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Chat Log of Town Hall 2016-08-13

Samofrome
Aug 13th, 2016
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  1. <20:02:56> NoobMan: Topics (subject to change):
  2.  
  3. Scanning and Wormhole connectivity, Frigate holes
  4. PvE - Site spawn rate/lifetime, Low Class, High Class, Battleships > Capitals
  5. PvP - FAX, Dreads, Content Drivers, Meta
  6. Citadels - POS degradation, Missing Features/Requests
  7. Bugs - Comprehensive list of Bugs ranked in priority. Bug Report IDs, and recreation videos.
  8. <20:05:33> [HPYWH] Areks: So ID at like 30%?
  9. <20:05:36> Maverick Klark: ^
  10. <20:05:39> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I like that allot
  11. <20:05:39> Khendon Kalmire: +
  12. <20:05:42> [EMBR.]Shogun - EliteForce: sounds reasonable
  13. <20:05:42> Qith Karrar: sounds good
  14. <20:05:49> Maverick Klark: +
  15. <20:05:58> [WHBOO] Inspector: It wouldnt change the time it takes to scan the shit down, just know whats out there earlier
  16. <20:06:00> Justin Cody: Scanning - related to the Observatory Structure - it automatically scans the home system and you can get the bookmarks that way by interacting with the structure itself
  17. <20:06:00> Rawne: you allready id the sig at 25% ...
  18. <20:06:02> [AoE]Timothyr Black: maybe good idea for Kspace, Wspace should be difficult
  19. <20:06:05> Axel Stenmark: Or reverse sig size so low class are easier to scan for newer/smaller corps
  20. <20:06:14> Selene Divine: c4s are aids
  21. <20:06:26> [COF] StevenEllecone: would be great for me, most of the time we're looking for wormholes and ignoring gas/data/relic
  22. <20:06:32> Gorski Car: could add a skill to improve identification chance
  23. <20:07:02> Foedus Latro: could I make a proposal of saying your name and place of living ?
  24. <20:07:06> Foedus Latro: before you start talking?
  25. <20:07:15> Foedus Latro: possibly introduce yourself for the recording
  26. <20:07:16> Glyndi|DG3N: ^^
  27. <20:07:21> [TDSIN]Glasgow: would that not be something to look towards with what skills have been trained in scanning for a change in the scanner?
  28. <20:07:25> [ERB] Emmaline Fera: mega upvotes to that one
  29. <20:07:29> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: This^
  30. <20:07:56> Axel Stenmark: not everyone has virtues, this would help newer WH people
  31. <20:08:26> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: no one uses virtues, not needed this change i think
  32. <20:08:47> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: i think this is more about cutting back on the tediousness
  33. <20:08:52> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: It will take the same amount of time to scan down signatures, but just let you identify them faster so you can eliminate stuff you don't want - I think it's a good idea
  34. <20:09:08> Illana: it will reduce the time in the big picture tho
  35. <20:09:09> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: Balance it by making sites harder to scan down but easier to identify.
  36. <20:09:12> Illana: since if ur looking for whs
  37. <20:09:18> Illana: u get to scan them faster
  38. <20:09:19> carl: not making it easy to locl on just see its a wh
  39. <20:09:22> [SHKL.]Jadiii: that's not a bad thing, more people transporting is more people that can get ganked
  40. <20:09:51> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: If you're out in Low/Null looking for Combat sites for example, you'll be able to eliminate those to get to the content you want faster
  41. <20:09:51> [ERB] Emmaline Fera: Easier/faster scanning = easier travel, more content, can get to fights more quickly
  42. <20:10:22> (Ace) Ashley Beiling: [URL]https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6580918#post6580918[/URL]
  43. <20:10:28> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: scanning is life, only dead people don't scan
  44. <20:10:37> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: This could be good for newer players too because if they don't have full skills, they can at least help identifying sigs to their type
  45. <20:10:37> BINAD-734 Seraph: it tellsyou what something is at 25% anyway. But yeah if we can move that band down slightly, makes it easier...but that at the same time makes it an issue of "dumbing it down"??
  46. <20:10:44> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: but do they enjoy it?
  47. <20:10:48> [AoE]Timothyr Black: people shouldnt live wh space if they dont like scanning, wormholes should be end-game, difficult stuff, i only hear the word easier :(
  48. <20:10:51> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: if you are a 1 TZ corp
  49. <20:11:02> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: being the first person on is punishment
  50. <20:11:05> [WHBOO] Inspector: It makes it easier for BAD people to scan your chain, good people can already do it quickly :P
  51. <20:11:11> [TDSIN]Glasgow: what about differing sets of probes then?
  52. <20:11:18> Illana: that's an idea
  53. <20:11:22> Listrentite Myteia: #svipul
  54. <20:11:25> [HPYWH] Areks: If you are locking your hole down, you're only looking for new sigs. You already have an advantage.
  55. <20:11:29> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: Perhaps a new set of probes?
  56. <20:11:31> Sylnai | Lucia Denniard: give RSS probes a reason to exist?
  57. <20:11:42> Maverick Klark: Glasgow dif probs = higher cause, doesn't help newer people get into whs
  58. <20:11:45> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: We used to have the deep core scanners, but they removed them - so it would be going back?
  59. <20:11:48> Rawne: They way you identify sigs is fine
  60. <20:11:48> Maverick Klark: cost*
  61. <20:12:00> [P-NXT] IcarusN: Scanning dual chains for a small C4 group can take up to an hour. Anything to make that take less time would be a major QOL improvement.
  62. <20:12:03> [AoL] Teh Bear: Sorry for my frequent disconnects, i'm connected from my phone at work.
  63. <20:12:09> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: nope, people need to be in space to scan so you can see them scan
  64. <20:12:26> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you wont see them scanning
  65. <20:12:32> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: only their probes while cloaked
  66. <20:12:41> Axel Stenmark: yeah brighter dots plz
  67. <20:12:49> [TDSIN]Glasgow: old map/scanning ftw
  68. <20:12:51> Sylnai | Lucia Denniard: new map's still trash
  69. <20:12:55> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: having someone scanning a hole 15 mins, vs 30 mins doesnt make them vulnerable longer
  70. <20:13:08> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: faint dots need to be fixed
  71. <20:13:14> [HPYWH] Areks: and a toggle for the DSCAN bubble?
  72. <20:13:21> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: there is one in the top
  73. <20:13:24> Loroseco Kross: Am I the only wormholer in Eve who really lieks the new map, and can't go back to the old one (except the brightness of the dots)?
  74. <20:13:25> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: It'd be nice if each type of site had a (bright) color?
  75. <20:13:26> [HPYWH] Areks: gotcha
  76. <20:13:28> Sylnai | Lucia Denniard: that dscan bubble confused me so much because I thought I had an extra probe that was stuck
  77. <20:13:35> Sylnai | Lucia Denniard: it should be a different colour
  78. <20:13:45> [HPYWH] Areks: or more transparent
  79. <20:13:48> [AoE]Timothyr Black: i like the new map, was some getting used to but in 1 day got the hang of it
  80. <20:13:58> [AoE]Timothyr Black: only the system map though
  81. <20:14:04> [AoE]Timothyr Black: kspace map not so much
  82. <20:14:06> Axel Stenmark: new map does it as well
  83. <20:14:11> Dark Cookiez: new map does it
  84. <20:14:27> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: dcok the map on the side,
  85. <20:14:46> Sylnai | Lucia Denniard: there are hotkeys for probes
  86. <20:14:51> Matt0649 | Larad: rounding issues with the scanning map, wh shows 100% but still cant warp to it
  87. <20:15:04> bigsigma: there's a hotkey for scanning
  88. <20:15:08> bigsigma: it's not bound by default
  89. <20:15:20> Axel Stenmark: so like WASD for probe movement?
  90. <20:15:59> [WHBOO] Inspector: wasd+qe for up and down
  91. <20:16:04> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: Is it even possible to change?
  92. <20:16:05> Justin Cody: wasd isn't enough since you have a z-axis
  93. <20:16:26> [ARCLI] Calli: wasd + qe for up and down
  94. <20:16:35> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: EBR-88513 2016-07-30 Solar System/Probe Map reverts signature progress when toggled
  95. <20:16:36> Axel Stenmark: round arrow
  96. <20:16:47> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: EBR-88515 2016-07-16 Cosmic Signature Red Sensor Overlay Markers are missing
  97. <20:16:53> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Will keep these for later when we discuss bugs
  98. <20:16:59> [ARCLI] Marcus Laurendel: or wasd relative to your current camera view, so you could rotate with mouse, do wasd with left hand, perhaps hit a space for analyze.
  99. <20:17:13> Axel Stenmark: careful because our scanning changes will affect nullsec fleet fights drastically
  100. <20:17:15> [AoE]Timothyr Black: got analyze on my mouse button,
  101. <20:17:25> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: the added hotkeys are nice yeah
  102. <20:17:31> Axel Stenmark: and getting probes on an enemy fleet is already really quick
  103. <20:17:34> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: that makes probing too easy
  104. <20:17:39> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: Good point Alex
  105. <20:17:43> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: Axel
  106. <20:18:13> [AOE] Mao T.: using WASD for X & Y axis ans Q&E for up and down on Z-axis would be nice for hte probescanner
  107. <20:18:16> [AoE]Timothyr Black: hold alt to increase decrease au range etc only missing hotkey for aligning map to camera pov
  108. <20:18:22> Maverick Klark: +
  109. <20:18:22> [HPYWH] Areks: Tab into the input would be good
  110. <20:18:37> Axel Stenmark: yeah, a reset
  111. <20:18:43> TheBlueFox: you can tab through the fields
  112. <20:18:43> Axel Stenmark: centered on your ship
  113. <20:18:45> Axel Stenmark: or sun
  114. <20:18:47> TheBlueFox: and use keyboard input exclusively
  115. <20:18:47> Ázshara: Just throwing this out there and I might be wrong but when scanning large systems its diffiuclt to place your porbes on the red dot becuase of the max zoom in so you need to screw around with your camera alot before getting close enough to the dot to actaully see where to move your probes.
  116. <20:18:48> [BAERS] Flatpeak: +1 for reset
  117. <20:18:52> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: scanning does not need to be to easy
  118. <20:19:01> [WHBOO] Inspector: reset to sun = A++++
  119. <20:19:02> [BAERS] Flatpeak: ^
  120. <20:19:07> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: +1 reset probes
  121. <20:19:16> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: If you launch probes fromt he scanner window instead of probe launcher, they set to the sun.
  122. <20:19:17> Valtyr Farshield: + reset to sun
  123. <20:19:43> [WHBOO] Inspector: :(
  124. <20:19:47> [HPYWH] Areks: reset to ship
  125. <20:20:29> [HPYWH] Areks: so how about reseting the XYZ axises within a tolerance
  126. <20:20:29> [WHBOO] Inspector: sun > ship balance wise
  127. <20:20:36> sicks: :)
  128. <20:20:39> Nick Jacob: I agree with "reset to ship"
  129. <20:20:46> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: no
  130. <20:20:49> [TDSIN]Glasgow: no
  131. <20:21:03> LZHX | Ashy: definite no
  132. <20:21:12> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: no for reasons stated :p
  133. <20:21:18> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Reset to ship will be a problem for combat probing on grid yeah
  134. <20:21:19> [ARCLI] Marcus Laurendel: hmm, how about reset and recall probes button
  135. <20:21:21> [Y790] Kelsey Auditore: Half the time is spent scanning relic/data's
  136. <20:21:21> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Reset to sun isn't bad
  137. <20:21:25> Listrentite Myteia: with regards to centering on the sun, most systems are flat so above the sun would work since you'd still have to drag it down
  138. <20:21:31> Matt0649 | Larad: scanning aint so rewarding in higher class holes as data/relic sites arent worth the scan time nowadays
  139. <20:22:01> Axel Stenmark: just buff some of the small sig sizes
  140. <20:22:09> [EMBR.]Shogun - EliteForce: maybe they can make some mapping probes :P
  141. <20:22:24> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: not needed to be easier
  142. <20:22:33> Rawne: what
  143. <20:22:35> Rawne: no
  144. <20:22:36> Axel Stenmark: 20% to identify instead of 25% or something
  145. <20:22:44> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I would love having probes that have less strength but quicker scan time and vise versa
  146. <20:22:45> [WHBOO] Inspector: Know what the wormhole is AND make them harder to scan :3
  147. <20:22:48> [EMBR.]Shogun - EliteForce: that would be good. just to get a type
  148. <20:23:07> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: I think if you made it easier to identify what the sig is, but don't change the difficulty to 100% it, that would be good.
  149. <20:23:11> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: would still make traveling easier
  150. <20:23:16> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: What about instead of just "Unstable Wormhole"
  151. <20:23:19> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: as a result
  152. <20:23:26> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you got the code for it too?
  153. <20:23:37> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: "Unknown Wormhole H900"
  154. <20:23:45> Maverick Klark: ehh then you don't even have to warp to it to check
  155. <20:23:48> Maverick Klark: unless k162
  156. <20:23:58> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: which people do in cloaked covops/ts anyways
  157. <20:24:02> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: *T3s
  158. <20:24:12> Maverick Klark: if not in the t3 you do risk being dragge by bubbles though
  159. <20:24:20> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: nullified T3s
  160. <20:24:24> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: More nullsecs is what I would really love to see
  161. <20:24:26> Maverick Klark: if not in a t3 steel
  162. <20:24:39> [BAERS] Flatpeak: they need isk buff too
  163. <20:24:43> Lemming Alpha1dash1: Can the "easier" identification of the "type" of the probe result by enhanced by drugs ?
  164. <20:24:43> [Sig u] Yacht-Rolling Neo: c6 - c5/Ns
  165. <20:24:49> [HRDKX] Heift: yep
  166. <20:24:50> [Sig u] Yacht-Rolling Neo: ^^
  167. <20:25:20> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: Isk buff you say? Escalation now spawns 6 avengers!
  168. <20:25:24> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: Woooo!
  169. <20:25:52> [HPYWH] Areks: So would it be a fair statement to say C6 space is broken?
  170. <20:25:57> BINAD Victor MaCleod: Mass limits on statics
  171. <20:26:19> Valtyr Farshield: 118 C6 in total
  172. <20:26:32> [P-NXT] jokerb: No
  173. <20:26:37> LZHX | Ashy: Wormhole fatigue, damn son
  174. <20:26:46> Auron: FATIGUE NOOO
  175. <20:26:47> BINAD Victor MaCleod: 113 besides shattered isnt it
  176. <20:26:50> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I think C6's should have 2 statics because it opens so much of J-Space up. Personally I love C4's because you can rat and do PvP in so many different kinds of holes. By adding another static you'd give another reason to live in a C6
  177. <20:27:07> [SHKL.]Jadiii: if there were more people in wormholes, then that wouldn't happen
  178. <20:27:08> Axel Stenmark: no, we travel through THOUSANDS of WH's each month, not going to wait to jump, the delay is in the scanning
  179. <20:27:21> Qith Karrar: you just need more people in W spaceto gank them
  180. <20:27:25> [TDSIN]Glasgow: if k-space folk use wormholes for shortcuts, so what? Not our fault there using them
  181. <20:27:35> Wolf: ^
  182. <20:27:46> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: K-spacers in Wh space is nice. It is content.
  183. <20:27:47> BINAD-734 Seraph: Get a fleet and go after them
  184. <20:27:57> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: fatigue would do nothing good, it would make it harder to get content
  185. <20:28:02> Auron: mkae odd clas wh ahve 1 static, and even holes double static.
  186. <20:28:19> Wolf: Fatigue in wormholes is like having fatigue on gates.
  187. <20:28:42> [AOE] Mao T.: mass allowance on a hole is what limits travel, as null travel is not limited by mass, that's why there is fatigue
  188. <20:29:07> Axel Stenmark: no PL has their own scanners
  189. <20:29:15> Gorski Car: the sphere confirmed
  190. <20:29:18> [Y790] Kelsey Auditore: cmon boat
  191. <20:29:21> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Sphere 2.0 Wormhole Generator
  192. <20:29:46> [HPYWH] Areks: Siggy and Tripwire security is another issue.
  193. <20:29:46> bigsigma: I was wondering how long it would be before tinfoil hats appeared
  194. <20:30:05> TheBlueFox: if you guys have siggy questions, i'll be more than glad to answer anything
  195. <20:30:09> TheBlueFox: HK does not run it
  196. <20:30:13> Axel Stenmark: yes, i like the small holes with regen
  197. <20:30:25> Foedus Latro: I think the frigholes have taken away from the wandering holes
  198. <20:30:32> Axel Stenmark: ^^
  199. <20:30:33> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I would love to see more roaming null holes in general (along all classes)
  200. <20:31:02> TheBlueFox: apart from heartbleed, siggy hasn't had any security issues that i'm aware of, but we quickly addressed that
  201. <20:31:49> Axel Stenmark: its just mass, it was t3c fleets
  202. <20:32:04> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: the medium regenerating hole should be in all wh classes
  203. <20:32:28> Lemming Alpha1dash1: ewww we will get sword fleets coming out of WH like diarrhea
  204. <20:33:06> Axel Stenmark: straw poll more c4 nulls?
  205. <20:33:23> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: They're size
  206. <20:33:29> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: (Their?)
  207. <20:33:40> BINAD-734 Seraph: there :)
  208. <20:33:46> [SHKL.]Jadiii: with regen, would a WH mass scanner module be a viable thing?
  209. <20:33:48> BINAD-734 Seraph: they're
  210. <20:33:53> BINAD-734 Seraph: their
  211. <20:33:54> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: Null groups are so large they might as well kill the wormholers
  212. <20:34:58> Axel Stenmark: there is a balance that brings everyone null content without fury road, they were heavy handed on the nerf, splitting the difference is where it is at
  213. <20:35:02> BINAD Victor MaCleod: Shorter lifetime but more frequent spawns for nulls
  214. <20:35:30> NoobMan: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10984782-[/URL] c6 dual static
  215. <20:35:41> Axel Stenmark: rip not found
  216. <20:35:47> [MCAV] Tim Nering: 404
  217. <20:35:48> [.SSAM] Lucius Kalari | Mike: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10984782[/URL]
  218. <20:35:48> [.SSAM] thebringer: not working ^^
  219. <20:35:52> Glyndi|DG3N: [URL]http://puu.sh/qA9Dr/a2e5290e7a.png[/URL]
  220. <20:35:55> Glyndi|DG3N: broke
  221. <20:36:07> [.SSAM] Lucius Kalari | Mike: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10984782[/URL] <- works
  222. <20:36:26> [HPYWH] Areks: Valid point.
  223. <20:36:42> Wolf: Imminent Collapse would be nice
  224. <20:36:52> Wolf: Less than 5 mins or whatever
  225. <20:37:08> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: last 15 min should be the "very close" status
  226. <20:37:16> Maverick Klark: 6s dual stats +\
  227. <20:37:18> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: I just think it's something we can track with our wormhole trackers now already if you've scanned them - and it's a big coding change I think
  228. <20:37:21> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: 15 shoulds fine.
  229. <20:37:44> Qith Karrar: note that it won't update on the show info menu untill someone new enters grid.
  230. <20:37:48> Axel Stenmark: it simply prevents people from jumping the hole
  231. <20:37:55> Lemming Alpha1dash1: Dual static C6 ? why, for general capital warfare or giving a large entity more control of C6's ?
  232. <20:37:59> Axel Stenmark: no the wobble is a myth
  233. <20:38:27> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: ok thanks i wasn't sure if there were two stages to the wobble
  234. <20:38:45> Wolf: for logistics it'd be great, for hunting, its not too good
  235. <20:38:50> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: we need the uncertainty to have the not planned content
  236. <20:39:01> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: That's a good point Tim.
  237. <20:39:05> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: ++ Tim
  238. <20:39:32> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I think eol should be reduced to 2 hours.
  239. <20:39:42> LZHX | Ashy: 15/30min is sensible
  240. <20:39:45> [AoL] Teh Bear: can we add a 3rd optino to the strawpoll. "dual static, but one is frig only)
  241. <20:39:51> Maverick Klark: +
  242. <20:39:58> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: i don't see the need for a change, we had lots of kills through them, because carebear feel safe
  243. <20:40:00> [.SSAM] Lucius Kalari | Mike: that would be awful
  244. <20:40:04> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: more in favor of time reduction on EOL than having another shorter warning.
  245. <20:40:05> NoobMan: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10984800[/URL]
  246. <20:40:09> (TDSIN)FullMetalTS1: o7 all. gotta head out for the night thanks noobman for the meeting
  247. <20:40:25> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: depends on kinds of static
  248. <20:40:30> [.A0E.] Tanya Frost: eol is perfect as it is in my opinion
  249. <20:40:38> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: K-space, low-class?
  250. <20:40:42> Lemming Alpha1dash1: Good point, about the dual static c6
  251. <20:41:02> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: If you give C5 space more connections, your only buffing the incentive to live there
  252. <20:41:35> Axel Stenmark: don't open up too many holes, you should really only do one because improving connectivity in one class still impacts all
  253. <20:41:49> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: Not necessarily, a lot of people won't want the extra static for the C5
  254. <20:41:50> Tis: just need to evict more c5 groups so they have a reason to move o:)
  255. <20:41:54> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: move-ing citadels is boring
  256. <20:42:06> Maverick Klark: FUCK EM
  257. <20:42:09> Lemming Alpha1dash1: nope
  258. <20:42:10> [Sig u] Yacht-Rolling Neo: KICK THEM OUT
  259. <20:42:10> [AoL] Teh Bear: I love them
  260. <20:42:10> [TDSIN]Glasgow: kill em
  261. <20:42:11> [DK3N] The Learned Hand: love em
  262. <20:42:13> Maverick Klark: -
  263. <20:42:15> NoobMan: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10984517[/URL]
  264. <20:42:18> NoobMan: frig holes
  265. <20:42:21> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: they will just go to K-space then
  266. <20:42:21> NoobMan: you might have already voted
  267. <20:42:23> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: please do not kill frig holes
  268. <20:42:23> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: good for content, backdoors, can roll em if you're determined
  269. <20:42:24> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: keep em
  270. <20:42:27> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: which hurts Wspace more
  271. <20:42:28> [MCAV] Tim Nering: maybe lets talk about frig holes before ppl vote
  272. <20:42:43> Gorski Car: 60 or 30 sec
  273. <20:42:45> Axel Stenmark: delayed local is linked to all of null
  274. <20:42:46> Listrentite Myteia: We don't go through gates, so why are we registered to local
  275. <20:42:50> Gorski Car: I like it but a ton of people would rage
  276. <20:43:05> Gorski Car: I want that for all gate jumps tbh
  277. <20:43:24> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: When you have to use lore as your argument, it's a bad argument
  278. <20:43:25> LZHX | Ashy: Thats a great point that we probably shouldn't be on local for a few seconds since we didn't come through a gate
  279. <20:43:33> Axel Stenmark: if i wanted to fly frigates id go back to FW
  280. <20:43:34> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: frig holes are good, they only need more pve 'ers in them
  281. <20:43:43> Maverick Klark: <12:43:44> "Axel Stenmark": if i wanted to fly frigates id go back to FW
  282.  
  283. <20:43:45> [AoL] Teh Bear: +1 for speaker
  284. <20:44:07> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: +1 killed our guards + VNIs
  285. <20:44:19> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: +1 tim's points
  286. <20:44:21> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: did for us
  287. <20:44:24> [P-NXT] IcarusN: We have a frig hole doctrine and it would make me very sad if they went away
  288. <20:44:25> TheBlueFox: frig holes are great for whiptails
  289. <20:44:28> Gorski Car: I agree I am a fan of frigate whs
  290. <20:44:29> Svara Eir: wew
  291. <20:44:40> [ARCLI] Calli: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGxuDq9opFM[/URL]
  292. <20:44:50> Lemming Alpha1dash1: lol T3D's to OP, will still need an AF balance
  293. <20:45:09> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: I think the problem is not that T3ds can go through frig holes, I think the problem is the balance of the T3ds in general right now.
  294. <20:45:13> [EMBR.]Shogun - EliteForce: they should add other themed ship holes. ilike a bc cruiser only holes. or a battleship hole...then we can have themed fights..
  295. <20:45:21> Axel Stenmark: [URL]http://i.imgur.com/jw5kShU.png[/URL] my thoughts
  296. <20:45:22> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: T3D are already on the balance block
  297. <20:45:29> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I agree, it'd give AF's a use and since you wouldn't be able to use dictors it makes Interceptors even more usefull
  298. <20:46:16> Jakamo: So why are you further limiting a hole class that no one uses anyways?
  299. <20:46:36> Maverick Klark: should jsut swap them to roaming holes
  300. <20:46:52> [P-NXT] IcarusN: Denying T3Ds also denies command destroyers and interdictors though
  301. <20:47:00> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: they do get used
  302. <20:47:03> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: t3d and destroyers should go through frig holes
  303. <20:47:04> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: Kitsunes, Keres
  304. <20:47:10> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: If nobody uses em we don't need to change em :P
  305. <20:47:10> Tis: thats just gimmicky and annoying
  306. <20:47:19> [EMBR.]Shogun - EliteForce: lol
  307. <20:47:20> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: I think what can come through them is fine
  308. <20:47:30> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: ^
  309. <20:47:35> [DK3N] The Learned Hand: ^
  310. <20:47:35> [ARCLI] Draacan: what about allinace bookmarks?
  311. <20:47:42> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: technical limitation
  312. <20:47:44> [EMBR.]Shogun - EliteForce: that would be good
  313. <20:47:46> [ARCLI] Draacan: we need thos
  314. <20:47:47> Gorski Car: considering the average wh fleets power I don't think a t3d fleet is dangerous enough
  315. <20:47:49> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: alliances don't exist in game as a mechanic :P
  316. <20:48:13> Lemming Alpha1dash1: good point untill T3D and AF are balanced right, skip frig holes
  317. <20:48:23> bigsigma: that's called a C13
  318. <20:48:39> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I would like to see more effects in the tiny holes
  319. <20:48:54> Gorski Car: You def can
  320. <20:49:03> LZHX | Ashy: we've done it before easily enough
  321. <20:49:06> Gorski Car: beam fessors should be able to keep outside range
  322. <20:49:07> Tis: not if the dread people arent completely shit
  323. <20:49:08> LZHX | Robby Godfather: not like theres many site running fleets left anyways
  324. <20:49:24> LZHX | Robby Godfather: capital site running fleets*
  325. <20:49:27> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: The Tengu point is valid I think... Have had stratios with the same problem
  326. <20:49:31> [.SSAM] Lucius Kalari | Mike: i would just replace frig holes with 1 bil mass holes
  327. <20:49:33> Axel Stenmark: gorski we tried it, we welped, doesnt work they get wrecked
  328. <20:49:51> [COF] StevenEllecone: don't think you can take HAW dreads at all with t3ds
  329. <20:49:53> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: you can get a confessor at 5 sig with implants
  330. <20:49:56> [COF] StevenEllecone: assuming they have webs
  331. <20:49:56> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: worlf rayet effect in shattered wh is needed because of the pve content, remove the effect and make tailered pve sites
  332. <20:50:06> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: most people still scan in covert ops
  333. <20:50:40> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I have one. I would really, REALLY love to see more sleeper caches and ghost sites
  334. <20:50:49> Gorski Car: 50 sigs in shattered
  335. <20:50:54> Axel Stenmark: its region wide
  336. <20:50:59> [SHKL.]Jadiii: how about a 10 day site time, not based on jump
  337. <20:51:02> [SHKL.]Jadiii: 20 day for shattered
  338. <20:51:04> [SHKL.]Jadiii: or something of the sort
  339. <20:51:05> [SHKL.] Denton: I feel 7 days at least, 4 would be fast but a week is a good amount of time
  340. <20:51:07> Lemming Alpha1dash1: agreed Merchant Rova
  341. <20:51:20> LZHX | Ashy: the point is to make it short
  342. <20:51:25> LZHX | Ashy: for distribution of sites
  343. <20:51:26> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: 4 is too short, make it 10~
  344. <20:51:38> LZHX | Ashy: it's really not about saving up sites
  345. <20:51:41> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: I'id agree with this - getting rid of the Rainmakers, and the tie to the Region is a good change
  346. <20:51:44> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: i like the idea, it pressures the pve"ers to be active
  347. <20:51:46> Nick Jacob: Yeah some groups run sites during specific times and some sites might dissapear before people gather up to have fun :p
  348. <20:51:53> [SHKL.] Denton: i understand short is goal but a week i feel is a good balance
  349. <20:52:45> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: They need a despawn timer so they don't build up in empty holes, but they need to be there long enough to give people a chance to run them, I personally think 10 days is a good number for that.
  350. <20:53:23> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: Moer people runnings sites daily instead of weekly
  351. <20:53:23> Axel Stenmark: C5's are a barren wasteland because rainmakers are impractical
  352. <20:53:27> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: *more
  353. <20:53:39> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: more people running sites day - to - day = more pvp
  354. <20:53:40> Maverick Klark: :(
  355. <20:53:43> Maverick Klark: im the best jew
  356. <20:53:43> NoobMan: [URL]http://i.imgur.com/6qnN7Ib.png[/URL]
  357. <20:54:23> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I feel like scanned sites in wormhole space it should be %30 sleeper caches, %20 ghost sitse, %20 null relic/data, %30 sleeper data/relic
  358. <20:54:43> LZHX | Ashy: 20% ghost site would be crazy OP
  359. <20:54:54> Axel Stenmark: it would make C5's much better, and then C5 and C6 income differences are based on the class only, not how populated the class is
  360. <20:54:55> [P-NXT] IcarusN: Merchant, that is a lot much
  361. <20:54:58> [BAERS] Flatpeak: plz leave ghosts
  362. <20:55:00> Tis: would make the loot worthless as fuck overnight
  363. <20:55:06> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: they dont do that anyways
  364. <20:55:11> Tis: remember, when you increase spawn rate, you decrease value
  365. <20:55:15> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: ok yea nevermind on ghost sites. I've never really run one so I have no idea what the loot value is
  366. <20:55:24> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: but people in C5 -> non C6/5 static
  367. <20:55:24> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: ganking capitals please :p
  368. <20:55:29> [SHKL.]Jadiii: only spawn rate on combat sites
  369. <20:55:32> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: wont run statics
  370. <20:55:34> [SHKL.]Jadiii: and that's blue loot with fixed cost
  371. <20:55:37> [HRDKX] Heift: the real question is "do you want to gank capitals? or do you want to warp in to nothing because the rattles MJD out"
  372. <20:55:55> Selene Divine: takes 1-2 ships to run c5and down
  373. <20:56:54> [HRDKX] Heift: we had plenty of rolling in to other people jewing their own holes back in the day. dont think that because people are only running in their home that nobody will get caught.
  374. <20:57:37> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: we do them weekly
  375. <20:57:41> [SHKL.]Jadiii: ^
  376. <20:57:42> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: We agree with them on this.
  377. <20:57:49> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: My suggestion, same or similar despawn in C1-C4 and faster in C5-C6. Ships that can move for krabbing will have greater reason to to so and those who can't will be more activce at home.
  378. <20:57:49> [SHKL.] Denton: very much so
  379. <20:58:23> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: >330
  380. <20:58:38> [P-NXT] Taxed: QOL Alliance bookmarks pls
  381. <20:58:43> NoobMan: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10984981[/URL]
  382. <20:58:44> [AoL] Teh Bear: ^
  383. <20:58:46> [SHKL.]Jadiii: oh god yeah
  384. <20:58:48> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: could be better for moving a dread into a static
  385. <20:58:49> [P-NXT] Taxed: Make Wormholes great again, alliance bookmarks
  386. <20:59:04> [SHKL.]Jadiii: yeah, actually pop up on corp list within a few seconds of being made
  387. <20:59:11> Gorski Car: deployable beacon that shows up on the overview for everyone please
  388. <20:59:14> TheBlueFox: alliance BMs is a roles issue
  389. <20:59:15> [AoL] Teh Bear: clarification on straw poll Does answering "yes" mean we've TRIED them? or that we actively Run them?
  390. <20:59:20> [HRDKX] Heift: you say you make plenty of money but the argument of lowclass entities for not fighting is because they dont want to lose anything
  391. <20:59:31> TheBlueFox: doubt that will happen anytime soon without a major code rewrite
  392. <20:59:46> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: yeah
  393. <20:59:49> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: there is no reason to use a capital, when you can earn the same with rattle, why more risk when not more isk
  394. <20:59:49> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: thats the problem
  395. <21:00:00> Gorski Car: Figured I should run this for you guys before I suggest it
  396. <21:00:10> Gorski Car: what do you think about a deployable that shows up to everyone on overview
  397. <21:00:12> Gorski Car: like a beacon
  398. <21:00:22> Maverick Klark: ?
  399. <21:00:22> [AoL] Teh Bear: what does it do?
  400. <21:00:25> Maverick Klark: ^
  401. <21:00:28> [SHKL.]Jadiii: just make it so corp bookmarks show up right away
  402. <21:00:32> Gorski Car: shows up on overview so anyone can warp to it
  403. <21:00:32> [SHKL.]Jadiii: and why bother
  404. <21:00:40> [GRMBL]Chavez: mnoar bookmarks
  405. <21:00:42> LZHX | Face: when someone is bearing gorski?
  406. <21:00:42> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you dont need 4 capos to escalate an incursion
  407. <21:00:44> [P-NXT] jokerb: risk reward is completely out of whack.
  408. <21:00:46> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: *caps
  409. <21:00:47> Gorski Car: nah
  410. <21:00:53> Gorski Car: more to help purple fleets warp to whs
  411. <21:00:58> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: 4 caps well fit = 8-12b
  412. <21:01:09> Gorski Car: when you cant do corp bms
  413. <21:01:27> [HRDKX] Heift: lol
  414. <21:02:08> Tis: related topic. sleepers need to SCRAM not just point...
  415. <21:02:17> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I feel like wormholes space needs more interesting PvE (special mechanics) and more difference in sites. Because of the lore with sleepers, it makes sense to maybe add the hacking mechanic into some special sites, or maybe another spedcialized mechanic.
  416. <21:02:36> [TDSIN]Glasgow: why not add wormhole effects to sleeper sites?
  417. <21:02:53> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: what about random site effects?
  418. <21:02:54> BINAD Victor MaCleod: why do it when you make 300 pr hr mill doing incursions...
  419. <21:02:55> Valtyr Farshield: i think it will be technically very difficult
  420. <21:03:08> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: There are a lot of people who moved their farming out to null out of C5/C6 space because the payouts weren't as good
  421. <21:03:18> [HPYWH] Areks: ^^^^
  422. <21:03:23> [AoL] Teh Bear: Especially in C5 space, it's super easy to run sites safely.
  423. <21:03:26> Gorski Car: also pure isk > blue loot
  424. <21:03:34> [AoL] Teh Bear: An increase in spawn rate would increase isk income
  425. <21:03:51> [SHKL.] Denton: YES
  426. <21:03:54> Maverick Klark: +
  427. <21:03:54> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: Modules/materials that players need > Blue loot
  428. <21:04:08> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: no
  429. <21:04:13> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: make avengers worth more in general
  430. <21:04:15> [SHKL.]Jadiii: make them pay 100m each
  431. <21:04:19> [SHKL.] Denton: YES
  432. <21:04:19> [SHKL.]Jadiii: 80-100m
  433. <21:04:19> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: ^
  434. <21:04:24> Dietrich | Crapalot: lol 100M each?!
  435. <21:04:27> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: That has a market balance. No one runs sites, higher price, better pay out to run them
  436. <21:04:28> [SHKL.]Jadiii: per avenger
  437. <21:04:29> Spleeden: More isk from sites would be great
  438. <21:04:31> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: 100M per avenger
  439. <21:04:32> [SHKL.]Jadiii: allowed 3 escalations
  440. <21:04:34> Dietrich | Crapalot: LOL
  441. <21:04:36> LZHX | Robby Godfather: people would just warp carriers/faxes at 200
  442. <21:04:46> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you are pointed while killing them
  443. <21:04:49> Dietrich | Crapalot: the drifter is where the money should be to encourage completing the site
  444. <21:05:05> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: the drifter is not a high enough reward with the avengers in play
  445. <21:05:11> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: ^^
  446. <21:05:14> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: make escalation waves triggerable once per site
  447. <21:05:18> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: per time it spawns
  448. <21:05:18> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: making it faster to kill the drifter boss when using a capital in stead of a rattlefleet
  449. <21:05:21> Gorski Car: link from carrier?
  450. <21:05:26> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: If you get scrammed/pointed when you warp in and the avengers tackle you, you can't just warp them in and then out to trigger the wave
  451. <21:05:32> Axel Stenmark: or just run without links, started doing that lately
  452. <21:05:38> Dietrich | Crapalot: the drifter is very quick to killl with dreads, so the price you pay for bringing dreads to the site is that you have to deal with avengers
  453. <21:05:40> [SHKL.] Denton: and more isk makes the reward better, which can buy more caps, and bring more ppl into WH too possibly
  454. <21:05:46> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: as i said
  455. <21:05:57> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: the benefit of killing the drifter in 5minutes is not worth having to deal with avengers
  456. <21:06:07> BINAD Victor MaCleod: risk vs reward is messed up atm. More isk and more content
  457. <21:06:11> Dietrich | Crapalot: dealing with 3 avengers is easysauce with 2 dreads on field
  458. <21:06:14> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: If you raise vaue of avenger
  459. <21:06:16> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: *value
  460. <21:06:24> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: theres now a reason to warp in all 3 cap types
  461. <21:06:37> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: because not warping a carrier in, is -300m to total value of iste
  462. <21:06:38> [SHKL.]Jadiii: higher value avengers, more caps on field, higher investment and payout
  463. <21:06:39> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: *site
  464. <21:07:00> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: payout that justifies bringing in those caps.
  465. <21:07:06> [HRDKX] Heift: cap in site > rattles in sites because the rattles just MJD away
  466. <21:07:22> Axel Stenmark: someone said it already, avengers discourage using caps, which is opposite of risk/reward balance
  467. <21:07:25> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: EXACTLY
  468. <21:07:28> [SHKL.]Jadiii: ^
  469. <21:07:30> [DK3N] The Learned Hand: ^
  470. <21:07:32> [ARCLI] Calli: this
  471. <21:07:34> LZHX | Robby Godfather: .
  472. <21:07:35> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: Yes Baracus^^^^
  473. <21:07:38> [SHKL.] Denton: yep
  474. <21:07:47> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: more isk per avenger = more caps on field = more cap kills
  475. <21:07:48> [ARCLI] Calli: Food chain starts at the bottom (krabs)
  476. <21:08:05> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: + people who can afford to lose the caps.
  477. <21:08:27> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: no you wont
  478. <21:08:37> Jakamo: Ravens don't work anymore
  479. <21:08:45> Jakamo: Changed that
  480. <21:08:52> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Yup you can't outrange the site now
  481. <21:08:58> Jakamo: Yep
  482. <21:09:05> [SHKL.]Jadiii: even if not 30b, 12b is reasonable with high avenger payout per site
  483. <21:09:14> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: IF avengers pay 100million per, and you need 1 dread, 1 fax and 1 carrier to make the max possible spawn, that's 900million isk, with a requirement of at least 3 caps on field.
  484. <21:09:16> [ARCLI] Calli: [URL]https://zkillboard.com/kill/44356287/[/URL] it does happen
  485. <21:09:18> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: making an extra 900m per site from full escalation with 3 caps isnt like the old days
  486. <21:09:26> [ARCLI] Calli: or did
  487. <21:09:28> Dante: Higher payout for avengers, caps have to be in the centre of the site to escalate, means more caps on field and not just caps warping at a ping
  488. <21:09:35> [AOE] Mao T.: I have a 1.2B ratlefit combined with a republic fleet mindlink pilot in a claymore tanks 3.3K sleeper DPS
  489. <21:09:41> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you already do
  490. <21:09:46> [AOE] Mao T.: so I can solo alot of sites
  491. <21:09:49> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you cant spawn 2 avenger waves at once
  492. <21:09:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: and their massive EHP
  493. <21:09:56> Jakamo: Nono don't make the sites longer Jesus they take 30minutes already
  494. <21:09:58> LZHX | Robby Godfather: spawn avengers on sieging/triaging?
  495. <21:10:00> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you have to do them 3 at a time
  496. <21:10:00> Lemming Alpha1dash1: Does CCP have a hard max value for how much isk can be earned per hr, to combat inflation ?
  497. <21:10:10> Jakamo: 30 mins with more payout than current seems entirely reasonable
  498. <21:10:21> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: You won't be able to farm the site for multiple days though, the avengers don't respawn.
  499. <21:10:34> [GRMBL]Chavez: force it in a group activity...
  500. <21:10:42> Axel Stenmark: yeah better avengers, AFTER the drifter
  501. <21:10:59> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: 150m? make it 300m.
  502. <21:11:06> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: they don't have to be after, they just have to be worth spawning.
  503. <21:11:11> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: may i speak?
  504. <21:11:12> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: make it despawn after 12 hours on first escalation, so people are forced to clear it or leave it
  505. <21:11:28> LZHX | Robby Godfather: how do you prevent people from warping stuff at 300km like they used to
  506. <21:11:33> LZHX | Robby Godfather: and using hero dread to clear avengers
  507. <21:11:47> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: they have too much EHP to do it
  508. <21:11:49> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: It's open push to talk I think.
  509. <21:12:27> Jakamo: So then if you have dreads and faxes on field it'll over escalate you decide have to warp shit off
  510. <21:12:29> [SHKL.]Jadiii: if it's only a dread in, you get +300m for the escalation
  511. <21:12:34> [SHKL.]Jadiii: if you add a fax +300m
  512. <21:12:40> [SHKL.]Jadiii: + carrier +300m
  513. <21:12:44> sicks: yea +1 drifter per capital
  514. <21:12:51> [SSC]Lisa Nardieu: just despawn sites at dt, if you warp things too it...no more running sites for 4days
  515. <21:13:04> Dietrich | Crapalot: also I'd suggest some of the sleepers have scrams instead of just points
  516. <21:13:06> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: an extra drifter per cap is gonna be too much.
  517. <21:13:07> Dietrich | Crapalot: so no MJD
  518. <21:13:26> Dietrich | Crapalot: you start running sites iwth rattlesnakes, you're committed just like bringing dreads to a site
  519. <21:13:34> Tis: detrich, yeah, definitely want that discussed
  520. <21:13:36> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: has anyone tried killing 6 avnegers at once?
  521. <21:13:38> Jakamo: So you can't run the site in caps basically
  522. <21:13:44> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: it would break most PVE dreads tank
  523. <21:13:50> [SHKL.]Jadiii: ^
  524. <21:13:55> Tis: steal yeah, just need 3 scimis, axk brax
  525. <21:14:00> Tis: *ask
  526. <21:14:06> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: with subs
  527. <21:14:10> [SHKL.]Jadiii: carrier would spawn drifters
  528. <21:14:13> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: but with all those neuts on one dread
  529. <21:14:16> [SHKL.]Jadiii: er, avengers rather
  530. <21:14:19> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you will cap out
  531. <21:14:25> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: and cant get reps in seige
  532. <21:14:34> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you would need dual cap boosters
  533. <21:14:44> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: and have like 10 minutes of charges
  534. <21:14:47> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: The sleeper should spawn if your in a cap regardless if you shoot the side
  535. <21:14:55> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: *structure
  536. <21:16:05> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: that takes time = vulnerability
  537. <21:16:05> [ARCLI] Calli: How does this bring more players to WH?
  538. <21:16:14> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: more isk
  539. <21:16:14> [SHKL.]Jadiii: they get more money
  540. <21:16:15> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: a reason to be there.
  541. <21:16:19> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: over nullsec.
  542. <21:16:45> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: Not with the refitting changes
  543. <21:16:47> Axel Stenmark: you need like two guardians to tank 1 HAW
  544. <21:16:51> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: Cant refit while in seige
  545. <21:16:55> Braxus Deninard: yes you can
  546. <21:17:12> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: siege doesnt give u a weapons timer
  547. <21:17:17> Braxus Deninard: ^
  548. <21:17:19> [GRMBL]Chavez: cant refit with weapong timer
  549. <21:17:20> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: oh sorry
  550. <21:17:20> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: which means you can refit
  551. <21:17:28> [P-NXT] Merchant Rova: I know bastion gives you one
  552. <21:17:30> Slack Aurelian no mic: bastion gives wep timer siege doesnt
  553. <21:17:32> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: oh really?
  554. <21:17:32> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: yeah bastion is special
  555. <21:17:37> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: so my dual cap battery dread...
  556. <21:17:44> [GRMBL] dp.Zoica // Henner: [URL]https://zkillboard.com/related/31001860/201608131300/o/%7B%22A%22%3A%5B%2298118385%5C%2F%22%5D%2C%22B%22%3A%5B%5D%7D/[/URL]
  557. <21:17:51> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: battery still helps some I guess?
  558. <21:17:52> [GRMBL] dp.Zoica // Henner: difficult, but possible
  559. <21:17:55> [HPYWH] Areks: Yep.
  560. <21:17:57> [SHKL.]Jadiii: yeah, they're all red cans
  561. <21:17:59> [HRDKX] Heift: intacts for 10m lol
  562. <21:18:00> [SHKL.]Jadiii: and they're all worth shit
  563. <21:18:15> [HPYWH] Areks: Yes.
  564. <21:18:38> [GRMBL]Chavez: not difficult, was a shit fleet ^^
  565. <21:18:40> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: In C4s the RANGES
  566. <21:18:45> [SHKL.]Jadiii: C3's are better than 4's just cuz of spawn distances
  567. <21:18:47> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: 120km spawn range?
  568. <21:18:51> [HPYWH] Areks: Yeah
  569. <21:18:52> Seraph Razgriz: 3s you can run faster and so they end up being the same as four with less effort and danger
  570. <21:18:53> Maverick Klark: somthing like taht
  571. <21:18:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: waiting 5 mins to even shoot
  572. <21:18:53> [HPYWH] Areks: that sucks
  573. <21:18:54> Maverick Klark: p dumnb
  574. <21:19:50> [.A0E.] Tanya Frost: don't have prob with c4 rr tough
  575. <21:20:05> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: the extra time it takes to run a C4 because of spawn distance is just silly.
  576. <21:20:20> BA Baracus: rorqual boys
  577. <21:20:21> [HRDKX] Heift: mine moon goo
  578. <21:20:23> Maverick Klark: +++++
  579. <21:20:30> [ARCLI] Iskalag Firehs: we need to have a reputation that we have the best isk/hour in EVE. That has always been the best add for k-space people. Just make us use caps in C5 / C6 but give us more money. Not that hard. AFK-Rattles gives you cancer
  580. <21:20:31> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: mining signatures plz not just anoms - its so boring
  581. <21:20:56> [P-NXT] jokerb: THIS!! so true change the ores!
  582. <21:21:04> [SHKL]Elderran: ^ 100% Agree
  583. <21:21:09> Maverick Klark: ++++++
  584. <21:21:12> Steveo | Moo: There used to be a time when mining was common. needs to be seriously buffed (also I will never do mining but some people do)
  585. <21:21:15> Selene Divine: and you have to haul all the shit out
  586. <21:21:17> Axel Stenmark: better ore, sure
  587. <21:21:19> Trip: More ninja skiffs in WH space
  588. <21:21:19> [NW0RT] Samof Rome: i mean, what about having some ores that would only be in WS, like gas?
  589. <21:21:30> Spleeden: Risk + Capitals + more money > More time + not as much risk + less money
  590. <21:21:44> Maverick Klark: highest yield? or just higher?
  591. <21:21:49> Pantuf | Vernona | Vernonica: more ore sites and lasts longer
  592. <21:21:49> [SHKL.] Denton: i would like to see belts in w-space
  593. <21:21:58> [P-NXT] IcarusN: C4 groups want more ore :)
  594. <21:22:08> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: i want wormhole specific ores
  595. <21:22:12> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: 10x more yield
  596. <21:22:15> [HPYWH] Areks: ^^^^^^^^^^
  597. <21:22:17> Maverick Klark: MORE MINING
  598. <21:22:19> [TDSIN]Glasgow: yup :)
  599. <21:22:22> sicks: more mining!
  600. <21:22:26> [P-NXT] jokerb: give us the better ores simple as that
  601. <21:22:28> LZHX | Ashy: i cant remember the last time i ganked a wh space miner
  602. <21:22:31> [AOE] Mao T.: i'm mining right now
  603. <21:22:31> LZHX | Ashy: so yeah, ltes have more
  604. <21:22:35> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: can u imagine the newbro venture swarm in whs
  605. <21:22:35> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Especially with the Rorqual changes coming up - are we going to be able to use those in W-Space?
  606. <21:22:40> Maverick Klark: ^^^
  607. <21:22:43> Axel Stenmark: can we get W-regions added to the montly economic report by CCP?
  608. <21:22:51> [GRMBL]Chavez: want to kill rorqual fleets
  609. <21:22:54> [TDSIN]Glasgow: its rare now
  610. <21:22:54> Kham: the 2 upper level ore sites... arent that bad really the Merc pays out well.
  611. <21:22:54> Maverick Klark: +
  612. <21:23:32> [TDSIN]Glasgow: 20 for sure?
  613. <21:24:06> [ERB] Emmaline Fera: I'm going to be Don Quioxte on this one, but CCPlease: Alliance bookmarks. Please.
  614. <21:24:11> [P-NXT] IcarusN: Pathway to the Next agrees with MCAV
  615. <21:24:18> Axel Stenmark: low class rorqual pvp roam
  616. <21:24:21> Kham: theres 3.2b in ore in the rarified, and 3.4b in the exceptional
  617. <21:24:22> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Need a mobile compression array for mining ops
  618. <21:24:35> [MCAV] Tim Nering: [URL]https://puu.sh/qxdIY/ed6b6c2477.png[/URL]
  619. <21:24:45> Lemming Alpha1dash1: Question, has the despawn for wrecks (npc) been seriously decreased ?
  620. <21:24:49> Lemming Alpha1dash1: time"
  621. <21:24:55> Selene Divine: 2hr?
  622. <21:25:27> Lemming Alpha1dash1: used to be 2hrs, now not so sure
  623. <21:25:29> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: reduce fuel costs for cits in WHs :D
  624. <21:25:38> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: or a fuel bonus in wh's
  625. <21:25:48> Sullen Decimus: they're already nothing comapred to pos's?
  626. <21:25:52> LZHX | Robby Godfather: eh, you no longer pay for pos fuel anyway so
  627. <21:26:00> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you do
  628. <21:26:02> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: for the modules
  629. <21:26:16> LZHX | Ashy: compared to a ton of pos's though...
  630. <21:26:21> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: oh i know
  631. <21:26:23> Axel Stenmark: damnit noob, the take a penny leave a penny hanger is ruining our market
  632. <21:26:36> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: but shit, if we give up asset safety, gimme lower costs
  633. <21:27:04> [WDS] Gillion Wyrddych: The new indy arrays will have a big impact on the mining in WH space.
  634. <21:27:24> [.A0E.] Egsise (drunk, mute me: What if you could reopeon previous wh that was rolled by either side, just a drunk idea
  635. <21:27:41> LZHX | Face: shh
  636. <21:27:44> [HPYWH] Areks: LOL
  637. <21:28:12> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: there was a evenews post that one tanked a supper and a few dreads, that amount of dps is not available in wh's
  638. <21:28:56> Dietrich | Crapalot: nerf the cap on faxes?
  639. <21:29:04> Dietrich | Crapalot: so you have to use batteries or other mods to overcome that
  640. <21:29:05> Maverick Klark: cap isn't hte issue
  641. <21:29:07> Maverick Klark: it's hte cap boosters
  642. <21:29:08> Dietrich | Crapalot: oh right cap boosters
  643. <21:29:14> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: What about taking away the Ship Maintenance Array so you can't just store industrials with extra cap boosters?
  644. <21:29:24> NoobMan: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10985280[/URL]
  645. <21:29:27> Maverick Klark: rnasu
  646. <21:29:32> Maverick Klark: the sma isn't hte issue
  647. <21:29:38> Maverick Klark: it's having a dst along side
  648. <21:29:44> Maverick Klark: with 60k worth of cap boosters
  649. <21:29:49> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: We can't kill the DST?
  650. <21:29:54> Maverick Klark: it's tank is dumb
  651. <21:29:57> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: Fax will probably get more use with a buff to avenger income.
  652. <21:29:58> Maverick Klark: and it getting repped by a fax
  653. <21:30:00> Maverick Klark: it's not happening
  654. <21:30:05> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Hmm that's a good point yeah if it's buffer and repped
  655. <21:30:09> Maverick Klark: mhmmm
  656. <21:30:11> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Good use for the DST :)
  657. <21:30:13> Maverick Klark: ya
  658. <21:30:14> [HOLE] Julian Hertel: [URL]https://zkillboard.com/kill/54365614/[/URL] you can kill a Fax....
  659. <21:30:14> Maverick Klark: lol
  660. <21:30:20> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: or dread blob
  661. <21:30:28> Maverick Klark: you cna't always dread blob in w spaces
  662. <21:30:29> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: which only works for defenders
  663. <21:30:34> Maverick Klark: ^
  664. <21:30:36> BA Baracus: that was the absolute last thing to die if I remember
  665. <21:30:47> Maverick Klark: it was
  666. <21:30:52> LZHX | Robby Godfather: maybe increase cap booster cycle time while keeping gj/s the same?
  667. <21:30:53> BA Baracus: and it tanked for a long time, all on its own
  668. <21:30:54> Slack Aurelian no mic: took ages to kill that thing
  669. <21:31:02> BA Baracus: until the pilot got bored
  670. <21:31:06> Maverick Klark: hte only reason we killed it was because the dst boated away from the ninazu
  671. <21:31:18> Selene Divine: [URL]https://zkillboard.com/kill/55079678/[/URL] ... disregard fit lol
  672. <21:31:18> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: cap bonus removal would make the apostle and the shield one make the only ones used
  673. <21:31:21> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: allow ecm again on triage faxes XD
  674. <21:31:33> Braxus Deninard: pls
  675. <21:31:40> [HPYWH] Areks: meaningful choices... triggered
  676. <21:31:48> Lemming Alpha1dash1: lol
  677. <21:31:54> Maverick Klark: maybe give nthem a regen bounes?
  678. <21:31:59> Maverick Klark: instead ofa cap boost bounes?
  679. <21:32:02> Kham: rip
  680. <21:32:31> BA Baracus: that's not a real fix... boat out of triage, scoop a full hold, re-triage
  681. <21:32:40> [SHKL.]Jadiii: or just bring a heavy buffer fit deepspace transport
  682. <21:32:41> [HRDKX] Heift: that would barely even work, once you run out of your first triage cycle, you grab more boosters in a few seconds the re-triage
  683. <21:32:45> [SHKL.]Jadiii: to hold cap batteries
  684. <21:33:26> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: OR
  685. <21:33:29> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: increase mass
  686. <21:33:32> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: 1 per hole
  687. <21:33:32> Axel Stenmark: not enough data, wait for PvE changes to encourage more cap usage then worry about faxes after that
  688. <21:33:35> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: no 2 cap holes
  689. <21:33:38> Lemming Alpha1dash1: uptime 1hr30mins
  690. <21:33:40> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: with a ninazu
  691. <21:33:43> Tis: make faxes like supers, null only?
  692. <21:33:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you bring FAX, you only get that before hole collapse
  693. <21:33:59> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: 1 fax + subs
  694. <21:34:06> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: not able to bring dread/carrier
  695. <21:34:13> [SSC]Lisa Nardieu: youi cant scram in triage
  696. <21:34:44> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: mass increase doesnt hurt K-Space
  697. <21:34:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: and helps with J-space balancing
  698. <21:35:07> Trip: No, it helps defending, attacking have to fight without a FAX
  699. <21:35:10> LZHX | Ashy: maybe, but then you just jump it last
  700. <21:35:22> [GRMBL]Chavez: the nidhog had infinte cap....
  701. <21:35:38> [GRMBL]Chavez: that was really hard to break
  702. <21:35:40> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: and if it closes on the way in
  703. <21:35:45> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: then you are 100% committed
  704. <21:37:49> Seraph Razgriz: even less
  705. <21:37:52> Maverick Klark: ^
  706. <21:37:54> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: they get used less now because no one has money to throw dread away
  707. <21:37:59> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: ^^
  708. <21:38:02> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: if you made more off C6/5 escalations
  709. <21:38:03> [HPYWH] Areks: ^^^^
  710. <21:38:04> Maverick Klark: i wouldn't say they dont ahve the money
  711. <21:38:05> Axel Stenmark: XL turrets >>> XL torps against subs, they only nerfed one blap dread
  712. <21:38:08> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: and could afford to lose dreads
  713. <21:38:12> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: You'll get the fights again if the income is buffed.
  714. <21:38:12> [HOLE] Julian Hertel: why bring Dreads if you cant kill the fax
  715. <21:38:14> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: then fuck it, ill bring dreads
  716. <21:39:04> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: cap neuts in null barely matter
  717. <21:39:10> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: they just melt you so fast
  718. <21:39:14> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: with 10+ dreads
  719. <21:39:20> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: barely
  720. <21:39:36> Holger Gurpgork: Wouldn't that also still fuck over non-c5/6 corps?
  721. <21:39:53> muha/Shadow: They would have 500mi+ mass
  722. <21:39:53> Maverick Klark: ehh
  723. <21:39:54> Holger Gurpgork: right now fax'es are just unkillable with subcaps
  724. <21:39:54> muha/Shadow: wouldnt go in c4
  725. <21:39:58> LZHX | Face: ya fuck it im game for 9 dreads through a wh
  726. <21:40:03> Maverick Klark: you jsut just say no caps jumping c4 down
  727. <21:40:10> [HOLE] Julian Hertel: but who has 5+ dreads to use in a fight?
  728. <21:40:11> Maverick Klark: instead of it being a mass issue
  729. <21:40:18> Holger Gurpgork: nah I mean if a C4 corp rolls into a C5
  730. <21:40:19> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: 9 dreads is a lot
  731. <21:40:26> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: yeah gg then
  732. <21:40:48> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: 9 dreads is a lot it wh space.
  733. <21:40:49> Slack Aurelian: holger whats to stop you getting caps dropped on you now if you roll in to a c5 entity though
  734. <21:40:50> Axel Stenmark: 9 is too much, you could see people so fast
  735. <21:41:02> Maverick Klark: 6?
  736. <21:41:02> [GRMBL]Chavez: with this shit income i wont throw so much caps in a risky fight
  737. <21:41:03> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: you got the knowledge that they can only have 3
  738. <21:41:17> [.SSAM] Lucius Kalari | Mike: i would increase the mass of a fax and then introduce a "light triage" that was basically what triage was before the changes
  739. <21:41:20> Holger Gurpgork: nothing, but now it's just "oh look a fax gg lets go"
  740. <21:41:29> Holger Gurpgork: which is shit gameplay
  741. <21:41:33> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: yes
  742. <21:41:40> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: or if it closes on you when attacking
  743. <21:41:52> Holger Gurpgork: pre-change carriers were difficult to deal with but doable
  744. <21:41:55> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: then you must commit a FAX 100%
  745. <21:42:05> [HOLE] Julian Hertel: increase the fax mass by 50%
  746. <21:42:19> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: It's not a problem with a dreads, it's a problem with the income.
  747. <21:42:38> LZHX | Robby Godfather: i think the biggest issue is peoples bed and dinner times
  748. <21:42:51> Kham: damn real life
  749. <21:42:56> LZHX | Ashy: Buffer isnt necessarily a fix
  750. <21:43:03> Axel Stenmark: WH effect on capital remote reps?
  751. <21:43:04> Wolf: [URL]https://gyazo.com/d7a69b9f7bfe75e277b41a1699bf6b42[/URL]
  752. <21:43:04> LZHX | Robby Godfather: you roll into pvp entity, you start forming, about to go and fight and suddenly bed time hits the entire corp
  753. <21:43:12> [P-NXT] IcarusN: All this capital talk really making this lean super heavy to High Class only. Citadels are relavent to all of us.
  754. <21:43:24> Axel Stenmark: yeah citadels
  755. <21:43:58> Axel Stenmark: allow citadels to be fit during their initial repair stage
  756. <21:44:06> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: anchoring duration reduction in W-space
  757. <21:44:15> Maverick Klark: i think it's just to long over all
  758. <21:44:26> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: 2 hour astrahus, 4 hours fort, 8 hour keepstar
  759. <21:44:38> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: what does this do?
  760. <21:44:48> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: more small groups willing to move in
  761. <21:44:54> [SSC]Lisa Nardieu: you need a 24h so you can anchor it in prime time and have finish anchoring in your prime
  762. <21:45:01> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: cost is more of a problem
  763. <21:45:09> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: 4 hours of game time isnt too long
  764. <21:45:16> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: drop on a weekend, easily get 4 hours of coverage
  765. <21:45:35> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: you need something accessible to store caps in
  766. <21:45:39> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: since POSs are going out
  767. <21:45:40> [GRMBL]Chavez: just defend it in the 15min timer
  768. <21:45:58> [GRMBL]Chavez: call your friends or something
  769. <21:46:06> Jakamo: 50 large poses does. Not equal a keepstar
  770. <21:46:32> [GRMBL]Chavez: you just need to rolll the holes... dont see a problem there
  771. <21:46:42> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: for 24 hours...
  772. <21:46:49> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: or you get seeded with a fleet/caps
  773. <21:46:55> [GRMBL]Chavez: or 2-3 hours before the timer
  774. <21:47:02> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: drop anchor time to reduce how long you need hole control
  775. <21:47:14> [P-NXT] IcarusN: I actually don't think the 24 is a problem
  776. <21:47:25> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: yes!
  777. <21:47:26> [P-NXT] IcarusN: we dropped our first astrahus with only 3 people
  778. <21:47:37> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: because its an astrahus
  779. <21:47:41> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: its 1b
  780. <21:47:46> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: who will seed for a 1b kill
  781. <21:47:51> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: fort? 12b
  782. <21:47:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: ill seed for it
  783. <21:47:54> [GRMBL]Chavez: get some friends
  784. <21:48:04> [P-NXT] IcarusN: We did our fort with only a dozen people
  785. <21:48:16> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: but we arent all TZ coverage
  786. <21:48:43> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: saying "you should have enough people to defend it, and enough people over all TZs"
  787. <21:48:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: that sets the bar really high to move in
  788. <21:48:59> Maverick Klark: not everyones corp covers every tz
  789. <21:49:12> [GRMBL]Chavez: so i can seed citadels in enemy holes?
  790. <21:49:18> [GRMBL]Chavez: 4h timer is nothing
  791. <21:49:20> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: yes
  792. <21:49:20> Vasama: Well you need to be aware if someonde drops citadel in WH you live..and one should have some even some time to prepare to evict it so 24 hrs is good
  793. <21:49:22> [ODIN] Urd Voiddaughter: We dropped our Citadel second week they were out when they were dropping like flys. Crit all holes, keep eyes and all hands on dick a few hours before vulnerable for rolling scanning and criting. Not that risky.
  794. <21:49:50> [P-NXT] Taxed: How about the ability to bug the counter with an extended name and block it
  795. <21:49:51> Dietrich | Crapalot: brb ship scanning keepstar
  796. <21:49:59> [AOE] Mao T.: It is up to the larger alliances to allow smallergroups to join in. If you kill em in the firs phase you deny yourself future content
  797. <21:50:21> LZHX | Face: is that a suggestion
  798. <21:50:22> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Tell that to Wingspan plz :/
  799. <21:50:24> LZHX | Face: or are you saying that works
  800. <21:51:08> Khelar: i just got avaliable to sit down and listen. Have we talked about fig holes/nullsec spawn rate
  801. <21:51:09> NoobMan: [URL]https://forum.hardknocksinc.net/index.php?/topic/6285-citadel-access-rights-submission/[/URL]
  802. <21:51:10> [AOE] Mao T.: well, I perfer a good fight over a gank
  803. <21:51:20> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Khelar yes at the start of the discussion
  804. <21:51:28> Khelar: ok cool
  805. <21:51:33> Khelar: how'd that discussion go down
  806. <21:51:37> NoobMan: [URL]https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HVr4V92mfZ0GfuEhY_Zx7B_NRS3BrxE92Z3kVTUkcfo/edit[/URL]
  807. <21:51:41> NoobMan: works
  808. <21:52:12> Seraph Razgriz: not being able to share ships between accounts is terrible
  809. <21:52:38> [AOE] Mao T.: also, managing my 5 PI alts will be shit once POS disappear
  810. <21:52:48> [MCAV] Tim Nering: my guys just tested ships scanning the citadel
  811. <21:52:49> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: We need a way to share a hangar between multiple alts
  812. <21:52:49> [MCAV] Tim Nering: it does not work
  813. <21:52:50> [MCAV] Tim Nering: Markj2 Antollare > 20:52:10 Notify Target is invulnerable.
  814. <21:53:01> Braxus Deninard: it is not vulnerable then
  815. <21:53:01> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: if containers with passwords get fixed... now people can drag the container to their hangar and retrieve the password, open it up
  816. <21:53:02> Dietrich | Crapalot: that's an EVE problem
  817. <21:53:04> [GRMBL]Chavez: shiphangars in citadels pls
  818. <21:53:06> Braxus Deninard: it needs to be vulnerable to ship scan
  819. <21:53:07> Dietrich | Crapalot: that's not a uniquely wormhole problem
  820. <21:53:13> [MCAV] Tim Nering: idk how said u can scan a citadel and find stuff. but hes high. citadel is invuln u cant see shit Markj2 Antollare > 20:52:10 Notify Target is invulnerable.
  821. <21:53:15> Seraph Razgriz: custum shared hangars
  822. <21:53:25> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: being able to share hangers betweens alts would be good
  823. <21:53:32> Braxus Deninard: tim it needs to be vulnerable
  824. <21:53:35> Braxus Deninard: to lock and ship scan
  825. <21:53:35> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: if you dont trust your directors
  826. <21:53:39> [P-NXT] IcarusN: I agree with that
  827. <21:54:11> [ARCLI] Calli: Once again. How does this bring more people to WH and generates more content?
  828. <21:54:20> LZHX | Ashy: corp wide defo
  829. <21:54:25> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: quality of life
  830. <21:54:27> [P-NXT] IcarusN: Citadel specific?
  831. <21:54:29> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: for everyone
  832. <21:54:36> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: make it less tedious
  833. <21:56:27> [MCAV] Arcander: I got here late. I assume somebody brought up alliance bookmarks?
  834. <21:56:32> [HPYWH] Areks: hmm
  835. <21:56:34> Maverick Klark: nope
  836. <21:56:36> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: not yet
  837. <21:57:55> Khelar: i doubt alliance bookmarks are ever gonna happen
  838. <21:58:16> [SHKL.]Jadiii: I just want corp bookmarks to show up within a few seconds of you making them
  839. <21:58:27> Axel Stenmark: [URL]http://www.strawpoll.me/10985488[/URL]
  840. <21:58:30> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: yes
  841. <21:58:30> [SOUND]Ronnie Cordova: thanks for running this, gotta run
  842. <21:58:34> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: a container in a corp hangar can be dragged by any member to its personal hangar... retrieving its password and whatnot...
  843. <21:58:34> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: I have one
  844. <21:58:39> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: I cant warp to my citadel
  845. <21:58:41> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: lol
  846. <21:58:47> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: rip
  847. <21:58:50> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: i have to warp to a undock bookmark
  848. <21:58:57> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: which is a pita
  849. <21:59:03> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: also the range you land at
  850. <21:59:05> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: should be doing that anyway
  851. <21:59:08> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: :p
  852. <21:59:16> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: otherwise u will get bubbled one day and be very sad
  853. <21:59:18> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: why do you land at end of tether range?
  854. <21:59:29> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: o i know
  855. <21:59:30> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: cause the radius is fat af
  856. <21:59:44> Slack Aurelian: steel i think its just like stations you land on the edge of the model radius or something like that
  857. <21:59:46> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: but i literally have to have a bookmark for each citadel
  858. <21:59:56> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: our corp bookmarks... RIP
  859. <21:59:56> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: We have 4 for each >.>
  860. <21:59:57> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: for alliance bm's they need to fix alliances
  861. <22:00:07> Maverick Klark: HACKEM
  862. <22:00:11> Trip: Let us hack them with analyzers
  863. <22:01:03> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: howabout X days with no dock/undock?
  864. <22:01:13> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: in wh's space you have loot if you kill citadels in wh's , in k-sapce there is no reason to kill em
  865. <22:01:16> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: then vuln timer grows
  866. <22:01:41> [MCAV] Arcander: alliance bookmarks I know is an old topic, but it's still very important
  867. <22:02:05> [WHBOO] Prayxxx: i thought they said that wont happen? alliance arent real
  868. <22:02:06> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: there is no alliance object in game - it's technically very difficult to do them
  869. <22:02:32> Maverick Klark: when i warp to a wh and i click jump and the hole despawns
  870. <22:02:35> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: EBR-88515 2016-07-16 Cosmic Signature Red Sensor Overlay Markers are missing
  871. <22:02:36> Refa: BUG: Warping to signature shortly after downtime instead of bookmarks.
  872. <22:02:37> Maverick Klark: :(
  873. <22:02:40> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: EBR-88513 2016-07-30 Solar System/Probe Map reverts signature progress when toggled
  874. <22:03:00> Seraph Razgriz: phantom sigs, no wh, but sigs stay
  875. <22:03:01> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: EBR-66563 2016-02-09 The Wormhole Has Collapsed
  876. <22:03:12> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: EBR-48016 2015-11-09 Wormhole Bug - The Wormhole Has Collapsed
  877. <22:03:20> [SHKL.]Jadiii: Corp bookmarks taking time to show up or needing a session change
  878. <22:03:25> [HPYWH] Areks: edit undo?
  879. <22:03:26> [SHKL.]Jadiii: screws us over while ganking
  880. <22:03:27> [HPYWH] Areks: kek
  881. <22:03:28> [SHKL.]Jadiii: sooo often
  882. <22:03:30> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: phantom sigs and bookmarks taking 5 minutes to show up.
  883. <22:03:42> BA Baracus: there is
  884. <22:03:47> BA Baracus: it's the rep symbol
  885. <22:04:00> BA Baracus: it doesn't update the drone hp window until you launch / recall them again
  886. <22:04:13> [SHKL.]Jadiii: ^
  887. <22:04:41> NoobMan: [URL]http://i.imgur.com/F11ky6N.jpg[/URL]
  888. <22:05:01> [SHKL.]Jadiii: I've had that
  889. <22:05:06> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: i was tethered on a WH
  890. <22:05:08> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: I've had that
  891. <22:05:16> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: i sat on the hole while tethered
  892. <22:05:25> [HPYWH] Areks: super tether.
  893. <22:06:42> [HPYWH] Areks: random decloaks
  894. <22:06:51> [HPYWH] Areks: that's another one.
  895. <22:07:12> [SHKL.]Jadiii: yeah
  896. <22:07:25> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: happens in shattereds alot
  897. <22:07:35> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: [URL]http://prnt.sc/bdlsta[/URL]
  898. <22:07:38> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: i had my cheetah decloak like 4 times in a row warping to empty planets
  899. <22:08:20> Seraph Razgriz: that sucks
  900. <22:08:22> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: [URL]http://prnt.sc/bpme4v[/URL]
  901. <22:08:24> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: another
  902. <22:08:30> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: some were cloaked
  903. <22:08:33> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: could still see em
  904. <22:08:34> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: burn to em
  905. <22:08:37> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: uncloack em
  906. <22:08:37> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: just makes the names really log.
  907. <22:08:58> [SHKL.]Jadiii: omg, just remembered we forgot to mention cloud brightness in C4 sites
  908. <22:09:04> [SHKL.]Jadiii: on the topic of suns
  909. <22:09:05> Maverick Klark: yo
  910. <22:09:06> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: clouds of deaaaath
  911. <22:09:10> Gorski Car: m8
  912. <22:09:10> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: im okay with that
  913. <22:09:11> Maverick Klark: some clouds are bright af
  914. <22:09:14> Gorski Car: thera sun
  915. <22:09:17> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: if they have a spy in a WH corp..
  916. <22:09:18> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: then
  917. <22:09:19> Gorski Car: brightest thing known to man
  918. <22:09:20> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: well
  919. <22:09:23> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: they earned it i guess
  920. <22:09:31> Gorski Car: yeah you should trust your people if they are in your wh
  921. <22:10:14> Lemming Alpha1dash1: [URL]http://i.imgur.com/E8Mf8hV.png[/URL] Thera sun :)
  922. <22:10:23> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: Gorski plz :D
  923. <22:10:27> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: GAS CLOUD DECLOAK
  924. <22:10:31> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: What if it's a freeport :P
  925. <22:10:33> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: can we nerf this?
  926. <22:10:40> Lemming Alpha1dash1: Isogen 5 ftw
  927. <22:10:41> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: i cant tackle shit if i get decloaked 35km out
  928. <22:10:46> NoobMan: [URL]http://updates.eveonline.com/date/2016-08-09/#3ak9Z[/URL]
  929. <22:10:56> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: gas clouds shouldnt decloak
  930. <22:11:01> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: its not a solid entity
  931. <22:11:13> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: deal with it :D
  932. <22:11:22> [V0LTA] Ransu Asanari: its good protection for ventures/prospect
  933. <22:11:24> muha/Shadow: [URL]https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/4xifc9/huge_performance_hit_around_new_clouds/[/URL]
  934. <22:11:29> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: DROP A CAN IN THE MIDDLE AND ORBIT IT
  935. <22:11:29> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: some combat sites have like 40km decloak spheres
  936. <22:11:32> [.A0E.] Tsukino Stareine: woops caps
  937. <22:11:45> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: yeah but its not just in Gas sigs
  938. <22:11:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: its even in combat/data/relic sites
  939. <22:12:12> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: i couldnt get a warpin on 2 tengus because i decloaked 55km out
  940. <22:12:16> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: C4 combat site gas clouds look like the sun for no reason^
  941. <22:12:17> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: next to nothing
  942. <22:12:27> [SHKL.]Jadiii: buttons are great
  943. <22:12:37> Selene Divine: they dont want to give becasue we always want more
  944. <22:12:39> Nick Jacob: I play eve for buttons!
  945. <22:12:42> Lemming Alpha1dash1: so many old wow players like buttons ;p
  946. <22:12:42> [.A0E.] Tanya Frost: buttons ftw
  947. <22:12:48> [HPYWH] Areks: mo'buttons
  948. <22:13:14> Nick Jacob: "nothing like pressing f1 :P"
  949. <22:13:17> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: I don't want to mess with any other settings though, except make gas clouds not a mini-sun in my combat site.
  950. <22:13:21> [SHKL.]Jadiii: burn the gas cloud away
  951. <22:13:32> Lemming Alpha1dash1: light a match
  952. <22:13:41> Trip: Make those sunglasses actually useful!
  953. <22:14:06> Lemming Alpha1dash1: tophat for some shade would be nice
  954. <22:14:23> [HRDKX] Heift: yea i almost never see the amount of people
  955. <22:14:25> Orange: that's because not init
  956. <22:15:33> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: [URL]http://prnt.sc/bpmfnc[/URL] was cloacked, uncloacked em, think it happened when warping off the forti when they warp at it, exactly when you warp away when they cloack you keep seeing them
  957. <22:15:59> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: but also had it like, oh their at custome roffice PX,
  958. <22:16:08> LZHX | Face: no thanks
  959. <22:16:32> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: [URL]http://prnt.sc/bpmi3i[/URL]
  960. <22:16:36> [.A0E.]Timothyr Black: chat log with em
  961. <22:17:29> Orange: YOU can ALWAYS assume THE KEEPSTAR has NOONE in it
  962. <22:17:31> Orange: promise
  963. <22:18:45> [.A0E.] DeathForMeh: *** THEORYCRAFT ALERT ***
  964. a ship that could work like jams (chance based) to disable use of capacitor injection on succesful chance would actually help on field to counter fax (since that is one of 2 problems to counter power of fax the rep power and cap we can't get rid of)
  965. we would have to make meaningful choices before we field fax with x type of fit regen/amount/injection
  966. just like before they were just cap amount and regen and we had to break that with neuts
  967. that is if CCP refuses to nefr theire power in any way that would help to balance wh fights without killing/majorly changing kspace usage
  968. thoughts?
  969. <22:19:14> LZHX | Face: its bad
  970. <22:19:15> LZHX | Robby Godfather: too strong
  971. <22:19:16> Trip: Would impact K-Space
  972. <22:19:16> LZHX | Face: its real bad
  973. <22:19:23> LZHX | Robby Godfather: would kill cap injected ships
  974. <22:19:30> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: Corp bookmark delay is cancer
  975. <22:19:37> [SHKL.]Jadiii: ^
  976. <22:19:46> [SHKL.]Jadiii: hey guys, caught a ship, got a bookmark on em, gank it
  977. <22:19:47> [SHKL.]Jadiii: oh wait
  978. <22:19:49> [SHKL.]Jadiii: it's not there yet
  979. <22:19:50> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: ^
  980. <22:19:52> Orange: bump the things more
  981. <22:19:57> Refa: Corp bookmark delay *is* awful... but the only way to fix that is to radically increase server demand.
  982. <22:20:13> [SHKL.]Jadiii: give it prioritization on load
  983. <22:20:16> Lemming Alpha1dash1: I'm chatting with my work in the meantime
  984. <22:20:16> [SHKL.]Jadiii: and np
  985. <22:20:23> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: but it kills the purpose of it sometime
  986. <22:20:43> [SHKL.]Jadiii: destroys on the fly corp bookmarks in fights
  987. <22:20:45> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: like, i should be able to quickly bookmark a hole and get people point to point quick
  988. <22:20:50> [SSC]Lisa Nardieu: the only idea i have with capital cap booster, give the cap other the cycle time instead of instantly, but i think its a bad idea
  989. <22:20:51> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: especially as a scoutr
  990. <22:20:53> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: *scout
  991. <22:21:07> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: Crest timeouts kills pathfinder every 4 hours
  992. <22:21:13> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: yes
  993. <22:21:15> Sullen Decimus: o7 guys sorry gotta run 20 min over though thanks for the feed back
  994. <22:21:17> [SHKL.]Jadiii: omg pathfiner crashaing
  995. <22:21:18> [SHKL.]Jadiii: cuz crest
  996. <22:21:19> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: sometimes every hour
  997. <22:21:19> [SHKL.]Jadiii: :/
  998. <22:21:24> [SHKL.]Keeperofthe7keys: yup
  999. <22:21:31> [.A0E.] DeathForMeh: @steel not entiirey wrong
  1000. <22:21:42> LZHX | Ashy: speak to your mapper devs
  1001. <22:21:49> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: its cresy
  1002. <22:21:52> [.A0E.] DeathForMeh: cause how to determinate the real rep power of dreads and fax now is assume you neuted out furing fight
  1003. <22:21:52> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: *crest
  1004. <22:22:01> Lemming Alpha1dash1: thanks for the CSM fire side chat o7
  1005. <22:22:02> [HPYWH] Areks: Make wormholes great again!
  1006. <22:22:02> [SHKL.]Steel Roamer: pathfinder claims Crest endpoint timeouts
  1007. <22:22:02> LZHX | Ashy: there may be things they can do to help though :)
  1008. <22:22:06> [.A0E.] DeathForMeh: and you count in usage of mods with time and cap inected/consumed
  1009. <22:22:12> [.A0E.] DeathForMeh: for consistance in your rep power
  1010. <22:22:13> [Y790] Kelsey Auditore: literally the only one from my corp who showed up :P
  1011. <22:22:31> Lemming Alpha1dash1: No Mans sky on PC hahahaha
  1012. <22:22:31> [TAKSH]unimatrix0030: many devs hate the crest instability
  1013. <22:22:47> Lemming Alpha1dash1: stick to eve atm
  1014. <22:24:01> [GRMBL]Chavez: thunderdome wormhole ^^
  1015. <22:24:05> LZHX | Face: connects to hk home everytime keepstar is vuln?
  1016. <22:24:06> Orange: \o/
  1017. <22:24:09> [HOLE] Julian Hertel: C5 with 5+ C5Static?
  1018. <22:24:34> [.A0E.] Tanya Frost: without the ability to anchor any type of structures
  1019. <22:24:42> [.A0E.] Tanya Frost: and no stations present
  1020. <22:25:40> LZHX | Face: LZHX#1
  1021. <22:25:46> LZHX | Ashy: ^
  1022. <22:26:03> LZHX | Robby Godfather: <
  1023. <22:26:12> [.A0E.] DeathForMeh: >
  1024. <22:26:12> LZHX | Ashy: v
  1025. <22:26:27> LZHX | Ashy: we did it reddit
  1026. <22:26:38> Maverick Klark: thx for fleet elo
  1027. <22:26:47> LZHX | Ashy: FC where is pap link
  1028. <22:26:56> Nick Jacob: no one attacks my bait drakes anymore :(
  1029. <22:26:59> LZHX | Robby Godfather: praise bob in local
  1030. <22:27:00> Maverick Klark: yo dbrb was p salty about pl
  1031. <22:27:01> Maverick Klark: like
  1032. <22:27:02> Maverick Klark: damn
  1033. <22:27:18> Nick Jacob: o7
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