mkalash - 03/14/2017
You continue to ignore the real reason I want AOOC muted by default, and are making up your own reasons to attack.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
And you have yet to fucking tell us
ParadoxSpace - 03/14/2017
because 'the real reason' keeps changing
mkalash - 03/14/2017
No, the reasons you make up keep changing.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
A D H O M I N I M
mkalash - 03/14/2017
You are too busy flipping out to take a breath and try to understand what I'm saying.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
So
ParadoxSpace - 03/14/2017
i mean i'm not the one who went from 'i don't want metagaming' to 'i don't want inappropriate antag coordination' to 'i don't want to enforce this on my own'
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
refute
our
arguments
Realm Code - 03/14/2017
^
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
go ahead
do it
mkalash - 03/14/2017
You continue to put words in my mouth, PS, and then complain about what I'm saying.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
so
refute
our
arguments
mkalash - 03/14/2017
Wow
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
I've yet to see you do it
Funklord Nito - 03/14/2017
isnt that exactly what he's doing :thinking:
mkalash - 03/14/2017
You cotinuing to say that really gives me a chance to talk.
Realm Code - 03/14/2017
no
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
Okay. Here's your talk time.
do it.
I'll sit back for a bit
Sorry for cramming down on you like that..
mkalash - 03/14/2017
You're arguing that antags will no longer be able to plan and this will create stale rounds. I say that AOOC has not helped rounds become unstale, and even then, antags will definitely be allowed to plan still.
ParadoxSpace - 03/14/2017
where
-cut-

She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
Okay, but some of my favorite antag rounds have occured by the result of planning
mkalash - 03/14/2017
In AOOC, since it isn't being removed, just disallowed by default.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
and my worst rounds, are, almost exclusively, those that are AOOC muted
Brett - 03/14/2017
Which are, cooincidentally, the majority of round types
mkalash - 03/14/2017
Then, Chaoko, I think your issue is outside of what my PR is doing.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
And what is my issue?
Albens - 03/14/2017
Rip chatter
IRCBridgeBOT - 03/14/2017
<Azlier> quick welcome me to the family
Lemon - 03/14/2017
AOOC has not helped rounds become unstale because a lot of people are afraid of using it outside of merc/heist
A lot of that fear I would attribute to your actions mkalash
mkalash - 03/14/2017
I am giving staff a tool to more easily enforce 'muting AOOC.'
Your complaint is that staff is doing that when they shouldn't.
ParadoxSpace - 03/14/2017
there is already a button to mute AOOC
mkalash - 03/14/2017
There is not.
Realm Code - 03/14/2017
I can see why this tool exists, but why does it default to muted.
This is what we disagree on.
Gero - 03/14/2017
Well is there anyone muting it but you
mkalash - 03/14/2017
You don't see the full picture of the round when I disallow AOOC.
I don't do it every single time.
Brett - 03/14/2017
Evidently neither do most staff
Given that you are the only one who publicly opposes AOOC on multiantag rounds
Admiral Alvin - 03/14/2017
Don't you just disallow AOOC whenever there are multiple antagonist types?
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
Mka, can I ask you a favor?
mkalash - 03/14/2017
Now, this PR isn't going to change at what times staff allow or disallow AOOC. Can we agree on that?
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
The next few mixed antag rounds
Brett - 03/14/2017
Which means that it doesn't solve problems
It only creates them
🅱intendo - 03/14/2017
(Which there should be less of BUT I'LL TALK ABOUT THAT LATER)
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
Rather, single antag rounds
memescope - 03/14/2017
i disagree, because sometimes staff won't be on to enable it when it'd normally be fine.
Admiral Alvin - 03/14/2017
I don't get how planning a common gimmick as different kinds of antags is in any way endangering a round. In fact, there's a lot of potential in it.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
can you just have AOOC disallowed for them? I mean cult, ling, and, say.. Rev
Realm Code - 03/14/2017
Question; If I am an antagonist during a mixed antagonist round, and I petition the administration in ahelp to enable it for the purposes of planning, would they actually consider my request or would they deny it immediately.(edited)
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
Disallow aooc for those
and see how they go
ParadoxSpace - 03/14/2017
if there's no button to disable AOOC
just make one
??
Brett - 03/14/2017
If there is now a button to enable it
Why not have it go the other way
👍1
mkalash - 03/14/2017
Because, like I said, I don't find an environment where the only way for a player to know if AOOC is not appropiate is to test the waters and thereby 1. get yelled at and 2. having already committed metagaming
to be a good envinronment
ParadoxSpace - 03/14/2017
how is your PR going to make it any easier for them to find out
Admiral Alvin - 03/14/2017
What I don't like here is that there doesn't seem to be an actual official policy on that. A lot of admins are fine with AOOC being used almost regardless of mode.
Realm Code - 03/14/2017
They perform a mistake once, they learn.
Admiral Alvin - 03/14/2017
And having an admin manually mute AOOC for specific round types does not quite sound like the ideal solution either.
mkalash - 03/14/2017
Realm, that's simply not the case. A player doesn't have enough information to determine alone when it is appropiate. They'd need to be able to check-antags.
Brett - 03/14/2017
I regularly tell them without any meta info
Often lings will say "yo where my lings at"
And rens will just say "Hey heads up there are other antags this round try and keep planning vague at best"
It's pretty EZ
ParadoxSpace - 03/14/2017
it's largely a self regulating thing rn
Admiral Alvin - 03/14/2017
I'm of the opinion that antagonists can and should be trusted enough in their roles to be able to use AOOC for their gimmicks in most if not all cases.
She's a phony! A big phony! - 03/14/2017
Semi-related question: What does a wizard do
what is it SUPPOSED to do?
mkalash - 03/14/2017
Use the tools of wizardy to make the round fun
like any other antag
Realm Code - 03/14/2017
Simple, establish what is inappropriate. Have mechanics in place to give clarity without the need of player assistance, such as having them be shown in AOOC as 'ckey (antag-type)' or so forth.