Umineko episode 4 notes

- So Ange is there from the beginning.
- The time freezing can be explained as her looking at everything from the future, like literally looking at photos
- like a marathon runner on a certain caramel box... I wonder which brand is referenced here
- Oh nice, Ronove tricked Beatrice
- Ange truly is embracing those cheesy one-liners
- so she introduces herself as Gretel to prevent timey-wimey confusion
- Ange magically talking to Maria = Ange imagining how it'd be like actually talking to her
- actually makes sense that Maria's a fan of Magical Girl stuff when her image of a witch is quite similar to that
- "The fact that she borrowed the name of a character she liked was as innocent and cute as you'd expect of someone of that age" and look at us, still doing the same thing with nicknames or character names
- ah yes, the order that exists in chaos
- this is kinda ironic, but I really hope nothing happens to that stuffed animal
- magic is somewhat similar to imagination
- We can assume that Ange's life sucks no matter if someone comes back or not, since the family on her mother's side are described as strict
- heh, Ange's sly
- oh wow, the Sumadera family seems to be just like the Ushiromiya family
- ...is Ange jumping down stuff going to be a theme
- wait, Ange's, uhm, hobby of jumping down things is a nice contrast to Battler's fear of heights (vehicles technically, but you catch my drift)
- Really, Ange seems to be opposite to Battler in many regards. This'll make for some interesting interaction later on
- so it's actually good of us as forum community to develop multiple theories, in case one of them gets blasted
- "difficulty depends on how you fought before" i.e. if you've been drilled to make multiple theories before, you'll have it easier, but if you're just now starting to think of more than just one solution, you'll have it hard.
- BLUE "Ushiromiya Kinzo is already dead. Therefore, the true number of people on the island is 17! By adding an unknown person X to that, it becomes 18 people. By supposing that this person X exists, the crimes will be possible even if all 17 people have alibis!" while this solves one of the mysteries of the last game, it also is an asset for this game.
- Kinzo looks... weird; but only in the new version, funnily enough
- Also apparently "It's useless" is a family catchphrase?
- oh, correction, I guess, Goldsmith
- Is Kinzo himself going to show the letter of the witch this time? At the very least, he most likely plans to acknowledge it himself
- The rose scene most likely happened again
- So are we again exploring the question "What is love?"
- huh. instead they're saying 'magic'
- I liked the original plushie more :P
- so ep 1 and ep 2 are those two diaries, ep 3 is more in line with what actually happened and ep 4 is I don't know?
- He already killed all his chances with calling her Sumadera. She is an Ushiromiya, after all
- Although she might have used her other family name as an alias
- alias it is
- Sumadera family is actually a possible 18th/19th person. They definitely have a motive
- Mariage Sorcière is the alliance of witches under Beatrice's name, more or less
- part of that alliance: Virgilia, Beato, Maria, Ange
- So the seven stakes really look different
- it is one thing to imagine a friend and know it's your imagination
- it is an entirely different and more complicated thing to imagine a friend and convince yourself that this is no mere imagination
- Mammon: "But eventually, you'll throw that friend away. After all, ..." was she about to say something of the future of even 1998?
- honestly, seeing her treatment it's easy to see that Ange decided to commit suicide. That she actually survived is a different topic
- I wonder if that one scene of Maria and Ange saying that Sakutaro is only a stuffed animal was actually a scene between 9 year old Maria and 6 year old Ange...
- welp, this game is thorough with its deaths...
- Ange has truly managed to be on both sides at the same time
- basically, she now looks at both sides from a third perspective
- So Sakutarou's death caused the "Kihihihi" Maria we all know and love
- Oh, this time it really was Kinzo who gave the umbrella. Interesting. No word of a letter this time though
- The option of killing Kinzo to stop the ceremony is new
- okay, now this is interesting. Because the theory of Virgilia = Kumasawa is harder to explain that way
- Gaap's the 33rd if anyone's curious
- Maria's probably going to be endlessly killing Rosa, because if I have learned one thing, then it's that revenge doesn't get rid of the sadness, no matter how often you kill
- ...So Maria's "Kihihi" when she's mad at someone is her imagining killing that person over and over?
- So we have a hidden room now as well
- 07151129 together with a magnetic card and a key A112: so that 8-digit number is a PIN to a safe deposit-box at a bank
- send to Nanjo's son, contents a lot of cash
- A113 to Kumasawa's son, contents the same
- another key to Ange
- was it her returning the already collected interest, since Eva won the game?
- what the hell did Ange see god damn cliffhangers
- the children's tests: In order two gain two, sacrifice one
- 1. your life
- 2. your most needed's life
- 3. everyone else's lives
- if you don't choose, all the above are lost
- considering her psyche, this test is probably easy for Maria
- from 410's reasoning, choosing the one you love, changed to choosing the memories of the one you loved: would actually be reasonable, because after forgetting that, you don't remember it at all, so it would be an "Ignorance is bliss" sort of deal
- Virgilia is cracking a mackerel joke
- she really seems to be Kumasawa
- okay, seriously, where is this going with the 4th wall break
- oh this was counting loser flags!
- huh, Battler's love is concealed to us
- RED: "Six years ago, no person called Beatrice existed for me."
- RED: "The sin I am now demanding that you remember is not between Ushiromiya Battler and Beatrice."
- RED: "Ushiromiya Battler has a sin."
- RED: "Because of your sin, people die." this seems to go in the direction of acknowledging the witch, but...
- RED: "Due to your sin, a great many humans of this island die. No one escapes, all die."
- so the motive is connected to something Battler did six years ago
- He is tasked to repeat that he's Asumu's son
- since this is most likely ending in his disappearance, this is not the case
- He actually is Kyrie's son and she probably swapped the babies and Asumu had the miscarriage
- "Including other people was our first mistake" if Battler is swapped later, was the original Battler part of Mariage Sorcière?
- Maria being able to stop saying 'uu' on a whim is now easily explained
- How was Sakutaro brought back? I'm guessing Ange made a new one going from the vivid descriptions in Maria's diary
- we already know that the gardening shed can be easily broken into and that there are more locks inside
- RED: "Kanon is dead. Among the five people in Kyrie's group, he was the first to die. In short, he was the 9th victim."
- Second game, Natsuhi's room, RED: "All of the master keys were under Rosa's control!"
- BLUE: "Aunt Rosa handed a key over to culprit X by some method, assisting in the closed room murder! And after that, she retrieved the key by a similar method!"
- third game, everything up to but not including Nanjo, BLUE: "Aunt Eva is the culprit."
- BLUE: "The murder of Doctor Nanjo can be explained with an 18th unknown person X!"
- RED: "George did not go down the stairs of the guesthouse."
- RED: "All windows and doors leading to the outside were locked from the inside. Furthermore, it is impossible to break those from the outside!" someone assisted
- BLUE: "In that case, everything works out as long as someone locked the window after George-aniki escaped through it!"
- fourth game, BLUE: "The 18th person X went wild with a gun and killed everyone [in the dining hall]. As for the pitfalls, there's a chance that pitfalls were truly hidden there, and it's possible using Kyrie-san's theory, supposing that poison dart-shooting device X, which can knock out a person instantly, exists. The murders of George-aniki, Jessica, and those that escaped from the dungeon can also be explained with guns, just like the dining hall."
- RED: "All of those who met at the family conference acknowledged the presence of Kinzo!" doesn't mean that it was actually Kinzo
- BLUE: "That Grandfather was a different person, a body double. A different person the relatives mistook for Grandfather!"
- RED: "No person would mistake Ushiromiya Kinzo by sight. No matter what disguise might be used, they would not mistake Ushiromiya Kinzo by sight."
- BLUE: "In the second game, when you announced with the red truth that there were five master keys, even though there could have been more than five in the first game, you changed the premises of the later games. So, it's possible that Kinzo's life or death status was changed for the 4th game alone. Therefore, Kinzo's presence in the fourth game doesn't serve as prove that he was present in the previous games...! Therefore, even if we suppose the six murders in the dining hall were carried out by Grandfather, it contradicts nothing!"
- RED: "Kinzo's life or death status is the same at the start of all four games. The setup was not different for the fourth game alone."
- BLUE: "My theory's that the name of Kinzo gets passed on as the title of the Ushiromiya Family Head! Ushiromiya Kinzo was already dead. And he passed 'that name' onto someone else! Everyone acknowledged that!! That way, 'all those who met at the family conference acknowledged the presence of Kinzo'!! There wasn't even any need for someone to disguise themselves as Grandfather. Because everyone acknowledged a new 'Kinzo'! So 'they didn't actually mistake Kinzo by sight'!! As long as this theory is not denied, nothing can change the fact that you're dead!!!"
- RED: "Kinzo is already dead at the starting time for all games! Before now, I have proclaimed that no more than 18 humans exist on this island. I will lower that by one for Kinzo! No more than 17 humans exist on this island!! That excludes any 18th person. In short, this 18th person X does not exist!! This applies to all games!!" there existed theories that didn't need an extra person for any mystery from the first three games
- sorry, I'm gonna stop writing most of the exchange down
- final mystery: How did Battler die as the last one?