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  1. [13:56] Gentle Heron: White says to T to start as the sim is full.
  2. [13:56] White Lebed: let me post the intro for those who came late
  3. [13:56] Gentle Heron: T introduces himself as Tom Hale
  4. [13:56] White Lebed: Hello, everybody! thank you for coming to this special meeting. Today we invited artists and builders who are not happy with the viewer 2.0 and have specific suggestions. You will have a chance to talk directly to T Linden - the VP of Product from Linden Lab who is managing the team which created the viewer.
  5. This is a professional meeting. I hope it will bring new ideas and improve mutual understanding between LL and the art community. To achieve that we must follow certain procedure.
  6. Please, IM me your specific questions and suggestions. I will copy paste them on a notecard and send it to T Linden. He will answer question by question. You can comment about the topic T is discussing, but you can't introduce any new questions in local chat - just IM me if you want to ask something. Please, type questions in form ready for copying - I will not have time to edit them.
  8. We understand you have serious issues with 2.0 and you feel so strong about it that you found time to come here, but it is v
  9. [13:56] Gentle Heron: T: a bit about himself.
  10. [13:57] Orange Planer: I've spent the last 15 year of my life creating software.
  11. [13:57] Orange Planer: I've worked on illustration tools like Freehand, imaging tools like Fireworks.
  12. [13:57] Orange Planer: HTML authoring tools like DreamWeaver, animation tools like Flash
  13. [13:57] Orange Planer: And don't take this the wrong way, but a couple of failed 3D authoring tools as well.
  14. [13:58] Orange Planer: White's telling me to take the stage, so I will.
  15. [13:58] Orange Planer: OK, I came to Linden because I was drawn to the creative community of residents.
  16. [13:58] White Lebed: please, welcome - T Linden
  17. [13:58] Orange Planer: And the expressive power of 3D.
  18. [13:58] Orange Planer: And the novelty of a b usiness that enabled people to create things and sell them directly.
  19. [13:59] T Linden: lol banana
  20. [13:59] Orange Planer: Someone asked if I was chewing on a gerbil, but I haven't had lunch, sorry, it was a banana.
  21. [13:59] Orange Planer: The first task I was given when I cdame to Linden was to work on the next generation viewer with a goal of enabling a larger
  22. [13:59] Orange Planer: audience of people to access the richness and creativity of Second Life.
  23. [13:59] Orange Planer: And we started by studying users as they came in to Second Life.
  24. [13:59] Orange Planer: The numbers are staggering.
  25. [14:00] Orange Planer: If there are 100 people starting in Second Life, at the end of one year there will be one left.
  26. [14:00] Orange Planer: That's not a great experience.
  27. [14:00] Orange Planer: Nor does it give content creators a great platform to share their
  28. [14:00] Orange Planer: creativity and creations.
  29. [14:00] Orange Planer: When we studied some of the reasons why
  30. [14:00] Orange Planer: we began to see some of the things that we thought were important for us to evolve.
  31. [14:01] Orange Planer: One was the complexity of the experience.
  32. [14:01] Orange Planer: Two was the degree to which the experience drew on things that people already knew about.
  33. [14:01] Orange Planer: Three was the interaction between 2D and 3D experience elements, for lack of a better word.
  34. [14:01] Orange Planer: Most of the users who joined Second Life for the first time understand how to use the Web.
  35. [14:02] Orange Planer: There are 2 billion people who use the Web on a regular basis.
  36. [14:02] Orange Planer: Our goal is to introduce to those users the wonder, glory, immersion, power, experience of a rich 3D virtual world.
  37. [14:02] Orange Planer: Without losing them along the way.
  38. [14:02] Orange Planer: We started by trying to solve a few critical problems.
  39. [14:03] Orange Planer: The first was to simplify the experience.
  40. [14:03] Orange Planer: One was to the overload of managing multiple windows.
  41. [14:03] Orange Planer: The second was to reduce the menu complexity.
  42. [14:03] Orange Planer: Viewer 1.23 has upward of 500 individual eleements.
  43. [14:03] Orange Planer: The menus that were most frequently used were side by side with menus that were not frequently used.
  44. [14:04] Orange Planer: The third was to build an information architecture.
  45. [14:04] Orange Planer: The fourth was to reduce communications confusion about public and private conversations.
  46. [14:04] Orange Planer: Many new uesrs didn't know who was talking or chatting with them and they didn't know if aybody would hear what they were saying.
  47. [14:04] Orange Planer: And the last was to simply navigation in the virtual world.
  48. [14:04] Orange Planer: \Now, in trying to solve those goals we also tried to deliv er improvements for existing users.
  49. [14:04] Orange Planer: We wanted to make it easier to change outfits.
  50. [14:05] Orange Planer: Make it easier to find cool places they had never visited through navigation and bookmark management.
  51. [14:05] Orange Planer: we wanted to increase the ability of people to express themselves with tattoos and alpha masking.
  52. [14:05] Orange Planer: And we wanted to introduce a new form of content to the world in the form of shared medial.
  53. [14:05] Orange Planer: media
  54. [14:05] Orange Planer: At the same time, we knew that Viewer 2, at least in its first instance,
  55. [14:05] Orange Planer: would be optimized for new users.
  56. [14:06] Orange Planer: And that we wanted to preserve choice for existing users.
  57. [14:06] Orange Planer: Because we couldn't solve every problem for everyone at the same time.
  58. [14:06] Orange Planer: It may surprise you to learn that we doubled the size of the viewer team in order to take a big leap forward and
  59. [14:06] Orange Planer: lengthened the product lifecycle to almost a year so that we could make some material changes.
  60. [14:06] Orange Planer: And, as you guys will testify, material changes can introduce risk.
  61. [14:07] Orange Planer: One lesson I've learned, having redesigned Freehand, Flash, Acrobat, is that change for existing users particularly users who create content
  62. [14:07] Orange Planer: and particularly users who make a living from that,
  63. [14:07] Orange Planer: is very hard.
  64. [14:07] Orange Planer: So you have my apologies in advance.
  65. [14:08] Orange Planer: We hope to mitigate that difficulty by making sure that third party viewers and Viewer 1.23 would remain available until we felt confident that we cdould make Viewer 2 meeting the needs of everyone who needed to use it.
  66. [14:08] Orange Planer: That may be Version 2.5, or 2.7, or 3.0, but when it happens, I think we'll all know.
  67. [14:08] Orange Planer: And for this coming year of 2010, our focus is shifting from simply the new users to residents who are more advanced in their usage.
  68. [14:09] Orange Planer: And starting to shift our focus from the Land experience like Linden Homes to things like the content creaqtion, merchant, avatar creation experiences.
  69. [14:09] Orange Planer: So we're shifting our focus from the new user to deeper in the resident lifecycle.
  70. [14:09] Orange Planer: But before we do that we need to take some steps to address some of the feedback we've heard about Viewer 2.
  71. [14:09] Orange Planer: So let me shift gears and talk a little about the things we've heard.
  72. [14:10] Orange Planer: Things we've heard include "I'd like pan and orbit controls on screen at the sme time"
  73. [14:10] Orange Planer: And if folks don't jump into chat we'll be able to make this more real-time.
  74. [14:10] Orange Planer: "I'd like the righ thand panel to float."
  75. [14:11] Orange Planer: We've heard folks would like ctrl-alt-f1 to hide the total UI for machinimists.
  76. [14:11] Orange Planer: We've heard a lot about folks wanting search and events back at parity with 1.23.
  77. [14:11] Orange Planer: We've heard lots of requests for settings around shared media and controls around shared media.
  78. [14:11] Orange Planer: We've heard about people wanting the build tool back in the context menus.
  79. [14:11] Orange Planer: We'/ve heard requests for customization of the bottom bar, adding buttons into the bottom bar.
  80. [14:11] Orange Planer: we've heard requests to make the side panel so it doesn't move the world when it moves out.
  81. [14:12] Orange Planer: Anecdote: we tested both scenarios and the user feedback when we tested it was mixed on both, and we made a choice, but I think we should provide the option.
  82. [14:12] Orange Planer: We heard feedback about uploading assets.
  83. [14:12] Orange Planer: We heard feedback around this sense of the monitor being crowded.
  84. [14:12] Orange Planer: Interesting data point here, and I'll ask it as a question.
  85. [14:13] Orange Planer: "What percentage of SL users do you think that are on monitors that are 1024x768?", which is the smallest configuration that you can comfortably use V2.
  86. [14:13] Orange Planer: The answer is about 20%.
  87. [14:13] Orange Planer: everybody else is on a larger monitor.
  88. [14:13] Orange Planer: Shocking, I know.
  89. [14:14] Orange Planer: We also heard lots of requests around performance.
  90. [14:14] Orange Planer: Around the use of keyboard shortcuts.
  91. [14:14] Orange Planer: I want to answer, that's Second Life data.
  92. [14:14] Orange Planer: The engineering lead on the viewer, his sister is deaf.
  93. [14:14] Orange Planer: We'v eheard about accessibility concerns, the dark UI, working with screen readers, and we take that quite seriously.,
  94. [14:14] Orange Planer: So we take accessibility very seriously.
  95. [14:14] Orange Planer: And one of the other things that we've heard and I think this is right
  96. [14:14] Orange Planer: is that there's a tremendous amount of change in viewer 2 and
  97. [14:15] Orange Planer: that the learning curve of transitioning from 1.23 to Viewer 2 was too much.
  98. [14:15] Orange Planer: My personal experience with this is watching the Lindens who had been using the product Second Life for several years and had grown up with it.
  99. [14:16] Orange Planer: And one of the moments of kind of increasing confidence for us was when one of the most committed, most curmudgeonly, most unwilling to let go of 1.23 came over and said that Viewer 2 was heading in the right direction.
  100. [14:16] Orange Planer: And watching those Lindens learn how to use Viewer 2 and explore some of the new capabilities, being able to access their teleport history, access the browser b ar by typing text, manage public/private conversations,
  101. [14:16] Orange Planer: it felt like we were at the beginning of something good.
  102. [14:16] Orange Planer: Now, that doesn't mean that Viewer 2 has to be the only way you access Second Life.
  103. [14:17] Orange Planer: Third party viewers, mobile viewers, text based viewers, Linden viewers,
  104. [14:17] Orange Planer: I think of the entire viewing experience and that there will probably be in the future be a wide rang eof ways people access, even wider than today.
  105. [14:17] Orange Planer: I was very happy to see that Emerald got their viewer into compliance with our third party policy and enter their viewer into the registry.
  106. [14:18] Orange Planer: adnd to put your fears at rest, those choices will always be available, because
  107. [14:18] Orange Planer: a choice of viewers means that particular problems will be better solved.
  108. [14:18] Orange Planer: For example,
  109. [14:18] Orange Planer: and puts more real estate ot the features they need.
  110. [14:18] Orange Planer: there probably should b ea machinimist viewer that puts the kind of features macinimists want at the top of the information architecture
  111. [14:19] Orange Planer: There probably should be a content creator viewer.
  112. [14:19] Orange Planer: There problably should be an accessibility viewer.
  113. [14:19] Orange Planer: And it's probably the only way to get there is to have third parties as well as Linden creating the viewing experience.,
  114. [14:19] Orange Planer: Now, we can't allow third party viewers to undermine the Second Life ecosystem.
  115. [14:20] Orange Planer: As the third party viewer policy makes clear, if you make a viewer that violates the terms of service, then that viewer cannot be allowed into the registry and
  116. [14:20] Orange Planer: we want to make sure that all the people who are building viewers are helping to protect your intellectual property and to protect the integrity of the Second Life experience.
  117. [14:20] Orange Planer: I'd like to turn to our roadmap for content creators.
  118. [14:21] Orange Planer: One of the most important things about Second Life is the wonderful experiences that are created, like this playa around us with its sculptures, portapotties, rocks, sky...
  119. [14:21] Orange Planer: And we believe that media, shared media,
  120. [14:21] Orange Planer: opens up a whole new world of expression and we're excited to see what creators do with that.
  121. [14:22] Orange Planer: It's not just for opening up your Facebook page on a prim.
  122. [14:22] Orange Planer: I've seen some amazing inworld experiences where animations, flash content, video are part of an immersive experience, more like performance art than Facebook on a prim.
  123. [14:22] Orange Planer: I've seen control panels that enable anyone who knows how to click on a web page to control the color and texture of a sofa.
  124. [14:23] Orange Planer: Those of you who have aLinden home have seen the control panel where you can change the color and textures of your home.
  125. [14:23] Orange Planer: And I am certain that the creators in Second Life has much to show us about what shared media
  126. [14:23] Orange Planer: (lost sound)
  127. [14:23] Roberto Salubrius: more expresive
  128. [14:23] Roberto Salubrius: the next,,,
  129. [14:23] Roberto Salubrius: just a sound check
  130. [14:24] Joshua Philgarlic: I'm still recording.
  131. [14:24] Roberto Salubrius: thx for picking up on the transcription
  132. [14:24] Orange Planer: Hydra, can you pick it up?
  133. [14:24] Hydra Shaftoe: The next thing I want to talk about is the import of mesh files created in authoring tools like those created in 3DSmax or maya, or any tool that can support the export of Collada
  134. [14:25] Hydra Shaftoe: This is not something that we do lightly
  135. [14:25] Hydra Shaftoe: We need to manage performance issues. we need to think hard about how much content
  136. [14:25] Hydra Shaftoe: gets into second life that's not6 created by the creators of second life. We need to think hard about the system around content, and how we manage that
  137. [14:26] Hydra Shaftoe: But, we think this is potentially a revolution in the kinds of experience that can be created in second life, and potentially a great leap forward for content creators
  138. [14:26] Hydra Shaftoe: That being said, we will not suprise you with this
  139. [14:27] Hydra Shaftoe: Our time line for this is later this year, and we will go through a period of beta, public beta, to make sure that we have the system right
  140. [14:27] Hydra Shaftoe: And we need to think hard abgout the ways that we segment the kinds of experince in second life, based on the kind of hardware a user has
  141. [14:27] Hydra Shaftoe: And amnage that experience for users
  142. [14:27] Hydra Shaftoe: Just as we try to make sure that adult content doesnt show up next to the world health organization's HQ, by creating a content called Zindra
  143. [14:28] Hydra Shaftoe: maybe we will manage the experience for people on (indecipherable)
  145. [14:28] Hydra Shaftoe: maybe will will manage the experience for people on low end machines
  146. [14:29] Hydra Shaftoe: so as for viewer 2, what should you expect? we're planning on a viewer 2.1 release for the summer
  147. [14:29] Hydra Shaftoe: many of the things I discussed are on the list. one thing about software is that you dont always get everything at once, but we are working hard to make viewer 2 work for those who want shard media, browser based navigation, and those of us who want it for other reasons
  148. [14:29] Hydra Shaftoe: we want to provide you with a choice
  149. [14:29] Hydra Shaftoe: And now ill start to field some of your questions
  150. [14:30] Hydra Shaftoe: I will paste them in chat and respond to them
  151. [14:30] T Linden: [13:19] Talvin Muircastle: For T: In the 2.0 Script Editor, you removed many of the line numbers and made it more difficult to read the text. This can't be "to make it easier for the new users": new users do not script. Why did you not retain the old look and feel of the Script Editor?
  152. [14:30] Talvin MuircastleTalvin Muircastle would not call it an "update".
  153. [14:31] Hydra Shaftoe: For the script editor, I dont think we made a conscious effort to change that
  154. [14:31] Hydra Shaftoe: That is something we should revisit
  155. [14:31] T Linden: [13:19] Raul Crimson: Hello, White, i have a comment-question: "I'm a user of 2.0, since most of my creation is related with SLphotography my issue is related with camera use and the new "View" control, the way it works, the fact you need to move in tabs to control camera maked it sometimes annoying and hard to use. Are there any plans to change the "View" controls?" Thanks
  156. [14:31] Hydra Shaftoe: *heavy breatheing*
  157. [14:31] T Linden: [13:19] Raul Crimson: Hello, White, i have a comment-question: "I'm a user of 2.0, since most of my creation is related with SLphotography my issue is related with camera use and the new "View" control, the way it works, the fact you need to move in tabs to control camera maked it sometimes annoying and hard to use. Are there any plans to change the "View" controls?" Thanks
  159. [14:32] T Linden: 3:33] Martin Luxor: Hi White, I would like to propose the changes shown in the image to the 2.0 UI
  160. [13:34] White Lebed: please, type it in the form you want me to send it to T
  161. [13:34] Martin Luxor: Could we add these buttons to the UI to make building easier
  163. [14:32] DocG Burner: someone tell T we cannot hear him please
  164. [14:32] T Linden: can you hear me?
  165. [14:32] Liamm Scribe: T you're mute
  166. [14:32] Morgaine Dinova: Only T's voice has gone
  168. [14:32] Liamm Scribe: we didn't hear the answer to Raul's question
  170. [14:33] Orange Planer: Can't see answers to anything since Raul's question.
  171. [14:33] T Linden: 3:33] Martin Luxor: Hi White, I would like to propose the changes shown in the image to the 2.0 UI
  172. [13:34] White Lebed: please, type it in the form you want me to send it to T
  173. [13:34] Martin Luxor: Could we add these buttons to the UI to make building easier
  175. [14:33] T Linden: 3:33] Martin Luxor: Hi White, I would like to propose the changes shown in the image to the 2.0 UI
  176. [13:34] White Lebed: please, type it in the form you want me to send it to T
  177. [13:34] Martin Luxor: Could we add these buttons to the UI to make building easier
  178. [14:33] T Linden: switching to chat
  179. [14:33] T Linden: ANswer: the attached image has build, edit linked, and many other buttons on the bottom bar
  180. [14:33] T Linden: 10 buttons in all
  181. [14:34] T Linden: Weplan to implement customizable buttons on the bottom bar
  182. [14:34] T Linden: but I can't yet say if every builder button will make that list
  183. [14:34] T Linden: [13:35] Scarp Godenot: T Linden question: Easy two click access to Windlight presets and graphics draw distance are two things that Emerald has that we find to be EXTREMELY useful. Can you implement these things in the new browser?
  184. [14:34] T Linden: These are good suggestions
  185. [14:35] T Linden: 13:37] Marianne McCann: Question: In your talk at SLCC, we heard that "Some Macintoshes would not be supported. With V2, non Intel Macs are totally shut out. Will non-Intel Macintoshes soon not be welcome on SL at all? Will *any* Macintosh be able to use avanced features such as shadows, etc?
  186. [14:35] T Linden: Answer: we can, but I would put these lower priority than some of the other requests
  187. [14:35] T Linden: Answer: Apple stopped shipping POwer PC machines in 2005
  188. [14:35] T Linden: (i think)
  189. [14:35] T Linden: I still have one
  190. [14:35] T Linden: but since MAcs are <10% of SL users
  191. [14:36] T Linden: and most of those are on Intel based macs
  192. [14:36] T Linden: supporting Power PC macs did not make sense
  193. [14:36] T Linden: from an engineering perspective
  194. [14:36] T Linden: So, no, we will not be supporting viewer 2 on powerpc macs
  195. [14:37] T Linden: [13:39] Marianne McCann: Question: will all build features be available to all users, or will SL move to an "approved builder" or even a payment model to allow people to use current or advanced building tools?
  196. [14:37] White Lebed: I am taking the last questions for T - please IM now
  197. [14:37] T Linden: Answer: Building and Creative is central to second life
  198. [14:37] T Linden: *Creativity
  199. [14:37] T Linden: even though most seoncd life users are not creators
  200. [14:38] T Linden: as it turns out that creativity is not equally distributed in the population
  201. [14:38] T Linden: it is true that more people in SL are creative than is typical in RL
  202. [14:39] T Linden: So a "free building experience" will never go away
  203. [14:39] T Linden: If someone wants to make a pro builders viewer and sell it, have at it
  204. [14:40] T Linden: But we will endeavor to support builders of all skill levels
  205. [14:40] T Linden: with our main viewer
  206. [14:40] T Linden: Anecdote: Our viewer Product Manager Esbee Linden
  207. [14:40] T Linden: Is a builder
  208. [14:40] T Linden: and in the viewer 2 product cycle she took an early beta
  209. [14:41] T Linden: and spent a weekend building
  210. [14:41] T Linden: b/c chat was less interuptive -she actually thought viewer 2 was better for builders
  211. [14:41] T Linden: but there is no accounting for taste (LOL)
  213. [14:42] T Linden: 13:38] Myrabelle Edenbaum: hi. i should ask that for a friend .. Frankstone Starsider: "Why wasn't there an inventory tab for Items created by the Avatar included in Viewer 2?
  214. [14:42] T Linden: That's a nice feature request!
  215. [14:42] T Linden: We had lots of ambitions for the inventory panel to be redesigned in viewer 2
  216. [14:42] T Linden: but we couldn't fit it into the first release
  217. [14:43] T Linden: [13:39] Uni Ninetails: In regards to Viewer 2.0+ as a building tool. I have difficulty using it for developing content as i utilise temporary textures to review sculptmap assets and textures before finalising anything (solve bleeding issues on alphas etc. This is something LL needs to allow fully to save us creators money, you money on wasted asset storage. Temp assets are a BIG issue for me personally i can tolerate/ adapt to everything else but that.
  218. [14:43] T Linden: Temp assets is a really great feature request
  219. [14:43] T Linden: my question is: what is with the other viewers...can we still use them after 30. of april? (for example the emerald)
  220. [14:44] T Linden: Answer: Yes - as long as they comply with the third party viewers
  221. [14:44] T Linden: the pie menu was far easier from a user interface perspective. Any plans on bringing that back?
  222. [14:44] T Linden: Pie menus were contentious as you might imagine internally
  223. [14:45] T Linden: However, one of our design centers for viewer 2 was to draw on popular widely used tools (eg the browser navigation metaphor)
  224. [14:46] T Linden: And the pie menu lost out to the right click context menu b/c it has too much heirarchy
  225. [14:46] T Linden: [13:52] Curious Sciurus: The most important thing I can mention is that many people NEED the old viewer HUDs and the same movement control HUD as on's much easier for many to leave one's hand on the mouse and not have to use so many keyboard controls...Especially for people with carpal tunnel or other problems with their wrist...Also the UI is very dark and causes eyestrain on even those that have no eye problems...We need to be confortable physically to enjoy a program
  226. [14:47] T Linden: Color
  227. [14:47] T Linden: we- can't test every hud
  228. [14:48] T Linden: But we have heard a lot of HUD issues with viewer 2. If the hud is one in broad use, we'll do our best to fix issues
  229. [14:48] T Linden: [13:55] Myrabelle Edenbaum: oh forgot my question.. giggles ... " is it normal that the viewer 2.0 needs so much resources on my pc,, that i cant run my sculptie or animations programs together with 2.0?"
  230. [14:49] T Linden: We've been tackling performance issues on Viewer 2
  231. [14:49] T Linden: And working on an issue around multicore processors usage
  232. [14:50] T Linden: Viewer 2.0.1 has fixed that issue, but we are focused on performance for 2.1
  233. [14:50] T Linden: [14:01] Bethi Catteneo: ok here goes : the ability to view websites on prims ( i dont know how to call it in a more technical way ) - won't it make sl potent to internet viruses and trojans ?
  234. [14:51] T Linden: There is a good blog post on media security
  235. [14:52] T Linden: The internet is a dangerous place, but share media is no worse than a browser. If you really want to control for that
  236. [14:52] T Linden: But we'll be enhancing Media controls in viewer 2.1
  237. [14:52] T Linden: [14:18] Wyn Nitely: Do you realize what a nightmare you are creating for teachers who now have to teach to all third party viewers as well as the official one since 2.0 isn't going to be for builders, or machinima (sp?) or photography?
  238. [14:53] T Linden: I didn't say that Viewer 2 is not going to be for builders, machinima, photography
  239. [14:54] T Linden: We will fix the bug on CTRL-ALT F1 (the shortcut for hiding UI) in Viwer 2.1
  240. [14:54] T Linden: make sure you check our flimsey Freenote's build with shared media it rocks!
  241. [14:54] T Linden: [13:43] Maya Paris: I would like to know if there are any changes planned to the build function. I can no longer build on top of another prim without using a keystroke, which is slowing me down a lot
  242. [14:55] T Linden: Answer: Goal is to return "build" to the right click/ctrl click menu in 2.1
  243. [14:55] T Linden: 13:43] Ladyslipper Constantine: Major concern right now is why don't Linden's realize there are so many who cannot hear or are foreign and can read English but not understand it when voiced.
  244. [14:55] T Linden: We know that 60% of SL users are from OUTSIDE THE US
  245. [14:55] T Linden: There are many good chat translators
  246. [14:55] T Linden: It's a great add on
  247. [14:56] T Linden: And we will consider this for a future release, but it's lower priority given that addins exist for this
  248. [14:56] T Linden: And voice to text transcription is getting better
  249. [14:57] T Linden: 1.THE INABILITY TO ARRANGE MY WORKSPACE. I need need to be able to undock windows such as inventory and profiles and arrange arround my screen as i need so I can access trextures etc fast withoput havin to opemn the side tab every time . I dont want half the screen dissappearing every time i need something from my inventory it destroys the focus of waht you are doing.
  250. I also host events at our venue and again need to be
  251. [14:57] T Linden: First off, the right hand panel emphasizes the top used functions and groups them for easy access
  252. [14:58] T Linden: The goal is to filter UI controls into relevant sets
  253. [14:59] T Linden: LOL - our orignal spec had all floating windows
  254. [14:59] T Linden: and a tearable, dockable right hand panel for advanced users
  255. [14:59] T Linden: however, it's super hard to implement
  256. [14:59] T Linden: Thought S20 Kirstensviewer has a nice compromise
  257. [14:59] T Linden: 2.THE WINDOWS NOT GOING TRANSPARENT WHEN NOT IN USE . I often need to keep them open even if im not using all the time and they just block the view if they are not transparent.
  258. There are other issue
  259. [15:00] T Linden: Transparent windows are a personal preference
  260. [15:00] T Linden: some like them, some don't
  261. [15:00] T Linden: There is a wiki page on how to make the windows transparent
  262. [15:01] T Linden: [13:45] Hydra Shaftoe: Are there any plans to implement developer tools? The standard viewer 2.0 seems to be an extremely dumbled down client compared to what you can do with emerad. What I need as a developer are tools that allow more building functions, more intuitive construction tools, and a way to examine objects that I want to use to ensure that they aren't copybotted (such as emerald's object inspect tool)
  263. [15:01] T Linden: AS I noted above, we have plans for Content Creators and Developers this year, however, in the meantime, if emerald works for you - have at it!
  264. [15:02] T Linden: [13:43] Bethi Catteneo: Will it be possible to upload polygon mesh shapes ? If so what will be the default format and pricing per upload?
  265. [15:03] T Linden: As I noted earlier - mesh import is a key feature for us this year. We have not yet decided how to roll them out and what the business model will be. Our goal is to protect IP rights, make sure we the experience for mesh content is good, and to make sure that we give you lots of lead time.
  266. [15:03] T Linden: [13:49] Bethi Catteneo: Question 2 : LOD and sculpts - most people use way faster computers than those sold 1 or 2 years ago now, will the Render LOD volume be raised to some higher default value ?
  267. [15:04] T Linden: Performance is a tricky issue. we will likely continue to tweak settings to optimize the experience across a variety of machines
  268. [15:04] T Linden: [13:49] Juanita Deharo: I would like to know if viewer 1.23 will continue to be available or if at some stage we will have to use Viewer2
  269. [15:05] T Linden: OUr engineering focus is on Viewer 2 - however, the 1.23 source is available and I believe many TPVs will continue to use that interface model
  270. [15:06] T Linden: We do not have plans to remove viewer 1.23
  271. [15:06] T Linden: And we believe in choice
  272. [15:07] T Linden: so long as your viewer complies with the Third party viewer policy, you can use it
  273. [15:07] T Linden: Griefing and content theft will not be tolerated
  274. [15:07] T Linden: and as content creators you must know that
  275. [15:07] T Linden: 14:35] Hydra Shaftoe: Question: Will there be ways of simplifying common functions? like in emerald and even SL classic, you had common fucntions like search, snapshot, map, minimap, radar. etc all on nice big convenient buttons, but in 2.0 you have to dig down, sometimes 4-5 mouseclicks just to get to a common featured. I would like to be able to put common stuff like that right on top.
  277. [15:07] Morgaine Dinova: At the last meeting with Copper Robot, T Linden specifically stated that LL *will* cease to provide support for 1.23 once a couple of releases of V2 are out. I take it that this policy is now changed.
  278. [15:08] T Linden: Morgaine - the timeline for ceasing support for 1.23 is not determined
  279. [15:08] T Linden: we'll make a good decision
  280. [15:08] T Linden: 14:35] Hydra Shaftoe: Question: Will there be ways of simplifying common functions? like in emerald and even SL classic, you had common fucntions like search, snapshot, map, minimap, radar. etc all on nice big convenient buttons, but in 2.0 you have to dig down, sometimes 4-5 mouseclicks just to get to a common featured. I would like to be able to put common stuff like that right on top.
  281. [15:09] T Linden: We are aiming to add customizable buttons to the button bar. Keyboard short cuts also help access things quickly.
  282. [15:09] T Linden: [14:38] Metaverse Engineer: QUESTION: Why has Windlight custom presets *STILL* not been made global?
  283. [15:10] T Linden: Answer: Stay tuned on windlight controls.
  284. [15:10] T Linden: [14:41] Star Fairymeadow: I'd like to know if there are plans to improve the media settings. I have looked and looked for a place to leave my feedback and suggestions on viewer 2.0 with no luck on where. so where do we leave feedback?
  285. [15:10] T Linden: Yes, we have plans to work on media controls in 2.1
  286. [15:10] T Linden: [14:41] Orange Planer: Question: given that most of the changes requested by the accessibility community are UI-based, wouldn't it be more productive if Linden implemented them rather than wait for a third party accessibility viewer?
  287. [15:11] T Linden: You are welcome!
  288. [15:11] T Linden: and THanks for all of your creativity and support
  289. [15:12] T Linden: Accessibility is very important to SL
  290. [15:14] T Linden: And as I noted, it's a personal passion for the engineering lead on the Viewerr team, Q LInden. The best solution today is a third party viewer that supports accessbility, but we'll be looking at accessbility int the future
  291. [15:14] T Linden: HI there - you guys want me to continue?
  292. [15:14] T Linden: Cause I still have some time
  293. [15:15] T Linden: [14:42] Zach Lordhunter: did you know that there are problems also with if you switch back from using the different viewers like I have 1.23 and 2 but when I switch to 2 it steals stuff from my inventory and also I have seen several people with problems with viewer 2 not working properly and everytime they are boo ted offline they have to reinstall there viewer in order to log back in or they will never be able to log in again
  294. [15:15] T Linden: IN viewer 2, we implemented :links in order to make the creation of outfits easier.
  295. [15:16] T Linden: OUtfits can be a collection of links to no copy items so that a favorite pair of boots can be used in multiple outfits
  296. [15:16] T Linden: However, viewer 1.23 has no concept of what a link is
  297. [15:17] T Linden: so it can make migrating between 1.23 and 2.0 challenging.
  298. [15:17] T Linden: never be able to log in again
  299. [14:43] Hydra Shaftoe: There's 5 things emerald does for me as a professional developer, and until viewer 2 supports those functions it simply is counterproductive to make the switch - less complicated interface, sim radar, object component inspects, static camera, and mouselook indicators. I use those all the time when building and viewer 2.0 either lacks them completely or has weak variants of them in very inaccessable locations that are time consuming to access
  300. [15:18] T Linden: Answer: These are great feature requests - we'll consider them for a future release. OUr goal is to get back to shorter release cycles for the viewer.
  301. [15:18] T Linden: [14:47] Roberto Salubrius: I want to ask if anytime soon we will see the incorporation of skins on the viewer ? not XML hacking as it's being done right now but real LL provided themes or skins.
  302. [15:19] T Linden: Answer: skins is on the roadmap, but it's probably lower priority than some of the other features we've discussed today
  303. [15:19] T Linden: 14:47] Tasia Tonic: Has T Linden and team given thought to the feelings many have reported of being disconnected from their friends and groups and is there a resolve on the way?
  304. [15:19] T Linden: Yes. We have thought about this. Tasia - let's talk offline about what might help you feel more connected.
  305. [15:19] T Linden: [14:47] Tasia Tonic: will they do something about the roller coaster feeling of the sidebar popping open?
  306. [15:20] T Linden: This will be a preference in a future release.
  307. [15:20] T Linden: Aside from making source code and APIs available to third-parties, is the lab doing anything to shape the direction of third-party viewers, for example, by endorsing, funding, or "making official" third-party efforts for much-needed viewres, like a "builders viewer"?
  308. [15:20] T Linden: Oh sorry - if you are asking about the sidebar , as I said earlier, we tested it with users. Some liked the world to move, some didn't. It was a jump ball.
  309. [15:21] T Linden: So it will be a preference for how you want it.
  310. [15:21] T Linden: Back to the regular questions
  311. [15:21] T Linden: Aside from making source code and APIs available to third-parties, is the lab doing anything to shape the direction of third-party viewers, for example, by endorsing, funding, or "making official" third-party efforts for much-needed viewres, like a "builders viewer"?
  312. [15:22] T Linden: Answer: we have just begun to work with the third party viewer community to make sure we can ensure the integrity of the SL experience
  313. [15:23] T Linden: And we encourage the third party developers to create great viewers
  314. [15:23] T Linden: 14:48] Gwenette Writer: Anyone adress the inabilty to easily PROFILE MINE thru individual's profile and groups?? You cannot keep a profile open for later review say at a gathering . .unless I am missing something. This is a very important tool for peer connection & professional development?? The ability to mimnimize profiles of avas and groups for later review: any way to do that in V2
  318. [15:26] T Linden: Answer: we don't yet have a design to help group managers attach files to groups etc in viewer 2, but we agree this is iomportant to fix.
  319. [15:26] T Linden: So making it easier to share group notices, objects, etc is a goal we share with group owners
  320. [15:26] T Linden: [14:49] Mebe Baudin: Regarding right click (aka pie menu) ... am in strong disagreement with "build OR edit" ... builder needs both "build" AND "edit" available on right click.
  321. [15:26] T Linden: We will likely see that in viewer 2.1
  322. [15:27] T Linden: T: One of my biggest issues with 2.0 is that content in the Sidebar is pretty much mutually exclusive. With few exceptions, you can't open more than one Sidebar function at a time. This greatly reduces interactivity between the functions that I currently find extremely useful and integral for my daily activities. I hear you are aware of the docking and sizing issues of the Sidebar. But, also, enabling floating and sizing of the individual windows would go a long way toward functionality. Is that in th
  323. [15:28] T Linden: Interactivity between views of the side bar (eg dragging an inventory item onto a group for distribution is a workflow we plan to address.
  324. [15:28] T Linden: [14:53] Glyph Graves: for me using viewer twohas flattened out the sense of three D the sense of immersion surely this can t be a good thing
  326. [15:29] T Linden: The balance between 2d and 3D is a critical issue for us. Reducing the number of floaters and the amount of floaters required to finish any one task was a design center
  327. [15:30] T Linden: We felt that the tabs of the right panel , and grouping floaters into the panel would help reduce the amount of work required to manage multiple floating windows and let the world SHINE THROUGH
  328. [15:30] T Linden: That being said, I believe the future of virtual worlds will be a blend of 2d and 3D - take a look at what unity has done... immersion via full screen and yet it runs in the browser
  329. [15:31] T Linden: 15:01] Martin Luxor: Will any of the Viewer 2 Tweaks in the forums be adopted into the official viewer? They fix many of the problems mentioned.
  330. [15:31] T Linden: The team is looking at these tweaks and other suggestions as well. However, we can't add everything...
  331. [15:31] T Linden: [15:06] Kaine Lowenstark: My Question is how where are http textures on the roadmap, before or after mesh import?
  332. [15:32] T Linden: Answer: HTTP textures is *likely* going to be in 2.1
  333. [15:32] T Linden: [15:27] Wyn Nitely: Will 3rd party viewers be able to incorporate media on a prim, or will it be 2.0 exclusively?
  334. [15:32] T Linden: The viewer 2 source is available so SHared Media can be added to TPVs
  335. [15:33] T Linden: My question is ... will there be a way anytime in the near future to where all viewers receive and post SLURL's in chat the same way ? Viewer 2.0 doesn't read or post them the same as other viewers, map doesn't allow coordinate input anymore, and the doesn't work often anymore either. This is a big issue for people who post slurls frequently for events and classes, etc.
  336. [15:34] T Linden: Answer: we are standardizing this, and took a big leap forward in viewer 2 - URLs show up as links in many places in the viewer 2 UI, and some have special properties for inspection (eg, what happens when you roll over them) and for action (when you click them) and for display - try pasting a slurl into chat in viewer 2 and see how it is formatted as a location
  337. [15:34] T Linden: [15:24] Suspiria Finucane: Many people would like to know the percentage of users accessing SL with Viewer 2, will those numbers be made available?
  338. We will report on viewer 2 in the Q2 Economy post as a drill down Spotlight
  339. [15:35] T Linden: 15:27] Juanita Deharo: The push seems to be for mulptiple/different viewers. I give a lot of help to newcomers and customers - but this will make it very difficult. have LL considered they may now not be able to tap into the experience of ex. players - this is a loss for new accts.
  340. [15:35] T Linden: New users will get a LInden Viewer and we have early evidence that viewer 2 is easier to adopt for new users
  341. However it's early days, and we want to get a good read on that. So if all new users get official linden viewers, it shoudl be easier to teach them.
  342. [15:36] T Linden: For builders and content creators, we are investing to make viewer 2 meet their needs
  343. [15:36] T Linden: 15:24] Carolhyn Wijaya: As both a performing musician in SL and someone who produces concerts and has created a media player for listening to media in SL, I am really missing the easy access to both the Parcel Music field and the Parcel Media field. Is there a chance you could put those back on the bottom bar, or somewhere easier to reach - or at least make it an option for users to do that?
  344. [15:37] T Linden: Turning on media will likely continue to be inthe upper right corner of viewer 2 UI - let us know what you need.
  345. [15:37] T Linden: [15:26] Martin Luxor: Are there any plans to improve inventory management?
  346. [15:37] T Linden: Yes, but that will require a big investment of energy and time.
  347. [15:38] T Linden: Do we get back "Interests" in profile? Especially for non US residents it's always good to know what language other people speak.
  348. [15:39] T Linden: As i mentioned above, we plan to engage residents in a process to learn what you want to see inf profiles. As I noted above, over time we hope to use Avatars United as a foundation for our profile experience, and to make profiles richer than they are now. Language is a good addition and I guess there is lots of good stuff
  349. [15:39] T Linden: for us to add to profiles
  350. [15:40] T Linden: Answer: we have lots of ways of gathering feedback from users - Pjira, the survey in the right hand panel, user testing etc
  351. [15:40] T Linden: One interesting note is that the response to viewer 2 among new and old users is very polarized
  352. [15:40] T Linden: some people love it
  353. [15:40] T Linden: some people hate it
  354. [15:41] T Linden: But the distribution of users is roughly equal
  355. [15:42] T Linden: But as I said, viewer 2 is more of a beginning than an end - we have lots of work to do and cool things to implement
  356. OK that's the end of the questions I have from white
  357. [15:42] T Linden: and my fingers are getting tired
  358. [15:42] T Linden: One things I have learned in my time in the software biz
  359. [15:42] T Linden: is that the folks who hate do so because they care
  360. [15:43] T Linden: and the folks who love don't always bother to answer
  361. [15:43] T Linden: or tell you that they love it
  362. [15:43] T Linden: Wait... more questions!
  364. [15:43] T Linden: 15:33] Myrabelle Edenbaum: is there a option to get a 2 tiled inventory window, to move things in the inventory easier ( like directory opus ) ?
  366. [15:43] T Linden: And this is an easy one - Myrabelle - your wish has been granted
  367. [15:44] T Linden: in viewer 2. simply hit ctrl - shift - I and you will create a second inventory window
  368. [15:44] T Linden: so that managing inventroy between two windows can happen
  369. [15:44] T Linden: Also under the inventory tab, file > new window will create a seperate instance of the Inventory window
  370. [15:45] T Linden: Yes white, I got number 7
  371. [15:45] T Linden: ok
  372. [15:45] T Linden: [15:42] Mab MacMoragh: If profiles are to be concentrated outworld, will we be able to also manage groups that way with tasks such as checking and sending notices?
  373. [15:46] T Linden: Answer: managing groups is a consistent pain point we hear about in SL - group chats, group notices b/c many folks use groups to promote their activities and to broadcast information in SL. We think that web based group profiles will be pretty powerful for that. But we're going to develop that with your input.
  374. [15:47] T Linden: what about all the pc's you all cut out? he id you cant wait for them to buy new pc's well ifi have 4 gigs of ram, a a dual core, i still have issues here, why arent you making it easier for ppl to access ratherthan shrinking your user base and therefor your monies coming in?
  375. [15:48] T Linden: Answer: managing low end performance on low end PCs is a real challenge for us and we're working on strategies to manage the expeience acorss different hardware configurations
  377. [15:49] T Linden: OK 5 more Q's then I am done!
  378. [15:50] T Linden: OK folks Gwynette had a question
  379. [15:50] T Linden: about 2d and 3D
  380. [15:53] T Linden: Gwynette - we can't predict the future of how 2D and 3D will interact. All I know is that there are 2 Billion web users and 1M SL users, so it's likely going to be a blended experience. You all will have to help us build it
  383. [15:50] T Linden: Silly
  384. [15:50] T Linden: Ok three more q's
  385. [15:50] T Linden: Silly
  386. [15:50] T Linden: Gwynette
  387. [15:50] T Linden: and...
  388. [15:50] T Linden: ?
  390. [15:50] Silly Stipe: what can be done about the memory processors??
  391. [15:52] T Linden: OK - Silly - I don't know what memory issues you are referring to. But the team fixes bugs every day.
  393. [15:52] Silly Stipe: ok i have 4 gigs ram
  394. [15:52] Silly Stipe: 22 ready boost
  396. [15:52] Orange Planer: Silly, IM me about the memory issues?
  397. [15:52] Silly Stipe: a dual core processor
  399. [15:23] Roberto Salubrius: will WASD navigation be removed ? or make it an option so we can keep focus on the chatbar ?
  400. [15:52] T Linden: OK, ROberto - the chat focus issue is a bug, will be fixed
  401. [15:55] T Linden: Roberto -
  402. [15:55] T Linden: here's a tip for you
  403. [15:55] T Linden: to bring focus back to chat bar
  404. [15:55] T Linden: if you use wasd to navigate
  405. [15:56] T Linden: hit enter to return focus to chat bar
  406. [15:56] Roberto Salubrius: but will that be made into an option ?
  407. [15:56] T Linden: I am not understanding your issue, sorry
  408. [15:56] Roberto Salubrius: to remove WASD can it be made an option ?
  409. [15:57] Roberto Salubrius: to use chat as it was before ?
  410. [15:57] T Linden: I see
  411. [15:57] T Linden: We'll consider that roberto - no promises
  412. [15:57] T Linden: what about all the pc's you all cut out? he id you cant wait for them to buy new pc's well ifi have 4 gigs of ram, a a dual core, i still have issues here, why arent you making it easier for ppl to access ratherthan shrinking your user base and therefor your monies coming in?
  414. [15:53] T Linden: last QUESTION!
  416. [15:53] Chantal Harvey: @T: i had a question about 3D in the 2.0 viewer, as 3D is certainly the future, not only for machinima but for all users. wouldnt that be innovative and wonderful, for Linden Lab to bring that
  417. [15:54] T Linden: Chantal - didn't understand your question
  421. [15:57] T Linden: [15:47] Sean Cinquetti: Why does a new install of V2 and a first login...universally take so long to show the avatar?
  422. [15:58] T Linden: Answer: because you are recreating your cache *and* the way texture download for the avatar was changed -
  423. [15:58] T Linden: [15:48] Gwenette Writer: CLOUD??? Any adoption plans for CLOUD processong for users
  424. [15:58] T Linden: Not sure what Gwenette is asking
  426. [15:58] Gwenette Writer: what i LOVE about sl we work together . . . with more creators working in third party build tools with meshes/sculties tec. and just dumping inworld or to slxstreet and not living here // with profiles and info gathering for groups and events being on the web instead of inworld . . we are a culture under a massive metamorphis . . . sighs
  428. [15:58] T Linden: 15:52] Perplexity Peccable: Wanted to just mention that having the chat window go transparent while typing means people with certain perceptual and cognitive anaomlies can't deal with the text or can't read it. Specifically, this creates problems for some people with dyslexia, ADD, ADHD, some on the autism spectrum, and scotopic sensitivity, as well as otehrs. Just lobbying to have the option to set in prefs for the chat window to be opaque. Also better font handling and customization.
  431. [15:59] T Linden: Thanks for the feedback perplexity - probably worth a chat. We tried to favor opaque windows over transparent windows b/c it's less visual noise
  432. [15:59] T Linden: OK
  433. [15:59] T Linden: thanks you gus
  434. [15:59] T Linden: You guys
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