Brené Brown: The Call to Courage (2019)

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[presenter]
She spent 20 years studying courage,

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vulnerability, shame, and empathy,

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wrote five New York Times
number one best sellers,

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and her TED Talk is one
of the most watched in the world.

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Please welcome Brené Brown.

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[audience cheering and applauding]

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[Brené] Hey!

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Hi!

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Hi!

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Oh, my God. Hi!

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Hi, everybody.

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Whoo!

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-Hi!
-[audience] Hi!

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How-- How's it going?

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[audience cheers]

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It was so funny.
I'm backstage. They're like,

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"Can we take your purse?" I'm like, "No."

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-[audience laughs]
-It's, like, totally a Texas thing

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where I always have to have my purse
and an exit plan.

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Uh, like, I'm not sure until I walk
out here that I'm actually going to do it.

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[audience laughs]

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Uh, but I am so happy
to be with y'all tonight.

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And I have to say, honestly,

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the older I get, the more I realize
that time is the big, precious,

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unrenewable resource.

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Um, yes or no?

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-[audience applauds]
-Yeah.

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So, thank you
for spending it with me tonight.

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I really appreciate it.

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I think we're gonna have some fun,

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talk about some hard stuff,
laugh a little bit,

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and hopefully learn something
from each other.

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I'm always laughing
when I'm listening to the bio.

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That, you know, "She studies shame,

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empathy, courage, and vulnerability."

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You have no idea how handy
that comes in my life. So...

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Really, not just in my work,
but in my life

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because how many of you know...

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I recognize some of y'all,
so I know you know me,

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but how many of you know
that I'm super introverted?

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-[woman whoops]
-Like, yeah.

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-Where are all the introverts? Like...
-[audience members whoop]

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It's super handy when I'm traveling
because I'll be sitting next to someone,

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and sometimes I'm in the mood to chat,
and sometimes I'm not.

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So they'll say, "So, what do you do?"

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And if I'm not in the mood to chat,
I'll be like,

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-"I study shame. What do you do?"
-[audience laughs]

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[Brené] And they're just--
They're just like...

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-[imitates window whirring]
-[audience laughs]

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Um...

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And then recently, it was really funny,
'cause I was like,

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"Oh, I study courage and vulnerability,"
and the guy was like,

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"Oh, opposite ends

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of the spectrum."

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[audience laughs]

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And there's that minute where you're like,
"Do I engage or do I not engage?"

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I was like, "No, actually,
they're the same.

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You know, courage-- You can't really--

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You can't really be brave
without vulnerability."

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And he's like, "Ha! Yeah.
No, the opposite ends."

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[audience laughs]

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Now, I can understand why it's complicated
for some people to get that.

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It took me 20 years of trying to disprove
that I had to be vulnerable,

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um, to be brave,

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but I really--

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This came to life for me

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when we started looking
at covers for Daring Greatly,

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which was the first book where I wrote
about courage and vulnerability, right?

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So I say to them,

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"Let's make sure
we really capture the spirit...

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of vulnerability and courage,

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that we really have to put ourselves
out there."

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And they're like, "We've got it.

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Do you need to see the cover?"

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And I was like, "Uh, yeah.
I need to see the cover."

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So they sent me the cover.

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[audience laughs]

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I've named that piece
"White Guy on a Wire."

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[audience laughs]

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[laughing] I was like,

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"I would never buy that book."

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[audience laughs]

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Had I known what was coming next,

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this would have been the cover
of Daring Greatly,

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I guarantee it, because...

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I go back and I'm like,
"That's not gonna work.

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I don't want a white dude
on the front of the book, period."

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Uh, especially with,
like, a 1980s briefcase.

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[laughing] Uh... And so then,
I get an email that says...

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"This is it. We all love it."

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And I'm like, "Oh, man. Dude.

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Don't use your invisible army with me.

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Like, I'm a shame researcher.

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Like, you can't do
the "we all love it" thing with me.

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Like, I will drill you down
till you are crying.

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And, who is the "we"?

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Unless you've got a mouse in your pocket,
that is chickenshit, like...

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No "we." Just like, "I love it."

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So I'm looking at it like,
"Oh, God. We all love it.

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We all think this is it.
We're all excited.

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We're all behind it."

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So you know, right? [scoffs]

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I'm gonna test...

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your empathic powers here.

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[audience chuckles]

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If you're really highly empathic,

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there'll be no laughter.

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[audience laughs]

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I was like, "What?"

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I-- Okay, so here's the thing.

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Like every woman born in this country,

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I've had to do my share
of body image work.

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[audience laughs]

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[Brené] And I have.

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To the point where I am dangerous,
I like myself so much.

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Like, I-- I'm good with everything.
Right? Yeah.

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-[audience cheers]
-[Brené] Pretty good.

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Okay.

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But the chance...

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of my name being under an elephant ass

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on the front of a book is zero.

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That-- Zero. There is zero opportunity
for that to happen.

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So it seems, like, crazy, right?

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You're like, "These are early concepts,
and people are trying to--"

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But let me show you.

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This book has been translated
into, like, 32 languages.

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Let me show you
some of the actual covers

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of how people have conceptualized

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the relationship between courage
and vulnerability.

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This is the Korean.
This is the real, actual--

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The funniest thing about this

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is it was on my-- my kitchen table
in my house

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when my daughter and her friends
got home from high school one day,

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and her friend was like,

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"Oh, my God.
Does your mom know Johnny Depp?"

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[audience laughs]

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[Brené] Which I do not.

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Okay.

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I totally love the Swedes, I really do.
Like, I just love them.

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But they got the saddest cover
in the whole world.

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[audience] Aw!

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[Brené] Okay.

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Why did you do that involuntarily?

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Because this is a sign, internationally,
for, like, abuse and neglect.

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[audience laughs]

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[Brené] And then... [chuckling]

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...we have the cover

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that completely jacked
with my kayaking game

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because I love to kayak.

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I'm a water person, right?

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So when I saw this Lithuanian cover,

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I couldn't get in a kayak for six months.

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[audience laughs]

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Yeah. Yeah.

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This is not what I had in mind,
but this is what people think. Okay.

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Here's where Daring Greatly
actually comes from.

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Teddy Roosevelt.

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So the day the book came out,

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my husband put pictures
of Teddy Roosevelt all over our house

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because the epigraph,

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the quote that kind of is the spine
of Daring Greatly,

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comes from Teddy Roosevelt.

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So I woke up in the morning.

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I was like, "Oh, my God. That's so sweet."
And my kids were like...

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-"Is that Opa? Is that Grandpa?" Um...
-[audience laughs]

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So here's the story.

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How many of you have seen the TED Talk
on vulnerability?

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-[audience cheers]
-[Brené] Okay.

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I wish I could take credit.

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It was me.
It's not that I can't take credit for it,

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but it was a complete accident.

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So here's what happened.

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The curators of TEDx Houston--

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this is the first people
to get the license in Houston--

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call and say,
"Hey, we got the TEDx license.

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Would you like to open up TEDx Houston?"

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And I was like, "Yes!
My God, yes. Thank you!

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What do you want me to talk about?"

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'Cause normally,
when you spend your career

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talking about things like shame
and fear, and scarcity,

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people get super prescriptive

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about what they want you to say
and what they don't want you to say.

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And this guy was like, "You know what?

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Whatever you want.
You have fun. Just crush it.

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Just have fun and just--
Whatever you want."

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-I was like...
-[audience laughs]

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"All right. I'll crush it, dude.
I'll do that. Okay."

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So I'm on a flight
the day before TEDx Houston,

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coming home from Maui,
where I had spent

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four days with CEOs from Silicon Valley

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talking about the importance
of vulnerability.

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Talking about courage
and putting yourself out there.

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And I turned to Steve,
my husband, on the flight.

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My kids are passed out. They went with us.

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And I said, "I'm not going to do
my normal talk tomorrow at TEDx Houston."

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And he's like, "What?"

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And I said, "I'm not gonna do
my normal talk

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on variables
mitigating self-conscious affect."

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And he's like, "Why not?"

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And I said, "I'm gonna be vulnerable
and talk about vulnerability.

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I'm just gonna put my whole self
out there." And he's like,

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"Why? Why would you do that?"

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[audience laughs]

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Which I think was a legitimate question.

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And I said, "Because I just spent
four days with these people

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trying to convince them to be vulnerable
and put themselves out there,

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and then I'm gonna walk on the stage
in my academic armor, you know, like,

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'This is the variable that, you know.'
Um, because that's my training."

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And so, I was like,ÂÂ
"I'm not gonna do that.

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I'm gonna just be vulnerable."

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So I got up there and,
as many of you know, I was vulnerable.

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I talked about how I'm scared
of vulnerability, how I hate it,

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how when it emerged from my data

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as the key
to wholehearted living and loving,

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I totally had a breakdown.

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I went to a therapist
with an Excel spreadsheet

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and said, "Here's what I need to work on.

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I have six weeks."
It took, like, eight years. Uh...

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[audience laughs]

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You know, and I did that.

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And so when I drove home
after giving the talk,

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I just remember thinking,

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"That was the worst 20 minutes
of my life."

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Like,
I had the worst vulnerability hangover

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that you can imagine.

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I thought,
"Thank God it was just 500 people

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at the University of Houston,
where I've taught.

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I know a hundred of them.

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Um, thank God that's over.

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I'm going back to the variables
mitigating self-conscious affect.

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That other's bullshit."
Like, "I'm not doing it."

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So then I find out it's on YouTube,

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and I'm thinking,
"Did I sign a clearance for that?"

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Like, I'm like--
I'm trying to get out of it.

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Then they put it on the big TED,

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and I go to my husband. I'm, like, crying,

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"We gotta stop this. What's happening?"
And he goes,

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"What are people gonna google?
'Brené Brown, vulnerability'?"

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[audience laughs, cheers]

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[Brené] Yeah.

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And, of course,
I'm just embarrassed at that point

242
00:11:07,667 --> 00:11:09,961
that I would be like,
"They're gonna find me!" [whines]

243
00:11:10,044 --> 00:11:11,921
I was like, "You're right.
No one's gonna watch."

244
00:11:12,255 --> 00:11:16,384
So I watch it, and it's like,
three people, four people,

245
00:11:16,467 --> 00:11:18,469
five million, six million...

246
00:11:18,553 --> 00:11:20,430
-[man whoops]
-[Brené] And there's this day--

247
00:11:20,513 --> 00:11:23,141
Like, yeah.
You're like, "Whoo!" And I'm like, "Shit!"

248
00:11:23,224 --> 00:11:25,351
-[audience laughs]
-Um, that's the difference.

249
00:11:25,435 --> 00:11:26,352
And so, I'm like...

250
00:11:28,021 --> 00:11:29,480
"What is happening?"

251
00:11:29,564 --> 00:11:32,150
And so, one day, every news outlet, like,

252
00:11:32,233 --> 00:11:34,611
in the world was covering this story.
Like,

253
00:11:34,694 --> 00:11:38,323
"Who is Bernie Brown,
and why is vulnerability important?"

254
00:11:38,948 --> 00:11:40,825
So I'm like, "Oh, my God."

255
00:11:41,618 --> 00:11:43,161
So, Steve-- My kids are at school.

256
00:11:43,244 --> 00:11:45,830
Steve leaves for work,
and he's like, "Hey, listen.

257
00:11:46,664 --> 00:11:48,833
Don't get online.
Don't read the comments."

258
00:11:49,584 --> 00:11:50,418
And I'm like,

259
00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:54,339
"I've done a lot of my own work.
I'm not gonna be reading the comments."

260
00:11:54,422 --> 00:11:58,218
And I'm, like, waiting for him
to back out of the driveway,

261
00:11:59,302 --> 00:12:00,678
and then I'm like...

262
00:12:02,222 --> 00:12:03,514
Oh, my God.

263
00:12:04,057 --> 00:12:07,018
You can study shame,
yet you are never prepared

264
00:12:07,435 --> 00:12:09,812
for... the...

265
00:12:10,230 --> 00:12:11,731
terrible stuff online. Right?

266
00:12:11,814 --> 00:12:14,150
It's the cesspool of humanity
on these things.

267
00:12:14,692 --> 00:12:16,444
So I start reading the comments,

268
00:12:16,819 --> 00:12:19,197
and the best way to describe shame,
to me,

269
00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:21,532
is shame is this--
the feeling that you would get

270
00:12:21,616 --> 00:12:24,827
if you walked out of a room
that was filled with people who know you,

271
00:12:24,911 --> 00:12:27,497
and they start saying
such hurtful things about you

272
00:12:27,580 --> 00:12:29,582
that you don't know
that you could ever walk back in

273
00:12:29,666 --> 00:12:31,626
-and face them again in your life.
-[woman] Wow.

274
00:12:32,043 --> 00:12:33,002
That's what shame is.

275
00:12:33,086 --> 00:12:33,920
And for me,

276
00:12:34,420 --> 00:12:36,506
the fear of shame,

277
00:12:36,589 --> 00:12:40,510
the fear of criticism was so great
in my life up until that point--

278
00:12:40,593 --> 00:12:42,220
I mean, just paralyzing--

279
00:12:42,303 --> 00:12:44,597
that I engineered smallness in my life.

280
00:12:44,681 --> 00:12:47,517
I did not take chances.
I did not put myself out there.

281
00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:49,811
I mean, I just didn't.
If I was gonna write an op-ed,

282
00:12:49,894 --> 00:12:51,854
I sent it to the Chronicle,
not the New York Times.

283
00:12:51,938 --> 00:12:54,107
Like, I didn't-- It wasn't worth it to me

284
00:12:54,190 --> 00:12:56,734
to step into my power and play big

285
00:12:57,068 --> 00:12:58,403
because I didn't know

286
00:12:58,486 --> 00:13:01,531
if I could literally,
physically withstand the criticism.

287
00:13:02,282 --> 00:13:04,200
And so, I pull up these comments,

288
00:13:04,284 --> 00:13:08,413
and there is everything I have feared
my entire life.

289
00:13:08,496 --> 00:13:11,749
First comment says,
"Less research, more Botox."

290
00:13:11,833 --> 00:13:14,419
The next comment says,
"Of course she embraces imperfection.

291
00:13:14,502 --> 00:13:16,546
What choice would you have
if you look like her?"

292
00:13:16,629 --> 00:13:18,214
The next comment says,

293
00:13:18,298 --> 00:13:21,718
"She should wait and talk about worthiness
when she loses 15 pounds."

294
00:13:21,801 --> 00:13:23,803
"I feel sorry for her husband
and her children."

295
00:13:23,886 --> 00:13:26,889
"I hope someone kills her."
"She's what's wrong with the world today."

296
00:13:26,973 --> 00:13:29,017
And I was vacillating between...

297
00:13:30,685 --> 00:13:31,519
like...

298
00:13:32,186 --> 00:13:35,398
"God, just let me die right now.
Just suck me up, Earth,"

299
00:13:35,481 --> 00:13:37,984
and "I am prepared for this.

300
00:13:38,067 --> 00:13:40,903
I have three degrees in social work.
I am prepared for this crisis."

301
00:13:40,987 --> 00:13:43,489
-Like, "I am trained for this moment."
-[audience cheers, laughs]

302
00:13:45,241 --> 00:13:46,909
And finally, I was just like,
"I am trained for this moment.

303
00:13:46,993 --> 00:13:48,494
I am trained for this moment.

304
00:13:48,578 --> 00:13:51,706
You're in a shame storm.
You're in a shame shitstorm.

305
00:13:51,789 --> 00:13:53,416
You're trained for this moment."

306
00:13:54,917 --> 00:13:57,378
And then I was like,
"Okay, you know what to do.

307
00:13:57,462 --> 00:13:59,922
-Peanut butter and Downton Abbey."
-[audience laughs]

308
00:14:01,007 --> 00:14:03,301
-[Brené] Yeah!
-[all cheer]

309
00:14:03,926 --> 00:14:06,804
So I get my "serving size"
of peanut butter. Arbitrary.

310
00:14:06,888 --> 00:14:08,890
[audience laughs]

311
00:14:10,224 --> 00:14:12,268
It just says how much you can fit
on the spoon

312
00:14:12,352 --> 00:14:15,229
and nothing about the size of the spoon.
Like...

313
00:14:15,688 --> 00:14:16,606
And so...

314
00:14:17,106 --> 00:14:19,859
And I turn on Downton Abbey.
It's like a hundred degrees in Houston,

315
00:14:19,942 --> 00:14:22,111
and I have the thermostat on, like, 58,

316
00:14:22,195 --> 00:14:26,824
and I've got on Uggs and a hoodie
and Woobies and I'm, like, sad,

317
00:14:26,908 --> 00:14:30,036
and I'm watching Downton Abbey.
For seven hours I watch it, just...

318
00:14:31,454 --> 00:14:33,498
How many of you have ever numbed
with TV or a movie?

319
00:14:33,581 --> 00:14:35,124
-[scattered applause]
-[Brené] Yeah.

320
00:14:35,375 --> 00:14:37,627
-You're my people. Um...
-[audience laughs]

321
00:14:38,086 --> 00:14:40,213
But how many of you have ever done this?
It's a lot of you,

322
00:14:40,296 --> 00:14:42,924
but fewer of you will confess
because it seems crazy.

323
00:14:43,424 --> 00:14:46,344
When it's over and you don't want
to go back to the real world,

324
00:14:46,427 --> 00:14:49,597
like, you get out your laptop
and then you start googling, like,

325
00:14:49,972 --> 00:14:52,266
"Where is the abbey?"
"Who plays this person?"

326
00:14:52,350 --> 00:14:56,187
-Like, yes or no? Yes or no?
-[audience laughs and applauds]

327
00:14:56,270 --> 00:14:58,481
Yes, I know. Don't lie.

328
00:14:58,898 --> 00:15:01,776
"Do you fly into Heathrow?
How much does it cost?" Like...

329
00:15:02,777 --> 00:15:04,153
And so then, I'm like,

330
00:15:04,237 --> 00:15:06,739
"Yeah, who was president
of the United States

331
00:15:07,073 --> 00:15:09,242
during this Downton Abbey thing?"

332
00:15:09,325 --> 00:15:12,370
And so I was like,
"Theodore Roosevelt, 1910."

333
00:15:12,745 --> 00:15:14,497
Then I had a total God moment.

334
00:15:14,580 --> 00:15:17,959
There is no other way.
This was God, like, descending

335
00:15:18,251 --> 00:15:20,545
in my living room in full regalia.

336
00:15:21,129 --> 00:15:21,963
I pull it up.

337
00:15:22,046 --> 00:15:25,633
The first thing on Google is a speech
that Theodore Roosevelt gave in 1910.

338
00:15:25,716 --> 00:15:28,469
And I start reading it
because, again, I'm doing anything I can

339
00:15:28,553 --> 00:15:32,014
to not go back to Houston, Texas,
and my life with the haters.

340
00:15:32,890 --> 00:15:35,309
So I start reading it, and it says,

341
00:15:35,393 --> 00:15:37,228
"It's not the critic who counts.

342
00:15:37,311 --> 00:15:40,022
It's not the man who points out
how the strong man stumbles

343
00:15:40,106 --> 00:15:42,942
or where the doer of deeds
could have done it different.

344
00:15:43,693 --> 00:15:46,779
The credit belongs to the person
who's actually in the arena,

345
00:15:46,863 --> 00:15:49,907
whose face is marred
with dust and sweat and blood,

346
00:15:49,991 --> 00:15:51,742
who strives valiantly,

347
00:15:51,826 --> 00:15:52,785
who errs,

348
00:15:52,869 --> 00:15:55,705
who comes up short
again and again and again,

349
00:15:55,788 --> 00:15:57,457
and who, in the end,

350
00:15:57,540 --> 00:16:00,042
while he may know the triumph
of high achievement,

351
00:16:00,501 --> 00:16:03,629
at least when he fails,
he does so daring greatly."

352
00:16:04,672 --> 00:16:06,507
[audience cheers]

353
00:16:10,303 --> 00:16:13,890
There is my life before that quote
and my life after that quote,

354
00:16:13,973 --> 00:16:15,933
like, in really one minute.

355
00:16:16,017 --> 00:16:18,269
And three things became very clear to me

356
00:16:18,352 --> 00:16:20,396
that were really life altering.

357
00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,024
One, I'm gonna live in the arena.

358
00:16:23,107 --> 00:16:25,943
I'm gonna be brave with my life.
I'm gonna show up.

359
00:16:26,027 --> 00:16:27,570
I'm gonna take chances.

360
00:16:27,653 --> 00:16:29,572
And here's a thing I can tell you:

361
00:16:29,655 --> 00:16:34,035
20 years of doing this research,
we just crossed 400,000 pieces of data.

362
00:16:34,118 --> 00:16:36,829
Here's what I can tell you for sure:
If you're brave with your life,

363
00:16:36,913 --> 00:16:39,874
you choose to live in the arena,
you're going to get your ass kicked.

364
00:16:39,957 --> 00:16:41,125
[audience chuckles]

365
00:16:41,209 --> 00:16:43,377
You are going to fall.
You are going to fail.

366
00:16:43,461 --> 00:16:45,213
You are going to know heartbreak.

367
00:16:47,256 --> 00:16:50,301
It's a choice.
It's a choice that I make every day.

368
00:16:50,384 --> 00:16:53,137
These are the words I say
before my feet hit the floor every day.

369
00:16:53,221 --> 00:16:55,848
"Today I'll choose courage over comfort.

370
00:16:56,849 --> 00:17:00,561
I can't make commitments for tomorrow,
but today I'm gonna choose to be brave,

371
00:17:00,645 --> 00:17:01,771
and I know what that means."

372
00:17:01,854 --> 00:17:03,773
And it's so funny
because I do all of this work

373
00:17:03,856 --> 00:17:07,527
with leaders and in organizations today,
and they'll always say to me,

374
00:17:07,610 --> 00:17:11,656
"I hear you, and I'm gonna be brave,
and I'm willing to risk failing."

375
00:17:11,739 --> 00:17:15,117
And I'm like, "You're-- You don't hear me.
You're not hearing me."

376
00:17:15,201 --> 00:17:17,662
Somewhere between what I'm saying
and what you're hearing,

377
00:17:17,745 --> 00:17:20,998
you're-- you're taking out
the "you're going to fail."

378
00:17:21,082 --> 00:17:22,583
Not "you're going to risk failure."

379
00:17:22,667 --> 00:17:25,628
"You're going to know failure
if you're brave with your life."

380
00:17:26,796 --> 00:17:28,047
The second thing...

381
00:17:28,881 --> 00:17:30,216
that became very clear to me

382
00:17:30,299 --> 00:17:33,511
is that quote was everything
I've learned about vulnerability.

383
00:17:33,594 --> 00:17:36,514
Vulnerability's not about winning.
It's not about losing.

384
00:17:36,597 --> 00:17:38,516
It's having the courage to show up

385
00:17:38,599 --> 00:17:40,977
when you can't control the outcome.

386
00:17:41,435 --> 00:17:45,147
And we have asked thousands of people
over the last couple of decades,

387
00:17:45,231 --> 00:17:46,816
"What is vulnerability to you?"

388
00:17:47,525 --> 00:17:48,901
And the answers range from:

389
00:17:48,985 --> 00:17:52,572
Vulnerability is the first date
after my divorce.

390
00:17:53,197 --> 00:17:55,825
Trying to get pregnant
after my second miscarriage.

391
00:17:55,908 --> 00:17:58,035
Sitting with my wife
who has stage four breast cancer

392
00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:00,079
making plans for our toddlers.

393
00:18:00,705 --> 00:18:02,832
Getting fired. Firing someone.

394
00:18:02,915 --> 00:18:04,625
Coming out to my Christian parents.

395
00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:07,878
Saying "I love you" first.

396
00:18:10,172 --> 00:18:12,258
There's this great story that--

397
00:18:12,341 --> 00:18:15,595
It's probably seven
or eight years ago now. I was in LA,

398
00:18:15,678 --> 00:18:20,474
and I was doing a talk
for a couple of thousand educators,

399
00:18:20,891 --> 00:18:23,561
and a young man
walked up to me afterwards, and he said,

400
00:18:23,644 --> 00:18:26,063
"Hey, do you have a minute?
I want to tell you a story."

401
00:18:26,147 --> 00:18:27,732
And I said, "Sure," and he goes,

402
00:18:27,815 --> 00:18:29,650
"Your work changed my life."

403
00:18:30,151 --> 00:18:32,069
And I said, "Thank you,"
and he said, "No, really.

404
00:18:32,153 --> 00:18:35,823
My parents sent me your TED Talks,
and they completely changed my life."

405
00:18:36,115 --> 00:18:38,284
And I said, "Wow, thank you,"
and he said, "In fact,

406
00:18:38,367 --> 00:18:41,287
they inspired me
to tell the woman that I'm dating

407
00:18:41,370 --> 00:18:42,246
that I love her."

408
00:18:43,122 --> 00:18:45,750
And I was like,
[quietly] "Oh, God. Okay...

409
00:18:47,793 --> 00:18:49,879
That's amazing.
It's so good to meet you."

410
00:18:49,962 --> 00:18:52,757
He was like, "No, let me tell you
what happened." And I was like...

411
00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:54,592
-[audience laughs]
-"Yeah."

412
00:18:54,675 --> 00:18:56,802
[audience laughs]

413
00:18:56,886 --> 00:19:01,265
And he said, "We went out to dinner,
and I was gonna wait until dessert,

414
00:19:01,349 --> 00:19:03,726
because we get this, like,
chocolate lava cake.

415
00:19:03,976 --> 00:19:07,396
I was gonna tell her when the chocolate
lava cake came, but I couldn't wait,

416
00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:09,899
so I just looked at her
halfway through dinner and I said,

417
00:19:10,399 --> 00:19:11,484
'I love you.'

418
00:19:12,360 --> 00:19:14,320
And she looked back at me,
and she said,

419
00:19:15,071 --> 00:19:16,489
'I think you're awesome.

420
00:19:16,947 --> 00:19:18,574
[audience groans and chuckles]

421
00:19:18,991 --> 00:19:20,951
And I think we should date other people.'

422
00:19:21,035 --> 00:19:22,703
[audience groans]

423
00:19:22,787 --> 00:19:25,289
And then she left and got a ride home."

424
00:19:26,624 --> 00:19:29,669
He said, "So, I just got in my car...

425
00:19:30,461 --> 00:19:32,254
and drove home,
and, just, the whole way home,

426
00:19:32,338 --> 00:19:33,923
I just kept saying, over and over,

427
00:19:34,006 --> 00:19:36,050
'Fuck Brené Brown.
Fuck Brené Brown.'"

428
00:19:36,133 --> 00:19:38,052
[audience laughs]

429
00:19:38,886 --> 00:19:40,346
[Brené] And I was like...

430
00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:43,641
I was like,

431
00:19:44,058 --> 00:19:46,644
"This is the worst mm-ing story ever!"

432
00:19:47,436 --> 00:19:49,397
And he said, "Then I got home,

433
00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:51,899
and I just, you know,
barged into my apartment.

434
00:19:51,982 --> 00:19:53,651
Both my roommates
were sitting on the couch,

435
00:19:53,734 --> 00:19:55,486
and they were on their laptops,

436
00:19:56,612 --> 00:19:58,781
and they were like,
'Dude, what's wrong?'" And he's like,

437
00:19:58,864 --> 00:20:00,074
"I told her I loved her...

438
00:20:00,533 --> 00:20:01,992
and she broke up with me."

439
00:20:02,076 --> 00:20:04,495
And his roommate goes, "That was so lame.

440
00:20:04,578 --> 00:20:06,497
You can't go after them.

441
00:20:06,580 --> 00:20:09,417
When you head toward them, they move away.

442
00:20:09,500 --> 00:20:12,253
When you're always moving away,
they move toward them.

443
00:20:12,336 --> 00:20:14,338
This is the way it works."

444
00:20:14,672 --> 00:20:17,967
And he was like, "I told them.
I was like, 'Oh, what? No!

445
00:20:18,050 --> 00:20:20,636
Man, that's not who I want to be.

446
00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:22,054
I was daring greatly.'"

447
00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:25,266
And he said both of them just got
really misty-eyed and went,

448
00:20:25,349 --> 00:20:27,852
-"Right on, man! Right on!"
-[audience cheers]

449
00:20:31,731 --> 00:20:33,065
So number one,

450
00:20:33,441 --> 00:20:36,986
if you're gonna be in the arena, join me.
It's really great.

451
00:20:37,069 --> 00:20:39,655
When you're down on the ground,
blood, sweat, tear--

452
00:20:39,739 --> 00:20:41,157
You know, it's an interesting view.

453
00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:42,867
You can see other people
who are brave too.

454
00:20:43,492 --> 00:20:47,121
Um, two, vulnerability is not weakness.
In fact, it's--

455
00:20:47,204 --> 00:20:49,039
You know,
vulnerability is our most accurate way

456
00:20:49,123 --> 00:20:52,293
to measure courage,
and we literally do that as researchers.

457
00:20:52,376 --> 00:20:56,172
We can measure how brave you are
by how vulnerable you're willing to be.

458
00:20:56,630 --> 00:20:58,299
The last thing I learned that day

459
00:20:58,382 --> 00:21:00,384
in my God moment with Theodore Roosevelt

460
00:21:01,135 --> 00:21:02,303
was this:

461
00:21:02,386 --> 00:21:05,389
If you are not in the arena

462
00:21:05,473 --> 00:21:09,518
getting your ass kicked on occasion
because you were being brave,

463
00:21:09,602 --> 00:21:13,814
I am not interested in
or open to your feedback about my work.

464
00:21:13,898 --> 00:21:14,815
Period.

465
00:21:14,899 --> 00:21:16,275
-[audience applauds]
-[Brené] Just period.

466
00:21:20,613 --> 00:21:24,742
And there's a really, really,
I think, easy...

467
00:21:25,409 --> 00:21:27,536
way to think about it, and it's this:

468
00:21:27,620 --> 00:21:30,539
There are millions
of cheap seats in the world today

469
00:21:31,499 --> 00:21:34,084
filled with people
who will never once step foot

470
00:21:34,168 --> 00:21:35,044
in that arena.

471
00:21:35,127 --> 00:21:37,463
They will never once
put themselves out there,

472
00:21:37,546 --> 00:21:39,840
but they will make it a full-time job

473
00:21:39,924 --> 00:21:44,720
to hurl criticism and judgment
and really hateful things toward us.

474
00:21:45,304 --> 00:21:49,016
And we have got to get out of the habit
of catching them

475
00:21:49,099 --> 00:21:52,311
and dissecting and, you know,
holding them close to our hearts.

476
00:21:52,394 --> 00:21:54,522
We've gotta let them drop on the floor.

477
00:21:54,605 --> 00:21:58,234
Don't grab that hurtful stuff
from the cheap seats and pull it close.

478
00:21:58,317 --> 00:22:00,444
Don't pull it anywhere near your heart.

479
00:22:01,111 --> 00:22:04,949
Just let it fall to the ground.
You don't have to stomp it or kick it.

480
00:22:05,032 --> 00:22:07,409
You just gotta step over it
and keep going.

481
00:22:08,369 --> 00:22:11,664
You can't take criticism and feedback

482
00:22:11,747 --> 00:22:14,667
from people who are not being brave
with their lives.

483
00:22:16,168 --> 00:22:18,128
It just will crush you.

484
00:22:18,921 --> 00:22:21,799
You know, I've been teaching
graduate school for 22 years,

485
00:22:22,007 --> 00:22:23,634
and here's what's interesting.

486
00:22:24,844 --> 00:22:29,682
To kind of deal with this huge,

487
00:22:30,224 --> 00:22:33,727
crushing mountain
of negativity and vitriol everywhere,

488
00:22:33,811 --> 00:22:35,354
especially social media,

489
00:22:35,437 --> 00:22:38,899
there's this kind of wholesale adoption
of "I don't give a shit

490
00:22:38,983 --> 00:22:40,442
what anyone thinks."

491
00:22:40,776 --> 00:22:44,280
How many of you have heard this?
How many of you have said it?

492
00:22:44,572 --> 00:22:47,533
-[audience murmurs]
-Right. Yes, you do.

493
00:22:48,117 --> 00:22:50,286
-[audience chuckles]
-You totally care.

494
00:22:50,369 --> 00:22:53,789
Like, you're neurobiologically hardwired
to care what people think.

495
00:22:54,039 --> 00:22:55,708
You have not hacked that.

496
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:57,668
We care what people think.

497
00:22:57,751 --> 00:23:00,880
The deal is
that you have to be very specific

498
00:23:00,963 --> 00:23:03,465
about people whose opinions of you matter.

499
00:23:03,883 --> 00:23:05,968
It's not that you don't give a shit
what anyone thinks.

500
00:23:06,051 --> 00:23:08,345
Just don't give a shit
what some people think.

501
00:23:08,804 --> 00:23:11,974
-[audience chuckles]
-And then really solicit feedback

502
00:23:12,057 --> 00:23:15,019
from the people
that do... give you good feedback.

503
00:23:15,102 --> 00:23:16,687
And you know who makes that list?

504
00:23:17,021 --> 00:23:18,564
I'll tell you who should make the list.

505
00:23:18,647 --> 00:23:22,234
People who love you, not despite
your imperfection and vulnerability,

506
00:23:22,318 --> 00:23:25,821
but because of your imperfection
and vulnerability. Their feedback matters.

507
00:23:25,905 --> 00:23:28,616
Not the "yes" people,
but the people who say, "Yeah,

508
00:23:28,991 --> 00:23:30,284
that kind of sucked,

509
00:23:30,367 --> 00:23:32,953
and you were really out of line,
and you need to clean that shit up,

510
00:23:33,037 --> 00:23:35,873
and I'll be here cheering you on,
but that was not okay."

511
00:23:39,043 --> 00:23:41,170
So, for me, this moment,

512
00:23:41,253 --> 00:23:43,672
this daring greatly moment
with Theodore Roosevelt

513
00:23:43,756 --> 00:23:46,383
changed everything,
and it really helped me understand

514
00:23:47,134 --> 00:23:50,137
what vulnerability is
and what it means to be in the arena--

515
00:23:50,220 --> 00:23:51,639
to show up and be brave.

516
00:23:53,140 --> 00:23:54,767
I want to tell a story

517
00:23:55,142 --> 00:23:59,980
that gives some color and context
to what it means to be vulnerable.

518
00:24:00,064 --> 00:24:03,317
So this is Lake Travis in Austin.

519
00:24:03,609 --> 00:24:06,153
-[audience whoops]
-Any Longhorns in the audience? Hook 'em!

520
00:24:07,863 --> 00:24:09,907
I knew I liked you
right from the beginning.

521
00:24:09,990 --> 00:24:11,575
-Yes.
-[laughs]

522
00:24:11,784 --> 00:24:13,452
So this is my magic lake. This--

523
00:24:13,535 --> 00:24:16,205
I spent every summer of my childhood
on this lake in Austin.

524
00:24:16,288 --> 00:24:18,457
Um, it's where I learned how to, like,

525
00:24:18,540 --> 00:24:21,293
do all the things that, you know,
Texas girls learn how to do.

526
00:24:21,377 --> 00:24:24,171
Fish, run a trotline for catfish,

527
00:24:24,338 --> 00:24:26,799
um... shoot BB guns, swim.

528
00:24:26,882 --> 00:24:28,300
I mean, this was my life.

529
00:24:28,384 --> 00:24:30,302
So a couple of years ago,
Steve and I decide

530
00:24:30,386 --> 00:24:32,388
that we're gonna pool our vacation
for the year

531
00:24:32,471 --> 00:24:34,848
and take one long vacation,

532
00:24:34,932 --> 00:24:37,768
rent a house on Lake Travis, and go.

533
00:24:38,185 --> 00:24:40,396
And I am so excited.
So, like, two and a half weeks.

534
00:24:40,479 --> 00:24:43,941
So we rent this big house,
we reach out to our families and say,

535
00:24:44,024 --> 00:24:46,193
"We've rented this house.
This is where we're gonna be.

536
00:24:46,276 --> 00:24:48,612
If you want to come visit us, do it,

537
00:24:49,113 --> 00:24:50,239
but schedule it on your own."

538
00:24:50,322 --> 00:24:51,824
'Cause my parents are divorced
and remarried,

539
00:24:51,907 --> 00:24:53,325
his parents are divorced and remarried.

540
00:24:53,409 --> 00:24:55,995
It's like NASA-level coordinating
on stuff like this.

541
00:24:56,745 --> 00:24:58,163
So just, "We're gonna be here."

542
00:24:59,164 --> 00:25:02,835
So it's great. So we're packing,
and we always have these--

543
00:25:02,918 --> 00:25:04,294
Do y'all have these,
or are we the only people?

544
00:25:04,378 --> 00:25:05,629
Like, we call them the CTJs.

545
00:25:05,713 --> 00:25:08,757
The vacation CTJ,
the vacation come-to-Jesus talk,

546
00:25:08,841 --> 00:25:09,842
before we leave.

547
00:25:09,925 --> 00:25:12,845
-[audience laughs]
-Do y'all have these in your lives?

548
00:25:12,928 --> 00:25:16,348
Where you have to level set expectation.
Like, I'll give you an example.

549
00:25:16,432 --> 00:25:18,767
This is not this, but this is more recent.

550
00:25:18,851 --> 00:25:21,687
We were going to Disney,
and I was packing, and he said,

551
00:25:21,770 --> 00:25:24,815
"I think we need to have our,
like, CTJ on Disney."

552
00:25:24,898 --> 00:25:25,733
And I was like,

553
00:25:26,316 --> 00:25:27,609
"Why?" And he said,

554
00:25:28,235 --> 00:25:31,113
"You've got five books, man.
What are you doing with these?"

555
00:25:31,196 --> 00:25:32,906
And he-- I'm like,
"I'm taking them to vacation.

556
00:25:32,990 --> 00:25:35,325
Do you know how long it's been
since I've read good fiction?"

557
00:25:35,617 --> 00:25:38,078
He goes, "You ain't reading nothing
for the next four days

558
00:25:38,162 --> 00:25:40,998
but 'too tall to ride,'
'too short to ride.'"

559
00:25:41,081 --> 00:25:43,000
-[audience laughs]
-I was like, "What?"

560
00:25:43,417 --> 00:25:45,377
And he was like,
"You won't be in the hotel reading.

561
00:25:45,461 --> 00:25:47,421
We're taking, like, five kids to Disney."

562
00:25:48,005 --> 00:25:50,049
So this was our CTJ for Lake Travis.

563
00:25:50,132 --> 00:25:52,676
We're like, "Two and a half weeks.
How do you do a vacation that long?"

564
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:55,596
We'd never been on a long vacation.
He's like, "First of all,

565
00:25:56,221 --> 00:25:57,681
there's gotta be rules for the kids."

566
00:25:58,098 --> 00:26:00,100
If we just, like,
go crazy on normal vacation,

567
00:26:00,184 --> 00:26:01,935
and let them do screen time
and stay up late,

568
00:26:02,019 --> 00:26:03,896
they'll be feral by the time we get back.

569
00:26:03,979 --> 00:26:08,650
So we gotta have,
like, limited screen time, early bedtime.

570
00:26:08,734 --> 00:26:10,861
And then I started to get the bug,
and I'm like,

571
00:26:11,028 --> 00:26:12,905
"We're gonna do a healthy vacation.

572
00:26:12,988 --> 00:26:15,908
We're gonna do, like,
a healthy family vacation.

573
00:26:15,991 --> 00:26:18,869
And we're gonna cook,
and we're not gonna eat a lot of crap,

574
00:26:18,952 --> 00:26:20,537
and we're gonna work out every day.

575
00:26:20,621 --> 00:26:21,997
[audience laughs]

576
00:26:22,081 --> 00:26:23,957
And he's like, "I love it."

577
00:26:24,041 --> 00:26:25,584
So we decide to swim every day.

578
00:26:25,667 --> 00:26:27,711
We're gonna swim this cove every day.
And so,

579
00:26:28,087 --> 00:26:31,799
we met coaching swimming.
We're both ex-competitive swimmers.

580
00:26:31,882 --> 00:26:34,051
He still swims competitively.

581
00:26:34,134 --> 00:26:35,594
I'm a shame researcher.

582
00:26:35,969 --> 00:26:37,846
[audience laughs]

583
00:26:37,930 --> 00:26:42,059
And so, I was like, "But I can do it."
Like, I can do this. Right?

584
00:26:42,601 --> 00:26:43,435
So...

585
00:26:44,478 --> 00:26:47,189
you know, I dig in the back of my drawer
for the old Speedo.

586
00:26:47,272 --> 00:26:48,690
I'm like, hm.

587
00:26:49,983 --> 00:26:50,818
Hm.

588
00:26:51,527 --> 00:26:52,653
Okay.

589
00:26:52,736 --> 00:26:54,863
So I get it, the goggles, my cap.

590
00:26:54,947 --> 00:26:57,074
So one morning, we head to the lake,

591
00:26:57,157 --> 00:26:59,868
and it is beautiful outside,
and it's early.

592
00:26:59,952 --> 00:27:03,288
The sun's coming up.
Gorgeous rock, turquoise water.

593
00:27:03,831 --> 00:27:06,166
We dive in.
The kids are upstairs sleeping.

594
00:27:06,250 --> 00:27:08,377
My sisters are there.
Their kids are upstairs sleeping.

595
00:27:09,128 --> 00:27:11,380
We start swimming, and I'm just like,

596
00:27:11,463 --> 00:27:14,341
"Oh, my God. This is like if-- if you die
and you're good your whole life,

597
00:27:14,424 --> 00:27:17,427
this is where you go, right here.
Lake Travis with your man.

598
00:27:17,511 --> 00:27:18,679
Like, this is it."

599
00:27:18,762 --> 00:27:19,972
[audience chuckles]

600
00:27:20,055 --> 00:27:23,308
And we stop about halfway across
'cause, you know, open water swimming,

601
00:27:23,392 --> 00:27:25,602
you're looking for boats,
you're looking for those things.

602
00:27:25,978 --> 00:27:29,606
And all of a sudden, I catch Steve's eye.
Now I'm gonna have to, like--

603
00:27:29,690 --> 00:27:31,900
Can I use you as my person?

604
00:27:33,026 --> 00:27:34,653
Yes? Great. Tell me your name.

605
00:27:34,736 --> 00:27:36,363
-[man] Samuel.
-Samuel.

606
00:27:36,446 --> 00:27:39,074
So we're about-- Raise your hand, Samuel,
for the people in the back.

607
00:27:39,158 --> 00:27:40,159
Okay.

608
00:27:40,242 --> 00:27:42,870
So we're about this far apart,
and I'm like...

609
00:27:44,663 --> 00:27:46,623
"I'm just gonna-- Steve?"
And he goes, "Yeah?"

610
00:27:46,707 --> 00:27:48,834
And I said, "I feel so connected to you.

611
00:27:48,917 --> 00:27:53,046
I'm so glad that we're spending
this time together doing this."

612
00:27:53,839 --> 00:27:56,341
And he looks back at me, and he goes,
"Yeah, water's good,"

613
00:27:56,425 --> 00:27:57,968
and he keeps swimming.

614
00:27:58,051 --> 00:28:00,012
[audience laughs]

615
00:28:01,722 --> 00:28:03,473
Yeah. [chuckles softly]

616
00:28:05,142 --> 00:28:07,561
Oh, boy! So...

617
00:28:08,061 --> 00:28:11,023
my first thought, literally, is this.

618
00:28:11,106 --> 00:28:13,233
I'm embarrassed to share it with you,
but I will.

619
00:28:13,984 --> 00:28:17,487
-"He is so overwhelmed with love for me."
-[audience laughs]

620
00:28:17,988 --> 00:28:21,325
That is my first thought,
that he is not functioning.

621
00:28:21,408 --> 00:28:22,492
Like, he is--

622
00:28:22,576 --> 00:28:24,870
Like, I'm actually thinking to myself,

623
00:28:25,287 --> 00:28:28,957
"I hope he's safe
in this deep water with this feeling."

624
00:28:29,875 --> 00:28:32,544
'Cause it was like
he couldn't process it, and--

625
00:28:33,045 --> 00:28:35,797
And I have to be honest with you.
He is a very courageous guy,

626
00:28:35,881 --> 00:28:38,800
and he is much more likely
to say that in our relationship

627
00:28:38,884 --> 00:28:40,427
than I am to say that.

628
00:28:40,510 --> 00:28:43,096
He's much more likely to go there
and be that connecting,

629
00:28:43,180 --> 00:28:44,431
and I'm not.

630
00:28:44,848 --> 00:28:47,935
I mean, I'm nice,
but I'm not, you know, I'm not like that.

631
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,188
And it was a big reach for me,
so I thought, "That overwhelmed him."

632
00:28:51,271 --> 00:28:54,149
He was like,
"Man, I gotta keep swimming." Um...

633
00:28:54,691 --> 00:28:56,568
So we get to the other end,
and it's not like, it's like--

634
00:28:56,652 --> 00:28:59,029
You're not gonna do a flip turn.
It's just like mossy and stuff.

635
00:28:59,112 --> 00:29:00,489
And so, you just kinda turn around.

636
00:29:00,864 --> 00:29:03,408
And we start swimming back,

637
00:29:03,700 --> 00:29:05,369
and now all of a sudden,

638
00:29:05,702 --> 00:29:07,663
we're about this far from each other.

639
00:29:07,746 --> 00:29:09,748
Raise your hand, Samuel,
for the people in the back.

640
00:29:09,831 --> 00:29:11,458
Okay, so we're close now.

641
00:29:11,541 --> 00:29:13,126
And I think to myself,

642
00:29:13,710 --> 00:29:15,128
"Should I go back in?

643
00:29:15,462 --> 00:29:17,089
Should I try it again?"

644
00:29:17,589 --> 00:29:19,591
And this is really funny
because I tell this story--

645
00:29:19,675 --> 00:29:21,843
When I tell this story
on the East Coast...

646
00:29:22,177 --> 00:29:24,471
It's rhetorical, this question.
Like, "Should I go back in?"

647
00:29:24,554 --> 00:29:28,725
I'm telling you what I was thinking.
I was thinking, "Should I go back in?"

648
00:29:29,059 --> 00:29:31,436
But for some reason, in New York, Boston,

649
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,648
these people feel compelled
to be like, "No! No!

650
00:29:35,649 --> 00:29:38,402
-No, ma'am!
-[audience laughs]

651
00:29:38,485 --> 00:29:42,364
No! That's bullshit. Do not go back there.
Uh-uh.

652
00:29:43,365 --> 00:29:44,199
No."

653
00:29:44,866 --> 00:29:46,034
But then...

654
00:29:46,660 --> 00:29:48,287
I'm gonna tell you what's worse.

655
00:29:49,162 --> 00:29:50,622
In California,

656
00:29:50,914 --> 00:29:51,915
people do this...

657
00:29:51,999 --> 00:29:54,876
Almost every time I do this in California,
someone goes...

658
00:29:55,627 --> 00:29:58,088
[audience laughs]

659
00:30:00,257 --> 00:30:02,259
[mouthing]

660
00:30:09,224 --> 00:30:12,394
That shit makes me uncomfortable.
No, it does.

661
00:30:12,477 --> 00:30:15,230
It makes me uncomfortable,
and it makes me charge extra

662
00:30:15,314 --> 00:30:16,481
to come to California.

663
00:30:16,565 --> 00:30:18,358
Like, I don't like that.

664
00:30:18,650 --> 00:30:20,193
But on this particular day,

665
00:30:20,861 --> 00:30:22,738
'cause Samuel and I are so connected,

666
00:30:23,238 --> 00:30:26,783
I said, "I'm gonna get my California on,
and I'm gonna go back in."

667
00:30:27,367 --> 00:30:29,036
So we're this far apart,

668
00:30:29,119 --> 00:30:31,663
and I'm like, "Hey!" And he's like...

669
00:30:31,747 --> 00:30:33,790
And I said, "I feel really close to you.

670
00:30:33,874 --> 00:30:36,126
This is a really...
This is a really special moment.

671
00:30:36,209 --> 00:30:38,211
Like, I love doing this with you."

672
00:30:38,795 --> 00:30:41,923
And he looks at me, and he goes,
"Water's good," and he keeps swimming.

673
00:30:42,007 --> 00:30:44,009
[audience laughs]

674
00:30:47,012 --> 00:30:48,722
I'm pissed off now.

675
00:30:48,805 --> 00:30:51,350
Like, I am so mad.

676
00:30:53,143 --> 00:30:56,980
So the thing about midlife
that's so great--

677
00:30:57,064 --> 00:30:59,358
For those of you in your 30s, don't fear.

678
00:30:59,441 --> 00:31:02,110
-[audience laughs]
-The thing about midlife that's so great

679
00:31:02,194 --> 00:31:04,780
is you can actually,
in situations like this,

680
00:31:04,863 --> 00:31:06,490
play the tape to the end.

681
00:31:06,865 --> 00:31:08,075
Like, you know what's gonna happen.

682
00:31:08,158 --> 00:31:10,369
Like, you can play the movie
all the way to the end

683
00:31:10,452 --> 00:31:11,703
and make changes accordingly.

684
00:31:13,413 --> 00:31:14,873
So I know how this is gonna end.

685
00:31:14,956 --> 00:31:17,959
Like, let me ask this.
There's a lot of men here tonight.

686
00:31:18,043 --> 00:31:21,713
How many men in the audience
are familiar with the term "payback"?

687
00:31:21,797 --> 00:31:23,298
[audience laughs]

688
00:31:23,382 --> 00:31:24,883
Let's see a show of hands.

689
00:31:25,717 --> 00:31:27,844
What's your familiarity? Yeah.

690
00:31:28,345 --> 00:31:30,180
This guy's like-- I see you.

691
00:31:30,263 --> 00:31:32,891
You're not raising your hand,
but you're thinking, "Yeah, I know it."

692
00:31:32,974 --> 00:31:34,851
-Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
-[inaudible]

693
00:31:35,227 --> 00:31:36,853
So here's I know how it's gonna end.

694
00:31:36,937 --> 00:31:38,897
So I will, like--

695
00:31:38,980 --> 00:31:41,525
I will go into complete pissed-off mode.

696
00:31:41,942 --> 00:31:46,113
I will beat him back to the dock,
fueled by nothing but rage and fury.

697
00:31:47,531 --> 00:31:51,576
We will get upstairs. We'll be drying off.
We'll be in the kitchen, and he'll go,

698
00:31:52,119 --> 00:31:54,454
"Hey, babe. What's for breakfast?"

699
00:31:56,498 --> 00:31:58,917
And I'll say, "I don't know, babe.

700
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,420
Let me ask the breakfast fairy.
Breakfast fairy!

701
00:32:01,503 --> 00:32:03,422
[audience laughs]

702
00:32:03,505 --> 00:32:05,257
Hey, breakfast fairy.

703
00:32:05,632 --> 00:32:06,842
It's Brené.

704
00:32:07,384 --> 00:32:08,760
What's for breakfast?

705
00:32:10,929 --> 00:32:13,640
Oh, I'm sorry, Steve.
I forgot how vacation works.

706
00:32:13,723 --> 00:32:15,183
I'm in charge of breakfast

707
00:32:15,267 --> 00:32:17,936
and lunch, and dinner,
and packing, and unpacking,

708
00:32:18,395 --> 00:32:21,022
and laundry, and sunscreen, and towels,

709
00:32:21,690 --> 00:32:22,941
and bug spray."

710
00:32:23,024 --> 00:32:24,151
Look, these--

711
00:32:25,068 --> 00:32:26,611
[audience laughs]

712
00:32:26,695 --> 00:32:29,364
I'm gonna hang out with this whole crew
after this is over.

713
00:32:29,448 --> 00:32:31,408
The crew going like this. "Mm-hmm."

714
00:32:31,491 --> 00:32:33,326
That's how vacation works. Yes or no?

715
00:32:33,577 --> 00:32:35,078
-[audience] Yes!
-[Brené] Yeah.

716
00:32:35,537 --> 00:32:37,789
And the worst thing is,
halfway during this,

717
00:32:37,873 --> 00:32:39,249
Steve will go like this...

718
00:32:41,209 --> 00:32:43,128
[audience laughs]

719
00:32:43,211 --> 00:32:44,754
"Did something happen?"

720
00:32:47,507 --> 00:32:49,134
And so... [laughing]

721
00:32:49,217 --> 00:32:52,846
I'm like, "I know this story.
I've lived it a thousand times.

722
00:32:52,929 --> 00:32:55,015
This shit is not happening
at my magic lake."

723
00:32:55,098 --> 00:32:58,935
And so, I actually do beat him
to the dock,

724
00:32:59,603 --> 00:33:01,188
again, fueled by fury,

725
00:33:02,105 --> 00:33:03,899
and when he gets to the dock,

726
00:33:04,608 --> 00:33:07,152
I look at him,
and I'm in 30 feet deep at this thing.

727
00:33:07,235 --> 00:33:09,404
Like, so we're, like,
treading water, right?

728
00:33:09,488 --> 00:33:11,239
And I said, "What's going on?

729
00:33:11,323 --> 00:33:13,492
I'm trying to reach out
and connect with you,

730
00:33:13,575 --> 00:33:16,995
and you're blowing me off.
Like, what is happening?"

731
00:33:17,746 --> 00:33:19,247
And he kind of turns around,

732
00:33:19,331 --> 00:33:20,957
and then he turns back toward me,
and he goes,

733
00:33:21,374 --> 00:33:23,251
"I don't want to do this with you."

734
00:33:24,002 --> 00:33:25,545
And, of course, I'm like...

735
00:33:25,629 --> 00:33:29,007
-[roars slowly]
-[audience laughs]

736
00:33:29,090 --> 00:33:30,967
[Brené] 'Cause I'm thinking, like...

737
00:33:31,384 --> 00:33:34,137
Actually, you wanna know actually
what I'm thinking?

738
00:33:34,262 --> 00:33:35,096
I'm thinking,

739
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:38,558
"If I find out we're getting a divorce
in a swimsuit,

740
00:33:38,642 --> 00:33:40,560
I'm gonna frickin' kill somebody,"

741
00:33:40,644 --> 00:33:43,188
is what I'm thinking.
That's what I'm actually thinking.

742
00:33:43,647 --> 00:33:46,149
Um, I'm like, "What do you mean,
you don't want to do this?"

743
00:33:46,233 --> 00:33:48,735
And he goes, "I don't want to have
this conversation with you now."

744
00:33:48,818 --> 00:33:50,570
I'm like, "Oh, tough shit."

745
00:33:50,654 --> 00:33:53,365
I'm like, "Okay. We gotta do this, Steve."

746
00:33:53,740 --> 00:33:56,826
And he starts to get out of the water.
I'm like, "Can you please get back in?"

747
00:33:56,910 --> 00:33:58,912
So he gets back in the water,
and I'm like,

748
00:33:59,162 --> 00:34:00,789
"I don't understand what's happening."

749
00:34:00,872 --> 00:34:03,041
And he's just not looking at me,
and it's weird.

750
00:34:03,500 --> 00:34:05,877
And then I go to this place...

751
00:34:06,253 --> 00:34:09,214
You know, when all else fails,
I go back to the data.

752
00:34:09,589 --> 00:34:10,966
I keep thinking about this sentence

753
00:34:11,049 --> 00:34:14,302
that's been in my research
for, like, 15 years.

754
00:34:15,178 --> 00:34:17,264
It never saturated--
like, that's our kinda code word

755
00:34:17,347 --> 00:34:19,182
for "it didn't come up enough
to write about it"--

756
00:34:19,266 --> 00:34:21,560
until I wrote Rising Strong.

757
00:34:21,643 --> 00:34:24,563
And when we were interviewing
to understand resilience,

758
00:34:24,646 --> 00:34:29,276
the most resilient participants
that we've met across all these years

759
00:34:29,359 --> 00:34:30,986
had this sentence in common.

760
00:34:31,069 --> 00:34:33,238
They all used some form of this sentence.

761
00:34:33,321 --> 00:34:36,283
And it has become--
I'm telling you, this is a magic sentence.

762
00:34:36,366 --> 00:34:40,495
It's a simple sentence.
It's just the story I'm telling myself.

763
00:34:41,204 --> 00:34:42,831
Because when something hard happens,

764
00:34:42,914 --> 00:34:47,586
our brain, which is wired to protect us
above all else, wants a story.

765
00:34:47,669 --> 00:34:49,504
It understands story
and narrative pattern,

766
00:34:50,171 --> 00:34:53,800
and it says, "Give me a story
so I can understand how to protect you."

767
00:34:53,883 --> 00:34:57,178
And it doesn't want a story that's like,
"Well, I'm not sure. And..."

768
00:34:57,637 --> 00:34:58,722
You know, that's not useful.

769
00:34:58,805 --> 00:35:02,225
It wants, like, bad guy, good guy,
safe, dangerous, against you, for you.

770
00:35:02,767 --> 00:35:05,145
And so we make up these stories.

771
00:35:05,604 --> 00:35:07,939
How many of you get the three dots on text

772
00:35:08,356 --> 00:35:10,108
and then it goes away,

773
00:35:10,191 --> 00:35:11,651
and then you make up a story?

774
00:35:11,735 --> 00:35:14,029
[audience laughs, applauds]

775
00:35:14,112 --> 00:35:15,280
[Brené] Right. Yeah. Right.

776
00:35:18,033 --> 00:35:21,119
So I look at Steve, and I said,

777
00:35:21,620 --> 00:35:25,624
"The story I'm making up right now
is one of two things just happened."

778
00:35:25,707 --> 00:35:28,418
And--- And in all fairness,
you're gonna want to laugh,

779
00:35:28,501 --> 00:35:30,712
but before I tell you,
I'm gonna ask you not to laugh.

780
00:35:30,795 --> 00:35:32,297
'Cause I'm gonna ask you
to take a deep breath...

781
00:35:32,380 --> 00:35:33,590
[audience inhales]

782
00:35:33,673 --> 00:35:34,966
...and think about this:

783
00:35:35,050 --> 00:35:37,719
When you make an emotional bid
for connection with someone,

784
00:35:37,802 --> 00:35:39,512
and you're pushed away,

785
00:35:39,596 --> 00:35:41,598
what is the thing that you feel?

786
00:35:42,932 --> 00:35:44,059
[audience] Rejection.

787
00:35:44,142 --> 00:35:46,144
Rejection, shame, fear, loneliness.

788
00:35:46,227 --> 00:35:48,563
Like, I am hurting when I say this.

789
00:35:48,647 --> 00:35:53,652
So I look at Steve, and I say, "Look...
the story I'm making up right now

790
00:35:53,735 --> 00:35:57,697
is either you looked over at me
while we were swimming and thought,

791
00:35:58,156 --> 00:35:59,157
'God...

792
00:35:59,574 --> 00:36:02,160
where's the girl I married 25 years ago?

793
00:36:02,243 --> 00:36:04,788
Like, you're old. You don't even know
how to swim anymore.'

794
00:36:05,205 --> 00:36:07,540
Or you looked over at me and thought,

795
00:36:07,624 --> 00:36:09,417
'Jeez, man. She does not rock a Speedo

796
00:36:09,501 --> 00:36:11,503
like she did two decades
and two kids ago.'

797
00:36:11,586 --> 00:36:14,047
Like, that's
what I'm telling myself right now, Steve.

798
00:36:14,130 --> 00:36:15,423
Like, so what's going on?"

799
00:36:17,050 --> 00:36:18,093
And he looks at me, and he said,

800
00:36:18,176 --> 00:36:20,679
"Look, I don't mind taking care
of the kids, Brené."

801
00:36:20,762 --> 00:36:21,930
And I was like, "What?"

802
00:36:22,013 --> 00:36:23,431
He said, "I don't mind taking care
of the kids.

803
00:36:23,515 --> 00:36:25,975
I know the kids want to spend all day

804
00:36:26,059 --> 00:36:28,311
back and forth across this cove

805
00:36:28,395 --> 00:36:31,106
because the pirate's treasure
is on the other side.

806
00:36:31,189 --> 00:36:33,024
I'll take all six of them back and forth.

807
00:36:33,108 --> 00:36:34,317
I don't mind."

808
00:36:34,776 --> 00:36:38,113
And, like, my first thought is,
"There's been a neurological event."

809
00:36:38,196 --> 00:36:39,030
[audience laughs]

810
00:36:40,198 --> 00:36:42,534
Which explains a lot of what's happening.

811
00:36:45,036 --> 00:36:46,204
So I'm like...

812
00:36:47,372 --> 00:36:49,833
I'm-- [chuckles] I'm scared a little bit.
And I'm like,

813
00:36:50,083 --> 00:36:53,670
-"Say more. Um..."
-[audience laughs]

814
00:36:54,879 --> 00:36:58,007
Resisting to go into, like, "Can you count
backwards from by sevens?"

815
00:36:58,091 --> 00:36:59,926
Like-- Like-- Going into, like...

816
00:37:00,802 --> 00:37:02,846
a full-on intake process.

817
00:37:03,179 --> 00:37:05,598
Um, and I was like,
"Say more," and he said,

818
00:37:05,682 --> 00:37:07,308
"Look, I don't mind taking them. I get it.

819
00:37:07,392 --> 00:37:09,644
Like, you get to spend time
with your sisters.

820
00:37:09,728 --> 00:37:11,438
The other dads are not great swimmers.

821
00:37:11,521 --> 00:37:13,982
I don't mind taking them across."
And I'm, like, "Okay.

822
00:37:14,065 --> 00:37:16,860
I am freaking out right now.
What is going on?"

823
00:37:16,943 --> 00:37:18,361
And he said, "Brené, I don't know.

824
00:37:18,445 --> 00:37:21,239
I don't know what you were saying to me
in the water.

825
00:37:21,322 --> 00:37:24,159
I was just fending off a panic attack

826
00:37:24,242 --> 00:37:25,869
and counting strokes."

827
00:37:26,619 --> 00:37:29,330
And I said, "What?" And he goes,
"I was just counting strokes, Brené.

828
00:37:29,414 --> 00:37:32,000
I was just counting strokes.
Fending off a panic attack.

829
00:37:32,083 --> 00:37:34,377
I don't know what you were saying to me
in the water."

830
00:37:35,044 --> 00:37:39,299
And so, all of a sudden--
I'm starting to try to process everything.

831
00:37:39,382 --> 00:37:42,260
Any competitive swimmers here,
ex-competitive swimmers?

832
00:37:42,343 --> 00:37:43,720
You know how when you learn--

833
00:37:43,803 --> 00:37:46,306
You know, when you're a swimmer,
and you're in a pool,

834
00:37:46,389 --> 00:37:50,018
and then all of a sudden you're in a lake,
it's anxiety-producing

835
00:37:50,101 --> 00:37:53,062
because you-- It's not like a pool
with a black stripe, and you see which--

836
00:37:53,146 --> 00:37:56,149
It's like, release the Kraken.
Like, you don't know what's in there.

837
00:37:56,232 --> 00:37:58,026
You lose your sense of control.

838
00:37:58,109 --> 00:37:59,778
When you have anxiety
and you're swimming,

839
00:37:59,861 --> 00:38:01,696
you usually just count strokes
or count breaths.

840
00:38:02,155 --> 00:38:02,989
So I'm like,

841
00:38:03,615 --> 00:38:06,868
"Why-- Why are you counting strokes?
Why-- What's the panic attack about?"

842
00:38:06,951 --> 00:38:10,580
And he said, "I had a dream last night
that I had all six of the kids,

843
00:38:10,663 --> 00:38:13,958
we were halfway across the cove,
and a ski boat came,

844
00:38:14,042 --> 00:38:15,960
and I waved it off,
and it didn't slow down,

845
00:38:16,044 --> 00:38:17,921
and I waved it off,
and it didn't slow down again,

846
00:38:18,004 --> 00:38:19,839
and it was coming straight at me
and the kids,

847
00:38:19,923 --> 00:38:22,801
so I grabbed all the kids,
and I went as deep as I could go,

848
00:38:22,884 --> 00:38:26,304
and I stayed there and stayed there,
waiting for that boat to pass

849
00:38:26,387 --> 00:38:28,765
'cause I knew it would kill us
if it hit us.

850
00:38:29,307 --> 00:38:32,560
And I just was waiting,
and then I looked at Charlie,

851
00:38:32,644 --> 00:38:37,065
our son, and knew that if we stayed
two seconds longer, he would drown.

852
00:38:37,899 --> 00:38:40,235
And so I don't know
what you were saying to me.

853
00:38:40,318 --> 00:38:42,403
I was just fighting off a panic attack."

854
00:38:43,738 --> 00:38:45,198
And so this made complete sense to me

855
00:38:45,281 --> 00:38:47,826
because we had arrived at the lake
on a Monday,

856
00:38:47,909 --> 00:38:49,786
and this was our first weekend
at the lake.

857
00:38:49,869 --> 00:38:51,162
And we had gone to bed that night

858
00:38:51,246 --> 00:38:54,457
talking about, "Hey, let's not tube
or do anything like that.

859
00:38:54,541 --> 00:38:57,418
Let's stay off the lake
'cause the boating and drinking is so bad.

860
00:38:57,502 --> 00:38:58,670
And let's just stay close."

861
00:38:58,753 --> 00:39:02,006
And we had gone to sleep talking
about that, so that made sense to me.

862
00:39:02,674 --> 00:39:05,134
So I looked at him, and I was like,

863
00:39:05,802 --> 00:39:09,222
"Oh, my God. I'm so glad
you shared that with me. Thank you."

864
00:39:09,305 --> 00:39:11,057
And he goes, "Bullshit."

865
00:39:11,516 --> 00:39:13,768
-[audience laughs]
-[Brené] And I was like, "What?"

866
00:39:13,852 --> 00:39:15,144
And he said, "Bullshit.

867
00:39:15,228 --> 00:39:18,857
And don't start quoting your research
on men and shame to me, either.

868
00:39:19,148 --> 00:39:21,317
That's bullshit. Here's what you want.

869
00:39:21,401 --> 00:39:23,695
You want the guy
that, when the speedboat comes,

870
00:39:23,778 --> 00:39:25,238
he takes all six of the kids,

871
00:39:26,447 --> 00:39:29,242
throws them,
then swims so fast, catches them,

872
00:39:29,617 --> 00:39:31,536
sets them down on the rock

873
00:39:31,953 --> 00:39:34,497
and then looks across the lake
at you and goes,

874
00:39:34,581 --> 00:39:36,958
'Don't worry,  little lady.
I've got this.'"

875
00:39:37,625 --> 00:39:39,544
He's like, "That's what you want."

876
00:39:41,212 --> 00:39:43,923
And I was like, "Oh, my God." I mean...

877
00:39:44,924 --> 00:39:47,802
We're in the perfect shame dance now,
right?

878
00:39:49,554 --> 00:39:51,639
So when you think about feminine norms,

879
00:39:51,723 --> 00:39:55,143
what's the number one shame trigger
around feminine norms?

880
00:39:55,226 --> 00:39:59,522
-[audience members speak indistinctly]
-Body image. Appearance and body image.

881
00:39:59,606 --> 00:40:02,567
And for masculine norms,
it's don't be perceived as what?

882
00:40:02,984 --> 00:40:04,694
-[audience] Weak.
-[Brené] Right.

883
00:40:04,777 --> 00:40:07,322
So here we are, in this complete...

884
00:40:07,864 --> 00:40:10,491
shame lockdown, right?

885
00:40:11,784 --> 00:40:13,077
And so I look at him--

886
00:40:13,161 --> 00:40:15,330
And, you know,
I often say about these situations,

887
00:40:15,413 --> 00:40:17,498
"You show me a woman
who can sit with a man

888
00:40:17,582 --> 00:40:21,169
in real shame and fear and vulnerability

889
00:40:21,544 --> 00:40:22,879
and just be with him,

890
00:40:22,962 --> 00:40:25,214
I'll show you a woman who's done her work

891
00:40:25,590 --> 00:40:28,593
and doesn't derive her status or power
from that guy.

892
00:40:29,135 --> 00:40:30,428
-You show me a guy--
-[man] Whoo!

893
00:40:30,511 --> 00:40:31,512
Yeah.

894
00:40:31,596 --> 00:40:33,431
-That's a whoo, right? Yes.
-[man] Yeah.

895
00:40:33,514 --> 00:40:35,642
-[audience laughs]
-[Brené] It is a whoo. It's whoo-worthy.

896
00:40:35,725 --> 00:40:36,851
Yeah, I like it.

897
00:40:37,143 --> 00:40:39,145
You show me a guy
who can sit with a woman

898
00:40:39,228 --> 00:40:41,522
who's in real shame
and fear and vulnerability

899
00:40:41,606 --> 00:40:43,441
and not fix anything

900
00:40:43,733 --> 00:40:45,276
but just listen.

901
00:40:45,610 --> 00:40:47,195
I'll show you a guy...

902
00:40:48,029 --> 00:40:50,823
who's done his work
and doesn't derive his power and status

903
00:40:50,907 --> 00:40:53,952
from being Oz, the fixer of all things.

904
00:40:54,702 --> 00:40:56,829
You know? We got work to do, right?

905
00:40:57,205 --> 00:40:59,624
So I looked at Steve,
and this was the hard part,

906
00:40:59,707 --> 00:41:02,460
'cause I knew I had to be honest,
and I said, "Look, ten years ago,

907
00:41:02,543 --> 00:41:05,046
I would have said the right thing
based on the research.

908
00:41:05,129 --> 00:41:08,257
And then, one or two days later,
when you were not suspecting it,

909
00:41:08,591 --> 00:41:10,677
you would have said, 'Hey,
I'm taking the kids tubing.'

910
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:13,513
And I would have said,
'Are you sure you're feeling up to it?'"

911
00:41:15,556 --> 00:41:16,683
Which is crushing, right?

912
00:41:19,143 --> 00:41:23,690
We usually reserve
using people's vulnerability against them

913
00:41:23,773 --> 00:41:25,566
for the people we love the most.

914
00:41:26,484 --> 00:41:28,194
Why? Because...

915
00:41:28,903 --> 00:41:30,905
I mean, to be honest with you,

916
00:41:30,989 --> 00:41:34,659
I wasn't raised with a father who modeled
what vulnerability looked like in guys,

917
00:41:35,410 --> 00:41:36,869
and it scares me.

918
00:41:37,328 --> 00:41:40,999
And that's why. We're scared
when we see vulnerability in other people.

919
00:41:41,082 --> 00:41:42,875
To be honest with you, we're just scared.

920
00:41:43,710 --> 00:41:45,378
And I said,
"I would have done that to you,

921
00:41:45,461 --> 00:41:49,465
and God, if I start making amends now,
and we're together for another 30 years,

922
00:41:49,549 --> 00:41:50,842
it'll probably take me that long.

923
00:41:50,925 --> 00:41:54,512
And, I guess, the most meaningful thing
I can do is not do that.

924
00:41:55,013 --> 00:41:56,514
Five years ago,
I would've said the right thing,

925
00:41:56,597 --> 00:42:00,268
and I think I would've maybe done
the right thing, but today, Steve,

926
00:42:00,351 --> 00:42:03,021
you are the most important thing
in my life.

927
00:42:04,355 --> 00:42:07,734
And to be able to see you and know you
is the greatest privilege of my life,

928
00:42:07,817 --> 00:42:11,571
and to be seen by you
is the most important thing in my life.

929
00:42:11,821 --> 00:42:13,322
We are all we have."

930
00:42:15,074 --> 00:42:17,869
How many of you want more love,
intimacy...

931
00:42:18,411 --> 00:42:20,163
in your lives? Joy?

932
00:42:20,913 --> 00:42:22,749
You can't have that

933
00:42:22,832 --> 00:42:24,751
if you don't let yourself be seen.

934
00:42:24,834 --> 00:42:28,129
How can you let yourself be loved
if you can't be seen?

935
00:42:28,212 --> 00:42:29,422
-Does that make sense?
-[audience] Yes.

936
00:42:30,214 --> 00:42:32,258
Vulnerability is the path
back to each other,

937
00:42:32,341 --> 00:42:34,510
but we're so afraid to get on it.

938
00:42:35,636 --> 00:42:37,513
You know,
and we end up hurting each other a lot,

939
00:42:37,764 --> 00:42:40,933
and for me, that day changed everything
in our marriage.

940
00:42:41,517 --> 00:42:42,769
For one,
I don't think we've had a fight

941
00:42:42,852 --> 00:42:45,354
since that day where we don't say,
"The story I'm telling myself,"

942
00:42:45,438 --> 00:42:48,441
even if it's like,
[angrily] "The story I'm telling myself."

943
00:42:48,524 --> 00:42:50,318
-[audience laughs]
-[Brené] Um...

944
00:42:50,985 --> 00:42:52,028
For me, it was a great story

945
00:42:52,111 --> 00:42:53,696
'cause, it ended up,
then we went upstairs,

946
00:42:53,780 --> 00:42:55,740
he popped me on the butt with a towel.

947
00:42:56,240 --> 00:42:58,242
He said, "I love you. I see you.

948
00:42:58,326 --> 00:43:00,828
You still rock the Speedo," which is love.

949
00:43:00,912 --> 00:43:02,038
-[audience laughs]
-Um...

950
00:43:02,121 --> 00:43:03,790
It's total love.

951
00:43:04,582 --> 00:43:08,252
We want it so bad, but we're so afraid

952
00:43:08,711 --> 00:43:10,213
to let ourselves be seen,

953
00:43:10,671 --> 00:43:12,548
and we're so afraid to see people.

954
00:43:12,965 --> 00:43:14,801
But again, it's the only way back.

955
00:43:15,384 --> 00:43:19,388
So let's look at some of the real,
concrete issues around vulnerability.

956
00:43:19,472 --> 00:43:21,724
So the thing that we tell ourselves is,

957
00:43:21,808 --> 00:43:23,643
"Why do you want me to be vulnerable?

958
00:43:23,726 --> 00:43:27,814
Vulnerability is like the gooey center
of hard emotion.

959
00:43:27,897 --> 00:43:32,235
Shame, fear, grief, scarcity.
Why should I do that? Why should I--

960
00:43:32,318 --> 00:43:33,361
Why should I feel them,

961
00:43:33,444 --> 00:43:35,571
and why should I let
other people see them? Like,

962
00:43:35,655 --> 00:43:38,866
I don't want to vulnerable.
I want to armor up.

963
00:43:38,950 --> 00:43:40,535
I want to stay protected."

964
00:43:40,618 --> 00:43:42,495
Here's the problem with the armor.

965
00:43:42,578 --> 00:43:44,455
The problem with the armor
is that vulnerability,

966
00:43:44,539 --> 00:43:47,500
yeah, is totally the center of these,

967
00:43:47,583 --> 00:43:50,378
but it's also the birthplace of these...

968
00:43:51,963 --> 00:43:53,631
How many of you love someone?

969
00:43:55,341 --> 00:43:56,342
Right.

970
00:43:58,094 --> 00:43:59,804
Are you 100% sure...

971
00:44:00,721 --> 00:44:04,809
that person will always love you back?
Will never leave? Will never get sick?

972
00:44:05,184 --> 00:44:07,645
How many of you have ever buried
someone you love?

973
00:44:08,729 --> 00:44:10,857
How many of you have lost
someone you love?

974
00:44:12,984 --> 00:44:17,280
To love is to be vulnerable.
To give someone your heart and say,

975
00:44:19,031 --> 00:44:21,993
"I know this could hurt so bad,
but I'm willing to do it.

976
00:44:22,076 --> 00:44:24,203
I'm willing to be vulnerable
and love you."

977
00:44:25,079 --> 00:44:27,832
And there is an increasing number
of people in the world today

978
00:44:27,915 --> 00:44:30,001
that are not willing to take that risk.

979
00:44:30,501 --> 00:44:32,295
They'd rather never know love

980
00:44:32,837 --> 00:44:33,880
than to know hurt...

981
00:44:34,630 --> 00:44:38,467
or grief, and that is a huge price to pay.

982
00:44:38,968 --> 00:44:40,094
Belonging.

983
00:44:40,178 --> 00:44:41,470
We're wired for love.

984
00:44:41,554 --> 00:44:44,515
We're hardwired for belonging.
It's in our DNA.

985
00:44:44,599 --> 00:44:45,766
And let me tell you,

986
00:44:46,142 --> 00:44:48,644
we are in the midst of what I would call

987
00:44:48,728 --> 00:44:51,731
a political and social shitshow right now.

988
00:44:52,148 --> 00:44:55,067
-[audience laughs]
-[Brené] It's a cultural nightmare. Um...

989
00:44:56,944 --> 00:44:58,029
It is.

990
00:44:59,572 --> 00:45:02,700
And we want belonging
in the midst of this thing, right?

991
00:45:02,783 --> 00:45:04,118
Let me tell you what belonging is.

992
00:45:04,202 --> 00:45:07,914
The opposite of belonging,
from the research, is fitting in.

993
00:45:09,207 --> 00:45:13,294
That's the opposite of belonging.
Fitting in is assessing and acclimating.

994
00:45:13,878 --> 00:45:16,172
"Here's what I should say, be.
Here's what I shouldn't say.

995
00:45:16,255 --> 00:45:17,882
Here's what I should avoid talking about.

996
00:45:17,965 --> 00:45:20,801
Here's what I should dress like,
look like." That's fitting in.

997
00:45:22,345 --> 00:45:23,179
Belonging...

998
00:45:24,222 --> 00:45:26,933
is belonging to yourself first.

999
00:45:27,850 --> 00:45:30,019
Speaking your truth, telling your story,

1000
00:45:30,102 --> 00:45:32,855
and never betraying yourself
for other people.

1001
00:45:33,314 --> 00:45:36,859
True belonging doesn't require you
to change who you are.

1002
00:45:37,276 --> 00:45:39,654
It requires you to be who you are,

1003
00:45:39,737 --> 00:45:41,239
and that's vulnerable.

1004
00:45:41,906 --> 00:45:46,035
And then the last of this big list is joy.

1005
00:45:46,369 --> 00:45:49,747
And I'm coming at you as someone
who studies shame and fear and scarcity.

1006
00:45:49,830 --> 00:45:54,335
I'm here to tell you that joy is
the most vulnerable of all human emotions.

1007
00:45:54,585 --> 00:45:57,797
We are terrified to feel joy.

1008
00:45:58,464 --> 00:46:01,926
We are so afraid
that if we let ourselves feel joy,

1009
00:46:02,593 --> 00:46:06,389
something will come along
and rip it away from us,

1010
00:46:06,472 --> 00:46:11,143
and we will get sucker punched
by pain and trauma and loss.

1011
00:46:11,477 --> 00:46:16,399
So that, in the midst of great things,
we literally dress rehearse tragedy.

1012
00:46:17,733 --> 00:46:19,944
How many of you are parents
in the audience?

1013
00:46:20,027 --> 00:46:23,489
How many have ever stood over your child
while they're sleeping and thought,

1014
00:46:23,572 --> 00:46:27,076
[exhales] "I love you
like I didn't know was possible"?

1015
00:46:27,159 --> 00:46:28,244
And in that split second,

1016
00:46:28,327 --> 00:46:30,413
you picture something horrific happening
to your child?

1017
00:46:31,998 --> 00:46:33,958
Ninety-five percent of parents do that.

1018
00:46:34,542 --> 00:46:35,584
Non-parenting example:

1019
00:46:35,668 --> 00:46:36,836
You wake up.

1020
00:46:36,919 --> 00:46:38,337
You're like, "Hey.

1021
00:46:38,421 --> 00:46:40,548
I feel pretty good. Working out.

1022
00:46:41,674 --> 00:46:43,050
Family's good.

1023
00:46:43,384 --> 00:46:44,635
House is good.

1024
00:46:45,094 --> 00:46:46,262
Holy shit."

1025
00:46:46,345 --> 00:46:48,347
[audience laughs]

1026
00:46:49,307 --> 00:46:50,391
Yes or no?

1027
00:46:50,474 --> 00:46:51,309
[audience] Yes.

1028
00:46:51,392 --> 00:46:52,977
[Brené] Like, "Oh, my God.

1029
00:46:53,853 --> 00:46:56,772
What's gonna happen next?"
We're waiting for the other shoe to drop.

1030
00:46:56,856 --> 00:46:58,190
Here's a great example.

1031
00:47:00,985 --> 00:47:03,321
The very first time I got to meet Oprah,

1032
00:47:04,780 --> 00:47:07,616
got to fly to Chicago
and do SuperSoul Sunday.

1033
00:47:08,492 --> 00:47:11,078
So... [chuckling] I'm leaving the house.

1034
00:47:12,121 --> 00:47:14,707
I get in the car
that's gonna take me to the airport.

1035
00:47:14,790 --> 00:47:16,876
I get out of the car,
and I go back in the house.

1036
00:47:17,585 --> 00:47:20,838
And I said, "Steve."
And he goes, "Oh, God, no."

1037
00:47:20,921 --> 00:47:21,922
[audience laughs]

1038
00:47:22,006 --> 00:47:24,091
And I said-- No, really. I said,

1039
00:47:24,884 --> 00:47:27,720
"The chance of me making it
to Chicago are slim.

1040
00:47:27,803 --> 00:47:28,888
[audience laughs]

1041
00:47:28,971 --> 00:47:32,016
Because this is too good to be true."

1042
00:47:32,683 --> 00:47:36,145
And he goes, "I hate it when you do this.
I really hate it when you do this."

1043
00:47:36,228 --> 00:47:39,440
And I was like, "I want you to remarry.

1044
00:47:40,358 --> 00:47:44,236
I... I want you to find someone to love.

1045
00:47:44,528 --> 00:47:46,864
I want you to wait
an appropriate amount of time,

1046
00:47:46,947 --> 00:47:49,575
but I want you to find someone else."

1047
00:47:50,242 --> 00:47:52,828
And he's like, "I got it. Go," you know.
And I said,

1048
00:47:53,829 --> 00:47:58,542
"And I've been thinking about it a lot.
In the right hand drawer of my study--"

1049
00:47:58,626 --> 00:48:00,920
And he's like, "Oh, my God.

1050
00:48:01,003 --> 00:48:04,632
Did you write a list of people
you think I should marry?"

1051
00:48:06,342 --> 00:48:08,260
And I was like, "No.

1052
00:48:08,344 --> 00:48:11,305
But I wrote a list of people
you damn well better not marry.

1053
00:48:11,389 --> 00:48:13,140
[audience laughs]

1054
00:48:13,224 --> 00:48:14,892
[Brené] Because I need to make sure...

1055
00:48:17,686 --> 00:48:19,105
[audience laughs]

1056
00:48:20,481 --> 00:48:23,109
...that if you marry somebody
on this list,

1057
00:48:23,651 --> 00:48:24,860
I'll be back.

1058
00:48:26,779 --> 00:48:28,823
And it won't be fun, like in the movies."

1059
00:48:28,906 --> 00:48:31,784
And he's like, "You've gotta get
in the car, or I'm gonna remarry.

1060
00:48:31,867 --> 00:48:33,077
Like-- Like, go."

1061
00:48:34,662 --> 00:48:36,580
How many of you do that thing?

1062
00:48:36,664 --> 00:48:38,165
That foreboding joy?

1063
00:48:38,457 --> 00:48:42,420
Because when we lose our capacity
for vulnerability, joy becomes foreboding.

1064
00:48:43,129 --> 00:48:46,132
It becomes scary to let ourselves feel it.

1065
00:48:46,215 --> 00:48:50,803
And the research participants
who had the ability to lean fully into joy

1066
00:48:50,886 --> 00:48:53,180
only shared one variable in common.

1067
00:48:53,264 --> 00:48:56,100
They only shared one thing
across all the variables.

1068
00:48:56,183 --> 00:48:59,520
The people who could really lean into joy,
they didn't dress rehearse tragedy.

1069
00:48:59,603 --> 00:49:01,939
They didn't practice the terrible things.

1070
00:49:02,022 --> 00:49:04,692
They just leaned in. What do you think
the one thing they share is?

1071
00:49:04,775 --> 00:49:05,776
[man] Gratitude.

1072
00:49:05,860 --> 00:49:06,944
Gratitude.

1073
00:49:07,778 --> 00:49:09,947
Gratitude. They practiced gratitude.

1074
00:49:10,531 --> 00:49:13,909
Because here's the thing.
Vulnerability has a real physiology.

1075
00:49:13,993 --> 00:49:16,078
It has a real tremor.

1076
00:49:16,495 --> 00:49:17,746
Something inside of us.

1077
00:49:17,830 --> 00:49:20,499
When we feel vulnerable,
our body is like, "Whew."

1078
00:49:20,791 --> 00:49:25,838
Some people use that as a warning
to start dress-rehearsing for bad things.

1079
00:49:25,921 --> 00:49:29,300
Some of us try to use it
as a reminder to be grateful.

1080
00:49:29,925 --> 00:49:31,844
Like,
I'll never forget standing at the door

1081
00:49:31,927 --> 00:49:34,722
watching my daughter, Ellen,
walk to the car

1082
00:49:34,805 --> 00:49:37,725
with her boyfriend
in her senior year to senior prom.

1083
00:49:38,350 --> 00:49:40,769
And I'm standing there,
and they're walking towards his truck,

1084
00:49:40,853 --> 00:49:42,855
and what's the only thing
I'm thinking about?

1085
00:49:42,938 --> 00:49:45,566
-[audience laughs and mumbles]
-Car crash, right?

1086
00:49:46,859 --> 00:49:49,528
And I remember just going,
"I'm so grateful. Y'all have fun.

1087
00:49:49,612 --> 00:49:53,699
I'm so grateful. I'm super grateful for...

1088
00:49:54,992 --> 00:49:56,660
being a part of this process.

1089
00:49:56,744 --> 00:49:58,120
I'm grateful."

1090
00:49:58,496 --> 00:50:00,080
Charlie, my son, was standing next to me,

1091
00:50:00,164 --> 00:50:03,292
and he kinda looked around at Steve,
on the other side, and he goes,

1092
00:50:03,751 --> 00:50:05,252
"What's wrong with Mom?"

1093
00:50:05,336 --> 00:50:08,839
And he said,
"Let her keep saying how grateful she is,

1094
00:50:08,923 --> 00:50:10,883
otherwise things will get
really dangerous.

1095
00:50:10,966 --> 00:50:13,093
Just, grateful. We're all grateful!"

1096
00:50:13,594 --> 00:50:15,596
-[audience laughs]
-[Brené] Um...

1097
00:50:17,264 --> 00:50:20,434
But gratitude is also vulnerable, right?

1098
00:50:21,101 --> 00:50:22,228
Gratitude is also vulnerable.

1099
00:50:22,311 --> 00:50:24,438
Sometimes we're afraid to feel it
'cause we feel like,

1100
00:50:24,522 --> 00:50:26,524
is that dangerous to say
I'm grateful for something

1101
00:50:26,607 --> 00:50:29,902
because then is someone listening
and saying, "Ooh, I can take that away."

1102
00:50:29,985 --> 00:50:32,238
Like, I don't--
My God doesn't work that way.

1103
00:50:32,613 --> 00:50:34,448
But sometimes I fear it anyway.

1104
00:50:35,157 --> 00:50:40,079
I've had this incredible experience, um,
doing this research over the past,

1105
00:50:40,162 --> 00:50:41,997
I don't know,
probably 15 years especially,

1106
00:50:42,081 --> 00:50:44,291
where I've had the honor of sitting across

1107
00:50:44,375 --> 00:50:47,127
from people who have survived
tremendous things.

1108
00:50:47,211 --> 00:50:52,132
Um, mass shootings,
the death of children, genocide.

1109
00:50:53,175 --> 00:50:57,054
And... really trying to understand...

1110
00:50:57,721 --> 00:51:02,101
from them what we can do better
collectively to show up...

1111
00:51:02,977 --> 00:51:04,770
in a compassionate way.

1112
00:51:05,688 --> 00:51:10,776
And it's an interesting swirl of variables
around joy and gratitude and compassion.

1113
00:51:10,859 --> 00:51:13,279
And so, there are three things I learned.

1114
00:51:14,029 --> 00:51:17,157
The first was,
across all of these interviews,

1115
00:51:17,241 --> 00:51:18,367
they said the same thing.

1116
00:51:18,450 --> 00:51:21,745
No matter what the trauma was
that they were recovering from, they said,

1117
00:51:22,246 --> 00:51:24,623
"When you are grateful for what you have,

1118
00:51:25,457 --> 00:51:30,588
I understand that you understand
the magnitude of what I've lost."

1119
00:51:32,381 --> 00:51:35,884
So often we're afraid to be grateful
for what we have,

1120
00:51:35,968 --> 00:51:39,847
especially in front of people
who've gone through great trauma and loss

1121
00:51:39,930 --> 00:51:41,640
'cause we think it's insensitive.

1122
00:51:43,475 --> 00:51:44,602
But it's really hard

1123
00:51:44,685 --> 00:51:47,062
because for those of us
who don't want to be grateful,

1124
00:51:47,146 --> 00:51:50,065
to show a picture of our child to someone
maybe who's lost a child,

1125
00:51:50,149 --> 00:51:51,942
what they see is,

1126
00:51:53,277 --> 00:51:55,904
"Not only are you not going to talk to me
about your child,

1127
00:51:55,988 --> 00:51:58,616
me talking about my loss
and child is not on the table either."

1128
00:52:00,117 --> 00:52:04,163
You know? So I think gratitude,
in some ways, is healing for people,

1129
00:52:04,496 --> 00:52:06,498
and we don't think about it that way.

1130
00:52:06,582 --> 00:52:08,542
The second thing that I learned

1131
00:52:08,626 --> 00:52:11,754
that changed me as well
is this idea that when I said,

1132
00:52:11,837 --> 00:52:14,590
"Tell me about the grief,
the longing, the loss,"

1133
00:52:14,673 --> 00:52:18,052
and they said the thing
that surprised them the most

1134
00:52:18,135 --> 00:52:21,096
was how they missed
the ordinary moments

1135
00:52:21,180 --> 00:52:22,681
more than anything else.

1136
00:52:23,515 --> 00:52:25,893
That they missed the simple,
ordinary things

1137
00:52:25,976 --> 00:52:29,521
that they never really took notice of
when they were happening.

1138
00:52:30,814 --> 00:52:34,109
One woman told me, "I used to get
these crazy texts from my mom

1139
00:52:34,193 --> 00:52:36,445
because she never quite learned
how to use her phone.

1140
00:52:36,528 --> 00:52:39,531
And I was like, 'Man, learn how to use
your phone, Mom, then text me.'

1141
00:52:39,615 --> 00:52:41,950
And now I would kill for a text
from my mom.

1142
00:52:42,034 --> 00:52:44,203
I wouldn't care, you know,
how many emojis were in it.

1143
00:52:44,286 --> 00:52:47,289
Just something from my mom,
but she's gone now."

1144
00:52:48,624 --> 00:52:49,458
Or someone--

1145
00:52:49,541 --> 00:52:53,629
A couple whose child had died of cancer,
a four-year-old.

1146
00:52:54,755 --> 00:52:57,591
And they said, you know, "We used to get
on him all the time and say,

1147
00:52:57,675 --> 00:53:00,219
'Man, stop slamming the screen door.'"

1148
00:53:00,302 --> 00:53:03,472
This was his, like--
This was his signature move, you know.

1149
00:53:03,555 --> 00:53:04,807
Just... [imitates door slamming]

1150
00:53:04,890 --> 00:53:07,601
And he said, "Sometimes me and my husband
just stand at the back door

1151
00:53:07,685 --> 00:53:10,688
and just slam it for five or ten minutes,
just to hear it."

1152
00:53:11,355 --> 00:53:13,941
You know, there's these--
And for all of us,

1153
00:53:14,024 --> 00:53:17,236
I think, for me, the lesson was,
and you can take it if it fits...

1154
00:53:17,945 --> 00:53:22,074
I get so busy sometimes
chasing the extraordinary moments

1155
00:53:22,157 --> 00:53:25,202
that I don't pay attention
to the ordinary moments.

1156
00:53:25,285 --> 00:53:28,706
The moments that, if taken away,
I would miss more than anything.

1157
00:53:29,790 --> 00:53:32,626
You know? My daughter has
this really interesting thing.

1158
00:53:33,168 --> 00:53:34,169
She was probably...

1159
00:53:35,337 --> 00:53:37,798
ten, maybe nine at the time,

1160
00:53:37,881 --> 00:53:40,384
and I picked her up from school
in Houston, where we live,

1161
00:53:40,467 --> 00:53:43,595
and we went to Hermann Park,
and we were on one of those paddle boats.

1162
00:53:43,679 --> 00:53:45,681
I brought some old bread,
and we were feeding the ducks.

1163
00:53:45,764 --> 00:53:47,516
I looked over and she was like this...

1164
00:53:48,892 --> 00:53:51,019
I was like, "Are you okay?"
And she goes...

1165
00:53:52,229 --> 00:53:53,522
[audience laughs]

1166
00:53:53,605 --> 00:53:56,191
And finally, she said, "Yeah, I'm good."
And I was like, "What are you doing?"

1167
00:53:56,275 --> 00:53:58,527
And she goes,
"I was making a picture memory."

1168
00:53:59,403 --> 00:54:02,531
And I said, "What's a picture memory?"
And she said, "Sometimes,

1169
00:54:02,823 --> 00:54:05,075
when I'm really grateful,
and things are just amazing,

1170
00:54:05,159 --> 00:54:07,286
I close my eyes and take a picture memory,

1171
00:54:07,369 --> 00:54:10,873
so when I feel lonely or things are hard,
I can remember it."

1172
00:54:11,498 --> 00:54:14,877
You know, I think the picture memory
is a lot better than our phone.

1173
00:54:15,210 --> 00:54:19,631
You know, I think taking a moment
and just committing to just that feeling.

1174
00:54:20,299 --> 00:54:22,217
What were we in, in that moment?

1175
00:54:23,051 --> 00:54:27,723
The next thing which is really hard
for me, and I'll be honest,

1176
00:54:27,806 --> 00:54:32,936
is sometimes just do the joyful thing
for the hell of it.

1177
00:54:33,020 --> 00:54:34,772
Just choose joy sometimes.

1178
00:54:34,855 --> 00:54:38,192
Just choose a thing
that seems frivolous and fun

1179
00:54:38,275 --> 00:54:41,987
and has no ROI or payoff or upside.

1180
00:54:42,070 --> 00:54:44,239
Just do the joyful thing.

1181
00:54:44,323 --> 00:54:46,950
You know? And, you know,
Stuart Brown, who studies play,

1182
00:54:47,034 --> 00:54:51,455
defines play
as time spent without purpose.

1183
00:54:52,039 --> 00:54:54,333
-Like, I call that an anxiety attack.
-[audience laughs]

1184
00:54:54,416 --> 00:54:58,378
Like-- Like,
I-- I have a hard time doing that,

1185
00:54:58,712 --> 00:54:59,880
just choosing joy.

1186
00:54:59,963 --> 00:55:02,299
But Charlie, who's 13 now,

1187
00:55:02,382 --> 00:55:05,803
last year when he was in sixth grade,
he came to me one day and he said,

1188
00:55:06,094 --> 00:55:07,763
"I really need to up my grade
in this class.

1189
00:55:07,846 --> 00:55:10,015
I really want to do it."
I said, "Your grade's fine."

1190
00:55:10,682 --> 00:55:13,852
And he said, "No, I-- I think
I really want to try." And I said, "Okay."

1191
00:55:13,936 --> 00:55:16,230
A week later he comes home and said,
"We got a huge project.

1192
00:55:16,313 --> 00:55:18,232
It's a big one." And I said, "Okay."

1193
00:55:18,315 --> 00:55:20,776
He said, "I was just gonna do it
tomorrow morning before school,

1194
00:55:20,859 --> 00:55:22,694
but maybe I should just dig in."

1195
00:55:22,778 --> 00:55:24,947
And I said, "Okay. Let's do it."

1196
00:55:25,030 --> 00:55:27,825
And he said, "It's an art project."
I'm like, "Oh, my God.

1197
00:55:27,908 --> 00:55:30,702
I have an art and craft supply
addiction issue.

1198
00:55:30,786 --> 00:55:33,997
So I was like,
"Let's go to the craft closet." Um...

1199
00:55:34,081 --> 00:55:37,626
And so he had to make a gladiator helmet
out of, like, paper.

1200
00:55:37,709 --> 00:55:39,920
And so he starts making it,
and I'm kinda watching.

1201
00:55:40,003 --> 00:55:43,465
Every now and then I have an idea,
and he's like, "Eh," which is good.

1202
00:55:43,924 --> 00:55:47,177
And he's like, "You know, you're allowed
to write something on it if you want to.

1203
00:55:47,261 --> 00:55:49,137
Should I take a chance
and write something on it?

1204
00:55:49,221 --> 00:55:50,848
I have a funny idea,
but it's kinda weird."

1205
00:55:50,931 --> 00:55:52,808
And I was like, "Take a chance."

1206
00:55:53,308 --> 00:55:55,769
So he writes on it, and he shows it to me,

1207
00:55:55,853 --> 00:55:58,647
and his gladiator helmet says,
"I run with scissors."

1208
00:55:58,730 --> 00:56:02,985
-[audience laughs]
-And I think it's really funny, right?

1209
00:56:03,485 --> 00:56:07,823
So he takes it to school,
and I'm like, "How'd it go?"

1210
00:56:07,906 --> 00:56:09,825
And he's like,
"Yeah, I think it was pretty good."

1211
00:56:09,908 --> 00:56:12,619
The next day he comes home,
and he goes, "Oh, my God.

1212
00:56:12,703 --> 00:56:15,163
I won first place.

1213
00:56:15,539 --> 00:56:18,083
The best gladiator helmet in sixth grade."

1214
00:56:18,417 --> 00:56:20,168
And I was like, "Oh, my God, Charlie.

1215
00:56:20,252 --> 00:56:22,129
Effort and you took a chance.

1216
00:56:22,212 --> 00:56:24,464
Like, effort and taking a chance
doesn't always pay off,

1217
00:56:24,548 --> 00:56:25,841
but I don't see anything, really,

1218
00:56:25,924 --> 00:56:28,135
that pays off without effort
or taking a chance,

1219
00:56:28,218 --> 00:56:29,386
so there you go." And he goes,

1220
00:56:29,469 --> 00:56:33,390
"She said I could have points added
to my final grade,

1221
00:56:33,473 --> 00:56:35,100
or, like, a secret treasure."

1222
00:56:35,183 --> 00:56:38,061
And I was like, "Oh, how many points
are you getting added to your grade?"

1223
00:56:38,145 --> 00:56:39,354
He goes...

1224
00:56:40,439 --> 00:56:43,692
-"What? I picked the secret treasure."
-[audience laughs]

1225
00:56:46,236 --> 00:56:48,071
"Yes, that's good.

1226
00:56:48,822 --> 00:56:51,241
Right on!" It was like a Pokémon pencil.

1227
00:56:51,909 --> 00:56:52,826
I was like,

1228
00:56:53,243 --> 00:56:54,077
"What?

1229
00:56:55,203 --> 00:56:57,706
Secret treasure?"
So now every now and then, I'm like,

1230
00:56:57,789 --> 00:57:01,627
"I could do this and it could get me here,
or I could just pick the secret treasure."

1231
00:57:02,210 --> 00:57:04,296
The joy, right? Just the joy.

1232
00:57:05,631 --> 00:57:10,802
Work is another place where vulnerability
gives birth to really important things.

1233
00:57:11,970 --> 00:57:13,931
Empathy, trust.

1234
00:57:14,264 --> 00:57:15,140
Look...

1235
00:57:16,183 --> 00:57:18,143
people call me all the time and say,

1236
00:57:18,226 --> 00:57:19,853
"Can you come talk
to our leadership team?"

1237
00:57:19,937 --> 00:57:22,940
I spend about 90% of my time now
doing leadership work.

1238
00:57:23,023 --> 00:57:24,399
"Can you come talk to our team?"

1239
00:57:24,483 --> 00:57:27,402
"What do you want me to talk about?"
"Anything but vulnerability and shame."

1240
00:57:27,486 --> 00:57:29,655
I'm like, "No, I'm not you."
They're like--

1241
00:57:29,738 --> 00:57:32,157
This is my favorite one.
Someone said, "Well...

1242
00:57:33,116 --> 00:57:34,701
fourth-quarter earnings."

1243
00:57:34,785 --> 00:57:37,079
I was like, "I don't give a shit
about your fourth-quarter earnings."

1244
00:57:37,162 --> 00:57:39,706
Like, I'm like, "What am I gonna talk
to you about?"

1245
00:57:39,790 --> 00:57:40,707
They're like,

1246
00:57:40,791 --> 00:57:43,418
"We have a huge creativity
and innovation problem."

1247
00:57:43,502 --> 00:57:46,046
I'm like, "But you don't want
to talk about vulnerability?"

1248
00:57:47,881 --> 00:57:50,300
No vulnerability, no creativity.

1249
00:57:50,634 --> 00:57:53,679
No tolerance for failure, no innovation.

1250
00:57:54,012 --> 00:57:55,263
It is that simple.

1251
00:57:55,681 --> 00:57:58,642
If you're not willing to fail,
you can't innovate.

1252
00:57:58,725 --> 00:58:01,979
If you're not willing
to build a vulnerable culture,

1253
00:58:02,604 --> 00:58:03,897
you can't create.

1254
00:58:04,523 --> 00:58:06,024
It's just that simple.

1255
00:58:07,526 --> 00:58:09,486
Inclusivity, equity, diversity.

1256
00:58:10,612 --> 00:58:13,573
We're in the middle
of really important movements right now,

1257
00:58:13,657 --> 00:58:16,576
movements that I hope
will change the world.

1258
00:58:16,660 --> 00:58:19,204
Black Lives Matter, Me Too, Time's Up.

1259
00:58:19,287 --> 00:58:21,248
-These are-- These are big...
-[audience applauds]

1260
00:58:23,917 --> 00:58:25,419
These are big movements.

1261
00:58:25,502 --> 00:58:28,213
Trans Lives Matter.
These are movements that matter,

1262
00:58:28,797 --> 00:58:31,758
and these are movements
that have the potential to change things.

1263
00:58:32,718 --> 00:58:37,305
What happens is, every organization
I go into right now, they say,

1264
00:58:37,514 --> 00:58:39,391
"We don't know
how to have these conversations.

1265
00:58:39,474 --> 00:58:41,268
They're incredibly uncomfortable.

1266
00:58:42,519 --> 00:58:44,855
We're afraid
we're gonna say the wrong thing.

1267
00:58:46,231 --> 00:58:48,859
We're afraid that what I say
won't match my heart.

1268
00:58:49,818 --> 00:58:51,570
I'll be taken the wrong way.

1269
00:58:51,653 --> 00:58:53,030
People will make assumptions."

1270
00:58:53,113 --> 00:58:57,117
And so, I think there's
a very clear answer here, which is,

1271
00:58:57,993 --> 00:59:02,914
first, to not have the conversations
because they make you uncomfortable

1272
00:59:02,998 --> 00:59:04,916
is the definition of privilege.

1273
00:59:05,250 --> 00:59:08,003
Your comfort is not at the center
of this discussion.

1274
00:59:08,086 --> 00:59:10,422
Like, that is not how this works.

1275
00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:13,258
It just doesn't work that way.

1276
00:59:13,341 --> 00:59:17,262
Of course you're going to get your ass
handed to you in these conversations.

1277
00:59:17,345 --> 00:59:20,182
And the whiter, straighter, Christian,

1278
00:59:20,265 --> 00:59:22,934
majority culture you are,
the more mistakes you're gonna make.

1279
00:59:23,018 --> 00:59:25,187
It's not a question about
whether you have a bias or not,

1280
00:59:25,270 --> 00:59:28,982
it's what biases do you have,
and how many, and how bad, and how deep?

1281
00:59:29,066 --> 00:59:30,484
That's going to happen.

1282
00:59:30,942 --> 00:59:33,904
That's what we sign up for
when we have these conversations.

1283
00:59:35,614 --> 00:59:38,450
That's how it works. And then you listen,

1284
00:59:39,576 --> 00:59:41,203
and you learn,

1285
00:59:41,286 --> 00:59:43,622
and you don't hold the people accountable.

1286
00:59:43,705 --> 00:59:45,999
You know, the people who are targeted

1287
00:59:46,083 --> 00:59:49,544
by racism and homophobia,
and heterosexism, and gender bias

1288
00:59:49,795 --> 00:59:53,215
are not responsible...
for initiating these conversations

1289
00:59:53,298 --> 00:59:55,634
and building the tables
where they should be happening.

1290
00:59:55,717 --> 00:59:58,136
-[audience applauds]
-That's not-- That's not how this works.

1291
01:00:00,972 --> 01:00:03,475
We have to be able
to choose courage over comfort,

1292
01:00:03,558 --> 01:00:04,976
and we have to say, "Look...

1293
01:00:06,436 --> 01:00:08,563
I don't know that I'm gonna nail this,
but I'm gonna try

1294
01:00:08,647 --> 01:00:11,483
'cause what I'm sure as hell
not gonna do is stay quiet."

1295
01:00:12,859 --> 01:00:14,402
That's what we can't do.

1296
01:00:15,570 --> 01:00:17,489
And so, yeah, you're gonna make
a lot of mistakes.

1297
01:00:17,572 --> 01:00:19,074
Yeah, it's gonna be uncomfortable.

1298
01:00:19,157 --> 01:00:21,284
Yeah, you're gonna learn about blind spots

1299
01:00:21,368 --> 01:00:23,578
that you didn't even know you had.

1300
01:00:24,663 --> 01:00:27,249
And then you're gonna be grateful
for that moment

1301
01:00:27,541 --> 01:00:29,084
and take learning it...

1302
01:00:29,835 --> 01:00:33,338
into your own hands, not make other people
responsible for teaching it,

1303
01:00:34,506 --> 01:00:36,258
and that's how we move forward.

1304
01:00:36,800 --> 01:00:39,594
But if you think there's gonna be
real conversation in this country

1305
01:00:39,678 --> 01:00:41,596
or in companies or organizations

1306
01:00:41,930 --> 01:00:45,350
around equity
and-- and diversity and inclusivity...

1307
01:00:46,351 --> 01:00:48,228
while you remain comfortable,

1308
01:00:50,021 --> 01:00:51,857
that is not gonna happen.

1309
01:00:51,940 --> 01:00:53,400
And it shouldn't happen.

1310
01:00:53,483 --> 01:00:56,444
So when we build cultures at work,

1311
01:00:56,903 --> 01:00:59,406
where there is zero tolerance
for vulnerability,

1312
01:01:00,824 --> 01:01:06,037
where perfectionism and armor
are rewarded and necessary,

1313
01:01:06,872 --> 01:01:09,791
you can't have these conversations.
They're not productive.

1314
01:01:11,334 --> 01:01:15,463
How many of you think, tomorrow,
if I had a magic wand

1315
01:01:15,547 --> 01:01:18,633
and I could wave it at where you work--
it's your office--

1316
01:01:18,717 --> 01:01:20,343
and tomorrow morning
when you walked in,

1317
01:01:20,427 --> 01:01:24,806
everyone in that office had the capacity
for difficult, productive conversation,

1318
01:01:24,890 --> 01:01:27,475
how many of you think
things would change overnight?

1319
01:01:27,934 --> 01:01:30,687
If everyone could have
really hard conversations?

1320
01:01:31,521 --> 01:01:33,398
We can't have them.
You know what we end up doing?

1321
01:01:33,481 --> 01:01:36,735
We end up talking about people
instead of talking to people.

1322
01:01:36,818 --> 01:01:38,278
[scattered applause]

1323
01:01:38,361 --> 01:01:39,321
And it's really--

1324
01:01:39,404 --> 01:01:42,866
It's toxic. It just takes over culture.

1325
01:01:43,700 --> 01:01:45,827
Giving feedback, receiving feedback,

1326
01:01:45,911 --> 01:01:48,622
problem-solving,
ethical decision-making...

1327
01:01:48,914 --> 01:01:51,041
These are all born of vulnerability.

1328
01:01:53,001 --> 01:01:57,214
I understand that work seems
like a hard place to be vulnerable,

1329
01:01:57,297 --> 01:02:00,133
but we spend
more than half of our lives at work,

1330
01:02:01,801 --> 01:02:05,305
and I've never met a single person
or interviewed a single person

1331
01:02:05,388 --> 01:02:06,640
in 20 years

1332
01:02:07,474 --> 01:02:10,852
that had a joyful, wholehearted life
that was miserable at work.

1333
01:02:11,686 --> 01:02:13,438
That stuff will eat you alive.

1334
01:02:14,231 --> 01:02:16,816
And we all have a responsibility
to show up

1335
01:02:17,442 --> 01:02:20,487
and bring our whole hearts
and our whole selves to work

1336
01:02:20,570 --> 01:02:23,698
and lean in to the tough conversations.

1337
01:02:24,115 --> 01:02:28,078
Brave leaders are never silent
around hard things.

1338
01:02:28,662 --> 01:02:31,039
Our job is to excavate the unsaid.

1339
01:02:31,957 --> 01:02:33,917
What is the thing that's not being said?

1340
01:02:34,000 --> 01:02:36,336
And that requires courage
and vulnerability.

1341
01:02:38,088 --> 01:02:40,382
People ask,
"Where do I start with vulnerability?"

1342
01:02:40,465 --> 01:02:43,301
And the best place to start
is dispelling the myths.

1343
01:02:43,385 --> 01:02:46,137
So myth one: Vulnerability is weakness.

1344
01:02:47,222 --> 01:02:48,515
I've spent a lot of time

1345
01:02:48,598 --> 01:02:51,142
evangelizing around this,
and here's the thing.

1346
01:02:52,143 --> 01:02:53,979
I've cut it down to one question.

1347
01:02:54,854 --> 01:02:56,189
And here's the question:

1348
01:02:56,773 --> 01:02:57,774
Vulnerability...

1349
01:02:58,692 --> 01:03:03,905
is-- the definition of it, from the data--
uncertainty, risk, emotional exposure.

1350
01:03:04,281 --> 01:03:07,575
So vulnerability is the feeling
that we get when we feel uncertain,

1351
01:03:07,659 --> 01:03:09,577
at risk, or emotionally exposed.

1352
01:03:10,954 --> 01:03:13,248
So I was doing work with special forces

1353
01:03:13,331 --> 01:03:17,127
maybe a year ago now,
and I asked a question.

1354
01:03:17,544 --> 01:03:20,171
Could anyone,
any one of the troops in this audience,

1355
01:03:20,255 --> 01:03:22,299
give me an example of courage
from their life

1356
01:03:22,382 --> 01:03:24,968
or something they witnessed
in a colleague's life.

1357
01:03:25,051 --> 01:03:26,886
A single example of courage

1358
01:03:26,970 --> 01:03:30,640
that did not require uncertainty,
risk, and emotional exposure,

1359
01:03:31,016 --> 01:03:32,767
and there was just silence.

1360
01:03:32,851 --> 01:03:35,395
And I waited, and it seemed
like a long time, and finally...

1361
01:03:36,187 --> 01:03:37,981
a young man stood up and said,

1362
01:03:38,690 --> 01:03:39,774
"Three tours, ma'am.

1363
01:03:40,734 --> 01:03:42,861
There is no courage
without vulnerability."

1364
01:03:44,070 --> 01:03:48,074
And so I would ask y'all, in here,
give me a single example of courage

1365
01:03:48,158 --> 01:03:50,994
in your life or that you've witnessed
in someone else's.

1366
01:03:51,077 --> 01:03:52,579
A single example of courage

1367
01:03:52,662 --> 01:03:55,999
that did not require uncertainty,
risk, or emotional exposure.

1368
01:03:57,876 --> 01:03:59,377
I don't think you can.

1369
01:03:59,461 --> 01:04:01,921
There is no courage without vulnerability.

1370
01:04:02,005 --> 01:04:04,883
Yet, how many were raised to believe
that courage is an important value?

1371
01:04:04,966 --> 01:04:07,385
That you should be brave with your life?
Show of hands.

1372
01:04:08,345 --> 01:04:11,806
How many of you were raised to believe
that vulnerability is weakness?

1373
01:04:15,143 --> 01:04:18,897
Here's the rub. Be brave,
but never put yourself out there.

1374
01:04:20,273 --> 01:04:22,484
We've gotta dispel the myth, right?

1375
01:04:22,776 --> 01:04:25,278
Number two: "I don't do vulnerability."

1376
01:04:25,362 --> 01:04:27,697
[audience laughs]

1377
01:04:27,781 --> 01:04:28,656
Yes, you do.

1378
01:04:28,740 --> 01:04:31,368
Anyone here manage to live
to this point in your life

1379
01:04:31,451 --> 01:04:33,870
without uncertainty, risk,
or emotional exposure?

1380
01:04:35,455 --> 01:04:36,581
No.

1381
01:04:36,664 --> 01:04:38,249
We do vulnerability. And here's the thing.

1382
01:04:38,333 --> 01:04:40,377
You only have two options. There's--
You only have two options.

1383
01:04:40,460 --> 01:04:42,337
You do vulnerability knowingly,

1384
01:04:42,420 --> 01:04:44,589
-or vulnerability does you.
-[audience laughs]

1385
01:04:45,840 --> 01:04:49,636
Vulnerability shows up, and you--
and if you don't know, just go home...

1386
01:04:50,178 --> 01:04:53,098
and say, "Hey,
do you think I do vulnerability well?"

1387
01:04:53,181 --> 01:04:55,642
to someone you love,
and then step back a couple steps...

1388
01:04:55,725 --> 01:04:58,061
-[audience laughs]
-...and take in the truth.

1389
01:04:58,937 --> 01:05:01,815
You do vulnerability,
knowingly or unknowingly.

1390
01:05:01,898 --> 01:05:04,442
And here's the thing.
Here's why we need it.

1391
01:05:06,778 --> 01:05:10,782
Man, it is so much easier
to cause pain than feel pain.

1392
01:05:11,908 --> 01:05:13,868
And people are taking their pain

1393
01:05:14,411 --> 01:05:16,996
and they're working it out
on other people.

1394
01:05:17,330 --> 01:05:20,208
And when you don't acknowledge
your vulnerability,

1395
01:05:20,291 --> 01:05:23,002
you work your shit out on other people.

1396
01:05:23,086 --> 01:05:26,047
Stop working your shit out
on other people.

1397
01:05:26,131 --> 01:05:27,799
[audience applauds]

1398
01:05:27,882 --> 01:05:29,384
Right? Stop.

1399
01:05:32,554 --> 01:05:36,099
It's okay if you've got
crazy stuff going on. Join the club.

1400
01:05:36,724 --> 01:05:37,809
Like we all do.

1401
01:05:38,268 --> 01:05:41,771
The difference is, don't offload
your hard stuff on other people.

1402
01:05:43,690 --> 01:05:46,151
Three: "I can go it alone."
This was my favorite.

1403
01:05:46,234 --> 01:05:48,236
One time after a talk,
a guy came up to me and goes,

1404
01:05:48,736 --> 01:05:50,029
"I'm gonna try it.

1405
01:05:50,363 --> 01:05:52,157
I'm gonna try vulnerability...

1406
01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:53,491
[audience laughs]

1407
01:05:53,575 --> 01:05:55,326
...but I'm gonna try it by myself.

1408
01:05:57,495 --> 01:05:58,788
And I'm gonna see how it goes,

1409
01:05:58,872 --> 01:06:00,999
and then I'm gonna try it
with other people."

1410
01:06:01,791 --> 01:06:02,959
And I was like,

1411
01:06:04,919 --> 01:06:08,590
"I-- I don't think that's gonna work.
Like, I don't know what that means."

1412
01:06:08,673 --> 01:06:09,507
And he's like,

1413
01:06:09,591 --> 01:06:10,508
"I'm just gonna...

1414
01:06:11,134 --> 01:06:14,971
do it alone for a while." And I was like,
"All right, you get back to me."

1415
01:06:17,390 --> 01:06:20,643
We can't go it alone.
We're neurobiologically hardwired

1416
01:06:20,727 --> 01:06:22,228
for connection with other people.

1417
01:06:22,312 --> 01:06:25,231
In the absence of connection,
love, and belonging,

1418
01:06:25,315 --> 01:06:26,816
there is always suffering.

1419
01:06:27,400 --> 01:06:28,943
You can't go it alone.

1420
01:06:29,777 --> 01:06:31,613
If you could,
I would have found a way by now.

1421
01:06:31,696 --> 01:06:32,572
[audience laughs]

1422
01:06:32,655 --> 01:06:33,698
As an introvert...

1423
01:06:34,324 --> 01:06:38,495
and somebody who loves humanity
but is más o menos on people...

1424
01:06:38,578 --> 01:06:40,997
-[audience laughs]
-...I would have found a way.

1425
01:06:42,207 --> 01:06:45,293
Number four: "You can engineer
the uncertainty and discomfort

1426
01:06:45,376 --> 01:06:46,503
out of vulnerability."

1427
01:06:46,586 --> 01:06:50,715
I work a lot with tech companies
in Silicon Valley and around the world,

1428
01:06:50,798 --> 01:06:54,093
and they really want to engineer

1429
01:06:54,177 --> 01:06:57,555
the uncomfortable part
out of vulnerability,

1430
01:06:57,639 --> 01:06:59,516
to the point where one of them said,

1431
01:06:59,599 --> 01:07:01,226
"We're thinking about an algorithm...

1432
01:07:01,309 --> 01:07:04,354
-[audience laughs]
-...that could actually help you predict

1433
01:07:04,437 --> 01:07:07,690
when it's okay to be vulnerable
with other people."

1434
01:07:08,441 --> 01:07:11,569
And I was like, "The minute it becomes
comfortable, it's no longer vulnerability.

1435
01:07:11,653 --> 01:07:14,113
Call it whatever you want,
but don't use that name on your app."

1436
01:07:16,908 --> 01:07:18,910
"Trust comes before vulnerability."

1437
01:07:18,993 --> 01:07:20,203
This is a hard one, right?

1438
01:07:20,411 --> 01:07:23,248
Like, do I trust you
then I'm vulnerable with you?

1439
01:07:23,331 --> 01:07:26,125
Or am I vulnerable with you,
and then I learn to trust you?

1440
01:07:26,209 --> 01:07:28,127
And the answer is "yes and..."

1441
01:07:28,211 --> 01:07:32,257
It's a slow stacking over time
of vulnerability and trust.

1442
01:07:32,549 --> 01:07:35,927
We don't go out with,
like, you know, the big guns, and like,

1443
01:07:36,010 --> 01:07:38,555
"Nice to meet you. I'm Brené.
Here's my darkest secret.

1444
01:07:38,888 --> 01:07:39,931
Can I trust you forever?"

1445
01:07:40,390 --> 01:07:42,725
We start with little things,
and we build over time,

1446
01:07:42,809 --> 01:07:45,562
and the more I share with you,
and the more you honor that sharing.

1447
01:07:45,645 --> 01:07:46,854
But here's the thing...

1448
01:07:47,564 --> 01:07:50,400
you share with people who've earned
the right to hear your story.

1449
01:07:50,483 --> 01:07:52,860
Your story is a privilege to hear.

1450
01:07:54,153 --> 01:07:57,240
You share it with people
who've earned the right to hear it.

1451
01:07:57,448 --> 01:07:58,575
You don't share it...

1452
01:07:59,576 --> 01:08:00,410
just because.

1453
01:08:00,493 --> 01:08:03,496
Vulnerability minus boundaries:
not vulnerability.

1454
01:08:05,248 --> 01:08:07,375
Last: "Vulnerability is disclosure."

1455
01:08:07,458 --> 01:08:09,335
This goes back to the boundary thing.

1456
01:08:10,086 --> 01:08:13,089
Live Tweeting your bikini wax:
not vulnerability.

1457
01:08:13,172 --> 01:08:15,174
[audience laughs]

1458
01:08:15,258 --> 01:08:19,095
Sharing the intimate details
of your divorce and your pain on Facebook

1459
01:08:19,178 --> 01:08:21,431
for your kids to read,
who are reeling as well:

1460
01:08:21,514 --> 01:08:22,473
not vulnerability.

1461
01:08:23,474 --> 01:08:27,353
Again, vulnerability minus boundaries
is not vulnerability,

1462
01:08:27,437 --> 01:08:31,441
and you don't measure vulnerability
by the amount of disclosure.

1463
01:08:32,275 --> 01:08:36,404
You measure it by the amount of courage
to show up and be seen

1464
01:08:36,487 --> 01:08:39,240
when you can't control the outcome.
Does that make sense?

1465
01:08:40,950 --> 01:08:42,994
Okay, we're gonna end with a story.

1466
01:08:43,786 --> 01:08:48,750
So, Ellen, my daughter,
decides to try swim team, and she tries--

1467
01:08:48,833 --> 01:08:50,960
She decides to try a year-round swim team,

1468
01:08:51,044 --> 01:08:53,338
which is a big commitment
'cause we have a rule in our house

1469
01:08:53,421 --> 01:08:55,840
that if you try a sport,
you've gotta finish the season.

1470
01:08:55,923 --> 01:08:59,135
So she-- I'm picking her up
one day from swim team practice,

1471
01:08:59,218 --> 01:09:01,429
and she's-- she's young. She's probably...

1472
01:09:02,138 --> 01:09:05,725
maybe fifth grade, and I can see--
How many of you have had this experience?

1473
01:09:05,808 --> 01:09:09,395
I can see from her silhouette
in front of me

1474
01:09:09,479 --> 01:09:11,856
when I'm still eight cars behind
that she's crying.

1475
01:09:12,106 --> 01:09:14,359
Like, I can tell by the way
she's holding her body

1476
01:09:14,442 --> 01:09:15,902
that things are not okay.

1477
01:09:16,235 --> 01:09:20,156
So I get up next to her. She gets
in the car, and she's crying, and I said,

1478
01:09:20,239 --> 01:09:22,408
"What's wrong? What happened?
What's going on?" She goes,

1479
01:09:22,700 --> 01:09:26,329
"I have to swim the 100 breaststroke
in the meet this weekend."

1480
01:09:27,205 --> 01:09:30,208
And I'm thinking to myself,
"No! Not the 100 breaststroke!"

1481
01:09:30,833 --> 01:09:33,461
And I was like,
"Man, that's a tough race."

1482
01:09:33,544 --> 01:09:35,838
And she goes, "Mom, you know."
And I was like,

1483
01:09:35,922 --> 01:09:38,591
"That's a tough race, girl."
And-- And here's the thing.

1484
01:09:38,675 --> 01:09:40,009
Breaststroke is a hard stroke.

1485
01:09:40,093 --> 01:09:42,970
It's like, one day it just comes together,
and you get it.

1486
01:09:43,054 --> 01:09:46,391
And like, the arms work
with the frog legs, and it just happens.

1487
01:09:46,474 --> 01:09:50,853
But until then, while you're doing it,
you actually don't propel forward.

1488
01:09:51,354 --> 01:09:52,271
Like, when you don't--

1489
01:09:52,355 --> 01:09:55,233
You kinda go forward, then you come back,
and then you go--

1490
01:09:55,316 --> 01:09:59,278
And so, 100 yards is a long way
for non-propelling.

1491
01:10:01,114 --> 01:10:03,658
I'm dying on the inside
'cause, you know, like,

1492
01:10:04,659 --> 01:10:07,328
I wasn't a great swimmer either,
and I had those moments,

1493
01:10:07,412 --> 01:10:10,957
and, like, what I want to say is,
"Well, run away and don't worry about it."

1494
01:10:11,040 --> 01:10:13,209
But I'm trying to be, like,
the parent that--

1495
01:10:13,292 --> 01:10:16,045
you know, the brave parent.
I'm like, "It's a tough thing.

1496
01:10:16,129 --> 01:10:18,381
Let's get home, get you showered.
Let's talk about it.

1497
01:10:18,464 --> 01:10:19,841
Let's talk about it with your dad."

1498
01:10:20,216 --> 01:10:22,343
And so we get home,

1499
01:10:22,802 --> 01:10:27,140
and she goes upstairs to take a shower,
and she comes down, and...

1500
01:10:27,223 --> 01:10:30,435
Steve's home, and we sit down for dinner,
and, you know, she starts crying again,

1501
01:10:30,518 --> 01:10:33,646
and she explains everything to her dad,
and, you know, he's like,

1502
01:10:33,730 --> 01:10:36,733
"Well, I think we respect your coach,
and it's your coach's call,

1503
01:10:36,816 --> 01:10:39,944
and I think you're gonna have to swim
if that's the race you're put in."

1504
01:10:40,403 --> 01:10:43,364
And, you know,
very much we aligned on messaging,

1505
01:10:43,448 --> 01:10:44,991
just like the books say.

1506
01:10:45,324 --> 01:10:49,412
And so she-- she starts crying.
And she goes up after dinner and I'm like,

1507
01:10:49,495 --> 01:10:51,289
[grunts] "Curse you, Steve," and,

1508
01:10:51,372 --> 01:10:54,292
you know, like, "You should have got her
out of this!" Um...

1509
01:10:54,375 --> 01:10:56,919
Then she comes back down real quick,
and she goes, "So you're sure?"

1510
01:10:57,003 --> 01:11:00,465
-I'm like, "We're sure. This is--"
-[audience laughs]

1511
01:11:00,548 --> 01:11:03,760
Yeah. So, but--
But I said, "Don't you think, Steve,

1512
01:11:03,843 --> 01:11:05,762
that she could take it up with her coach?

1513
01:11:05,845 --> 01:11:07,472
If you don't want to swim it,
take it up with your coach."

1514
01:11:08,264 --> 01:11:11,434
She comes home the next day, and she said,
"Coach Jason says I'm in.

1515
01:11:11,517 --> 01:11:14,270
A hundred yards-- 100 yards breaststroke.
I'm doing it."

1516
01:11:15,146 --> 01:11:17,106
I said, "That's tough."
Starts crying again,

1517
01:11:17,190 --> 01:11:19,567
and she said, "My friend said

1518
01:11:20,109 --> 01:11:21,861
that I could scratch my heat."

1519
01:11:22,945 --> 01:11:25,782
And so what that means is,
in swim meets, they'll call an event,

1520
01:11:25,865 --> 01:11:27,074
like girls' 100 breaststroke,

1521
01:11:27,158 --> 01:11:29,911
then they start calling heat.
Heat one, heat two, heat three.

1522
01:11:29,994 --> 01:11:31,871
And swim meets run like this,

1523
01:11:31,954 --> 01:11:35,124
and a lot of the time,
swimmers miss their call.

1524
01:11:35,208 --> 01:11:38,503
And so, that's considered
scratching the heat. So her friend said,

1525
01:11:38,586 --> 01:11:40,838
"Just don't show up
when they call your heat."

1526
01:11:41,214 --> 01:11:44,634
Which I know all about
because I scratched some heats in my day.

1527
01:11:45,218 --> 01:11:47,220
[audience laughs]

1528
01:11:47,553 --> 01:11:49,806
Only one or two, but for big races.

1529
01:11:50,389 --> 01:11:53,851
And I said, "You-- You could do that."
And she goes, "I could?"

1530
01:11:53,935 --> 01:11:56,813
And I said, "You definitely could do that.
I think it's a choice.

1531
01:11:56,896 --> 01:11:58,523
You'll have to take that up
with your coach

1532
01:11:58,606 --> 01:12:01,108
if you don't show up on the blocks
for, you know, for your race."

1533
01:12:01,192 --> 01:12:03,903
And she said, "Will I get grounded here?"

1534
01:12:04,695 --> 01:12:05,863
And Steve's like,

1535
01:12:05,947 --> 01:12:09,534
"No. No. I mean, that's your choice,
Ellen, you know."

1536
01:12:09,617 --> 01:12:13,120
And then she just starts sobbing.
She said, "I'll never win this race."

1537
01:12:14,038 --> 01:12:16,624
And I said,
"You will never win this race."

1538
01:12:16,916 --> 01:12:19,669
I said, "That is for sure,"
and I said, "But you know what?

1539
01:12:19,752 --> 01:12:22,630
Sometimes winning is not coming in first.

1540
01:12:22,713 --> 01:12:25,508
Sometimes winning
is doing the really brave thing.

1541
01:12:25,591 --> 01:12:29,554
Maybe winning for you is just
coming off the block and getting wet.

1542
01:12:29,637 --> 01:12:31,430
Maybe that's winning for you.

1543
01:12:31,514 --> 01:12:33,432
Maybe that's what a win looks like."

1544
01:12:33,850 --> 01:12:34,851
She goes,

1545
01:12:36,018 --> 01:12:38,771
"So if I scratch the heat,
I don't get grounded?"

1546
01:12:38,855 --> 01:12:41,941
-[audience laughs]
-[Brené] And I said, "Yes. Right. Yeah."

1547
01:12:42,024 --> 01:12:44,110
So, it's meet day. We're there.

1548
01:12:44,193 --> 01:12:46,863
They call the heat. No--
We don't see Ellen.

1549
01:12:47,655 --> 01:12:49,365
And then all of a sudden,
at the last minute,

1550
01:12:49,448 --> 01:12:51,576
she pops up on block number eight,
you know,

1551
01:12:51,659 --> 01:12:54,245
so Steve and I situate ourselves
at the end of the thing,

1552
01:12:54,328 --> 01:12:56,581
and then the gun goes off,
and there they go.

1553
01:12:56,664 --> 01:13:00,293
And I can see her,
and she is struggling, and she's trying,

1554
01:13:00,376 --> 01:13:04,463
and I can see, like, right kind of like
at 75 yards,

1555
01:13:04,547 --> 01:13:07,383
she checks the lanes,
you know, 'cause she's in a far lane.

1556
01:13:07,466 --> 01:13:08,634
She checks the lanes,

1557
01:13:08,968 --> 01:13:11,178
and she gets this look on her face like,

1558
01:13:11,929 --> 01:13:12,889
"I'm ahead."

1559
01:13:14,181 --> 01:13:16,684
And-- And you can see, you know, like,

1560
01:13:17,268 --> 01:13:19,312
"Oh, my God. I'm ahead!"

1561
01:13:19,395 --> 01:13:22,648
And then you can see,
as she's finishing the final 25,

1562
01:13:22,732 --> 01:13:26,402
that she understands that there are
no other swimmers in the pool,

1563
01:13:27,320 --> 01:13:30,072
that she's been lapped so badly

1564
01:13:30,156 --> 01:13:32,408
that the whole field is out of the pool,

1565
01:13:32,825 --> 01:13:34,577
and that, in fact, when she finishes,

1566
01:13:34,660 --> 01:13:37,788
not only are all the other girls
from her heat out of the pool,

1567
01:13:37,872 --> 01:13:41,459
the next heat is on the blocks,
ready to go in,

1568
01:13:41,542 --> 01:13:44,253
and people are just kinda watching
but not watching.

1569
01:13:45,713 --> 01:13:48,466
And I can see her struggling
to get out of the pool

1570
01:13:48,549 --> 01:13:49,800
'cause that's-- that was a big race.

1571
01:13:49,884 --> 01:13:52,595
When you're not going anywhere
for that long, it's a lot of work.

1572
01:13:52,678 --> 01:13:53,930
I mean, it-- it's hard.

1573
01:13:55,139 --> 01:13:58,017
And I can see her,
and she stops by her coach.

1574
01:13:58,100 --> 01:14:00,770
He kind of bends down on one knee,
and you can see her talking to him,

1575
01:14:00,853 --> 01:14:03,648
and he's doing this,
and she's just shaking her head.

1576
01:14:03,731 --> 01:14:05,024
And she didn't have her goggles off,

1577
01:14:05,107 --> 01:14:07,735
and I know she didn't have her goggles off
'cause I know she's crying.

1578
01:14:07,818 --> 01:14:09,362
And then she comes over and--

1579
01:14:09,445 --> 01:14:11,072
You know, and her dad--
And, you know, me and Steve,

1580
01:14:11,155 --> 01:14:13,616
we were like mama and papa Phelps
during this thing.

1581
01:14:13,699 --> 01:14:15,785
It was like she was going
for the Olympic trial.

1582
01:14:15,868 --> 01:14:18,746
We were like, "Pull! Pull!"
Like, you know?

1583
01:14:18,829 --> 01:14:21,540
There's no one in the water but Ellen,
and people are just like,

1584
01:14:22,166 --> 01:14:24,669
"Wrap it up. Pull, whatever, just, like--"

1585
01:14:24,752 --> 01:14:26,128
[audience laughs]

1586
01:14:26,212 --> 01:14:28,130
And she comes over,
and she pulls her goggles off,

1587
01:14:28,214 --> 01:14:30,049
and she's just like--

1588
01:14:30,424 --> 01:14:33,719
Just, I think, ashamed
and tired and exhausted.

1589
01:14:34,136 --> 01:14:36,931
And she said, "Can I say a cuss word?"

1590
01:14:37,473 --> 01:14:41,560
And I was like, "Oh, hell, yes,
you can say a cuss word."

1591
01:14:41,644 --> 01:14:44,063
And she goes, "That sucked."

1592
01:14:44,146 --> 01:14:45,314
[audience] Oh!

1593
01:14:45,398 --> 01:14:46,482
[Brené] And I said,

1594
01:14:47,108 --> 01:14:49,193
-"That really did suck."
-[audience laughs]

1595
01:14:49,276 --> 01:14:50,611
I said, "That sucked."

1596
01:14:51,278 --> 01:14:54,573
And then she stopped for a minute,
and she was looking down, and she goes,

1597
01:14:59,787 --> 01:15:01,956
"But I was brave, and I won."

1598
01:15:02,039 --> 01:15:03,874
-[audience] Ah! [applauds]
-You know?

1599
01:15:08,587 --> 01:15:09,547
And...

1600
01:15:11,298 --> 01:15:12,133
Yeah.

1601
01:15:12,675 --> 01:15:14,844
And, to me, she was brave, and she won.

1602
01:15:16,846 --> 01:15:17,763
Here's the thing.

1603
01:15:17,847 --> 01:15:18,889
I'm not gonna bullshit you.

1604
01:15:18,973 --> 01:15:22,810
Vulnerability is hard,
and it's scary, and it feels dangerous,

1605
01:15:23,602 --> 01:15:26,480
but it's not as hard, scary, or dangerous

1606
01:15:26,564 --> 01:15:30,735
as getting to the end of our lives
and having to ask ourselves,

1607
01:15:30,818 --> 01:15:32,486
"What if I would have shown up?

1608
01:15:32,903 --> 01:15:37,158
What if I would have said I love you?
What if I would have come off the blocks?"

1609
01:15:38,701 --> 01:15:39,827
Show up,

1610
01:15:40,578 --> 01:15:42,997
be seen, answer the call to courage,

1611
01:15:43,581 --> 01:15:44,915
and come off the blocks

1612
01:15:45,291 --> 01:15:46,459
'cause you're worth it.

1613
01:15:47,126 --> 01:15:49,503
You're worth being brave. Thank y'all.

1614
01:15:49,587 --> 01:15:50,546
[audience applauds]

1615
01:15:50,629 --> 01:15:52,631
[cheering and whooping]

1616
01:15:58,929 --> 01:15:59,972
[Brené] Thank you.

1617
01:16:04,810 --> 01:16:07,772
Thank you! Thank y'all!

1618
01:16:11,317 --> 01:16:12,193
Good night!

1619
01:16:19,033 --> 01:16:21,035
[audience chattering]