@erisia: ~workshop new
@BB-8-NU: A new workshop session was created
#Orphic: ty
#Orphic: ~workshop add kangaskhan
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan added
#Orphic: ~workshop add omastar
@BB-8-NU: omastar added
#Orphic: ~workshop add weezing
@BB-8-NU: weezing added
++nv: mfw building KangaSpikes for Workshop lol
++nv: :o
++nv: OmaZing tho
 Watchog: i a ctually
@erisia: tbh weezing + kanga is our starting core, we can pick a different SR user if people want
++nv: <3
 Watchog: have to go
 Watchog: rip
 Watchog: have fun
@erisia: rip
#Orphic: okay can we use
#Orphic: solrock as our rocker
++nv: I mean
@erisia: do we need to?
#Orphic: no lol
++nv: Fire check + Normal check is nice
  Eternally: lol
@erisia: :p
  Eternally: mfw I join and see solrock talk
#Orphic: yeah kanga + weezing + rocker
@erisia: but yeah i think omastar is an obvious good pick
#Orphic: sure, works for me
  Andersonba1210: Agreed
#Orphic: it has spikes too
@erisia: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing
++nv: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing
#Orphic: which is important
++nv: So we need Speed
@erisia: spinblocker
@erisia: defog deterrant
@erisia: maybe some way of stalling more poison turns
  yogibears: ayy, what we doing here
@erisia: kangaspikes - garb
  Eternally: kanagaspikes
  Eternally: without garb
 lucianvega: yea cuz
 lucianvega: what if garbodor leaves ;/
@erisia: eternally's sick kangaspikes team becomes obsolete
  Eternally: true
  Eternally: rip
@erisia: just like my sub sceptile kangaspikes D:
  Eternally: in fact, the last 3 teams I built become obsolete
  Eternally: cause they all have garb lol
#Orphic: 9/10 of my teams will too
#Orphic: lol
@Eternally: rip sawsbuck team
#Orphic: oh god no
#Orphic: okay so i'm thinking swellow?
++nv: Wow rood Orphic leaving me here as a voice :P
@Eternally: lol
++nv: NormalSpam is a nice idea tbh Orphic
@Eternally: swellow is always greaton kangaspikes
#Orphic: or maybe something that adds some defensive help
@erisia: also, we either need a spinner or skuntank to stop tspikes from wrecking us (and not stacking a psychic weakness)
+nv: -
 lucianvega: swellow will need a hazard control then
  yogibears: lol
#Orphic: so claydol as spinner
#Orphic: if you like
#Orphic: cos i don't like defogger on spikes
+nv: Ew Claydol
@erisia: yeah no defog lol
#Orphic: claydol is good ._.
+nv: Chan or nothing imo
  Andersonba1210: NU needs better spinners
 lucianvega: definitely not a defoger
#Orphic: ik but it stacks psychic weakness, but sure chan + 2 psychic checks/resistances is fine
@erisia: chan + skunk?
@erisia: like normal taunt skunk
  yogibears: i'd go chan tbh, dol is just... meh
@erisia: we already have weezing so idk how nice claydol is
#Orphic: hitmonchan + skunk + swellow
@erisia: AV chan?
#Orphic: yeah i'd think so
#Orphic: problem is
#Orphic: we lose to lanturn :(
@erisia: hmmm
@erisia: what about cryo!!!
+nv: -
@erisia: cryo me a river
@Eternally: cryo gets so much flak
#Orphic: no
#Orphic: its okay, but not here
@Eternally: its a __cool__ mon
@erisia: it's a n**ice** choice
@erisia: yeah we need a scald switchin
@Eternally: nvm, obviously Cryo is getting an __icey__ reception from everyone else
@Eternally: ok ill stop
@Eternally: !ds rapid spin, nu
  Andersonba1210: Shiftry would give strong priority and a grass type
#Orphic: you will honestly all be banned
#Orphic: ;)
@erisia: do we even need a spinner if we have skunk to absorb t-spikes
#Orphic: i would have suggested shiftry but it would be a defogger :/
@Eternally: probably not
#Orphic: i guess not
  Andersonba1210: I meant over skunk. No defog on it
#Orphic: maybe we could just bring a xatu
  Relaxed Dedenne: Orphic is RO?!
@erisia: yeah how does xatu match up against tspikes users
  Relaxed Dedenne: no way
#Orphic: ..
+nv: !ds tspikes, nu
#Orphic: erisia, pretty well tbh
@erisia: yeah i like either xatu or skunk
+nv: It would only lose to TSpikes Omastar so yea Xatu is a safe enough option
@erisia: i don't normally pick xatu but it seems nice
  Relaxed Dedenne: Beedrill
  Relaxed Dedenne: tbh
@erisia: especially since we're building for a post-skunk meta
@erisia: er, post-garb
#Orphic: mhm
#Orphic: yeah, cos garb hits it decently hard
@erisia: what set
#Orphic: but it won't be something to consider
#Orphic: i like the cm set
#Orphic: gives us a wincon
@erisia: we already have two phys def mons so idk
#Orphic: we do?
  Andersonba1210: W Xatu and weezing we eliminate a bit of quake weakness
@erisia: are we running def omastar or offensive lead?
#Orphic: i'd say offensive lead
@erisia: oic
#Orphic: idk, it doesn't offer much defensively
#Orphic: fire types all have hp grass
@erisia: strong ass normal resist
@erisia: stops swellow
@erisia: tauros
@erisia: like omastar + weezing seems like a really good phys def core
#Orphic: 252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Hidden Power Grass vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Omastar: 292-348 (103.9 - 123.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
#Orphic: yeah okay, so what are you saying for xatu
#Orphic: yo unless
#Orphic: we use spdef weezing
@erisia: does swellow even run hp grass? but yeah if we go offensive omastar, cm xatu sounds good.
@erisia: if we go defensive omastar, maybe an offensive xatu set?
#Orphic: sure, i mean
  yogibears: CM xatu seems nice
@erisia: idk i don't have a lot of experience with xatu
#Orphic: offensive xatu comes in on all the tspikers
#Orphic: besides garb
#Orphic: which we're preparing to not have to deal with
  Andersonba1210: CM xatu is that one extra trick to maybe get that extra win
#Orphic: ^^
#Orphic: wincon
@erisia: yeah i just wonder whether having extra coverage + immediate power is more useful to this team
@erisia: brb
#Orphic: 52 SpA Life Orb Xatu Psyshock vs. 40 HP / 140 Def Lanturn: 173-204 (43.1 - 50.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
#Orphic: 252*
  yogibears: solid af tbh
  yogibears: is that a 2hko with rocks?
#Orphic: 50% chance
  yogibears: p-decent
#Orphic: just cos we are struggling vs lanturn atm
  yogibears: and since we're hazard, we'll probably have other hazards up to
@Eternally: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing
  Andersonba1210: If w lead star, we might struggle w lix
@Eternally: could always go with Roselia over weezing
#Orphic: no dude
@Eternally: if you want a lanturn/rotom check
#Orphic: that offers no fighting check
@Eternally: true
#Orphic: :/
#Orphic: i'd be inclined to say plume, and have tspikes + sr on omastar
  Andersonba1210: I love grass typing :]
  yogibears: plume does absorb other t-spikes
  Andersonba1210: So what is current team
#Orphic: literally no idea
#Orphic: we have kanga, weezing, omastar
#Orphic: for definite still
#Orphic: i think we chose hitmonchan + xatu
  yogibears: y
#Orphic: what i have in my teambuilder rn is kanga, weezing, omastar, hitmonchan, xatu, swellow
  Andersonba1210: Xatu, plume, chan, weez, star, Kang
#Orphic: what do people think of that
  yogibears: xatu needs to run signal beam
  yogibears: but yeh, looks good
#Orphic: erisia, eternally, thoughts
#Orphic: what are we weak to with that setup
@Eternally: Ice-types I guess, Lanturn
+nv: Yea Lanturn and Ice-types
#Orphic: oh yeah lanturn is still a problem
#Orphic: hm
+nv: ~~Even tho I am not erisia or Eternally lol~~
#Orphic: dw fren your opinion is valid too n_n
@Eternally: also switching into Floatzel/Samurott looks rly difficult
#Orphic: yeah in general
+nv: Yea no Water-type check stinks
#Orphic: water/ice check isn't there
  yogibears: zard is kinda a problem too, and we have no real stop to rotom
#Orphic: okay so what about
  yogibears: jynx could be decent here
  yogibears: soft water check, ice check, is okay against lanturn
#Orphic: hm
  Andersonba1210: Sub jynx plus the tspikes
#Orphic: or scarf jynx cos we lack speed
  yogibears: y
 Steph Kekry: do ferroseed work
  Andersonba1210: Jynx does give another knock weakness
#Orphic: we don't mind knock
 Steph Kekry: cause lannturn check
 Steph Kekry: also has spikes
#Orphic: you mean instead of omastar?
 Steph Kekry: i not sure but yeah
#Orphic: well that's fine but then it doesn't pressure xatu at all which means we struggle to get our hazards up
 Steph Kekry: ah
 Steph Kekry: ok sorry didnt read up
#Orphic: ~workshop add hitmonchan
@BB-8-NU: hitmonchan added
#Orphic: ~workshop add xatu
@BB-8-NU: xatu added
#Orphic: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing / hitmonchan / xatu
  yogibears: I say either scarf/sash jynx over swellow
#Orphic: i like jynx in the final slot yeah
 Steph Kekry: do we take lililigant as option
  yogibears: lili add a bigger weakness to ice
  yogibears: *adds
#Orphic: lilligant is also an option but it is ice weak
 Steph Kekry: hmm yeah
#Orphic: hm okay so
  yogibears: and doesn't threaten as much with scarf
#Orphic: what do you guys think of
#Orphic: having no spinner
  yogibears: n, because with having weezing, we can't absorb t-spikes, which wrecks our team if put up
#Orphic: yeah ik but
@erisia: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing / hitmonchan / xatu
  yogibears: and duel priority is great with kanga+chan
#Orphic: ~workshop add jyn
@BB-8-NU: jyn added
@Eternally: I dont have any hazard control on the kangaspikes team I used besides Lovely Kiss Jynx, so I dont think its a huge issue
#Orphic: jynx lol
#Orphic: okay this is my problem
#Orphic: ~workshop remove jyn
@BB-8-NU: jyn removed
#Orphic: ~workshop add jynx
@BB-8-NU: jynx added
#Orphic: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing / hitmonchan / xatu / jynx
#Orphic: there is no spin blocker
#Orphic: there is no defog absorber
#Orphic: i love malamar on kangaspikes for that reason
@Eternally: I think Weezing sort of sucks all the momentum out of this team
  yogibears: gtg, tell me how the team goes guys (and girls)
+nv: Bye yogibears
@erisia: is weezing really a momentum suck?
@erisia: taunt + decent speed
@erisia: +wisp
#Orphic: yeah i don't mind weezing
@Eternally: I guess I shouldn't try and compare it to garbodor
#Orphic: just want thoughts on
@Eternally: (rip garb)
  Andersonba1210: I like the support moves
@erisia: firstly what xatu set are we using
#Orphic: kanga, weezing, omastar, malamar, rotom, filler
@erisia: i like rotom a lot
#Orphic: erisia, my problem so far is that there's no ghost, and no defog absorber
@erisia: i agree
  Andersonba1210: I always like rotom
#Orphic: so i'm thinking maybe not having xatu
@erisia: we need a spinblocker for the core first and then do the remaining two slots
@erisia: rotom + skuntank imo
@erisia: then we still absorb tspikes and don't present a psychic weakness
@erisia: and we get a strong sucker punch to go with kanga
@erisia: for speed control
#Orphic: yeah i like that
#Orphic: we can pursuit other rotoms
#Orphic: here's what i think now
@erisia: skuntank can also taunt defoggers if required
#Orphic: we either go malamar or jynx final slot
@erisia: ~workshop remove hitmonchan
@BB-8-NU: hitmonchan removed
#Orphic: ~workshop add rotom
@BB-8-NU: rotom added
@erisia: ~workshop remove jynx
@BB-8-NU: jynx removed
#Orphic: ~workshop add skuntank
@BB-8-NU: skuntank added
@erisia: ~workshop remove xatu
@BB-8-NU: xatu removed
#Orphic: ~workshop remove xatu
@BB-8-NU: xatu is not in the team
#Orphic: ._.
@erisia: rip
@Eternally: jynx gives us some more speed, malamar gives us a nice wincon/defog deterrent
@erisia: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing / rotom / skuntank
#Orphic: i like that^
#Orphic: so whats more important, wincon?
@erisia: i like jynx but at that stage it's getting quite similar to your team eternally :p
  Andersonba1210: I think both fit well
@Eternally: lol
@Eternally: I think Malamar would work really nicely
@Eternally: however
@erisia: both also deal with scald decently
  Andersonba1210: we need the superpower and we need the ice beam lol
@Eternally: if we're assuming garbodor is going to rise when it had 3.3% usage
@Eternally: are we also assuming malamar will rise with 4.4%?
@erisia: the objective was just to design without garb for a change
@erisia: i don't mind if we include malamar or not
@Eternally: oh fair enough
@Eternally: well in that case malamar would work really nicely
@Eternally: nice status absorber, wincon, defog detterent etc
@erisia: we also don't have an ice resist which makes me favor jynx more
#Orphic: yeah i also don't mind if garb doesn't rise
#Orphic: we're just doing it to have a non garb kangaspikes team
#Orphic: shall i make a poll :o
@erisia: let's run AV jynx hur hur hur
@Eternally: y
@Eternally: lol
  Andersonba1210: Poll!
@erisia: !dt jynx
#Orphic: n
#Orphic: nv, Andersonba1210, Clarry SP, Steph Kekry, yogibears
#Orphic: vote pls n_n
  Andersonba1210: Voted
#Orphic: oh then
#Orphic: Eternally, erisia
#Orphic: have you voted
 Clarry SP: voted
@erisia: yip
+nv: Hmm
+nv: Voted
+nv: :)
#Orphic: 5
#Orphic: 4
#Orphic: 3
#Orphic: 2
#Orphic: 1
#Orphic: jynx it is
#Orphic: ~workshop add jynx
@BB-8-NU: jynx added
#Orphic: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing / rotom / skuntank / jynx
#Orphic: shall we do sets?
@erisia: thoughts on AV kanga?
#Orphic: bad
#Orphic: silk scarf 100%
@erisia: ;_;
  Andersonba1210: 101
#Orphic: or
#Orphic: rest early bird kanga n_n
#Orphic: nah so
#Orphic: silk scarf
#Orphic: fake out, dedge
#Orphic: what coverage do you guys like
#Orphic: do we want pup? aqua tail? eq? sucker?
@erisia: eq sucker imo
@erisia: does pup actually do anything
@erisia: !ms kangaskhan, physical, bp > 60
@erisia: lel
#Orphic: !dt power up punch
#Orphic: yes it does somethign
@erisia: -_-
  Andersonba1210: Sucker is a must right
#Orphic: but no hehe
#Orphic: yeah sucker is pretty essential
@erisia: eq imo we lack ground coverage otherwise
#Orphic: adamant max speed
#Orphic: okay man
#Orphic: not like we struggle vs steelix/archeops
@erisia: also i know silk scarf is better
@erisia: but we don't have much SpD on this team
#Orphic: i know but silk scarf just means double edge hits that bit harder
@erisia: but with AV you could potentially live to fire off a second one
  Andersonba1210: Weez spd set? Not there yet I kno
@erisia: i think weezing is our malamar check so idk
#Orphic: we need it as our fighting check so prob not
#Orphic: and malamar yeah
#Orphic: erisia
#Orphic: i'm willing to go AV
#Orphic: since i've never done that before
@erisia: i mean people can just use silk scarf instead if they prefer
@erisia: probably still run double edge
+nv: Yea Slash Silk and DEdge imo
+nv: But AV seems like an ok option :P
  Andersonba1210: I guess so long as we don't pretend Kang can risk a scald. Also w AV, return over edge for health?
@erisia: okay cool now it's different enough from eternally's
@erisia: jynx is our scald switchin
@erisia: unless it's quite quiet's scald kabutops
@Eternally: lol
@erisia: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing / rotom / skuntank / jynx
#Orphic: can we use AV facade kanga
@erisia: erm idk
#Orphic: dw dude, it doesn't have room
#Orphic: jynx is our scald switchin yes
@erisia: we already have switchins for most status
@Eternally: what does AV Kanga even rude, I havent seen that set since it was taken out of the analysis page lol
@Eternally: *run
@erisia: i was just thinking the normal set but return is probably better
@erisia: fake out / return / earthquake / sucker
  Andersonba1210: If AV is to take hits, return makes more sense
@erisia: yeah
#Orphic: alright thats fine by me
#Orphic: standard fast taunt weezing?
@erisia: yeah
@erisia: now which rotom set? really anything could be good
@erisia: we don't //need// wisp
@erisia: but sub wisp could be nice
@erisia: or sub split
@erisia: or scarf
  Andersonba1210: I'd personally rather scarf rotom and sub jynx
#Orphic: wait
#Orphic: whats the omastar set
@erisia: defensive imo
@erisia: especially if we're doing av kanga
#Orphic: what moves
@erisia: stealth rock / spikes / scald / ???
@erisia: we don't really need hp electric with rotom
@erisia: maybe hp grass?
#Orphic: for what
@erisia: gastro
#Orphic: yes i like that
  Andersonba1210: Rock for swellow?
@erisia: scald does enough
#Orphic: since we don't have much else for gastro
@erisia: sick lure
#Orphic: yeah scald does enough, in fact, the same amount with stav
#Orphic: stab
#Orphic: as hp rock to swellow
@erisia: well rock gets stab too remember
#Orphic: oh
#Orphic: yeah haha
#Orphic: sorry
#Orphic: yeah i like hp grass
@erisia: !learn omastar, power gem
@erisia: rip
#Orphic: lets do skunk set then rotom
@erisia: physical skunk for sure
#Orphic: !learn omastar, ancient power
@erisia: we have a ton of special attackers already
@erisia: and omastar lures gastro
  Andersonba1210: Grass makes sense for gastro
@erisia: probably lum skunk?
#Orphic: yeah to pursuit rotom
@erisia: yeah
#Orphic: rotom + jynx sets then
  Andersonba1210: id sub np jynx and scarf rotom?
#Orphic: we get a wincon that way
#Orphic: erisia?
@erisia: i like scarf rotom
#Orphic: cool, and sub np jynx?
@erisia: what does that run
@Eternally: what do we get rid of for sub
#Orphic: sub, np, ice beam, psychic
#Orphic: oh
#Orphic: sub, np, ice beam, lovely kiss
@erisia: hmmmm
  Andersonba1210: Or drop Psy and go kiss
@erisia: do we need lovely kiss?
@erisia: on tspikes
#Orphic: oo
#Orphic: v good point
#Orphic: we can just go sub np ice beam psychic if you want
@Eternally: yeah dual STAB seems better
#Orphic: and sub when we force shit out
@erisia: i like the idea of sub / plot / ice beam / psyshock
#Orphic: psyshock yeah
  Andersonba1210: ^
@erisia: sub on lanturn
#Orphic: yup
@erisia: does volt switch from defensive break it?
#Orphic: probably
@Eternally: 0 SpA Lanturn Volt Switch vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Jynx: 63-75 (23.2 - 27.6%) -- 73.1% chance to 4HKO
@Eternally: sometimes
@erisia: ooooooooh
  Andersonba1210: Jynx was specially built from gf to take no hits
#Orphic: 0 SpA Lanturn Volt Switch vs. 120 HP / 0 SpD Jynx: 63-75 (20.9 - 24.9%) -- guaranteed 5HKO
@erisia: jynx has fine SpD
@erisia: + a water immune
#Orphic: we could put 120 hp in it
#Orphic: :o
#Orphic: 136 spA
@erisia: lool bulky jynx
  Andersonba1210: Fun!
@Eternally: pivot lanturn isnt really that common enough to dedicate that investment imo
@Eternally: like most people run AV nowadays
 Steph Kekry: ^^
 Steph Kekry: i see more invested spa
@erisia: does it help against other things
#Orphic: alright
#Orphic: we'll just take our chances with the rolls
++Blast: ~workshop team
@BB-8-NU: kangaskhan / omastar / weezing / rotom / skuntank / jynx
@erisia: actually why are we investing in hp
@erisia: what physical hits is jynx taking lol
  Andersonba1210: Tackle
#Orphic: we aren't
#Orphic: i wish gastro got rocks
 Xergeok: that's toad
#Orphic: !dt palpitoad
@erisia: yeah just go offensive jynx lol
  Andersonba1210: It wouldn't b NU
#Orphic: ikr
#Orphic: okay so are we done
#Orphic: should i test
@Eternally: y
 Xergeok: yes
#Orphic: http://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-nususpecttest-393818872
#Orphic: loool vs a user in this workshop
 Clarry SP: i dont have seen the team
 Clarry SP: tbh
@erisia: 0 SpA Lanturn Volt Switch vs. 40 HP / 60 SpD Jynx: 58-70 (20.6 - 24.9%)
@erisia: why is this the efficiency breakpoint lol
@Eternally: lol
@erisia: !dt omastar
#Orphic: there we go
#Orphic: if everyones happy with that
#Orphic: i'll make the post later :)
  Andersonba1210: Good times
#Orphic: Andersonba1210 you got a smogon account?
  Andersonba1210: Not yet. I'm still figuring all this out.
@erisia: thanks everyone, this looks pretty good (might use for reqs idk)
@erisia: oh wait it's far too late for reqs hahah
+nv: rip erisia