*GM:* "Get off of her, you're one stiff wind away from being ash yourself," Caroline snaps as the car drives, Fuller's and Widney's vehicle close behind.

*Amelie:* "It's instinct, shut it!" she snaps back. Her mouth runs on it's own in that while her mind strains and bends, trying to make out the scent, the peripheral memory of the shooter. She has to have seen something before the sudden gunshots.

*GM:* "_Lie flat beside Autumn_," Caroline commands, her voice iron.

...

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:19 PM
If you want to resist, spend a WP

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:19 PM
And make a predatory aura roll

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:19 PM
And a Resolve + Blood Potency roll

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:20 PM
Getting really fucking tired of being ordered around, but they're already driving away, so she's not going to resist.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:20 PM
Hey, Pete brought up Amelie's Health a hundred times more than you have

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:20 PM
I'm just playing Caroline as he's played her...

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:21 PM
Nothing against how you're playing her

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:21 PM
Just fucking tired of getting ordered around.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:21 PM
Brujah aren't known for enjoying that

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:21 PM
Neither are most neonates, I imagine.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:22 PM
Some clans tend to be more amenable

...

*Amelie:* Amelie snarls at the order, but quickly pops her head up, pulling herself from the human and fitting herself on the floor as best she can. Keeping the balls of her feet and her hands on the ground waiting to pounce up out of the car when ordered.

...

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:23 PM
Also, note Amelie's head wouldn't have popped up

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:23 PM
Autumn is already on the floor

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:23 PM
Dominate makes Amelie lie flat beside her, A to B, no extraneous actions

...

*Amelie:* * Amelie snarls at the order, but reluctantly pulls herself from the human and fits herself on the floor as best she can. Keeping the balls of her feet and her hands on the ground waiting to pounce up out of the car when ordered.

*GM:* Amelie doesn't snarl. She doesn't feel reluctant. She doesn't feel anything. Or even see anything.

One moment, she's on top of Autumn. Now she's next to her on the floor. The obedience simply comes, without thought--or even sight. A terrible thought gnaws at Amelie like an ulcer:

Her body is not hers. Her perceptions are not hers.

They're Caroline's.

...

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:28 PM
That's one of the things that's so awful about Dominate, it doesn't care about consent

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:28 PM
It doesn't care whether someone is giving consent or denying consent

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:29 PM
They're just as forced either way

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:29 PM
Cool

...

*Amelie:* It feels sickening. Aggravating. Another intrusion into her corner, and another reason to get angry. But it's also another terrifying card dealt on the field. Like a blackout when she rips something's throat out, but more like when she was ordered as though it was that command from the house and her cholo thugs. It's different. Confusing. And that just makes her angrier on the inside. She files it away to look into later. But she bites her tongue for now, waiting for Hall to stop the damned car.

...

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:39 PM
I can definitely see Amelie feeling sickened/angered

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:39 PM
But she should be freaked out too

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:39 PM
Amelie doesn't know about Dominate, remember

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:39 PM
It's already been used on her.

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:40 PM
Very clearly and in the open

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:40 PM
Remind me when that was?

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:40 PM
When she headbutted that fucking cholo

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:40 PM
Before the little bad wolf came around

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:40 PM
Caroline hit you there with predatory aura

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:41 PM
Rather than Dominate

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:42 PM
I assume they're two different feelings then, she's not using her aura here obviously.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:42 PM
For sure. Amelie was conscious of what Caroline did then

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:42 PM
It was the same thing she did to the cholos herself

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:42 PM
(whatever that was)

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:43 PM
Here Amelie blanked out and literally obeyed without thought

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:44 PM
Okay then

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:44 PM
So where did Caroline make eye contact here

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:44 PM
Because Amelie was face down ontop of Autumn.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:45 PM
You don't need to worry about Dominate's mechanics

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:45 PM
As Amelie doesn't know those

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:45 PM
I'm worrying about it here because without eye contact OOC, it shouldn't work. We already spoke awhile ago about the deterrence of Dominate.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:46 PM
I'm not prepared to go into depth regarding how the mechanics did or didn't work, as Amelie doesn't know them

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:47 PM
It doesn't matter if she knows them or doesn't, I do.

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:47 PM
There's an entire sidebar for it in the book

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:47 PM
I can't go into depth, as your PC doesn't know the mechanics in play

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:47 PM
And I want to keep your knowledge on the same page as Amelie's wherever possible

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:48 PM
So we're fudging rules because Amelie doesn't know how Dominate works IC

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:50 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
I know what you're trying for here, you expressed that you wanted B&B to feel a lot more like a mystery to be pulled apart and paid attention to, but this isn't a case in which that needs to be put at the forefront. Knowing the rules to a game you're playing should take FAR more priority than narrative work.

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:50 PM
Otherwise you're just roleplaying, why attach it to a system

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:51 PM
B&B has always been a mystery that's needed to be pulled apart. This is however the first time we're dealing with this specific mechanical circumstance

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 3:52 PM
I'm not willing to lay all the cards on the table here, however, as your PC doesn't know the mechanics

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:52 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
Caroline doesn't know how to build a car, then. Can Amelie magically make the thing armour plated while her back is turned, she hasn't explored that IC

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:53 PM
She doesn't know the rules. Just has heard legends of cars being worked on by people who actually work for a living

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:53 PM
I don't know if it's the cordical steroids I'm on for a fly chest infection or just a lot of built up shit, but this is legitimately bothering me

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:54 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
Unless you're telling me Caroline is able to bore her eyes through the back of Amelies skull to her eyes, her being face down over Autumn shouldn't allow dominate to just magically kick her in the cunt

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 3:57 PM
You're making a number of assumptions here that I'm not willing to clarify. There are numerous times I pull the figurative wool over players' eyes and don't tell them all that's going on. This is one of those times. As far as Amelie can tell, Caroline was able to command her without eye contact

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:57 PM
So you're telling me this is an exception?

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:57 PM
That this isn't just another rule I'm not aware of?

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:58 PM
We didn't nix the eye contact?

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 3:58 PM
I'm not telling you anything except that it looks like Caroline didn't make eye contact when she commanded Amelie. You can draw whatever conclusions you will from that

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:58 PM
K

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 3:58 PM
I'm going to take a walk and take my garbage out then

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 4:22 PM
Much like when I asked you not to use Google Maps when Amelie lacked a phone in a neighborhood she was unfamiliar with, I'm also going to request that you no longer look up mechanics for Disciplines or other powers your PC doesn't understand the workings of. The GM knows the rules and applies them fairly, even when players don't understand what's going on

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 4:48 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
It also shoots my understanding of things in the foot though. I want to be able to understand what the fuck is going on, not just be a fucking passenger or a limp fish getting fucked on a mattress. We had a specific talk about me putting in the effort to relearn certain rules to better understand my options and make better choices, and all of the sudden it's became a non-discussion. This doesn't affect Pete or Jack fuck-all because they've been been through a lot more character action to understand that shit, so all this is doing is kicking me in the side of the head with 'can't talk about it' with shit I should be looking closely at. And all that does is limit what actions Amelie might be able to take advantage on in details IC. The details are everything. Does this building have a fire escape? I can sabotage it! How tall is this building from looking out the window, how many flights of stairs did we go up, the details are everything, and that's ALREADY fucked in the ass with the whole wits per details thing and the ever fucking shifting sands of rule fix after rule fix. If I don't know what the hell is happening there's no hope for me to get in the chinks in the armour that a weak character needs to be effective. D&D, I'm fighting a fucking turtle knight, the detail that his left leg is weak is super fucking important. Doesn't matter if my character is a caster class, OOC I should be aware of called shots and combat maneuvers to better know what the hell my options are, and what my character can be aware of to help them out of this fucking situation. But no! Amelie is ignorant, so I have to sit here and wonder what the fuck is happening mechanics wise that has fucked her and not learn any OOC or IC lessons, just sit there and get fucked again

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 4:48 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
A horror movie is terrifying and mysterious because you dont know shit, but it never just...pulls it's pants down and shits out new garbage. There's always a pre-set bent of rules that you become aware of before the character does, it's called Literary Irony. We knew Jason Voorhees fucking teleported like a cunt, that he's super strong, that's he's really a fucking child ghost immortal thing. The characters don't, but we do, and that only adds to the tension of the situation because we know the threat of whats coming and the characters do not!

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 4:48 PM
I am so fucking pumped up about this shit that 3 rounds around the fucking blood hasn't stopped me

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:49 PM
Here's the big thing though

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:49 PM
If a PC doesn't know about said chinks in armor, the player shouldn't either

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 4:51 PM
In practice that isn't always tenable. Caroline doesn't know how Obfuscate 5 works, between her Occult rating and never (knowingly) having encountered the power before, but Pete might know how it works from having studied the rules

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:52 PM
So that leaves us with two options, if Caroline would get into circumstances where Obfuscate 5 might be in play

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 4:53 PM
#1 is that Pete can play Caroline like she doesn't know any of the mechanics involved, even though he does, and have her make potentially suboptimal tactical choices

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:53 PM
This is the ideal option

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:54 PM
If Pete isn't able to keep his metagame knowledge separate from Caroline's, though, I have the option of going with #2

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:54 PM
Which is to render Pete's mechanical knowledge of Obfuscate 5 invalid/not helpful

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:54 PM
I can do that in a lot of different ways

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:54 PM
I can give an NPC a Devotion that changes the rules of how Obfuscate 5 works for them

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:54 PM
I can have them use different powers altogether

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:55 PM
I can come up with something completely new and original that isn't referenced in any rulebooks ever

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 4:56 PM
I still do that a ton, btw, there are LOTS of game mechanics that have significantly shaped events in B&B which players were only partially (not at all) aware of at the time

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:57 PM
Players can find those mechanics out, too, through investigative efforts on the part of their PCs

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:59 PM
But if a vanilla Obfuscate 5 would have served my needs just fine, however, it's regrettable Pete has removed that particular tool from my toolbox

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:59 PM
None of this is to say that understanding the game's rules is a fruitless pursuit

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 4:59 PM
It's an incredibly worthwhile one, in fact

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:00 PM
Players might not be allowed to take advantage of rules their PCs don't know, but they can take advantage of ones their PCs do know

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:00 PM
For instance, if you'd had Amelie heal her damage in between fights with the cholos

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:06 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
Doesn't fucking feel very worthwhile here. But aside from that, why then? It's already fucking infuriating enough having to deal with there being so many narratives boots curb stomping your fucking teeth into the gutter, why have players clawing to be able to get the fucking rules into place then? It feels like at any second someone could come and kick your sandcastle over or some cringy fuck can teleport behind you like a bad 2000s meme roleplaying meme. It's like trying to stand on quicksand, there's nothing solid to hold onto! And when the entire name of the fucking game is "The story isn't about you, it's about New Orleans, have fun getting ass-rammed faggot!" not even having the solid ground of standing as a neonate character feels like fucking garbage. When Amelie was fighting with the Cholos I didn't even have the fucking health system right! And then I didn't know where to subtract damage from her ballistics armor from her stamina point, and we had that argument about using Blur to get away and instead used dodge. Out of the fucking blue she's using wits to have to tell details about the car she would know right away. Like what fucking SIDE of it she's on when she already run towards it as her target.

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:06 PM
It's fucking stressful

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:07 PM
As much as I trust you to do the rules like you want them, there are constant changes, I'm paranoid now that there are unwritten rules you'd only realize exist

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:08 PM
And on top of the SETTING already doing plenty of the ass-raping??

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:08 PM
You've just cited the exact reasons it's worthwhile for you to understand the rules

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:09 PM
And yet I've also stated that it does fuck all!

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:09 PM
If you'd understood how Health worked, you'd have been able to make more informed decisions

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:09 PM
If it was written anywhere I would have been informed

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:09 PM
If you'd understood you could've spent Vitae to heal wounds, you'd have been in better shape during the second cholo fight

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:10 PM
Knowing the rules always helps you. Knowing 100% of the rules would obviously help you the most, but even knowing 70% sure is better than 10%

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:11 PM
But let's even take that teleporting serial killer as an example

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:11 PM
Are there rules for teleporting in the Requiem rulebook?

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:11 PM
Nope

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:11 PM
I'm still happy to drop a teleporting serial killer into the game

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:11 PM
And if he showed up, you'd have no idea how the mechanics work on the OOC side

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:12 PM
Which is good

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:12 PM
As that'd help maintain the mystery I'd want to cultivate

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:12 PM
However, you could take steps IG to remedy that ignorance

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:13 PM
You could observe his powers in action and draw conclusions, use Auspex, make knowledge checks, etc

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:13 PM
You might not understand 100% of how his teleporting powers work

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:13 PM
That's what I'm trying to do here! If Amelie makes or doesn't make eye contact with her during dominate it sets in her mind that there are rules to the power!

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:13 PM
But 50% is likely to be more beneficial for you than not

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:13 PM
If Caroline needs to bark at Amelie to catch her eyes before using it, that's a lesson

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:13 PM
Good

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:13 PM
As far as Amelie saw, Caroline didn't make eye contact with her

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:14 PM
But if we're buggering the rules and saying Carolien can see through skulls to use it, that's either an exception or FUCK that rule, piss on it's grave

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:14 PM
And not telling me which isn't a mystery

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:14 PM
It's telling me that everything I read is possibly suspect!

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:14 PM
That's actually true

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
Well it's horse shit!

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
Why should I read then!?

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
Theres no fuckign reason to, fuck it

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
That's exactly how Sam runs WF too, by the way

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
I'll delete the PDFS

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
let's take down the house rules page

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
Everyone get a notebook

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
White in the blood of your grandmother what rules you THINK apply

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
And in 6 months we'll meet in seattle

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
Under fucking candle light

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:15 PM
And argue in person over brandy which of us are wrong

Peter Stewart
Dec 3, 2018, 5:17 PM
Worth noting here David. Dominate explicitly doesn't leave you with memory of the event

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:17 PM
Worth noting, a sudden BLACKOUT the moment you make eye contact with someone is telling

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:17 PM
Did you have any idea what the rules were when Moses regenerated the punch Brook threw at him, but apparently didn't after Hudson and co shot him?

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:17 PM
Because let me tell you, I had (and still have) absolutely no idea what game mechanics were at play there

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:17 PM
I have a number of theories

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:18 PM
But the GM hasn't confirmed any of them

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:18 PM
And I know they might be wrong

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:18 PM
How Moses heals/when he can heal is a big question mark still

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:18 PM
Maybe Brook even has false memories of the event

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:19 PM
A strong working knowledge of the mechanics Sam did let me know, however, still enabled us to win the encounter against him

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:21 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
And yet Brook already has a basis for his theories! He knew that even the brain wouldn't put Moses down, it should have been the heart, like the coyotes. Brook has been able to see something happen and formulate a base to stand on with Moses. Which was incredibly important if the fight would have gone on! Headshots wouldn't have mattered to him, he struck off something. That's progress. And Brook never even learned about his necklace either! Sam kept that from me. He put the bonus' to my rolls even without my knowledge it gave bonus', but there were context clues! Brook's described attachment to it, how he felt when he wore it, there was a handhold there on that cliff of knowledge!

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:21 PM
And the rules in WF were STILL fucking these rules!

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:22 PM
Brook does not possess a complete understanding of how Moses' healing works

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:22 PM
There was still aggravating shit I'm sure we would have gone onto if the game wasn't fucking DEAD

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:23 PM
Until then there was a lot of shit that I didn't get mechanically that I sure as fuck would have liked to know then!

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:23 PM
Like the health rule!

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:23 PM
*I* don't know how Moses' healing works

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:23 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
The physical character int hat game, the hunter, the one fist fighting Moses

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:23 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
Was using the raw health system while Moses was not

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:24 PM
I didn't notice! No one noticed. He didn't take damage but if he'd been less lucky or the axe had come back into play it would have been a lot of tactics change

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:24 PM
If there aren't cement rules, there's nothing to fucking stand on

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:25 PM
You're wrongly conflating a number of separate topics here

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:37 PM
The Health system isn't relevant to that example. Yes, it could have changed tactics, if the rules for how much damage causes unconsciousness/death were different than you or I believed they were. It likely would have impacted the fight, but that's not what I'm talking about.

_No mortal_ can instantly heal lethal damage in the middle of a fight. It takes them two days to heal a single point. By all appearances, that's exactly what Moses did.

Neither of us understands the mechanics involved. You clearly have theories about how Moe's healing worked, as do I. But until the GM outright tells us they are true, it's possible we could be wrong, and make/have made tactical decisions that hurt our PCs.

That's exactly as things should be. How Moses heals (and hell, _if_ he healed) is a mystery, and it's one our PCs aren't privy to. There's a thousand different possible explanations for how Moses could have healed his damage, and our uncertainty is good for the game. Mystery is part of the World of Darkness' atmosphere. Sam could have told us, "Oh, he's a ghoul who spent Vitae to heal his damage," and that would have drastically changed the tenor of the encounter. The mystery would be dead. It might also have caused us to make tactical decisions using knowledge our PCs didn't have--"oh, a ghoul's max Vitae is capped by their Stamina, so assuming Moe has Stamina 5 and spends it all on healing, that equates to 5 extra Health. Shooting him is still a good tactic."

And me making a decision like that would have been HORRIBLE. Hudson should not have been able to make a decision like that. When Sam kept the mystery under wraps, I honestly had no idea if shooting Moses was a horrible idea or not. Maybe he was a werewolf who'd have regenerated all the damage in a single turn, in which case I'd have taken an incredibly stupid action with my PC.

That would have been a GOOD THING. Because Hudson doesn't know how werewolves work either.

But that is how the World of Darkness works

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:37 PM
What you don't know can kill you. Mortals in the World of Darkness are easy prey to the supernatural, because they know so little about how it works

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:38 PM
Younger supernatural monsters are prey to elder terrors, because they don't know how everything works there either

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:39 PM
When possible, GMs in the World of Darkness should strive to have player ignorance match PC ignorance, so as to provide the most authentic experience within the setting as possible. It makes for genuinely better games

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:39 PM
Like I said... I honestly didn't know, when I had Hudson and his Retainers shoot Moses, whether or not that was a horrible idea which would get him killed

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:39 PM
But from Hudson's POV, it was the most logical thing to do

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:40 PM
I embraced the setting's tropes and played my character the way he should have been played

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:40 PM
Granted, I didn't have a choice... because Sam didn't tell me whether Moe was a ghoul or a werewolf or whatever

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:41 PM
And the game was much better for it

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:41 PM
But since I didn't know all the rules, does that mean learning them is worthless?

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:41 PM
Absolutely the hell not

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:41 PM
I could tell that Sam was expecting me to have Hudson and his Retainers charge into a melee with Moses

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:42 PM
But my solid grasp of the rules/dice probabilities, and ability to make comparative analyses, was why I had Hudson and co. shoot Moses with their guns, instead of attacking him in melee

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:43 PM
And that turned out to be a good tactical decision

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:43 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, David
It's possible that the Dominate without eye contact is a result of a blood bond or a specific Devotion, knowing those are two avenues as RAW - there's also Dom 2 that can implant long-lasting commands and triggers

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:43 PM
We took down Moses in a single round, with no loss of civilian life

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:43 PM
We saw Caroline's "sire" do it without eye contact

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:44 PM
I may not have seen the full picture, but I saw enough of it to substantially help out my PC

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:44 PM
These things aren't all or nothing

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:44 PM
There is a huge spectrum between 100% knowledge of all the mechanics involved in a given encounter, and 0% total ignorance of them

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:45 PM
Being a higher percentage may not _always_ help you (though it helped me with Moses), but it will always have the POTENTIAL to help you

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:45 PM
Jack is also correct about both those forms of eye contact-less Dominate, incidentally

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:46 PM
This might be something completely different, but he's raised possibilities

Calder Rooney <calderrooney@gmail.com>
Dec 3, 2018, 5:47 PM
Though speaking relatedly of... compared to the time when Rene Dominated Caroline, again without eye contact, she was in way bigger trouble than Amelie is now

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:48 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, David
Just letting you know this isn't a gotcha moment, because there is examples of it in the book and in-game, A isn't the first one to be surprised by Dom without eye contact

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:48 PM
I remember Pete being surprised at the time, too

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:48 PM
Incidentally, on the subject of PCs making false assumptions their players know to be exactly that

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:48 PM
When Rem hit her with it

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:49 PM
Rocco botched his knowledge roll on good gifts for Accou and gave him a horrible gift

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:49 PM
But it wasn't the end of his world

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:49 PM
Accou forgave him after an apology and successful Social roll

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:50 PM
And for that trouble/adversity overcome, Rocco is gaining 2 extra Beats, so he's actually in a better position than if he hadn't made the mistake

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:50 PM
went full-on how to make friends book mode

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:50 PM
There's a reason it's sold so many copies

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:51 PM
apologise quickly, strongly

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:51 PM
Yep

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:53 PM
Still remember a politician in Aus who stayed in power for ages (long enough that HE was the one to retire) because he was the master of apology

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:53 PM
Not surprised to so hear

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:54 PM
Premier of Queensland, Peter Beaty

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:54 PM
So, highest position of state

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:54 PM
There are so many politicians who are bad at apologizing

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:55 PM
I'm a fucking Canadian, apology is a national passtime.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:55 PM
"I'm sorry if you were offended"

Jack Ell
Dec 3, 2018, 5:55 PM
Lol

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:55 PM
to Samuel, me, Peter, Jack
I'm not satisfied with that answer though. Going off assumptions when I have no real cemented basis of rules, not being able to grab onto anything, and then getting bitch slapped for assuming things and trying to gripe my way through a system.

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:56 PM
It feels like shit in a game that's already less about characters and more about New Orleans itself.

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:56 PM
Rather it's how it's meant to be or not

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:56 PM
In both cases

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:56 PM
David, you've spent about an hour complaining about the fact that Amelie thinks Dominate works differently than the rulebook says it does

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:56 PM
When she has no idea what Dominate even is

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:57 PM
I have spent an hour complaining about how Amelie knowing what domination is or not shouldn't limit my OOC knowledge of how it works

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:58 PM
I don't like being limited in OOC knowledge just because Amelie hasn't grabbed onto certain concepts yet.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:58 PM
That may be an area where we will have to agree to disagree

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:58 PM
If I can't tell how I can leverage things OOC, IC I'm way less likely to be able to figure out how these things out.

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:59 PM
(As well as you and Sam, whenever WF resumes, as he shares my views)

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:59 PM
He's welcome to come around

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 5:59 PM
Whenever he deigns appropirate

Calder Rooney
Dec 3, 2018, 5:59 PM
Preach it

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 6:00 PM
But fine

David Armstrong
Dec 3, 2018, 6:00 PM
I'm done talking about it