[12:05] <@Xrious> Isnada/Crossfire, I've just replied, I'd be interested in hearing your suggestions.
[12:07] * Herr_Nerdstrom (Herr@CPE-124-183-122-242.lns15.ken.bigpond.net.au) Quit (Quit: )
[12:08] <@Xrious> and I'm happy to discuss it in here aswell
[12:09] <Isanda> how many people would actually rate for some of the discounts?
[12:09] <Isanda> I struggle to think of many
[12:09] <@Xrious> I don't know. why?
[12:10] <Isanda> I get the angle, reward people for helping out where they can make perfect sense. But the vast majority of people wont ever be involved in that.
[12:11] <@Xrious> So, if someone's looking to get an SC, help out before hand and you'll save isk.
[12:11] <@Xrious> the more you help, the more you'll save.
[12:12] <@Xrious> if you can think of another activity that warrents a discounts, I'll be happy to take a look at adding it to the list
[12:12] <@Xrious> Do you think the discounts need to be adjusted??
[12:12] <Isanda> Fueling POSs for months to save a bil or so isent really worth the time, I would be suprised if anyone took it up.
[12:13] <@Xrious> why? fuel 5 POS's. its say an hours work every 20 days.
[12:13] <@Xrious> saves you a Bil.
[12:14] <@Xrious> So what don't you like? the whole idea? or the amounts?
[12:14] <@Xrious> Can you think of another option? And no, we're not going back to the old method. It was flawed as we found out.
[12:15] <Isanda> Mostly the ammounts, I really think ANZA should be going full pelt into trying to get everyone they can into suppercarriers and have them willing to deploy them.
[12:15] <@Xrious> Right, so how would you suggest we do that?
[12:16] <Isanda> Build them for cost for people who you trust, personal builds only
[12:16] <Isanda> no resales
[12:18] * Crossfire2142 (Crossfire@CPE-124-183-122-242.lns15.ken.bigpond.net.au) Quit (Ping timeout)
[12:23] <Isanda> from what ive seen alot of corps just chain build supers now, if a corpie wants one they put up their hand and pay cost, if noone wants it it gets sold off for profit
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[12:27] <@Xrious> so you want to remove the ability for corpies to make isk by making SC's?
[12:29] <Isanda> If it involves any effort on your part to help them, yea absolutly. Make a alt corp or something for people that want to do that and they can do every step of the process themselves. Its their risk for the reward.
[12:29] <@Orbital> X. mind if i but in here and just state an opinion that its in the corps best interest to see that the Corp makes the isk from super carrier sales.
[12:29] <@Xrious> Orb, no worries.
[12:29] <@Xrious> Isanda...
[12:29] <@Orbital> not individual copies unless the decide to take the risk of thier own CSAA POS self funded
[12:30] <@Orbital> as in we provide the sov. you take the risk.
[12:30] <Isanda> exactly
[12:30] <@Orbital> but secure corp pos's CSAA are for corp profit
[12:30] <Isanda> yeap
[12:30] <@Orbital> since you yourself are doing that loading work X.
[12:31] <@Xrious> No one other than myself or Roo can be in the alt corp that makes the SC. We can't adjust roles like someone suggested so that people can build under Anza as it will no one else will be asble to build things at a POS anywhere. We can't take that risk
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[12:31] <Isanda> Make another alt corp for others wanting to build for profit, or tell em to get fucked. Priority should be given to corpies wanting to strengthen the corp
[12:32] <@Orbital> no. a corpie in anza wanting to make a SC builds in within the corp not the alt corp. the take on the "extreme" risk of cancellation if they re bbuilding for profit
[12:32] <@Xrious> Isanda, we tried that, thats exactly what the old way was, but it didnt work.
[12:32] <@Xrious> lets take your suggestion.
[12:32] <@Xrious> a corpie wants an SC,
[12:32] <@Xrious> they get it at cost.
[12:32] <@Xrious> then they sell it on.
[12:32] <@Xrious> what do we do?
[12:33] <Isanda> Isks or gtfo
[12:33] <@Orbital> no more super caps for you buddy
[12:33] <Herr_Nerdstrom> minimum time in corp to buy one?
[12:33] <@Xrious> and who has to monitor and record that? Me? Roo?
[12:33] <@Orbital> some trust needs to be given the the corpie buying, but in the end of the day if they decide to sell it straight away then all we need to say is sorry bud. you no longer have nay further access to super cap production
[12:34] <@Xrious> and why should we stop corpies making isk? surely if they want to they can?
[12:34] <@Orbital> you dont think Roo wont be able to add a note to his dossias on all us corpies?
[12:34] <Fish-Tohan-Tril> Isanda	Fueling POSs for months to save a bil or so isent really worth the time, I would be suprised if anyone took it up. --- I did :P
[12:34] <Crossfire2142> yes fishy but we know your crazy
[12:34] <Isanda> I dont see why corp builders need to lift a finger to help other people make isk
[12:34] <@Orbital> im sure Roo has an access data base on all current/past members of the corp
[12:35] <@Xrious> ISanda, thats exactly right, so we added in the corp tax to penalise those people, but that didn't work. to be honest, I liked the old way, it was simple, it was easy, and best of all, it was my suggestion :p
[12:35] <@Xrious> but it was flawed, so something else needed to be dne.
[12:36] <mayhemmaker> whats wrong with this method.? <Isanda> Isks or gtfo
[12:36] <mayhemmaker> they'l only fuck up once
[12:37] <@Xrious> that is in an option, but not one I wanted to do.
[12:37] <mayhemmaker> a little harsh i aggree but it stops the corp getting fucked over and it helps loyal crpies get intot SC's faster
[12:38] <@Xrious> Its an option, but its not one I wanted to do. Its not how I like to work.
[12:39] <@Xrious> I hop eyou guys can appreciate how hard it was for me to try and come up with a fair way to handle this, without pissing people off.
[12:39] <Crossfire2142> this seems similar to my way actually
[12:39] <Isanda> My ideal option would be. Corp has a SC chain in action, builds as many as it can, sells to corpies for cost. Any unsold get sold for profit. Any corp member wanting to build their own SCs for profit joins a 2nd alt corp where they supply EVERYTHING, POSs, CSAAs etc etc, do all the logistics all the building and take all the risk outside of the normal corp building program. Corp has nothing to do with it.
[12:39] <Sandra_Buldock> TBh, i don't really care about corpies getting into SC's if they are not going to use them in PVP. I would of been happy to pay stated amounts and gotten money back once i showed i was using it for anything other than ratting.
[12:39] <Crossfire2142> i do recall arguing with you for some time regarding this
[12:42] <@Xrious> Sandra, I apprecaited that, but thats from your point of view, I need to look at it from all the corpies.
[12:45] <Sandra_Buldock> yep...not an easy system to come up with... sucks to be you :)  who is actually getting them tho X? I'm guessing a few have been made over the past couple of months..are most ppl just reselling or what?
[12:46] <@Xrious> probably about 50/50 split
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[12:52] <@Xrious> Look, I'm not trying to fuck people over, I try to do whats best for ALL the corpies and also for the corp. If you guys have any comprehensive suggestion's then I'd love to see them.
[12:53] <@Xrious> As it stands, this is my second choice for everything I could think of ( first choice didn't work )
[12:55] <Isanda> whatever option has the most chance of letting the corp/alliance defend against the obscene supercap blob that will eventually come down and say hi gets my vote
[12:55] <Sandra_Buldock> if half the SC's are getting sold i don't think its going to matter :P
[12:56] <mayhemmaker> for the interem any wya i thikn getting pilots into active pvp SC should be the priority not corpies making isk
[12:57] <mayhemmaker> when the corp has a sizeable SC fleet that are active and can defend then look athte corpie isk making options
[12:57] <Sandra_Buldock> i know shit all about building stuff so i'll leave it to the pro's, but i would like the system to favor ppl using them in pvp
[12:57] <Sandra_Buldock> but that might be super hard to keep track of
[12:58] <Fish-Tohan-Tril> perhaps make em more expensive (through a deposit) and everytime it's in a fleet, some of the deposit gets returned???
[12:58] <@Xrious> Fish, who's going to monitor that? you?
[12:58] <mayhemmaker> that would work but i reckon that would be a shit load of micro management
[12:59] <mayhemmaker> someone would have to keep track of every sc char there
[12:59] <Sandra_Buldock> yep, lots of work and bitching
[12:59] <@Xrious> sod that, that'll be a right pain the arse.
[12:59] <mayhemmaker> yer that would be fun