[04/01/2013 14:55:59] *** Juan Calderón ha agregado a G??l?ø ***
[04/01/2013 14:56:15] *** Juan Calderón ha agregado a Dulaan ***
[04/01/2013 14:56:19] Juan Calderón: Hello again
[04/01/2013 14:56:34] G??l?ø: Hi
[04/01/2013 14:56:52] Dulaan: Hello, this time everything is working
[04/01/2013 14:57:15] Christopher Chia: Hi
[04/01/2013 14:57:24] Christopher Chia: By the way, I'm new to Skype :)
[04/01/2013 14:57:34] Christopher Chia: Been relying on MSN all the while
[04/01/2013 14:58:13] Christopher Chia: Gulio, u can understand what we are writing?
[04/01/2013 14:58:24] Christopher Chia: Let me introduce myself
[04/01/2013 14:58:48] Christopher Chia: I'm the owner for Tec Interactive, a game publisher registered in Singapore and also the publisher for Metin2
[04/01/2013 14:59:14] Christopher Chia: Juan is our Chief Technical Officer and he also double as an operation director for Metin2
[04/01/2013 14:59:29] G??l?ø: It's a honor to meet you
[04/01/2013 14:59:38] G??l?ø: and yes, i can understand all
[04/01/2013 14:59:45] Juan Calderón: Nice to meet you too :)
[04/01/2013 15:00:05] G??l?ø: i'm a python programmer and a client developer
[04/01/2013 15:00:30] Christopher Chia: Nice to meet u
[04/01/2013 15:00:51] Juan Calderón: I guess you already have heard of the project we are considering now
[04/01/2013 15:01:29] Dulaan: Yes, I told him pretty much everything about Metin2 PH
[04/01/2013 15:02:16] Juan Calderón: on the development side what we do basically is get Ymir content (which they send themselves)
[04/01/2013 15:02:28] Juan Calderón: and try to make something the players will like out of it.
[04/01/2013 15:02:47] Juan Calderón: We also fix bugs and create events
[04/01/2013 15:03:30] Juan Calderón: Im the leader of the development team and my colleagues are Tim Niederhausen and musicinstructor
[04/01/2013 15:03:39] Juan Calderón: I guess those names should sound familiar to you
[04/01/2013 15:03:50] G??l?ø: yes :)
[04/01/2013 15:04:37] Christopher Chia: Juan handles the technical part of the game while I overlook the GM Team who manage the community
[04/01/2013 15:05:11] Christopher Chia: About Metin2 Philippines, we have been talking to Ymir since late last year when they approached us in Singapore with a proposal to take up the license for Philippines.
[04/01/2013 15:06:16] Juan Calderón: There are some differences between running a private and official server you should be aware of
[04/01/2013 15:06:46] Christopher Chia: Juan will share with you the expectation from Ymir since we have been working with them for more than 3 years
[04/01/2013 15:07:21] Juan Calderón: First of all there is a 30% payment to Ymir from sales
[04/01/2013 15:07:59] Christopher Chia: 30% is inclusive of Value-Added Tax (VAT) and Withholding Tax
[04/01/2013 15:08:09] Juan Calderón: Second, all the earnings are clean and taxed
[04/01/2013 15:08:24] Juan Calderón: there is no black money involved anywhere
[04/01/2013 15:09:28] Dulaan: I see, and the fact that there are not black money is pretty much obvious. You would risk a lot I think
[04/01/2013 15:10:17] Christopher Chia: Tec Interactive and Ymir are both registered companies in their respective country and every month we have to submit tax filing to the Government. :)
[04/01/2013 15:10:40] Christopher Chia: Of course, there are still money left to be made as an official licensee for Metin2
[04/01/2013 15:11:10] Juan Calderón: Generally speaking, official server players spend more.
[04/01/2013 15:11:50] Christopher Chia: Ymir Entertainment used to be a small company with only 25 staff but in 2011, they were bought over by the 2nd largest Game Developer in Korea known as NHN Webzen. Right now they have more than 100 development staff who is working hard on updates as u can see from Gameforge and our server.
[04/01/2013 15:12:05] Dulaan: And of course official servers have more ways to spend money, like phone-based payments
[04/01/2013 15:12:21] Juan Calderón: We have a wide range of options
[04/01/2013 15:12:36] Christopher Chia: TEC has signed with every available payment option in SEA, EUROPE and North America.
[04/01/2013 15:12:38] Juan Calderón: Sponsorpay, Super Rewards, Paypal, Allopass and PSC
[04/01/2013 15:12:46] Juan Calderón: we have a contract with all those
[04/01/2013 15:13:35] Dulaan: That's great
[04/01/2013 15:13:45] Dulaan: It is very difficult to make it for a private server
[04/01/2013 15:13:50] Christopher Chia: What is the most common payment solution in Italy?
[04/01/2013 15:14:07] G??l?ø: postpay or paypal for the pserver
[04/01/2013 15:14:12] Dulaan: Probably Postepay, which is a visa payment
[04/01/2013 15:14:15] Dulaan: and paypal
[04/01/2013 15:14:21] Christopher Chia: I see
[04/01/2013 15:14:34] Christopher Chia: With Paypal, we do not have limitation on payment amount
[04/01/2013 15:14:47] Christopher Chia: Our contract with Paypal is a corporate account
[04/01/2013 15:15:08] Christopher Chia: I understand that most of the private server use an individual Paypal account for collection?
[04/01/2013 15:16:02] Christopher Chia: Anyway, we think that launching Metin2 PH now is a good timing because Ymir has a lot of new updates for the official licensees which includes a 5th character class known as the Wild Man.
[04/01/2013 15:16:14 | Editado 15:16:22] Dulaan: Each pserver uses a normal account, so it may be limited. Mine was limited for the first year, then (I don't remember how) it was upgraded
[04/01/2013 15:16:38] Juan Calderón: As for PSC, we can cash those directly without middlemen
[04/01/2013 15:16:42] Dulaan: Yes, the only problem is the condition about the ip block or the tagalog language...
[04/01/2013 15:16:56] Juan Calderón: We may think of some solution for that.
[04/01/2013 15:17:20 | Editado 15:17:23] Dulaan: in Italy PSC is not used a lot, but I think it is the most used payment method in Germany
[04/01/2013 15:17:21] Juan Calderón: Tagalog is not a good idea
[04/01/2013 15:17:39] Juan Calderón: Because we spent 3 years making a good english translation
[04/01/2013 15:17:44] Juan Calderón: which would go to waste
[04/01/2013 15:18:05] Juan Calderón: and its pointless because everyone in Philippines speaks english
[04/01/2013 15:18:25] Dulaan: Ah, I didn't know this
[04/01/2013 15:18:47] Juan Calderón: Gameforge translations are terrible.
[04/01/2013 15:18:54] Christopher Chia: In the event if Ymir agreed to let us run the server in English without any IP block base on mutual trust, we must be very careful because our license is only for Philippines.
[04/01/2013 15:18:56] Juan Calderón: We put a lot of effort into good english
[04/01/2013 15:19:36] Christopher Chia: Yesterday, you suggested to start a forum section for Metin2 PH in inforge which I think is not good because Gameforge will then complain to Ymir about our territory rights.
[04/01/2013 15:20:16] Christopher Chia: Instead, I think just the database of FL2 and Infinity would be good enough and slowly every Italian will soon know about Metin2 PH
[04/01/2013 15:20:18] Dulaan: Hm, inforge actually already have a section for all the foreign official server, KR and US included
[04/01/2013 15:20:25] Christopher Chia: Ah
[04/01/2013 15:21:17] Christopher Chia: Well, we just do not want to have problem with Ymir because during our first year as a publisher with them, we made them angry and they put an Ip block on our SG server.
[04/01/2013 15:21:45] Dulaan: I think they will open new threads on their own in inforge
[04/01/2013 15:22:17] Dulaan: Btw, my database has a lot of emails, they are not italians only
[04/01/2013 15:22:45] Dulaan: mainly italians, romanian and germans
[04/01/2013 15:22:50] Christopher Chia: Ah
[04/01/2013 15:23:26] Christopher Chia: And they can understand Italian language?
[04/01/2013 15:23:41] Juan Calderón: I think there are dual language servers in Italy
[04/01/2013 15:23:50] Dulaan: As for infinitymetin, we need to speak with them first.
[04/01/2013 15:23:50] Christopher Chia: I see
[04/01/2013 15:24:03] Christopher Chia: Gulio is part of Infinitymetin?
[04/01/2013 15:24:47] Dulaan: Yes, he is working there since december
[04/01/2013 15:25:11] G??l?ø: i've contact in many pserver, and yes, actually i work in infinitymetin staff
[04/01/2013 15:26:08] Juan Calderón: Well other differences are the content
[04/01/2013 15:26:30] Juan Calderón: we only publish Ymir's content, but adapted with our values and programming
[04/01/2013 15:26:54] Juan Calderón: we consider everything carefully to avoid upsetting game balance
[04/01/2013 15:27:30] Dulaan: I see
[04/01/2013 15:27:37] Juan Calderón: and try to reach the point where the game doesnt feel too easy nor too frustrating
[04/01/2013 15:28:01] Juan Calderón: there is a responsability towards the players
[04/01/2013 15:28:47] Dulaan: I see, this is hard and it takes a lot time, because of testing. But that's needed
[04/01/2013 15:29:33] Christopher Chia: In fact, Ymir took our work on the football field and they are now creating a much better concept.
[04/01/2013 15:29:40] Juan Calderón: In private servers its often a fight to see who has more updates without much consideration of what they add or substract from the game
[04/01/2013 15:30:15] Christopher Chia: By the way Juan, Dulaan told me yesterday that the p servers have only the 2011 files
[04/01/2013 15:30:24] Christopher Chia: All the latest file by Ymir are not valid to them
[04/01/2013 15:30:38] Juan Calderón: not valid?
[04/01/2013 15:30:53] Christopher Chia: Regarding the pet system, they use a walk around and is totally different from the original pet system that is developed by Ymir
[04/01/2013 15:31:02] Juan Calderón: yeah
[04/01/2013 15:31:04] Juan Calderón: and I guess
[04/01/2013 15:31:10] Juan Calderón: they dont have costumes eithe
[04/01/2013 15:31:25] G??l?ø: our version of game file is 2089
[04/01/2013 15:31:39] Juan Calderón: sorry for my ignorance but I havent logged to any other server in 2 years... just know what I read in forums
[04/01/2013 15:31:54] Juan Calderón: 2089 = 2010
[04/01/2013 15:31:59] G??l?ø: yes
[04/01/2013 15:32:01] Dulaan: lol
[04/01/2013 15:32:10] G??l?ø: many developer do a quest workaround
[04/01/2013 15:32:21] Dulaan: Though it was 2011, not 2010
[04/01/2013 15:32:23] G??l?ø: or rewrite part of code of the game file
[04/01/2013 15:32:32] Juan Calderón: hmm
[04/01/2013 15:32:35] G??l?ø: creating new function
[04/01/2013 15:32:35] Juan Calderón: well
[04/01/2013 15:32:47] Juan Calderón: its possible they are from early 2011
[04/01/2013 15:33:00] Juan Calderón: anyway
[04/01/2013 15:33:04] G??l?ø: but there aren't many that do this
[04/01/2013 15:33:06] Juan Calderón: there are many changes now
[04/01/2013 15:34:12] Dulaan: I see, so 2089 are very old, which is the latest version number?
[04/01/2013 15:34:46] Juan Calderón: hmm
[04/01/2013 15:35:35] Juan Calderón: im not sure, Tim is in charge of that part
[04/01/2013 15:35:57] Juan Calderón: of the game binaries I mean (because they also have our own patches in it)
[04/01/2013 15:36:04] Juan Calderón: but for example
[04/01/2013 15:36:08] Dulaan: Ah ok, I see
[04/01/2013 15:36:11] Juan Calderón: item and mob proto are not in db anymore
[04/01/2013 15:36:41] Dulaan: Well that's a big difference, lol
[04/01/2013 15:37:14] Juan Calderón: also the client doesnt reload the screen everytime you mount or dismount a horse
[04/01/2013 15:37:35] Juan Calderón: and we used compiled Python for root and uiscript
[04/01/2013 15:38:04] Dulaan: Nice
[04/01/2013 15:38:24] Juan Calderón: now we are rewriting the network code to allow CH switching ingame
[04/01/2013 15:38:59] G??l?ø: you can ask to ymir developer to do a client that supports python version > of 2.2?
[04/01/2013 15:39:38] Juan Calderón: ymirs strength is in creating graphics
[04/01/2013 15:39:52] Juan Calderón: dont expect programming wonders from them
[04/01/2013 15:40:13] Juan Calderón: but... we can talk about that with Tim later on
[04/01/2013 15:40:51] Dulaan: 2.2 is a very old version and it has not a lot of useful functions. It would be great to use the latest python version
[04/01/2013 15:42:19] Dulaan: What should we ask to infinitymetin owner?
[04/01/2013 15:42:31] Juan Calderón: Chris?
[04/01/2013 15:42:37] Christopher Chia: Yes
[04/01/2013 15:42:59] Christopher Chia: I suggest you can ask if they will be interested to join with you for Metin2 PH
[04/01/2013 15:43:33] Christopher Chia: Let them know the business opportunity as an official server where payment solution is not an issue and there will be guaranteed update from ymir
[04/01/2013 15:44:06] Christopher Chia: Such as new maps, new equipment, new gem socketing system and also a new character class coming out early this year.
[04/01/2013 15:44:31] Christopher Chia: Ymir has tighten their security feature to prevent leakage of their server files
[04/01/2013 15:44:57] Christopher Chia: Hence I think when that happens, p server may eventually loose out on the competition when they see the official servers having all the wonderful update.
[04/01/2013 15:45:46] Christopher Chia: The terms of collaboration has been shared with you yesterday. Right now we are waiting for Ymir to let us know if we can run the Metin2 PH service without IP block and in English language.
[04/01/2013 15:45:55] Christopher Chia: I guess they should be able to let us know by early next week.
[04/01/2013 15:46:22] Christopher Chia: If Metin2 PH goes well, other p server may want to join in and by then we can create Metin2 PH server 2, server 3 and so on for them.
[04/01/2013 15:47:53] Christopher Chia: From a business prospective, we will collect a License Fee from them since we are paying License Fee and royalty to Ymir. That should help p server to find a 2nd opportunity to become legalize and potentially make more money from Metin2
[04/01/2013 15:48:28] Dulaan: ah, so he will be a co-publisher, am I right?
[04/01/2013 15:48:51 | Editado 15:48:53] Dulaan: or just a game admin with a "salary"?
[04/01/2013 15:49:04] Christopher Chia: Co-publisher
[04/01/2013 15:49:37] Christopher Chia: Juan and our technical staff will work closely with Ymir on the updates while the partner can manage the community as Game Masters
[04/01/2013 15:50:00] Christopher Chia: You will have access to the CRM Tool to check daily revenue collection and CCU
[04/01/2013 15:51:15] Christopher Chia: At the last day of every month, our finance department will work out the profit share after deducting operation cost and royalty fee and send the 50/50 profit sharing via telegraph transfer to your designated bank account under contract fee since you do not have a registered company to receive collection.
[04/01/2013 15:51:41] Dulaan: Understood. I guess he need to take also all the team (GMs, etc)
[04/01/2013 15:51:46] Christopher Chia: Operation cost on the technical and backend structure will be borne by Tec Interactive
[04/01/2013 15:52:06] Christopher Chia: Yes, but make sure that the GMs are credible people with integrity
[04/01/2013 15:52:29] Christopher Chia: I'm worried about p servers because I have heard that there are many corruption issues in p servers
[04/01/2013 15:52:50] Christopher Chia: This must be avoided as news will spread and tarnish the reputation of the server and Tec Interactive
[04/01/2013 15:52:50] Dulaan: Yes, you're right. I will tell him to choose only the best
[04/01/2013 15:53:04] Christopher Chia: Yes, people who are mature and reliable
[04/01/2013 15:53:24] Christopher Chia: The Game Masters must not have player account
[04/01/2013 15:54:21] Dulaan: And how will him help metin2 become popular? I mean, he can't just say to all his players after for example closing the server: "Everyone, go there: www.metin2.ph"
[04/01/2013 15:54:39] Dulaan: metin2 ph become popular*
[04/01/2013 15:55:22] Christopher Chia: We can always offer a starter package for everyone in his server to join Metin2 PH
[04/01/2013 15:55:52] Christopher Chia: A one month starter package which includes the exp ring, thief glove, gold coin etc
[04/01/2013 15:56:12] Christopher Chia: Of course, he don't have to shut down his p server
[04/01/2013 15:56:43] Christopher Chia: If players think that they want to join an updated official server instead of a p server where updates are not guaranteed they can stay in the p server
[04/01/2013 15:57:23] Dulaan: Ok, he should make something similiar to our collaboration, back in 2010
[04/01/2013 15:57:27] Christopher Chia: I think a lot of players from the p server are already tempted when they saw the new maps which is on Close Beta at Gameforge test server
[04/01/2013 15:57:44] Christopher Chia: What was the collaboration?
[04/01/2013 15:58:08] Dulaan: We had a fast registration in our website for metin2sg
[04/01/2013 15:58:17] Dulaan: newage developed it
[04/01/2013 15:58:24] Christopher Chia: Ah
[04/01/2013 15:58:58] Dulaan: Of course he won't make a fast registration, but he'll advertise metin2 ph
[04/01/2013 15:59:12] Christopher Chia: He needs to also understand that players will only spend more money in an official server and not a p server :)
[04/01/2013 15:59:19] Dulaan: Ok
[04/01/2013 16:00:39] Dulaan: One last thing, about investment: Does he need to invest the exactly half of what I pay (so 12500 me, 12500 him), or can he invest a different % ?
[04/01/2013 16:01:32] Christopher Chia: I suggest that you start Metin2 PH server 1 first
[04/01/2013 16:01:48] Christopher Chia: Then when server 1 has begun, he can start server 2 so there will be no dispute about profit
[04/01/2013 16:02:12] Christopher Chia: Yes, I think it is only right that he will pay the same amount as you since the license fee for Metin2 isn't cheap
[04/01/2013 16:02:31] Christopher Chia: In 2009, we paid 300,000 USD for Metin2 SG
[04/01/2013 16:03:09] Christopher Chia: We managed to drive a good deal with Ymir for just 50,000 USD convincing them that Philippines is a poor country and the revenue will be small
[04/01/2013 16:03:24] Christopher Chia: License Fee is base on territory
[04/01/2013 16:03:46] Christopher Chia: For countries such as Germany and US, you can imagine how expensive the License Fee will be :)
[04/01/2013 16:03:51] Dulaan: Wait, licensee fee is for only one server? So if we want to make a server2, we will need to pay again 50k usd?
[04/01/2013 16:04:07] Dulaan: Yes, gameforge paid a lot lol
[04/01/2013 16:04:12] Christopher Chia: Not 50k
[04/01/2013 16:04:19] Christopher Chia: We will share half of the fee
[04/01/2013 16:04:39] Christopher Chia: But if any p server want to join, we shall make them pay 25k and I can share part of it with you
[04/01/2013 16:04:59] Christopher Chia: If they don't put in cash commitment, I'm worry that they will not be serious :)
[04/01/2013 16:05:21] Christopher Chia: However, if they are committed to an investment, they will understand what it takes for that money to grow
[04/01/2013 16:05:29] Christopher Chia: By the way, License is for 3 + 2 years
[04/01/2013 16:05:55] Christopher Chia: After 3 years, Ymir will counter offer if we would like to sign an extension contract and let us know how much License Fee we have to pay
[04/01/2013 16:06:27] Christopher Chia: If we can show them a good result, it is likely that they will not ask for more License Fee after the 3rd year :)
[04/01/2013 16:06:43] Dulaan: Ok, great
[04/01/2013 16:07:49] Dulaan: If infinitymetin doesn't want to invest at the beginning, what can we do? I mean, what if he say that he wants to do it but accepting only a salary, not a % of the profits
[04/01/2013 16:08:12] Christopher Chia: We can discuss further on that.
[04/01/2013 16:08:23] Dulaan: Ok
[04/01/2013 16:08:43] Dulaan: Now he's offline, me and Giulio will speak to him asap
[04/01/2013 16:09:04] Christopher Chia: It is still early. :)
[04/01/2013 16:09:19] Christopher Chia: I will speak with you again next week once I get a final reply from Ymir
[04/01/2013 16:09:52] Christopher Chia: During this time, if u have any question, u can come to me or Juan
[04/01/2013 16:10:27] Dulaan: Ah, ok. Then, I'll wait
[04/01/2013 16:10:56] Christopher Chia: Yes, wait for us to get an answer from Ymir first as right now we are speaking with them regarding the issue of Ip block and language version ;)
[04/01/2013 16:12:07] Dulaan: But, why they already let you have metin2.sg without ip block (even if you already had a fight for that) and in english language? It doesn't have any sense, lol
[04/01/2013 16:12:51] Christopher Chia: Actually, first 2 years of Metin2 SG has an IP block but our staff created an anti-block client to let users bypass the authentication server.
[04/01/2013 16:13:25] Christopher Chia: When NHN Webzen bought over Ymir Entertainment, we negotiated with the new owner and they thought that there is no IP block in our server
[04/01/2013 16:14:00] Dulaan: Ah, ok
[04/01/2013 16:14:28] Christopher Chia: IP block is very sensitive to Ymir because they do not want to offend their biggest customer which is Gameforge
[04/01/2013 16:14:51] Christopher Chia: Worse come worse we will do a multi-language client :)
[04/01/2013 16:15:48] Dulaan: And that's great, the multilanguage client is one of the best solution
[04/01/2013 16:15:53] G??l?ø: And one question...Exactly, what role should I have in Metin2 PH, and how do I'll get paid?
[04/01/2013 16:16:23] Christopher Chia: Ah I believe you will be with Dulaan in this project and maybe share the profit with him?
[04/01/2013 16:16:35] Christopher Chia: I will let you work out with him on this matter
[04/01/2013 16:17:14] Dulaan: Ok
[04/01/2013 16:17:32] Dulaan: will we work closely with ymir programmers or we will work on our own?
[04/01/2013 16:18:50] Christopher Chia: Juan and Tim will work with Ymir programmers on the updates. Gulio can probably work with Juan and Tim if they want to tweak the update to make it better for the players. As for you, you would need to gather one or 2 GM to manage the community and handle report.
[04/01/2013 16:20:05] Christopher Chia: I can share with you what are the necessary things to do next week after confirmation has been made with Ymir.
[04/01/2013 16:20:36] Dulaan: I see, we need to speak about it later, because a lot may change, of course (Mainly because of the infinitymetin team, they may have other developers)
[04/01/2013 16:21:30] G??l?ø: there is only one other developer
[04/01/2013 16:21:38] G??l?ø: in infinitymetin
[04/01/2013 16:23:06] Christopher Chia: Actually, updates are all from Ymir so there is very little or almost no backend job necessary since we have Juan and Tim who can handle that portion.
[04/01/2013 16:23:14] Christopher Chia: Ah, the updates from Ymir are in Korean test
[04/01/2013 16:23:15] Christopher Chia: text
[04/01/2013 16:23:24] Christopher Chia: We have to translate it to English :)
[04/01/2013 16:25:54] Dulaan: Hope you already have someone that can do it, lol
[04/01/2013 16:30:45] Christopher Chia: We have a friend from Korea who can help us.
[04/01/2013 16:31:02] Christopher Chia: Alright Dulaan and Gulio, it was nice speaking to both of you.
[04/01/2013 16:31:20] Christopher Chia: We will catch up again next week and hopefully by that time we have confirmation and good news from Ymir :)
[04/01/2013 16:32:06] G??l?ø: it was a pleasure :)
[04/01/2013 16:32:10] Dulaan: Ok, Hope everything'll go well
[04/01/2013 16:32:25] Dulaan: We'll wait for the ymir reply too