<Boilerplate> I wonder if anyone has come up with a alternative "WoD" setting before?
<DarthDavid_ooc> what do you mean?
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> define alternative
<DarthDavid_ooc> I had a friend that wrote up a WoD game on what if Cain did not kill abel, but instead learned from his mistake and the following year Cain was blessed and Abel wasnt, then abel killed Cain.  so they were Abelites.  Different clans, powers
<Shimon_OOC> interesting
<Boilerplate> Which for example, instead of Vampires, there are Revenants, Instead of Werewolves they are Shapeshifters, instead of Fae/Changelings they are simply Spirits, instead of "Wraith" they are incomporal undead, and perhaps "Mages" would remain similar to Acension but except instead of the Traditions being based on sterotypes, maybe perhaps have splats based on actual magical traditions
<Boilerplate> Revenants as in Corporal Undead
<Boilerplate> in every type
<Boilerplate> DarthDavid_ooc: That's not the alternative I have in mind since it still uses Masquerade's christian basis cosmology
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<Boilerplate> As for "Demon" I would entirely ditch that since it's entirely a Christian concept.
<Boilerplate> Since "Demons" in Abrahamic mythology are really just demonized versions of other Deities from other religions.
<Sociopathicus_dreaming> why not just make a whole new game, based on alternative mythology?
<Sociopathicus_dreaming> there's plenty of them around.
<Boilerplate> That's what I have in mind actually
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> there's a local owod troupe game that has shifters based chinese zodiac
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> auspice still determined by moon, but breed determined by year in the 12year cycle
<Boilerplate> I don't think the Chinese Zodiac has anything to do with Shapeshifters, I would rather stick true to Theology/Mythology/etc 100% completely including approaching other culture's religions/etc respectivly.
<Sociopathicus_dreaming> so ... since you can't be true to every belief system at once, which would you pick?
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<Boilerplate> Actually you can since I would go with the "All Myths are True" route
<Boilerplate> rather than have one define them all like Christianity has in some many medium
<Boilerplate> or rathe All Belief systems are True and Valid
<Boilerplate> Thus creating a dense diverse world
<Boilerplate> Let's just say I'm trying to avoid this trope at all costs: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OneMythToExplainThemAll
<Boilerplate> In short: You can be true to every belief system and I would them all coexist
<Sociopathicus_dreaming> how can you be true to them all, when even their creation myths differ?
<Boilerplate> Because their creation myths are also all true
<Sociopathicus_dreaming> sorry, you've lost me there.
<Boilerplate> I guess I just went over your head
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> you confused me alot too
<Shimon_OOC> This is interesting and I would like to read more, but I gotta go start dinner.
<Shimon_OOC> I'll be back tomorrow
<Shimon_OOC> !op
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> and I'm only a few credits short of officially being an anthropologist
<Shimon_OOC> actually, i can just afk and lurk, read it all after dinner :)
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<Shimon_AFK> !deop
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<Sociopathicus_dreaming> no, you didn't go over my head. I just don't see how it's possible without resorting to a trope you want to avoid.
<Boilerplate> Well there isn't one way of doing things you know
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<Boilerplate> What I had in mind however that their all true is because humans created them eversince the Middle/Upper Paleothic eras and before that, maybe perhaps the "Materialist" paradigm was the default one and we just added more layers of reality due to our creative minds.
<Sociopathicus_dreaming> no, there isn't.
<Sociopathicus_dreaming> and the trope(s) you want to avoid are done dozens of ways.  but, there's a difference between all myths being true, and all myths being different ways to describe one event. and I"ll leave my input at that.
<Boilerplate> Of course the latter you described is what i'm trying to avoid
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> it's not that all myths are true, it's taht all myths are, in part, based upon historical events relative to the culture the myths belong to
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> add into that that many myths are also stolen from earlier cultures
<Boilerplate> Even though those eariler cultures still exist though and their religions are still being praticed believe it or not.
<Boilerplate> What your referring to is cultural approation where one comes in dominates the other culture and using their culture as entertainment instead of respecting where they came from.
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> teh religions not so much as the bastardisation of their beliefs
<Boilerplate> well also cultural imperialsim
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> you don't have to explain to me what it is that I was referring to
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> what's wrong Rachel?
<Sefina> I almost had to tell someone that I wasn't about to change my tweeting habits just for them
* `Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties hugs teh rachel
<Sefina> They were complaining about my tweets overpowering their feed because I put a . in front of all of my @'s so that Twitter doesn't filter them.
<Boilerplate> Well actually there is a difference between syncretism and "stolen cultures" you know. For example  Greco-Buddhism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Buddhism
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<Boilerplate> Also speaking of which that's the work I was looking for Syncretism
<Boilerplate> Syncretism of reality actually where every belief system down to their creation stories are true.
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> they are, in perspective of the culture.....
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> but not in perspective of every other culture
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<Dawn_OOC> !op
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> hi dawn
<Dina_Corazon_BoH_SL4> hey Dawn
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<Boilerplate> `Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> they are, in perspective of the culture.....
<Boilerplate> <`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> but not in perspective of every other culture This is where cultural approation/imperialism comes in
<Boilerplate> It's best to have stay within their own grounds and not define the other
<Boilerplate> and have them exist as independant paradigms
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> when you look at cultures individually, they all are correct, when you start looking at them collectively, it's when they overlap, steal, incoprorate, or change things when everything falls apar
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> apart
<Boilerplate> Actually that only happens in the West since Christinaity tends to define every Deity who isn't the Christian God "Demons".
<Boilerplate> While everything else syncretizes
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> no not everything else syncretizes
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> roman appropriated the greek and norse
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> there are several african tribes that incorporate new things into their oral history and treat them as having always been part of it
<Sefina> Boilerplate: Actually that's not necessarily "solely" Christianity
<Sefina> It's a monotheistic idea.
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> it's a practice used to "convert" conquests
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> incorporate their shit and they will convert
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> in simplistic terms
<Boilerplate> However the main point is the one who is doing the incorporting doesn't mean their right which is merely justifying their actions.
<Boilerplate> i.e. "Our culture is dominating you there we are right and you are wrong"
<Boilerplate> *therefore
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> history, andf to a large extent Mythology, is written by the victor, and those in charge....look at the bible ass an example and the councile of nicae......
<Boilerplate> Doesn't mean the victor doesn't have to have define reality.
<Boilerplate> Doesn't mean the victor have to have define reality.
<Boilerplate> I mean
<Boilerplate> *has
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> to put it in game terms, he with the most status, is right
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> if you don't agree, you are "wrong", and don't matter
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<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> is it right?
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> no
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> is it accepted?
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> yes
<Boilerplate> I don't accept it
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> is it a bitch to try and change the outlook when proof exists counter to popular accepted theory
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> hell yes
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> whether one person accepts it or not, has no impact on the greater scheme of things
<`Evil`OWoD-Ventrue-Ties> undeniable definitive proof is needed to change things
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