New ban request system introduced

(16:15:19) ‹~moot› the extension is going to be changed soon but i want to force the new templated BRs
(16:15:24) ‹~moot› sorry for the hassle, but this will make BRs actually work
(16:15:35) ‹~moot› if you use templates, whereas as of now they basically never get filled because they are a huge pain in the ass
(16:15:46) ‹~moot› so it's slightly more hassle but will actually result in them getting handled
(16:16:21) ‹%kdel› whoa, new ban requests
(16:16:39) ‹%kdel› awesome
(16:17:16) ‹%kdel› oh, it's still not finished yet
(16:18:15) ‹%dongfix› ya it is
(16:18:20) ‹%dongfix› ALL IS WELL
(16:23:43) ‹+Kyoubro› How are you going to fit BRs into templates?
(16:23:53) ‹+Kyoubro› Tests on Azatsu?
[...]
(16:27:11) ‹%kdel› the old system was a big hassle and it was usually more productive to work on actual active reports
[...]
(16:31:47) ‹+Kyoubro› Eh, not like they did much of anything most of the time.
(16:31:53) ‹+Kyoubro› Ban evasion and whatnot.
(16:32:05) ‹%kdel› if they're that context heavy, then you might be requesting too trivial stuff
(16:32:06) ‹Azatsu› still
(16:32:20) ‹~moot› if it isn't templated, we shouldnt be banning for it
(16:32:23) ‹%kdel› most banworthy posts should fit under one of the global rules
(16:32:25) ‹~moot› because they arent actually breaking a rule.
(16:32:31) ‹%kdel› yeah
(16:32:33) ‹+Kyoubro› Trolling.
(16:32:38) ‹~moot› against the fucking rules
(16:32:39) ‹~moot› global 2
(16:32:40) ‹+Kyoubro› It's impossible to explain why someone's trolling without context.
(16:32:47) ‹~moot› i dont need to know why
(16:32:48) ‹%kdel› you don't need to EXPLAIN
(16:32:49) ‹~moot› you just need to put in
(16:32:50) ‹~moot› "GLOBAL 2"
(16:32:57) ‹~moot› we can see the image and comment
(16:33:01) ‹%kdel› we mods will look at it and either approve or disapprove of the request
(16:33:11) ‹~moot› we see the board, image, comment, and template
(16:33:13) ‹%kdel› we can figure out for ourselves, and if we can't, we'll ask the janitor who requested it
(16:33:17) ‹~moot› if it isnt obvious to us why you picked a template, youre an idiot
(16:33:22) ‹+Kyoubro› And if you don't know that this has been posted in every thread for the past few weeks?
(16:33:26) ‹~moot› and/or are trying to get us to ban for something that isnt against the rules
(16:33:27) ‹+Kyoubro› Which does happen.
(16:33:31) ‹~moot› then tell us here
(16:33:34) ‹~moot› christ you're the mother of all axe grinders
(16:33:38) ‹+AlBorland› WOAH
(16:33:40) ‹+AlBorland› WOAH
[...]
(16:36:10) ‹~moot› every moderator is forced through templates now anyway
(16:36:20) ‹~moot› and you can select "Other..." and enter your own reason
(16:36:22) ‹~moot› and we can ban for it manually
(16:36:51) ‹~moot› but the point of this is to a) be consistent about ban reasons and lengths, b) actually ban for things that are explicitly against the rules c) make ban requests faster to file and A MILLION TIMES FASTER TO FILL
(16:36:58) ‹~moot› what used to take hours now takes minutes for moderators
(16:37:07) ‹~moot› BRs were never effective for a number of reasons
[...]
(16:42:44) ‹~moot› the old system requires a mod look at your reason, look at the post on a separate page, click a ban button, a ban panel popped up, and then populate the ban panel entirely
(16:42:51) ‹~moot› azatsu: that's the way it works now?
(16:42:55) ‹~moot› i dont even know the old system
(16:42:56) ‹Azatsu› yeah
(16:42:59) ‹Azatsu› that's why I think it's better
(16:43:00) ‹~moot› i think you're referring to the chrome extension that i never used
(16:43:01) ‹Azatsu› now
(16:43:06) ‹Azatsu› yeah, that one
(16:43:10) ‹~moot› i never used it
(16:43:19) ‹~moot› i added ~125 ban templates to the system a few weeks ago
(16:43:23) ‹~moot› i went through /rules by hand and added them all
(16:43:34) ‹~moot› so there should be a template for anything in /rules
(16:43:42) ‹~moot› and now mods just click an accept button or deny button
(16:43:54) ‹~moot› accept puts in the ban automatically, no ban panel or anything
(16:43:58) ‹~moot› deny just clears it
(16:44:07) ‹~moot› what once took hours now takes minutes
(16:44:15) ‹~moot› but it requires janitors actually use the templates, because manual entry is still a pain in the ass
(16:44:22) ‹~moot› and again, not what i want because i want 99% of bans to be templated
(16:44:37) ‹~moot› because it standardizes ban reasons and lengths, something we've always sucked at

(16:53:47) ‹%kdel› all we want is a CONCISE system that allows for maximum speed nad efficiency
(16:53:49) ‹~moot› the same reason we dont allow notes on user reports is because it's useless noise
(16:54:11) ‹+Kazisho› RapeApe9k, https://www.4chan.org/reports/new.php . But don't use it for ban requests.
(16:54:16) ‹Azatsu› there's always the ban appeal
(16:54:24) ‹+Kyoubro› Then why don't we have more specific report reasons?
(16:54:29) ‹%kdel› the global rules are already far reaching enough, they should all fit under there
(16:54:30) ‹~moot› it should be obvious when looking at a post's image or comment why it was reported as a rule violation, spam, or illegal
(16:54:32) ‹~moot› same goes for BRs
[...]
(16:54:39) ‹Azatsu› because everything falls under 3 categories
(16:54:42) ‹Azatsu› literally everything
(16:54:43) ‹~moot› right
(16:54:49) ‹~moot› it's either a RULE VIOLATION, ILLEGAL, or SAM
(16:54:50) ‹~moot› SPAM*
(16:54:56) ‹+Kyoubro› Well, you can say that for ban requests too.
(16:55:34) ‹~moot› huh?
(16:55:48) ‹+Kyoubro› Every ban request falls under rule violation, illegal, or spam.
(16:55:59) ‹~moot› correct!
(16:56:05) ‹~moot› because every fucking ban template deals with one of those three
(16:56:13) ‹~moot› and there is a ban template for /EVERY BANNABLE THING LISTED IN THE RULES/
(16:56:52) ‹+Kyoubro› Wouldn't it also help to extend the number of report reasons so that janitors can go through the report queue more quickly and efficiently?
(16:57:03) ‹~moot› no
(16:57:15) ‹~moot› why would splintering it further help?
(16:57:41) ‹Azatsu› reports fall under the 3 categories. Those 3 categories for reports need to be broken up into the rules categories so there will be specific ban lenghts, and that will make going through the ban requests much easier
(16:57:44) ‹Azatsu› that's how I see it
(16:58:03) ‹~moot› the reason is just to help triage the importance of the report
(16:58:07) ‹~moot› hence why illegal is at the top
(16:58:13) ‹~moot› and posts with multiple reports show above others
(16:59:20) ‹+Kyoubro› Because then it allows users to be clear on what they're reporting something for. "Illegal" is very clear most of the time (although a lot of users seem to think it just means "against global rules"), "spam" is also fairly obvious, but "rule" has a hell of a lot of subdivisions that aren't all obvious without looking at the context of the post.
(16:59:48) ‹~moot› rule violation is binary
(16:59:50) ‹~moot› it IS, or it ISNT
(16:59:59) ‹~moot› if people are reporting for shades of grey, it probably shouldnt have been reported
(17:00:10) ‹Azatsu› gray areas imo just need a deletion
(17:00:15) ‹Azatsu› or even let for users to decide
(17:00:21) ‹+VCR_Working› mm
(17:00:23) ‹~moot› the three reasons triage how important the report is, i do not give two shits about why a user thinks it should be reported, that's for you to decide
(17:00:26) ‹+Kyoubro› For example, there's a group of trolls on /a/ who target Horizon threads. Without context, it looks like the Horizon fans are reporting them because "stop hating what I like", but then when you go and look at the actual CONTEXT it turns out that there are a few trolls who have been doing this for months.
(17:00:44) ‹~moot› great
(17:00:47) ‹~moot› so take that into account!
(17:00:58) ‹~moot› i dont know why you're applying your stupid /a/ drama shit across the board to every other use case for reports
(17:01:03) ‹~moot› you're describing an edge case
(17:01:06) ‹~moot› this works for 99% of cases
(17:01:16) ‹~moot› making the system more complicated to deal with /a/ drama will make it shit
(17:01:22) ‹+Kyoubro› Because these edge cases are what I spend most of my time on with /a/.
(17:01:25) ‹%kdel› look, you guys as janitors are not stupid
(17:01:31) ‹~moot› the point is to get reports sorted as quickly as possible, and ban requests filled as quickly as possible
(17:01:36) ‹~moot› that's it
(17:01:41) ‹%kdel› if YOU as a janitor believes the gray cases are black, then ban request under one of the global rules
(17:01:56) ‹%kdel› then us MODS we'll take a look and if we agree, we'll approve
(17:02:04) ‹%kdel› it's a simple system
(17:02:23) ‹Azatsu› consider that mods that don't understand at all why did you submit that ban request will just go and ask you
(17:02:33) ‹Azatsu› and you explain that horizon threads get specific treatment from a small group of trolls
(17:02:38) ‹%kdel› yes, if we don't know, we will ask you on irc
(17:02:47) ‹%kdel› it's not like this is some sort of automated system
(17:02:50) ‹+Kyoubro› Never been asked in the past. But who knows, that may change.
(17:02:56) ‹+VCR_Working› yeah(17:02:58) ‹Azatsu› that will probably change
(17:03:03) ‹Azatsu› since now they will go through the BR's
(17:03:04) ‹Azatsu› unlike before(17:03:08) ‹+andonuts› They can also check out threads pertaining to certain boards on /j/.
(17:03:11) ‹Azatsu› that only 3 or 4 did
(17:03:30) ‹~moot› mods didnt do ban requests because clearing the queue actually took /hours/
(17:03:35) ‹~moot› i can go through 100 templated ban requests in minutes
(17:03:43) ‹Azatsu› yeah they would complain about that
(17:03:48) ‹+Kyoubro› Well, let's see, then. I hope I'm proven wrong.
(17:03:49) ‹~moot› the old system had been ineffective for years
[...]
(17:04:56) ‹+RapeApe9k› next question is, should illegal shit be reported on channel first?
(17:05:02) ‹+RapeApe9k› *still
(17:05:06) ‹Azatsu› I think so
(17:05:09) ‹Azatsu› since they are a big problem
(17:05:24) ‹%kdel› banned
(17:05:30) ‹~moot› no
(17:05:32) ‹~moot› delete and BR it
(17:05:35) ‹~moot› always remove it as quickly as possible
(17:05:53) ‹~moot› and if there is someone evading, tell a mod to check the BR queue
(17:06:01) ‹~moot› er spamming CP or spamming in general
(17:06:13) ‹Azatsu› Oh
(17:06:45) ‹+RapeApe9k› kdel you may as well delete the thread too
(17:06:48) ‹+RapeApe9k› i can't
(17:06:49) ‹+VCR_Working› since it's templated now it'll make it easier to kill off quickly