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The R.E.T.C.O.N. final level and Pumpernickel's Design

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Jan 2nd, 2016
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  1. [12/7/2015 1:53:19 PM] Duvi: You missed Kood's pet's introduction, you missed how Pumpernickel and Broadsword leave the story and the EoW8 takes place in the R.E.T.C.O.N.
  2. [12/7/2015 1:54:21 PM] Duvi: and you missed me fixing Frenzy Citadel
  3. [12/7/2015 1:54:32 PM] Duvi: so it's approved now, due to the changes
  4. [12/7/2015 1:55:01 PM] retchthehaycook: Not EOW8, but a true final level accessible from the hub after EOW8
  5. [12/7/2015 1:56:06 PM] retchthehaycook: Where the RETCON goes from a mini-hub area to a full-fledged level that has you going into the machine's inner workings to get to the core
  6. [12/7/2015 1:56:24 PM] SAJewers: couldn't that just be W9?
  7. [12/7/2015 1:57:00 PM] retchthehaycook: Isn't W9 supposed to be the postgame zebraspace or equivalent?
  8. [12/7/2015 1:57:05 PM] Duvi: the boss of W9 is Serac, too
  9. [12/7/2015 1:57:12 PM] SAJewers: W9 is a cannon world
  10. [12/7/2015 1:57:15 PM] Duvi: and she's supposed to appear in all 4 of the games
  11. [12/7/2015 1:58:03 PM] retchthehaycook: gimme a sec to quote the post
  12. [12/7/2015 2:00:20 PM | Edited 2:00:50 PM] retchthehaycook: You get back from W8 and suddenly there's alarms everyone's panicking. You can go around the hub one last time, then you enter the RETCON as a level.
  13.  
  14. The level starts with the same layout as the hub form but various branching sections previously accessible are blocked off by debris/lockdown security/some other thing, so you eventually have to move through the inner workings of the machine to get to the core, where Pumpernickel is fought in the raw chaos form Wasabi proposed further up.to sum up the rest, you get the ending where Broadsword sacrifices himself to save the krew, leaving him and pumpernickel trapped in a pocket of spacetime but Demo and company are safe and the universe isn't destroyed. Roll credits, reload save file, move on to W9
  15. [12/7/2015 2:01:20 PM] Duvi: and Serac now doesn't just hate you
  16. [12/7/2015 2:01:23 PM] Duvi: she DESPISES you
  17. [12/7/2015 2:01:32 PM] Duvi: her only mission in life becomes to avenge her husband
  18. [12/7/2015 2:01:38 PM] SAJewers: i thought we planned for Broadsword to be part of the main cast in Ep3?
  19. [12/7/2015 2:01:46 PM] SAJewers: and how does W9 fit into all this?
  20. [12/7/2015 2:01:55 PM] Duvi: Serac's torture realm
  21. [12/7/2015 2:02:29 PM] Duvi: She taunts the main cast by telling them she has a universe-destroying device and will set it off unless they catch her in time
  22. [12/7/2015 2:02:40 PM] Duvi: turns out this device is a lie
  23. [12/7/2015 2:03:05 PM] Duvi: but she traps the main cast in an attempt to put them through the exact pain her husband is going through that very moment
  24. [12/7/2015 2:04:07 PM] Duvi: of course, you guys beat up serac, escape somehow, roll final final credits, get post-postgame stuff, end of episode 2
  25. [12/7/2015 2:04:20 PM] SAJewers: and how does this set up Ep3?
  26. [12/7/2015 2:06:32 PM] Duvi: So what I imagine is, Serac has a prototype of Wind's stasis device and attempts to freeze the main cast in time
  27. [12/7/2015 2:07:00 PM | Edited 2:07:15 PM] retchthehaycook: Whatever happens, it should involve Papi Earthquake as the last chicken wing
  28. [12/7/2015 2:12:02 PM] Duvi: and I imagine Serac having stolen this prototype from Grandpa Wind before it's complete because, hey, she only needs to freeze THESE goons in time
  29. [12/7/2015 2:12:43 PM] Duvi: so basically, after you beat her up, Wind comes in, angrily takes it back, spits a fireball at her, and leaves
  30. [12/7/2015 2:20:50 PM] Duvi: So as for the Elder and Uncle designs, I like all of them but one, and it's the one raocow famously had no opinions on
  31. [12/7/2015 2:21:56 PM] Duvi: Pumpernickel's design doesn't really fit the character we set up, the visual theme of any of the cyclopes, and it doesn't exactly look that good
  32. [12/7/2015 2:21:59 PM] SAJewers: the main thing I'm concerned with is how W9 fits into Ep2's plot
  33. [12/7/2015 2:22:15 PM] SAJewers: and how it will give us a starting point for Ep3
  34. [12/7/2015 2:22:48 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: you are beginning to be punished for your ep2 hubris
  35. [12/7/2015 2:22:57 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: that's what w9 does
  36. [12/7/2015 2:23:01 PM] Duvi: That's easy, SAJ
  37. [12/7/2015 2:23:23 PM] Duvi: Serac is trying to torment the main cast on their way to finishing them off, and she's using a device she stole from Wind
  38. [12/7/2015 2:23:34 PM] Chaoxys _: Wait, I just realized, I've never even seen pumpernickle's design. Is it really that unfitting?
  39. [12/7/2015 2:23:44 PM] retchthehaycook: http://talkhaus.raocow.com/viewtopic.php?t=13539&start=1025#p223230
  40. [12/7/2015 2:23:51 PM] Duvi: Pumpernickel is kind of like a headless turtle with a ruby on his back?
  41. [12/7/2015 2:24:07 PM] Duvi: it's super unfitting imho
  42. [12/7/2015 2:24:26 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: the ruby is the eye
  43. [12/7/2015 2:24:34 PM] Duvi: yeah I gathered that much
  44. [12/7/2015 2:24:46 PM] Duvi: OH
  45. [12/7/2015 2:24:52 PM] Duvi: I thought it was in a glass case
  46. [12/7/2015 2:24:57 PM] Duvi: like Science's eyeball
  47. [12/7/2015 2:25:25 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: it may well be, but let's say it's a sclera
  48. [12/7/2015 2:25:30 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: actually let's keep it ambiguous
  49. [12/7/2015 2:26:00 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: sclera sclera sclera
  50. [12/7/2015 2:26:07 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: English has so many specific words
  51. [12/7/2015 2:26:08 PM] Duvi: Like, I'd be willing to do all the spritework for a different design of Pumpernickel
  52. [12/7/2015 2:26:09 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: I like them a lot
  53. [12/7/2015 2:26:12 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: wish I knew them
  54. [12/7/2015 2:26:16 PM] retchthehaycook: http://talkhaus.raocow.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14371&p=242644&hilit=pumpernickel#p242644
  55. [12/7/2015 2:26:35 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: oh
  56. [12/7/2015 2:26:36 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: huh
  57. [12/7/2015 2:26:45 PM] retchthehaycook: http://talkhaus.raocow.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14371&hilit=pumpernickel&start=825#p319329
  58. [12/7/2015 2:26:45 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: you made pumpernickel's feet be that way
  59. [12/7/2015 2:26:56 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: I assumed he was kind of wide and facing forwards in that picture
  60. [12/7/2015 2:27:02 PM] Chaoxys _: http://i.imgur.com/4pjieV8.png
  61. [12/7/2015 2:27:07 PM | Edited 2:27:12 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah, only realizing now that I may have misinterpreted the image :D
  62. [12/7/2015 2:28:50 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: anyway, I say staying true to raocow's design is like... important
  63. [12/7/2015 2:29:08 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah
  64. [12/7/2015 2:29:28 PM] Duvi: yeah, but 1: he doesn't think so
  65. 2: he specifically doesn't care about Pumpernickel
  66. and 3: pumpernickel looks JANK
  67. [12/7/2015 2:29:34 PM] retchthehaycook: except now I know my interpretation isn't completely true to it either >_<
  68. [12/7/2015 2:30:31 PM] Chaoxys _: Honestly, I like the concept for his design, but I think it could use some tweaking
  69. [12/7/2015 2:30:37 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: 2. he didn't give him a personality writeup, true
  70. 3. big lebowski quote I think
  71. [12/7/2015 2:31:40 PM] Duvi: alright, so unless we're gonna argue "because original design" because it's not like every other ABCD was raocow's design
  72. [12/7/2015 2:31:57 PM] Duvi: I propose we either scrap or retool Pumpernickel
  73. [12/7/2015 2:32:08 PM] Duvi: and if need be, I'll do 100% of the spritework
  74. [12/7/2015 2:32:23 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: I'm against that notion
  75. [12/7/2015 2:32:34 PM] SAJewers: let's stick with what raocow gave us
  76. [12/7/2015 2:32:52 PM] Chaoxys _: Why not ask raocow's opinion on the matter?
  77. [12/7/2015 2:33:02 PM] retchthehaycook: I'll ask raocow through PM or patreon if he could whip up new reference images of pumpernickel- yeah, was just saying that
  78. [12/7/2015 2:33:10 PM] retchthehaycook: from different angles and stuff
  79. [12/7/2015 2:33:14 PM] Duvi: he'd probably answer "I have no opinions on that dude"
  80. [12/7/2015 2:33:22 PM] retchthehaycook: still worth a try
  81. [12/7/2015 2:33:27 PM] SAJewers: IMO what he drew is what we go with
  82. [12/7/2015 2:34:18 PM | Edited 2:34:24 PM] retchthehaycook: but we're not 100% clear on how to interpret what he drew
  83. [12/7/2015 2:34:54 PM] Hoeloe: I always saw him as wide
  84. [12/7/2015 2:35:25 PM] Hoeloe: like a big wide turtle thing with an eye on top
  85. [12/7/2015 2:35:56 PM] SAJewers: looks to me in that reference image they're all facing front
  86. [12/7/2015 2:36:19 PM | Edited 2:36:35 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah, that was a stupid mistake on my part when making the cinematX sprites
  87. [12/7/2015 2:37:09 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: so it seems I agree with Hoeloe
  88. [12/7/2015 2:37:11 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: alright
  89. [12/7/2015 2:37:42 PM] Hoeloe: I think pumpernickel would look good sort of side on - but maybe a little smaller than in rocky's sprite - less long at least
  90. [12/7/2015 2:38:47 PM] retchthehaycook: so if those aren't back legs, what are they?
  91. [12/7/2015 2:38:59 PM] Hoeloe: oh I think they are back legs
  92. [12/7/2015 2:39:00 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: they are?
  93. [12/7/2015 2:39:21 PM] Hoeloe: pumpernickel is a quadruped turtle thing with a big eye on top
  94. [12/7/2015 2:39:23 PM] Hoeloe: in my view
  95. [12/7/2015 2:39:25 PM] retchthehaycook: that was part of duvi's objection to his design
  96. [12/7/2015 2:39:29 PM] SAJewers: he's like Science
  97. [12/7/2015 2:39:41 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah, he could be a UFO or something
  98. [12/7/2015 2:40:13 PM | Edited 2:40:25 PM] retchthehaycook: which is why I think we should try asking raocow for another image at a different angle or something
  99. [12/7/2015 2:40:24 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/00/8f/52/008f52f7dc2ae27006b9dbda17d3d386.jpg
  100. [12/7/2015 2:40:44 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: my proposal is to keep the dome status inconsistent
  101. [12/7/2015 2:40:54 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: sometimes it's sclera, sometimes it's glass
  102. [12/7/2015 2:41:04 PM] Maciej B. // Minnakht: part of his whatever ability he has
  103.  
  104. ...
  105.  
  106. [12/7/2015 11:30:00 PM | Edited 11:30:28 PM] retchthehaycook: Also, may I suggest that Demo and company have to return to the RETCON after each world in order to progress the story and open up the next world? On one hand, it could get repetitive, but on the other the final level being the RETCON itself would be part of a pattern, and it could tie into the worlds split up into two parts.
  107. [12/7/2015 11:30:09 PM] retchthehaycook: Perhaps the krew returns from the city/factory world early and come back to learn Rewind had stolen a crucial component of the RETCON, so then they need to go to the second half of the wait a second that's world 7 now nvm
  108. [12/7/2015 11:33:01 PM] Wasabi: well yeah it's the hub town
  109. [12/7/2015 11:33:12 PM] Wasabi: I thought we already talked about that?
  110. [12/7/2015 11:33:16 PM] retchthehaycook: I thought the RETCON was a separate mini-hub area
  111. [12/7/2015 11:33:25 PM] Wasabi: It's like the spaceship
  112. [12/7/2015 11:33:38 PM] retchthehaycook: with the main hub being the Chronotron town/city around it
  113. [12/7/2015 11:33:38 PM] Wasabi: Well it's chronotown with RETCON in it
  114. [12/7/2015 11:33:39 PM] retchthehaycook: ah
  115. [12/7/2015 11:33:43 PM] retchthehaycook: yeah
  116. [12/7/2015 11:33:44 PM] Wasabi: But you'd arrive through retcon
  117. [12/7/2015 11:33:46 PM] Wasabi: Cause
  118. [12/7/2015 11:33:50 PM] Wasabi: that's the time thing
  119. [12/7/2015 11:34:11 PM | Edited 11:34:36 PM] retchthehaycook: ah, okay, I figured there'd be a separate spacetime portal
  120. [12/7/2015 11:34:26 PM] retchthehaycook: maybe nearby, but not part of the machine itself
  121. [12/7/2015 11:34:51 PM] Wasabi: I'd assume it'd be in/near enough to the machine to do your idea
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