@Snowydoe: Ok sweet
@Alkov: xD
@Snowydoe: Our first team comes from lt2cario http://pastebin.com/mabEspAr
#IronBullet: perfect time to start, people were talking about the colour of their piss -.-
+Sonired: he's littlelucario now
littlelucario was promoted to Room Voice by Snowydoe.
+littlelucario: :D
+littlelucario: thanks
@Snowydoe: np n_n
+littlelucario: ive never done onoe of these
+littlelucario: is that ok?
+fleggumfl: ok
@Snowydoe: Nothing much too it, will just go over your team and give you suggestions n_n
+Sonired: it's cool
+littlelucario: ok, thanks guyus
+Sonired: alba missed it x
+littlelucario: rip alba
+littlelucario: i think that hes actually seen this team before
+littlelucario: lol
@Snowydoe: So I see zard y+sand so im guessing that was the focus point of the team?
+fleggumfl: well before we start, I've seen a team almost exactly the same as that
+littlelucario: actually, i wanted to build around lucario, and i chose zardy as my wallbreaker
+littlelucario: it took off from there
@Alkov: so fitting of your name :]
+littlelucario: yeah
+Sonired: lol
@Snowydoe: Ah I see, so lucario is a must for this team then
+littlelucario: it is, yes
%Team Pokepals: :)
+Sonired: so how did the sand idea come in?
+littlelucario: hi pokepals :D
+littlelucario: i just figured that having exca and luke as twin sders could break down walls
+littlelucario: pretty well
+fleggumfl: sand kinda comes to mind straight away with zard y
+littlelucario: yeah that too
+fleggumfl: considering a weather resetter is one of the best partners
+fleggumfl: and exca spins
+littlelucario: i actually decided to have lati as my hazard clearer so that i could have twin sd users
+fleggumfl: o
@Alkov: fair enough, but have you considered using a different weather resetter aka hippowdon
@Alkov: since your team is fairly weak to volt-turn in general
@Alkov: or thundurus with focus blast
+fleggumfl: and slowbro is used to handle priority from the likes of conkeldurr / azu
+littlelucario: i haven't but i would be open to changing to hippo
+fleggumfl: but its weak to breloom
%Team Pokepals: wait littlelucario, didn't I build that team with you a long time ago?
+littlelucario: Team Pokepals i think so
@Alkov: xD
@Snowydoe: I like hippo too, cause NP thunderus is a problem
%Team Pokepals: lol, I remember cause of that Slowbro
+littlelucario: lol
+Sonired: although hippo kindof is a risky check to np thundurus
+littlelucario: because +2 hp ice
+littlelucario: does a lot
+Sonired: yeah
@Alkov: the downside, however is that hippo makes you a little too weak to opposing lati
@Snowydoe: It can live any hit and fire off a stone edge so it's not a bad answer, just dont let it get to plus 3
+littlelucario: ok
%Team Pokepals: the only things that can "catch" dracos are Lucario and Excadrill
@Alkov: so what i'll suggest is replace slowbro for a lati switch-in along with a pivot against thundurus
+littlelucario: ill be lop weak if i replace bro
@Alkov: but you'll have a hippo
+Sonired: hippowdon can work for lop
+littlelucario: oh
+littlelucario: ok
@Alkov: and exca to revenge kill
+littlelucario: i didnt know we decided on hippo
+littlelucario: toxic as the last move
+littlelucario: right?
@Alkov: replacing hippo > ttar helps to cope with your existing weakness but it brings about another hole which is NP thundurus and lati so what i'm suggesting is another pivot
@Alkov: to help cope with those 2
@Alkov: to replace slowbro
@Snowydoe: I agree with that
+littlelucario: ok
@Snowydoe: as for the hippo set I think edge/quake/slackoff/ rocks is fine
+littlelucario: ok
+Sonired: yeah
@Snowydoe: I would run standard mixed if not a bit more spd for gengar
%Team Pokepals: we're replacing slowbro now, right?
@Snowydoe: yeah, lets move onto slowbro
%Team Pokepals: ok
%Team Pokepals: so once slowbro is gone
@Snowydoe: cause like alkov said we need an answer to latis
%Team Pokepals: we'll need something to take scalds and catch dracos
@Alkov: to keep things a little more face-paced, an AV raikou can help to replace slowbro as the pivot or you can just use clef
%Team Pokepals: the only thing that can take scald is latias
@Alkov: since they are capable of winning the lati + thundurus fairly well
+littlelucario: id prefer av raik
+fleggumfl: what about clefable?
+Sonired: that team can potentially get run through by manaphy
+Sonired: and raikou is a better check to manaphy
+fleggumfl: you get a bit overwhelmed by np but you can handle it if its not np
%Team Pokepals: specs keldeo just says gg once latias dies
@Alkov: there aren't that many specs keldeo switch-in in the metagame to begin with
@Alkov: relying on roost latias is fair enough with the ability to revenge kill it using driller
%Team Pokepals: I agree that'll work
@Alkov: or raik if the change is accepted as the change or clef
%Ana1ytic: Team looks pretty weak to Fairies in general
@Alkov: both soft-checks raikou as well
@Alkov: i mean keldeo*
+littlelucario: roost over hw on lati?
+littlelucario: and av raik
+littlelucario: right?
+littlelucario: since im running raik, can i run iron tail on luke to lure fairies
+Sonired: yeah i would say
%Ana1ytic: How about Amoonguss over Slowbro?
%Ana1ytic: Checks Keldeo
%Ana1ytic: MAlt
%Team Pokepals: Ana1ytic he also needs something to catch dracos
%Ana1ytic: MDiancie
%Ana1ytic: Oh yeah
%Ana1ytic: Tbf
+littlelucario: how would iron tail work on luke
%Ana1ytic: Raikou seems out of place
+littlelucario: to lure fairies
%Ana1ytic: On this team
+Sonired: but then the team is kinda weak to amoonguss too
+Sonired: i mean
+Sonired: manaphy
%Ana1ytic: How about Ferro?
%Ana1ytic: Provides Spikes support too
%Team Pokepals: it can catch dracos, check fairies, check thundy without focus blast
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
%Ana1ytic: Seems decent enough for me
%Ana1ytic: Thoughts, littlelucario?
+littlelucario: ferro seems solid
+littlelucario: id be weak to hp fire manaphy
+littlelucario: with hp fire over eball
%Ana1ytic: But then again
+Sonired: eball is the most common secondary coverage move on manaphy
+littlelucario: yeah
%Ana1ytic: You always will have to scout what set it is running regardless
+littlelucario: yeah
+littlelucario: ok
%Ana1ytic: Ferrothorn gives the team a decent Kyurem-B check too
+littlelucario: ok
+littlelucario: ferro it is
%Ana1ytic: Changes:
@Snowydoe: so ferro > bro?
+littlelucario: ye
%Team Pokepals: I think so
+littlelucario: dual stabs or iron head twave
+littlelucario: or whip twave
%Ana1ytic: Ferro>Slowbro I Hippowdon>Tyranitar
%Team Pokepals: so it's zard y, hippo, excadrill, lucario, ferro, and latias?
+littlelucario: yeah
@Snowydoe: gyro/whip/spikes/seeds
%Ana1ytic: Are the changes so far
+littlelucario: ok
+littlelucario: and roost over hw on lati
+littlelucario: right
@Snowydoe: yep
+littlelucario: ok
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
+littlelucario: thanks
%Team Pokepals: watch out for heatrans
%Ana1ytic: No problem bud
+littlelucario: we're looking weak to pup+encore mlop
%Ana1ytic: How rare is that lmfao
+Sonired: lol
+littlelucario: i see it a lot
+littlelucario: lol
%Team Pokepals: that sounds funny, but Stone Edge can kill Zard Y, magma storm can kill lucario, ferro and drill, while latias can get trapped and can't do anything back
@Snowydoe: I think his talking about them separately analytic
@Snowydoe: not all on the same set
%Ana1ytic: Ah
+littlelucario: encore lop in general
+littlelucario: is a problem
%Ana1ytic: Yeah well
%Ana1ytic: Hippowdon
%Ana1ytic: Should deal with it pretty well
+Sonired: hippo should just really try to eq it down
%Team Pokepals: hippo might be enough for heatran too
+littlelucario: ok
+littlelucario: ok
@Snowydoe: it's annoying but it isnt going to break hippo any time
+Sonired: not try anything too crazy for the encore lop
+littlelucario: anything else?
%Ana1ytic: I think we're good?
+littlelucario: yeah
@Snowydoe: how do we feel on jolly luc?
%Team Pokepals: I think so
+littlelucario: i think so
%Team Pokepals: iirc
%Team Pokepals: adamant luc at +2 can 1HKO tank chomp
+littlelucario: im not weak to anything around that speed tier
+littlelucario: tbh
@Snowydoe: ah that's nice
@Snowydoe: im p happy with that then
%Ana1ytic: Yeah we're good :)
+Sonired: it's a roll pokepals
+littlelucario: thanks guys :D
@Snowydoe: thanks bro for the team n_n
+littlelucario: it looks rerally nic
%Ana1ytic: No problem dude
(littlelucario was demoted to Room regular user by Snowydoe.)
%Team Pokepals: Sonired depends on the ev spread tho, anyways, how good is the roll?
+Sonired: +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Lucario Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 164+ Def Garchomp: 399-472 (95 - 112.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
@Snowydoe: next team comes from explodingdaisies http://pastebin.com/icS6ReHX
+Sonired: it shouldnt be too problematic tbh
+fleggumfl: ok
explodingdaisies was promoted to Room Voice by Snowydoe.
%Team Pokepals: didn't we get a chesnaught last OU workshop too?
@Snowydoe: you there bro?
+explodingdaisies: thanks
+fleggumfl: belly drum chesnaught
@Snowydoe: awesome
+fleggumfl: cool
+explodingdaisies: appreciate it
+Sonired: interesting team
+explodingdaisies: rock slide is a great bird lure
+explodingdaisies: but u could run overgrow and seed bomb
+explodingdaisies: as it OHKO's both latis with overgrow boost
+Sonired: bulletproof is better imo
+fleggumfl: nah, it needs overgrow
%Team Pokepals: overgrow is power
+explodingdaisies: and I believe it OHKO's torn t also
+Sonired: yeah that's what i meant
+Sonired: overgrow
%Ana1ytic: Alright so
%Ana1ytic: The zards look like threats
+explodingdaisies: they do
%Ana1ytic: Hmm
+explodingdaisies: especially zard X
@Snowydoe: zzard get y gets a kill everytime its in
%Team Pokepals: I think Zard Y was the more threatening one
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
+explodingdaisies: what do u guys suggest to fix that
%Team Pokepals: cause Zard X needs to setup to kill suicune, and at that point you can just cripple it with klefki's t-wave
@Snowydoe: I think we need to fit a zard y check into this team
%Ana1ytic: You've built around M-Gardevoir+Bisharp, explodingdaisies?
+explodingdaisies: I use to run dragalge
+explodingdaisies: he was a great chary check
+explodingdaisies: im building around chesnaught
%Ana1ytic: Oh okay
+explodingdaisies: stack hazards and keep pressure with bisharp
@Snowydoe: as much as I like keys, what does it do for this team really? Like we have tran to help vs dragons/fairies and we have stuff for weavile in cune
@Snowydoe: I think we could drop it
@Snowydoe: for a zard y check
@Snowydoe: id thats fine with you
+explodingdaisies: toxic spikes dragalge?
%Ana1ytic: Dd M-Altaria and M-Gardevoir are too big of a threat
@Snowydoe: I like drag, but lets see what everyone else thinks
%Team Pokepals: Dragalge sounds cool
%Ana1ytic: Klefki provides team with a fairy resist too
%Ana1ytic: And spikes
@Snowydoe: Another we we could do is drop gardevoir for altaria as a check to zrd
%Team Pokepals: but once heatran dies, specs sylveon, mega gardevoir and MEGA DIANCIE become huge threats
%Ana1ytic: Also checks DD ZardY if its set up
@Snowydoe: I think we change gardevoir to alt then
%Ana1ytic: Yeah MAlt sounds cool
+explodingdaisies: which m-alt set?
%Ana1ytic: One minute
+explodingdaisies: offensive?
@Snowydoe: I think it would have to be bulky to better deal with zard x/y
%Ana1ytic: I think defensive suits this better
%Team Pokepals: how much does gardevoir do to venusaur with psyshock?
+explodingdaisies: def venu?
+Sonired: 232 SpA Mega Gardevoir Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Mega Venusaur: 194-230 (53.2 - 63.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
%Team Pokepals: 232 SpA Mega Gardevoir Psyshock vs. 232 HP / 0 Def Mega Venusaur: 260-308 (72.4 - 85.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
%Team Pokepals: basically not a 1HKO
%Ana1ytic: -188 SpDCareful Nature
%Ana1ytic: EVs: 248 HP / 72 Atk / 188 SpD
%Team Pokepals: if we run mega alt
%Team Pokepals: we need something for mega venusaur
@Snowydoe: we have heatran
+explodingdaisies: ya but some venu's carry EQ
%Ana1ytic: The EV spread survives LO Torn-T, twice
%Team Pokepals: Snowydoe I meant we need something to kill mega venusaur
+Sonired: timdi heatran risks a 3hko on venu as well
%Ana1ytic: I run mono attacking DD set with Refresh
%Ana1ytic: I think we're good with Heatran
%Ana1ytic: For M-Venusaur
@Snowydoe: We could run air ballon tran if you really scared of the rare eq venu
%Team Pokepals: 252 SpA Heatran Fire Blast vs. 232 HP / 4 SpD Thick Fat Mega Venusaur: 152-182 (42.3 - 50.6%) -- 1.6% chance to 2HKO
%Ana1ytic: Just run Lava Plume
+explodingdaisies: i prefer the lefties
+Sonired: that's a 2hko after rocks
%Ana1ytic: 30% Burn chance
+explodingdaisies: ya that 30% is big
%Team Pokepals: 252 SpA Heatran Lava Plume vs. 232 HP / 4 SpD Thick Fat Mega Venusaur: 114-134 (31.7 - 37.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
+fleggumfl: ok sorry ive just been coming and going
%Ana1ytic: Gonna stall out the synthesis anyway
%Team Pokepals: lol
@Snowydoe: honestly heatran is fine, cause if there running eq they cant touch magnet rise klefki
+fleggumfl: im doing like 3 things at once
@Snowydoe: so I think we drop garde for bulky alt and focus on the set
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
+explodingdaisies: now i got 2 mons weak to ground and no ground immunity
%Ana1ytic: The EV Spread i gave
@Snowydoe: I personally like heal bell, because waking up cune is nice after a nap
+explodingdaisies: pre-mega alt
%Ana1ytic: Yeah that works too
%Team Pokepals: you have chesnaught and suicune for ground types
%Ana1ytic: Yeah lol
+explodingdaisies: ya
%Alastor Law: we are like
%Alastor Law: ultra mega weak to spike stack teams
%Ana1ytic: EVs: 248 HP / 72 Atk / 188 SpD
%Ana1ytic: Careful Nature
+Sonired: i think maybe run taunt and magma storm on tran, to kill ferro/skarm and stop them from stacking any more spikes
+Sonired: it also stops mvenu from synthesis if anything
@Snowydoe: mh what do you think we could add in to stop that alastor?
%Ana1ytic: DD/Heal Bell/Roost/Return
+explodingdaisies: then i got no rocks
%Alastor Law: altaria + defog skarm
+Sonired: run rocks on tran as well
@Snowydoe: I like that
@Snowydoe: over klefki I assume?
+explodingdaisies: magma storm taunt rocks e-power?
%Team Pokepals: taunt + magma storm + rocks + earth power?
%Alastor Law: y
@Snowydoe: ok sweet
%Ana1ytic: Okie
%Team Pokepals: skarm can check the fairies too
+explodingdaisies: ill go air balloon with this tran
@Snowydoe: Yeah skarm is great for this team over klefki
%Ana1ytic: SpD M-Altaria>M-Gardevoir I SpD Skarmory>Klefki
%Alastor Law: it also lets us have a backup answer for venu
%Ana1ytic: We're good?
@Snowydoe: which means we can leave the heatran set the same
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
+Sonired: yeah that works
%Team Pokepals: I think we're good
%Team Pokepals: we just need that moveset for skarm
%Alastor Law: spikes roost brave bird/IH defog
+explodingdaisies: so skarm over drag?
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
@Snowydoe: So leave the heatran set the same, if not make it bulkier, then add in bulky alt > gardevoir and Skarm > klefki
%Ana1ytic: Klefki
%Ana1ytic: EVs: 248 HP / 72 Atk / 188 SpD Careful
@Snowydoe: are we running no attack skarm? or bb > ww
%Team Pokepals: I think BB
%Ana1ytic: It's the spread
%Team Pokepals: Ana1ytic I think you meant altaria?
@Snowydoe: just max defensive with 8/12 speed is fine
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
%Alastor Law: 8 Speed
%Ana1ytic: MAltaria spread is
%Alastor Law: to outpace CB Azus who run speed to outpace skarm
%Ana1ytic: EVs: 248 HP / 72 Atk / 188 SpD Careful
@Snowydoe: I believe the bulky alt spread is 152 to out speed 110s at +1, then 104+ spd and rest in hp
%Ana1ytic: This spread
%Ana1ytic: Aboids 2HKO from LO TornadusT Hurricane
%Alastor Law: it needs no attack actually as it is a late game sweeper
@Snowydoe: I think the speed is crucial in all honesty, what do you guys think?
%Ana1ytic: I mean
%Alastor Law: and we kill opposing unaware fable with skarm, hazards and sharp
+explodingdaisies: i believe speed is most important
%Alastor Law: the speed is more important
%Ana1ytic: MManectric and MLop
%Alastor Law: or even some investment in defense
%Alastor Law: whichever are gud
@Snowydoe: btw if we're not going to run WW on skarm and we have heal bell, what about roar > sleep talk?
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
%Alastor Law: ya, for those guys actually
%Ana1ytic: Sounds decent
%Team Pokepals: let's do it
%Alastor Law: I was going to say that Snowy
@Snowydoe: yeah i think it's nice to remove those annoying steels that could set up
@Snowydoe: what are our thoughts on bulky tran? instead of max speed?
%Alastor Law: Ability: Cloud Nine
%Alastor Law: EVs: 248 HP / 136 Def / 96 SpD / 28 Spe
%Alastor Law: Impish Nature
%Ana1ytic: Yeah we're looking p good
%Alastor Law: either tran works tbh
%Alastor Law: it's just a pivor
+explodingdaisies: ill test it to see how it works
%Alastor Law: pivot*
+explodingdaisies: so whats the set for skarm?
@Snowydoe: defog/spikes/roost/bb
%Alastor Law: !analysis skarmory
XY Skarmory analysis, brought to you by Smogon University
+explodingdaisies: hmm defog
%Alastor Law: the first one
+explodingdaisies: kinda counterproductive with spikes stack
%Alastor Law: with 248 Speed, 252+ Def, 8 Speed
%Ana1ytic: Defog is fine
%Alastor Law: you can kill the opposing spiker
%Alastor Law: and then set up your own
+explodingdaisies: true
%Alastor Law: it's just as a backup not to have many trash on your side
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
%Team Pokepals: and you have bisharp to abuse their defog
@Snowydoe: so here's the team I got http://pastebin.com/9bpnsVmF everyone happy with this?
+explodingdaisies: http://pastebin.com/XNWTPCcY
+explodingdaisies: oh
%Ana1ytic: Yeah looks pretty nice
%Alastor Law: you should put some nicks on altaria and skarm
%Alastor Law: other than that, gud stuff
@Snowydoe: haha yep n_n
%Team Pokepals: lol yeah
@qtrx: >nicks
@Snowydoe: thanks for submitting man, hope we helped!
(explodingdaisies was demoted to Room regular user by Snowydoe.)
kin3 was promoted to Room Voice by Snowydoe.
%Alastor Law: sorry for being late guys
%Alastor Law: btw
@Snowydoe: next team is by kin3 http://pastebin.com/dw53uVyP
+kin3: hey
@Snowydoe: also no worries alastor glad your here bud n_n
+fleggumfl: i see electrics look like a problem
%Team Pokepals: specifically mega manectric
+fleggumfl: same with zardy
%Ana1ytic: The PB
%Ana1ytic: Isnt loading for me
%Albacore: raikou>thundurus possbly
%Team Pokepals: it's weavile, mega medicham, thundy, BD azu, tank chomp and scarf heatran
+kin3: yeah thundurus doesnt do anything usually lol
+fleggumfl: oh
%Albacore: that being said you do lose a ground immunity if you do that
+fleggumfl: this is weavcham
+kin3: i use it to surprise people with hp ice because they always expect grass knot because i have weavile
%Alastor Law: raikou over thundu
%Albacore: which makes you vulnerable to stuff like scarf lando EQ spam i guess
%Alastor Law: lando over chomper to make a volturn core
%Team Pokepals: Zard X looks like a big threat imo
%Albacore: also if you run raikou, run knock off>waterfall on azu to lure ferro
%Alastor Law: offensive tran to help with the scizor weakness
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
%Team Pokepals: you do have a lot of priority tho
%Ana1ytic: BD Azu shouldnt run Waterfall anyway
%Team Pokepals: mega alt can beat the team too
%Alastor Law: and check the Azu spread and moves
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%Albacore: well malt can sota be revenge killed but yeah it's a problem
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%Alastor Law: those are my suggestions during this one rate
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%Albacore: sableye looks really annoying actually
%Albacore: so maybe run CM on raikou if you use it
+kin3: hmm i guess i can try out lando and raik
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%Ana1ytic: Yeah that sounds good too
+fleggumfl: the only thing is
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+kin3: i used to run lum on azu for sableye
+fleggumfl: that makes the team a lot weaker to bisharp
%Albacore: i dont think running lando-t over chomp is a good idea b/c then bisharp becomes a huge problem
+Sonired: yeah i agree with fleg
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%Ana1ytic: And Talonflame too
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%Albacore: also stray ice punch lop
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%Ana1ytic: Mhm
%Alastor Law: you can change
+Sonired: encore lop even
+fleggumfl: garchomp is needed as it holds this team together
%Alastor Law: azumarill for keldeo
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
%Alastor Law: to help that
%Alastor Law: and also helps with sableye
%Albacore: yeah taht seems like a good idea
%Alastor Law: no big deal or anything
+kin3: i like chomp because it punishes priority revenge killers, and easy rocks
%Albacore: *that
%Ana1ytic: Hmm
%Ana1ytic: Azu checks the zardx
%Team Pokepals: sub calm mind keldeo?
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+fleggumfl: hmm
%Alastor Law: Zard X is taken care of my Lando and Offensive Heatran
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%Alastor Law: by my*
%Albacore: keldoe also makes the team weaker to opposing azu
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+fleggumfl: if anything I think i would change heatran
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+fleggumfl: i think it feels like the weakest mon in the team
%Alastor Law: azu has like no switch ins anyway
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%Ana1ytic: True
+fleggumfl: i think klefki would be a nice replacement
%Albacore: i agree
%Alastor Law: and WoW tran can help that
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+fleggumfl: as it also gives the team a fairy switch in
%Ana1ytic: Mhm
%Alastor Law: WoW Lava Plume EP Taunt
%Ana1ytic: Helps M-Gardevoir
%Ana1ytic: Vs
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+fleggumfl: this frees up twave on thundy and lets us easily drop it for raikou
%Team Pokepals: klefki + chomp works well imo
%Ana1ytic: MAltaria too
%Ana1ytic: Yeah i like that
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%Team Pokepals: so right now, it's Weavile, Mega Medicham, Azu, AV Raikou, Klefki and Tank Chomp?
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+Sonired: magnet rise klefki would be best imo
+kin3: should i keep azu belly drum?
%Albacore: clefable can be pretty annoying i guess
%Alastor Law: that's 6-0ed by Kube
%Albacore: yeah keep BD on azu
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%Ana1ytic: No Raikou
+Sonired: kyub doesnt do much to magnet rise klefki
%Albacore: maybe scizor instead of klefki?
%Ana1ytic: Thundurus
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+fleggumfl: yeah i like bisharp over weavile as the dark type for these kind of teams for clefable
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%Albacore: i thought we went with raikou to handle electrics
+fleggumfl: the only thing with that alba is that the team loses out on needed speed control
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%Alastor Law: gtg, gl with the rates guys :P
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%Ana1ytic: Bye
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+fleggumfl: you can't stop zard/alt/gyara etc
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%Albacore: yeah and spikes really benefit the team to
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%Albacore: *too
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@Snowydoe: Later alastor. Sorry I had to duck out for a bit, what have we chanaged so far?
+Sonired: klefki and av raikou
+Sonired: over tran and thundy
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%Ana1ytic: Raikou>Thundurus I Klefki>Heatran
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@Snowydoe: ok awesome
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+kin3: gives me some good torn switch ins
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+kin3: people try to be cool and not u-turn
+Sonired: lol
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+kin3: they see chomp, they hit hurricane
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%Albacore: what are the downsides of bisahrp>weavile?
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%Ana1ytic: Not a lot
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+Sonired: makes the team a bit weaker to landorus i guess
+kin3: lando is a big problem
+Sonired: wait no
+Sonired: it doesnt
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%Ana1ytic: Lol
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%Ana1ytic: Defiant
+kin3: i can bait it in with medi, but if its scarf i cnat do anything to it
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+Sonired: keep on forgetting defiant lol
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%Albacore: EQ spam is still kindof a problem
@Snowydoe: I feel like this team is very grounded and weak to hazard stack :/
+Sonired: magnet rise on klefki can sort that alba
%Albacore: if you volt swicth and a scarf lando swicthes in your in trouble
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%Team Pokepals: would skarm over klefki work again?
+fleggumfl: n
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+fleggumfl: it needs speed control
+Sonired: then xzard/malt/gyara would be harder
@Snowydoe: What do we lose by using skarm > klefki?
%Albacore: is there a flying type with purusit
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%Albacore: honchkrow ftw
+fleggumfl: altaria
+fleggumfl: !
%Team Pokepals: Albacore mega pidgoet too
+Sonired: !ds flying type, pursuit
Pidgey, Pidgeotto, Pidgeot, Spearow, Fearow, Zubat, Golbat, Doduo, Dodrio, Scyther, and 18 more. Redo the search with 'all' as a search parameter to show all results.
+Sonired: well there must be
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+Sonired: skarmory lol
@qtrx: !ds flying type, pursuit, atk>100
Aerodactyl, Dodrio, Honchkrow, Scyther, Staraptor
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+Sonired: staraptor
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+Sonired: and the odd pursuit mega aero
+fleggumfl: well most medisharp ho teams go something like
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%Albacore: in all seriosulness alastor's earlier idea of lando+keldeo doesnt seem too bad
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%Albacore: even though it changes 50% of he team
+fleggumfl: dark/medi/water/electriccheck/rocker that doesnt lose to lopunny/spike stacker
+kin3: idc
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%Team Pokepals: Albacore do you know what he tended to replace?
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+kin3: change all you want
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%Albacore: keldeo>azu and lando-t>chomp IIRC
+kin3: you guys are great
+Sonired: yeah
%Team Pokepals: intended*
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+fleggumfl: i dont like lando for handling lop, but it can work i guess
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%Albacore: klefki can always twave lop
@Snowydoe: Im guessing that's cm keldeo so we dont lose to sab?
%Albacore: yeah
@Snowydoe: and stall in general
@Snowydoe: ok that's cool
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@Snowydoe: and I like lando as well
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%Ana1ytic: Yeah
+Sonired: is this choice scarf lando?
%Albacore: probably not sinc we want SR on teh team
@Snowydoe: Defensive Rocks lando. So if someone go through all the changes and sun it up that would be great
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@Snowydoe: sum*
+Sonired: maybe offensive rocks
%Team Pokepals: we also get a volt turn core
+Sonired: ?
%Team Pokepals: raikou + lando
+kin3: am i weak to breloom? i remember my team had trouble with fc loom, and bisharp would make it worse
%Albacore: the team is still weak to clef though :(
%Albacore: even more so now that azu cant BD past it
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+Sonired: bd azu sorted that really tbh
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+Sonired: well sorted*
%Ana1ytic: Keldeo>Azu/Raikou>Thundurus/Klefki>Heatran
+Sonired: almost sorted
+fleggumfl: what if
+fleggumfl: bisharp > weavile
%Ana1ytic: That's like
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%Ana1ytic: 4/6 mons
+Hack Guy left
@Snowydoe: p-jab weavile as a lure is nice
+fleggumfl: ,
+fleggumfl: yeah pjab weav is not bad
+Sonired: yeah snowy that's a good idea
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%Ana1ytic: I don't like the idea of changing the whole team
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%Ana1ytic: PJab
%Ana1ytic: Is nice
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%Albacore: well half of the appeal of vile on tah team is pursuit
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%Albacore: *that
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+kin3: yeah, i love catching slobros lol
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+Sonired: but still clefable seems like a bigger problem
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%Albacore: yeah
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@Snowydoe: I think we have to bite the bullet and use it, unless you are willing to use sharp, but then we've changed a lot of the team
+Sonired: !learn Medicham, Poison Jab
Medicham can learn Poison Jab
+Sonired: o_O
%Albacore: specs>AV on raikou makes you less weak to clef too
@Snowydoe: huh
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+Sonired: i dont like bullet punch on medicham tbh
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+Sonired: it doesnt do enough to clef
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+fleggumfl: nah its too good
+fleggumfl: for fast stuff
+kin3: i love it
%Team Pokepals: poison jab sounds nice
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%Ana1ytic: I thought we were SubCM Raikou?
%Team Pokepals: but bullet punch smacks diancie
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%Ana1ytic: Yeah
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@Snowydoe: I think we just make that weavile change and wrap this one up
%Team Pokepals: I thought we were AV Raikou...
%Ana1ytic: Picks off
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+kin3: yeah half the people stay in wih diance hoping i dont have bp too lol
+Sonired: it only does like 32-37%
%Ana1ytic: Weakened threats
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+kin3: if klef sets spikes then i could fake out headbut clef
+kin3: or headbutt hax it
%Albacore: !learn klefki, iron head
Klefki can't learn Iron Head
+Sonired: what set is klef running?
%Albacore: aww
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+Sonired: lol
+Sonired: rip the dream 2015
@tab and the pokeseyan joined
+kin3: t wave , magnet rise, something something lol
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%Albacore: what about SD eplate lando-t
+kin3: hopefully spikes and flash idk
%Ana1ytic: I gtg guys
+Sonired: i think soft sand lando-t personally
%Albacore: but then it cant switch into things
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%Ana1ytic: Sorry for the early leave
+Sonired: kin3, you could run foul play
%Albacore: like talon xzard lop etc
+Sonired: bye Ana1ytic :)
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@Snowydoe: max attack eplate 2hko clef anyway right? so 3 attack sr eplate is nice
%Ana1ytic left
+kin3: by ana1ytic, thanks for your help :)
+Sonired: yeah
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+kin3: lol ill call it bandorus yes?
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%Albacore: if things get out of hand i guess you have prio+twave
+Sonired: 252+ Atk Earth Plate Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Clefable: 247-292 (62.6 - 74.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
@Snowydoe: gone
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+Sonired: !learn Landorus-Therian, Iron Tail
Landorus-Therian can learn Iron Tail
+Sonired: too unreliable lol
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@Snowydoe: lol well just run eq/edge/turn/sr
@Snowydoe: with eplate
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+Sonired: yeah that seems cool
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@Snowydoe: max attack and enough speed for adament/jolly shar with rest in bulk
@Snowydoe: sound good?
+kin3: whats the point in e plate
@Snowydoe: to do a shit ton
%Albacore: to 2HKO clefable
+Sonired: that would be 180 speed on lando-t
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+kin3: why not scarf again?
@Snowydoe: rocks
+Sonired: for rocks
@Snowydoe: are needed
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+kin3: alright :p
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+Sonired: and after leftovers recovery i don't think eq has a guaranteed chance to 2hko clef
+Sonired: with scarf
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@Snowydoe: Well I think with e-plate lando this team is done? How do you guys feel about it?
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+Sonired: the only real thing to be worrying about is sb + 3 attacks clef
+Sonired: which is rare af
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+kin3: medi, weavile, cm keldo, av raik, klefki, eplate lando
+kin3: ^ did i get it right?
@Snowydoe: yep
%Team Pokepals: I think it should be done
+kin3: alright im happy
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+Sonired: sub cm would be best for sab?
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+Sonired: over taunt cm
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%Team Pokepals: I think it needs sub over taunt to handle sableye
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@Snowydoe: Yeah sub/cm ofc
+Sonired: yeah agreed
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@Snowydoe: WIth that, thanks man for submitting!
+Sonired: it seems solid
+kin3: thank you!
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%Team Pokepals: hope we helped :)
(kin3 was demoted to Room regular user by Snowydoe.)
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cellgoondude was promoted to Room Voice by Snowydoe.
@Snowydoe: cellgoondude you there?
+cellgoondude: Huh
%Team Pokepals: this is the 4th one I think
+Sonired: all right
+cellgoondude: o hi snowydope
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+cellgoondude: im in band now so yeh I'm k
%Team Pokepals: if we go fast enough, we can finish a 5th one within the hour
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@Snowydoe: Sweet, heres the team http://pastebin.com/D8iGEYqg
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+Sonired: nice a sand team
+Sonired: sun + sand again
• +cellgoondude whistles
+cellgoondude: i just grabbed a team. Don't kill me.
+Sonired: naw it's cool
@Snowydoe: it's fine bro
+cellgoondude: I blame snowy.
+cellgoondude: :)
@Snowydoe: ;-;
+cellgoondude: in return I'll write something to you just bite the bullet
@Snowydoe: this looks very similar to a team we rated today
+cellgoondude: I can go grab something else
@Snowydoe: it's fine
+cellgoondude: Meh kay
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@Snowydoe: Will stick with this
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@Snowydoe: So what are your guys first thoughts?
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%Albacore: weavile looks a bit annoying i guess?
@Snowydoe: yeah I can aagree with that
%Team Pokepals: he has a clefable and a rotom-w tho
%Albacore: but it can be played around
%Albacore: really the team isnt weakto much
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%Albacore: serperior can be pretty annoying to deal with
+cellgoondude: It's not like I'm bad right snowy ;)
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%Team Pokepals: I think
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@Snowydoe: gengar is a threat tbh
%Team Pokepals: NP Thundy is a threat too
@Snowydoe: I think we have to make the hippo more specially based with leftiez
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%Team Pokepals: the team's kinda slow if Excadrill can't get it's sand up
%Team Pokepals: its*
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%Albacore: how about raikou>rotom
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%Albacore: wow im reccomeding raikou a lot today
+cellgoondude: Im fine with the Hippo spd
+Sonired: isnt that like the 3rd time
+cellgoondude: not with the lefties
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+Sonired: if you're running sd exca, sand isn't going to be hugely useful for 3 turns tbf
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%Team Pokepals: with rotom gone
%Team Pokepals: opposing SD Excadrill are gonna be a big problem
+cellgoondude: Fair enough but the Raikou thing may get me run through
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%Team Pokepals: or double dance lando
+cellgoondude: just a bit.
+Sonired: even scarf excadrill tbh
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+cellgoondude: Wouldn't scarf carry mold anyways...?
+Sonired: yeah exactly
+Sonired: but i guess it's not too huge of a problem anymore
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+Sonired: with hippo around
%Albacore: how much does LO exca do to hippo?
+Sonired: around 40%
@Snowydoe: depends what spread we going with?
@Snowydoe: how much spd is need for gar ?
%Team Pokepals: 252+ Atk Life Orb Excadrill Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Hippowdon: 208-246 (49.5 - 58.5%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
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%Team Pokepals: that's with max SpD
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@Snowydoe: I think 136 spd insures a 3hko from shadow ball from gar
@Snowydoe: so we can run 120 bold
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@Snowydoe: max hp
%Team Pokepals: 252 SpA Life Orb Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 135+ SpD Hippowdon: 173-204 (41.1 - 48.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
%Team Pokepals: lol 135 mb
+cellgoondude: 5 tho
+Sonired: that's careful nature
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%Team Pokepals: yeah
+Sonired: snowy was suggesting bold
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%Albacore: if we have max SpD on hippo doesnt the team jus tlose to bisharp
%Team Pokepals: 252 SpA Life Orb Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 136 SpD Hippowdon: 187-222 (44.5 - 52.8%) -- 24.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
%Team Pokepals: that's impish
+TDK joined
%Albacore: lop becomes annoying too
%Team Pokepals: Hippo can't do much back to gengar tho
%Yagura left
@Snowydoe: if we want it after rocks it has to be 192 iirc
@Snowydoe: stone edge bro
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%Team Pokepals: how much does that do?
%Albacore: !learn hipowdon, crunch
Pokémon 'hipowdon' not found.
the pokeseyan left
%Team Pokepals: if it htis
Charroshi left
%Albacore: !learn hippowdon, crunch
Hippowdon can learn Crunch
@Snowydoe: 46 min
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+cellgoondude: Lol crunch
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%Team Pokepals: 0 Atk Hippowdon Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 120-142 (46.3 - 54.8%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO after sandstorm damage
%Team Pokepals: nb
@Snowydoe: with lo it's always a 2hko
%Team Pokepals: I like it
+cellgoondude: Imo hippo should learn knock off
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+cellgoondude: solve my problems
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+Sonired: i guess knock off on clefable can lure gengar
%Team Pokepals: brb
%Albacore: or twave
@Snowydoe: so max hp/64+/192 spd
+Sonired: yeah twave is probably better tbh
@Snowydoe: sound good?
+cellgoondude: Eh. As long as exca doesn't kill it
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+cellgoondude: Im fine with it
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@Snowydoe: I actually like knock off on clefable and then t-wave on rotom for zard x
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%Albacore: +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 64+ Def Hippowdon: 329-387 (78.3 - 92.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
%Albacore: yeah guess youre fine
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+Sonired: 0- Atk Clefable Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 142-168 (54.8 - 64.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
santana5747 joined
+Sonired: would you run negative speed?
@Snowydoe: nah
@Snowydoe: minus attack
@Snowydoe: it's for the utility more than damage
+cellgoondude: That wouldn't be 2hko
+Sonired: i guess since it's a lure
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@Snowydoe: like knocking off got
+Sonired: oh yeah
+Sonired: get rid of lo
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+Sonired: then hippo can handle it much easier
@Snowydoe: and things lefties
%Ana1ytic joined
@Snowydoe: and chansey eviolite so you beat it 1v1
+Sonired: also heatran's lefties
+Sonired: so yzard can beat it easier
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@Snowydoe: yeah I think that's solid
%Ana1ytic: Yo I'm back
+Sonired: yeah
%Team Pokepals: me too
@Snowydoe: Then I think t-wave > wow is needed
@Snowydoe: for zard x
+fleggumfl: what do we currently have
%Ana1ytic: What team are we rating
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@Snowydoe: http://pastebin.com/D8iGEYqg
+Sonired: cellgoondude's
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+cellgoondude: Ana obviously the best one ever.
+Sonired: sun + sand
+Sonired: it's called snowydope
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+cellgoondude: Yep.
@Snowydoe: Changes so far are More spd based hippo/ Knock > fire blast clef/ Thunder Wave > WoW rotom
+cellgoondude: Cuz he's so dope he's a gril. Yep totally. Mm
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%Ana1ytic: Team looks so weak to Mixed M-Metagross
+TDK: negative speed is always on option for clef to take less from ferro's gyro. sassy 19 speed IVs never gets 2hko'd by gyro.
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+TDK: and this team doesn't really like ferro @ all so it'd be good if clef wasn't forced out
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@Snowydoe: Ok I agree with that
+Sonired: ohi tdk
+TDK: yo
@Snowydoe: what do we think of roost > heal wish on this team? everything but excadrill has some form of recovery and we have a status absorber
+cellgoondude: I mean thats the whole reason it had fire blast in the first place
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
@Snowydoe: +keldeo is looking like a threat
%Ana1ytic: Its absolutely necessary
+Sonired: keldeo is certainly a threat
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%Ana1ytic: So is ZardY
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+cellgoondude: Before you pointed that out
@Snowydoe: ye
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+cellgoondude: i did not realize all of them had a recovery
+cellgoondude: lol
%Ana1ytic: Team looks quite weak to M-Diancie and M-Altaria too
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%Ana1ytic: M-Gardevoir as well
@Snowydoe: We have spd hippo for diancie
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%Ana1ytic: Yah but
+cellgoondude: I mean if you really had to
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+cellgoondude: ~|remember there's always Clefable -> Heatran~~
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+cellgoondude: fml phone why.
%Ana1ytic: Heatran
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%Ana1ytic: Gets bopped by epower
+cellgoondude: That's only for diancie right?
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+Sonired: snowy's idea for twave over wisp on rotom wash lowers the threat of malt and garde
+Sonired: .roomauth
+cellgoondude: Well then again I run maltaria a lot
+Sonired: i haven no idea why that happened...
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+cellgoondude: so nvm
%Ana1ytic: Why do we have Rotom-W on this team?
@Snowydoe: thunder wave is a mus on this team, cause zard x is a huge threat
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%Ana1ytic: Imo
@Snowydoe: bird check cause hippo is spd
%Ana1ytic: We should replace with Ferrothorn
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%Ana1ytic: Hippowdon is mixed
%Ana1ytic: And is a more than decent check to Talonflame
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+Sonired: twave ferrothorn if you are considering running it
%Ana1ytic: Ferrothorn helps vs Manaphy and Kyurem-B
%Ana1ytic: M-Altaria too
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@Snowydoe: Ok but then we run mixed hippo
+Sonired: btw this guy pm'd me to ask for the command to see auth
+Sonired: i accidentally typed it in here sorry
@Snowydoe: np
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%Albacore: yeah ferro seems solid
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%Ana1ytic: Yeah
@Snowydoe: ok i like ferro > rotom, then we go back to mixed hippo
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%Ana1ytic: Yep
+cellgoondude: Lol so t-wave + gyro? K lol
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%Ana1ytic: No lol
%Albacore: i think maybe run spikes on ferro, spin on exca, and then hpfire on latias for opposing ferros and sakrms
+cellgoondude: And wait you want me to revert hippo' secs?
%Albacore: *skarms
%Ana1ytic: Yeah
+cellgoondude: evs*
@Snowydoe: I needs power whip for dos
%Ana1ytic: Yep
@Snowydoe: so power whip/gyro/spikes/seeds i guess
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+cellgoondude: K brb.
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+Sonired: so then is clef still running knock off?
+cellgoondude: Wait that wasn't directed toward alba tho. Idk about that eh
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@Snowydoe: Yeah it is
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+Sonired: lowers gar threat stil
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@Snowydoe: changes are Def Hippo > SpD/ Knock Clef > blast/ Ferro > rotom/ recover > hw
%Ana1ytic: Yep
+Sonired: yeah
+cellgoondude: Yea
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@Snowydoe: i think we make hippo 136 evs so that way it's 3hko'd by shadow ball (no rocks) and still takes on zard x
+Sonired: although the team can still be threatened by dd + 3 attacks alt
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%Albacore: i mean, exca can awlays revenge
%Ana1ytic: Yep
%Ana1ytic: We're good, i guess
+cellgoondude: I mean this is still smooth rock hippo right?
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@Snowydoe: n leftiez
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+cellgoondude: No snowy whyudothis
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@Snowydoe: it's not like t-tar were you dont have reliable recovery and only have a few chances to set up weather
@Snowydoe: so lefties is fine
%Albacore: y ypu kinda need that else bish lop talon etc can easily overwhelm you
%Albacore: *you
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%Ana1ytic: Mhm
+cellgoondude: I mean my hippo dies a lot for me. I'm bad at OU snowy. Yeah I see what you mean. Sure I'll do it
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@Snowydoe: http://pastebin.com/NrcnAhJU so this is the team here, we happy with it?
+cellgoondude left
+fleggumfl: looks good
+cellgoondude joined
+Sonired: yeah
+fleggumfl: kinda struggles a bit with garde but otherwise seems fine
+Sonired: seems legit
%Ana1ytic: Yep
Testeequipa left
+fleggumfl: maybe chople berry on ferro
+cellgoondude: >team not named Snowydope
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@Snowydoe: I'm not sure what the ferro evs are for tbqh as a stole them off a tdk team, but standard spread can do as well
%Team Pokepals: looks good
%Team Pokepals: sorry for being away
+fleggumfl: same
+Sonired: 232 SpA Mega Gardevoir Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Charizard Y: 189-223 (63.6 - 75%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+Sonired: aww
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@Snowydoe: I dont think chople is that needed with lati and hippo, so we should be sweet
+Sonired: that could be a threat
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+cellgoondude: Snowy
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%Albacore: okay gotta go guys, sorry I didn't do much this workshop, hopefully next time I'll stay active throughout the entire thing
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@Snowydoe: laters alba, thanks bro
+cellgoondude: i did 252 HP/144/116 I think
+Sonired: cya alb
@Snowydoe: Are you happy with that Cell?
+Sonired: 112
+Sonired: that makes a total of 512 lol
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+cellgoondude: Fffff yeah shh
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%Team Pokepals: gotta go, see you guys later
%Team Pokepals and uchihagenma left
+fleggumfl: Snowydoe its just for being able to guarantee a gyro into garde
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+cellgoondude: I just committe the first two numbers to memory
@Snowydoe: ah fair enough
+cellgoondude: and fle there's no gyro tho?
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@Snowydoe: thanks cell for submitting bro, dont go writing fan fics about me ok
+Sonired: if only ferro got bullet punch
+Sonired: lol
(cellgoondude was demoted to Room regular user by Snowydoe.)
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+fleggumfl: whats the next team
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@Snowydoe: Ok it's been 2 hours nearly and it's 4 am
+Sonired: 2 hours?
+fleggumfl: oh jesus
+Sonired: whoa
+fleggumfl: it has been 2
+Sonired: it actually has
@Snowydoe: so I'm going close it here, unless you guys want to take over?
+fleggumfl: i thought it was only 1
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+Sonired: i think one more team?
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+fleggumfl: yeah we'd probably be better off ending it
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@Snowydoe: I'm dead haha
%Ana1ytic: Snowy
@Snowydoe: We good to finish it and start a tour
%Ana1ytic: Gdi sleep
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+fleggumfl: unless tab wants to help with promoting/demoting for the next one
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@tab: wat
+Sonired: unless tab wants to wake up you mean
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@Snowydoe: [02:36] Mantis Flip Coin: Here's the one I want rated: http://pastebin.com/TZqVgyNf
@Snowydoe: heres the next team
@Snowydoe: and person
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@Snowydoe: if we do decide to countinue
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+fleggumfl: okay
@Snowydoe: so if tab can handle promos and demos
@tab: if you can tell me how to make you %
@tab: i can do that
@Snowydoe: that would be great
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@tab: or i can keep it open and hl me when you need someone promoting
+Sonired: /roomvoice tab i think
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+Sonired: /roompromote OR /roomdemote [username], [group symbol] - Promotes/demotes the user to the specified room rank. Requires: @ # & ~
@tab: no thats +
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Mantis Flip Coin was promoted to Room Voice by Snowydoe.
+TDK: tab you can only promote to +
+fleggumfl: we can't do % without a RO here
@Snowydoe: w/e ill stay for one more
+Mantis Flip Coin: yo
@tab: oh
+fleggumfl: so unless someone can wake up rey/ib/celtic
+Mantis Flip Coin: i've written a short explanation of the team
@tab: well hl me if you want someone promoting
+Mantis Flip Coin: ill paste it now
@Snowydoe: here's the team bros http://pastebin.com/TZqVgyNf
@tab: as long as it isnt too many
@Snowydoe: lets go over it
+Mantis Flip Coin: The team started with a Mega-Beedrill and Kyurem-B core. The idea is to force in hippo, Ferro, Rocky helmet garchomp etc with U-turn, then get a kill with kyurem-b.
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+Mantis Flip Coin: I then noticed that the team was very weak to sand rush escadrill, so I added defensive landorus-t to patch that hole up, and also as a birdspam check.
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+Mantis Flip Coin: It can also u-turn out into breakers to further support the initial idea. Next off, I needed rocks removal, and I don't really like the idea of giving bisharp a +2 or getting pursuit trapped by ttar so easily.
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+Mantis Flip Coin: Starmie also functions as my primary Keldeo switch-in, and it also has the benefit of being able to spin on Heatran.. Thunderbolt is because the team is somewhat weak to Azumarill and I need to patch that weakness up as best I can.
+Mantis Flip Coin: I then realised that I was weak to a number of threats, including Scizor and Weavile. The next pokemon I added was Heatran, to function as an actual ferro switch-in.
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+Mantis Flip Coin: It also doesn't do too badly against talonflame either, and it lets me further break stall, possibly by removing something like Chansey, although that is becoming increasingly uncommon, and also letting me wear down M-Sableye.
+Mantis Flip Coin: The last pokemon I added was scarf Keldeo, because it is a Weavile check, my Bisharp check, and another solid revenge killer.
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+Mantis Flip Coin: Hidden power fire on Kyurem-b is to lure Scizor and ferro, with those eliminated Beedrill can have an easier time, and Tailwind on Beedrill can let Kyurem-B put in a lot of work late game, I chose it over drill run because I already have enough ways to hit Heatran.
+Sonired: my mind is struggling to function
+Mantis Flip Coin: thats it
%Ana1ytic: I like Magnezone over Keldeo here, traps Ferrothorn and Skarmory and makes a nice VoltTurn Core. Helps out Kyurem-B in the process too
+Mantis Flip Coin: idk
%Ana1ytic: Scarf/Specs Magnezone
+Mantis Flip Coin: doesnt it make the team pretty weak to lop?
+Sonired: then the team is weaker to bisharp
+Mantis Flip Coin: keld helps out a lot, wed only have lando for lop
+Sonired: without keldeo
+Mantis Flip Coin: yeah bish as well
+Mantis Flip Coin: and weav
+fleggumfl: i kinda like magneton over zone if we're going with that
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%Ana1ytic: Hmm
+fleggumfl: outspeeds weavile
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+Mantis Flip Coin: as a rule of thumb dont really want mag, it's a do-nothing mon in a lot of matchups and the utility it brings to the team isnt really worth the waste of a slot and weakening of the synergy
+Mantis Flip Coin: kyurem lures it anyway
+Mantis Flip Coin: with hp fire
+fleggumfl: true
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+Mantis Flip Coin: the main problem with the team is that it's really weak to mega zam
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%Ana1ytic: Hmm
+Sonired: would mega scizor over mega beedrill be too big of a change?
%Ana1ytic: How about we replace Heatran with Klefki
+Sonired: otherwise we're likely going to have to go for something really passive
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%Ana1ytic: And make Keld a SubCm set?
+Mantis Flip Coin: why klefki over tran?
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+Sonired: switches into megazam easier
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%Ana1ytic: Yeah
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%Ana1ytic: Provides spikes support too
+Sonired: and twaves it down
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+Sonired: so bee can revenge it
+Sonired: although, 252+ SpA Mega Alakazam Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Klefki: 141-167 (44.3 - 52.5%) -- 20.7% chance to 2HKO
+Mantis Flip Coin: i mean
+Sonired: if you ever come across a modest one
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+fleggumfl: nobody uses modest though
+Mantis Flip Coin: it was conceptually a mega-bee team but sciz may work, i'm not quite sure
+fleggumfl: bee outspeeds it
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+fleggumfl: if modest
+Sonired: true
%Ana1ytic: No i don't want to change the mega
+Mantis Flip Coin: but
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+Mantis Flip Coin: the problem with sciz is that
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+Mantis Flip Coin: we lose a way to revenge keld, makes it a bit harder
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%Ana1ytic: Yeah
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%Ana1ytic: M-beedrill is fine
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+Mantis Flip Coin: the damage that m storm tran does to keld to make it revengable by bee really helps the team etc
+Mantis Flip Coin: it's a hard fix
+Mantis Flip Coin: klefki is for sure a good idea though
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+Sonired: all righit if you say so
+Mantis Flip Coin: and it would give a check to zam
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%Ana1ytic: Yeah
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+Mantis Flip Coin: i wouldn't be too keen on replacing bee anyway because its conceptually a mega bee team
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%Ana1ytic: The team is pretty weak to zardy tho
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+Mantis Flip Coin: thats true
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%Ana1ytic: Keldeo to an extent too
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+Sonired: malt pressures it too
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+Mantis Flip Coin: specs keld does run thru the team, we do have starm to switch in once but it does buckle a bit
+Mantis Flip Coin: you gotta play around it well
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%Ana1ytic: How about CM Latios+Roost over Keldeo?
+Mantis Flip Coin: bee + tran pretty much take care of every m-alt set
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+Mantis Flip Coin: why cm lati?
%Ana1ytic: Breaks walls
%Ana1ytic: Pretty well
+Mantis Flip Coin: we don't really have trouble with wallbreaking atm
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%Ana1ytic: Well
+Mantis Flip Coin: keld is needed for weav/bish
%Ana1ytic: You can go 3 attacks+Roost then
+Mantis Flip Coin: like pretty severely
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%Ana1ytic: For Bish yeah
%Ana1ytic: But Weavile is cheked by Klefki now
+Sonired: you still kinda need a bisharp check though
+Mantis Flip Coin: i've been playing around with scarf terrak over keld
+Mantis Flip Coin: but it makes the team weaker to rain and it can't switch into iron head
%Ana1ytic: Hmm
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+Mantis Flip Coin: the team really blows against rain considering our water resists
%Ana1ytic: Right
+Mantis Flip Coin: i mean
+Mantis Flip Coin: i do like the klefki idea
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+Mantis Flip Coin: but it does make the zard y weakness worse and we lose that breaker, i think heal bell alt can kinda 1v1 it as well
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%Ana1ytic: It's up to you
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%Ana1ytic: Changing the mega i mean
+Mantis Flip Coin: if i were to add klefki is there another way to patch up those holes?
+Mantis Flip Coin: the only thing i'm really dead-set on keeping is bee + kyub, the rest is just kinda necessary to check shit
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+Mantis Flip Coin: if we can move the team around to make that initial core work while keeping synergy in the team itd be fine
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+Sonired: wait
+Sonired: if you run bulky bulk up talon over keldeo, wouldn't that beat weavile and keldeo
+Sonired: sorry
+Sonired: altaria and weavile
+Mantis Flip Coin: like a phys def spread?
%Ana1ytic: Yeah that sounds pretty good
%Ana1ytic: No SpDef
+Sonired: spdef
%Ana1ytic: But with bulk up
+Mantis Flip Coin: does that reliable switch into weav?
+Mantis Flip Coin: reliably*
+Sonired: no
+Sonired: but it does so with alt
+Sonired: and you can play around with talon
%Ana1ytic: Klefki switches into Weavile pretty well
+Sonired: and it can also put a lot of pressure onto keldeo as well
+Mantis Flip Coin: that does help with both lopunny and keld
+Sonired: yeah weavile does nothing to klefki
+Mantis Flip Coin: and zam
+Mantis Flip Coin: but
+Sonired: wow im so proud of myself for that
+Sonired: lol
+Mantis Flip Coin: we don't really have an alt weakness
%Ana1ytic: We don't
+Mantis Flip Coin: that is a very good suggestion though
+Mantis Flip Coin: i have to play around with that
%Ana1ytic: But this patches up your team's remaining weaknesses
+Mantis Flip Coin: yea
+Sonired: but with beedrill out of the way, and beedrill is an easy pokemon to take down, alt can do a lot of damage
+Mantis Flip Coin: yea
+Mantis Flip Coin: if its dd eq
+Mantis Flip Coin: for sure
+Sonired: and if you ever do get alt to +2, which shouldn't really happen, alt wins
+Sonired: although that happening is unlikely
+Sonired: especially with speed control from klefki and all that
%Ana1ytic: Klefki can TWave it tho
+Sonired: exactly
+Mantis Flip Coin: yeah, any dder getting to +2 toasts the team but it is an HO team
+Sonired: and iirc alt's only way to beat magnet rise klefki is with fire blast
+Mantis Flip Coin: klefki and talon could add some much-needed speed control
+Mantis Flip Coin: talon also
+Mantis Flip Coin: walls zard y pretty well
%Ana1ytic: Yep
+Sonired: yeah
+Mantis Flip Coin: yea
+Mantis Flip Coin: that sounds really good
%Ana1ytic: We're good?
+Mantis Flip Coin: yeah i think so
+Sonired: that's a wrap i would sya
+Mantis Flip Coin: thanks for the input peeps
@Snowydoe: I would say so too
+Sonired: what changes did we make?
+Sonired: klefki over tran
+Mantis Flip Coin: just talon and maybe klefki
+Sonired: talonflame over keldeo
+Mantis Flip Coin: i'm gonna play around with them
+Mantis Flip Coin: but nothing's in stone
+Mantis Flip Coin: i don't need a real importable
+Mantis Flip Coin: thanks guys
+Sonired: i would say if you are running talon run keld
%Ana1ytic: Np
+Sonired: i mean
+Sonired: klefki
+Sonired: d'oh
(Mantis Flip Coin was demoted to Room regular user by Snowydoe.)
+Sonired: is that it for the workshop?
@Snowydoe: yep
%Ana1ytic: gg guys
%Ana1ytic: Was fun
%Ana1ytic: Snowy
+Sonired: that was a good session :D
%Ana1ytic: Do yoy have tye logs for this?
@Snowydoe: Thanks for everyone who came out and submitted teams! Means a lot!
@Snowydoe: I have the logs bro
%Ana1ytic: Nice
%Ana1ytic: Damn im tired
%Ana1ytic: Gonna crash
%Ana1ytic: Night