
[13:10:44]	<_ikke_>	Stushla: probably
[13:10:47]	<WillWill56>	_notch, I was going to type a long, witty message about this game, but I thought these three words would suffice: I WANT IT!
[13:10:48]	<reynir>	jesus christ, stop flooding
[13:10:50]	<Stushla>	that's actually quite low
[13:10:53]	<SinZ>	Stushla: I was in the channel, but left after awhile, came back though
[13:10:55]	<Zackman94>	that's how the internet works
[13:10:56]	<WillWill56>	Don't mind waiting but it sounds awesome.
[13:11:01]	<enygmata>	notch is here o.O
[13:11:09]	<Anderkent>	It will calm down eventually
[13:11:10]	<enygmata>	what is going on
[13:11:23]	<Ymgve>	_notch: you never answered about the action replay!
[13:11:37]	<net4all>	quick check: is anyone working on a cross-compiling version of gcc?
[13:11:38]	<lucian>	_notch: are there any RNG devices in-game, perhaps to be bought? it seems to me entropy is scarse on the dcpu
[13:11:53]	<Ymgve>	lucian: radar noise, perhaps
[13:11:56]	<Zackman94>	_notch appears to be AFK
[13:11:57]	<lucian>	net4all: there's a llvm backend and a few from-scratch C compilers
[13:12:01]	<reynir>	net4all: I think perhaps some are, but I think it sounds like a Bad Idea®
[13:12:15]	<lucian>	Ymgve: sure, if radar has actual entropy
[13:12:22]	<Anderkent>	lucian: there's a channel to the real internet, you can get randomness from outside
[13:12:23]	<SinZ>	Zackman94: his hiding from us
[13:12:29]	<net4all>	lucian: perhaps a link to the backend? :)
[13:12:31]	<Anderkent>	latency shouldn't be that much of an issue
[13:12:34]	<lucian>	Anderkent: ah, there is? cool
[13:12:36]	<Lerc>	Buy entropy in-game. earn money by entropy mining.
[13:12:51]	<Baughn>	net4all: 64kW memory, less memory-mapped devices.. and you want to use gcc?
[13:12:56]	<lucian>	otherwise it seemed to me like battles between automated weapons would be won by whoever had the most entropy
[13:13:06]	<Lerc>	Getting close to bitcoin there.
[13:13:07]	<lucian>	Lerc: that sounds awesome
[13:13:18]	<tiffany>	"64kW memory", since when is memory measured in watts
[13:13:28]	<Baughn>	Words.
[13:13:29]	<derinerkan>	hahahahaha
[13:13:31]	<tiffany>	oh
[13:13:32]	<tiffany>	:s
[13:13:32]	<enygmata>	lol
[13:13:37]	<kanzaka>	huh?
[13:13:41]	<Anderkent>	lucian I dont see how that follows, you're assuming targeting algorithms are public knowledge
[13:13:48]	<WillWill56>	I'd like to strap a dcpu to a large missile, hopefully to make it a homing missile, hope they're not too expensive.
[13:13:56]	<Baughn>	kibiwords, I suppose. ^^;
[13:14:00]	<net4all>	Baughn: i have used gcc for a lot smaller things than the dcpu-16
[13:14:06]	<Edzorg>	I am super excited for this new game
[13:14:07]	<Anderkent>	WillWill56: you get 3 cpus on your basic ship, that doesnt sound like 'missile-level cheap'
[13:14:09]	<lucian>	Anderkent: they can be deduced, or software can be sold
[13:14:11]	<DJUrsus>	WillWill56: How about laser-guided?
[13:14:25]	<lucian>	Anderkent: it's easy to exploit lack of entropy in common software, and with some effort even in unique software
[13:14:28]	<Baughn>	net4all: I haven't. The code comes out less bloated for smaller targets?
[13:14:33]	<tiffany>	laser guided missiles still require an onboard computer :/
[13:14:38]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	To be fair, some missiles cost in the range of a million each :P
[13:14:43]	<SinZ>	_notch: will there be airlocks?
[13:14:54]	<reynir>	.quote reynir
[13:14:54]	<scybot>	reynir: [2/3] 2012-04-16 <reynir> I'll have my ship's missile interception system run brainfuck
[13:14:54]	<Edzorg>	_notch: hi
[13:15:04]	<Edzorg>	\to bia hello
[13:15:07]	<Edzorg>	\bia hi
[13:15:09]	<lucian>	that channel to the internet gives me an idea: charge for compilers-as-a-service
[13:15:10]	<Baughn>	lucian: Picking apart a PRNG on the fly, along with whatever algorithm it's running? Hard goal.
[13:15:13]	<Edzorg>	\msg bia sa
[13:15:13]	<net4all>	Baughn: not sure what you mean by bloated, but if you skip the std-lib and stuff you get small enough code
[13:15:14]	<lucian>	charge in-game that is
[13:15:20]	<Anderkent>	sure, but that's a hard won advantage ;) If your algorithm can model the opponent, you deserve to win
[13:15:30]	<FireFly>	Edzorg, looking for '/'?
[13:15:43]	<DJUrsus>	tiffany: Yes, but it could be a small tracking computer, rather than general-purpose.
[13:16:02]	<deltab__>	tiffany: "When we say it's the most powerful computer on the market, we mean it uses the most electricity"
[13:16:15]	<lucian>	Baughn: indeed. but if a particular PRNG was widely distributed, not so hard
[13:16:59]	<Baughn>	lucian: Depends. Some PRNGs require ludicrous amounts of cpu time to crack, after all.
[13:17:08]	<Baughn>	The DCPU ain't fast
[13:17:11]	<Anderkent>	If your opponent is moving randomly you don't really need to pick his algorithm apart, you win by having a good algorithm
[13:17:16]	<WillWill56>	I was thinking I'd wirelessly control the missile if possible...
[13:17:19]	<FireFly>	So then keep your specific values secret, and seed it often with new data from the radar
[13:17:30]	<lucian>	Anderkent: sure, but think of it the other way. your opponent will want an advantage too, and that might be a better rng
[13:17:49]	<Baughn>	Or fill a HDD with random numbers, and use that
[13:17:57]	<lucian>	Baughn: good point. although LCG is probably doable
[13:18:04]	<Zackman94>	what's the best way to learn programing?
[13:18:13]	<lucian>	Baughn: yes, that would be a solution, collect entropy constantly and store it
[13:18:18]	<Edzorg>	Just become bro Zackman
[13:18:25]	<reynir>	migerh: so what have you been up to?
[13:18:26]	<Stushla>	how fun is mastermind when you only know what colours are in the correct position?
[13:18:35]	<Rick>	...crack...prngs? :v:
[13:18:38]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: Depends on your goal. Not the same if you want to just write DCPU code as if you want to become a career programmer.
[13:18:42]	<Anderkent>	Zackman94: google pyton tutorials for the very basics, then start doing stuff like project euler
[13:18:47]	<rmmh>	lucian: I've implemented a MWC RNG that doesn't have the low bit biases that LCGs do.
[13:18:57]	<Rick>	sup rmmh
[13:19:02]	<Rick>	you missed the notch visit :3
[13:19:10]	<Baughn>	lucian: Use a cryptographic PRNG, store for later. Probably too slow to use in real-time. :P
[13:19:13]	<rmmh>	no, he's still here, we just got 100 people from the forums
[13:19:14]	<cafaxo>	@Zackman94: first read some books or so, then start out with some small projects and then just lerning by doing ^^
[13:19:21]	<Rick>	oh
[13:19:23]	<Rick>	whaaat
[13:19:26]	<Rick>	he came back? swank~
[13:19:27]	<Edzorg>	Notch(or anyone), do you know of, or have you written any good starting points to writing games in java? For an intermediate/advanced java developer
[13:19:28]	<_notch>	i am kind if afkish :D
[13:19:29]	<Baughn>	lucian: Though AES doesn't actually take that much CPU-time
[13:19:32]	<lucian>	rmmh: yeah, i know. and that's cool. does it run on dcpu?
[13:19:37]	<jdiez17>	hey guys
[13:19:45]	<reynir>	hey jdiez17
[13:19:49]	<jdiez17>	did I miss something? I read something about some chat logs with notch
[13:19:53]	<rmmh>	lucian: http://0x10co.de/3odrv
[13:19:57]	<lucian>	Baughn: even AES is useless without no real entropy, but yeah it's not as big a problem as my initial question suggests
[13:20:04]	<lucian>	rmmh: awesome :)
[13:20:18]	<kcj>	This channel is probably going to double in size by the time I wake up.
[13:20:19]	<Baughn>	lucian: That's what /dev/random is for. :P
[13:20:25]	<lucian>	rmmh: good distribution
[13:20:37]	<Baughn>	You only need *one* block of true randomness
[13:20:40]	<lucian>	Baughn: right, but can you get the output of your /dev/random into the game easily?
[13:20:49]	<Rick>	offloading!!
[13:20:50]	<Rick>	:D
[13:20:59]	<Baughn>	lucian: As I said, you only need one. Then feed that through AES repeatedly.
[13:20:59]	<Ymgve>	gah, do I have to learn quaternions?
[13:21:01]	<jdiez17>	okay, so what did _notch say? reynir, Rick, give me a summary!
[13:21:08]	* kcj wonders if people think /dev/ means development.
[13:21:10]	<Zackman94>	Thanks for the advice guys, I actually started to get into python at one point, but got distracted by other things. I'm hoping 0x10c will give me the push to really learn it
[13:21:13]	<Rick>	jdiez17: um, random stuff about games
[13:21:17]	<Rick>	*0x10c
[13:21:18]	<Rick>	:D
[13:21:19]	<FireFly>	I think stuff like entropy from input is enough, really
[13:21:20]	<lucian>	kcj: heh
[13:21:21]	<jdiez17>	nothing specific?
[13:21:22]	<Rick>	nothing really significant
[13:21:27]	<jdiez17>	fu
[13:21:37]	<Baughn>	FireFly: Depends on the combat model
[13:21:42]	<rmmh>	and standard disclaimer that everything is subject to change
[13:21:45]	<derinerkan>	cosmic radiation could make a rng couldn't it?
[13:21:46]	<Rick>	jdiez17: he talkedd about his ideas for the future, etc
[13:21:49]	<Lord_DeathMatch>	what about a badly configured sensor for random input? :P
[13:21:50]	<tiffany>	when I went to generate a key using gnupg it whined that I didn't have a big enough entropy pool :x
[13:21:58]	<jdiez17>	what about dcpu? no love for dcpu?
[13:21:59]	<Baughn>	derinerkan: Absolutely
[13:22:03]	<Rick>	he's here for the dcpu love
[13:22:08]	<derinerkan>	i mean, i looked at some of the seti@home data my pc was processing
[13:22:09]	<Ymgve>	tiffany: shoulda smashed your keyboard more
[13:22:12]	<derinerkan>	it seemed pretty random
[13:22:17]	<ehd>	jdiez17: lots of love, there's going to be a summary on reddit/forums i guess
[13:22:18]	<reynir>	Can't we somehow enforce that this is the -dev channeL?
[13:22:38]	<jdiez17>	ehd: uh, but what did he say?
[13:22:41]	<cafaxo>	@notch: i'm not really up to date here, but will there be something like a network interface for the dcpu?
[13:22:41]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: If you're interested in DCPU programming, Python ain't gonna help you.
[13:22:44]	<Rick>	given notch's presence that'll be a bit difficult :p
[13:22:54]	<Baughn>	cafaxo: How do you like radio?
[13:22:57]	<rmmh>	cafaxo: 08:05:07 < _notch> there will be radios. Several kinds. Normal ones work within your game session. Multiverse communicator arrays work across the multiverse. Hyperverse commuication arrays lets you talk to real world servers
[13:23:04]	<deltab__>	jdiez17: no universal memory map
[13:23:05]	<Zackman94>	Baughn: what will
[13:23:06]	<Zengief>	jdiez17 he only gave us a few huge secrets that now we can't tell to anyone.
[13:23:07]	<ehd>	jdiez17: sorry, i can't recollect that all now for you :(
[13:23:08]	<WillWill56>	I checked all the channels and notch was on this one so :P
[13:23:18]	<tiffany>	baughn: it's better to go into something like this knowing something than knowing nothing
[13:23:23]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: How good do you want to get? How much time investment do you want?
[13:23:29]	<lucian>	jdiez17: something interesting dcpu-related is likely interrupts at 60hz
[13:23:57]	<derinerkan>	wouldn't calling an interrupt repeatedly like that lag the program
[13:24:06]	<Rick>	oh that's right, he was asking about interrupts
[13:24:06]	<Zackman94>	I want to be able to write simple programs in DCPU and go from there, like maybe simple navigation, turning off and on systems as a start
[13:24:17]	<jdiez17>	?log
[13:24:17]	<scybot>	log http://vps.thomascomputerindustries.com/logs/freenode/0x10c-dev
[13:24:24]	<DJUrsus>	derinerkan: That's how every modern OS works.
[13:24:28]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: So.. you already have another career, I assume.
[13:24:30]	<Sky___>	rmmh I also put that disclaimer in my 0x10c forum post!
[13:24:31]	<derinerkan>	huh
[13:24:39]	<jdiez17>	also someone whould tell notch that everyone can see his IP
[13:24:43]	<Zackman94>	I'm still in high school
[13:24:44]	<derinerkan>	i'll read up on that then
[13:25:04]	<DJUrsus>	jdiez17: Also his epidermis.
[13:25:11]	<_ikke_>	Zackman94: First start with reading from and writing to a console :P
[13:25:16]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: That's okay. I'd say.. learn (very simple) vector math, trigonometry, and C.
[13:25:39]	<Zackman94>	I know trig, and I'm in grade 12 physics
[13:25:55]	<Zackman94>	C is really what I need
[13:25:56]	* Baughn notes that 'grade 12 physics' means nothing to people outside your school
[13:26:06]	<WillWill56>	I have no idea what I'd use a 10 mb hard drive for, seems so big when I think about the tiny numbers and text strings I'll be storing.
[13:26:07]	<Baughn>	But I'll take it you have a basic idea.
[13:26:37]	<FireFly>	It *is* rather big, WillWill56
[13:26:39]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: Grab a copy of Introduction to Algorithms.
[13:26:42]	<tiffany>	you can fit a linux kernel into 6mb
[13:26:53]	<FireFly>	It's kinda funny how modern games are tens of gigabytes
[13:27:00]	<FireFly>	It's pretty insane really
[13:27:01]	<Zackman94>	alright
[13:27:07]	<derinerkan>	WillWill56: permanently inserted floppy is the answer, just 1.44megs there
[13:27:08]	<tiffany>	most of that is not-very-compressed JPEG texture files
[13:27:11]	<net4all>	Zackman94: what about vector and matrix mathematics?
[13:27:21]	<net4all>	(very usefull for 3d-stuff)
[13:27:22]	<brendel>	FireFly: the size of recent game tends to decrease
[13:27:35]	<WillWill56>	Hey ZackMan94, seems you're in a similar boat to me.
[13:27:41]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/electrical-engineering-and-computer-science/6-046j-introduction-to-algorithms-sma-5503-fall-2005/ <- Here's the matching lectures. Free, unlike the book, but you'll want the book.
[13:27:58]	<_notch>	I'm behind seven proxies, I don't care. Also tor
[13:28:00]	<jdiez17>	is http://dcpu.com/highnerd/ an official emulator?
[13:28:01]	<scybot>	jdiez17: that url has been posted 5 times in the past 10 hours by Blecki, mappum, Rick, and Twisol (last linked by Rick 2 hours, 3 minutes ago).
[13:28:11]	<rmmh>	yes, jdiez17
[13:28:14]	<jdiez17>	WOOT
[13:28:23]	<jdiez17>	*nerdgasm*
[13:28:34]	<Rick>	it's a slightly newer version of notch's dcpu code
[13:28:35]	<sstagg>	ro
[13:28:38]	<Zackman94>	I know vector addition and subtraction... but I know I need to learn more. I start calculus next year
[13:28:46]	<jdiez17>	okay, time to get hackin'
[13:29:02]	<WillWill56>	Is there a dcpu emulator for android? That's all I have access to at the moment, in bed :P
[13:29:03]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: You won't need calculus for this. :P
[13:29:04]	<reynir>	I thought dcpu.com was owned by some russian guys
[13:29:11]	<Baughn>	Well it /helps/ - it always helps - but not /need/
[13:29:14]	<reynir>	I dont trust java applets from russian guys
[13:29:15]	<Ymgve>	notch "bought them out"
[13:29:17]	<Rick>	.remember highnerd-diff http://pastie.org/pastes/3802184/text?key=to03bv10exlrc1dwoeua
[13:29:18]	<scybot>	Rick: done.
[13:29:25]	<Ymgve>	with broken kneecaps
[13:29:30]	<FireFly>	Rick, nice
[13:29:32]	<FireFly>	thanks
[13:29:37]	<Zackman94>	that's good to hear
[13:30:05]	<Rick>	OH YEAH
[13:30:08]	<Rick>	_notch
[13:30:11]	<Ymgve>	_notch: will there be something like an intergalactig GPS?
[13:30:13]	<Rick>	you have a bug in VirtualKeyboard
[13:30:21]	<sstagg>	_notch mentioned an 'official' emulator, can't find any reference to it tho?
[13:30:22]	<Ymgve>	that gives your exact location in space
[13:30:23]	<Rick>	it's harmless, but it's a silly bug
[13:30:23]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: This should be enough material for a month or two, easily. If you decide you want to learn *programming*, as opposed to just DCPU coding, have a look at Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs. That one's free.
[13:30:42]	<Rick>	_notch: if(i < 80 || i > 255)
[13:30:51]	<net4all>	sicp ftw!
[13:30:53]	<Rick>	_notch: in keyPressed/keyReleased
[13:31:01]	<Rick>	_notch: that 80 is most likely meant to be 0x80
[13:31:24]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: Er, http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/
[13:31:27]	<kanzaka>	guys, very noob question: what does << means?
[13:31:32]	<Rick>	shift left
[13:31:35]	<cafaxo>	bitshift left
[13:31:41]	<jdiez17>	kanzaka: left shiftr
[13:31:42]	<HenryTrollins>	how would an interaglactic gps work/be explained
[13:31:42]	<rmmh>	print to stdou
[13:31:42]	<jdiez17>	well
[13:31:43]	<sstagg>	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitwise_operation
[13:31:46]	<jdiez17>	you guys beat me to it xD
[13:31:47]	<Rick>	lol rmmh
[13:31:48]	<tiffany>	rmmh: that's only in C++
[13:31:51]	<kanzaka>	ooh! now it' s all clear! xD
[13:31:52]	<tiffany>	where nothing makes sense
[13:31:54]	<rmmh>	HenryTrollins: quasar positions
[13:31:59]	<Ymgve>	HenryTrollins: magic
[13:32:02]	<HenryTrollins>	hmm
[13:32:07]	<HenryTrollins>	i like the quasar position idea
[13:32:09]	<Rick>	sstagg: the 'official' emulator came as a reward for his little puzzle
[13:32:21]	<jdiez17>	Rick: what puzzle?
[13:32:22]	<sstagg>	ash, ok, I'm late to the party it seems
[13:32:26]	<sstagg>	^aah
[13:32:32]	<Ymgve>	the alternative is that we would have to use the positions of stars and planets to calculate our position
[13:32:37]	<Ymgve>	and that's not fun
[13:32:39]	<Zackman94>	thanks, this should help for sure!
[13:32:40]	<Baughn>	Sounds fun!
[13:32:45]	<Rick>	http://t.co/GeMDiDYC
[13:32:46]	<HenryTrollins>	well say you had to code your gps for the dcpu16
[13:32:53]	<Rick>	.remember puzzle http://www.0x10c.com/screenshots/009.png
[13:32:54]	<scybot>	Rick: done.
[13:32:59]	<HenryTrollins>	you'd have need some sort of sensor input
[13:33:33]	<rmmh>	can we avoid too much speculation about things in the distant future?
[13:33:35]	<Rick>	basically through several layers of unwrapping, it led to a dcpu program
[13:33:44]	<reynir>	rmmh++
[13:33:51]	<Rick>	http://0x10co.de/whgua
[13:33:52]	<rmmh>	let
[13:34:03]	<Rick>	which gave us the emulator URL
[13:34:17]	<rmmh>	let's discuss how the fg color should be inverted so SET [0x8000], "A" prints white on black text to the screen
[13:34:32]	<Rick>	disagree
[13:34:42]	<reynir>	rmmh: I suggested that, but people wanted to kill me
[13:35:07]	<Rick>	it means two things
[13:35:14]	<DJUrsus>	rmmh: You'd also have to set 0x0 to be a blank character.
[13:35:17]	<Rick>	a) the font will have to be reshuffled so the first character is empty
[13:35:22]	<Rick>	b) no xor magic
[13:35:27]	<rmmh>	good points
[13:35:36]	<DJUrsus>	Rick: b) I disagree.
[13:35:42]	<SmokestormX>	http://199.26.85.31/whgua
[13:35:53]	<Rick>	oh thanks SmokestormX
[13:35:56]	<SmokestormX>	np
[13:36:19]	<DJUrsus>	Alternative: Flip the foreground highlight bit only.
[13:36:41]	<deltab__>	HenryTrollins: http://www.scientificcomputing.com/news-DS-Celestial-Map-uses-Observations-of-3000-Quasars-for-GPS-Directions-103009.aspx
[13:37:40]	<FireFly>	DJUrsus, that's a pretty good suggestion
[13:37:59]	<reynir>	Ah, finally it's quiet again
[13:38:06]	<SmokestormX>	everytime i made something on 010code matt would change the way it works. constantly changing.
[13:38:06]	<deltab__>	rmmh: two-color text mode (with Unicode)
[13:38:14]	<Rick>	unicode will never happen
[13:38:21]	<Ymgve>	_notch: will the DCPU have any jobs that it _must_ do, or can a ship be operated entirely without any DCPU programs?
[13:38:28]	<HenryTrollins>	deltab__: thanks, i will check it out
[13:38:32]	<Zackman94>	Baughn: thanks for showing me this I bought a book one time that was literally just a bunch of programs. it explained nothing at even though it was called "learn C".
[13:38:54]	<rmmh>	dropping the highlight bit might be useful so we can have 256 chars, would be foreigners aren't completely screwed
[13:39:06]	<Rick>	rmmh: you mean blink bit
[13:39:25]	<_ikke_>	rmmh: Why might better directly go to unicode then :P
[13:39:31]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: No problem. Ever thought about being a programmer? :P
[13:39:36]	<deltab__>	rmmh: 8 bits is only slightly better than 7 in that regard
[13:39:46]	<Anderkent>	8bits gives you utf-8
[13:39:49]	<rmmh>	err, right
[13:39:51]	<Rick>	no it doesnt
[13:39:54]	<_ikke_>	Anderkent: Nope
[13:39:54]	<DJUrsus>	deltab__: I would posit that it's twice as good :-D
[13:39:55]	<Rick>	we already have ushorts
[13:40:00]	<Rick>	we can store utf16 just fine
[13:40:12]	<rmmh>	deltab__: at least you can do kana/cyrillic/etc
[13:40:26]	<Anderkent>	oh right it's display, sorry was out of context
[13:40:26]	<deltab__>	rmmh: which one, though?
[13:40:31]	<Zackman94>	Of course! I tried to take the course they had at my school 3 times, and it always seemed to either be full or conflicted with another course
[13:40:34]	<OlaHughson>	http://0x10cwiki.com/images/c/c2/DCPU_Basic_1.0.png ;(
[13:41:00]	<Rick>	http://199.26.85.31/os.asm
[13:41:11]	<DJUrsus>	deltab__: Any. Code pages!
[13:41:14]	<FireFly>	OlaHughson, why ";("?
[13:41:16]	<deltab__>	ugh, code pages
[13:41:19]	<SpacemanSpiff>	?log
[13:41:20]	<scybot>	log http://vps.thomascomputerindustries.com/logs/freenode/0x10c-dev
[13:41:30]	* OlaHughson doesn't like C64.
[13:41:33]	<OlaHughson>	Just that^^
[13:41:33]	<Zackman94>	^ spacemanspiff... as in Calvin and Hobbs?
[13:41:36]	<HenryTrollins>	deltab__: that was a good read
[13:42:06]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: I've never heard of a high-school programming course that is any good
[13:42:13]	<Rick>	the easiest solution to this
[13:42:16]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: ..I rarely hear of good university-level courses, at that
[13:42:25]	<Rick>	is to make it possible to draw a tile then change it without the drawn tile changing
[13:42:32]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: If you want to be one, it's pretty much up to you.
[13:42:33]	<Rick>	then you can have all the unicode you want
[13:42:39]	<rmmh>	Baughn: you're the df graphics guy right?
[13:42:40]	<jdiez17>	okay, so I can't seem to be able to run any memory dump on the dcpu example
[13:42:43]	<jdiez17>	Rick: any pointers?
[13:42:47]	<Ymgve>	Rick: that sounds complicated
[13:42:50]	<Baughn>	rmmh: Yep
[13:42:53]	<Anderkent>	say again? Draw a tile then change it [the tile] without the tile changing?
[13:42:54]	<SpacemanSpiff>	Zackman94: yes
[13:42:57]	<Rick>	Ymgve: I know
[13:43:11]	<Rick>	but seriously, people thinking there's going to be native unicode support in the display are bonkers
[13:43:16]	<Baughn>	rmmh: And the source of all ads. >_>
[13:43:17]	<migerh>	completely OT so cool, since we're all gamers and asm coders: jordan mechner released the prince of persia 2 source code :)
[13:43:26]	<FireFly>	Rick, then we wouldn't have awesome animated tiles though :(
[13:43:27]	<deltab__>	Rick: for what reason?
[13:43:32]	<FireFly>	Not as awesome, at least
[13:43:33]	<Ymgve>	Rick: another alternative would be to have the screen as a separate device which accepts "plot stuff at x,y with color z" commands
[13:43:46]	<Rick>	Ymgve: that would achieve the same effect but be slower
[13:43:46]	<Baughn>	Ymgve: That would massively inflate cpu and memory costs
[13:43:47]	<rmmh>	we are not going back to vector displays
[13:43:54]	<Zackman94>	so the MIT course is an exception then?
[13:44:07]	<Zackman94>	or did you just send me that for starters?
[13:44:08]	<Ymgve>	Baughn: it would decrease memory costs, at least compared to a full bitmap
[13:44:13]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: It's an exception.
[13:44:16]	<deltab__>	rmmh: not even for radar plots etc? :-)
[13:44:19]	<Zackman94>	Noted.
[13:44:22]	<Baughn>	Zackman94: There /are/ good universities for this. MIT is definitely one of them.
[13:44:29]	<Zengief>	Could you use a second dcpu as a south bridge? Or bus?
[13:44:41]	<Ymgve>	You could use it any way you want!
[13:44:41]	<Baughn>	Possibly?
[13:44:50]	<jdiez17>	so I'm assuming the mem.dmp is the thing run by the emu, and it's little endian, isn't it?
[13:44:50]	<Baughn>	Ymgve: But there's no reason to have more than a character cell display!
[13:44:56]	<Rick>	jdiez17: naturally
[13:45:11]	<Ymgve>	Baughn: sure there is - if you want to do graphics
[13:45:32]	<jdiez17>	Rick: well, I can't run it for some reason >:(
[13:45:45]	<reynir>	oh crap
[13:45:46]	<deltab__>	Ymgve: plenty of nice symbols etc. in unicode
[13:45:53]	<FireFly>	You can do lots of graphics with the current setup, Ymgve
[13:46:02]	<SmokestormX>	wasnt there a hacked version of deNULLs emu that did graphics well
[13:46:03]	<reynir>	i did $ foo | vim
[13:46:08]	<Ymgve>	FireFly: you're limited to a 64x64 area tho
[13:46:08]	<deltab__>	box drawing, blocks, arrows, etc.
[13:46:09]	<FireFly>	Tilesets, spriteart
[13:46:21]	<FireFly>	Ymgve, assuming you don't reuse tiles
[13:46:38]	<rmmh>	I'm pretty okay with a limited display :v
[13:46:40]	<dx>	the tweet said 150 nicks and this channel has 251, so this must be the right place
[13:46:51]	<FireFly>	Haha
[13:47:03]	<tiffany>	notch is also here and voiced
[13:47:10]	<Zengief>	How was that game of life program done? Graphically. It wasn't using ASCII for sure
[13:47:15]	<Rick>	it's not notch, it's the notch behind notch
[13:47:28]	<rmmh>	Zengief: modifying character ram. the other guy's is even more insane
[13:47:31]	<SmokestormX>	it's the 64 bit name of god.
[13:47:31]	<FireFly>	Zengief, you can modify the charset
[13:47:32]	<dx>	notch is also getting pinged a lot
[13:47:47]	<cparrot>	Lets imagine we will have an os managing multiple processes, how will it manage the tilesets ?
[13:47:47]	<FireFly>	So you print an "A", but it doesn't show up as an A
[13:47:54]	<Ymgve>	Zengief: an array of 16x8 chars and then drawn directly into the font ram
[13:47:57]	<Rick>	?rick-display
[13:47:57]	<scybot>	rick-display https://github.com/gibbed/0x10c-Notes/blob/master/VirtualMonitor.txt
[13:48:10]	<dx>	_notch: i love you guys for hiring the bukkit staff. that's all i have to say.
[13:48:28]	<dx>	lurk time for me now.
[13:48:29]	<Rick>	what's a bukkit staff
[13:48:50]	<Ymgve>	http://199.26.85.31/starfield uses a 64x64 gfx display
[13:49:00]	<_ikke_>	Rick: bukkit are the guys who did a lot for creating mods for minecraft
[13:49:03]	<cparrot>	tileset are ok as long as you dont want to switch between programs
[13:49:25]	<cparrot>	otherwise you have to store all tilesets
[13:49:42]	<Zengief>	Interesting, is that supported, or is it only ASCII for now officially?
[13:49:44]	<SmokestormX>	lol i was waiting for someone to do a starfield :P
[13:49:45]	<FireFly>	when we get floppies/HDDs that wouldn't be much of a problem
[13:49:51]	<FireFly>	Having to load the charset and other resources, I mean
[13:49:54]	<DJUrsus>	cparrot: I'm kinda hoping for fast blitting to solve that.
[13:50:03]	<OlaHughson>	swap RAM on floppy? ;o
[13:50:23]	<reynir>	I can't find my java decompiler o.O
[13:50:26]	<Rick>	that's where I know unicode isn't going to happen
[13:50:41]	<Rick>	unicode font data far exceeds the amount of memory dcpu has access to
[13:50:42]	<Rick>	:p
[13:50:46]	<Baughn>	rmmh: So yeah, I'm excited to make *EVEN WORSE* graphics, for this thing. xD
[13:50:47]	<FireFly>	Zengief, Notch's implementation supports modification of the charset
[13:51:02]	<FireFly>	Zengief, that rick-display text is what we've figured from Notch's implementation
[13:51:10]	<FireFly>	(or rather, what Rick figured)
[13:51:18]	<reynir>	Rick: I think there are a lot of glyphs taht would be unreadable at 4*8 pixels
[13:51:33]	<Rick>	so combine multiple tiles
[13:51:36]	<Rick>	not hard
[13:51:38]	<deltab__>	Rick: external rom
[13:51:59]	<Anderkent>	well all you need is a table of unicode glyph on your hdd
[13:52:16]	<entrusC>	is anyone planning to port spacetaxi to the dcpu? I'd really like that!
[13:52:23]	<deltab__>	or in the display's circuitry on a rom chip :-)
[13:52:38]	<Ymgve>	did unicode even exist in 1988_
[13:52:45]	<reynir>	No
[13:52:52]	<deltab__>	it was just starting
[13:52:55]	<reynir>	unicode is from the nineties
[13:52:59]	<Anderkent>	doesn't matter if we're doing it using only generic primitives
[13:53:05]	* Baughn will, if possible, port a DF client to the DCPU. :P
[13:53:14]	<Rick>	"The origins of Unicode date back to 1987, when Joe Becker from Xerox and Lee Collins and Mark Davis from Apple started investigating the practicalities of creating a universal character set", thanks, Wikipedia.
[13:53:17]	<cparrot>	DJUrsus: how so ? you'll still have to save/load the current tileset and copy it to the screen tileset at every program switch
[13:53:18]	<Anderkent>	but yeah means notch won't provide unicode displays probably
[13:53:25]	<dx>	shift-jis is the standard
[13:53:25]	<SmokestormX>	I will look through that code later Ymgve , looks interesting
[13:53:33]	<Rick>	heh sjis
[13:53:38]	<reynir>	Baughn: with simulations and all? :o
[13:53:45]	<swiley>	meh I don't like unicode
[13:53:46]	<Rick>	the way I see it
[13:53:51]	<jdiez17>	what the fuck, I can't get anything to run on the official emu!
[13:53:58]	<Rick>	operating systems won't need many characters from any language, or it can be simplified
[13:54:04]	<swiley>	I'm fine with 16bit chars but my programs won't support "unicode"
[13:54:05]	<Rick>	the actual game interface will probably support unicode just fine
[13:54:06]	<Baughn>	reynir: 'DF client', as in a terminal hooked to the host CPU. Yes, okay, that's unlikely to work.
[13:54:21]	<rrivera>	swiley: that's awful.
[13:54:23]	<DJUrsus>	cparrot: True, but if we have fast blitting, we can do that in maybe 20 cycles.
[13:54:34]	<swiley>	why I don't know anything but english
[13:54:36]	<jdiez17>	Rick: any idea?
[13:54:44]	<Rick>	jdiez17: no idea
[13:54:55]	<jdiez17>	have you managed to run anything?
[13:54:55]	<Rick>	why do you need to run using his code?
[13:54:57]	<swiley>	btw: just figured out groff supported ebcdic
[13:55:02]	<swiley>	:)
[13:55:03]	<Rick>	the applet runs notch's code fine
[13:55:04]	<Rick>	not tried modifying it
[13:55:06]	<jdiez17>	yeah
[13:55:09]	<jdiez17>	notch's sure
[13:55:13]	<dx>	are there any plans/proposals for graphic video memory? that could sort the problem for people who REALLY need unicode
[13:55:16]	<jdiez17>	but not any that my assembler outputs!
[13:55:24]	<Ymgve>	who really needs unicode?
[13:55:29]	<entrusC>	why do you need unicode?
[13:55:29]	<dx>	no idea
[13:55:30]	<Baughn>	dx: *Nobody* really needs unicode
[13:55:32]	<Anderkent>	people who only speak russian
[13:55:33]	<Anderkent>	;X
[13:55:34]	<dx>	haha
[13:55:39]	<swiley>	I was going to use ebcdic until I looked at it… Then I was like "that's awfull!"
[13:55:55]	<rrivera>	Baughn: Um, think outside the US.
[13:55:55]	<DJUrsus>	swiley: You scared me for a second there.
[13:55:55]	<Ymgve>	I don't want those non-latin-charset-using foreginers in my game!
[13:55:58]	<HenryTrollins>	maybe i want my terminals in shift-jis
[13:56:01]	<derinerkan>	hahahahahah
[13:56:02]	<derinerkan>	şşş
[13:56:03]	<Baughn>	rrivera: I'm norwegian. What's your point?
[13:56:04]	<reynir>	I need a program to replace all one-length strings with the ascii value of that character
[13:56:07]	<reynir>	in a file
[13:56:16]	<rrivera>	Baughn: Think of others, like the Chinese.
[13:56:16]	<derinerkan>	ççğşş -> unicode is baws
[13:56:29]	<Baughn>	rrivera: The chinese can use a romanization just fine
[13:56:36]	<DJUrsus>	If ym math is right, Unicode glyphs would be 1MB.
[13:56:40]	<DJUrsus>	*my
[13:56:47]	<tiffany>	if you can get onboard of other people's ships then maybe there will be good reason to set your font to something like ancient or standard galactic alphabet
[13:56:52]	<Baughn>	rrivera: It just isn't possible to fit unicode in this computer
[13:56:55]	<swiley>	I'm sorry but most people only speak english, if you want other languages you'll have to modify the program anyway
[13:57:04]	<reynir>	doesn't unicode have klingon glyphs?
[13:57:04]	<Jerub>	swiley: ....
[13:57:12]	<Jerub>	reynir: no, that was in draft only.
[13:57:12]	<Baughn>	reynir: Among other things.
[13:57:13]	<rrivera>	Baughn: There's not really a lot of information yet to come to that conclusion is there?
[13:57:15]	<deltab__>	reynir: unofficial, in CSUR
[13:57:19]	<OlaHughson>	swiley: they should speak polish <3
[13:57:29]	<tiffany>	there's several fonts which have glyphs for klingon
[13:57:34]	<Khoyo>	swiley : Most people only speak chinese, actually.
[13:57:34]	<Baughn>	rrivera: There is enough. The instruction set only allows you to address 64 kilowords.
[13:57:38]	<tiffany>	but afaik it's in a private range and isn't official
[13:57:44]	<dx>	my question about graphic video memory still stands btw
[13:57:50]	<OlaHughson>	actually, there is a fun satyric page http://www.wielka.net, where Poland owns most of the Earth and whole Solar System :D
[13:57:52]	<Jerub>	i still think that the only user-visible output should be blinking lights and a tape printer.
[13:58:00]	<Jerub>	;)
[13:58:00]	<Baughn>	Anyway, this is a historical simulation
[13:58:01]	<OlaHughson>	and is based 50 years forward in time
[13:58:03]	<DJUrsus>	dx: We'll probably end up with a graphics mode.
[13:58:04]	<derinerkan>	kyoho: that's why we have cheap chinese knockoffs with horrible grammar :D
[13:58:09]	<swiley>	khoyo: ok, most devs speak english, at least as a secound language
[13:58:10]	<Baughn>	It would not be realistic to support anything but EBCDIC, or maybe ASCII
[13:58:15]	<DJUrsus>	dx: He did say hardware sprites at some point.
[13:58:22]	<dx>	cool
[13:58:23]	<Baughn>	Thank your lucky stars you get code-pages. :P
[13:58:30]	<OlaHughson>	Jerub: I would prefer something really awesome. Like, port of AROS.
[13:58:31]	<usuario_>	ijo de puta
[13:58:34]	<cparrot>	DJUrsus: thats good to know
[13:58:35]	<usuario_>	fuck you
[13:58:36]	<swiley>	YES ALL SOFTWARE WILL USE EBCDIC!!!
[13:58:51]	<Ymgve>	you BASTARD
[13:58:56]	<jdiez17>	could someone please kb usuario_? he's a repetitive troll
[13:58:59]	<derinerkan>	ASCII OR DEATH
[13:58:59]	<OlaHughson>	I speak polish, english , a bit russian, and also HTML
[13:59:00]	<reynir>	swiley: I vote for EBCDIC
[13:59:03]	<Jerub>	\asianfather{EBCDIC?}{Why not UTF-EBCDIC?}
[13:59:09]	<DJUrsus>	swiley: How about EBCDIC XORed with your mom's birthday?
[13:59:11]	<hachque>	ping Cr8 jdiez17
[13:59:12]	<OlaHughson>	wat
[13:59:16]	<jdiez17>	hachque: pong
[13:59:21]	<Khoyo>	swiley: True for occidental devs, but not for chinese/japanese devs.
[13:59:24]	<Anderkent>	wow, this degraded fast
[13:59:27]	* derinerkan aims an AK-47 at swiley
[13:59:28]	<dx>	rmmh: kb usuario_ please
[13:59:29]	<derinerkan>	ASCII.
[13:59:34]	<OlaHughson>	no no no
[13:59:37]	<OlaHughson>	no ascii
[13:59:39]	<OlaHughson>	ISO/IEC 8859-2
[13:59:40]	<swiley>	DJUrsus: yes then we can be diffrent!! :D
[13:59:40]	<hachque>	jdiez17: to #0x10c-dcpu to avoid the noise
[13:59:41]	<OlaHughson>	<3
[13:59:51]	* derinerkan aims the AK47 at OlaHughson
[13:59:52]	<OlaHughson>	or better, AmigaPL
[13:59:55]	<derinerkan>	what'd you say
[14:00:02]	<dx>	lol #0x10c-dcpu.. so what is this channel about then?
[14:00:09]	<derinerkan>	randomness
[14:00:12]	<dx>	haha
[14:00:12]	<jdiez17>	dx: don't worry about -dcpu