[b]Update 5th July 2015:[/b]
We had so many good posts in the past weeks here, many of them are either praises or compliments, but some of them are also critical and worrying, and i (and many others) think that those posts should be seen by more people than just those, who can keep up with this thread. Those posts shouldn't be lost in here, so i will try to link to a few of them here at the start.

If you want to see the full post, click on the link above it.

[b]Critical and worrying posts:[/b]
[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1818128&viewfull=1#post1818128]My own rant with 20 red points (and people are telling me this needs to be seen more)[/url]
[QUOTE=Kallelinski;1818128]Okay, to be honest the more I read nowadays here and there, the more I get angry about the whole situation in the meanwhile. It’s great that CDPR actually want to rework on the approach of Triss, but what about other characters and in particular Yennefer?[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1818573&viewfull=1#post1818573]Kaldea[/url]
[QUOTE=Kaldea;1818573]Kallelinski's post summed up why I was as unhappy about Yennefer's part in the game as I was. At first I was very happy, mostly because she was finally in a game and they did her justice appearance-wise. They got her attitude down perfectly and I ended up waiting the whole game for the rest of her character to show. Only bits and pieces made it in and I was really disappointed with that. I feel like CDPR was way too focused on getting her right at face value and her sensitive side suffered from it.[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1818468&viewfull=1#post1818468]Scholdarr.452[/url]
[QUOTE=Scholdarr.452;1818468]I think there is another problem with the games (not only TW3) that deeply influences how relationships work in the games and how they feel. The games miss to show Geralt's internal conflict, his weakness, his insecurity. [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Scholdarr.452;1818598]Tbh I think that CDPR "nerfed" Yennefer on purpose in order to make her less attractive (not visually) than she would be if they just depicted late-book Yennefer the way she is. I man, the Triss fans already complain about Yennefer and how she important she suddenly is in TW3. And for somebody who doesn't know the book this is a perfectly viable compliant since Triss is indeed a very important NPC in the games. But for book lovers on the other hand, and especially Yen fans, that feels weird as well because it's just kind of inconsistent. Especially the relationship between Ciri and Yennefer feels greatly reduced, probably to make Triss a viable option.

It's really hard for CDPR, I think. Too many different expectations from different groups of people with different knowledge...[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1819236&viewfull=1#post1819236]Willowhugger[/url] or [url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1819270&viewfull=1#post1819270]here[/url] or [url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1819270&viewfull=1#post1819270]here[/url]
[QUOTE=Willowhugger;1819236]Honestly, I'm not a huge fan of the Yennefer in the games as a representation of the book version because I think they went overboard in trying to establish her as ruthless in pursuit of protecting Ciri because the qualities I most remember about Yennefer from the books are her compassion and fundamental decency. She's a woman who deeply cares about children in general, has a deep friendship with the Sisters of Melitele, is protective of nonhumans as well as the weak, and loathes the politics that the other Sorcerers are neck deep in. [/QUOTE]

[b]General opinions about Yennefer:[/b]
[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1747982&viewfull=1#post1747982]dzbrown with 16 thanks and 12 red points[/url]
[QUOTE=dzbrown;1747982]I should first preface this by saying that I have only played the games and have not read the books (they are on order). I also chose Yennefer in the game. I'm also wondering why there are so many posts about Yennefer v. Triss on here and other forums as if people need to justify why they choose one or the other. In the interest of being mildly hypocritical, I am just throwing my hat in with the rest of you.

That being said, I felt Yennefer was a much deeper character. Let me explain what I mean: Triss came off as being more of a 'game character', that is, typically cute, friendly, and, for the most part, riding the coat tails of our much beloved protagonist, Geralt. This combined with her good looks and the assumed ginger obsession, probably seems like the more obvious choice for a lot of people, hence the great lengths people are going through in order to acquire additional content for her. I can understand this. But, and maybe this is just strange game mechanics, there are instances where Triss' character seems flat, one-dimensional and lacking depth due to her more 'game character' attributes. You don't really get a sense, at least in the third game, that there is a rich history between them even though there is, at least according to the games (which is what I am drawing references from)..[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1716138&viewfull=1#post1716138]jockmick[/url]
[QUOTE=jockmick;1716138]Oh, I haven't noticed this thread. Seems like a lot of my posts lately, which has been about Yen, could have been posted here. I guess we can treat this thread as a collective thread for Yennefer, where we can write what we think about her.

I should start by saying that I have read all the books. I love Yennefer, in the books and in the game. I think she is a very misunderstood character by non-book readers. She might come off as cold and bitchy, and sure she bosses Geralt around a bit, but in my opinion this is just a facade and a defense in order to hide who she truly is.[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1767541&viewfull=1#post1767541]luc0s[/url]
[QUOTE=luc0s;1767541]Yennefer to me is like an older mature married woman with a bit of a diva complex and unconditional love for her husband (Geralt) and daughter (Ciri).
Sure, Yen and Geralt never actually got married, but their relationship dynamic feels like that of and old married couple, which I think is fitting considering the fact they're both pretty old (they're both approaching their 100th birthday!) and they have been together for ~20 years. They really know each other through and through, they've seen all the good and all the bad stuff, with both of them accepting the bad stuff and learned to live with it. Their love for each other is what I'd call true unconditional love.[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1803012&viewfull=1#post1803012]latios507[/url]
[QUOTE=latios507;1803012]I felt in love with Yen & Geralt's relationship. I've personally been in a relationship with someone who's very close to Yen's personality & her sarcasm (only lacking in terms of that violet eyes), and I enjoyed it all the way. Hence the moment I looked at Yen, I knew she's the one.
It's not a toxic relationship but a healthy relationship. Simply put, It's like a roller coaster ride (w/ full of surprises at every corner). You get to see many different perspective and even end up in situation where you least expected.[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1795349&viewfull=1#post1795349]NevaEilhart[/url]
[QUOTE=NevaEilhart;1795349]As a mother Yennefer probably aknowledges that too, hence why I don't think she'd be over worried about Ciri being a Witcher (it's a different matter for the Emperess ending, since it's well known in this world that politics are far more dangerous than the next wyvern). The thing I like about the game is that Yennefer does grow up too. They did a pretty good job to make her react like her book counterpart at the beginning, but by the end of the game she makes decisions proving she's changed : the way the prepares the "aftermath" by progressingly stepping away from politics and the lodge, the way she doesn't fight anymore for petty power related struggles (she even bows in a way to Philippa). That's why I think Yen wouldn't want her daughter to become a member of the lodge. [/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1808670&viewfull=1#post1808670]Redemyr[/url]
[QUOTE=Redemyr;1808670]I prefer Triss, yet I don't dislike Yen's character per se. As a mostly game player (read only some of the books) If anything I was very intrigued by her character. I decided to pick Triss first and then Yen'S charm captured me, even if some parts didn't resonate with me that much, but still, in that last wish quest, with them in the boat and the music, I gotta confess, I almost got caught in the tango stuff. I decided to leave her for a second walkthrough. That never happened because of the whole Triss content stuff which left me angry and I somehow took it on her character entirely for metagaming reasons. Anyway, point is, not all Triss fans are equal lol. And there are also some suggestions/ideas/missed opportunities about Yen content too. Here is one of mine:[/QUOTE]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1802346&viewfull=1#post1802346]Interesting opinions about Yennefer by reddit users, who haven't read the books[/url]

[b]Book quotes:[/b]
[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1805146&viewfull=1#post1805146]Yennefer's childhood[/url]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1809466&viewfull=1#post1809466]Ciri asking Yennefer, when a woman is ready for...[/url]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1770256&viewfull=1#post1770256]Ciri asking Yennefer what is there between Geralt and her[/url]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1735600&viewfull=1#post1735600]Trying to explain why Yennefer couldn't decide between Istredd and Geralt[/url]

[url=http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/40716-Yennefer-of-Vengerberg-%28all-spoilers%29?p=1735010&viewfull=1#post1735010]Trying to explain what Geralt sees in Yennefer at the Last Wish[/url]

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[b]The following is my original first post, which started this thread:[/b]
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Triss, Triss, Triss, everywhere Triss threads....let's talk about the woman with the violet eyes and the dream of raven locks entwisted, stormy, Yennefer of Vengerberg.

I still haven't finished the game despite a game time of >50 hours now, just arrived at Kaer Morhen. I don’t want to finish the series for good so soon, but since i did the "The Last Wish"-Quest, i think it is time.
I don't want to wait another week before i can talk about it and participating in other threads concerning mostly the relationship with Triss...well, let's say, i don't want to hit a hornets nest or rub salt into wounds by saying, "i told you this could/will happen", that isn't fair or appropriate. We had enough disputes in the "Choice"-thread about that.

We can of course also talk about how Geralt handled the situation with Triss, as it is part of Geralt's story and therefore Yennefer's too. When you arrive at Kaer Morhen, you know what i mean by that, just saying that we need a new bed.

Don’t hold back with spoilers, even if I could read something, what I haven’t seen in the game yet. I want this thread to be an all spoilers thread instead of having dozens of specific threads concerning only one issue. But we could still spoiler the books, so people who haven't read the books yet, shame on you :), can discuss, too.

Anyway, to get into the mood, I recommend seeing this again:
[video=youtube;NyKsC3bklIE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyKsC3bklIE[/video]
or the clean polish version with english subtitles
[video=youtube;mSY4k9aVyNY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSY4k9aVyNY[/video]

The official The Witcher Youtube channel just uploaded a multilanguage version, it changes the language every 20-30 seconds and has all available subtitles:
[video=youtube;lMvAAfPs0UE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMvAAfPs0UE[/video]

[quote]Lyrics
These scars long have yearned for your tender caress. To bind our fortunes, damn what the stars own
Rend my heart open, then your love profess. A winding, weaving fate to which we both atone
You flee my dream come the morning. Your scent – berries tart, lilac sweet
To dream of raven locks entwisted, stormy. Of violet eyes, glistening as you weep
The wolf I will follow into the storm. To find your heart, its passion displaced
By ire ever growing, hardening into stone. Amidst the cold to hold you in a heated embrace
You flee my dream come the morning. Your scent – berries tart, lilac sweet
To dream of raven locks entwisted, stormy
Of violet eyes, glistening as you weep
I know not if fate would have us live as one. Or if by love’s blind chance we’ve been bound
The wish I whispered, when it all began. Did it forge a love you might never have found?
You flee my dream come the morning. Your scent – berries tart, lilac sweet
To dream of raven locks entwisted, stormy
Of violet eyes, glistening as you weep
[/quote]

I was caught totally unawares by it and I loved it, and before i go into details, I think CDPR did a great job integrating Yennefer into the game (so far) in general. It's not easy to satisfy everyone's expectation, but i think they did justice to her and her character. Unless i see it it with rose-colored glasses, i could swear you can even see that...[from The Last Wish]
[spoiler].... her left shoulder, slightly higher than her right. Her nose, slightly too long. Her lips, a touch too narrow. Her chin, receding a little too much. Her brows a little too irregular. Her eyes . . . He saw too many details. Quite unnecessarily.
[/spoiler]
But she never really stands straight, so it's hard to tell, but it wouldn't surprise me, if they took care of such details (e.g. the mole on Keira Metz).

Sure, the really short reunion at Vizima castle was really too short for my liking and it took me almost 20-30 hours before seeing her again, but the final reward later on Skellige is all the better then.

I think we talked already a lot about her outer appearance, Yennefer's black hair was a huge concern before the release and i guess everybody can confirm that her hair is indeed raven black, good for everybody :) Even though i hoped to see her in a similiar dress as Triss during the masquerade.


But what about her behaviour? her attitude? goals? motivations?

Did you like her? Did you hate her? Can you empathize with her? Do you understand why she does things like she does, even agree with what she is doing and for what? So many questions in my head, but nobody wants to talk about the scenes? The importance, significance and meaning?

Many already thought of the worst, when they heard that she is cooperating with Emhyr, but as you progress through the games, it is quite simple why she did it (well, she also tells you it). She doesn't care with whom or for whom she has to work, as long as it helps her to find Ciri. She would stop at nothing to rescue Ciri. That's a really big matter for me, since everybody around you just helps you to find her, but she is the only one that tries to do it on her own.
She doesn't say, "yeah, i help you, if you help me first", no, she has no time for that, time is running and Ciri is too important for her.

That scene where they interrupt a ceremony for the dead showed how cold and at the same time how resolute she can be. She doesn't care for the dead, they are dead, nothing you can do about it, but she cares for the living, those who she holds dear and that's Ciri.

But i also had the feeling that she didn't trust Geralt at the beginning, because she didn't know what she has to think of him after those 2 games. Later on you can ask her why she didn't look for him, since she was released by the Wild Hunt and hadn't as many problems with amnesia as Geralt had. The simple answer you get is that she didn't thought that Geralt would have such a problem with the amnesia as a witcher and the fact that he fleed from the Wild Hunt and Eredin couldn't erase his memories intentionally, she thought that he would look for her, not vice versa, but apparently Geralt had other things with other characters to do, *cough* Triss & politics.

It is quite a simplistic answer to that and i am not really that 100% pleased with it, but if i recall correctly she was imprisoned during the games and only released 6 months ago? That's exactly when Witcher 2 ends, so i wouldn't interpret too much into it. Geralt can take care of himself, she knows that, but Ciri? She was always alone with no real friends and to be fair, a child will be always a child for a mother (and father).
The fact that Yen rather tries to find and save Ciri from the Wild Hunt, while Geralt tries to play politics, shows Yen in a better light than Geralt in my opinion.

Now bear with me for a comment on the Triss situation. I don't think Geralt handled it well, not at all. I hope i can still talk about it later, but other comments aren't really raising my hopes for that. I also just read that, if i don't tell her to stay, she won't be back at Kaer Morhen, so there is that too...


Anyway, i tried to be friendly with Triss again without going too far, but all i could see was either option A) commit myself to her or b) bluntly reject her, what feels like breaking someones heart and as i said here, i felt like an asshole after that. Shows how the characters grow on you.

As someone who holds the books dearly, i think it is quite similiar to what happend in the books, when Geralt and Triss meet again, so it's at least faithful to it in my opinion with the same outcome for Geralt and Triss, and i can't stop myself from saying (even to myself), "i told you so that this could happen, you saw it coming and yet you didn't want to hear it."

The "what's wrong with Triss romance" thread is full of people mourning for more interactions with Triss, not without good reason, but i feared a long time ago that it will happen like that and a little bit of me even hoped it, i have to admit that.
Yennefer makes here and there some remarks on her, blaming me for what happened and i can't disagree with her. Amnesia doesn't give you a free pass.
I feared the worst, when she said that i fucked a dear friend of her, you could say that all of my Witcher senses were on high alert.

Speaking of remarks, Cerys also made some interesting ones about Yennefer. It was also interesting that not only the deeds of the White Wolf is famous, but also his relationship to Yennefer, which some people commented by "you are the White Wolf, so she is the sorceress?", i was amused and confused at the same time :)


Now coming to the climax for me so far, the quest "The Last Wish", also something i didn't really expected. Yen asks you to help her finding a djinn, but without telling you why. In the end she admits that she wants to remove the forced bond between them, which Geralt wished upon them to save her life from the djinn.

This scene is quite remarkable as it shows that Yen is not in any way the person anymore she was in the The Last Wish chapter. Back then she wanted the djinn to get infinite power, maybe even fixing her infertility, which is arguable at this point in the story though. But this time she wants to know, whether what she is feeling for Geralt are her feelings or just the product of a wish. It's interesting that Geralt can say, "i don't want you to do that", showing that Geralt fears that this could lead to something awful and to be honest, i feared it too, but Yen doesn't change her mind and says her last wish.

The scenes after that show that she is indeed feeling the same for him nonetheless and you can either say the same or break another heart by saying to stay friends (don't you dare).
Sure, on one side this creates the possibility to stay with Triss, since you can say now 'no' to Yen without annoying people like me insisting on the importance of the last wish in the books :D, but in my opinion this means so, so much more for the relationship with Yen as for anybody else, it's immense.

[quote]Yennefer:
we repeatedly split up, then return to one another... Something draws us to each other. but i can never be certain if it's a true feeling, or merely a bit of mischief by a djinn.[/quote]
She wants to know, whether everything that happened in the whole story, books and games, was because of her feelings or not. This includes even Ciri ! Since she would have never been a mother figure for her, if she was never saved by Geralt's last wish and bound to him.

[quote]Yennefer:
to see what it's like without it. To see if we'll still matter to one another, or if we'll be like two strangers.[/quote]

Imagine the horrific insight she would have, if with the removal of the wish all her feelings for Geralt and Ciri were fake, just fabricated due to a wish? Devastating.

[quote]
Y: I thought... you'd become a stranger to me... That i'd look at you and not feel a thing...
But it's not like that at all. Nothing's changed.
G: Djinn mighta cheated us after all...
Y: Why?
G: Cause i don't feel that anything's changed, either.[/quote]
And then they finally said it out loud and even as a man, I... :wub: (...something like that, *cough*, damn rain.

This not only shows that the wish was never the reason why they felt in love with each other but also gives Yen the certainty that she loves him and he loves her and that the wish was never the reason for it, just the beginning.

And before i finish this really long text, i could probably write even more, when i have finished the game, i want to come back to song at the top of this post and now read this quote again:
I know not if fate would have us live as one. Or if by love’s blind chance we’ve been bound
The wish I whispered, when it all began. Did it forge a love you might never have found?

The doubts for both are finally gone and we need an updated version or a continuation of the ballad :D


Feels good to get that finally off my chest. So where are all those people favouring Yen instead of Triss